View Full Version : 2025 Oklahoma City Aviation Thread
dcsooner 01-22-2025, 08:22 PM I’m not in agreeing or disagreeing with you I’m just stating there’s always excuses for mediocrity in Oklahoma especially on this website. It gets very tiring. And once again, I’m sure there are many airports that serve the 20 million people that live in this area. So the other person‘s point is still valid. Not saying yours isn’t. You do have a good point. But to me it seems Oklahoma City should pull more of its weight than it does when it comes to direct flights.
Agree
Plutonic Panda 01-22-2025, 08:23 PM I probably shouldn’t have posted anything at all because in actuality I agree with what you’re saying. I’m just saying that it’s frustrating about our airport situation. I just went about wording it very poorly. But yes, you’re right. This is a much more dense area of the country population wise. Having looked up all these numbers now I’m actually surprised this airport doesn’t have more flights than it does.
Plutonic Panda 01-22-2025, 09:27 PM Agree
Yeah, just seems like every time there’s some excuse for Oklahoma for being as mediocre as it is and really it is a boring state. I say that as someone who is from there and loves Oklahoma and wants to see it do more, but the state sucks. And I’m sorry if that offends anybody here, but I guarantee you a lot more people feel that way than who don’t. And it doesn’t have to be that way there’s so much potential. I’m not trying to get political or anything, but you probably get where I’m going with this.
I too wish we had the route network of a city 3 times our size. Has airport leadership thought about this?
Richard at Remax 01-22-2025, 10:02 PM Are you getting Wilmington, Delaware confused with Wilmington, NC?
The tweet was about the one in NC
Plutonic Panda 01-22-2025, 10:06 PM Are you getting Wilmington, Delaware confused with Wilmington, NC?
The tweet was about the one in NC
Well, hang on now you’ve got me confused. I’m looking at Delaware slightly south of Philadelphia off the 95. I just Google maps the one in North Carolina. There is really 20 million people around that area?
Plutonic Panda 01-22-2025, 10:07 PM I too wish we had the route network of a city 3 times our size. Has airport leadership thought about this?
Well, unless I’m confused about which city we were talking about it looks like we already do have a bigger network. But that’s only due to the fact that there’s other larger cities closer by than what we have.
Celebrator 01-23-2025, 12:32 AM I’m not in agreeing or disagreeing with you I’m just stating there’s always excuses for mediocrity in Oklahoma especially on this website. It gets very tiring. And once again, I’m sure there are many airports that serve the 20 million people that live in this area. So the other person‘s point is still valid. Not saying yours isn’t. You do have a good point. But to me it seems Oklahoma City should pull more of its weight than it does when it comes to direct flights.
What excuses are being made? A lot of people contributing to the current discussion here are presenting facts or well-thought out theories, not excuses. And you just say things like its "boring" and it "sucks." As sports commentator Jim Rome says, "Saying something sucks is not a take."
Plutonic Panda 01-23-2025, 06:01 AM What excuses are being made? A lot of people contributing to the current discussion here are presenting facts or well-thought out theories, not excuses. And you just say things like its "boring" and it "sucks." As sports commentator Jim Rome says, "Saying something sucks is not a take."
Hey, I love my home state. I love your analogy to a sports commentators. But I’ll tell you it. It’s a little exciting or at least I feel a little relief when I come back in hear thunder. I miss my thunderstorms. :(
Urbanized 01-23-2025, 07:44 AM Are you getting Wilmington, Delaware confused with Wilmington, NC?
The tweet was about the one in NC
Ah, I’d missed that if it was NC. In that case the proximate population is very similar. 2.9 million within 100 miles vs 2.8 million for OKC. Possibly difference are related to demographics or industry, but I haven’t dug into that.
BG918 01-23-2025, 10:53 AM Ah, I’d missed that if it was NC. In that case the proximate population is very similar. 2.9 million within 100 miles vs 2.8 million for OKC. Possibly difference are related to demographics or industry, but I haven’t dug into that.
It is the main gateway airport for NC beaches including the OBX.
Swake 01-23-2025, 11:30 AM So just looking at some cities that I would put in our lane (Omaha, des Moines, grand rapids, Louisville) and their route maps, I found something obvious but interesting.
