New thread for what will hopefully be a record-breaking pax year at WRWA.

manifesting OKC-CUN nonstop.

manifesting OKC-CUN nonstop.

Frontier?

So other than Cancun, what's on our wishlist for this year?

PHL?
BOS?
SW returning OKC-DAL?
PDX?
Something in the Bay area (SFO, OAK, SJC)?

I'd like to see the restart of routes removed. Delta to Detroit. United to Newark and San Francisco.

New routes: It would be cool to see Delta add service to Austin since they're trying to pick up what American is leaving. Something new from their pretty new gates here.

I’d love to see Boston and more Delta service in general.

PHL on AA, SFO on United or Alaska, BOS on Delta or Jetblue, EWR on United, someone to somewhere in Mexico for a seasonal service.

I have a hunch when they announce the rebrand of the airport they will announce a few routes.

So other than Cancun, what's on our wishlist for this year?

PHL?
BOS?
SW returning OKC-DAL?
PDX?
Something in the Bay area (SFO, OAK, SJC)?

PHL very possible on AA - all hubs would be covered, and is another option for East Coast and trans-Atlantic connections
BOS - unlikely unless Delta adds it
DAL - unlikely
PDX - possible with Alaska
SFO - likely as United builds back up their hub there - possibly OAK on SW

Boston, please!!!

I would love to see restoration of pre-lockdown routes as mentioned above, plus

WN to OAK and LAX (a nonstop WN flight to somewhere in CA is long overdue)
DL or AA to BOS (1xE170/175 service similar to LGA would work, I would think)
AS to PDX (again 1xE170/175 service to start just as they did with SEA should work)

I would love to see restoration of pre-lockdown routes as mentioned above, plus

WN to OAK and LAX (a nonstop WN flight to somewhere in CA is long overdue)
DL or AA to BOS (1xE170/175 service similar to LGA would work, I would think)
AS to PDX (again 1xE170/175 service to start just as they did with SEA should work)

I would love a nonstop flight to Socal that doesn't involve LAX. Long Beach, Santa Ana or Ontario would be great. Currently we have to connect in Denver, Vegas or Phoenix and that's fine, but a more direct flight would be awesome.

I second Damonsmuz's thoughts -- need UA to resume SFO and IAD badly.

is there any international flights currently? also nonstop to Cleveland, OH

I would love a nonstop flight to Socal that doesn't involve LAX. Long Beach, Santa Ana or Ontario would be great. Currently we have to connect in Denver, Vegas or Phoenix and that's fine, but a more direct flight would be awesome.

Oh so would I, for instance I much prefer BUR to LAX for example, but that's really dreaming, LAX is a more reasonable expectation and probably OAK before that is more reasonable to see for OKC's future.

I like John Wayne. Always have. Easy to get in and out of.

So other than Cancun, what's on our wishlist for this year?

PHL?
BOS?
SW returning OKC-DAL?
PDX?
Something in the Bay area (SFO, OAK, SJC)?

WN to SEA would be great.
FLL or MIA would also be really nice.

WN to SEA would be great.
FLL or MIA would also be really nice.

We already have MIA with AA

My list:

RESTORATIONS:

OKC-BWI on WN
OKC-IAD on UA
OKC-SFO on UA
OKC-LAX on UA
OKC-DET on DL
OKC-PHL on AA (isn't this being restored)
OKC-MCI on WN
OKC-ABQ
OKC-MSY on WN
OKC-MEM
OKC-OAK on WN
OKC-SAN
OKC-ICT (would this, regional type flight work?)
OKC-COS

NEW:

OKC-PDX on AS
OKC-BOS on DL
OKC-MKE on Spirit
OKC-HNL on AS (direct via SEA or PDX is fine)
OKC-MEX
OKC-CAN
OKC-MTY
OKC-YYZ
OKC-Orange County on WN

These dont all need to be dailies, esp the international. Having a weekly flight or two internationally is quite common. Also, I'd be fine with some of the WN flights being direct just like there are several WN flights into OKC that direct elsewhere (it'd be nice if the pax could deplane, which would add to our numbers).

