2017 Oklahoma Commercial Aviation Discussion

[catch22]

I wonder if SW would rather send traffic through STL adding a 3rd daily nonstop? I had heard that is what they planned to do on the TUL-STL route. TUL-MDW was also recently cancelled. Surprising in that Midway is Southwest's largest hub and offers a ton of connections especially to the Midwest and Northeast but it's also growth-restricted while STL has plenty of room to grow with a good number of connections.

Regarding Orlando there is still daily nonstop service to nearby SFB on Allegiant. For the price sensitive family/Disney crowd that is probably a better option. Oklahoma-Florida has been tried many times and for whatever reason isn't successful.

Twice weekly, not daily.

[Downwind17]

Just to clarify...Southwest is dropping MCO or MDW?

[Jeepnokc]

I don't trust allegiant. 4 hrs before a flight to vegas they cancelled the flight with no explanation. I couldn't find any indication of weather that would have caused a cancellation vs a delay. This was on a Thursday. Next outbound flight was Sunday, so weekend Vegas trip ruined.

My wife flew them for the last time last month. Early Thursday afternoon flight delayed for several hours. Last delay was told flight would leave at 6 pm. At 4 pm, they cancel the flight. Wife, kids, and mother-in-law head home. My wife is at home literally in the process of booking Friday morning flights on Delta when we get a recorded call at 515pm saying they cancelled the flight by mistake and it will be departing at 6 pm. Fortunately we live literally catty corner to the airport so they made the flight.

I told her never again. Spend the extra money to fly on Delta.

[BG918]

Just to clarify...Southwest is dropping MCO or MDW?

MDW is being cancelled. The rumor is Saturday only MCO will end soon leaving no non-stop options to Orlando (Allegiant flies to nearby Sanford).

I think MDW could be the result of two things: 1) slot restrictions at the closed-in airport where other routes that perform better are added and lower performing routes like OKC and TUL are dropped and/or 2) Southwest is retiring a lot of its older aircraft and dropping routes or frequency ahead of their new aircraft orders which arrive later this year into 2018, and once that happens these routes and frequency may come back. Let's hope it's #2 as MDW is an important route and alternative to ORD.

[s00nr1]

Several DFW and DAL-bound a/c diverting to OKC this afternoon due to weather in DFW. No heavies yet though. Maybe we could get out there and throw a welcome party to Virgin to get them (Alaska) to add CA service

So far I have found:

AA608 PHL-DFW // A320
AA1141 LGA-DFW // A321S
AA2335 ORD-DFW // MD82
AA2607 BOS-DFW // A321S
AA3621 TVC-DFW // E175
AA5757 EVV-DFW // CR9
AA5919 MEM-DFW // CR9
NK857 BOS-DFW // A320
VX790 LAS-DAL // A319
VX874 LAX-DAL // A319
WN487 AMA-DAL // 733
WN3905 BNA-DAL // 737

[OUman]

Just something for anyone interested, Austin Bergstrom bagged its 6th overall international carrier, Norwegian.

Norwegian starting thrice weekly Gatwick nonstops

Yes, it's only thrice a week but unlike Condor's summer-only twice-weekly to FRA, this will be year-round (at least there's no mention of this being seasonal in the press). So unless BA is affected by this service, it will give AUS a total of 10 weekly nonstops to London. And Condor is expected to continue its expanded service to/from FRA next summer also.

AUS May passenger traffic was up over 12% from last May, and overall year-to-date traffic is up by 8.5%. Must be nice to have a growing airport! It can't get that east concourse expansion soon enough.

[HangryHippo]

Just something for anyone interested, Austin Bergstrom bagged its 6th overall international carrier, Norwegian.

Norwegian starting thrice weekly Gatwick nonstops
Yes, it's only thrice a week but unlike Condor's summer-only twice-weekly to FRA, this will be year-round (at least there's no mention of this being seasonal in the press). So unless BA is affected by this service, it will give AUS a total of 10 weekly nonstops to London. And Condor is expected to continue its expanded service to/from FRA next summer also.

AUS May passenger traffic was up over 12% from last May, and overall year-to-date traffic is up by 8.5%. Must be nice to have a growing airport! It can't get that east concourse expansion soon enough.

Very jealous of their growth. Would be nice to see some new stops here in OKC.

[Richard at Remax]

DIdn't realize there was that much demand coming out of Austin. Pretty impressive

[BG918]

Very jealous of their growth. Would be nice to see some new stops here in OKC.

Maybe Southwest will eventually try a 1x daily nonstop to AUS. ExpressJet briefly flew this route in the mid-2000's using smaller aircraft, I would think there would be enough demand to fill a daily 737 down there especially if tied to an ongoing flight to San Antonio. There is a decent amount of oil & gas traffic between OKC and South Texas as well concentrated south of San Antonio.

