Driver's School (traffic ticket)

[Pete]

So, I got a ticket for going 41 MPH on 10th Street west of Western. This is a stretch that is divided 4-lane road on a major thoroughfare... I honestly had no idea the speed limit was 30 and I'm sure very few people do either, which is why one of OKC's Finest hid himself behind a building and decided that the best use of his time in the aid of OKC's public safety was to pull over and ticket someone going 10 MPH over a ridiculously low speed limit.

One more editorial comment: He was basically writing the ticket before I got a word out of my mouth, being I had no idea the speed limit was 30 because on most major roads it is 40 and that I had just moved from California and wasn't familiar with that stretch. And it was only 41 MPH for crying out loud.... How about a warning? He didn't even listen, he was there to write tickets.

I have not had any type of violation in many years so now I have to decide if I want to suck it up and go to traffic school to keep this off my driving record.

Problem is, that's an additional $200 (!) on top of the $161 for the ticket.

My car is older (and so am I) and thus my car insurance is very low.

Is it worth $200 to keep this off my record?

[turnpup]

So sorry you got caught in that speed trap! We've seen them parked by that VFW post several times lately, so it's clearly a revenue-making scheme. They love to camp out at the bottom of that hill. Hell, even if you were going 30, you'd have to be riding your brakes to keep it that speed right there.

If I were you, I'd just eat the cost of the ticket and move on. But I'm saying this from the perspective of somebody who hasn't gotten a ticket in probably 20 years, so don't have much information.

[Pete]

Yes, forgot about the hill part.

It's absolutely absurd to ticket people there unless they are going unreasonably fast, which I was not.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^^^^^^
A perfect example of traffic engineers building a road for more speed than is wanted or safe. At that point it is left up to law enforcement, because people tend to intuitively drive the speed that a road LOOKS like belongs there, rather than what is posted on a sign. The built environment dictates how people act/react; not signs. If they wanted 30 MPH through there, they should have built a 30 MPH road, not a 50 MPH road.

[Pete]

Frankly, I am surprised I wasn't driving faster given the setting -- divided 4-lane road with nothing along the north side (this is the completely empty stretch that drew a multi-use proposal) and going downhill.

It's stuff like this that makes people unsympathetic to the police department's constant cry for more officers. And him being a jackass didn't make it any better.

[Kemotblue]

Frankly, I am surprised I wasn't driving faster given the setting -- divided 4-lane road with nothing along the north side (this is the completely empty stretch that drew a multi-use proposal) and going downhill.

It's stuff like this that makes people unsympathetic to the police department's constant cry for more officers. And him being a jackass didn't make it any better.

WOW! That's 30mph! look at that straightaway and wide open looks like a 40mph street not a 30mph street. I don't see a lot of posted speed limit signs.

[Paseofreak]

Revenue, baby, revenue! It's a sad, sad thing when the government turns against the people with malice and afore thought.

[sooner88]

I drive that part of 10th once or twice a month. Sporadically enough that I forget what the speed limit is, but I've caught myself multiple times going 40-45 before I see a speed limit sign. In no way does it feel like you should be going that slow.

[Urbanized]

Section line roads don't HAVE to be 4-lane, high-speed. It depends on the area and the availability of other arterials nearby. Pennsylvania, through Nichols Hills, is 25 MPH. Western Avenue where it runs through Wheeler district is proposed to be narrowed and reduced to 25 MPH.

[Pete]

Can anyone think of any OKC major (as in section line) 4-lane road that has a 30 MPH speed limit?

I cannot.

[OKCDrummer77]

Can anyone think of any OKC major (as in section line) 4-lane road that has a 30 MPH speed limit?

I cannot.

MacArthur, just north of NW Expressway. In its defense, it is a somewhat hilly and curvy road right there as it goes through the "survey correction" that all section line roads go through at Wilshire Blvd.

[Urbanized]

Here is an excellent NACTO page discussing design/target/posted speeds and their relationships: Design Speed - National Association of City Transportation Officials

[adaniel]

Can anyone think of any OKC major (as in section line) 4-lane road that has a 30 MPH speed limit?

I cannot.

Broadway, between 13th and 23rd, which is also a massive speed trap. The cops frequently hide in the bakery lot just on the other side of the hill.

[Pete]

^
Broadway, between 13th and 23rd, which is also a massive speed trap. The cops frequently hide in the bakery lot just on the other side of the hill.

Yes! Although Broadway isn't a section line road.

