^ oh, that's right. Thanks!

United Airlines will be adding "college football flights" this fall. Similar to how American and Delta added flights, too.

American will have flights from Knoxville to OKC in September for the the OU/Tenn game and November, flights from Birmingham,Huntsville and Baton Rouge.

It looks like United will be running the exact same specialty flights as American and to/from the same cities.

Delta is running a flight from Knoxville to OKC in September, Columbia,SC in October as well as Birmingham,Huntsville and Baton Rouge in November.

Looks like the majors are all jumping on board these specificity flights.

United Airlines will be adding "college football flights" this fall. Similar to how American and Delta added flights, too.

American will have flights from Knoxville to OKC in September for the the OU/Tenn game and November, flights from Birmingham,Huntsville and Baton Rouge.

It looks like United will be running the exact same specialty flights as American and to/from the same cities.

Delta is running a flight from Knoxville to OKC in September, Columbia,SC in October as well as Birmingham,Huntsville and Baton Rouge in November.

Looks like the majors are all jumping on board these specificity flights.

I wonder how people are supposed to find these flights? Do they direct advertise to season ticket holders and boosters via the universities? Are they full of package purchasers who buy from travel agents, etc.? Or do they just put them in time slots where people will hopefully notice they are nonstop specials when they are just looking for flights around these games? Just curious as to how the marketing works to be able to fill these one off flights.

I wonder how people are supposed to find these flights? Do they direct advertise to season ticket holders and boosters via the universities? Are they full of package purchasers who buy from travel agents, etc.? Or do they just put them in time slots where people will hopefully notice they are nonstop specials when they are just looking for flights around these games? Just curious as to how the marketing works to be able to fill these one off flights.

I imagine most people will find it searching via google, travel, or airlines websites; which will hit a database for flights with departure and arrival dates around that time between the two airports.

Oooof

19088

Oooof

19088

Borderline criminal.

Borderline criminal.

And small equipment to boot--different on both legs, too! Weird.

Oooof

19088

Keep in mind that this is Thanksgiving weekend which is the busiest airline travel time of the year and, since it is so close, only the more expensive fares are available. Prices on United and Delta are the same or higher for the same dates. People wanting decent prices over Thanksgiving weekend need to be booking at least 6 months or more before departure.

I'm gonna disagree with you there. This has nothing to do with Thanksgiving and all about giving fans an easy way, although stupid expensive, to get to and from these hard to reach cities that might have no reason to be connected if it weren't for a football game.

Oooof

19088

So I gotta ask. Did you check fares from Tulsa, Stillwater, or Dallas?

So I gotta ask. Did you check fares from Tulsa, Stillwater, or Dallas?

This is a nonstop, direct flight from OKC to Baton Rouge, only offered for the OU-LSU game Thanksgiving weekend. It is supposed to be some cool offer airlines are offering college football fans, but the prices make it almost criminal.

It's a one-off charter flight over Thanksgiving weekend. It's high but understandable given all those qualifiers. On an ERJ/CRJ they only need 75 or so folks willing to pay that price. I think there are enough OU fans that will dish that out to save an 18 hour round trip drive.

I'm gonna disagree with you there. This has nothing to do with Thanksgiving and all about giving fans an easy way, although stupid expensive, to get to and from these hard to reach cities that might have no reason to be connected if it weren't for a football game.

Disagree all you want but I deal with airline ticket prices all day every day and know what I'm talking about.

Disagree all you want but I deal with airline ticket prices all day every day and know what I'm talking about.

I stand by my statement. Offering easy travel in exchange for a really expensive ticket.

$4161 RT for two if you are coming from Knoxville (Tenn) on Delta in Sept
19089

$2000+ for two coming from Columbia (USC) to OKC on Delta in Oct
19092

$1900 RT for two on if you are coming from Birmingham (Bama) on Delta In Nov
19090

$1900 for two from OKC to Baton Rouge (LSU) on Delta in Nov
19091

Let's look at a few on United. It looks like they only added OKC to Baton Rouge with a direct.