Each one of those above have nonstop connections to 9-12 airports in Florida alone. We have 3, and right now they are mostly seasonal. I don't have any rhyme or reason on why oklahomans don't want to go to Florida, but it was eye opening.
This has to be part of it:
Average snowfall per year:
OKC 10 inches
Louisville 17 inches
Grand Rapids 29 inches
Omaha 31 inches
Des Moines 37 inches
VeggieMeat 01-23-2025, 01:16 PM This has to be part of it:
Average snowfall per year:
OKC 10 inches
Louisville 17 inches
Grand Rapids 29 inches
Omaha 31 inches
Des Moines 37 inches
Louisville (Mesa, Republic), Grand Rapids (Allegiant), and Des Moines (Allegiant) are regional bases.
Enough natural demand to merit a base may be just enough to beget a few additional routes beyond the natural demand.
dcsooner 01-23-2025, 07:34 PM Yeah, just seems like every time there’s some excuse for Oklahoma for being as mediocre as it is and really it is a boring state. I say that as someone who is from there and loves Oklahoma and wants to see it do more, but the state sucks. And I’m sorry if that offends anybody here, but I guarantee you a lot more people feel that way than who don’t. And it doesn’t have to be that way there’s so much potential. I’m not trying to get political or anything, but you probably get where I’m going with this.
My sentiment as well. But don't say it to loudly or to often you will get crushed
Celebrator 01-23-2025, 11:23 PM My sentiment as well. But don't say it to loudly or to often you will get crushed
It gets crushed because it is not constructive. Again, saying something sucks "is not a take." And honestly, it is harder to hear from posters who do not even live here, which, given your screen name, I assume you don't, just like PluPan doesn't. Just lobbing insults from afar is not only not constructive, it's frankly annoying and rude. You don't live here, I assume, because you like it better somewhere else, well that is good for you, but the rest of us live here and many of us on here love it, despite the challenges. Can it be better, sure, (what place shouldn't be working on continuous improvement) but I am certainly not bored here and am happy to call it home.
Mississippi Blues 01-24-2025, 12:04 AM It gets crushed because it is not constructive. Again, saying something sucks "is not a take." And honestly, it is harder to hear from posters who do not even live here, which, given your screen name, I assume you don't, just like PluPan doesn't. Just lobbing insults from afar is not only not constructive, it's frankly annoying and rude. You don't live here, I assume, because you like it better somewhere else, well that is good for you, but the rest of us live here and many of us on here love it, despite the challenges. Can it be better, sure, (what place shouldn't be working on continuous improvement) but I am certainly not bored here and am happy to call it home.
I’ve been with you but I don’t think someone not living here makes their critiques any less valid, at least intrinsically. If the person is saying it with a trite mind built on an outdated notion or it is clear they aren’t familiar with the city, I agree and they shouldn’t be entertained; however, outside perspectives - particularly those that have lived there but have also spent a chunk of time elsewhere - often push the thinking forward since they can more easily take down their blinders and tribalistic tendencies to identify what can be improved. Some of the best perspectives for how I’d like to see Oklahoma City develop have come from posters that live outside of Oklahoma. Heck, Pete didn’t live in Oklahoma for years while also being the one that had the best information about the happenings around the city. It’s healthy to both recognize how far the city has come and be proud of that while also acknowledging it has some work to do and just because it comes from someone outside the city doesn’t inherently make it offensive.
To be clear, I’m speaking only to the notion that those who don’t live here just don’t value the intricacies of the city/state enough for their negative feedback to be considered, not that this is an instance where those living elsewhere have a more realistic handle on the situation being discussed.
LakeEffect 01-24-2025, 09:30 AM This has to be part of it:
Average snowfall per year:
OKC 10 inches
Louisville 17 inches
Grand Rapids 29 inches
Omaha 31 inches
Des Moines 37 inches
As a West Michigan native, that GR total caught me off guard. That's the average essentially for Jan/Feb alone, not the entire year. In reality, it's closer to 80 inches. I knew A LOT of people that had grandparents w/ second homes in FL, or families that had condos/time shares and always went for spring break, etc.
