This part of the city will see a boost with MAPS 4 funds although the proposed connection over 235 is not exciting to me.


WHAT IS THE INNOVATION DISTRICT?
Oklahoma City Innovation District Plan

The vision of the Oklahoma City Innovation District is to bring together the greatest minds in total collaboration, yielding world-changing results. Home to internationally-acclaimed organizations spanning Oklahoma’s diverse sectors – health, energy, aerospace, technology, research, academia, and more – the Innovation District provides opportunities for entrepreneurship, innovation, and community growth.

OKC’s emerging Innovation District currently encompasses about 1.3 square miles east of downtown –roughly between NE 13-16th Streets to the north and NE 4th to the south and Robinson and Lottie Avenues to the west and east. It crosses Broadway/Interstate 235 and includes Automobile Alley in addition to the Oklahoma Health Center, University Research Park, and numerous other institutions. The OKC Innovation District is also home to the heart of the city’s bioscience sector, where many institutions are already conducting groundbreaking research and fostering entrepreneurship and innovation. A significant center of job growth, the district reflects the shifting geography of the global economy and the emergence of dense hubs of economic activity where innovation, entrepreneurship, creativity, and placemaking intersect.

The purpose of the Innovation District is to capitalize on OKC’s dominant industries; investing in high-quality places where research institutions, firms, and talent concentrate and connect. The district will support the region in being more competitive, both in attracting investment and the talent necessary to continue our community’s economic expansion. And, not incidentally, it is critical that we provide more opportunities for area residents who are not currently connected to the innovation economy. As an existing employment hub, the home of major anchor institutions and research assets, and a site ripe for placemaking interventions, the innovation district could propel the Oklahoma City region forward.

District website: https://okcinnovation.com/

Article from VeloCity:

https://www.velocityokc.com/blog/economy/catching-up-with-the-innovation-district-symposium-events-set-stage-for-growth-maps-4-projects/

This part of the city will see a boost with MAPS 4 funds although the proposed connection over 235 is not exciting to me.



District website: https://okcinnovation.com/

we’re definitely poor boying that District. We should be throwing far more money at it.

I don’t think folks realize just how F’d the city is right now, economically speaking.

Just look at the budget projections.

This is from a presentation on the Innovation Distirct as part of MAPS4.

You can see the once grandiose plan for 10th Street (which was only conceptual and never funded) has been scaled way back. You can see that original concept here: https://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=42496&p=965118#post965118


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The bridge expansion is the best thing here.

This whole thing is a disappointment. At least the Innovative Plaza looks really cool as long as it doesn’t get scaled down.

It would be a lot better IMO if the bridge expansion allowed for buildings instead of park space.

The bridge expansion is the best thing here.

I agree. This makes so much more sense than capping I-235.


It would be a lot better IMO if the bridge expansion allowed for buildings instead of park space.

Yeah, buildings would be cool. I like how they did that in Columbus, Ohio... but, you're really not connecting to any urban streetscape on the west side of I-235 anyway.

I think this pedestrian-focused addition makes a lot of sense.

Question: Is Booker T. Washington park already there or is this a new park? Is that the name preferred by Black leaders in OKC? There's a long legacy of naming places and schools after Booker T. in more conservative places (especially the South) because he accommodated Whites publicly instead of more equity-oriented leaders like Frederick Douglass, W.E.B. DuBois, or Ida B. Wells. Just curious.

^

It's already there, so this would be an upgrade.

Seems like it'd be a good time to do any reworking/restriping/etc of 10th over the bridge and in the periphery, but they're not showing any of that here (which is not to say it won't happen).

Henrietta B. Foster Center use to be home of the YMCA, it has an indoor swimming pool and is fully operational. Mrs. Foster was the librarian at Moon Jr. High School that currently houses offices for OU Health Science Center area.




https://s3.amazonaws.com/gs-waymarking-images/17e8c1d3-a39f-4a0c-a793-73ca1c43ae05_l.JPG
Site of the old Webster and Moon Jr., High Schools

There's a Plains Indians' marker still on site.