OKC actually has a very nice route system, but the restoration of all of the hubs and pax numbers at 5 million per year is a given to me for 2024.

Growth is limited without new routes, more frequencies, and larger planes. I truly hope there is work going on behind the scenes to get more routes. And also figure out how to lower prices. OKC is, for some reason, a lot more expensive than a lot of airports in their size range. Not sure why.

I mostly fly American, but this past week I flew Delta through Atlanta (side note: gosh, I hate ATL). I have to think Delta does plan on adding more flights in OKC. I flew out on the 6:00 AM flight, which was full, and the busiest time at the airport. Yet, Delta was unbelievably overstaffed. Sure, it was nice from a customer service standpoint. But if I was a shareholder, I would question their management skills. They had way too many people at the ticket counter and gate. Either they are content to be spending too much money on payroll in OKC, or they plan on adding flights that their existing staff can handle.

Interestingly enough, Delta is adding a second daily OKC-LGA flight in the summer, meaning there will now be four daily round trips to NYC (2 on AA, 2 on DL).

Interestingly enough, Delta is adding a second daily OKC-LGA flight in the summer, meaning there will now be four daily round trips to NYC (2 on AA, 2 on DL).
Where did you see this?

It's loaded on delta.com. Looks like a morning and early afternoon departure. Mixed between a EMB-175 and crj-900

Nice!

Interestingly enough, Delta is adding a second daily OKC-LGA flight in the summer, meaning there will now be four daily round trips to NYC (2 on AA, 2 on DL).

Why not fly 1x LGA and 1x BOS? With the AA flights 4x/daily to NYC is too much capacity

I noticed on AA that the 3x daily service to PHX is getting equipment upgrades to E170s. Not mad about that.

Why not fly 1x LGA and 1x BOS? With the AA flights 4x/daily to NYC is too much capacity

Evidently they disagree. They don't just do things like that for no reason.

Why not fly 1x LGA and 1x BOS? With the AA flights 4x/daily to NYC is too much capacity

Only a small percentage of people are traveling to the hub city, despite being at the same airport, the two airlines practically operate different hubs there.

It's loaded on delta.com. Looks like a morning and early afternoon departure. Mixed between a EMB-175 and crj-900

We have done the OKC-LGA trip several times now and have several planned this year. The times are fantastic for a three day weekend in NYC for a show or concert. We are seeing Billy Joel in June at Madison again. There by noon and depart late afternoon. Prices have been decent.

I noticed on AA that the 3x daily service to PHX is getting equipment upgrades to E170s. Not mad about that.There have also been times they've thrown in an A319. I'd really like this route to get rid of the CRJ aircraft. More times than not they park the OKC-bound CRJs at the few non-jetway gates, and we get the furthest one at that. I hate that. Hopefully the E170s get an actual gate in PHX. United is notorious in DEN for doing this for the OKC flights on the smaller regional jets. It's infuriating-- walking past an RJ going to Salina or Fargo at a gate that could handle a mainline and walking to the furthest RJ gate and still walking 200 yards outside to get to the OKC-bound plane. First world problems, but still.

I do a fair amount of business in CA, so seflishly would like to see UA restore SFO and LAX.

SW returning to DAL would be nice especially as connections are far less time-consuming than AA via DFW, but AA options for Int'l flights there is a big plus.

I'm less optimistic there will be a significant increase at OKC regarding new destinations, more like an increase in capacity on existing routes. BOS would be great, though.

I don't mind the EMB's, but can we please ditch those CRJ's from OKC !!!

Hatch Early Mood Food opening at WRWA. No specifc date was mentioned, but their banner is up in the terminal covering the entry location.

This is one of six planned new Hatch locations the Provisions Concepts group will be opening in '24.

^^^^^^^^^
Provision won’t be operating the Hatch at the airport. Like all of the locally-themed shops and restaurants there, they’ve instead licensed the use of their marks, concept, recipes and other IP to the vendor who operates ALL of the shops and eateries at WRWA. They’ll continue to be consulted but it won’t be a burden to them in any way operationally.

