Some Edmondnites are already bitching about it but oddly enough I agree with some of their concerns how the have requested variances to forgo traffic studies on Coltrane and Second St. Not a fan of that:

https://okcfox.com/news/local/are-we-ready-for-this-lots-of-back-and-forth-over-proposed-sculpture-park-in-edmond-the-uncommon-ground-east-2nd-street-north-coltrane-road-park-conservancy-trust-splash-pads-dog-dogs-ampitheater-art-pieces-local-international-randel-shadid-mayor-french#

Some Edmondnites are already bitching about it but oddly enough I agree with some of their concerns how the have requested variances to forgo traffic studies on Coltrane and Second St. Not a fan of that:

https://okcfox.com/news/local/are-we-ready-for-this-lots-of-back-and-forth-over-proposed-sculpture-park-in-edmond-the-uncommon-ground-east-2nd-street-north-coltrane-road-park-conservancy-trust-splash-pads-dog-dogs-ampitheater-art-pieces-local-international-randel-shadid-mayor-french#

because it is kind of a bait and switch ...

everyone in Edmond knows that Coltrane needs to be fully 4 lane from Covell all the way south to 33rd the city is just waiting on funds to do it .. (the city will own this park in the future) a traffic study is not going to give new information and is not a reason to delay the project ..

Some Edmondnites are already bitching about it but oddly enough I agree with some of their concerns how the have requested variances to forgo traffic studies on Coltrane and Second St. Not a fan of that:

https://okcfox.com/news/local/are-we-ready-for-this-lots-of-back-and-forth-over-proposed-sculpture-park-in-edmond-the-uncommon-ground-east-2nd-street-north-coltrane-road-park-conservancy-trust-splash-pads-dog-dogs-ampitheater-art-pieces-local-international-randel-shadid-mayor-french#

The traffic study would have showed the need to go ahead and expand the 1000 ft of Coltrane to 4 lanes with half of that being in the property area of the park and the rest north of the park property. Not sure I agree this expansion would fall solely on the Park bc you also have the development on the NE corner that could also split. If anything, I think the City should own half the expense with the Park and the NE property owner splitting the rest.

with the Park and the NE property owner splitting the rest.

the City is going to be the park owner ...

They are going to be, they are not now.

Some Edmondnites are already bitching about it but oddly enough I agree with some of their concerns how the have requested variances to forgo traffic studies on Coltrane and Second St. Not a fan of that:

https://okcfox.com/news/local/are-we-ready-for-this-lots-of-back-and-forth-over-proposed-sculpture-park-in-edmond-the-uncommon-ground-east-2nd-street-north-coltrane-road-park-conservancy-trust-splash-pads-dog-dogs-ampitheater-art-pieces-local-international-randel-shadid-mayor-french#


The traffic study would have showed the need to go ahead and expand the 1000 ft of Coltrane to 4 lanes with half of that being in the property area of the park and the rest north of the park property. Not sure I agree this expansion would fall solely on the Park bc you also have the development on the NE corner that could also split. If anything, I think the City should own half the expense with the Park and the NE property owner splitting the rest.

Traffic study is completely unnecessary for this park. While it might be popular, there are fast food places that will have higher peak traffic times than a park that will have as its traffic will be spread out over the day. Also, are you suggesting that on top of donating 62 acres for a park to the city that they should also widen Coltrane from the intersection? Suggest that hey should have to spend even more money on public infrastructure just because they are doing something along a road before the city has got around to widening it? Im sorry but this needs to be the city's job, not a developer or in this case a philanthropist. If you are going to make developers widen section lined roads then you will have no development to begin with, its just too expensive.

Yah its like saying thank you for the donation but we want more Its not just the land, they are spending money on developing it. Ok it might not be totally complete but they are spending a boat load of their own money. Its ok if the city will need to spend a bit. This is a lot of land and a lot of enjoyment for the citizens of Edmond.

This is probably best case scenario for the piece of land and go figure there is pushback about traffic concerns. It should not be on developer or anyone associated with it to expand any public roads.

As someone who watched this meeting, it seemed like more of the consternation seemed to stem from Shadid's insistence that they should just be happy with the gift, shut up, and approve the variances without a per variance vote and without getting their questions answered. I don't think there's anyone involved at the city level who doesn't want this to happen, but I think it's realistic for questions to be answered (including the long term economic impact to the citizens). Mayor Davis isn't exactly anti-development and he had some concerns and wished the developers had met with his staff more before the vote.

