I got one in the mail yesterday and actually was coming here to post about it. It's clearly an investment pitch. I don't know how common it is to seek out investors in this manner, and I have no idea how they got my name and address, but it is an interesting approach.

Seeking out investors in any manner has been going on since the dawn of time. Why is this seeming so foreign? I don't get it. It is capitalism and venture investing.

Didn't mean to sound rude, and i apologize, but this stuff happens every hour of every day.

Seeking out investors in any manner has been going on since the dawn of time. Why is this seeming so foreign? I don't get it. It is capitalism and venture investing.

Didn't mean to sound rude, and i apologize, but this stuff happens every hour of every day.

It's weird.

When was the last time you saw full-page ads in the Oklahoman seeking investors for a commercial real estate project?

It's weird.

When was the last time you saw full-page ads in the Oklahoman seeking investors for a commercial real estate project?

Maybe the manner is weird. I will grant you that.

Maybe the manner is weird. I will grant you that.

That's the entire point. No one is saying seeking investors is weird. It's the manner in which they are doing it. I have never seen a highly produced magazine, made to look like a lifestyle periodical, mailed to seemingly random people seeking investment in a product like this.

My spidey sense is tingling...

I mean, they are already building in Colorado Springs, right?

Seeking out investors in any manner has been going on since the dawn of time. Why is this seeming so foreign? I don't get it. It is capitalism and venture investing.

Didn't mean to sound rude, and i apologize, but this stuff happens every hour of every day.

Just because people seek investors all the time doesn't mean that the way they are doing it is 'normal' and there are VERY specific legal requirements when raising money, especially on commercial real estate when considering taking investment dollars from qualified or non-qualified investors. They are trying to skirt that by being an 'entertainment venue' and using a kind of crowdfunding technique but all of that is risky and they are just asking to get sued. There is a ton of questions about what 'purchasing' a fire pit actually gets you and feels like they are purposely misleading potential investors by being so vague - let alone not being anywhere forthcoming about what happens to the return of your money if the venue is never built.

This just screams being a future episode of American Greed.

I mean, they are already building in Colorado Springs, right?

Yes, I checked Google Earth and they have started construction.

However, something seems off here... Remember, Relax Park was finished and opened before it collapsed in lawsuits; it's now just weeds.

Hope this all works out but I'll be keeping a close watch.

it's now just weeds.


I thought it was all weed before :lol2:

Another full-page ad in the Oklahoman today:


HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/noteslive080623a.jpg


HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/noteslive080623b.jpg

it may be unusual for OKC but I don't see anything wrong with the advertisement tbh. Plenty of these type of ads appear in larger markets all of the time. Again, welcome to the big leagues - OKC.

it may be unusual for OKC but I don't see anything wrong with the advertisement tbh. Plenty of these type of ads appear in larger markets all of the time. Again, welcome to the big leagues - OKC.

Please provide one example from the 'larger markets'. I never saw anything like this in 25 years in Los Angeles.

Please provide one from one of the larger markets. I never saw anything like this in 25 years in Los Angeles.

My reasoning is this: the people this group is targeting are those who read the newspaper. Not those who are right out of college. They could never afford these things. But adult businesspeople are more likely to. The newspaper is still a pat of their day. Am I saying it will be effective? Maybe not. But they have a target group. It isn't 25-35 year olds. It is 45-55 year olds, who are more likely to be able to afford things like this.

Again, it may fail. But this group has already broken ground in Colorado Springs on an amphitheater, so they aren't a total fail, like some on this board are thinking. It is a unique format, but who knows. Why say they struck out before they step in the batters box?

Nobody has said this group is a total fail.

But the manner in which they are approaching this -- and 5-6 other cities at the same time -- is very strange.

it may be unusual for OKC but I don't see anything wrong with the advertisement tbh. Plenty of these type of ads appear in larger markets all of the time. Again, welcome to the big leagues - OKC.

Not a single legit developer raises money like this and there are not plenty of ads like this in major markets like Dallas, LA, NY, etc.

This is a massive red flag. Return rates in typical projects are in the 8% - 14% range with over 10% deemed highly, highly speculative in nature. Offering 19% return, before depreciation is crazy to put it nicely. Like the feds should be knocking on their door soon type of thing. The only time I've ever seen anyone offer a return rate that high has been when people are operating Ponzi schemes.

19.6% return on investment? Plus concerts? That's awesome! Sign me up!

/s

This is being advertised like it is a REIT, though REITs already have income producing commercial properties in them. It actually seems like a type of crowdfunding. Very odd indeed.