Booker T. Washington Park on 4th Street once was home to Page Stadium, the former home to Douglass High School. The 3,000 capacity all brick two-sided stadium was demolished in the late 60s., with a smaller community park stadium erected for little league football. Abram Ross (Negros in the News) use to host his annual birthday party which attracted thousands to the park during Juneteenth celebrations. Glad to see what looks like a jogging course on the park.

The 10th Street Bridge expansion (Cap) will brace for some interesting options from Downtown to the OUHSC's Innovation link which will be pivotal from downtown to the Health Science Center complex.

Our city's MAPS 4 includes community human needs and parks' projects. Can't wait to see the sequel to MAPS 4.

Larry, thanks for that.

It's so interesting that the media is so ignorant about OKC's black culture that they often portray OKC as this all-white cowtown (mostly due to nat'l voting results) that you and I know it is not. And I'm so happy the city has diversified even moreso than when we grew up so that it's very close to being a minority majority city, yet still conservative compared to other major cities.

^^^
I feel like local and school histories have contributed to the problem. I basically had to teach myself about OKC area Black legends like Roscoe Dunjee, Ralph Ellison, and Ada Lois Sipuel Fisher (Chickasha). When they are included in the curriculum, it's what multicultural educator James Banks calls the "additive" approach. In other words, they're basically just added into the White story of Oklahoma and OKC's history, sometimes literally on the margins of textbooks. We need more historical perspectives that center and teach through Black Oklahoman perspectives. And OKC has done a terrible job of promoting Black history. They've repeatedly celebrated the landrun and early White settlers, but not near enough historical markers or statues for the folks I mentioned earlier. I know Mayor Holt and others have highlighted Ellison and there's been movement on a more visible Clara Luper statue, but there's a lot more work that needs to be done.

I agree. This makes so much more sense than capping I-235.



Yeah, buildings would be cool. I like how they did that in Columbus, Ohio... but, you're really not connecting to any urban streetscape on the west side of I-235 anyway.

I think this pedestrian-focused addition makes a lot of sense.

Question: Is Booker T. Washington park already there or is this a new park? Is that the name preferred by Black leaders in OKC? There's a long legacy of naming places and schools after Booker T. in more conservative places (especially the South) because he accommodated Whites publicly instead of more equity-oriented leaders like Frederick Douglass, W.E.B. DuBois, or Ida B. Wells. Just curious.

I was going to laugh at this comment as one of your (what I would consider) overly sensitive social justice commentaries (only kidding) but I think you do make a good point in that it could easily be named after someone else when so many things are named after Booker T. Would be cooler if it was named after a prominent black historical figure from OKC or OK. We have plenty of them to choose from.

^^^
I feel like local and school histories have contributed to the problem. I basically had to teach myself about OKC area Black legends like Roscoe Dunjee, Ralph Ellison, and Ada Lois Sipuel Fisher (Chickasha). When they are included in the curriculum, it's what multicultural educator James Banks calls the "additive" approach. In other words, they're basically just added into the White story of Oklahoma and OKC's history, sometimes literally on the margins of textbooks. We need more historical perspectives that center and teach through Black Oklahoman perspectives. And OKC has done a terrible job of promoting Black history. They've repeatedly celebrated the landrun and early White settlers, but not near enough historical markers or statues for the folks I mentioned earlier. I know Mayor Holt and others have highlighted Ellison and there's been movement on a more visible Clara Luper statue, but there's a lot more work that needs to be done.

You were a step ahead of me!

I was going to laugh at this comment as one of your (what I would consider) overly sensitive social justice commentaries (only kidding) but I think you do make a good point in that it could easily be named after someone else when so many things are named after Booker T. Would be cooler if it was named after a prominent black historical figure from OKC or OK. We have plenty of them to choose from.

Thanks! Both for associating me with social justice and considering my comments. Both great compliments.

Does anyone know how the 10th street plan would affect the Oklahoma School of Science and Mathematics campus?

I agree with the above and it's the reason why Rosa Parks gets credit for the civil rights movement and not earlier pioneers like our very own Clara Luper.

