I do like the idea of having some outdoor patios and ample daytime natural lighting (similar to Gainbridge in Indy), although I wonder if the natural lighting would present operational challenges for some events.

What we've learned from previous MAPS projects is to have enough funds to cover those operational challenges. Having an option to shift those extra funds to cover the unforeseen challenges--with operational expenses built into the development.

That's why the new arena's budget will be 10x what was budgeted for the DT arena 20 years ago.

What are you implying? There are a many, many people, the majority of OKCitians, for whom downtown isn’t the center of their universe. But they do come for special reasons, athletic events, plays, art museums, concerts, etc. Housing grand events or special purpose buildings seems like a normal function for a centrally located city center catering to all the citizens of OKC.

I'm implying exactly what you stated. What was mentioned in that post I responded to was specific for that person and everyone is different in their interests. When I said I hope you don't take this the wrong way I meant I wasn't criticizing.

I'll accept your cover for the statement. But, when someone starts a post or conversation with "don't take this the wrong way", I believe they know what they are saying is likely interpreted in a negative way. There would be a hundred better ways to make the statement about things to do in downtown than the one chosen. That's why I said I wasn't sure what he was implying.... and he never came back to clarify. I don't spend a lot of time on this forum so just because I don't answer immediately doesn't mean I won't.

$900 million divided by 500K population works out to be roughly $1,800 per person. It's not "just a penny".

Another way to look at it is if you spend $30k per year, that's $300 in sales taxes for the stadium. $300/yr x 6yrs is $1,800. Of course, the amount you pay will depend on how much you spend in OKC and how much you order online.

The question is, is a new stadium worth $1,800 to you, or would you rather spend the money on something else? Or would you rather end the "temporary tax" and put the $1,800 in your pocket?

You're already doing it.. Not sure what you're talking about.

He's assuming OKC residents will pay 100% of the sales tax revenue going to the cost of the arena, not taking into account prorating the cost over a roughly 20 year period or continued population and tax revenue growth over that time frame. The per capita cost will be far less than $1,800/resident, in reality.

$900 million divided by 500K population works out to be roughly $1,800 per person. It's not "just a penny".

Another way to look at it is if you spend $30k per year, that's $300 in sales taxes for the stadium. $300/yr x 6yrs is $1,800. Of course, the amount you pay will depend on how much you spend in OKC and how much you order online.

The question is, is a new stadium worth $1,800 to you, or would you rather spend the money on something else? Or would you rather end the "temporary tax" and put the $1,800 in your pocket?

Oklahoma City population is 700,000, the $900 million will be collected over 6 years--you'll need to recalculate.

He's assuming OKC residents will pay 100% of the sales tax revenue going to the cost of the arena, not taking into account prorating the cost over a roughly 20 year period or continued population and tax revenue growth over that time frame. The per capita cost will be far less than $1,800/resident, in reality.

Or the fact that visitors to OKC pay sales tax, as hard as that is for him to fathom....

Not to mention thhe fact that he's already been paying the sales tax. Come to think of it, I'm not sure what the No side's beef is. It's not like they're going to charge an extra 1 cent on top of the MAPS cent. Yes, the city should get a better deal out of it but in all honesty we dont even know what the deal is other than 1) continue the 1 cent for six more years after MAPS IV ends and 2) to build an arena that's bigger than 750,000 square feet, in return 3) the OKC Thunder will sign for 25+ more years after the arena opens in 2028.

While I'd love more feel good details (and potential renderings or at least benchmark arenas), this is a no brainer. OKC needs a new arena even if we didn't have the Thunder; OKC wants to compete with the Tier I and II, and have associated events - then we need a new arena. Paycom was built to test the market, put OKC out there as a viable option in 2000. It worked, we have a team and concerts WANT to come to OKC.

We all were wondering why OKC wasn't getting touring concerts; I recall even myself thinking it was the Thunder who were blocking dates at then Chesapeake Arena. But instead, it was the arena itself that was limiting - I myself even wondered why then Staples could host both NBA teams or NBA and NHL the same day, concert the next, then NBA or NHL the following day whereas OKC/Chesapeake would only have NBA games every other night and only concerts when the Thunder weren't in town (and usually just one concert or event while the team was gone). Now I know - it is the arena that held OKC up.

Let's fix this - it wont cost extra and as an OKC expat I'm happy to continue to do much shopping/eating in OKC when I visit as I've done in the past. Vote Yes!