They already have plenty of projects fully funded. If OKC can't match what a Gainesville, GA or Colorado Springs, CO did, then we don't deserve this. No developers have tried to put an amphitheater in town until Notes did.

Yes, I checked Google Earth and they have started construction.

However, something seems off here... Remember, Relax Park was finished and opened before it collapsed in lawsuits; it's now just weeds.

Hope this all works out but I'll be keeping a close watch.

I will say...if they can manage to get an amphitheater completed before it collapses in lawsuits, that still might not be a terrible outcome for OKC if a more reputable company can take it over from there.

I will say...if they can manage to get an amphitheater completed before it collapses in lawsuits, that still might not be a terrible outcome for OKC if a more reputable company can take it over from there.

This post was unnecessarily nihilistic and vague on my part (what can I say, it is Monday Morning after all), so let me just add on to it and say that the tackiness of the advertising has me more convinced than ever that this is at least scam-adjacent, and will in fact most likely collapse in lawsuits if it ever gets going. Certainly not something I'd be investing money in if I had anywhere close to the net worth needed to buy into in this project, lol.

This post was unnecessarily nihilistic and vague on my part (what can I say, it is Monday Morning after all), so let me just add on to it and say that the tackiness of the advertising has me more convinced than ever that this is at least scam-adjacent, and will in fact most likely collapse in lawsuits if it ever gets going. Certainly not something I'd be investing money in if I had anywhere close to the net worth needed to buy into in this project, lol.

But, if the building gets built, then someone will manage it. Either Notes, or Live Nation. Or some other group. I think the manner is weird, yes. But I don't think weird automatically means fraud.

Would it be accurate to say that all these people are doing is just gauging the demand for this sort of venue in OKC? Because it seems like they have successfully built these types of venues in other cities. So why do people think it must be crowdfunding here or some sort of scam?

Would it be accurate to say that all these people are doing is just gauging the demand for this sort of venue in OKC? Because it seems like they have successfully built these types of venues in other cities. So why do people think it must be crowdfunding here or some sort of scam?

I've talked to someone pretty close to the situation and they indicated a pretty strong demand already.

Please provide one example from the 'larger markets'. I never saw anything like this in 25 years in Los Angeles.

perhaps I should alter my statement to say, many large developments advertise in newspapers in larger markets. Most in Seattle are for highrise residential, so I agree an ampitheatre is a little unusual but advertising for investors is not.

Anything new on this? A venue like this is long overdue for a metro our size. Construction is already underway on the company's Colorado Springs facility. Here's a link to its progress. https://www.kktv.com/2023/08/16/sunset-amphitheater-colorado-springs-1-step-closer-opening/

Anything new on this? A venue like this is long overdue for a metro our size. Construction is already underway on the company's Colorado Springs facility. Here's a link to its progress. https://www.kktv.com/2023/08/16/sunset-amphitheater-colorado-springs-1-step-closer-opening/

I'm sorry, but that does NOT say construction is underway. All it says is that the company has filed applications for 12 construction permits covering $24 million in work.

I'm sorry, but that does NOT say construction is underway. All it says is that the company has filed applications for 12 construction permits covering $24 million in work.

I checked Google Earth and as of April, they were moving dirt at the Colorado Springs location.

Has anybody checked into the cost of "ownership" of the Firepit Suites ??

Has anybody checked into the cost of "ownership" of the Firepit Suites ??

A little information is here if it applies to all of their locations. It looks like they are all sold in Colorado Springs.

https://noteslive.vip/properties/sunset-luxury-fire-pit-suites/

"One time lease execution fee of $200,000 due at inception of lease with no additional costs"

From another website is this.

"There are 202 luxury suites available for lifetime ownership investment in The Sunset Amphitheater at Mustang Creek. Now is your chance to be a part of a solid, real estate anchored investment and diversify your portfolio. All 8-person luxury fire pit suites can be secured with at $200,000 non-refundable down payment and 4-person luxury suites can be secure with a $100,000 non-refundable down payment. The remaining balance is due 30-days before the amphitheater’s opening concert.

Notes Live is seeking qualified investors that enjoy outstanding live music accompanied by great food and beverage. Participants must have income in excess of $200,000 individually or $300,000 income as a couple in each of the prior two years, or a net worth exceeding $1 million (excluding your primary residence)."

$200,000 is the down payment. Any idea was is due 30 days later ?? Thanks for the info !!

$200,000 is the down payment. Any idea was is due 30 days later ?? Thanks for the info !!


"One time lease execution fee of $200,000 due at inception of lease with no additional costs"

If this is true ?

So many questions here. :eek:

So many questions here. :eek:

For sure.

