Put this another way. Imagine you’re a senior in high school, and a nice sophomore who’s coming into his own but you don’t know very well snags a date with the head cheerleader. You might look at him differently and with some newfound respect. When an 8th grader brings Taylor Swift to a dance because he wrote her an email that she liked, the 8th grader gets momentary attention but only in a fleeting, unserious way.

This thread?

The corresponding thread

Yes and no.
When the tone is: this particular building won’t happen but look at the activity and momentum in OKC, that’s fine.

When the tone is mocking/laughter, it actually makes OKC look desperate for attention.

I would have loved to see the rest of the proposal (minus the super tall) get introduced and discussed. That’s ambitious but reasonable and shows us in a positive light. The addition of the 134 stories makes the proposal look unserious. Why not a 200 story in Wichita or a 300 story in Des Moines?

The proposal doesn't make "OKC" look any way. If you are correct in your criticism, it is on the developer who proposes it and presumes their reasoning in doing so. Now, the people who actually believe that it will happen just as shown in a pie in the sky pretty drawing are probably being silly and risk being mocked. And those who are dead set in scolding them are probably being silly and risk being mocked, too.

If the tower actually gets built as proposed it’ll absolutely completely change OKC.

If the tower actually gets built as proposed it’ll absolutely completely change OKC.

Even if the vision of that tower is reduced to half of what is proposed, it may start a bit of a skyrace for future developers, and it would probably prompt the city to get on the ball about cleaning up the coop site. There would be a lot of developments that would get pushed through if they completed this to the visual (or half of it).

Even if the vision of that tower is reduced to half of what is proposed, it may start a bit of a skyrace for future developers, and it would probably prompt the city to get on the ball about cleaning up the coop site. There would be a lot of developments that would get pushed through if they completed this to the visual (or half of it).
Agreed. Honestly even without this tower if the development is built as proposed it’ll be one of the nicest developments in the state.

and it would probably prompt the city to get on the ball about cleaning up the coop site.

the city has nothing to do with that

the city has nothing to do with that

Enforcement of cleanliness is ultimately the city's authority. Are you kidding me? You know, code enforcement...

The COOP site is essentially an empty grass field at this point. No different than unimproved property all over OKC. Not sure how much code enforcement can be done there.

That said, there IS much pollution below the ground there, of a brownfields variety. But that is the responsibility of the property owner (buyer or seller); not something that the City can force at this point.

The COOP site is essentially an empty grass field at this point. No different than unimproved property all over OKC. Not sure how much code enforcement can be done there.

That said, there IS much pollution below the ground there, of a brownfields variety. But that is the responsibility of the property owner (buyer or seller); not something that the City can force at this point.

Willing to put up $10 that the COOP site will end up being park. Scissortail Park East, lol.

I love the ambition, but this tower looks way out of proportion to the rest of the skyline. What I would like to see is for urban density in and around the CBD. Throw up several more 400-600 footers around Devon Tower.

I love the ambition, but this tower looks way out of proportion to the rest of the skyline. What I would like to see is for urban density in and around the CBD. Throw up several more 400-600 footers around Devon Tower.

The first phase will be built, with the three 350 footers, which is good density for the area. As for the supertall, it will get approved, but scaled down dramatically. If Matteson is that bullish on OKC, I wouldn't be surpised if he proposes more high rises closer to the new arena, especially if the Boadwalk at Bricktown is a success. I have a feeling this is a start of wave a new high rises that we will see go up fo the next decade.

The first phase will be built, with the three 350 footers, which is good density for the area. As for the supertall, it will get approved, but scaled down dramatically. If Matteson is that bullish on OKC, I wouldn't be surpised if he proposes more high rises closer to the new arena, especially if the Boadwalk at Bricktown is a success. I have a feeling this is a start of wave a new high rises that we will see go up fo the next decade.
Only if supported with real demand, not just talk board optimism.

Enforcement of cleanliness is ultimately the city's authority. Are you kidding me? You know, code enforcement...