However, I want it to be known that I also disagree with BLM's approach in 're-writing' history that they disagree with. Instead, I think we need to tell ALL history, good and bad, black and white (and red, yellow, brown), as THIS is what makes America. We should NOT be tearing down statues, names, or destroying flags because that history is no longer politically correct. Instead, we should be educating WHY those things were bad and the GOOD that came from it/them or in-spite of it/them.

We can't sweep history under the rug just like we shouldn't have hid OKC's black (and other) historical contribution.

We should absolutely be tearing down statues that were put up during Jim Crow and the Civil Rights era in order to intimidate Black people. And that's nearly all of them, it's why you have random confederate statues over far more than just the south.

I agree with the above and it's the reason why Rosa Parks gets credit for the civil rights movement and not earlier pioneers like our very own Clara Luper.

However, I want it to be known that I also disagree with BLM's approach in 're-writing' history that they disagree with. Instead, I think we need to tell ALL history, good and bad, black and white (and red, yellow, brown), as THIS is what makes America. We should NOT be tearing down statues, names, or destroying flags because that history is no longer politically correct. Instead, we should be educating WHY those things were bad and the GOOD that came from it/them or in-spite of it/them.

We can't sweep history under the rug just like we shouldn't have hid OKC's black (and other) historical contribution.

This is getting way off topic. I'll try to keep this short (I'm a professor of social studies education so this is an area I teach on), I'd just ask you to consider the ways you're conflating "history" (which is always re-written; see historiography) with statues intended to honor and celebrate. They're not the same thing. If you're interested in a relevant book, David Blight's Race and Reunion (https://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674008199) is considered a classic on Civil War memory.


We should absolutely be tearing down statues that were put up during Jim Crow and the Civil Rights era in order to intimidate Black people. And that's nearly all of them, it's why you have random confederate statues over far more than just the south.

And most people don't know that when/why these statues were put up in the first place. Confederate statues and textbooks were targeted by groups like the Daughters of the Confederacy (who were closely allied with the Klan) with the intention of re-writing Civil War history:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOkFXPblLpU

Now living in Texas, I feel very fortunate to not have grown up around this Confederate history in Oklahoma. It's weird to me that many Oklahomans would care about Confederate monuments considering the state had a minimal role in the Civil War.

Anyway, I was just curious about this park and who chose the name. I'd think there are better options than Booker T. Washington, but I was genuinely curious who chose the name and why.

I agree with the above and it's the reason why Rosa Parks gets credit for the civil rights movement and not earlier pioneerods like our very own Clara Luper.

However, I want it to be known that I also disagree with BLM's approach in 're-writing' history that they disagree with. Instead, I think we need to tell ALL history, good and bad, black and white (and red, yellow, brown), as THIS is what makes America. We should NOT be tearing down statues, names, or destroying flags because that history is no longer politically correct. Instead, we should be educating WHY those things were bad and the GOOD that came from it/them or in-spite of it/them.

We can't sweep history under the rug just like we shouldn't have hid OKC's black (and other) historical contribution.

Educate, don’t venerate.

Making the recording of history correct doesn’t mean an alternate version. It means THE version.

Cancel culture was the erecting of these statues in the first place, and writing a misleading or incomplete historical account in the first place. I hear cancel culture complaints and political correctness complaints and it is almost always from the worst offenders. They aren’t worried about rights, they are worried about being right.

Now living in Texas, I feel very fortunate to not have grown up around this Confederate history in Oklahoma. It's weird to me that many Oklahomans would care about Confederate monuments considering the state had a minimal role in the Civil War.

the texas state board of education finally realized that slavery was one of the key issues of the civil war way back in 2018. texas also has more active klan groups, and more public symbols of the confederacy than oklahoma. i'm curious what objective measures you're basing your opinion on.

