Wheeler Park

[jedicurt]

Awesome Sid... 40 minutes roughly, not to bad, especially if you had the young ones in tow...

And as for distances people will walk, i agree with the posters just above... i averaged 7 miles a day walking when i was in San Fran for a few weeks, and there was public transportation to take, but it didn't always go where i wanted it to. If people are willing to walk a 1/2 mile for anything, then if you build something that they really want to go to, what is another 1/2 mile? now add to that the future streetcar system and where it can run, and we might decrease that distance even more.



It's only 1.1 miles from the skydance bridge if we use the current trails and put something on the furthest point of Wheeler park

[jedicurt]

I walked this yesterday from Bass Pro Shop. And i made the whole trip in 30 minutes without any kids in tow. granted, i do kinda walk fast and regularly. but i still spent time looking around and didn't try to make it there as fast as i could. Walking the shortest distance i could from the Skydance bridge, it was around like 7 minutes to the far side of Wheeler Park.

[Pete]

For those claiming this park doesn't see much use (and thus removing it in favor of a privately-owned soccer stadium) I was by there Thursday evening and it was extremely active wtih soccer practices and lots of families.

[SEMIweather]

For those claiming this park doesn't see much use (and thus removing it in favor of a privately-owned soccer stadium) I was by there Thursday evening and it was extremely active wtih soccer practices and lots of families.

I've been to 7 Energy home games so far this year and there's no way they're drawing more than 2,000 per game. Given that, I find it hard to believe that there would be serious momentum to demolish this park and build a soccer stadium instead.

Side Note: I honestly have no idea what the Energy's 5-10 year plan is at this point. I know they want to be out of Taft sooner rather than later, but it seems like the team's popularity peaked in 2015, slowly declined in 2016-17, and fell off a cliff this season with the poor quality of play thus far.

[Urbanized]

I wonder what the average attendance was for OKC Cavalry games...

[OKC2017]

I've been to 7 Energy home games so far this year and there's no way they're drawing more than 2,000 per game. Given that, I find it hard to believe that there would be serious momentum to demolish this park and build a soccer stadium instead.

Side Note: I honestly have no idea what the Energy's 5-10 year plan is at this point. I know they want to be out of Taft sooner rather than later, but it seems like the team's popularity peaked in 2015, slowly declined in 2016-17, and fell off a cliff this season with the poor quality of play thus far.

i agree with you. there's no point altering this park much less hand it over to private hands just to fit a small sports team stadium in it. the funks can really pull a development project at much lesser financial & social cost. i, for example, would propose the following site for a multi use development district anchored by a soccer stadium. perhaps the only thing i would add to it is a river boat house to load and unload passengers coming over on boats from the boat house district and brick town via the river.

[Jake]

The stadium would need to be multi-use to get any sort of value out of it. I think USL has a stipulation that every team will need to have a soccer-specific stadium here in a few years, so that will cause a need, but I agree that the attendence doesn't exactly demand a stadium.

The Energy being literally one of the worst teams in the entire league this year doesn't exactly help attendance either.

[SEMIweather]

The stadium would need to be multi-use to get any sort of value out of it. I think USL has a stipulation that every team will need to have a soccer-specific stadium here in a few years, so that will cause a need, but I agree that the attendence doesn't exactly demand a stadium.

The Energy being literally one of the worst teams in the entire league this year doesn't exactly help attendance either.

Yeah, the Energy's terrible form this year has definitely been a drag on attendance. I'm sure it will go back up somewhat if they can get back to putting a competitive team on the field, but they weren't exactly filling up Taft last season when they were in the top half of the league, either.

The USL does want all of their teams playing in soccer-specific stadiums by the start of the 2020 season, but I'd be surprised if that deadline actually sticks, because there are currently 10 teams playing in baseball stadiums, with three more expansion teams playing in baseball stadiums set to join next season. From what I've read, the main issue with Taft is that it's slightly too narrow to be a USSF-approved field. It frustrates me that when the Energy and OKCPS renovated Taft back in 2014, they didn't just tear out the track and build a new track across the street, to the north of the NW Classen baseball field. Not sure how much additional money that would have cost, but it would have allowed the Energy to build the field to USSF standards. I know the Energy want their own stadium though, so I doubt they've ever thought of Taft as a long-term home, anyways.

