Unlucky post ^

:)

agreed

Unlucky post ^

:)

Would have been better if I had been talking about an Iron Maiden show.

Would have been better if I had been talking about an Iron Maiden show.

My daughter's roommates' dad founded Iron Maiden. Want an autograph? Haha!

I had the chance to visit the "Walgreens Upmarket: Fresh" at Sunset & Vine (extremely urbanized area) in LA over the holidays. If this is what is planned at the Century Center, I believe most participants on this board will be pleased. It is unlike any Walgreens I've seen. First of all, it's huge. Secondly, it has a coffee bar with real baristas and a nice selection of sandwiches and accoutrements; an attended fresh fruit bar; a frozen yogurt bar; and a large make-up department that rivals many department stores. Plus, it has all the usual Walgreens fare.

Yes, that particular Walgreens is really slick.

Just wanted to be clear, though, that this will be a CVS, who has it's own urban concept which is somewhat similar but certainly different.

Let's not let facts get in the way of misinformed rants

As a moderately reputable poster (if I can still say that lol) I do tend to think this development should be getting more scrutiny than the Stage Center Tower. Based on what stage this project is at and what we're getting on a lot equally as important as the stage center site. "A CVS, wow, downtown OKC is truly big time now! We should be so lucky to have a park-front CVS!"

This one is actually really head scratching...

As a moderately reputable poster (if I can still say that lol) I do tend to think this development should be getting more scrutiny than the Stage Center Tower. Based on what stage this project is at and what we're getting on a lot equally as important as the stage center site. "A CVS, wow, downtown OKC is truly big time now! We should be so lucky to have a park-front CVS!"

This one is actually really head scratching...

I would normally think just like you on this. However, I think the big difference with this particular CVS project is it actually fills a void.

"A CVS, wow, downtown OKC is truly big time now! We should be so lucky to have a park-front CVS!"

Am I reading the plans wrong? I think it's going in on the North side, not the park side....

Yes, north side (along Main) most likely.

This would fill a huge need and hopefully be a key tipping point for more downtown retail.

Personally, I think this is an important step.

Ditto

If I lived downtown, this would be the one store I would want first.

In fact, I'd much rather have a CVS than a full grocery store because I'd like Native Roots to survive, thrive and be rewarded for going in and providing a great service at a very early stage.

The CVS / Native Roots combination would fill a good chunk of the basic needs for residents and when I worked downtown, I would have loved to have had a CVS or Walgreens .

Not sure I put CVS over full grocery, but it's close. Very glad to have CVS in the neighborhood. I hope they can open up before the other tenants do. The sooner the better.

I'm hearing talk of A small market being considered for the Farmers Market building.

I would prefer individual specialty shops over a single grocery store.

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I like cheese.

Yes, north side (along Main) most likely.

This would fill a huge need and hopefully be a key tipping point for more downtown retail.

Personally, I think this is an important step.

It's far more embarrassing that we don't have a CVS yet than it is an important step. CVS is in any and every downtown. Downtown Cleveland has several, not to invoke that, but they're even usually in deader pockets of downtowns. The fanfare is just weird and the only point I'm making is that I'm concerned we are overlooking actual issues w this development...because oh my god a CVS!

It's just odd. I understand throwing us a bone to overlook issues. But a CVS? And I'm the last person to ever question the importance of a corner store in meeting residents needs but I'm just thinking critically here.

I'm hearing talk of A small market being considered for the Farmers Market building.

The timing for this is not good, and while laudable, it will probably not work.

It's far more embarrassing that we don't have a CVS yet than it is an important step. CVS is in any and every downtown. Downtown Cleveland has several, not to invoke that, but they're even usually in deader pockets of downtowns. The fanfare is just weird and the only point I'm making is that I'm concerned we are overlooking actual issues w this development...because oh my god a CVS!

It's just odd. I understand throwing us a bone to overlook issues. But a CVS? And I'm the last person to ever question the importance of a corner store in meeting residents needs but I'm just thinking critically here.

Because there is virtually zero general retail in downtown OKC right now and certainly no national chains.

As stated, if I lived downtown this is the one store I would want because it has a little of everything. And it compliments Native Roots without stealing a lot of it's business.

