https://youtu.be/mlIfKj6DnXA?si=6s2we3JDso4t-_Xj I hope the powers that be take a tour and take notes once this place is complete. If OKC can come close to this it’ll be a game-changer.

Kaufmann Stadium opened 50 years ago, while I am a fan of how the Truman Sports Complex has worked over the years, the setup has certainly favored the Chiefs and Arrowhead, versus a baseball friendly venue. Both stadiums in KC allow the common fan a great experience.

The Georgia Dome and Ballpark in Arlington also had very short lifespans as arenas/stadiums. (Yes, I know the Ballpark in Arlington is still standing, but it's a very odd configuration for sporting events, and not a major league tenant)

I don't know specifics of the Georgia Dome but there was nothing wrong with The Ballpark at Arlington except that it was outdoors. With the frequent day games before travel, playing outdoors in at The Ballpark in Arlington was not reasonable. I can attest to trying to watch games in 105 to 115 degrees and it was awful. This was the main reason for building the new dome.

I don't know specifics of the Georgia Dome but there was nothing wrong with The Ballpark at Arlington except that it was outdoors. With the frequent day games before travel, playing outdoors in at The Ballpark in Arlington was not reasonable. I can attest to trying to watch games in 105 to 115 degrees and it was awful. This was the main reason for building the new dome.

I actually miss the days of melting into the seats watching the Rangers. My childhood :)

I DON'T miss burning myself on frying pan hot seats.

We're all waiting on the 'explosion' that will reveal some semblance of the new downtown arena. The $900 million budget should build OKC something that will turn heads around--if we improve on the exterior facade and interior square footage.

It's going to be just as impactful as when Larry Nichols revealed the Devon Tower shown next to First National Center.

Pete, we're looking forward to your excellent Indepth reporting.

This thought just popped into my head. So Paycom has a 15-year deal for the naming rights to the arena and when this one opens it'll be only on year 8-ish? Will the name be transferred to the new arena or will they terminate the contract somehow?

Discussed upthread. Paycom will retain naming rights to whichever arena is in use by Thunder.

Discussed upthread. Paycom will retain naming rights to whichever arena is in use by Thunder.



https://youtu.be/gaKy6amLd78


KFOR 4 - 15 seconds into Tanner DeLeon reports, he says the city is in the beginning stages--not giving the new arena a name yet . . .

. . . You would think they would give Paycom the option of moving the name from the current arena to the new arena.

IIRC this aired two month ago, last week in December.

https://youtu.be/gaKy6amLd78


KFOR 4 - 15 seconds into Tanner DeLeon reports, he says the city is in the beginning stages--not giving the new arena a name yet . . .

. . . You would think they would give Paycom the option of moving the name from the current arena to the new arena.

IIRC this aired two month ago, last week in December.

They wouldn't be able to confirm that at this time because the agreement on who has naming rights has not been signed. It will most likely be left with the Thunder and they would likely keep Paycom through the end of that agreement.

Gonna be a long year or so til we see preliminary designs.

Hopefully they come sooner, but given a roughly 2 year construction process, and a 2029 projected opening, 2025 for designs, 1.5 or 2 to get site ready, then 2 year construction, 2025 seems right.

Saw this in one of my Thunder fan groups.


"Hello all,

I am a student at the University of Oklahoma and am part of a group for a class that is tasked with doing a research project for the Oklahoma City Thunder. While we are not directly affiliated with the Thunder, we will be presenting our findings to members of the Oklahoma City Thunder at the end of April.

As a part of our research project, we are required to develop a survey to help with our analysis. Our group’s theme is fan engagement and atmosphere in the new arena. Our survey is completely anonymous, only general demographic questions are asked. It should only take 5 minutes to complete and it will greatly help our group out in delivering findings and proposals to the Thunder themselves.

Your response could very well make a difference in the new arena!

Here is the link to the survey.

https://ousurvey.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_engDjJfbAAZUznE

Thank you for your time and go Thunder!"

Don't know how close they are to the organization but I figured it might be cool to add our input here for the Thunder's office to see. Maybe they will take our input into consideration and we could see something cool added to the arena.

Saw this in one of my Thunder fan groups.


"Hello all,

I am a student at the University of Oklahoma and am part of a group for a class that is tasked with doing a research project for the Oklahoma City Thunder. While we are not directly affiliated with the Thunder, we will be presenting our findings to members of the Oklahoma City Thunder at the end of April.