The Tennessee game. Cheapest is almost $2300/ticket
19093

Almost $2k/person for direct to LSU
19094

Now american which looks like they are only doing Tenn, Bama, and LSU for directs

Tenn to OKC $1300/person
19095

Huntsville to OKC $757/person
19096

Birmingham to OKC $937/person
19097

^ These are actually nonstops, not directs.

well technically, nonstops are directs. but you can also have a direct that has a stop inbetween, just doesn't change planes.

direct means doesn't change planes (could be nonstop, or one or more stops).

^ These are actually nonstops, not directs.

It was after midnight, give me some slack lol

I stand by my statement. Offering easy travel in exchange for a really expensive ticket.

$4161 RT for two if you are coming from Knoxville (Tenn) on Delta in Sept
19089

$2000+ for two coming from Columbia (USC) to OKC on Delta in Oct
19092

$1900 RT for two on if you are coming from Birmingham (Bama) on Delta In Nov
19090

$1900 for two from OKC to Baton Rouge (LSU) on Delta in Nov
19091
I'm not saying that airlines don't try to take advantage of sports fans. Prices have been like that for years for flights to bowl games. My point was that the price for Thanksgiving weekend can easily be justified because other airline prices with connections are just as high or higher and that is due to thanksgiving.

It was after midnight, give me some slack lol

Sorry just the personal pet peeve of an avgeek, lol

No reason to pay those fares unless you like burning money.

Looks like starting Sept 3 - May 4, the MIA route on AA goes to Saturday only. Then it goes back to daily in May.

I noticed United recently resumed nonstop flights from Omaha to SFO. Made me wonder if this route would get resumed from OKC. I also know SFO and SEA are the two highest priority routes that TUL is trying to get served.

Also saw XNA resumed nonstops to DTW and SLC, and American just announced flights to PHL.

I wonder if OKC will ever get SFO or DTW back. Those would be amazing to get back. And PHL.

Looks like starting Sept 3 - May 4, the MIA route on AA goes to Saturday only. Then it goes back to daily in May.Which is ridiculous. There have been times this route has been upgraded to A319 and even A321 during holiday and busy periods over the past year because of demand. No reason it should be less than daily.

No reason to pay those fares unless you like burning money.

They're likely aimed at big money donors who wipe their butts with $1000 bills. They aren't geared toward the "normal fan" like you and me. I'm sure AA will have no trouble filling those flights. If I had money to burn like that, I'd definitely highly consider splurging for the convenience.

Which is ridiculous. There have been times this route has been upgraded to A319 and even A321 during holiday and busy periods over the past year because of demand. No reason it should be less than daily.

Weird cause winter is high season for Miami. Maybe it's too make room for more profitable routes, only so many slots.

Losing the daily Miami flight is so disappointing. Was just looking last week and it was daily starting back up in December after a two month hiatus (on mainline). No more TPA on SW either and ORL is no longer daily. And still no DTW, PHL, SFO, or IAD as peer cities are gaining back service is a tough look. Feels like we haven't added a new route in a year plus.

Losing the daily Miami flight is so disappointing. Was just looking last week and it was daily starting back up in December after a two month hiatus (on mainline). No more TPA on SW either and ORL is no longer daily. And still no DTW, PHL, SFO, or IAD as peer cities are gaining back service is a tough look. Feels like we haven't added a new route in a year plus.

And losing Allegiant entirely

Losing the daily Miami flight is so disappointing. Was just looking last week and it was daily starting back up in December after a two month hiatus (on mainline). No more TPA on SW either and ORL is no longer daily. And still no DTW, PHL, SFO, or IAD as peer cities are gaining back service is a tough look. Feels like we haven't added a new route in a year plus.

We haven't. Just been losing them. Or having them paused.

I think it means OKC's not having as many leisure travelers as people thought.

We haven't. Just been losing them. Or having them paused.

I think it means OKC's not having as many leisure travelers as people thought.

It doesn't mean that at all. I guarantee you that the airlines had and still have a solid knowledge of what the market is. They track the origin and destination of every person who flies. They are always changing schedules and with limited capacity in order to maximize their profits.

It doesn't mean that at all. I guarantee you that the airlines had and still have a solid knowledge of what the market is. They track the origin and destination of every person who flies. They are always changing schedules and with limited capacity in order to maximize their profits.

Well then apparently OKC's seen as a highly expendable market. More so than other cities of their size, it seems, like Louisville or Omaha.