Frankly, I think it's weirder that you of all people don't understand the importance.


Here are the cities in the region with CVS's in their downtown:

El Paso (new) 7-9, 7-8, 8-5
Dallas – two
Houston
San Antonio
Austin
Kansas City
No St. Louis, Wichita or Omaha

....but I'm just thinking critically here.

Critical thinking or just thinking how to be critical?


Sorry...couldn't resist. ;)

The timing for this is not good, and while laudable, it will probably not work.

I disagree. Urban Agrarian is already basing their operation out of there, with regular sales in that location. This seems like a scalable extension of that. Organic growth, pun intended.

I agree that CVS complements NR without stealing business. Between the two I could see my dependence on out-of-core supermarkets dwindling to almost zero.

Because there is virtually zero general retail in downtown OKC right now and certainly no national chains.

As stated, if I lived downtown this is the one store I would want because it has a little of everything. And it compliments Native Roots without stealing a lot of it's business.

Frankly, I think it's weirder that you of all people don't understand the importance.


Here are the cities in the region with CVS's in their downtown:

El Paso (new) 7-9, 7-8, 8-5
Dallas – two
Houston
San Antonio
Austin
Kansas City
No St. Louis, Wichita or Omaha

Woah let's take a step back. I'm not dogging on CVS I can't say that enough.

I'm dogging on this development. You guys all piled onto the OG+E Tower project, which is a decent development that with a few small-scale fixes could be exactly the kind of development we want surrounding the park. This is one of the worst structures in all of downtown and all this development does is re-skin it. It's a small parking garage and it's going to remain mostly a small parking garage. It's a small, inconsequential structure and that's also exactly what it's going to remain as.

For the life of me I can't figure out why the Stage Center project isn't good enough. For the life of me, I can't figure out why this development is. All because Steve came out and dangled a CVS in front of you? So that takes me back to the point I'm really trying to make: Look at the issues with this development that you guys are overlooking just because you're getting a CVS. That argument that I'm making isn't about a CVS, but again just to restate it for the umpteenth time, about this development.

There are far more major questions left unresolved here than with the Stage Center site. This project has been downscaled even more than the OG+E Tower which never even announced firm plans like this project had. The original plans were okay. Now that it's been downscaled and delayed I'm just not sure what to think here.

The only "downsizing" was the deletion of two two levels of parking which will have minimal effect in any meaningful way.

Secondly, there was never any promise of decent retail and now CVS is a done deal. That's a very nice addition and something no one contemplated.

Third, this project already exists; they are not building it from scratch, just renovating.

Fourth, there will only be gain with nothing lost due to the construction

Fifth, they've done a respectable job of creating public areas of interests, from the video screen to the proposed patio restaurant facing the park, even trying to showcase the OPUBCO newsroom in a vibrant way. Plus CVS, of course.

And sixth, if and when the CBD continues to grow, it would be very easy to scrape this building altogether and build something better.

Yes, too easy to scrape. What we have is probably, what a 30-40 foot tall structure? The two parking levels would've made a big difference, and the screening would've blended it seemlessly w the facade giving us a worthwhile structure where there wasn't one.

Yes, too easy to scrape. What we have is probably, what a 30-40 foot tall structure? The two parking levels would've made a big difference, and the screening would've blended it seemlessly w the facade giving us a worthwhile structure where there wasn't one.

Quit yer bitchin'. They're renovating an existing structure.

Woah let's take a step back. I'm not dogging on CVS I can't say that enough.

I'm dogging on this development. You guys all piled onto the OG+E Tower project, which is a decent development that with a few small-scale fixes could be exactly the kind of development we want surrounding the park. This is one of the worst structures in all of downtown and all this development does is re-skin it. It's a small parking garage and it's going to remain mostly a small parking garage. It's a small, inconsequential structure and that's also exactly what it's going to remain as.

For the life of me I can't figure out why the Stage Center project isn't good enough. For the life of me, I can't figure out why this development is. All because Steve came out and dangled a CVS in front of you? So that takes me back to the point I'm really trying to make: Look at the issues with this development that you guys are overlooking just because you're getting a CVS. That argument that I'm making isn't about a CVS, but again just to restate it for the umpteenth time, about this development.