I think we should demand every effort is made to ensure this will be a 75 year (or longer) building. Every element of design and construction should be done with future growth and adaptability in mind. We are now a mature and financially stable city, with (hopefully) well engineered road and real estate configurations in the core. We should be able to adjust to modifications and future trends in such a way that replacement would be unnecessary. I'm old enough to remember a pre-Myriad downtown, and we are now going to build arena number three. I'm all for it. But I hope leadership says....

We don't want to ask anyone voting on this arena to have to vote on another one in their lifetime.

75 year lifespan is a pie-in-the-sky demand. The best they could do is figure out a way to somehow build it so it could be updated every 20-25 years without a completely new facility. They don't build Fenway Park's anymore.

^^^^^^^^^
Baseball stadiums are an apropriate discussion point if you want to talk about making sports and/or multipurpose facilities last 70 years. Baseball - the most nostalgia obsessed of the sports - has exactly two stadiums over six decades old; Fenway and Wrigley. Even the most storied of all, the house that Ruth built, wasn’t spared the wrecking ball.

The third oldest ballpark is Dodgers Stadium, at just over 60. The overwhelming majority of parks were built in the 90s, 2000s or 2010s.

NBA arenas as a rule are even newer than ballparks. Could this new one, built with adaptability in mind, and without cost cutting at every turn (like Paycom) last 40-50 years? Sure, it’s possible. Also possible that the world, OKC and entertainment in general will have changed so much in coming decades that we’re talking about a new building 25 or 30 years from now, like we’ve done every 30 years or so since OKC’s early days.

That $1,800 per person calc is so nonsensical we're collectively becoming less informed the more we discuss it.

I think we should demand every effort is made to ensure this will be a 75 year (or longer) building. Every element of design and construction should be done with future growth and adaptability in mind. We are now a mature and financially stable city, with (hopefully) well engineered road and real estate configurations in the core. We should be able to adjust to modifications and future trends in such a way that replacement would be unnecessary. I'm old enough to remember a pre-Myriad downtown, and we are now going to build arena number three. I'm all for it. But I hope leadership says....

We don't want to ask anyone voting on this arena to have to vote on another one in their lifetime.

Couldn't agree more. The BUILDING should last and we shouldn't be asked to vote again for another BUILDING until this new one is beyond repair. However, let's be clear that there will need to be votes to 'retrofit' and/or reconfigure the building as the NBA evolves and if OKC gets another indoor sports team. That vote would be somewhat similar to what Salt Lake as been doing with the Delta Center (whatever it's called now - Verink?).

There will be future votes (next one probably in 2055?) but they should be to reconfig/add to (or even delete from) the new building we're voting on today and not replacing the building itself.

Couldn't agree more. The BUILDING should last and we shouldn't be asked to vote again for another BUILDING until this new one is beyond repair. However, let's be clear that there will need to be votes to 'retrofit' and/or reconfigure the building as the NBA evolves and if OKC gets another indoor sports team. That vote would be somewhat similar to what Salt Lake as been doing with the Delta Center (whatever it's called now - Verink?).

There will be future votes (next one probably in 2055?) but they should be to reconfig/add to (or even delete from) the new building we're voting on today and not replacing the building itself.

They will retrofit this arena every 8-10 years. Why fall behind? I am not saying $200 million, but $20 million every 8z10 years is MORE than reasonable. Just to modernize everything and make it more appealing.

Couldn't agree more. The BUILDING should last and we shouldn't be asked to vote again for another BUILDING until this new one is beyond repair. However, let's be clear that there will need to be votes to 'retrofit' and/or reconfigure the building as the NBA evolves and if OKC gets another indoor sports team. That vote would be somewhat similar to what Salt Lake as been doing with the Delta Center (whatever it's called now - Verink?).

There will be future votes (next one probably in 2055?) but they should be to reconfig/add to (or even delete from) the new building we're voting on today and not replacing the building itself.

agreed ... and if you look around the NBA that is the type of vote OKC would be having now if the ford center was built as a state of the art nba arena (especially in size ) when it was

agreed ... and if you look around the NBA that is the type of vote OKC would be having now if the ford center was built as a state of the art nba arena (especially in size ) when it was

I agree. We should keep it front of the market at all times.

The only reason I suggest we plan for a long term building is that we should be responsible and sustainable in publicly funded projects. We wouldn't consider taking down the Devon tower if it were 30 years and doesn't fit it's original purpose anymore.