It isn’t cleanliness, it’s contamination. Big difference. This isn’t bubblegum wrappers blowing around. It’s health threatening contamination.

This development is going to be a game changer for OKC. Here comes the cranes, glassy high rises, and new skyline pics! OKC has arrived, talk about an early Christmas gift!

Only if supported with real demand, not just talk board optimism.

Beyond demand, it's not like Matteson has any other property that we're aware of, so it's kind of this or bust for them. Obviously they could acquire more, but this is a unique and quality site that they have now, and land is only going to get more expensive by the time they have proved out any of their success enough to invest more.

Beyond demand, it's not like Matteson has any other property that we're aware of, so it's kind of this or bust for them. Obviously they could acquire more, but this is a unique and quality site that they have now, and land is only going to get more expensive by the time they have proved out any of their success enough to invest more.

Yes, but we have to remember Matteson is not doing this by himself. This is a joint venture with local developer Randy Hogan, who actually owns the land. Hogan has more land in OKC. Remember Hogan is behind The Half as well.

This development is going to be a game changer for OKC. Here comes the cranes, glassy high rises, and new skyline pics! OKC has arrived, talk about an early Christmas gift!
Sure like to see steel going up before this kind of exuberant prognosis.

Like it or not news is spreading across the world.

�� Look at this post on Facebook https://m.facebook.com/groups/cityscapes/permalink/2298863586972457/?mibextid=adzO7l

It’s being talked about on multiple forums and a friend I met in LA(he’s an architect) who now lives in Singapore found out about it.

I’ll also mention pretty much the majority of comments I’ve seen are people hating on OKC with replies stating OKC is actually a really cool underground/up and coming city. It’s generating a lot of press.

Like it or not news is spreading across the world.

�� Look at this post on Facebook https://m.facebook.com/groups/cityscapes/permalink/2298863586972457/?mibextid=adzO7l

It’s being talked about on multiple forums and a friend I met in LA(he’s an architect) who now lives in Singapore found out about it.

I’ll also mention pretty much the majority of comments I’ve seen are people hating on OKC with replies stating OKC is actually a really cool underground/up and coming city. It’s generating a lot of press.

The developers had to have known this would get global attention. That’s what actually made me take this seriously. You don’t see this type of proposal get thrown around everyday.

The developers had to have known this would get global attention. That’s what actually made me take this seriously. You don’t see this type of proposal get thrown around everyday.
I’m wanting to know how much effort they’ve put into the tower proposal. Have they had engineering/architectural plans yet? It seems to blend into the more realistic part of the development pretty well. These types of projects seem to be ego/pet projects in f@ck you money cities like Dubai, London, NYC, etc.

Even if this tower doesn’t get built I doubt OKC ever sees a proposal like it again. Really amazed this was proposed at all. I love it.

Like it or not news is spreading across the world.

�� Look at this post on Facebook https://m.facebook.com/groups/cityscapes/permalink/2298863586972457/?mibextid=adzO7l

It’s being talked about on multiple forums and a friend I met in LA(he’s an architect) who now lives in Singapore found out about it.

I’ll also mention pretty much the majority of comments I’ve seen are people hating on OKC with replies stating OKC is actually a really cool underground/up and coming city. It’s generating a lot of press.

Well SugarHoneyIcedTea, guess we got a little more attention than we've bargained for. Since this is now international news among skyscraper enthusiasts, this might end up drawing a lot more than tourist attention to the city. Looks like the city will be needing to update it's infrastructure, because a lot is about to come sprouting from this. Guess we'll be seeing a few more buildings in the next two decades getting proposed to be around the Devon's height. If all go as proposed and the attention proves as monumental as it already is in concept, the building boom we're seeing now will be nothing compared to what'll come as a result of some national chains and international conglomerates looking to plant their stake near a regional landmark.

Get ready to either see a proper rail system implemented, or may we suffer the congestion seen in places like Houston and Austin.