There are far more major questions left unresolved here than with the Stage Center site. This project has been downscaled even more than the OG+E Tower which never even announced firm plans like this project had. The original plans were okay. Now that it's been downscaled and delayed I'm just not sure what to think here.

The Century Center is one of the ugliest buildings downtown and one of the biggest mistakes in OKC history. To see it being renovated into something half-way acceptable is a big deal, and CVS going downtown is a tremendous sign of progress. Yes, most other cities already have them, but much has been said how far behind OKC once was and this is a sign that this city is starting to catch up. In three years, nobody will get excited about something like a corner store downtown, the prize will be real retail like a SuperTarget or full-service grocery.

Yes, too easy to scrape. What we have is probably, what a 30-40 foot tall structure? The two parking levels would've made a big difference, and the screening would've blended it seemlessly w the facade giving us a worthwhile structure where there wasn't one.
Spartan, you're looking too hard for a reason to disagree with everyone.

If I don't, who will? :P


Quit yer bitchin'. They're renovating an existing structure.

That should be demolished and not long for this world.

I've said my piece, I'm just pointing out that there are concerns here because everyone is currently distracted with banging their head against the wall bc a project across te park isn't tall enough (only 12-16ish stories)

If I don't, who will? :P



That should be demolished and not long for this world.

I've said my piece, I'm just pointing out that there are concerns here because everyone is currently distracted with banging their head against the wall bc a project across te park isn't tall enough (only 12-16ish stories)

Oh I'm not a fan of Century Center at all. I'd love it if we had a proposal to put a 40 story tower there. We just don't right now.

Personally though, I'd rather see new development go on empty blocks, rather than tear down existing structures, even if they're unsightly.

If I don't, who will? :P



That should be demolished and not long for this world.

I've said my piece, I'm just pointing out that there are concerns here because everyone is currently distracted with banging their head against the wall bc a project across te park isn't tall enough (only 12-16ish stories)

The two projects are completely different in dozens of ways which is why lots of people are concerned about one and not the other.

The two projects are completely different in dozens of ways which is why lots of people are concerned about one and not the other.

Sorry that's weak.

The Century Center is one of the ugliest buildings downtown and one of the biggest mistakes in OKC history. To see it being renovated into something half-way acceptable is a big deal, and CVS going downtown is a tremendous sign of progress. Yes, most other cities already have them, but much has been said how far behind OKC once was and this is a sign that this city is starting to catch up. In three years, nobody will get excited about something like a corner store downtown, the prize will be real retail like a SuperTarget or full-service grocery.

100% agree.

It's far more embarrassing that we don't have a CVS yet than it is an important step. CVS is in any and every downtown. Downtown Cleveland has several, not to invoke that, but they're even usually in deader pockets of downtowns. The fanfare is just weird and the only point I'm making is that I'm concerned we are overlooking actual issues w this development...because oh my god a CVS!

It's just odd. I understand throwing us a bone to overlook issues. But a CVS? And I'm the last person to ever question the importance of a corner store in meeting residents needs but I'm just thinking critically here.


I'm personally lauding this because it will save me many car trips a year. I live downtown and will be glad for the short stroll vs the drive. Should we have had this long ago? Of course. I'm just glad to finally get it from a practicality stand point. And frankly, I don't give a darned whether the CVS is in the Century Center or the Montgomery, just open it already.

The two projects are completely different in dozens of ways which is why lots of people are concerned about one and not the other.

Not to be a poop-head, but you were the one who overlaid the Century Center and Sheraton hotel on to the Stage Center block and labeled them as being extremely similar.

^

That was just to show the form factor proposed for the Stage Center site.

One of these is existing and one has yet to be built.

I'm one of those people who isn't a fan of either. In fact they both are almost exactly the same to me, even post renovation.

Think this will be a 24/7 CVS or minimal hours like a lot of downtown stores?

Think this will be a 24/7 CVS or minimal hours like a lot of downtown stores?

I've heard talk it may be 24 hours but I'm having a hard time envisioning that at this location.

Yeah would be tough to do 24/7.

Past 6-7 pm there's really no one in the CBD. Understandable, I don't go anywhere near my job when I am off work.

As long as it's open until 9pm-ish everyday I'm good with it not being 24hr, though that would be cool too.