I like OKC2017's proposed development district, but I do wonder how much it would cost to buy out those remaining homes and businesses between Walker, I-40, Harvey, and the river. I know Louisville's USL team is in the process of building a development district anchored by a 10,000 seat soccer-specific stadium (which I think is about the maximum size the Energy should be looking to build) with a mix of public and private financing. They are spending about $50 million on the stadium and about $200 million total on the entire district. I won't pretend to know whether Funk and McLaughlin can finance that on their own, or whether they'll ask for subsidies and/or the creation of a TIF district.

Another (short-term) possibility is that the Energy could look to build their own pop-up stadium after this season or next season, while they continue to explore long-term options. I'm not 100% sure where they would put such a stadium, but somewhere on the State Fairgrounds seems like a potential option. Phoenix's USL team did this prior to last season as part of a larger rebrand, and their club has had a lot of positive momentum over the past two years as a result. The Energy recently brought in a senior advisor who was instrumental in getting Sacramento's USL team a soccer-specific stadium, so I would expect some stadium news in the next several months.

[mugofbeer]

What about attendance if such a stadium were built near the stockyards or elsewhere south of the river? Demographics might work a bit better.

BTW, I saw a list of sports stadiums being built around the country and I think 8 or so soccer facilities of 20 to 40K in size are being built for MLS.

The facility could certainly also be used for concerts

[Laramie]

I've been to 7 Energy home games so far this year and there's no way they're drawing more than 2,000 per game. Given that, I find it hard to believe that there would be serious momentum to demolish this park and build a soccer stadium instead.

Side Note: I honestly have no idea what the Energy's 5-10 year plan is at this point. I know they want to be out of Taft sooner rather than later, but it seems like the team's popularity peaked in 2015, slowly declined in 2016-17, and fell off a cliff this season with the poor quality of play thus far.

USL's goal by 2020:

USL: League announces intention to house all 24 teams in soccer-specific stadiums by 2020 - https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2015/...-stadiums-2020

Really thought that once Rayo OKC exited the scene that the Energy FC would have capitalized on the whole market to themselves.

Let's see, the OKC IGA Tennis Classic (Williams' sisters early participation), Oklahoma City RedHawks, Oklahoma City Barons AHL all went down hill once under the Funk's umbrella and now the Oklahoma City Energy FC. Had great expectations in the Funks to market soccer, bring OKC its second major league sport with MLS expansion.

Thank God, they didn't secure the NHL Calgary Flames (post Thunder), as Bob Funk Sr., once raised eyebrows about the possibility of the NHL in OKC--we would be in the same position as the City of Hartford--too close to Boston. OKC is just far enough from Dallas that we don't have to live in their shadow or that of Mavericks' owner, Mark Cuban.

[Laramie]

USL is one tier below Major League Soccer. Our city could use a venue; hopefully bring the OSSAA's 5-A & 4A high school championships to a new stadium in the Wheeler area or on the riverfront. Much like we did with the Peake, build a basic stadium, something in the 25,000-seat range without all the bells & whistles; if Funk wants to occupy the stadium as a USL tenant or future anchor MLS tenant; let him partnership with the city to provide all the bells and whistles--chairback seats, suites etc.

Feel the city could be ready to move forward on a soccer specific stadium with a Funk partnership.

[JesStang]

For those claiming this park doesn't see much use (and thus removing it in favor of a privately-owned soccer stadium) I was by there Thursday evening and it was extremely active wtih soccer practices and lots of families.

Just wait until next week when adult softball starts back up. We use those fields Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, Friday and sometimes Sunday.
We should’ve started summer league last week but I won’t get into that.