Texas Will Finally Teach That Slavery Was Main Cause of the Civil War | Smart News | Smithsonian Magazine (https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/texas-will-finally-teach-slavery-was-main-cause-civil-war-180970851/)
Whose Heritage? | Southern Poverty Law Center (splcenter.org) (https://www.splcenter.org/data-projects/whose-heritage?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_8PV7evS7gIVwQN9Ch0PZAj ZEAAYASAAEgI9OfD_BwE)
The KKK Is Still Based in 22 States in the U.S. in 2017 | Best States | US News (https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2017-08-14/the-kkk-is-still-based-in-22-states-in-the-us-in-2017)


Anyway, I was just curious about this park and who chose the name. I'd think there are better options than Booker T. Washington, but I was genuinely curious who chose the name and why.now i'm curious about this as well and will dig around to see what i can find out... given the city's historic geography (to put it kindly), i would imagine that this park is pre-ww2.

Now living in Texas, I feel very fortunate to not have grown up around this Confederate history in Oklahoma. It's weird to me that many Oklahomans would care about Confederate monuments considering the state had a minimal role in the Civil War.

Anyway, I was just curious about this park and who chose the name. I'd think there are better options than Booker T. Washington, but I was genuinely curious who chose the name and why.

lol

I think that was just phrased really strangely by Dan.

according to the city, booker t. washington park was created in 1924. Booker T. Washington Park | City of OKC (https://www.okc.gov/departments/parks-recreation/parks-trails/ward-7-parks/booker-t-washington-park)

i searched the oklahoman archives and couldn't find anything in the 1920's.

i found several articles from the 1930's. other than mentions of youth programs and celebrations of emancipation day, there were some issues regarding oil wells on the property. the following was written in 1935 by a candidate for city council, charles w. offutt. please excuse the antiquated language, assuming that the site's filters don't get it for me.

when the question of the city leasing booker t. washington park for oil development was presented, there was a gentlemen's agreement between the city council and the negro representatives that the oil bonus money, or a sufficient portion thereof, would be best used by the city to procure another negro park, the site thereof to be selected by the negro people. the negro representatives selected a 50-acre tract known as "hassman park" which is located north of tenth street and east of grand boulevard. the city received $38,000 for a lease on the old booker t. washington park. the new park site cost the city $25,000. the city has received more than $100,000 from booker t. washington park in oil royalties. this booker t. washington park has been the most productive area in the city field and depended upon to bolster the city's future oil income.

while this isn't direct evidence... if the black community played a large role in selecting the site of a replacement park in the 1930's, it is likely that it had great involvement in selecting the details of booker t. washington park in the 1920's, including selecting its name. i imagine that the site reverted to a park after the oil lease expired. i'm not so sure that the rail spur that gives the park its triangular shape existed at this point... but my old okc maps are at home and i'm here at the office. i also wonder if this hassman park is what is currently called edwards park.

We should absolutely be tearing down statues that were put up during Jim Crow and the Civil Rights era in order to intimidate Black people. And that's nearly all of them, it's why you have random confederate statues over far more than just the south.

Yes, this. We watch "Southern Charm" (wife watched it, I was generally just in the room when it came on, wandering in and out, but this season I watched it) and there was a hugely tall statue (100+ ft) of John C. Calhoun which got removed. It stood for over 100 years, over 100 ft tall, and any person of color would probably be angered, dismayed, saddened, etc. when they walked by/under it while it was watching over them, and since it was over 100 ft tall, its intimidation powers were pretty considerable. So yeah, tear them down. Put them in a museum or a warehouse or something like that, maybe not destroy them, but do not leave them standing, it's a massive insult to a huge percentage of the population.

first off, I never said any thing about the type of statues or whatever. I said that we shouldn't destroy history just because we are now so politically correct. This is what the mao era ccp did during the cultural revolution, they destroyed anything tied to the past in order to "bring the country forward" when in reality they used it as an excuse to get rid of tradition, culture in order to brainwash society.

I fear the same here. We surely agree that there were bad actors from history so why not STATE the history and why it was bad rather than try to cover it up. And as a person of mixed race from Oklahoma City, I never felt the racist ferver many on here are saying that existed due to a statue of this or a naming of a school. I'd also argue that non-minorities probably never had privilege due to those names either nor because most statues are of white pioneers and settlers, etc. No, the privilege comes from the INTERPRETATION of history, leaving some things out (or glancing on them) yet highlighting others.