As a part of our research project, we are required to develop a survey to help with our analysis. Our group’s theme is fan engagement and atmosphere in the new arena. Our survey is completely anonymous, only general demographic questions are asked. It should only take 5 minutes to complete and it will greatly help our group out in delivering findings and proposals to the Thunder themselves.

Your response could very well make a difference in the new arena!

Here is the link to the survey.

https://ousurvey.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_engDjJfbAAZUznE

Thank you for your time and go Thunder!"

Don't know how close they are to the organization but I figured it might be cool to add our input here for the Thunder's office to see. Maybe they will take our input into consideration and we could see something cool added to the arena.

it would do them well to proof read their questions before publishing the survey

it would do them well to proof read their questions before publishing the survey

Yes, and have a box to check if you are retired.

I think they used a survey company. It's common with them to leave off a "retired" choice.

Thought we’d at least have a location announcement by now.

Thought we’d at least have a location announcement by now.

I doubt we know anything before 4Q 2024, at the earliest.

I doubt we know anything before 4Q 2024, at the earliest.

You're probably right.

Just can't understand what the hold up might be. The Cox PSM site (if selected) needs to be prepped for building the new arena. Those 4 square blocks will allow enough room to build something big, bold and beautiful. Possibly add more exhibition space to back up our new convention center complex.

You're probably right.

Just can't understand what the hold up might be. The Cox PSM site (if selected) needs to be prepped for building the new arena. Those 4 square blocks will allow enough room to build something big, bold and beautiful. Possibly add more exhibition space to back up our new convention center complex.

They can't really do anything substantial anyway until the studio is out.

There is no reason for them to announce the site because they already own it (Myriad/Cox Center/Prairie Surf).

Notice has already been given to Prairie Surf and I'm sure they are working on an RFP for the site, and there are only two real players: HOK and Populous.

They have the MAPS 4 money being reallocated from proposed improvements to Paycom and of course the billion $ funding plan has already been approved.

You would think the RFP would be the next big step, because they are going to want to start work the minute Prairie Surf's lease expires 12/31/25, if not before. The stated goal is to be open and operating before the end of the decade.

There won’t be a location announcement. The location will be confirmed via site plans and construction drawings.

There won’t be a location announcement. The location will be confirmed via site plans and construction drawings.

So pretty much an “announcement”

No..?

There won’t be a location announcement. The location will be confirmed via site plans and construction drawings.

Will they receive approval from the FAA?

Lol

There is no reason for them to announce the site because they already own it (Myriad/Cox Center/Prairie Surf).

Notice has already been given to Prairie Surf and I'm sure they are working on an RFP for the site, and there are only two real players: HOK and Populous.

They have the MAPS 4 money being reallocated from proposed improvements to Paycom and of course the billion $ funding plan has already been approved.

You would think the RFP would be the next big step, because they are going to want to start work the minute Prairie Surf's lease expires 12/31/25, if not before. The stated goal is to be open and operating before the end of the decade.

slight correction: Prarie Surf's lease expires 12/31/2024. Right?

No..?

Once the location is confirmed, I would think that someone will report on it and let the people know the location.

No..?

Double post

slight correction: Prarie Surf's lease expires 12/31/2024. Right?

Quote from article -

Freeman intends to place a resolution on the Dec. 19th city council agenda that will provide notice to the Cox Convention Center's tenants, Prairie Surf Media, that the city will not be extending its lease.

The current lease between the city and Prairie Surf Media ends in December 2025.

There won’t be a location announcement. The location will be confirmed via site plans and construction drawings.

This seems like a ketchup vs catsup argument. lol

I think everyone should just assume its at the Cox unless there is some kind of 'location announcement' saying otherwise. That would be a bigger announcement if the city has to enter some kind of land purchase or swap deal.

It is the Cox Center/PSM location. There is no question at this point. Trust me on this.

It is the Cox Center/PSM location. There is no question at this point. Trust me on this.

Any idea when a timeframe for plans being released ? I'd say 15 to 18 months ?

Any idea when a timeframe for plans being released ? I'd say 15 to 18 months ?

Somewhere along the line, it was stated that the plans would take 18 months to 2 years.

So, to be ready to go by 12/31/25 (the end of the PSM's lease) the RFP for an architect would need to go out very soon.

thank you for the correction on the lease end.