Well then apparently OKC's seen as a highly expendable market. More so than other cities of their size, it seems, like Louisville or Omaha.

Omaha is known for having unusually high amount of business travel. Louisville probably benefits getting east coast and upper midwest connections vs OKC due to being around half the distance between city pairs, saving both fuel and time the planes are needed for the trips.

https://journalrecord.com/files/2024/08/km-airport-name-page-1-e1724787890863-875x548.png

"We Made It.'

https://okcrotary.club/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Holt_David_2018.jpg

Well then apparently OKC's seen as a highly expendable market. More so than other cities of their size, it seems, like Louisville or Omaha.

Lots of people still drive to DFW. Most other similar-sized cities don’t have one of the largest hub airports on the planet within a 3 hour drive

Lots of people still drive to DFW. Most other similar-sized cities don’t have one of the largest hub airports on the planet within a 3 hour drive

Was going to say this. Haven't done it in a while, but family and I have driven several times in the past to DFW for a flight and bypassed OKC entirely. That doesn't even include Love Field, which is also a busy airport.

Substantial difference between competing against Des Moines/Cincinnati and competing against Dallas.

Well then apparently OKC's seen as a highly expendable market. More so than other cities of their size, it seems, like Louisville or Omaha.

That's not at all what they are saying. The low cost carriers change routes all the time, it's more obvious when you look across their entire network that this isn't anything unique. Not sure about Allegiant in OKC but a lot of the times they won't even have a dedicated gate which means they change schedules or remove service altogether at a moments notice. With that being said, they can also add it back relatively easily any time as well. This isn't the end of the world like you are making it out to be lol

Was going to say this. Haven't done it in a while, but family and I have driven several times in the past to DFW for a flight and bypassed OKC entirely. That doesn't even include Love Field, which is also a busy airport.

Substantial difference between competing against Des Moines/Cincinnati and competing against Dallas.

I’m flying to Mexico City in November. OKC-MEX on AA with a stop in DFW was over $600 vs $300 from DFW. That plus the connection being tight made us decide to make drive which from Norman is only 2.5 hours.

so why is it that many folks in the Chicago area (esp northern Chitown) will fly out of MKE. What do they have that OKC can work on to match?

MKE is actually much closer to Chicago (ORD, MDW) than OKC is to Dallas (DFW, DAL), yet the leakage seems to be switched. I assume both MKE and OKC lose international pax to DFW and ORD respectfully, but what can OKC do to get DFW folks to drive up? or at least keep most of our pax like MKE does.

it's 45 - 50 min from the northern Chicago suburbs to the Milwaukee airport. I would assume there is little to no traffic too. easy to see why some would fly out of MKE.

so OKC is too far from the DFW metroplex to garner similar leakage as shown in Chicagoland to MKE?

“Looks like starting Sept 3 - May 4, the MIA route on AA goes to Saturday only. Then it goes back to daily in May.”

That is outrageous. This flight has a tremendous load factor nearly every day. Seems hard to fathom that AA’s analysis of the route’s profitability told them to just yank it altogether instead of just raising the fare some. Seems like they’re just crapping on us do they can send an E175 to some smaller market in the east.

Omaha is known for having unusually high amount of business travel. Louisville probably benefits getting east coast and upper midwest connections vs OKC due to being around half the distance between city pairs, saving both fuel and time the planes are needed for the trips.

It just doesn’t make sense. Our planes are full…numbers are up, yet we are loosing service. Fares out of OKC are not the cheapest, either. Obviously, people are willing to pay. OMA, DSM, SDF, BOI, XNA…all markets that are smaller than OKC, but we don’t seem to get any attention. Surely it’s more than “we’re just 2.5 hours from Dallas.” I would never think of driving to Dallas for a domestic trip. After you pay for parking, potentially a hotel the night before and the lost time driving back…it can be a net loss to do so.

It just doesn’t make sense. Our planes are full…numbers are up, yet we are loosing service. Fares out of OKC are not the cheapest, either. Obviously, people are willing to pay. OMA, DSM, SDF, BOI, XNA…all markets that are smaller than OKC, but we don’t seem to get any attention. Surely it’s more than “we’re just 2.5 hours from Dallas.” I would never think of driving to Dallas for a domestic trip. After you pay for parking, potentially a hotel the night before and the lost time driving back…it can be a net loss to do so.

