Personally, I think present day Frontier City and White Water Bay need to shut down.

Going into dream mode here...

I would like to see a group of local investors take advantage of the "adventure district" area up there. Buyout the assets of the current parks and close them down. Then partner with a company like Cedar Fair and redevelop Frontier City in or near the same location. Introduce new rides (to Oklahoma), expand the offering, and freshen up the area. Then build a new White Water Bay next to Frontier City, but increase the size and offering. I would recommend even an indoor water park/hotel that you tend to find up north a lot, even now in Dallas. Having it next to Frontier City will allow people to travel between the two.

Then I would like to see some sort of transportation method from the theme park area of the district down to the Zoo, Science Museum, Western Heritage Museum, and Remington Park. Eventually extend this to the Bricktown area.

I also wouldn't be half against relocating Frontier City/WWB to near the Zoo/Remington now...but I'm just afraid of the animal smell. So now we have a connection between the two...monorail or whatever (dreaming here remember). The new locally backed Adventure District Group (ADG) will handle managing the relationships and will setup programs such as season park passes to all of the attractions with admission. Will also be the main advocating group for additional development of the parks to grow their offering. Ideally with joint partnerships helping to grow the parks, we would be able to keep expanding their offerings and even promote further development in the remaining empty areas between the two locations.

I know it is all a dream, but when you step back - you can look and see the opportunity here to create an actual resort destination that people in the region can go to. I would like to see more man made water features and hotels built in the area. Also the old airport in the area, I think would be a great location for a new Air & Space Museum. The runway isn't serviceable, but most aircraft don't have to be flown in - or it could probably be redone with donations that normally are put together for things like this.

Blah blah blah. Yeah it is a big long shot dream. However, a concentrated area of attractions like this offers something very few cities have. We need to take advantage of it.

but this has alrady been thought up, plus fronteir city isnt not even using half the land it already owns

but this has alrady been thought up, plus fronteir city isnt not even using half the land it already owns

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There is an old adage that quotes:....Location, location, location...However, it needs to be customers, customers, customers.....We can all sit here and think up ways to spend other peoples money but, I haven't been out to frontier City in years how about the rest of you????? If WE the locals don't financially support these places, what makes an investor want to spend his/her money here....Animal Smell????? Go to Allen, Texas and see the old Outlet Mall that is Flourishing tremendously....We don't support our outlet Malls...Oh, that's right, we demolished them because they went broke from lack of support.....on any given day you can see numerous Oklahoma Tagged cars in Allen....Hmmmmm..

A few years ago, Frontier City was rumored to relocate to a huge land on the corner of I-240 and I-35. That plan fell thru. Personally, I want Frontier City to NOT close. They have a long way to restore and they are getting there. Relax, this is only the 1st year under new management.

OK, I've posted my own history on Frontier City at www.okchistory.com

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Somewhere in my piles of "Junk" I have some pictures of the Semi-Centennial...1957....And, yes there was an old frontier town in the pictures. The two guys who owned the candy shop at Frontier City were in the '57 centennial and they moved to the present location with the move. They have both since passed away....The move was to get the rest of the fairgrounds available to build the State Fairgrounds as we know it today. The race track put the demise to the old Taft Stadium Stock Car Races....those were fun and exciting......

so there were stock car races at taft. i thought i rembered going there with my dad back in the late 50's or so and watching races there and even a destruction derby or two?

so there were stock car races at taft. i thought i rembered going there with my dad back in the late 50's or so and watching races there and even a destruction derby or two?

Both tracks ran for a few years overlapping. Quarter mile track at Taft and Half mile at the Fair Grounds. And, yep, there were destruction derbies at Taft.

A few years ago, Frontier City was rumored to relocate to a huge land on the corner of I-240 and I-35. That plan fell thru. Personally, I want Frontier City to NOT close. They have a long way to restore and they are getting there. Relax, this is only the 1st year under new management.

First year? This is the third year that the park has been run by PARC...Six Flags sold it to them in 2007. Although I think that they have made some improvement by improving the rides (adding the Steel Lasso and Quick Draw), I think that they have a long way to go as far as customer service goes. I worked at FC while both Six Flags and PARC owned the park, and I have to say that the "new management" is just as bad (if not worse in some ways) as far as attitudes towards customers and employees go.

They need to figure out how to get employees who do not suck and who actually care about their jobs....because the majority of good employees are going elsewhere to work. And heck, they need to figure out how to get enough employees to begin with to staff the rides department. Most of the time I worked there, there were days that they did not have enough employees to even open all of the rides (even with the temp agency workers they brought in).