The CVS they just opened in downtown El Paso is 7-9 M-F, 7-8 SA, and 8-5 SU.

Not crazy about the Sunday hours but the rest is fine.

If they would start at those hours, strong business might get them to expand them.

The CVS they just opened in downtown El Paso is 7-9 M-F, 7-8 SA, and 8-5 SU.

These hours would be great. Opening at 7am would help me out if I need to pick up something before work.

Did you mean for that to go in the Stage Center thread?

I'm one of those people who isn't a fan of either. In fact they both are almost exactly the same to me, even post renovation.

Yeah, you're probably right...

58085809

Yeah, you're probably right...

58085809

Except one was dead as a door nail and the other will be teeming with activity. BIG difference (to me).

I meant the proposed stage center tower and the renovated century center are practically the same. Obviously not exactly, but they are very similar in stature and appearance.

I meant the proposed stage center tower and the renovated century center are practically the same. Obviously not exactly, but they are very similar in stature and appearance.

Perhaps...

58105811

Except one was dead as a door nail and the other will be teeming with activity. BIG difference (to me).

How do we know this?

How do we know this?

Spartan, Understand I misunderstood the comparison. I was comparing the Century Center today versus the Century Center of tomorrow. We know there will be lots of activity based on the fact The Oklahoman offices will be there. That alone brings the property to life.

It's a relatively small office where most people go home at 5. They've downsized more than you may realize, which is what made this all possible. It's phenomenal to have the newspaper, a civic beacon for better or worse, located in the heart of the city. But the Candy Factory w Advanced Academics was a larger office WITH a street level museum (museum > CVS) and still pretty dead.

It's a relatively small office where most people go home at 5. They've downsized more than you may realize, which is what made this all possible. It's phenomenal to have the newspaper, a civic beacon for better or worse, located in the heart of the city. But the Candy Factory w Advanced Academics was a larger office WITH a street level museum (museum > CVS) and still pretty dead.

You may very well know more about this than I do. I understand the newspaper industry has fallen on hard times. But as for the numbers that are going downtown for the paper - I assumed it would be substantial. As for going home at 5:00, so does every other business in the CBD, that's no big deal. 5:00, though? That's a bit early I would guess for a morning newspaper. But then again, maybe many just file their material online, I don't know. Maybe Steve could help us out with this question.

OPUBCO is moving 350 employees into the Century Center and the newsroom will be featured prominently on the ground floor with large windows. There will be all types of video broadcasts on the a huge outdoor screen.

There will be a large CVS, perhaps operating 24 hours.

And there will be a restaurant with large patio on the most prominent corner facing the park.


Given the current state of downtown, I don't see how you could possibly squeeze more life into / out of this structure.

I absolutely cannot wait for this to happen (in the way that Pete describes). I know this is supposed to happen in 2014. But I hope it's sooner in 2014 vs later. But so far it feels behind (even if it's not).

OPUBCO does a whole lot more than newspapers.

Now if they could make the pedestrian barrier that is EKG easier for people to walk from DD to the CBD, I could see the CVS getting lots of foot traffic.

Now if they could make the pedestrian barrier that is EKG easier for people to walk from DD to the CBD, I could see the CVS getting lots of foot traffic.

That's probably my biggest concern downtown, not including a practical grocery store. No one really mentions it here but to me, EKG cuts DD and BT off from everything else.

Now if they could make the pedestrian barrier that is EKG easier for people to walk from DD to the CBD, I could see the CVS getting lots of foot traffic.

I walk (and bike) a lot from Midtown to DD and BT, and while EKG does suck, especially after having walked through the P180 areas, I don't really feel cut off from BT/DD. If there are places you want or need to be at on the other side, you go. At least there are crosswalks and traffic signals (again not apologizing for its suckishness compared to P180). For example, the train tracks between DD and BT definitely cut DD and BT off from each other, it's the most pedestrian-unfriendly scenario imaginable, but people still traverse them every single day, because there are places on the other side that they want or need to be at. I guess my point is that we need more places in the CBD that you DD and BT folks want to be at, and then it doesn't matter what the barriers (perceived or actual) are, you'll cross them gladly to get there. Perhaps the CVS will be a start.