OKC is usually one of the first places airlines cut, and rarely returns to prior capacity (see Delta pulling DTW, United puling EWR, SFO, AA pulling PHL and now indefinitely pausing Miami). These route closures/pauses will have impacts down the line, especially from an optics perspective. Airlines see OKC losing routes/frequencies, and it doesn't inspire them to develop the OKC market further.

OKC is usually one of the first places airlines cut, and rarely returns to prior capacity (see Delta pulling DTW, United puling EWR, SFO, AA pulling PHL and now indefinitely pausing Miami). These route closures/pauses will have impacts down the line, especially from an optics perspective. Airlines see OKC losing routes/frequencies, and it doesn't inspire them to develop the OKC market further.

They aren't indefinitely pausing MIA. It's going to Saturday only, then going back to daily service starting again in May.

It def is discouraging to see cities get new routes, but I also see a ton of cities losing service to places as well. I think our last true new nonstop was to Nashville. Our equipment upgrades on the legacy carriers and the increased frequencies across all airlines are pushing our numbers up.

At a minimum, I think not having back SFO or IAD is absurd. I understand EWR because they have been slowly trimming away regional service, but would still use it even though I am an AA FF. AA to PHL would great for me as it opens a handful of more European destinations with only 1 stop.

If you look at our current map, only having two destinations to the NE is a travesty. https://www.flightconnections.com/flights-from-oklahoma-city-okc

We always hear how much our city is growing population wise, but our routes don't really reflect that yet. Hopefully we'll get some news soon

OMA, DSM, SDF, BOI, XNA

BOI: Horizon, SkyWest domiciles
DSM: Allegiant domicile
SDF: UPS, Mesa, Republic domiciles

XNA and OMA have Walmart and Berkshire Hathaway. At one time, you could get paid well to be a plane spotter in those areas.

They aren't indefinitely pausing MIA. It's going to Saturday only, then going back to daily service starting again in May.

It def is discouraging to see cities get new routes, but I also see a ton of cities losing service to places as well. I think our last true new nonstop was to Nashville. Our equipment upgrades on the legacy carriers and the increased frequencies across all airlines are pushing our numbers up.

At a minimum, I think not having back SFO or IAD is absurd. I understand EWR because they have been slowly trimming away regional service, but would still use it even though I am an AA FF. AA to PHL would great for me as it opens a handful of more European destinations with only 1 stop.

If you look at our current map, only having two destinations to the NE is a travesty. https://www.flightconnections.com/flights-from-oklahoma-city-okc

We always hear how much our city is growing population wise, but our routes don't really reflect that yet. Hopefully we'll get some news soon

Nashville is no longer daily after September. Delta was planning on adding a second daily to LGA but looks like they abandoned those plans.

Not surprised about pulling BNA back a bit. It's a very leisure market right now.

Not surprised about pulling BNA back a bit. It's a very leisure market right now.

Our largest unserved market for Q2 2024 is SF with 100 PDEW. Easily enough to fill a regional jet. Followed by Tampa (83), Boston (81) and San Diego (75).

LA had 247 PDEW with only two regionals daily. Room to expand service there for sure.

Nashville is no longer daily after September. Delta was planning on adding a second daily to LGA but looks like they abandoned those plans.

Again, not helping the case that OKC isn't marketing itself to these airlines enough. No one will ever convince me that airports don't gain points based off marketing. Or better use of incentives. OKC deserves better than the service we have.

Hell, by the time the Olympics come around in 2028, passengers will have to connect in Dallas to get to OKC from LAX. Lol.

Again, not helping the case that OKC isn't marketing itself to these airlines enough. No one will ever convince me that airports don't gain points based off marketing. Or better use of incentives. OKC deserves better than the service we have.

Hell, by the time the Olympics come around in 2028, passengers will have to connect in Dallas to get to OKC from LAX. Lol.-

What inside information do you have about what OKC is doing except guessing?

Our largest unserved market for Q2 2024 is SF with 100 PDEW. Easily enough to fill a regional jet. Followed by Tampa (83), Boston (81) and San Diego (75).

LA had 247 PDEW with only two regionals daily. Room to expand service there for sure.

Where do you get these stats? Interesting for sure. SF not surprising

-

What inside information do you have about what OKC is doing except guessing?