Must be nice to walk into a city with money and get whatever you want. Edmond citizens must be a bunch of whores.

I should note I’m being sarcastic. Kinda. Traffic concerns are justifiable here especially for nearby homes. Am I becoming a NIMBY!?!?

I'm just glad they got rid of all of those trees. What an eyesore it was before. Too many trees, horses running...

When I think of a park, I think barren land.

I'm just glad they got rid of all of those trees. What an eyesore it was before. Too many trees, horses running...

When I think of a park, I think barren land.
Lololol I laughed a little too hard at this.

Must be nice to walk into a city with money and get whatever you want. Edmond citizens must be a bunch of whores.

I should note I’m being sarcastic. Kinda. Traffic concerns are justifiable here especially for nearby homes. Am I becoming a NIMBY!?!?

this is much more like walking into the city to give them and the public lots of money ..

Traffic study is completely unnecessary for this park. While it might be popular, there are fast food places that will have higher peak traffic times than a park that will have as its traffic will be spread out over the day. Also, are you suggesting that on top of donating 62 acres for a park to the city that they should also widen Coltrane from the intersection? Suggest that hey should have to spend even more money on public infrastructure just because they are doing something along a road before the city has got around to widening it? Im sorry but this needs to be the city's job, not a developer or in this case a philanthropist. If you are going to make developers widen section lined roads then you will have no development to begin with, its just too expensive.

They are doing exactly that for neighborhoods all over Edmond especially East Edmond. Not saying he should have to do it bc I do believe it is on the City especially since this area has needed to be expanded regardless of the current construction. It is 1000ft of road that needs to be addressed and should be by the city.

Must be nice to walk into a city with money and get whatever you want. Edmond citizens must be a bunch of whores.

I should note I’m being sarcastic. Kinda. Traffic concerns are justifiable here especially for nearby homes. Am I becoming a NIMBY!?!?

According to the meeting, the only neighborhood that is affected by this (to the north) is all in on its support. Anything else should be background noise.

e this area has needed to be expanded regardless of the current construction. It is 1000ft of road that needs to be addressed and should be by the city.

this

this

It simply goes back to the city always waiting far too long after the need is established rather than looking and planning ahead making it a bigger inconvenience to motorist, residents and visitors once they finally do something.

It simply goes back to the city always waiting far too long after the need is established rather than looking and planning ahead making it a bigger inconvenience to motorist, residents and visitors once they finally do something.

Really the problem is the unanticipated growth (but it should have been) of East Edmond and far West Edmond. They're playing catchup with a lot of the infrastructure like water processing, roads, etc. All of the CIP money for the next 7 years is already committed so they really need to look at GO bonds or something to finance some major transportation projects in Edmond. Edmond should have been doing a lot more work along this line in the 2000s and we're behind the 8-ball now and it's hard to keep up with all the new construction.

Really the problem is the unanticipated growth (but it should have been) of East Edmond and far West Edmond. They're playing catchup with a lot of the infrastructure like water processing, roads, etc. All of the CIP money for the next 7 years is already committed so they really need to look at GO bonds or something to finance some major transportation projects in Edmond. Edmond should have been doing a lot more work along this line in the 2000s and we're behind the 8-ball now and it's hard to keep up with all the new construction.

the City is really kind of derelict when it comes to Coltrane .. from 15th to 2nd there is about 500 ft that would make it 4 lanes for the entire stretch (no excuse for the city workers to just blacktop it in those sections are a temp)

Probably need to create a new thread directly to identify roads that are like this that need to be done like now. That 500 ft section northbound between 15th and 2nd, just north of 2nd by the park. The ones they have on the planned list but with no funding also need to be done. So much needs to be done and yet just waiting. GO bonds need to be issued to address a large section of the road issues and better to do it now with all the inflow of homes being built and strong revenue numbers.

this is much more like walking into the city to give them and the public lots of money ..
If memory serves right, Edmond is aware of the situation and they will soon put forth a bond proposal to expedite surface transportation projects.

And to this the push for density in housing. Yes we need wider roads in the heart of Edmond. County is working on roads east of I 35 but but but, as I have talked to the road folks, if you build new roads then have all the concrete trucks, brick trucks, back hoes etc driving it everyday, it would be nice for long. Please wait a bit and then when less construction traffic, fix the roads.