Couldn't agree more. The BUILDING should last and we shouldn't be asked to vote again for another BUILDING until this new one is beyond repair. However, let's be clear that there will need to be votes to 'retrofit' and/or reconfigure the building as the NBA evolves and if OKC gets another indoor sports team. That vote would be somewhat similar to what Salt Lake as been doing with the Delta Center (whatever it's called now - Verink?).

There will be future votes (next one probably in 2055?) but they should be to reconfig/add to (or even delete from) the new building we're voting on today and not replacing the building itself.

I'm OK with this in theory since we are looking at a build-to-order arena. Chesapeake was not a build-to-order NBA arena but since no one knows what the fads will be in 25 years it's a little hard to make a 25 "guaranty." Heck, pro pickleball may be bigger than the NBA. That NBA rookie down in San Antonio could be a senior pickleball legend! :)

Came to OKC from Tulsa to take our kids to the Polar Express and stayed at Embassy Suites near OUHSC. When we checked in there was three groups ahead of us (one from Texas and another from Arkansas) that were all going to the Thunder game. I saw a bunch of Thunder hats in the hotel as well. I can only imagine how much more could’ve been at the hotels closer to the arena. The truth is the Thunder brings fans from all over the region spending money in OKC, including us from Tulsa for 3-5 games a season. In my outsider opinion it would be crazy to not be supportive of a new arena.

Came to OKC from Tulsa to take our kids to the Polar Express and stayed at Embassy Suites near OUHSC. When we checked in there was three groups ahead of us (one from Texas and another from Arkansas) that were all going to the Thunder game. I saw a bunch of Thunder hats in the hotel as well. I can only imagine how much more could’ve been at the hotels closer to the arena. The truth is the Thunder brings fans from all over the region spending money in OKC, including us from Tulsa for 3-5 games a season. In my outsider opinion it would be crazy to not be supportive of a new arena.

shhhhh don’t tell PoliSciBoy that!!!

If we (voters) can get this approved, $900 million will put Oklahoma City at the top of the spectrum among NBA-NHL arenas in the country. Hire the best architects to craft an arena to fit our city's direction.

Our city looks aesthetically pleasing since the investments in MAPS in the 90s and bond issues--dating back to the 1970s with the approval of the Myriad Convention Center.

Let's keep up the momentum.

This new arena with the competitiveness of the Thunder might just land us the All Star game. We should have 6,000 downtown hotel rooms by then ?

If that number is still a requirement.

This new arena with the competitiveness of the Thunder might just land us the All Star game. We should have 6,000 downtown hotel rooms by then ?

If that number is still a requirement.

Long shot, Oklahoma City needs 6,000 downtown hotel rooms comparable to the new 605 room Omni and First National Center 149.
Not sure if the Sheraton 395, Wydham Grand 311, Hilton-Skirvin 225 or the proposed Dream Hotels 394 qualify under NBA All Star weekend hotel room criteria.

Our city needs a 2,000 room Omni type hotel to promote itself as a higher tier destination.

Don't hold your breath getting the All-Star game. It's not just an arena and a lot of hotel rooms that goes with that game. Out of towners will demand entertainment that OKC may not have enough of.

Don't hold your breath getting the All-Star game. It's not just an arena and a lot of hotel rooms that goes with that game. Out of towners will demand entertainment that OKC may not have enough of.

Salt Lake City just hosted the all-star game. No reason OKC can't too once hotel rooms hit the threshold. A lot of all-star weekend events are manufactured for that weekend. If all the local OKC venues host events (Scissortail Park, Criterion, Tower, Beer City, Jones, Oklahoma Ranch, Fassler Hall, etc.), it could be enough.

Salt Lake City just hosted the all-star game. No reason OKC can't too once hotel rooms hit the threshold. A lot of all-star weekend events are manufactured for that weekend. If all the local OKC venues host events (Scissortail Park, Criterion, Tower, Beer City, Jones, Oklahoma Ranch, Fassler Hall, etc.), it could be enough.

Salt Lake City has a ton of infrastructure leftover from the Winter Olympics though, such as the Salt Palace and the significant density of hotels directly around it, plus their airport is a hub for a major airline. OKC is a long way from even reaching SLC levels of high-demand infrastructure.

Salt Lake City has a ton of infrastructure leftover from the Winter Olympics though, such as the Salt Palace and the significant density of hotels directly around it, plus their airport is a hub for a major airline. OKC is a long way from even reaching SLC levels of high-demand infrastructure.