I truly do want to see a park like Frontier City succeed...but sadly I don't see it going anywhere with current management.

Steve is so right about the Wikipedia entry on Frontier City being riddled with errors. I thought surely this had to have been discussed on this forum before and knowing the name of one of the three guys who had Frontier City in some its biggest days back in the early 80's, Gary Story, I did a search on his name and found this old thread: http://www.okctalk.com/okc-metro-area-talk/2518-did-you-know-about-okc.html#post15886 So you don't have to click over, here was the post -

"Frontier City was going to be razed and turned into a shopping plaza along I-35 until Gary Story took over."

Actually it was saved by Tierco Properties which was headed up by Brad Swickey and another guy whose name escapes me. When they bought the park in the early eighties it was run down and on its last shallow breath of air. Swickey hired Gary Story from Six Flags Over Texas to "save Frontier City." The rest is history. Story went on to become President and CEO of Six Flags, Inc. after Tierco became Premier Parks and Premier purchased Six Flags. Had it not been for the last gasp efforts of a few visionaries at Tierco, who were determined to save Frontier City as a theme park, it would be as Pulse correctly wrote, a strip center. Swickey was a banker at heart and went back to his first love to (I think) Local Federal. Today, he is a founder and president of Valliance Bank. Quite a story that I heard recited not too long ago at a Chamber function. It shows brilliantly that it sometimes just takes one or two to see something different, and turn certain failure into huge success. Frontier City is still a part of our city (and it became much more than that) because a couple of guys sat in an office and saw possibilities. Their decision to bring the then little-known Gary Story to Oklahoma City changed everything - and is a chapter in itself of Oklahoma City history.

That's also the way I remember it. There was a few years there, four to five, where Frontier City was one great little park. Beautiful landscaping, redone walkways, new rides, fresh paint, that new management.

The Wikipedia entry is seriously flawed.

Gary did a lot for the park, and for the local BSA council. I suspect he had his hand in several other improvements in the area as well.

I often wonder what kind of insurance protection a place like Frontier City has?

It's bad enough if someone were injured by a ride.

Today if kids fight it's with knives and guns.

The Wikipedia entry is seriously flawed.

FIX IT!

http://i31.tinypic.com/qxrjfs.jpg

Just read it and wow, it's so wrong in so many ways. The factual errors are way out of line.

Just curious, did you correct it since it's Wiki?

ha! Yeah, Gary and Manny had some ideas for the park alright. Wow.

Just curious, did you correct it since it's Wiki?

Naw, man, it's easier to just throw up a thread here to bitch about how inaccurate the Wikipedia page is and hope that someone else corrects it, than it is to just fix the Wikipedia page yourself and move on. Come on.

Metro and Matt, I've tried to make changes to Wiki before and they were either not posted or posted and then thrown out. That experience has me soured on Wiki as a source and on its editing options. Not worth my time. I simply stumbled on the page while doing research and was surprised at how bad it was. And I didn't just throw up a thread to bitch - I've posted what I hope is a more accurate history online.
(I'm encouraged to know that this forum's participants are against simply putting up threads "bitching" about problems and are more interested in setting things right).

Metro and Matt, I've tried to make changes to Wiki before and they were either not posted or posted and then thrown out. That experience has me soured on Wiki as a source and on its editing options. Not worth my time. I simply stumbled on the page while doing research and was surprised at how bad it was. And I didn't just throw up a thread to bitch - I've posted what I hope is a more accurate history online.
(I'm encouraged to know that this forum's participants are against simply putting up threads "bitching" about problems and are more interested in setting things right).

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Hey Steve:....you know that the old-timers are more interested in correct memories than to just gripe and bitch. We don't open a thread for that kind of stuff.....anyway, a lot of us remember when Frontier City actually opened.....Thanks for staying with us and on top of reality.....Matt...Metro....Hot dogs are on me if you show for the Nostalgic group at Coit's this month....Not you papaOU...oh, that's right your team is playing aren't they...

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Hey Steve:....you know that the old-timers are more interested in correct memories than to just gripe and bitch. We don't open a thread for that kind of stuff.....anyway, a lot of us remember when Frontier City actually opened.....Thanks for staying with us and on top of reality.....Matt...Metro....Hot dogs are on me if you show for the Nostalgic group at Coit's this month....Not you papaOU...oh, that's right your team is playing aren't they...

I'll be there because the 26th is an open date.

You must be talking about the Tulsa game on 9/19.

That meeting date has been moved to the 26th.

I'll be there because the 26th is an open date.

You must be talking about the Tulsa game on 9/19.

That meeting date has been moved to the 26th.