I think some are just confusing the questions with being negative about it. It's not really even clear how the 19% target return would be generated. Sounds like maybe a rev share, but there's no real track record and that would totally depend on how that share is structured.

Unfortunately, it sounds like that information only comes after providing financials. I'm curious, but not that curious.

^

I wonder how many people are sending in their financial information from an ad in the newspaper?

This whole thing is either brilliant or dodgy... Time will tell.

^

I wonder how many people are sending in their financial information from an ad in the newspaper?

This whole thing is either brilliant or dodgy... Time will tell.

Or, it could be brilliant and dodgy...

Personally, I typically don't have $200,000 to invest in an amphitheater fire-pit rev-share lease agreement, but when I do, I check the newspaper ads.

They are performing some very serious work at the Colorado Springs location. I can't speak of the proposed locations including OKC and Tulsa, but it seems like the Colorado Springs location is not a scam with the concrete foundations for the stage going in and the massive hill they have constructed.

https://i.gyazo.com/3aced65fcaaf90a6083b8b176407d096.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/8082ab3cf04854c3a0739149ba697fde.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/025b1bd6ceb713d0a36957d2a5a8cc91.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/d095b3717c7e3b20ff8551ca49ecd4c1.jpg

... the Colorado Springs location is not a scam with the concrete foundations for the stage going in and the massive hill they have constructed.

It could get built and still be a scam.

Timeshares get built all the time.

But for those that aren't investing and just want to see a new amphitheater get built, actual work in CS is a good sign for sure.

It could get built and still be a scam.

Timeshares get built all the time.

But for those that aren't investing and just want to see a new amphitheater get built, actual work in CS is a good sign for sure.

If an amphitheater gets built, it will be used. Whether by this group or Live Nation. It won't be empty if built.

It could get built and still be a scam.

Timeshares get built all the time.

But for those that aren't investing and just want to see a new amphitheater get built, actual work in CS is a good sign for sure.

That fair, the entire thing could be a scam as you do need a proof of concept to get people to put more money in. I don’t think it sounds like an intentional scam, but I could definitely see myself drinking some margaritas and eating nachos while watching an American Greed episode about it in a few years.

This ad showed up on Facebook the other day.

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This ad showed up on Facebook the other day.

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I got an email earlier this week inviting me to a dinner at Stock & Bond to learn more (i.e. get pitched) on the fireplace suites. For what it's worth, I was told the purchase of the suite does include tickets to every event.

I got an email earlier this week inviting me to a dinner at Stock & Bond to learn more (i.e. get pitched) on the fireplace suites. For what it's worth, I was told the purchase of the suite does include tickets to every event.

And it will get plenty of events. A lot of tours overlook OKC because there isn't a 10-12,000 seat outdoor venue (mainly in the summer). The Zoo holds roughly 8k. If it held 11k, OKC would get a lot of those tours that go to Dallas or KC or even Rogers (Walmart AMP holds 10k).

I got an email earlier this week inviting me to a dinner at Stock & Bond to learn more (i.e. get pitched) on the fireplace suites. For what it's worth, I was told the purchase of the suite does include tickets to every event.

Hopefully OKC corps pick up on that and purchase a suite. This could be a recruiting tool for new hires, come to OKC - see a show and how awesome Oklahoma City is to live, work, and play.

Hopefully OKC corps pick up on that and purchase a suite. This could be a recruiting tool for new hires, come to OKC - see a show and how awesome Oklahoma City is to live, work, and play.

I didn't get an answer on the cost, but imagine there's a range. They've apparently sold 40 of the 202 available suites.

I didn't get an answer on the cost, but imagine there's a range. They've apparently sold 40 of the 202 available suites.

Interesting development...in the Yukon Happenings Facebook page...someone claiming to be Carol Coury Hefner has posted a tread pumping this development. In her initial post, the OP states: As we move into the next phase, we are excited to present The Sunset Amphitheater at Mustang Creek Crossing opportunities to own your piece of the excitement. Fire pit Suites and interior seating with class A service and menu are coming to rock the city! We could not be prouder of this venue and the team that has been built along with it! Richard Clift Jr Yes! 5 lanes planned for Sara Road for 2 miles, and SW 15th Street too. The development will have a tunnel under the Turnpike for interior traffic flow and 7 roundabouts to keep it moving."