Is waiting so long for the lease end in the best interest for the city/team or is this a good thing in that we don't need to take on so much debt in waiting and perhaps rates might be lower after a regime change in Washington? I was thinking the sooner the better with regard to demolition and reconstruction scheduling in order to meet a 2029 deadline (with hard construction needing to finish in 2028 for that to happen).

In my mind there are 3 main tasks that need to happen with enough time to fit/fixture the arena in 2029 for an opening of the 2029-2030 NBA Season:
1) demolition
2) reconstruction of the parking foundation/connection to Bricktown Canal
3) arena superstructure

I assume amenities like Thunder Alley and highrise development of the remainder of the site could be later. Anybody have any insight on what the timeline should be for the major steps to be completed to make the deadline?

thank you for the correction on the lease end.

Is waiting so long for the lease end in the best interest for the city/team or is this a good thing in that we don't need to take on so much debt in waiting and perhaps rates might be lower after a regime change in Washington? I was thinking the sooner the better with regard to demolition and reconstruction scheduling in order to meet a 2029 deadline (with hard construction needing to finish in 2028 for that to happen).

In my mind there are 3 main tasks that need to happen with enough time to fit/fixture the arena in 2029 for an opening of the 2029-2030 NBA Season:
1) demolition
2) reconstruction of the parking foundation/connection to Bricktown Canal
3) arena superstructure

I assume amenities like Thunder Alley and highrise development of the remainder of the site could be later. Anybody have any insight on what the timeline should be for the major steps to be completed to make the deadline?

I mean, the city is already paying 95% of the arena cost. Why should they have to pay extra to buyout PSM of their lease?

I mean, the city is already paying 95% of the arena cost. Why should they have to pay extra to buyout PSM of their lease?

i mean it is the cities arena .. they own it ..

Will they receive approval from the FAA?

That made me laugh

Forgot about the lease with PSM.

The city uses the 4-square PSM site, there will be plenty of room to add more amenities to the site. Agree with Hot Rod:


1) Demolition
2) Reconstruction of the parking foundation/connection to Bricktown Canal
3) Arena superstructure

Have confidence the city will get it correct this time. They know the deficiencies of our current Paycom Center; therefore, look for a competitive venue making OKC a top five NBA arena and the best small market arena (under 2 million MSA) better than Milwaukee (Fiserv) , Salt Lake City (Delta), Memphis (FedEx) and New Orleans (Smoothie King).

.

i mean it is the cities arena .. they own it ..

I know. As is the Cox Center. But they have a lease with someone to use it. They can't kick them out without paying them, before that lease expires. I don't want the city paying anymore than they will already have to for the arena. Just wait til 2026 to start demolition, if they are going to build it here. Don't pay PSM a freaking dime to leave early.

But I agree on the 3 steps needed. Just starting in 2026 :)

thank you for the correction on the lease end.

Is waiting so long for the lease end in the best interest for the city/team or is this a good thing in that we don't need to take on so much debt in waiting and perhaps rates might be lower after a regime change in Washington? I was thinking the sooner the better with regard to demolition and reconstruction scheduling in order to meet a 2029 deadline (with hard construction needing to finish in 2028 for that to happen).

In my mind there are 3 main tasks that need to happen with enough time to fit/fixture the arena in 2029 for an opening of the 2029-2030 NBA Season:
1) demolition
2) reconstruction of the parking foundation/connection to Bricktown Canal
3) arena superstructure

I assume amenities like Thunder Alley and highrise development of the remainder of the site could be later. Anybody have any insight on what the timeline should be for the major steps to be completed to make the deadline?

The longer they wait, the cheaper it will be to break the lease and hopefully PSM will be ready to move within a year. It hurts them when securing movie contracts.

I know. As is the Cox Center. But they have a lease with someone to use it. They can't kick them out without paying them, before that lease expires. I don't want the city paying anymore than they will already have to for the arena. Just wait til 2026 to start demolition, if they are going to build it here. Don't pay PSM a freaking dime to leave early.

But I agree on the 3 steps needed. Just starting in 2026 :)

Cost-benefit analysis - if it will cost less in the long run and be better for the project, then they should buy Prairie Surf out. I'm sure the big brains have already done the math on that...

Cost-benefit analysis - if it will cost less in the long run and be better for the project, then they should buy Prairie Surf out. I'm sure the big brains have already done the math on that...

