Maps 4 Neighborhoods

[gopokes88]

Can we take this somewhere else?

[dankrutka]

Yeah, this discussion should definitely be moved... But, in the meantime, he's a breakdown on state spending across different areas: http://www.governing.com/topics/educ...ng-states.html You'll notice that Oklahoma's administrative spending is comparable to other states. The funding is low across the board, particularly in money for teacher salaries.

[jerrywall]

I think it's relevant only in that the future of Maps could be affected by an increase in the state sales tax, but yeah.

[warreng88]

Actually it is way worse than that.

Oklahoma has 520 school districts.

Florida has 74.

Think about those numbers.

Thanks for the clarification. This was about five years ago when she brought it up and it feels like a new school district is popping up every day in Oklahoma, each with a super and support staff. I know it wouldn't make too much of a dent, but it would at least be a start to reducing the expenses without sacrificing the teachers and their salaries.

[dankrutka]

Actually it is way worse than that.

Oklahoma has 520 school districts.

Florida has 74.

Think about those numbers.

So, here's a comparison between Oklahoma and Florida per pupil spending:

Florida school administration spending: $481
Oklahoma school administration spending: $447

Florida general administration spending: $78
Oklahoma general administration spending: $252

I would guess that the difference in those latter numbers is superintendent spending, but I'd have to do some more research.

Source: http://www.governing.com/topics/educ...ng-states.html

[Laramie]

It wouldn't hurt to consolidate some districts that are willing to consolidate. Give those districts some kind of incentive who are willing to consolidate.

Grandfather and phase out (5 - 7 year process) those extra administrative/support personnel staff as two or more districts consolidate.

The Oklahoma City metro area alone has over 14 districts when you count Oklahoma City, Midwest City-Del City, Luther, Harrah, Jones, Oakdale, Choctaw-Nicoma Park, Crutcho, Piedmont, Putnam City, Millwood, Western Heights, Crooked Oak, Bethany & McLoud.

[HangryHippo]

So, here's a comparison between Oklahoma and Florida per pupil spending:

Florida school administration spending: $481
Oklahoma school administration spending: $447

Florida general administration spending: $78
Oklahoma general administration spending: $252

I would guess that the difference in those latter numbers is superintendent spending, but I'd have to do some more research.

Source: http://www.governing.com/topics/educ...ng-states.html

School district consolidation should be priority #1. It's asinine how many districts and administrations there are in this state. The number of superintendents and their salaries is criminal. Fix this and then OK would have some additional funding for teacher salaries to get the ball rolling.

[aDark]

School district consolidation =/= Maps 4. Please move this conversation. I keep coming to this thread looking for updates on Maps 4 only be let down be a discussion of how crappy our current state of education is. We know. It sucks. Let's talk about Maps 4 in this thread.

[Midtowner]

Whatever ideas anyone has on consolidation, no one really cares. The legislature is still largely rural-dominated. Consolidation is dead on arrival--and that's a bipartisan notion. It's better to talk about problems which actually have solutions. It's also not a major issue. I believe if you add all of the administrator salaries together, you get something around $20 million, which is chump change in a $1.5 billionish budget.

Suggesting that education cannot be fixed if first we can't address this politically non-fixable thing is holding Oklahoma's children hostage when the legislature is unwilling to negotiate that point. Best focus on something else.

[Laramie]

Well, we won't have to concern ourselves with any of the state's pork barrel spending until post 2020; that's how long it will take to dig out of this hole. We still have the rainy day fund which could be used wisely as we weather this storm.



Any new ideas that would help spruce up our neighborhoods or improve infrastructure like sidewalks, lighting & drainage to the tune of $200 million.

[KayneMo]

I would love for a MAPS 4 Neighborhoods, especially in regards to completing the sidewalk system. My neighborhood probably wouldn't see any of this initiative at all but that's fine, I'd still vote in favor of it for the benefit of others.

[Pete]

The sidewalks make such a big difference.

They put new ones in all throughout my neighborhood and along Penn from NW Expressway to 36th.

It's nice to see the kids walking to the neighborhood school and not having to walk in the street.

And I see lots of people just using them for walking... Women with strollers, older couples, etc.

[David]

I'm quite happy about the new sidewalk on the west side of Penn, that is right in my neighborhood too. I think it extends north of NW Expressway all the way to 63rd, if I am correctly remembering the construction I've been seeing.

[AP]

I really wish they would add sidewalks to my neighborhood. It seems like there are a significant number of neighborhoods in the core that don't have them. I live at 42nd and Classen and no sidewalks. It makes no sense.

[shawnw]

I really wish they would add sidewalks to my neighborhood. It seems like there are a significant number of neighborhoods in the core that don't have them. I live at 42nd and Classen and no sidewalks. It makes no sense.

Not the solution you're looking for by any means, and no excuse for the current lack of sidewalks, but the city has a program where they will split the cost of putting in a sidewalk with homeowners. You could potentially hasten sidewalks in your hood if you got with your neighbors and worked with the city...

https://www.okc.gov/departments/publ...cement-program

[shawnw]

I would also recommend making sure your councilor knows your feelings before the next GO bond election.

[Pete]

Council members planning for MAPS 4
By: Brian Brus The Journal Record January 24, 2017

OKLAHOMA CITY – The next MAPS special sales tax issue for Oklahoma City should focus more on the foundational aspects of the community and fewer showcase projects, City Council members said.