You can never have a road that’s too wide. The wider and more lanes the better. Edmond needs to get to it.

Like I said in the Waterloo thread, the city as a whole had never grasped if you build it they will come. Now the NIMBYs nay feel they (growth) won’t come if we avoid the building but we all know that’s not true so it’s time to update the infrastructure in preparation to the growth in lieu of reactive to it.

Wow, looks like this project is now dead according to this letter from Hal French on the Uncommon Ground Facebook page.

https://www.facebook.com/people/The-Uncommon-Ground-Sculpture-Park/100083479831925/

Edmond gonna Edmond.

strange

I was skeptical it was gonna happen even with unilateral support. Funny they mention Gathering Place in Tulsa. This plan did remind me of it. I always thought they were too in over their heads.

I was skeptical it was gonna happen even with unilateral support. Funny they mention Gathering Place in Tulsa. This plan did remind me of it. I always thought they were too in over their heads.

very well said. Huge difference between the financial strength of GK3 and the UGP benefactors.

very well said. Huge difference between the financial strength of GK3 and the UGP benefactors.
I just kept sitting back hoping to see it happen. I was rooting for it.

We need more details, whoever blocked this needs to be voted out

Do we even know if it was “blocked?” It sounds by the wording of their post they just gave up.

It wasn't from what I saw . I thought the council approved the plan. He seems sort of pissed the city didn't just rubber stamp it without asking questions. Like how dare they try to see what the long term impact and liabilities to the city would be. His comment in the letter about the planning commission and their 30 minute rubber stamp on all those variances is telling. Also, at the last council meeting the mayor mentioned something about French and Co not being willing to meet with city staff in advanced of the council meeting to get some of those questions answered. I've been a big supporter of this project but something stinks.

We need more details, whoever blocked this needs to be voted out

Or maybe we vote you out, since no one blocked it. It was fast-tracked. There was no blocking of this project. The letter never said anything about it being blocked. It reads like their alligator mouths wrote checks their hummingbird backsides couldn't cash.

It wasn't from what I saw . I thought the council approved the plan. He seems sort of pissed the city didn't just rubber stamp it without asking questions. Like how dare they try to see what the long term impact and liabilities to the city would be. His comment in the letter about the planning commission and their 30 minute rubber stamp on all those variances is telling. Also, at the last council meeting the mayor mentioned something about French and Co not being willing to meet with city staff in advanced of the council meeting to get some of those questions answered. I've been a big supporter of this project but something stinks.
+1

Well I stand corrected. Thanks for the clarification

Here is an article with further details.

https://nondoc.com/2023/06/02/developer-pulls-plug-on-edmond-sculpture-park/

Here is an article with further details.

https://nondoc.com/2023/06/02/developer-pulls-plug-on-edmond-sculpture-park/

I’m wondering if it might be half-penny tax time.

Two more articles:

https://okcfox.com/news/local/weve-had-enough-developer-calls-it-quits-on-edmond-sculpture-park-uncommon-ground-stephen-murdock-project-62-acres-coltrane-east-2nd-street-traffic-randel-shadid-hal-french-barry-moore-mayor-darrell-davis-landowner-construction-development-council#

https://kfor.com/news/local/edmond-park-sculpture-plans-scrapped-by-developers/

They’ve been moving land in this area for some time now. Is the entire project dead now and will they stop? Or will there still be some kind of park there anyway?

They’ve been moving land in this area for some time now. Is the entire project dead now and will they stop? Or will there still be some kind of park there anyway?

if they are stopping there won't be a park at all .. it will be large scale commercial and apts ..

Again, awesome that they cut down all those trees and took the horses away for nothing. Now we have a baren wasteland to look at. Good jorb!

Here's the News 9 story.

https://www.news9.com/story/647bda664594af073b5272f1/developer-pulls-plug-on-sculpture-park-planned-for-city-of-edmond-

I can't help but wonder if this isn't just a Shadid tactic to create pressure on the city to cave on something we may not be aware of.

^^^ or just a way to skirt around the recently enacted tree removal ordinance to cut down the trees with no penalties and build a typical Edmond development.

This will most likely be on the open market soon, according to Mr. French.

Here's the News 9 story.

https://www.news9.com/story/647bda664594af073b5272f1/developer-pulls-plug-on-sculpture-park-planned-for-city-of-edmond-

I can't help but wonder if this isn't just a Shadid tactic to create pressure on the city to cave on something we may not be aware of.