Yeah, depends if they have to pay construction works overtime to make a deadline. But I think Mid-2025 would be the earliest they would consider a buyout of the lease. If they could start demolishing today, the site would just sit empty until site and design plans are ready.

Saw on News6 that the City is actively seeking partner to help design new Arena? I thought it was Populous?

https://www.newson6.com/story/66010011eab37a12951e1ea0/oklahoma-city-seeks-partner-for-billion-dollar-arena-project

Saw on News6 that the City is actively seeking partner to help design new Arena? I thought it was Populous?

https://www.newson6.com/story/66010011eab37a12951e1ea0/oklahoma-city-seeks-partner-for-billion-dollar-arena-project

No, this is the RFP to select the architect, a process all public projects have to follow.

I didn't realize this was posted on March 15th and respondents have until April 5th to put in a bid.

So we should know here in a couple weeks...

Here is the entirety of the RFP - not much to it.

It's generally understood the only real qualified firms are Populous and HOK. Given that Populous has already done a ton of work with the City, I expect there have already been discussions with them and they are going to get this contract.

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/arena032524a.jpg

This is not a bid for an architect. This is a bid for a consultant and agent for the City, one which will HELP them select and hire - and ultimately supervise - an architect. It’s project management. This consultant will essentially be doing peer review, on behalf of all three concerned parties; the City, the Thunder, and ASM. This is S.O.P..

There will be a vote this week by the MAPS 4 Board to formally move $78 million from the MAPS 3 Paycom improvements budget to MAPS 4.

So, they will soon have tons of money to hire an architect and have the start on the plans.

^ ^ ^
Good news, now we should hear the press release on the PSM Cox site selection by the year's end.

There will be a vote this week by the MAPS 4 Board to formally move $78 million from the MAPS 3 Paycom improvements budget to MAPS 4.

So, they will soon have tons of money to hire an architect and have the start on the plans.

Due to the rapid rate at which designs for arenas are changing, I'd imagine makes it a hard time to release accurate drawings when the project is still a few years out. They'll probably be very basic with the more fine details to be filled in when the arena is less than a year out from construction.

Due to the rapid rate at which designs for arenas are changing, I'd imagine makes it a hard time to release accurate drawings when the project is still a few years out. They'll probably be very basic with the more fine details to be filled in when the arena is less than a year out from construction.

They will have to submit broad designs to both design review and to the citizen oversight committee for what is essentially MAPS 5.

And then there'll be a bunch of permutations as they refine the final design. But they are going to have to hustle to be ready to start work by 12/31/25 when Prairie Surf moves out.

They will have to submit broad designs to both design review and to the citizen oversight committee for what is essentially MAPS 5.

And then there'll be a bunch of permutations as they refine the final design. But they are going to have to hustle to be ready to start work by 12/31/25 when Prairie Surf moves out.
This project will not have an associated citizen oversight committee. That function will essentially be filled by the owners representative third party consultant that is currently being sought via RFP. Some posters here have been confused by this RFP, and interpreted it as one seeking the architect of record. It is NOT for the architect. The RFP for the architect is probably 2-3 months out.

The City is being quite clear to repeatedly point out this this is NOT a MAPS project. Obviously it's very MAPS-adjacent, but there are very important differences.

^

Whatever the oversight group is called, it will still be subject to open meetings and open records laws.

So, any decisions will have to involve a public vote with advance notice.

^

Whatever the oversight group is called, it will still be subject to open meetings and open records laws.

So, any decisions will have to involve a public vote with advance notice.

by guess is that it will function much more like GO bond projects do ..

Populous and HOK Sport merged just fyi.

Related to citizens funding arenas and stadiums for professional teams. I was a little surprised by the Jackson county vote in Kansas City to reject/No vote to the 3/8 cent sales tax to build the Royal's a new stadium and renovate Arrowhead Stadium for the Chiefs. It was a 40 year tax proposal! I am wondering if that is why the proposal failed? It will be interesting to see what the two ownership groups do in response. It initially sounds like this was the "best/only deal" offered.

There are rumors that the Kansas side of KC may offer incentives for the Chiefs to move, but stay in the Metro, while the Royal's future in KC seems a little more uncertain.

https://www.kctv5.com/2024/04/03/royals-chiefs-concede-loss-stadium-sales-tax-vote/

It was voted down almost 60% to 40%, noting that this was a county vote, not a city/metro vote, which may have impacted the numbers, or simply the citizens didn't agree with the scope of what was being proposed. Given the Chiefs recent success (3 Super Bowl victories in 5 years) and Arrowhead Stadium known for its loud atmosphere and 50+ year history, I wonder if bundling the deal with the Royals also hurt the proposed sales tax?