But what are you going to fill all those buildings with?

I’m wanting to know how much effort they’ve put into the tower proposal. Have they had engineering/architectural plans yet? It seems to blend into the more realistic part of the development pretty well. These types of projects seem to be ego/pet projects in f@ck you money cities like Dubai, London, NYC, etc.

Even if this tower doesn’t get built I doubt OKC ever sees a proposal like it again. Really amazed this was proposed at all. I love it.

I’m with you there. It’s truly impressive but I have no idea what they’ve put into this.

Guess everyone here is drinking the KoolAid

But what are you going to fill all those buildings with?

Storage for junk from the Uhaul building next door.

Guess everyone here is drinking the KoolAid

It's fun to dream, eh? I know, unrealistic to put to practice, but I'd rather imagine the improbability of something like this manifesting as opposed to seeing nothing of significance showing up for years on end. Where I've been stuck at for the past decade has been completely stagnant developmentally speaking. And the reason for that is because of old-timey southern politics.

It's fun to dream, eh? I know, unrealistic to put to practice, but I'd rather imagine the improbability of something like this manifesting as opposed to seeing nothing of significance showing up for years on end. Where I've been stuck at for the past decade has been completely stagnant developmentally speaking. And the reason for that is because of old-timey southern politics.

OKC has had a vibrant development scene here for some time. We just will never be a Dubai with multiple supertalls and mega development. That is just reality in a 4 million population state with the demographics we have. The original plans on this are exciting enough and (I hope) way more realistic. But excitement turns to lunatic ranting if not kept within the bounds of sanity.

Completely stagnant from a development standpoint for the past decade? Are we still talking about OKC? Or do new projects only count if they are new build AND over 50 stories tall..?

The problem that happens sometime is that, because of geographic proximity, some people in OKC just look reflexively at the Texas cities. Those cities really are outliers. (And let's please not rehash why yet again.) If you look at OKC's real peers, like Memphis or Louisville, we stack up very well development-wise. I might put Milwaukee in there but I don't know as much about Milwaukee.

Or if you want to look at the next natural tier "up," which we really should, then analyze Kansas City. I am often on their urban development page, www.kcrag.com. It's interesting and impressive, but pound for pound on a per-capita basis, no more impressive than OKC.

Some of us (myself included) need to relax and realize that OKC is doing just fine from a growth standpoint, actually better than fine. Not that we shouldn't always strive for more but a dose of realism is healthy too.

Completely stagnant from a development standpoint for the past decade? Are we still talking about OKC? Or do new projects only count if they are new build AND over 50 stories tall..?
Where I'm currently stuck at is a city named Mobile, Alabama. It's not much to talk about, there are no interactive forums to discuss developments, and there's barely any new development because of a lot of negotiations made either in nepotism, bad faith, or one-sided benefits.

I would love for something like the Citizen to pop up down here, just a few of those mixed-use compounds to sprout up to make things interesting. But we dont get that.

I'm uber excited for OKC, and that's long before this project even had the thought of plopping a sky-high supertall in the middle of a parking lot.

Ahh, I misread. Deleted. Didn't understand you were talking about a city other than OKC.

I misread that as well, and I apologize.

At least Mobile is close to the ocean!

The problem that happens sometime is that, because of geographic proximity, some people in OKC just look reflexively at the Texas cities. Those cities really are outliers. (And let's please not rehash why yet again.) If you look at OKC's real peers, like Memphis or Louisville, we stack up very well development-wise. I might put Milwaukee in there but I don't know as much about Milwaukee.

Or if you want to look at the next natural tier "up," which we really should, then analyze Kansas City. I am often on their urban development page, www.kcrag.com. It's interesting and impressive, but pound for pound on a per-capita basis, no more impressive than OKC.

Some of us (myself included) need to relax and realize that OKC is doing just fine from a growth standpoint, actually better than fine. Not that we shouldn't always strive for more but a dose of realism is healthy too.