Ski Jumps and ice rinks don’t count. Lol

The earliest the new arena comes into play is several years away. This is like bird hunting … Aim where they will be, not where they are now. OKC ability to host is accelerating quickly now. OKC hosting in 7-10 years is certainly a real possibility.

Ski Jumps and ice rinks don’t count. Lol

The earliest the new arena comes into play is several years away. This is like bird hunting … Aim where they will be, not where they are now. OKC ability to host is accelerating quickly now. OKC hosting in 7-10 years is certainly a real possibility.

The Salt Palace is a convention center triple the size of OKCs, and their hotel density is much higher than that of OKCs (almost quadruple). Read the post, which said nothing about ice rinks or ski jumps, before trying to be snarky, otherwise you come off as ignorant.

Don't hold your breath getting the All-Star game. It's not just an arena and a lot of hotel rooms that goes with that game. Out of towners will demand entertainment that OKC may not have enough of.

salt lake just had the all star game .. OKC will get one if they build this new stadium

Salt Palace Convention Center:


Opening Date: October 2022
Floors: 25
Sleeping Rooms: 700
Luxury Suites: 33
Flexible Meeting Space: 60,000 Sq. Ft.
Restaurant(s) & Sixth-Floor Rooftop Pool

Skyline structure: Wells Fargo Center 422 ft/36 stories, LDS Church Office Building 420 ft/28 stories, 95 State Street at City Creek (Tower 8) 395 ft/25 stories

Oklahoma City Convention Center & Omni Hotel:


Opening date: January 2021
Floors: 17
Sleeping rooms: 605
Luxury suites: 29 suites, with dramatic views of the 70-acre Scissortail Park and the downtown skyline.
Flexible meeting space 76,000 Sq. ft.
Rooftop pool deck terrace, located on the hotel’s third floor.
American modern cuisine to a sports bar with outdoor seating on two floors and an award-winning steak house.

Skyline structure: Devon Tower - 844 ft/50 stories, BancFirst - 500 ft/37 stories, First National Center - 433 ft/ 33 stories

Oklahoma City IMO has the most impressive skyline among NBA small market cities (Milwaukee, OKC, Memphis, SLC, New Orleans).

.

It' s not just number of hotel rooms required for an All Star game; it's entertainment, clubs, etc., and we are still a ways away on those fronts, thought Salt Lake is indeed more analogous than other places such as LA, Vegas, Orlando.

But one of the most important requirements is exhibit hall space, and we are still lacking there. The All Star Game is among other things a trade show, with large trade show booths from vendors like Nike, with thousands of square feet per booth. The Salt Palace above is a fine point of comparison, but what was not listed was the most important part; exhibit hall. Salt Palace has over half a million square feet of exhibit hall space and OKC's convention center has 200K. Orlando has over TWO MILLION square feet.

I agree that a new arena would put OKC much closer to hosting, but disagree that hotel rooms are the only other item that needs to reach a tipping point. We still have a ways to go. An expansion to the convention center (in OKC's long range plan) will probably also be needed to get to that point.

It' s not just number of hotel rooms required for an All Star game; it's entertainment, clubs, etc., and we are still a ways away on those fronts, thought Salt Lake is indeed more analogous than other places such as LA, Vegas, Orlando.

But one of the most important requirements is exhibit hall space, and we are still lacking there. The All Star Game is among other things a trade show, with large trade show booths from vendors like Nike, with thousands of square feet per booth. The Salt Palace above is a fine point of comparison, but what was not listed was the most important part; exhibit hall. Salt Palace has over half a million square feet of exhibit hall space and OKC's convention center has 200K. Orlando has over TWO MILLION square feet.

I agree that a new arena would put OKC much closer to hosting, but disagree that hotel rooms are the only other item that needs to reach a tipping point. We still have a ways to go. An expansion to the convention center (in OKC's long range plan) will probably also be needed to get to that point.

Since you are in the know on this, could the Bennett Event Center at the Fairgrounds be included in that and subsequently the new fairgrounds arena or would it all be contiguous space near the arena?

Since you are in the know on this, could the Bennett Event Center at the Fairgrounds be included in that and subsequently the new fairgrounds arena or would it all be contiguous space near the arena?

kinda feels like the nba would look down on that as a bit of a bush league solution. But what do I know lol

Since you are in the know on this, could the Bennett Event Center at the Fairgrounds be included in that and subsequently the new fairgrounds arena or would it all be contiguous space near the arena?