I was actually pulled over there once going about 40 but just received a warning.

[turnpup]

Broadway, between 13th and 23rd, which is also a massive speed trap. The cops frequently hide in the bakery lot just on the other side of the hill.

Yikes! Guess I'm lucky because I travel that route 2 x per day at least now and haven't run into the speed trap. Thanks for the heads-up. Going to be much more careful now. It's really easy to get over 30 on that stretch.

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

"Can anyone think of any OKC major (as in section line) 4-lane road that has a 30 MPH speed limit?"

That stretch of 23rd from the Gold Dome to Penn is 30, plus they have those flashing yellow school slowdown lights too. People fly though

[Urbanized]

Britton Road through old town Britton

[ctchandler]

Britton Road through old town Britton

Urbanized,
Actually, it's 25 mph. Going East on Britton, it's 35 till you hit Western, then it's 25 for about half a mile, then it's 35 again. After you cross Broadway, it's 45.
C. T.

[Pete]

^

Right, just that brief stretch and no doubt due to a pretty big curve that makes it very difficult to make a left turn off of Wilshire onto MacArthur.

I doubt many people are blazing through there due to the curve itself which tends to slow down traffic.

[Urbanized]

Yeah, if it is <10 MPH over, like rezman says, it is called a "municipal violation" and is not reported to the database that insurance companies use. Cops love it because those tickets are contested less (they have to appear in court to testify against you on the docket date for a ticket), and because they can come off as a good guy who gave you a break, while still ringing you up for a hundy. If he stuck to the 14 over you're right about him being a bit of a jerk.

Edit: also like Martin says.

[rezman]

Pete, did the officer code the ticket so it wouldn't go on your insurance? I was stopped by OCPD on N Western between 150th & 164th. He said he clocked me @ 54 in the posted 40 zone, but wrote the ticket for 10 over to keep it off of my insurance, as anything 11mph and over will get their attention. I didn't have to say anything. He just came to my window, took my license, and came back with the ticket and told me how he wrote it, including the court date and how to pay for it, and to have a good day.

[Urbanized]

That section of 10th where you got your ticket was a fairly recent widening. It was late in Paul Brum's tenure and was widened mostly just "because it was there," if you listened to the Public Works explanations of the project. There were rarely actual TRAFFIC issues there that caused it, other than people coming off of I-44 and complaining that they couldn't drive 40 MPH straight to Saint Anthony or wherever they were headed.

In retrospect, it would have been much healthier for the surrounding neighborhoods if there had been a single lane, a parking lane, and either a center turn lane in lieu of the median or slip lanes in the median instead. The 4 lane, fast traffic and no street parking approach has made it that much more difficult to attract commercial and mixed use projects on that corridor. Though the two RFPs have attracted interest, they would have made much more sense with on-street parking available for the proposed first-floor commercial. In turn this would have benefited CTP and the neighborhood south of 10th, adding some services and walkability to areas where the residents either really value it OR really need it.

[Martin]

was the ticket issued for 1-10 over or for 11 over? afaik, in oklahoma 10 or less over doesn't result in any points on a regular driver's license and therefore shouldn't affect your insurance. -M

edit: refer to page 6 of this document to see what i'm talking about: https://www.dps.state.ok.us/recm/VCB.pdf

[Pete]

was the ticket issued for 1-10 over or for 11 over? afaik, in oklahoma 10 or less over doesn't result in any points on a regular driver's license and therefore shouldn't affect your insurance. -M

edit: refer to page 6 of this document to see what i'm talking about: https://www.dps.state.ok.us/recm/VCB.pdf

Hey hey! So glad I sought the collective wisdom of this site.

Even though he wrote "41/30" on the ticket, the violation was for "Speeding 1-10 over".

So, it looks like this won't even appear on my record. You think the guy would have bothered to tell me this, but he literally just handed me the ticket and walked away, without a word.

Still $161 bloody dollars but better than having to pay another $200 or have higher insurance premium.

Thanks Martin.

[gamecock]

I have not had any type of violation in many years so now I have to decide if I want to suck it up and go to traffic school to keep this off my driving record.

Problem is, that's an additional $200 (!) on top of the $161 for the ticket.

My car is older (and so am I) and thus my car insurance is very low.

Is it worth $200 to keep this off my record?[/QUOTE]

I recently got a ticket, too, and I took an online course that cost $29. It only took about 1.5 hours to complete the online course and earn the certificate. For me, it was worth it.