You are spot on with this. OKC is right where it needs to be, and growing at a good pace.

Sorry If this has already been mentioned but a Business Journal article Quoted Matteson saying he is working with Prairie Surf Studios on a future entertainment studio and industrial development.

I just would like to add as a skyscraper enthusiast myself, If this tower were to be constructed it would be the tallest tower in the United States. Everyone says "One World Trade is the tallest." But real ones know that they cheat with that spire on the top.

Sorry If this has already been mentioned but a Business Journal article Quoted Matteson saying he is working with Prairie Surf Studios on a future entertainment studio and industrial development.

Where did you see that?

I would love that!

The Journal Record. https://journalrecord.com/2023/12/details-emerge-on-1750-foot-downtown-okc-tower/
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I misread that as well, and I apologize.

At least Mobile is close to the ocean!

Not go off topic, but the RSA Battlehouse is a nice building, and i believe it claims Alabama's tallest, so go Mobile there! And i remember right, the hotel next door added a crown to match the RSA crown. I have a long family history in Mobile and even have some pictures of aunts in the 50's in their gowns at the old RSA Battlehouse for the balls. Mob-town is a small town, but it's doing fine for what it is too. When the RSA was planned for Mobile, a lot of people in Alabama looked at it and said "um, why in the hell would you build that in Mobile?". Sound familiar?

Now there is no way in my right mind that i think this tower is going to be built like his concept shows. He would be much better off building multiple towers, financially. There are a million reasons not to build it like that. So i'm not getting any hopes up here, but the development to start with, is a good one. If anything happens on the 4th tower spot, i'll be happy.

The Journal Record. https://journalrecord.com/2023/12/details-emerge-on-1750-foot-downtown-okc-tower/
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Can't read it...

Here’s the quote from the article
This the first, but won’t be the last project in town. Matteson said. Industrial development and entertainment studio are future possibilities. We are looking forward to working with Prairie surf down the road.

Can't read it...

Click the link it was free for me.

He sounds serious albeit probably not moving dirt till 2030s

Skyscraper Page discussion: https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=257177

Skyscraper Page discussion: https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=257177

The difference between OKCTalk and Skyscraper Page is hilarious.

The difference between OKCTalk and Skyscraper Page is hilarious.

Almost half of it is user "Shakespeare2016" asking to sign a petition for a 600' tall tower in Wichita.

LOL yes! Somehow he turns everything into some commentary for wanting something in Wichita. It's so weird.

The Journal Record. https://journalrecord.com/2023/12/details-emerge-on-1750-foot-downtown-okc-tower/
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General contractor listed as Hensel Phelps with Thornton Tomasetti listed as the structural engineering firm.

Both have impressive portfolios;
https://www.thorntontomasetti.com/projects
https://www.henselphelps.com/projects/

General contractor listed as Hensel Phelps with Thornton Tomasetti listed as the structural engineering firm.

Both have impressive portfolios;
https://www.thorntontomasetti.com/projects
https://www.henselphelps.com/projects/

https://y.yarn.co/72024cfb-815e-48ab-be2c-3b9c4c8f2272_text.gif

Guess everyone here is drinking the KoolAid
You better believe it and I’m gonna keep drinking it until the world’s supply has ran out. I’ll drink enough to end all conspiracy theories.

The problem that happens sometime is that, because of geographic proximity, some people in OKC just look reflexively at the Texas cities. Those cities really are outliers. (And let's please not rehash why yet again.) If you look at OKC's real peers, like Memphis or Louisville, we stack up very well development-wise. I might put Milwaukee in there but I don't know as much about Milwaukee.

Or if you want to look at the next natural tier "up," which we really should, then analyze Kansas City. I am often on their urban development page, www.kcrag.com. It's interesting and impressive, but pound for pound on a per-capita basis, no more impressive than OKC.

Some of us (myself included) need to relax and realize that OKC is doing just fine from a growth standpoint, actually better than fine. Not that we shouldn't always strive for more but a dose of realism is healthy too.