^^^^^^^^^
Provision won’t be operating the Hatch at the airport. Like all of the locally-themed shops and restaurants there, they’ve instead licensed the use of their marks, concept, recipes and other IP to the vendor who operates ALL of the shops and eateries at WRWA. They’ll continue to be consulted but it won’t be a burden to them in any way operationally.

I haven't eaten at WRWA in years, if not over a decade (and obviously not at any of the new places). Does this arrangement impact the quality or types of offerings at the airport locations? How strict are the licensing entities at enforcing the same quality that you get at one of their "real" restaurants?

Those are good questions to which I don’t have a first-hand informed answer. I know several of the operators who have licensed their local brands, but the only one who I’ve spoken with about this particular arrangement was a retailer, not a F&B owner.

The retailer was extremely happy with the relationship, and their stores are incredibly detail-focused and driven by a very specific in-store character. They indicated that Paradies (the WRWA operator) was very conscientious from an execution standpoint, and that they (the retailer) would have continuing input relative to merchandising and operations.

They also indicated that the local restaurant partners they had spoken with were similarly happy.

So it seems to me that Paradies is very committed to being true to the brands they are licensing, which makes sense. Why commit to this approach without taking care of the brands’ respective reputations? Doing otherwise would doom the concept.

It’s worth noting that WRWA is far from the only airport with this concept in place. Paradies specializes in this business model, and seem to have it down to an art form at this point.

When did WRWA switch from Delaware North to Paradies? I think Paradies is the main reason there has been a huge improvement. I wish they would takeover F&B operations at TUL which look like WRWA 5 years ago

I haven't eaten at WRWA in years, if not over a decade (and obviously not at any of the new places). Does this arrangement impact the quality or types of offerings at the airport locations? How strict are the licensing entities at enforcing the same quality that you get at one of their "real" restaurants?

I bet it will never be a one for one comparison with the higher end places, but hopefully close.

Off topic, but the whole Chick Fil A debate comes into mind. I wonder if Chick Fil A got into this kind of agreement, they would force them to close on Sundays since that kind of makes up their brand?

I bet it will never be a one for one comparison with the higher end places, but hopefully close.

Off topic, but the whole Chick Fil A debate comes into mind. I wonder if Chick Fil A got into this kind of agreement, they would force them to close on Sundays since that kind of makes up their brand?

IIRC, the CFA at Love Field is operated by an outside firm and is closed on Sundays.

I bet it will never be a one for one comparison with the higher end places, but hopefully close.

Off topic, but the whole Chick Fil A debate comes into mind. I wonder if Chick Fil A got into this kind of agreement, they would force them to close on Sundays since that kind of makes up their brand?
The authority runs the NY Thruway is having it out with Chick-fil-A right now about it and might require them to open on Sundays or take it to court with getting them out. Not sure what’s going to happen.

The authority runs the NY Thruway is having it out with Chick-fil-A right now about it and might require them to open on Sundays or take it to court with getting them out. Not sure what’s going to happen.

the court will not end up liking the blatant religious discrimination that is going on in that case ..

the court will not end up liking the blatant religious discrimination that is going on in that case ..

It can also be viewed in a completely non-religious way-
The turnpike wants to make sure travelers on the 5th busiest road in the country have a same number of options no matter the day they are traveling. And if a business cannot meet the goals, then they just shouldn't place a bid.

It can also be viewed in a completely non-religious way-
The turnpike wants to make sure travelers on the 5th busiest road in the country have a same number of options no matter the day they are traveling. And if a business cannot meet the goals, then they just shouldn't place a bid.

I mean, CFA isn't starving. Have billions and billions in revenues. And whoever does business with them has to know their business model, and that they don't change for anyone, aside from the Mercedes Benz Stadium location.