[Urbanized]

I honestly see very little utilization and lots of empty surface parking in that pic, but agree that softball brings a TON of people to Wheeler Park.

[Pete]

What park has parking lots that size?

The only reason Wheeler does is because of the softball crowds.

[Urbanized]

If Wheeler is redeveloped as a soccer stadium there is ample room to replace the softball use and in fact the current park usage by upgrading the entire series of connected park and other space along the river, which actually even connects to Scissortail, Wiley Post, et. al. All of that is to say that if a soccer stadium makes sense for that location I believe we should do it when the time comes, but also should pay attention to not losing existing amenities and perhaps even leveraging it to have INCREASED park access and amenities for current users who would be displaced by the stadium. It's not a zero sum situation.

[Pete]

If Wheeler is redeveloped as a soccer stadium there is ample room to replace the softball use and in fact the current park usage by upgrading the entire series of connected park and other space along the river, which actually even connects to Scissortail, Wiley Post, et. al. All of that is to say that if a soccer stadium makes sense for that location I believe we should do it when the time comes, but also should pay attention to not losing existing amenities and perhaps even leveraging it to have INCREASED park access and amenities for current users who would be displaced by the stadium. It's not a zero sum situation.

Do you know something about this or are you just speculating?

[Urbanized]

Just speculation. What I do know is that the connected parkland exists and is very underutilized. I also know there has been discussion in the past of utilizing this space for amateur sports and other recreational uses. It seems quite natural that if the existing site is ultimately redeveloped as a soccer stadium that there would be consideration given to relocating and replacing the amenities currently within Wheeler to adjacent and nearby - and currently underutilized - park land.

[ABCOKC]

I will never understand this site.

Google Maps puts Wheeler Park at ~55 acres. We are literally building a 70-acre park almost directly adjacent to this one. So either we are 70 acres short on park space as it stands, or some of that land could easily be redeveloped without a drop in quality of life for the surrounding residents.

If the only real concern is that softball games need somewhere to be played, there is tons of underutilized parkland in that area where new fields could sit.

[Pete]

^

So every time a new park is built we should sell off all or part of the nearest existing park to a private concern?

When Scissortail Park was proposed and voted on it was never part of the deal that Wheeler would somehow be expendable. The plan was always to keep them both and all the other OKC parks.

The city is growing and more and more people are living and recreating near the core. Look how incredibly busy the Myriad Gardens has become in a very short time.

We are also getting ready to add a new Manuel Perez Park on the south shore of the river, just to the east of Robinson. Should we then get rid of the existing parks that are adjacent? On not build the lower portion of Scissortail Park which be closer than Wheeler is to it?


It seems people are being very cavalier about a park because they don't personally use it, although lots of other people do.

I go to a bunch of OKC parks all over town, including this one. I walk my dogs, fly my drone and usually pick up trash along the way. I love seeing and experiencing our parks and frankly it puts me in contact with people I wouldn't otherwise interact with; and I happen to think isolation is one of the biggest problems in our culture today; especially not interacting with those different than you and your direct neighbors.

Almost all our parks are busy, mainly used by people who don't have big yards or any yard at all.

I bet almost no one here has even been to Wheeler Park and those who have go to play or watch softball. I go by, to or through that park once every week or two (it's one of my favorite places to launch my drone plus I just like it).

And in general OKC could use tons more recreation space, well beyond what is currently planned. If there are so many great places for the amenities of this park to be relocated, then there should be tons of places for a privately owned soccer stadium that doesn't involving taking all or most of an existing area park.

[Laramie]

If you're going to take a park, prefer that you take Wiley Post Park west of the Mat Hoffman Action Sports Park for a Soccer Specific Stadium; then tie both Wheeler & Wiley Post parks together as Urbanized suggested in Post #92. The two parks are separated by Walker Avenue: https://www.google.com/maps/search/+...97.5288912,15z

[Pete]

We should never, ever be doing away with existing parks.

We need a lot more recreation, not less.

[BoulderSooner]

^

So every time a new park is built we should sell off all or part of the nearest existing park to a private concern?