OKC Citizens voted yes by a 70%+ margin to fund the penny for a new Paycom Center.

Related to citizens funding arenas and stadiums for professional teams. I was a little surprised by the Jackson county vote in Kansas City to reject/No vote to the 3/8 cent sales tax to build the Royal's a new stadium and renovate Arrowhead Stadium for the Chiefs. It was a 40 year tax proposal! I am wondering if that is why the proposal failed? It will be interesting to see what the two ownership groups do in response. It initially sounds like this was the "best/only deal" offered.

There are rumors that the Kansas side of KC may offer incentives for the Chiefs to move, but stay in the Metro, while the Royal's future in KC seems a little more uncertain.

https://www.kctv5.com/2024/04/03/royals-chiefs-concede-loss-stadium-sales-tax-vote/

It was voted down almost 60% to 40%, noting that this was a county vote, not a city/metro vote, which may have impacted the numbers, or simply the citizens didn't agree with the scope of what was being proposed. Given the Chiefs recent success (3 Super Bowl victories in 5 years) and Arrowhead Stadium known for its loud atmosphere and 50+ year history, I wonder if bundling the deal with the Royals also hurt the proposed sales tax?

OKC Citizens voted yes by a 70%+ margin to fund the penny for a new Paycom Center.

They probably messed up by trying to tie the Royals’ deal to the Chiefs Arrowhead improvements. And I also heard the Royals had some wild land use asks.

In any event, good for those taxpayers. It’s nice to see one of these boondoggles voted down.

I think baseball has real challenges in the current sports landscape. It is seen as a slow moving game that draws old men.

The Baltimore Orioles just struck a deal to sell for $1.725 billion. A team in a top 10 area, when you consider the DMV. Playing in one of the iconic stadiums of the last 50 years. Yet they went begging for an owner for years, and the Washington Nationals finally gave up trying to find an owner.

The Oakland Athletics are embarrassing the game through their incompetent search for a new stadium, which has zero chance of happening in the current Las Vegas scenario. This after exposing their financial weakness in their attempts to get a new stadium in Oakland.

The Royals are the weak link in the KC vote, IMO. There is nothing smaller than a small market team in MLB.

All these teams that want multi billion stadiums, yet aren’t worth half of what the Thunder could sell for in 2026.

Related to citizens funding arenas and stadiums for professional teams. I was a little surprised by the Jackson county vote in Kansas City to reject/No vote to the 3/8 cent sales tax to build the Royal's a new stadium and renovate Arrowhead Stadium for the Chiefs. It was a 40 year tax proposal! I am wondering if that is why the proposal failed? It will be interesting to see what the two ownership groups do in response. It initially sounds like this was the "best/only deal" offered.

There are rumors that the Kansas side of KC may offer incentives for the Chiefs to move, but stay in the Metro, while the Royal's future in KC seems a little more uncertain.

https://www.kctv5.com/2024/04/03/royals-chiefs-concede-loss-stadium-sales-tax-vote/

It was voted down almost 60% to 40%, noting that this was a county vote, not a city/metro vote, which may have impacted the numbers, or simply the citizens didn't agree with the scope of what was being proposed. Given the Chiefs recent success (3 Super Bowl victories in 5 years) and Arrowhead Stadium known for its loud atmosphere and 50+ year history, I wonder if bundling the deal with the Royals also hurt the proposed sales tax?

OKC Citizens voted yes by a 70%+ margin to fund the penny for a new Paycom Center.

I think it’s because more and more metro populations understand how much of a scam these sorts of bailouts are. See also the experience of the Caps/Wizards in Virginia

I think it’s because more and more metro populations understand how much of a scam these sorts of bailouts are. See also the experience of the Caps/Wizards in Virginia

There's more behind the story than just that. The owners did some things to shoot themselves in the foot and a large number simply didn't want to leave Arrowhead. It's still not going to reverse OKC citizens vote.

I think it’s because more and more metro populations understand how much of a scam these sorts of bailouts are. See also the experience of the Caps/Wizards in Virginia

Here we go again...