I don't, but my eyes can see that OKC isn't doing enough. It is common sense. OKC can't be that bad of a market if they are growing, passenger-wise, every year. Yet here we are, not getting any new routes, losing frequencies on full routes, not regaining routes they lost in 2020. I mean one of those is fine, but all 3 points to a deficiency somewhere.

I am an auditor and CPA, so I am literally trained to not believe in coincidences.

I don't, but my eyes can see that OKC isn't doing enough. It is common sense. OKC can't be that bad of a market if they are growing, passenger-wise, every year. Yet here we are, not getting any new routes, losing frequencies on full routes, not regaining routes they lost in 2020. I mean one of those is fine, but all 3 points to a deficiency somewhere.

I am an auditor and CPA, so I am literally trained to not believe in coincidences.

LOL, so you're guessing and don't really know anything. That's what I figured. Get back to me when you really know something to back up your guesses. I know from over 35 years of dealing with airlines that many things they do are just decided by computers and seemingly make no obvious sense at all.

I am an auditor and CPA, so I am literally trained to not believe in coincidences.
Joe "have you tried DMT" Rogan could change your mind.

LOL, so you're guessing and don't really know anything. That's what I figured. Get back to me when you really know something to back up your guesses. I know from over 35 years of dealing with airlines that many things they do are just decided by computers and seemingly make no obvious sense at all.

Whatever you say.

I don't, but my eyes can see that OKC isn't doing enough. It is common sense. OKC can't be that bad of a market if they are growing, passenger-wise, every year. Yet here we are, not getting any new routes, losing frequencies on full routes, not regaining routes they lost in 2020. I mean one of those is fine, but all 3 points to a deficiency somewhere.

I am an auditor and CPA, so I am literally trained to not believe in coincidences.

So why the assumption that all markets have uniform variables?

So why the assumption that all markets have uniform variables?

I'm not. We are in OKC, so we are more exposed to it. And I am basing it solely off what others have that we don't. We need more connections. It boosts tourism, boosts tax revenue. Our mayor keeps calling us a Big League City, but our airport doesnt reflect that. Losing routes and frequencies at this rate OKC has isn't a good look, perception-wise. Airlines definitely use what other airlines are doing at airports to help determine whether to look into expanding at an airport. If they don't, they are foolish.

OKC has been growing, yet still losing options. Which causes airlines to be able to charge more for flights out of OKC. At some point, someone in OKC is failing.

As for uniform variables, what variables does OKC lack that Louisville and Omaha don't? I refuse to believe that many people, aside from maybe some of those flying overseas, drive to DFW to skip flying out of OKC.

I'm done cluttering up this thread, though. Feel free to DM me for more of my thoughts. Even though it is on topic.

Where do you get these stats? Interesting for sure. SF not surprising

https://data.transportation.gov/Aviation/Consumer-Airfare-Report-Table-6-Contiguous-State-C/yj5y-b2ir/explore/query/SELECT%0A%20%20%60tbl%60%2C%0A%20%20%60year%60%2C% 0A%20%20%60quarter%60%2C%0A%20%20%60citymarketid_1 %60%2C%0A%20%20%60citymarketid_2%60%2C%0A%20%20%60 city1%60%2C%0A%20%20%60city2%60%2C%0A%20%20%60nsmi les%60%2C%0A%20%20%60passengers%60%2C%0A%20%20%60f are%60%2C%0A%20%20%60carrier_lg%60%2C%0A%20%20%60l arge_ms%60%2C%0A%20%20%60fare_lg%60%2C%0A%20%20%60 carrier_low%60%2C%0A%20%20%60lf_ms%60%2C%0A%20%20% 60fare_low%60%2C%0A%20%20%60table_1_flag%60%2C%0A% 20%20%60location_1%60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_1_add ress%60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_1_city%60%2C%0A%20% 20%60location_1_state%60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_1_ zip%60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_2%60%2C%0A%20%20%60l ocation_2_address%60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_2_city %60%2C%0A%20%20%60location_2_state%60%2C%0A%20%20% 60location_2_zip%60%2C%0A%20%20%60tbl6pk%60%0AORDE R%20BY%20%60year%60%20DESC%20NULL%20FIRST/page/filter