When Scissortail Park was proposed and voted on it was never part of the deal that Wheeler would somehow be expendable. The plan was always to keep them both and all the other OKC parks.

The city is growing and more and more people are living and recreating near the core. Look how incredibly busy the Myriad Gardens has become in a very short time.

We are also getting ready to add a new Manuel Perez Park on the south shore of the river, just to the east of Robinson. Should we then get rid of the existing parks that are adjacent? On not build the lower portion of Scissortail Park which be closer than Wheeler is to it?


It seems people are being very cavalier about a park because they don't personally use it, although lots of other people do.

I go to a bunch of OKC parks all over town, including this one. I walk my dogs, fly my drone and usually pick up trash along the way. I love seeing and experiencing our parks and frankly it puts me in contact with people I wouldn't otherwise interact with; and I happen to think isolation is one of the biggest problems in our culture today; especially not interacting with those different than you and your direct neighbors.

Almost all our parks are busy, mainly used by people who don't have big yards or any yard at all.

I bet almost no one here has even been to Wheeler Park and those who have go to play or watch softball. I go by, to or through that park once every week or two (it's one of my favorite places to launch my drone plus I just like it).

And in general OKC could use tons more recreation space, well beyond what is currently planned. If there are so many great places for the amenities of this park to be relocated, then there should be tons of places for a privately owned soccer stadium that doesn't involving taking all or most of an existing area park.

If a soccer stadium is build in wheeler park (I have no knowledge of this). Keep in mind that it is almost 100% that the stadium will be owned by the city of OKC.

[jccouger]

Pete I used to go to Wheeler all the time, 3-4 times a week to run on the river trail. I can't ever remember going there when there wasn't a youth soccer team, or adult rugby team using the open fields for practice/games. Wheeler is a heavily used space.

Just from the photo it looks like at least 75% of the space is softball fields, so of course if softball games aren't going on its gonna look empty from an aerial shot.

[David]

The south lot at Wheeler is where I park if I go running on the river trails. Off hours, so I don't see as many people using the park directly, but the trails get a lot of use.

^

So every time a new park is built we should sell off all or part of the nearest existing park to a private concern?

When Scissortail Park was proposed and voted on it was never part of the deal that Wheeler would somehow be expendable. The plan was always to keep them both and all the other OKC parks.

The city is growing and more and more people are living and recreating near the core. Look how incredibly busy the Myriad Gardens has become in a very short time.

We are also getting ready to add a new Manuel Perez Park on the south shore of the river, just to the east of Robinson. Should we then get rid of the existing parks that are adjacent? On not build the lower portion of Scissortail Park which be closer than Wheeler is to it?


It seems people are being very cavalier about a park because they don't personally use it, although lots of other people do.

I go to a bunch of OKC parks all over town, including this one. I walk my dogs, fly my drone and usually pick up trash along the way. I love seeing and experiencing our parks and frankly it puts me in contact with people I wouldn't otherwise interact with; and I happen to think isolation is one of the biggest problems in our culture today; especially not interacting with those different than you and your direct neighbors.

Almost all our parks are busy, mainly used by people who don't have big yards or any yard at all.

I bet almost no one here has even been to Wheeler Park and those who have go to play or watch softball. I go by, to or through that park once every week or two (it's one of my favorite places to launch my drone plus I just like it).

And in general OKC could use tons more recreation space, well beyond what is currently planned. If there are so many great places for the amenities of this park to be relocated, then there should be tons of places for a privately owned soccer stadium that doesn't involving taking all or most of an existing area park.

Amen.

[Jersey Boss]

If a soccer stadium is build in wheeler park (I have no knowledge of this). Keep in mind that it is almost 100% that the stadium will be owned by the city of OKC.

Yeah that would be true. The fact of the matter is that the city owns the Chesapeake arena but the Thunder for all practical purposes are the tail that wags the dog. There seems to be a precedent with these city built and owned facilities for the primary tenant to have outsized influence in what gets allowed to be booked.