Hard to plead ignorance or breach of contract when their model and strategy is among the most well-known in the universe. CFA wouldn't sign any agreement that forced them to be open 7 days a week. I've worked with them. They are VERY strict about that policy, and it won't change.

https://tulsaworld.com/news/local/business/first-direct-international-flights-coming-to-tulsa-new-customs-facility-planned/article_71bf726a-af11-11ee-8298-fb6b277920a0.html#tracking-source=home-the-latest

Tulsa really is likely to mess around and get an international flight before OKC...

Be happy for Tulsa then.

Be happy for Tulsa then.

Nah. It would be at the expense of OKC getting one.

Nah. It would be at the expense of OKC getting one.

You are probably wrong if you believe it is either or. It appears Tulsa will though have international service before OKC.

You are probably wrong if you believe it is either or. It appears Tulsa will though have international service before OKC.

It looks like all it saying is that they are building an addition to the terminal to be able to host international flights..OKC already had the same thing done when they added the new terminal so it appears as though you are wrong but you could be right

Nah. It would be at the expense of OKC getting one.

I’d rather Tulsa get Cancun if it means Oklahoma City might get something like Guadalajara or Mexico City or Monterrey. If it *must* be a tourist heavy coastal area in Mexico, Puerto Vallarta or Los Cabos or Puerto Escondido/Oaxaca.

It looks like all it saying is that they are building an addition to the terminal to be able to host international flights..OKC already had the same thing done when they added the new terminal so it appears as though you are wrong but you could be right

I don't even think the customs center has staff yet. And we've heard nothing about any future routes.

And that article reads as one had already been secured for Tulsa, just can't be announced until the customs center is built. OKC has nothing like that ready to announce, and the customs center has been ready for years.

And that article reads as one had already been secured for Tulsa, just can't be announced until the customs center is built.

i don't think that is how it reads at all ..... more hopes and dreams ..

I don't even think the customs center has staff yet. And we've heard nothing about any future routes.

And that article reads as one had already been secured for Tulsa, just can't be announced until the customs center is built. OKC has nothing like that ready to announce, and the customs center has been ready for years.

I posed in last year's thread that the OKC airport put out for bids to finish the international arrival area of the recently completed expansion. In the paperwork, it said that the CBP promised to staff the center once the build out was complete to their standards.

Will Rogers is already ahead of Tulsa in that the space is built, just needs to be finished out and they have an assurance that it will be staffed. And staffing is up to CBP. The airport, nor the much maligned airport director have any say in that.

Finally, an airline will only offer international routes if it makes business sense for them.

I was about to say, I'm pretty sure OKC already has this, just needs to be finished out and staffed. I didn't read it as they had something lined up already, just that they are marketing it to carriers.

I was about to say, I'm pretty sure OKC already has this, just needs to be finished out and staffed. I didn't read it as they had something lined up already, just that they are marketing it to carriers.

Correct. This expansion gives TUL the ability to have international flights. OKC will also have that ability once they finish the buildout of the CBP facility that was added in the last expansion.

I have no idea which airline would offer international service at either airport. The best bet would be by Allegiant if their JV with VivaAerobus happens. I could see 2x weekly flights to places like Cancun, Cabo and Puerto Vallarta. Frontier is another possibility. I just don't see any of the legacy carriers offering point-to-point international service from OKC/TUL.

Our airport director is at it again!!!:eek:

https://tulsaworld.com/news/local/business/first-direct-international-flights-coming-to-tulsa-new-customs-facility-planned/article_71bf726a-af11-11ee-8298-fb6b277920a0.html#tracking-source=home-the-latest

Tulsa really is likely to mess around and get an international flight before OKC...

Not really? As others have said they're actually behind OKC since we already have these facilities or will have them before Tulsa. Nothing in that article says anything is imminent other than a quote from the architectural company that "flights will be landing in 5 years," which seems aspirational/PR talk than anything concrete. In fact the article stresses that the airport is reaching out to airlines, not vice versa, about trying to get a flight.