That would not have been a useful setup for any conference or convention I have ever attended, and I have to assume a trade show would be the same.

kinda feels like the nba would look down on that as a bit of a bush league solution. But what do I know lol

I definitely don't know either. And I'd think is was fine. But I imagine something on a fairgrounds about 5 miles from the arena wouldn't meet the level of NBA image.

Salt Palace Convention Center:


Opening Date: October 2022
Floors: 25
Sleeping Rooms: 700
Luxury Suites: 33
Flexible Meeting Space: 60,000 Sq. Ft.
Restaurant(s) & Sixth-Floor Rooftop Pool

Skyline structure: Wells Fargo Center 422 ft/36 stories, LDS Church Office Building 420 ft/28 stories, 95 State Street at City Creek (Tower 8) 395 ft/25 stories

Oklahoma City Convention Center & Omni Hotel:


Opening date: January 2021
Floors: 17
Sleeping rooms: 605
Luxury suites: 29 suites, with dramatic views of the 70-acre Scissortail Park and the downtown skyline.
Flexible meeting space 76,000 Sq. ft.
Rooftop pool deck terrace, located on the hotel’s third floor.
American modern cuisine to a sports bar with outdoor seating on two floors and an award-winning steak house.

Skyline structure: Devon Tower - 844 ft/50 stories, BancFirst - 500 ft/37 stories, First National Center - 433 ft/ 33 stories

Oklahoma City IMO has the most impressive skyline among NBA small market cities (Milwaukee, OKC, Memphis, SLC, New Orleans).

.

Friend, your data is bad. The Salt Palace has a 515,000 square foot exhibit hall and an additional 160,000 square feet of meeting space. (https://utahsportscommission.com/venues/salt-palace-convention-center/)

salt lake just had the all star game .. OKC will get one if they build this new stadium

Tend to agree with this. By that 2030ish mark
-new arena
-we'll probably be close hotel rooms wise
-while we'll never be a "hub", our airport pax counts will have doubled if the 10% growth rate continues

I’m surprised how confident people are who say we’ll never become a hub. In theory, what would it take to get one.

I’m surprised how confident people are who say we’ll never become a hub. In theory, what would it take to get one.

dallas to not exist

dallas to not exist
Isn’t Austin a hub though?

Isn’t Austin a hub though?

They lost a lot of their routes to non-hubs on AA. So they aren't, or are at least significantly neutered, in terms of hub status.

The move to a new arena would be great timing for a complete re-brand.

I’m surprised how confident people are who say we’ll never become a hub. In theory, what would it take to get one.
1. An airline that needed a new hub. Not likely to happen.
2. A lot of airport infrastructure to support logistics. Very extensive and expensive.

kinda feels like the nba would look down on that as a bit of a bush league solution. But what do I know lol


That would not have been a useful setup for any conference or convention I have ever attended, and I have to assume a trade show would be the same.

Fair...

The move to a new arena would be great timing for a complete re-brand.

lol they don't need a rebrand

An economic impact study on the OKC NBA arena is out. Do the numbers justify a new one?

Link: https://news.yahoo.com/economic-impact-study-okc-nba-120046135.html


"This study, using real inputs from arena activity, makes it clear that the impact on our economy is significant," Christy Gillenwater, CEO of the Greater OKC Chamber, said in a statement recently. "There is an important impact to the families dependent on the arena activity — those that work in the building, along with restaurants, hotels and companies that provide goods and services to the arena."

An economic impact study on the OKC NBA arena is out. Do the numbers justify a new one?

Link: https://news.yahoo.com/economic-impact-study-okc-nba-120046135.html

The PDF can be found here:
2 (velocityokc.com) (https://www.velocityokc.com/clientuploads/PDFs/Economic_and_Revenue_Impacts_of_OKC_Arena.pdf)

An economic impact study on the OKC NBA arena is out. Do the numbers justify a new one?