Then later in the thread, she claims that ODOT was "already" underway, and had "already planned" the widening of SW 15th Street, and Sara Road to 5 lanes each to ease traffic to and from the site. This was in response to local homeowners concerned about traffic. She repeated that claim multiple times. Then she stated that OTA was going to build a tunnel under the Kilpatrick Turnpike to allow access to the site from the turnpike side. And finally that OTA "has already established out 4 lane boulevard for the development..." Obviously this is incorrect as ODOT and OTA have no legal authority to build, reconstruct or widen any streets or roads in a municipality. In response to comments about OTA not building a boulevard for their development, and OTA would not build a tunnel..she responded stating the tunnel was already built and she included a photo of a flood control culvert passing under the turnpike. A culvert is not a "tunnel" for pedestrian or vehicular use. Here is a photo of the "tunnel" she claims OTA built for them.

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Anyway...I reached out to ODOT to inform them that someone has been posting on Facebook making claims that ODOT and OTA were going to do all this road infrastructure work for the development. Just a few minutes ago, ODOT posted the following on their Facebook page.

We are seeing a number of posts about ODOT potentially widening several Oklahoma City roads, including S.W. 15th St. and Sara Rd., as part of the new amphitheater proposal. ODOT does not work on or widen city streets without an agreement with the city. At this time, there is no agreement in place for this kind of work. Any work on S.W. 15th St., Sara Rd. or other city streets would be performed by the City of Oklahoma City - Government


https://www.facebook.com/OKDOT


Now again...to be clear...the OP of that thread stated unequivocally that "ODOT is getting underway" in the widening of SW15 and also Sara Roads. That is completely false. No such thing has happened nor has it been presented to ODOT. Now...I do not think ODOT usually responds on Facebook to Facebook posts in other groups...but this one was clearly bad enough that ODOT felt the need to respond.

So...to those asking is this development a scam. I do not know. And I wouldn't venture a guess. But I do ask this question...if someone will post erroneous information over something so easily verifiable...what else would they say?

After the post about ODOT went up...the thread on Yukon Happenings is gone. Here are some screen shots I took before it disappeared.

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^

Reminder that Carol Coury Hefner is the daughter of Sam Coury, the developer of Mustang Creek Crossing and owner of the Spaghetti Warehouse building.

She also said on that Facebook thread (which has now been completely deleted) that "we" are building another amphitheater in McKinney, TX. Perhaps Coury is involved in several or all of the proposed new locations?

On another Facebook page...Ms. Hefner posted that "we also own Red Rocks in Denver..." I'll bet that's news to the City and County of Denver who also claim to own Red Rocks Amphitheater. This is quite bold to claim you own one of the premier facilities in the US when you clearly don't.

Below are her post making the claim...and a screen shot from the Red Rocks web page.


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Well now it seems the City of Oklahoma City takes issue with the things Ms. Hefner claimed. They have shared the ODOT post on the City's official Facebook page.

https://www.facebook.com/cityofokc

Is that the same Carol Hefner that tried running for Mayor?

Is that the same Carol Hefner that tried running for Mayor?

I believe so yes.

Whoa. This went from curious to bizarre. At first I was thinking she may have been hacked or something, but in context of her other posts, maybe not.

I wonder if Notes Live will say anything or if they're just waiting to see if it passes. I would think this kinda threatens their legitimacy as they're campaigning for investors.

Whoa. This went from curious to bizarre. At first I was thinking she may have been hacked or something, but in context of her other posts, maybe not.

I wonder if Notes Live will say anything or if they're just waiting to see if it passes. I would think this kinda threatens their legitimacy as they're campaigning for investors.

It is bizarre. It’s one thing to make erroneous statements about ODOT and OTA building or modifying roads that those state agencies have no jurisdiction to perform…but it’s a completely different thing to claim you own one of the most renown music venues in the country when you clearly do not own it. That’s not hyperbole…that’s just plain bogus. Who does that?

I believe so yes.

That makes sense with what she's saying then because she is a certified wackjob.

She's an obvious liar.

I have heard that they are preselling the suites and have commitments for about 40% of them.

From their website:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/noteslive092123a.jpg

^ That number has been stuck at 87 for at least two months (which most likely means they aren't bothering to update their website for whatever reason)

It is bizarre. It’s one thing to make erroneous statements about ODOT and OTA building or modifying roads that those state agencies have no jurisdiction to perform…but it’s a completely different thing to claim you own one of the most renown music venues in the country when you clearly do not own it. That’s not hyperbole…that’s just plain bogus. Who does that?

I think they're called charlatans.

^ That number has been stuck at 87 for at least two months (which most likely means they aren't bothering to update their website for whatever reason)

Yeah. I'd guess quite a few have been purchased. I think this will happen, and is much needed. OKC might be the largest metro area without a 10k seat amphitheater. It hurts OKC's concert scene in the summer, a ton. Look at what Rogers gets due to the Walmart AMP. 40 to 50 events a year, whereas the Zoo Amp maybe gets 20? And this will hold more than the Walmart AMP does.