Which is all to say, yes, there's a reason why GR has an impressive amount of FL flights.
https://www.wzzm13.com/article/weather/shifting-snow/ (https://www.wzzm13.com/article/weather/shifting-snow/69-d1f64729-d1ae-4538-99a4-23c259347eec#:~:text=Grand%20Rapids%20averaged%207 0.9%22%20of,%22%20(1991%2D2020))
Celebrator 01-24-2025, 11:09 AM I’ve been with you but I don’t think someone not living here makes their critiques any less valid, at least intrinsically. If the person is saying it with a trite mind built on an outdated notion or it is clear they aren’t familiar with the city, I agree and they shouldn’t be entertained; however, outside perspectives - particularly those that have lived there but have also spent a chunk of time elsewhere - often push the thinking forward since they can more easily take down their blinders and tribalistic tendencies to identify what can be improved. Some of the best perspectives for how I’d like to see Oklahoma City develop have come from posters that live outside of Oklahoma. Heck, Pete didn’t live in Oklahoma for years while also being the one that had the best information about the happenings around the city. It’s healthy to both recognize how far the city has come and be proud of that while also acknowledging it has some work to do and just because it comes from someone outside the city doesn’t inherently make it offensive.
To be clear, I’m speaking only to the notion that those who don’t live here just don’t value the intricacies of the city/state enough for their negative feedback to be considered, not that this is an instance where those living elsewhere have a more realistic handle on the situation being discussed.
I hear you and see your point about the value of outside viewpoints, but sometimes they just come off rudely, that's all. If done constructively, it is a lot easier to swallow.
progressiveboy 01-24-2025, 11:42 AM Outside perspectives are good to have especially for people that lived in OKC and now reside in another city. I lived in 3 other cities outside of Oklahoma in Texas, Florida and California. I moved back in 2023. When you realize how other cities are and you experience living other places, I feel I can be objective in my perceptions whether one agrees with me.
Plutonic Panda 01-24-2025, 04:35 PM It gets crushed because it is not constructive. Again, saying something sucks "is not a take." And honestly, it is harder to hear from posters who do not even live here, which, given your screen name, I assume you don't, just like PluPan doesn't. Just lobbing insults from afar is not only not constructive, it's frankly annoying and rude. You don't live here, I assume, because you like it better somewhere else, well that is good for you, but the rest of us live here and many of us on here love it, despite the challenges. Can it be better, sure, (what place shouldn't be working on continuous improvement) but I am certainly not bored here and am happy to call it home.
It is very constructive read again and reply to me why you think it isn’t.
Plutonic Panda 01-24-2025, 04:37 PM I’ve been with you but I don’t think someone not living here makes their critiques any less valid, at least intrinsically. If the person is saying it with a trite mind built on an outdated notion or it is clear they aren’t familiar with the city, I agree and they shouldn’t be entertained; however, outside perspectives - particularly those that have lived there but have also spent a chunk of time elsewhere - often push the thinking forward since they can more easily take down their blinders and tribalistic tendencies to identify what can be improved. Some of the best perspectives for how I’d like to see Oklahoma City develop have come from posters that live outside of Oklahoma. Heck, Pete didn’t live in Oklahoma for years while also being the one that had the best information about the happenings around the city. It’s healthy to both recognize how far the city has come and be proud of that while also acknowledging it has some work to do and just because it comes from someone outside the city doesn’t inherently make it offensive.
To be clear, I’m speaking only to the notion that those who don’t live here just don’t value the intricacies of the city/state enough for their negative feedback to be considered, not that this is an instance where those living elsewhere have a more realistic handle on the situation being discussed.
I love the city and I wanna see it better. That is my hope.
Celebrator 01-24-2025, 05:45 PM Outside perspectives are good to have especially for people that lived in OKC and now reside in another city. I lived in 3 other cities outside of Oklahoma in Texas, Florida and California. I moved back in 2023. When you realize how other cities are and you experience living other places, I feel I can be objective in my perceptions whether one agrees with me.
I agree. If done constructively. I would love to hear what you think about our air service. Seriously. If you want to weigh-in.
brianinok 01-25-2025, 06:07 AM https://thepointsguy.com/news/american-airlines-earnings-takeaways-2025-look-ahead/
I wonder if this means there is any chance of a return of the PHL flights by this summer.