It think they're talking about the Southwestern Bulldogs. They're in Texas,
so the whole weekend is clear.

...Matt...Metro....Hot dogs are on me if you show for the Nostalgic group at Coit's this month...

Can't. Busy editing the Frontier City article on Wikipedia.

Good luck getting the corrections to stick.

Oh, I'll make 'em stick.

Oh, I'll make 'em stick.
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Go for it...if it doesn't work you owe Steve the Hotdogs...That's
the way the game is played.....Like to me you....tell you about opening day at
Frontier City.....or maybe about the original town that was at the Semi-Centennial celebration 1957.....were you there????

Go for it...if it doesn't work you owe Steve the Hotdogs...That's the way the game is played.....

I don't remember ever entering into any agreement which could possibly result in me owing Steve hot dogs.


Like to me you....tell you about opening day at Frontier City.....or maybe about the original town that was at the Semi-Centennial celebration 1957.....were you there????

I think my first visit to Frontier City was probably about thirty years after that. http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/8697/lolr.gif



(Wait: Am I in the "Nostalgia & Memories" section? I'm in the "Nostalgia & Memories" section, aren't I?)

/backs out very slowly

The General is a slick negotiator. It could be worse - he could have slipped in a Root Beer as well.
On a more serious note, I really meant what I said with Wikipedia. I've tried to correct it before and was totally frustrated in my efforts.

I have no doubt Steve. I long ago stopped trying to do anything over there. Some folks have agendas that simply weren't worth my time and energy. Maybe back in my twenties, but I'm a tad more selective in time commitments these days, even if I'm not any smarter.

Here it is the ending of the Summer...kids are getting ready for Back to School and no one on this thread has even mentioned Frontier City this the Summer of '10

Here it is the ending of the Summer...kids are getting ready for Back to School and no one on this thread has even mentioned Frontier City this the Summer of '10

General, is Frontier City even operating this year? I drove out by that part of town earlier this summer, and I swear it looked like the place was mothballed - grass overgrown in the parking lot, signs in disrepair, etc. Maybe its still going, but it sure didn't look very appealing from the outside.

After reading several stories regarding how the company that had previously owned Six Flags bankrupted the company, it makes it all the more amazing the place has lasted this long. The beginning of the end of that previous ownership group was when they decided to sell off Astroworld because its property was deemed so valuable, so they closed and demolished the park - only to find that the property didn't bring in half (a quarter?) of what they expected....

I went by Frontier City on Saturday and it looked pretty well packed. But, I just wonder if it's only opened on Week-ends...does anyone know?

The beginning of the end of that previous ownership group was when they decided to sell off Astroworld because its property was deemed so valuable, so they closed and demolished the park - only to find that the property didn't bring in half (a quarter?) of what they expected....

I'm 75% sure that decision was made by the current Six Flags management, just after the hostile takeover which led to the sale of FC and the company's departure from OKC. Story's regime did a great job until they overextended themselves.


I still think that the only way we'll have a great theme park in OKC (or one at all) is by sticking with Frontier City in it's current location. It needs a lot of money sunk into it to bring the crowds back, but it would cost a lot more to start from scratch.

Some of the vacant properties by Frontier City need to be remodled or torn down. The vacant Red Carpet Motel next door looks hideous. The vacant properties make Frontier City look bad. I like Frontier City and hope it stays open. The park and the areas around it need improvement.

Bigray in Ok

I agree. The old Red Carpet is a true eyesore.

I'm 75% sure that decision was made by the current Six Flags management, just after the hostile takeover which led to the sale of FC and the company's departure from OKC. Story's regime did a great job until they overextended themselves.


I could be wrong, but I'm pretty darned sure the decision to dump Astroworld was done by the group, led by Kieran Burke (sp?) that owned SF *before* the hostile takeover. In fact, from what I recall reading, that shutdown/sale fiasco was one of the catalysts *for* the hostile takeover by Shapiro.



I still think that the only way we'll have a great theme park in OKC (or one at all) is by sticking with Frontier City in it's current location. It needs a lot of money sunk into it to bring the crowds back, but it would cost a lot more to start from scratch.

Yeah, sure would. I hate to be a pessimist, but I'm not sure the circumstances are in FC's favor. Theme parks, in general, are having a pretty rough go, and the successful ones have ticket prices so high that it almost makes them unreasonable. A non-discounted single-day adult ticket up at Silver Dollar City is $51, and I don't think that park is half the size of Six Flags over Texas.