Nothing going on behind the scenes.

Sounds like this Project is a bust

I wonder if the Famous people residing in Edmond have something to do with the project going bust

French should consider Moving his project to Moore he may have better luck there

French should consider Moving his project to Moore he may have better luck there
Lol the city approved this project and it had public support. It isn’t Edmond on this one and I am VERY critical of Edmond. Ask many here and they’d likely tell you I have something against Edmond. The developers and Shadid are a bunch of babies who got their feelings hurt because it wasn’t rubber stamped in approval or there is something more nefarious going on.

Lol the city approved this project and it had public support. It isn’t Edmond on this one and I am VERY critical of Edmond. Ask many here and they’d likely tell you I have something against Edmond. The developers and Shadid are a bunch of babies who got their feelings hurt because it wasn’t rubber stamped in approval or there is something more nefarious going on.

100% false.

100% false.
What is false? I watched the city council meetings. The city had concerns but was in favor of the project. The mayor even said he wants to work with the group to get it done. How am I wrong?

The part about being babies. I work right down the hall from Mr French. I came on here and posted the first renderings and what the lark will be called, ect. The city council was great. The city manager and people in the city offices are clowns. Have been difficult to deal with for over 2 years now on what would be an aweosme legitimate gift. Mr. French had enough after the meeting last week and pulled the plug. A ton of background stuff happened that's not being reported. Thankfully, the court of public opinion is on the developers side so that should tell you all you need to know.

Okay so it wasn’t 100% false then. Maybe my characterization of them being babies isn’t fair but they certainly just gave up fast and everything they’ve said in news reports just doesn’t add up.

Seems like there is more to the story that isn't being communicated. The city council approved numerous variances for the project yet suddenly the project is dead. The city has neglected the intersection of 2nd and Coltrane far too long. Placing the responsibility for street infrastructure on the developer was heavy handed.

Getting things approved by city council is only part of the battle. The planning department can throw all kinds of demands on someone, put up roadblocks, come up with 11th hour requirements that add costs, etc. The details are worked out with planning department, not the council, and that can sometime be too expensive or difficult to make it worth their while. And in this case they were tired of it and walked away. No one at their age wants to have to fight battle after battle to get something like this done. Moral of the story, the city of Edmond needs to find more of a can do attitude and less of a cant do.

Without knowing the details, it's hard to know who is really to blame here. I am a civil engineer myself and work on development projects every day. Sometimes cities are indeed hard to work with, but many of the frustrations are just part of doing business. Each department does what they think is necessary to protect the city and it's citizens and while it can be annoying to "jump through hoops" there is usually a reason. There are occasions where city staff are way too slow or just incompetent, but most of the time I find that everyone is just doing their jobs under the constraints they have.

This story sounds incredibly fishy to me. I have a feeling the guy giving this "gift" didn't take into account all the issues a park like this brings. Who provides security? Who maintains it? Who pays the water/electric/trash/etc bills? What programming will be provided? What happens if it gets vandalized? Lots of questions to answer. Sounds like this guy just wanted to build something and dump it on the city and got mad that everyone didn't line up and kiss his ass for it. Who knows though, like I said it's hard to see what is really going on, but that is sure how it comes off to me.

Edit: just looked up more info and I see that there was much debate about who would fit the bill for the infrastructure around the park. Probably talking about millions, if not tens of millions of dollars of pipe and roadwork to support this thing that the city would have to dig out of somewhere that wasn't planned for. Tulsa had enormous help to get Gathering Place off the ground. I can't remember what the bill was for the infrastructure alone, but including the tunnels it was over a hundred million dollars. Gathering Place didn't just randomly happen as some big gift from a billionaire plopped on the city - it took years and years of planning and an absolute assload of money from multiple sources.

^^^^^^^
Realest post in this thread.

I saw some trees had been torn out at Covell and Coltrane. Can we expect another park? Call it Barren Wasteland Park.

Saundra Naifeh, Patrice Douglas, Dan O’Neil and Elizabeth Waner are now jumping into the mix...

FORMER EDMOND MAYORS SPEAK OUT AFTER UNCOMMON GROUND PARK CALLED OFF
https://www.news9.com/story/648398a79f2d060732d6b307/former-edmond-mayors-speak-out-after-uncommon-ground-park-called-off