Urban Vs. Suburban

[Plutonic Panda]

How about a civilized urban vs. suburban discussion?

I want OKC to have the beauty of the option. I realize urban living will likely win out here on this board, and that's fine.

I want the option for people to live in a place such as this:
















I want these kinds of places in OKC... I also want these















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Shopping/dining/staying at places like this









and this









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Having the option of transportation solutions such as these
















and these













Now not all of these examples need to be to scale and most of them would likely be scaled down a little bit, but that is the general idea. I want an urban ring from I-240/I-35(to downtown) and then I235-I-44- Continued over I-40. All of that would be urbanized creating one of the biggest/dense urban cities in the US.

Now, I do like very large highways but I am NOT advocating for this:




OKC can and will become a great city and we can have balance between urban and suburban living. As technology gets more advanced, cement will be engineered to last longer and become stronger resulting in reduced road costs.

I will also post in a bit what I consider to be acceptable sprawl and out of control sprawl.

[Plutonic Panda]

The poll is also based on no limitation what so ever. Money and feasibility are no object. If you had a choice on any of the four (1)Urban (2)Suburban (3)Ex-Urban (4)Rural; which would you pick?

[Plutonic Panda]

PS, this is also a special thread for Spartan, Just the Facts, and Paseofreak to understand I want new urbanism here and I want it to thrive and be successful. It seems that they think I am all about suburban and I am anti-urban.

[bradh]

holy crap, Auchan Hypermarket! What a failed place that was in Houston!

[Plutonic Panda]

holy crap, Auchan Hypermarket! What a failed place that was in Houston!

If it failed, it was due lack of upkeep and scaled back. I guarantee you it would've been successful under certain circumstances. I did not know it was located in Houston though but I suspect if something like that were to placed on Memorial, it would be a huge hit.

[Paseofreak]

Oh, I have so much to write here, but there's football on!

[Just the facts]

Oh, I have so much to write here, but there's football on!

It's half-time.

[Plutonic Panda]

Oh, I have so much to write here, but there's football on!

Please do. I want a nice debate with people and want to hear their opinions on this.

[Plutonic Panda]

And yes, it was me who voted for the suburban lifestyle. Not that it would be a surprise to anyone.

[Just the facts]

The difference between urban and suburban development is the amount of taxes people want to pay. It seems a lot of people want 1/4 acre lots but they don't want to pay the tax rate to support 1/4 acre lot development. How much longer do you think that combination can last? Which option do you think will win-out in the end?

[Plutonic Panda]

The difference between urban and suburban development is the amount of taxes people want to pay. It seems a lot of people want 1/4 acre lots but they don't want to pay the tax rate to support 1/4 acre lot development. How much longer do you think that combination can last? Which option do you think will win-out in the end?

So raise property taxes. Add a mileage tax. Raise the gas tax 10 cents. Legalize Marijuana and use that to support education resulting in a diversion of property taxes and other sorts to transit and highway funding. There are options for this.

[Paseofreak]

For the record, I don't think you are anti-urban, i just think suburban development and lifestyle are inherently inefficient and the further the sprawl goes it becomes exponentially harder to support and overwhelms the capacity of existing infrastructure to accommodate, and is therefore unsustainable. This remains a discussion.

[Plutonic Panda]

For the record, I don't think you are anti-urban, i just think suburban development and lifestyle are inherently inefficient and the further the sprawl goes it becomes exponentially harder to support and overwhelms the capacity of existing infrastructure to accommodate, and is therefore unsustainable. This remains a discussion.

It is no question whether--at this rate--sprawl and suburban building styles/practices are inefficient and take tons of more money to accommodate people(which makes it possible to live there)as opposed to urban living and I understand that.

If everyone lived in cities like Paris, think how much money and energy we could save...


My argument is, people like me want to live in suburban areas for--what "we" consider--increased quality of life. Nice large private back yards and front yards(something most urban housing doesn't have). Quietness and peacefulness... birds out, big trees and gardens, children playing in the yard not on the street, etc.

I can understand wanting live in an area like Deep Deuce having the convince of walking and being able to walk to work or just taking a quick 2 minute walk to the store and back if you ran out of eggs or milk. I actually want to try living in a place like Deep Deuce one day to see if I like it.