Not really? As others have said they're actually behind OKC since we already have these facilities or will have them before Tulsa. Nothing in that article says anything is imminent other than a quote from the architectural company that "flights will be landing in 5 years," which seems aspirational/PR talk than anything concrete. In fact the article stresses that the airport is reaching out to airlines, not vice versa, about trying to get a flight.

There have been multiple articles just like that in the Tulsa newspaper. Either there is nothing to talk about in Tulsa, or there is a lot of movement behind the scenes and likely an LOI of some kind with an airline for an international flight or 2 as soon as able. OKC's customs center hasn't been finished, and has been stagnant, for well over a year, with no signs of movement happening anytime soon.

Interesting reply from the Tulsa Airport Facebook page:

Hi, everyone! A few more details for you all, as we've seen some questions and comments. We have always had international flights here at TUL, as the CBP does already have a presence here. The international flights now are just cargo or private charters currently. After this new customs facility is added to our existing terminal and opens in Fall 2025, then the CBP would be able to clear commercial international flights. The most likely first few nonstop international flights that airlines would add would be Cancun or Cabo, as those two cities have the highest demand. On average, we have 115 passengers traveling from Tulsa to Mexico daily. 32% of TUL’s daily international traffic is to Mexico, the highest share of any country, followed by Canada at 8%, UK at 5%, and Italy at 4%. All other countries are 3% or less.

Interesting reply from the Tulsa Airport Facebook page:

Hi, everyone! A few more details for you all, as we've seen some questions and comments. We have always had international flights here at TUL, as the CBP does already have a presence here. The international flights now are just cargo or private charters currently. After this new customs facility is added to our existing terminal and opens in Fall 2025, then the CBP would be able to clear commercial international flights. The most likely first few nonstop international flights that airlines would add would be Cancun or Cabo, as those two cities have the highest demand. On average, we have 115 passengers traveling from Tulsa to Mexico daily. 32% of TUL’s daily international traffic is to Mexico, the highest share of any country, followed by Canada at 8%, UK at 5%, and Italy at 4%. All other countries are 3% or less.

Would love to see this kind of info from our city airport. But doubt we will. Being proactive hasn't been a thing for a while there.

Would love to see this kind of info from our city airport. But doubt we will. Being proactive hasn't been a thing for a while there.

Ugh. Time and again it's been proven you don't know what the heck you're talking about, on most threads, but esp this one. You post comments that read with such certainty but like clockwork, you're exposed for not knowing anything about the topic. Even when you're confronted with info from members who do have actual operational knowledge of the airport and how the system works, you continue to circle the drain.

Once again, Will Rogers built a customs/processing/receiving space in the lower level of the new addition. It is currently being built-out, ready for operations the last QR 2024 (per Airport Trust meetings). TUL is proposing to construct an entire new addition to process such flights and construction hasn't yet started. As for airport management not being pro-active, why don't you do something positive and find the data on Mexico passengers from OKC yourself, instead of continually being a gadfly.

Tell us, what is your airport management background that gives you such insight on how to airlines determine their routes? Did you apply for the position of Executive Director, only to be denied? I guess it's easier to stomp your feet and hold your breath...

Would love to see this kind of info from our city airport. But doubt we will. Being proactive hasn't been a thing for a while there.

I presented to you facts from the minutes of the Airport trust meeting. The build out for the international arrivals is happening, not just a plan. And because TUL posts something on Facebook doesn't mean they have any deal signed.

You were doubting Pete in regard to the Olympic events here in OKC, yet are claiming movement behind the scenes that Tulsa will be getting international flights. I don't know about you, but I trust Pete's sourcing over guessing. The Olympic events WILL happen in 2028 and Tulsa MAY get international flights in a few years.

Does it really matter in the end who gets international flights first? It just seems like you have something against the leadership of the OKC airport and I don't really understand why.

This reminds me of the grousing when Tulsa would get some retail store or restaurant to open there first. Sometimes the numbers just work better at the time for that to happen and lately OKC has been getting more of first to state or only in state options to open here first.

These sorts of things take time and there is indeed a lot going on behind the scenes.