Regardless of the struggling, local economy, the fourth iteration in the Metropolitan Area Projects series will definitely happen, and probably sooner than later, said Councilman James Greiner and others.

“The overall feedback that I’m getting is that people wouldn’t be against it,” Greiner said. “They’re already expressing support for a big bond issue for street repairs and work on the infrastructure.”

Mayor Mick Cornett in his January 2009 State of the City address announced the launch of MAPS 3, which ended up as a $777 million package of projects supported by public vote at the end of that year. The penny sales tax expires in December.

Cornett didn’t mention anything about MAPS 4 at this year’s event, implying more work behind the scenes before it’s ready to be unveiled. Cornett’s office did not respond to a request for comment Tuesday.

However, council members have been thinking about what shape MAPS 4 should take. It cannot be a clone of the work now underway, Greiner said.

The first MAPS, like those to follow, was a temporary sales tax with an expiration date. It produced $350 million for renovations and construction of sites such as the Civic Center Music Hall, the Cox Convention Center, Oklahoma state fairgrounds, the downtown library and Bricktown Canal.

The second MAPS was given the suffix “For Kids” instead of a numeral because the $700 million initiative focused on school district improvements and repairs at more than 100 schools.

MAPS 3 focused again on municipal properties, promising a new convention center, senior wellness centers, 70-acre central park and downtown streetcar route.

Councilman John Pettis Jr., like Greiner, said it’s time to go back to basics.

“There definitely should be a strong emphasis on making improvements to the infrastructure in our city – streets, sidewalks, drainage and so forth,” Pettis said. “We need to focus on doing some things in neighborhoods.”

Greiner added that MAPS 4 might even need a new name to distance itself from the old mold. The public might want a break between temporary sales taxes to avoid the sense that MAPS is a permanent fixture in city growth. He said a lot of that fatigue comes from too much attention to downtown showcase sites such as the river and convention center.

Before City Hall can place a printing order for MAPS 4 ballots, however, officials have to convince the public to support a massive general obligation bond issue. The GO bond issuance is a regular feature of municipal government in Oklahoma, necessary for funding municipal projects such as street repairs, police station buildings and rainwater drainage systems for several years at a time. The last GO bond issue in 2007 totaled $835.5 million; this round will likely top $1 billion.

Councilman Pete White said he believes the GO bond issue will be supported by the public, possibly with a slight increase to annual tax bills property owners receive from the county assessor’s office. But it still won’t be enough to raise the standard residents are expecting now. Additional infrastructure works should be pushed into MAPS 4, he said.

“We’re going to try to get as much of that sort of work in the bond issue as we can,” White said. “It will be primarily parks, streets, sidewalks and that kind of thing. … The projects will be focused outside the core of the city this time – arterial streets, for example.”

Pettis said his constituents don’t want to break development momentum.

“I don’t think it should be delayed. Voters are ready to continue to improve the infrastructure,” Pettis said. “Yes, we have the GO bond happening this year. But I still believe we have to do more sooner, and that would be MAPS 4.”

[KayneMo]

How about MAPS for US (for Upgrading Streets and neighborhood inclusiveness)?

[bradh]

has James Greiner ever even been inside the core? He speaks like spending in the core has been a total waste.

[dankrutka]

He said a lot of that fatigue comes from too much attention to downtown showcase sites such as the river and convention center.

I've never heard anyone say, "I'm really worn out by how popular the Cheseapeake Arena and baseball stadium and the canal have been. Just completely fatigued by their success."

[mkjeeves]

Greiner is my councilman and I appreciate his voice. He just saved me from giving him an earful about issues in our ward. Or maybe I'll add some praise.

[Zuplar]

I think it's going to be hard to convince people to vote for MAPS if it's neighborhood oriented and it's not their neighborhood.

[ABCOKC]

Greiner added that MAPS 4 might even need a new name to distance itself from the old mold. The public might want a break between temporary sales taxes to avoid the sense that MAPS is a permanent fixture in city growth. He said a lot of that fatigue comes from too much attention to downtown showcase sites such as the river and convention center.

Well as long as they're promoting a losing cause I'd appreciate it if they'd drop the MAPS brand so we can come back with an actual MAPS 4 on a future ballot.

Also I'm sorry but "The public might want a break between temporary sales taxes"? What exactly is he proposing if not a temporary sales tax? Isn't this supposed to be a penny tax?

[emtefury]

Well as long as they're promoting a losing cause I'd appreciate it if they'd drop the MAPS brand so we can come back with an actual MAPS 4 on a future ballot.

Also I'm sorry but "The public might want a break between temporary sales taxes"? What exactly is he proposing if not a temporary sales tax? Isn't this supposed to be a penny tax?

The is deceptive and I believe so for a reason. Penny sales tax equals 1 percent extra on your sales tax. Instead of it being about 7.xx percent the tax is 8.xx with the MAPS tax.

[Laramie]

Calling it another name related to the tax collection theme; shorten the collection period to 2 to 4 year collection period will allow the city to focus on the primary projects.

A capital sales tax crafted projects which would extend the current MAPS III collections could be called:

OKC Neighborhood Infrastructure & Cornerstone Enhancements (OKC NICE).

1. Eight Wards to divide amount collected (formula) based on each ward's population & collections.

2. Council members to schedule meetings with citizens in their Wards to decide projects.

3. Collect sales taxes until collection period expires; divide proportionately the amount collected.

Continue with the MAPS brand following OKC NICE.