I actually like getting in my car and driving to the store(just wished it was Tom Thumb instead of Homeland) and getting some milk and eggs. I enjoy driving my car down the highway having my own air-conditioning settings, radio(blasting music), seeing something on the side of the road and being able to stop and pull over quickly, having nice comfortable/adjustable seats. You don't really get this with buses and other mass transit. However, you have to deal with traffic and such, but I can tolerate that and willing to accept it.

I can make an argument for buses as being able to text(not that people don't do it while driving anyways), getting work done, not having to deal with car maintenance and upkeep, no gas or fuel worries, not having to deal with traffic, being able to look out the window and admire the landscape etc. There are arguments for both sides.

[Plutonic Panda]

Also, biking is awesome to. I ride a lot around Edmond and I want to buy a Cannondale 700 from Schlegel Bicycles in Auto Alley. I just need $1,800 lol

I plan on riding 15 miles a day and want to ride from Edmond to Downtown OKC at least once a week. I have done that on a mountain bike and it was hell, but it took me about 2 hours.

[Urbanized]

Man, that was more work than one of my 20 paragraph posts.

[bchris02]

I agree. OKC should expand its options for both urban and suburban living. One thing that is the truth is for a city that is so suburban oriented like this one, we don't do suburbia very well. Other cities are light years ahead in many ways in the types of suburban shopping centers and neighborhoods being built. It would be nice to see suburban neighborhoods in OKC have more quality lifestyle centers, some even mixed use rather than travesties like Belle Isle (which is the standard in OKC). It would be nice to see more landscaping and beautification in suburban areas. We see some of that in Edmond and in Norman but not so much in OKC proper. Suburbia can grow and develop with more dignity than has been the norm in OKC. For instance, take a look at the suburban neighborhoods in the pictures above. Even the tract house subdivisions have sidewalks and landscaping. Why don't we see that in OKC? Why don't we see suburban shopping centers that have some class like those pictured above? Why do they all have to be like Belle Isle? This is another area, while not talked about much on OKCTalk, where the bar needs to be raised.

[bluedogok]

For me, ex-urban bordering on rural at this point in my life. Preferably not working downtown like we do now, I am tired of working in downtown. We rarely go downtown (except for work) unless it is for a Broncos, Rockies, Avalanche game or some other event which is only a few times a year.

[bchris02]

As for my choice in the poll, if I had my way I would prefer to live in suburbia but with easy access to urban amenities.

[flintysooner]

I had to think about this.

Since being an adult I've lived in suburban areas near my work and other places I go regularly. I am a little over 5 miles away now and I was even closer when I lived in the Kansas City area. So living near work and church and other family and other responsibilities has always been a big factor in choosing a place to live.

But I still have farmland both rural and exurban. Truth be told I'd rather live on the rural farm if there were no other issues except my personal preference. And the poll question was to ignore constraints.

Of course in real life there are constraints that cannot be avoided.

[Plutonic Panda]

Here are some more shopping centers

[ljbab728]

Plupan, I think we get what you're trying to say.

[Midtowner]

I loved my time living in downtown OKC. When it came time to get a big boy house, I just didn't find anything downtown which met my needs--or at least nothing south of ~$200/square foot. When I could double my square footage, pay $75/square foot, have a 2 car garage and a yard for my then, desired but non-existent dog to crap in, the math for downtown didn't add up.

[Plutonic Panda]

I loved my time living in downtown OKC. When it came time to get a big boy house, I just didn't find anything downtown which met my needs--or at least nothing south of ~$200/square foot. When I could double my square footage, pay $75/square foot, have a 2 car garage and a yard for my then, desired but non-existent dog to crap in, the math for downtown didn't add up.

Just so you know, the poll does not factor in money. So if you had unlimited funds, pick whichever you would prefer.

[flintysooner]

I don't care about shopping centers or bars or restaurants or basketball games or crowds of people. I am glad I've gotten to enjoy all those things but they hold no interest for me now.

But being out on the Gator in the pasture or along the creek, or being in the trees so far you can't tell one direction from another -- those things thrill me now -- even when it's 7 degrees or 105.

I like buildings, especially those that are nicely designed and quality I've only lived in apartments twice in my life. Neither experience makes me ever want to do it again voluntarily.

[Mel]

I want to live out in the sticks. With butt eating dogs and my choice of weapons. Coded gate with camera. Ready for the walkers, and salesmen.