Theme parks need lots of land, lots of startup capital, a close highway, and lots and lots of regular regional visitors to make it a true destination site. That's a tough call here, I fear. Not saying its impossible, of course, but it just isn't going to be easy. I think it would be great to have a successful, high-profile theme park here in OKC...

I think it's possible with the right strategy. They've got plenty of land and plenty of locals that remember the park's glory days fondly. They've also got nearby Tulsa, Wichita, Amarillo, and Little Rock with no theme parks so that's a large region to draw from. They just need the capital to get things going.

You are partially right about Astroworld. It was the previous management's idea, but ultimately the new management under Mark Shapiro went through with the sale.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2005_Sept_12/ai_n15385833/?tag=rel.res3
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4182/is_20050919/ai_n15358561/
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2006_June_1/ai_n26883357/
http://www.sixflagshouston.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=10009&sid=47005790adc020af5ef9cad478614a48 (scroll down)

I agree. The old Red Carpet is a true eyesore.

It has great architectural "bones" and could be a real jewel under the right circumstances...

True. It has a pretty unique design.

Hey, Amarillo has had a local theme park for ever and it is still going strong. Similar to the old Springlake with a wild roller coaster...North side of Amarillo. Amarillo also has Palo Duro Canyon....Western theme with Cowboy style events and a play like there used to be in northern Oklahoma...

Here it is the ending of the Summer...kids are getting ready for Back to School and no one on this thread has even mentioned Frontier City this the Summer of '10

I have been by there several days and times. Pretty packed and traffic backed-up.

By the way. Frontier City is not on Wikipedia, it's on the west side of I35

General, is Frontier City even operating this year? I drove out by that part of town earlier this summer, and I swear it looked like the place was mothballed - grass overgrown in the parking lot, signs in disrepair, etc. Maybe its still going, but it sure didn't look very appealing from the outside.
We went there on Memorial Day weekend.


After reading several stories regarding how the company that had previously owned Six Flags bankrupted the company, it makes it all the more amazing the place has lasted this long. The beginning of the end of that previous ownership group was when they decided to sell off Astroworld because its property was deemed so valuable, so they closed and demolished the park - only to find that the property didn't bring in half (a quarter?) of what they expected....
Drove by there coming back from Galveston during Spring Break this year, the entire area is still vacant. You can look at it on Google Earth and it is there on the January 2006, a dirt patch on the October 2006 slide and grass starting to fill it in on the January 2008 slide. Here's a blogpost (http://swamplot.com/green-and-wiggly-astroworld-redevelopment-plan-coulda-been-a-contender/2010-06-14/) about what could have been.

Wanna be in for a scare at Frontier City this year? :LolLolLol


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8re5TUIo8M

That was a cute little coaster in its day.

^
formerly 'the orange blossom special', right? -M

The current owners of frontier city PARC seems to be having problems paying its bills and is eliminating some of its properties, and they are saying frontier city is one of them, but thats good news because the buzz is Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation has put a bid in on frontier city, I hope they get it because Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation knows how to run a successful theme park, they own branson silver dollar city and dollywood

The current owners of frontier city PARC seems to be having problems paying its bills and is eliminating some of its properties, and they are saying frontier city is one of them, but thats good news because the buzz is Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation has put a bid in on frontier city, I hope they get it because Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation knows how to run a successful theme park, they own branson silver dollar city and dollywood

I haven't had the pleasure of visiting Dollywood but Silver Dollar City is one of the nicest amusement parks anywhere.

i agree, i hope this turns out, and Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation takes over and completely remakes frontier city into a real themed frontier land, Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation is really good at theming, its tie between theme and disney parks when it comes to great family parks..please oh please, this is what okc really needs

If true, this could be the best thing to ever happen at Frontier City. Its past ownership groups have been focused more on short-term shareholder value (and keeping a step ahead of their creditors). Herschend seems to be more long-term oriented, and they have an awesome portfolio of successful entertainment venues all over the nations... dinner theaters, aquariums, etc. Plus, their wholesome "family values" mission seems a good fit for OKC. I expect to see great things if this goes forward. Frontier City has such potential and has languished for so long.

They also own Wild Adventures in Valdosta, Georgia which has a pretty good collection of coasters. Dollywood will blow you away. It is really nice.

There is a huge vacant tract just west of Frontier City that would allow for great expansion of the park.

As others have said, so much potential.

If some money was invested in this park (updated, newer rides, etc. ), it could be a draw for most of the state (not extreme Southern -- they'd go to Dallas), West Texas (Amarillo), and South Central Kansas (Wichita).

This park is full of potential.