[catch22]

As much as I'd like to see AUS, it would be a significant change in network for OKC. I'm not sure if OKC is ready (in the eyes of the airlines) for Point-2-Point. Even Southwest, the King of P2P is rapidly backing away from point-to-point and entrenching into large market hub/spoke. With Southwest's change in business model and the network carrier view of OKC (and comparable markets) I just can't see it happening anytime soon.

[BG918]

As much as I'd like to see AUS, it would be a significant change in network for OKC. I'm not sure if OKC is ready (in the eyes of the airlines) for Point-2-Point. Even Southwest, the King of P2P is rapidly backing away from point-to-point and entrenching into large market hub/spoke. With Southwest's change in business model and the network carrier view of OKC (and comparable markets) I just can't see it happening anytime soon.

Until the past year or so I would consider OKC-STL as somewhat of a P2P with about the same number of Southwest departures as Austin. Now they are a mid-sized hub with around 100 daily departures, and obviously are in a better geographic location for connecting flights. OKC-STL is also a legacy route that has been served for decades going back to TWA, then American, and now Southwest. Like I've said before if Southwest had a smaller plane than the 737 I would imagine OKC would have service to larger regional cities like AUS, SAT, MCI, BNA and MSY.

[Richard at Remax]

As someone who is flying to STL in December, the SWA direct flight out of OKC is not the most ideal time. 5:50am is too early lol.

[catch22]

Until the past year or so I would consider OKC-STL as somewhat of a P2P with about the same number of Southwest departures as Austin. Now they are a mid-sized hub with around 100 daily departures, and obviously are in a better geographic location for connecting flights. OKC-STL is also a legacy route that has been served for decades going back to TWA, then American, and now Southwest. Like I've said before if Southwest had a smaller plane than the 737 I would imagine OKC would have service to larger regional cities like AUS, SAT, MCI, BNA and MSY.

MCI and STL were always kind of the outliers in that they existed primarily for connections, but neither were very large hubs. With WN's business model change, MCI has taken a back seat (even more than it was) and STL has actually had a good bit of "spillover "growth as MDW is literally maxed out. If WN had about 15 more gates and 2 full length runways at MDW, STL would be shrinking.

Southwest's labor costs and waning of fuel hedging programs has resulted in them being forced to adopt the legacy hub and spoke network. When Southwest's costs were low they could make the numbers work on small market to medium market point to point. Now they have to consolidate their flights into their largest stations and create connection banks to create some economies of scale to overcome their costs.

I feel about 10 years ago would have been our best shot for AUS, BNA, and MSY on WN. It fit perfect in their previous business model, but OKC didn't have the passenger numbers at the time.

[Richard at Remax]

Since MSY has been brought up a few times, any chance we get there via Allegiant? Even though looking at their route map they have zero direct flights west of the Mississippi (I thought Tulsa had one but might have been mistaken)

[catch22]

Since MSY has been brought up a few times, any chance we get there via Allegiant? Even though looking at their route map they have zero direct flights west of the Mississippi (I thought Tulsa had one but might have been mistaken)

Allegiant could be a possibility. But it would be less than daily. They have shown some mild interest in OKC lately.

[whatitis]

Since MSY has been brought up a few times, any chance we get there via Allegiant? Even though looking at their route map they have zero direct flights west of the Mississippi (I thought Tulsa had one but might have been mistaken)

I don't work in the airline industry but I know for a fact allegiant at one point did have a Tulsa to new Orleans route. My brother in law was thinking of booking it for a vacation but they didn't have the dates he wanted. Not sure if it's seasonal or if it got dropped altogether

[damonsmuz]

Love seeing UAL EWR-OKC seeing an upgauge in the equipment from the EMB-145 to EMB-175. How is it that EWR is seasonal but IAD is yearly? Is it basically a "one of the routes has to be seasonal and EWR is it" sort of thing or does IAD do that much better than EWR?

[BG918]

I don't work in the airline industry but I know for a fact allegiant at one point did have a Tulsa to new Orleans route. My brother in law was thinking of booking it for a vacation but they didn't have the dates he wanted. Not sure if it's seasonal or if it got dropped altogether

I believe TUL-MSY lasted about a year before Allegiant dropped it. There is an airline called Glo that has started a small regional network out of New Orleans, maybe they would consider expanding west?

[Downwind17]

News9 reported that a new carrier to OKC will be announced on Tuesday. Anyone know of any details?

[gopokes88]

Very very good month of June.

http://www.flyokc.com/statistics/Jun...nplanement.pdf

[OkiePoke]

There will be an announcement tomorrow for a new airline & non-stop service. Via Claire Donnelly @donnellyclairee

[HangryHippo]

I hope it's somewhere in the NE or New Orleans.

[sbs]

I hope its JetBlue, but I'll bet its Frontier.

[catch22]

Well new airline and new destination would pretty much bring it down to JetBlue or Spirit; or a possible Frontier return.

[AP]

I would put my money on Spirit. This is a great market for a super low-cost airline, IMO.