BG918 01-25-2025, 03:36 PM https://thepointsguy.com/news/american-airlines-earnings-takeaways-2025-look-ahead/
I wonder if this means there is any chance of a return of the PHL flights by this summer.
I hope so. They are the last AA hub that isn’t served. AA just started XNA-PHL.
Do we know if OKC-MIA is returning to 1x/daily?
s00nr1 01-25-2025, 07:55 PM Just realized UAL now has zero(!) mainline to/from OKC. That's just sad.
juhobra 01-26-2025, 08:55 AM I was thinking the same thing. I took a flight from Burlington, VT to Chicago on United and it was a 737. Crazy we are stuck with packed ERJs.
VeggieMeat 01-26-2025, 02:21 PM I was thinking the same thing. I took a flight from Burlington, VT to Chicago on United and it was a 737. Crazy we are stuck with packed ERJs.
BTV has two year-round flights per day total to Chicago (both United). (American adds a regional seasonally).
OKC has seven (three American regionals, three United regionals, one Southwest).
Would you rather have more frequency or bigger planes? And does the potential air cargo merit the bigger planes? Self-loading cargo isn't how 73s (or anything else bigger than an ERJ/CRJ) make money.
BTV also gets ~40% of their passengers through the gates from Quebec (as in they cross the border via highway to start their US air journeys) which is probably why they have so many hub directs east of the rockies. They are also pulling their traffic from NE upstate NY and the parts of NH north of the notches.
Downwind17 01-26-2025, 08:24 PM I hope so. They are the last AA hub that isn’t served. AA just started XNA-PHL.
Do we know if OKC-MIA is returning to 1x/daily?
OKC-MIA is scheduled to be 1x daily starting May 5. The 1x daily should have never been reduced to a 1x weekly.
BG918 01-27-2025, 02:48 PM OKC-MIA is scheduled to be 1x daily starting May 5. The 1x daily should have never been reduced to a 1x weekly.
Looks like TUL-MIA also returns to 1x/daily starting 6/5. Hopefully both routes stay daily through next winter.
Will Dearborn 01-27-2025, 09:48 PM Just realized UAL now has zero(!) mainline to/from OKC. That's just sad.
Besides routing, this is the top reason I no longer fly United...was Global Services for years and have now gone years without flying them at all (except for irregular ops).
PoliSciGuy 02-10-2025, 11:46 AM FlyOKC just announced an upgrad (https://x.com/fly_okc/status/1889006178426126383)e to two routes. Alaska is adding a second flight to SEA this summer, and Delta is adding a second to MSP.
bison34 02-10-2025, 11:48 AM They will both do well!
VeggieMeat 02-10-2025, 02:06 PM FlyOKC just announced an upgrad (https://x.com/fly_okc/status/1889006178426126383)e to two routes. Alaska is adding a second flight to SEA this summer, and Delta is adding a second to MSP.
Nothing comes up for me at that link except an error, and the latest update I see when I just go to the account is from 2017. Is there a publicly-accessible source elsewhere?
Richard at Remax 02-10-2025, 07:35 PM Only thing they posted recently was today when the reminded people about Frontier flying to Orlando
damonsmuz 02-10-2025, 07:41 PM On Instagram,the airport announced an extra flight to MSP on Delta and an extra flight to Seattle on Alaska.
BG918 02-10-2025, 09:09 PM On Instagram,the airport announced an extra flight to MSP on Delta and an extra flight to Seattle on Alaska.
Good to see, too bad it’s not a nonstop to PDX. Still surprised Delta hasn’t brought back TUL-MSP, it’s the last pre-Covid nonstop that hasn’t returned.
Richard at Remax 02-10-2025, 10:12 PM Only thing they posted recently was today when the reminded people about Frontier flying to Orlando
That was on FB. I see it on IG now. Good news about 2x Seattle now. That 8am flight back here is painful
Richard at Remax 02-10-2025, 10:17 PM Someone mentioned that we are getting another daily flight to DCA on American in May. I just looked and it looks like there is an early morning flight now. Only thing that's a bummer is they are now on crj700s vs the E175/A319 that was operating the 1x daily
VeggieMeat 02-10-2025, 10:50 PM Someone mentioned that we are getting another daily flight to DCA on American in May. I just looked and it looks like there is an early morning flight now. Only thing that's a bummer is they are now on crj700s vs the E175/A319 that was operating the 1x daily
Looks like switching from Republic to PSA for American Eagle OKC-DCA. 1x 76 seats to 2x 65.