I know these comments were made out of a misunderstanding but on this topic, I agree that Texas cities aren’t what we should be striving for. To be fair, I think when you isolate Ft. Worth from the rest of the metroplex it’s a great city for us to look at, but it can get complicated when trying to sort out what is Ft. Worth and what is spillover from being the second largest city in a monstrosity of a region. That alone can make it unrealistic to consider sometimes.

I feel like Oklahoma City falls somewhere between Omaha and Kansas City. Omaha is smaller but they have some great things going on and I think we could learn from them in certain areas, while Kansas City offers the best look into what our city should be striving for in the immediate future.

Another city that offers a fairly sustainable model for us to consider, I think, is Denver. Obviously the nearby topography and geography makes it distinct in a way we could never strive towards but outside of the natural setting and the interests that come with it, it’s a place that - like Kansas City - “feels” like a larger and more developed Oklahoma City. Also, it should go without mentioning, but I’d move heaven and earth if possible to get something like Union Station built here.

A bunch of posts about Nashville have been moved here:

Nashville (https://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=47974)

Pete, you've been unusually quiet on this thread. What are you overall thoughts on the proposal, including the supertall?

Pete, you've been unusually quiet on this thread. What are you overall thoughts on the proposal, including the supertall?

I am completely discounting the supertall and Phase II. It's not even close to realistic, but fun to see the renderings.

The 3 towers in the first phase are what I find most interesting. The renderings look great and I'm looking forward to seeing more details. Those should be coming soon because the first step is design review.

If you take away the crazy tower, the three others are amazing in their own right. And the Dream Hotel should be really cool.

I am completely discounting the supertall and Phase II. It's not even close to realistic, but fun to see the renderings.

The 3 towers in the first phase are what I find most interesting. The renderings look great and I'm looking forward to seeing more details. Those should be coming soon because the first step is design review.

If you take away the crazy tower, the three others are amazing in their own right. And the Dream Hotel should be really cool.

The supertall is the sort of thing you scream at your assistant after getting a fresh transfusion from your blood boy.

I think the supertall will happen, but not anytime soon, and will be scaled down. Matteson stated depends on how the other residential towers are leased. Well if you look at the timeline, construction for phase I will probably start in 3rd quarter of this year, best case. Then when we are talking 2-3 years for construction. Then it will take a year or two to see how quickly leases are absorbed and retained. So we are looking at 2030 if and when the supertall has steel going up.

The next few/several years in downtown are going to be amazing. We'll have a new arena, stadium, at least 3 high rises (hopefully some more are announced that we don't know about yet), as well as a number of other projects all unfolding at the same time. It'll be a great backdrop for the 2028 olympics!

I think the supertall will happen, but not anytime soon, and will be scaled down. Matteson stated depends on how the other residential towers are leased. Well if you look at the timeline, construction for phase I will probably start in 3rd quarter of this year, best case. Then when we are talking 2-3 years for construction. Then it will take a year or two to see how quickly leases are absorbed and retained. So we are looking at 2030 if and when the supertall has steel going up.

And in that time, if demand is strong, there will be other developments started that the supertall would have to compete against. Chances of a real supertall are extremely remote.

The next few/several years in downtown are going to be amazing. We'll have a new arena, stadium, at least 3 high rises (hopefully some more are announced that we don't know about yet), as well as a number of other projects all unfolding at the same time. It'll be a great backdrop for the 2028 olympics!

If this project had completed renderings that were waiting on the arena announcement to be revealed, makes me wonder how many more projects are waiting on an OLYMPICS announcement. We'll be looking real good even with the 3 proposed towers.

Will they take core samples here as one of the first steps to ground breaking?

New image from matteson adds a 345ft spire to the building to I guess drum up interest. Maybe he needs investors. Anyway, I think this further illustrates the lack of likelihood the mega tower gets built. I really need to see tower cranes up for the second phase before I believe it