Link: https://news.yahoo.com/economic-impact-study-okc-nba-120046135.html

No, because these numbers are completely made up and have no backing with reality. This is a firm hired by the Chamber of Commerce to produce a good report to justify the arena, not an actual, empirically backed study. There's a reason why none of these PR firms actually submit their "findings" to peer review. This is a pretty good takedown of studies like this by an actual economist: https://x.com/jc_bradbury/status/1729132330294628773?s=20

No, because these numbers are completely made up and have no backing with reality. This is a firm hired by the Chamber of Commerce to produce a good report to justify the arena, not an actual, empirically backed study. There's a reason why none of these PR firms actually submit their "findings" to peer review. This is a pretty good takedown of studies like this by an actual economist: https://x.com/jc_bradbury/status/1729132330294628773?s=20

Aren't you a ray of sunshine.......... lol

No, because these numbers are completely made up and have no backing with reality. This is a firm hired by the Chamber of Commerce to produce a good report to justify the arena, not an actual, empirically backed study. There's a reason why none of these PR firms actually submit their "findings" to peer review. This is a pretty good takedown of studies like this by an actual economist: https://x.com/jc_bradbury/status/1729132330294628773?s=20

Funny. My peers reviewed it and found it was an accurate and wonderfully enlightening instrument of truth and happiness.

Why is your "reality" better than mine?

Don't hold your breath getting the All-Star game. It's not just an arena and a lot of hotel rooms that goes with that game. Out of towners will demand entertainment that OKC may not have enough of.

We've got our share of working women... j/k

Salt Lake City has a ton of infrastructure leftover from the Winter Olympics though, such as the Salt Palace and the significant density of hotels directly around it, plus their airport is a hub for a major airline. OKC is a long way from even reaching SLC levels of high-demand infrastructure.

Are we hosting part of the 2028 olympics ? That's kind of a big deal.

One reason it may be taking so long to select a site for the new arena, the PSM site (former Myriad) has 100,000 sq. ft of exhibition space with 900+ parking slots; it could be used as overflow for the 200,730 sq. ft. exhibit hall space in the new convention center. The Omni Hotel has 76,000 sq ft in exhibition space.

The new $900 million arena will be better equipped to handle Thunder games, concerts and other events that Paycom Center
now has.

What we don't know is how much sq ft of usable exhibition space the new arena might have ?

What we don't know is how much sq ft of usable exhibition space the new arena might have ?
I would imagine that with the BB court in place the new arena would have practically zero exhibition space. That's not the function of the arena. How much does the Paycom have? I can't remember much if at all. Though I could be wrong.

Salt Lake City just hosted the all-star game. No reason OKC can't too once hotel rooms hit the threshold. A lot of all-star weekend events are manufactured for that weekend. If all the local OKC venues host events (Scissortail Park, Criterion, Tower, Beer City, Jones, Oklahoma Ranch, Fassler Hall, etc.), it could be enough.

I was going to say the same thing. If SLC can do it, then OKC (which is bigger city/metro but not a natural tourist destination) can.

I would imagine that with the BB court in place the new arena would have practically zero exhibition space. That's not the function of the arena. How much does the Paycom have? I can't remember much if at all. Though I could be wrong.

I've been in conference rooms in the latest Southwest corner addition. Not a ton, but I'd think a new arena would have much more.

lol they don't need a rebrand

most people who know what they're talking about recognize that it's one of the worst logos in professional sports. and i think you would admit that it's bizarre that the ownership group would demand to play in a state of the art / BLC arena but would continue to rock non-BLC marks and logos. it's incongruent at best, imo. so they better fix it before 2029.

most people who know what they're talking about recognize that it's one of the worst logos in professional sports. and i think you would admit that it's bizarre that the ownership group would demand to play in a state of the art / BLC arena but would continue to rock non-BLC marks and logos. it's incongruent at best, imo. so they better fix it before 2029.
“Most”? lol.
Some people on gossip boards don’t like it and some designers would like to think they could do better. Most of the comments are based on preferences and not on objective results.

What we don't know is how much sq ft of usable exhibition space the new arena might have ?

LOI said at least 750,000 sq. ft., or more - Urbanized mentioned this in an earlier post #2801 on this thread page 141.

“Most”? lol.
Some people on gossip boards don’t like it and some designers would like to think they could do better. Most of the comments are based on preferences and not on objective results.

I’m pretty surprised that you would go out of your way to defend Ackerman McQueen’s handiwork. That’s interesting.

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/sports/nba/thunder/2015/09/08/thunder-logo-ranked-worst-in-the-nba-could-be-changing/60724735007/

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-thunder-considering-revision-of-logo-because-it-is-terrible/amp/

https://www.jamesrobertwatson.com/thunderlogo.html

https://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=41146&page=3

https://thunderousintentions.com/2016/07/18/the-end-of-an-era-its-time-for-a-logo-change/

https://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-definitive-nba-logo-rankings/