Southwest still has their 1x 737.
damonsmuz 02-11-2025, 12:01 AM Nice to see an increase in frequency out of OKC. I guess I'm surprised that Delta added frequency to MSP instead of restarting DTW. Not complaining,just an observation. Hopefully United follows with bringing back SFO,EWR and IAD
Jeepnokc 02-11-2025, 06:37 AM Hopefully they put a bigger plane on the MSP. The current flight uses an Embraer75 which is not the most comfortable plane (even in first) for a 2 hour flight. I usually avoid going through MSP for this reason.
BG918 02-11-2025, 10:57 AM Nice to see an increase in frequency out of OKC. I guess I'm surprised that Delta added frequency to MSP instead of restarting DTW. Not complaining,just an observation. Hopefully United follows with bringing back SFO,EWR and IAD
SFO is a good bet to be added back, likely with some kind of subsidy. I wouldn't expect to see the others anytime soon though - too much competition in those markets now and they can better serve OKC from their IAH, DEN and ORD hubs.
bison34 02-11-2025, 11:18 AM SFO is a good bet to be added back, likely with some kind of subsidy. I wouldn't expect to see the others anytime soon though - too much competition in those markets now and they can better serve OKC from their IAH, DEN and ORD hubs.
If OKC got another flight to the NYC area, I agree. But a lot of people go to EWR to avoid the NYC airports, and can easily train in to Manhattan.
Jersey Boss 02-11-2025, 11:52 AM if okc got another flight to the nyc area, i agree. But a lot of people go to ewr to avoid the nyc airports, and can easily train in to manhattan.
Iykyk
gopokes88 02-11-2025, 12:57 PM January is out. Growth trend continues. https://flyokc.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/January-2025-Enplanement.pdf
American might surpass Southwest sometime this year.
PhiAlpha 02-11-2025, 01:07 PM If OKC got another flight to the NYC area, I agree. But a lot of people go to EWR to avoid the NYC airports, and can easily train in to Manhattan.
This
Jeepnokc 02-11-2025, 02:37 PM If OKC got another flight to the NYC area, I agree. But a lot of people go to EWR to avoid the NYC airports, and can easily train in to Manhattan.
I think a lot also has to do with direct flights available. If you fly United...makes sense to fly into EWR. I fly Delta so I fly into LGA. No way am I going to do two flights and then spend all the time to get into Manhattan and then Uber from train station to hotel. LGA was just remodeled and is so much better and easier than it used to be. Has a great skyclub now also.
PistolChad 02-12-2025, 05:02 PM Many people like to blame airport officials, but the FACT is that the majority of the non-hub / non-"focus city" airports that lost direct flights in 2020 haven't gotten them all back. Oklahoma City is normal - not an anomaly.
ALL US-based airlines are SIGNIFICANTLY behind where they wanted to be in both pilots and aircraft. Airbus is behind. Boeing is WAY behind and can't seem to pull their head out. Every single source of training new pilots in the USA is already at max capacity. It is a time consuming process to get pilots trained in this country. It is also very difficult to bring in foreign pilots to fly domestically here for many reasons.
By the end of 2025 it appears all regional airlines will FINALLY have their entire fleets back operational. Only a small number of regional jet pilots that flew in 2020 are still flying regional jets. Most have gotten hired by mainline operators. They have taken the brunt of backfilling all the talent they lost. The ONLY reason they are FINALLY going to be able to recover this year IS BECAUSE Boeing can't produce jets fast enough. If Boeing suddenly started producing twice the number of jets per year, the regional airlines would get decimated again within a year and would have to rebuild all over again.
For OKC, if what you care about is MORE cities with direct flights, then those are going to be via regional jets to begin with. Fill those regional jets and then we'll get more flights per day and ultimately then we'll get mainline aircraft.
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