Awesome news. Remember though too that Herschend has a history of closing parks that aren't profitable, so we just need to be careful. They closed Celebration City in Branson because it wasn't profitable. But, they really do a nice job with Silver Dollar City.

but if frontier city hada true theme to it, like silver dollar city does, it will attract more from texas area beacuse they dont have themed area..I go still as an adult to silver dollar city because i love the theme to it all.. I would be great to have old western city theme at frontier city, not just some pop up walls, all employees dressed up in old western days, carriage rides, late 1800s theme.. and Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation goes all out for christmas

i was there the day they closed celebration city down, that park was really cramped to begin with, plus branson really couldnt get enough tourist for 3 theme parks plus all the ohter attractions they have.. Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation still owns the property celebration city was on..

True. I do hope that keep the Frontier theme and run wild with it, because previous owners have kinda moved away from it, even though the park is still called that. I would prefer it stay a theme park with rides and not fringe on what Silver Dollar offers because that would just be copying...I think they'll probably do that though.

i hope they add great rides, im hoping they turn the park intoa a true western have western town and indian themed territory, I am just hoping for the best

If it was me, I would relocate the park to a bigger piece of property and start with a new layout and better rides. Move the good ones from where it is now and start over. Maybe even do a combo theme park and water park with an indoor component to keep things going year around. Sell the current land for a truck stop and even build a new resort hotel on the new property.

The wife and I went to Adventuredome in Veags many moons ago and it was pretty good.

http://www.adventuredome.com/rides_and_attractions.aspx

It's certainly interesting to see HFEC attempt to pick up the park again. They put in a bid on the park and a few others back when Six Flags was auctioning them off cheap, but pulled out early or were outbid by CNL.

I'm not holding my breath for HFEC to swoop in and build a mini-SDC though. For one, there's no certainty that CNL will sell unless they are made a good offer, and FC probably isn't worth all that much... I mean, the park was pretty much dead all summer with the only attendees being unsupervised children. Frightfest saw much better attendance, but again most of the crowd consisted of teens and rather scary-looking individuals. A lot of the major rides in the park flat out need to be replaced. To really turn this place around, HFEC would probably have to throw in a good $15-20 million, and have a solid plan for the next ten years or more.

They did plop $40 million to turn the old Branson USA park into Celebration City, and they've spent quite a lot turning Wild Adventures around, so it's definitely something they are in the business of doing these days. (Even though CC didn't pan out - there's a longer story there)

The current owners of frontier city PARC seems to be having problems paying its bills and is eliminating some of its properties, and they are saying frontier city is one of them, but thats good news because the buzz is Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation has put a bid in on frontier city, I hope they get it because Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation knows how to run a successful theme park, they own branson silver dollar city and dollywood

Source? Link? I can't find anything about PARC "having problems paying its bills." It may be true, but where's the proof? How do you know? What puts you in a position to know? Too many questions for all the discussion here to go much further. What has changed since this a few months back?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/stories/2010/04/19/story4.html

Kerry, PARC headquarters is in Jax - maybe you can do some sleuthing?

ON EDIT: Okay, I found some information and it confirms PARC's problems with paying the leases on the parks they manage. Key word is manage. Frontier City is still owned by CNL Lifestyles Properties. CNL states in the article I found (below) that they will seek a new third-party operator for their parks. As for Herschend Family Entertainment Corporation, they actually own Silver Dollar City and Dollywood (with co-owner Dolly Parton) among other parks and attractions. However, they do apparently operate (manage - not own) the Stone Mountain Park property in Atlanta. So, the question is could HFEC be interested in operating more parks as opposed to buying them? But, again, CNL still owns Frontier City and apparently is only terminating the lease with PARC to operate Frontier City and Whitewater Bay and will find another operator. No ownership change.
http://thedailynewsonline.com/news/article_00236ad4-f3be-11df-a4fc-001cc4c002e0.html

Thanks for the info, Mike. Sounds like Herschend would be a great fit for Frontier City.

I still think it would be a major mistake to move the park though. I can see moving White Water Bay so that it's adjacent/connected, but it's not like the park is in Stroud or something. It's a good location with rolling hills and mature trees, with plenty of room to expand. Moving it all would be cost prohibitive.

Thanks for the info, Mike. Sounds like Herschend would be a great fit for Frontier City.

I still think it would be a major mistake to move the park though. I can see moving White Water Bay so that it's adjacent/connected, but it's not like the park is in Stroud or something. It's a good location with rolling hills and mature trees, with plenty of room to expand. Moving it all would be cost prohibitive.

Agreed. The park needs more space, but there's plenty of undeveloped or underdeveloped property adjacent to the west. The location is fine where it is.