That is what needs to change in my opinion, learn WHY so and so was bad. But if you remove it/him from history then you'll never know - which could be repeated again.

That is what needs to change in my opinion, learn WHY so and so was bad. But if you remove it/him from history then you'll never know - which could be repeated again.

History should be studied in schools and museums.
There is no place for statues in the public common areas honoring those who took up arms against the duly elected government.

History should be studied in schools and museums.
There is no place for statues in the public common areas honoring those who took up arms against the duly elected government.

Yes, this is the entire crux of the argument.

Tearing down statues is not "erasing" history, tearing down statues of confederate generals is stopping the glorification of these traitors. Just like we cannot erase what happened on April 19th, it would make absolutely no sense to erect a statue of Timothy McVeigh, hence why we would never ever do such a thing. We still teach our children what happened on the horrid day and we have designated a memorial to honor the victims of the tragedy but we DO NOT and WOULD NEVER put a statue up of someone who was on the wrong side of history. It makes no sense just like having statues of traitors who were INDEED fighting to keep their social norms and refused to see their own evil greed.

This argument is beyond me, I cannot believe as a black man who has SERVED this country that we are still debating such things.

Stop using HISTORY as a tool to hang on to ignorant traditions and beliefs.

This argument is beyond me, I cannot believe as a black man who has SERVED this country that we are still debating such things.

Stop using HISTORY as a tool to hang on to ignorant traditions and beliefs.

Yes, it's just become a political lightning rod to rile people up and get them on your side.

There really is no debate, no more there is about the value of vaccines, wearings masks, the earth being flat and several other common sense things that have been exploited for political gain.

lol

I live in Denton, Texas and there was, until recently, a large Confederate monument on the city Square. I grew up in Tulsa and can't remember seeing Confederate monuments and I can't think of any from my time in OKC or Norman. Maybe there's a lot of Confederate statues I didn't know about.

To be clear, I am not at all saying Oklahoma is bereft of white supremacy and anti-Black racism. Oklahoma's first law was Jim Crow segregation, Tulsa was the site of the worst racial violence in U.S. history, and much more. But, I was not around a lot of Confederate history as a child that I can remember, but please educate me because I'd like to learn more.


I think that was just phrased really strangely by Dan.

Which part? Maybe I can clarify.


History should be studied in schools and museums.
There is no place for statues in the public common areas honoring those who took up arms against the duly elected government.

I was trying to say something similar, but this is far more succinct and eloquent.

first off, I never said any thing about the type of statues or whatever. I said that we shouldn't destroy history just because we are now so politically correct. This is what the mao era ccp did during the cultural revolution, they destroyed anything tied to the past in order to "bring the country forward" when in reality they used it as an excuse to get rid of tradition, culture in order to brainwash society.

I fear the same here. We surely agree that there were bad actors from history so why not STATE the history and why it was bad rather than try to cover it up. And as a person of mixed race from Oklahoma City, I never felt the racist ferver many on here are saying that existed due to a statue of this or a naming of a school. I'd also argue that non-minorities probably never had privilege due to those names either nor because most statues are of white pioneers and settlers, etc. No, the privilege comes from the INTERPRETATION of history, leaving some things out (or glancing on them) yet highlighting others.

That is what needs to change in my opinion, learn WHY so and so was bad. But if you remove it/him from history then you'll never know - which could be repeated again.

As someone who works everyday on what we teach in schools, this narrative that people are systematically "destroying history" like in authoritarian states is really bizarre. I literally know of zero people who have tried to somehow destroy or hide history. Most of the debates actually just focus on historical emphasis and narrative.

Let me give a brief example. We've always taught about George Washington in schools, but textbooks and teachers often ignored his role as a slave owner. I guess you could say educators and the public were "hiding" the history of Black Americans. Social studies educators today don't "cancel" Washington, but we actually teach him and others in more complex ways. So now, I often teach both about him as a slave owner and in his roles as a general and president. My elementary social studies teacher candidates read a Young Adult version of Erica Armstrong Dunbar's Never Caught: The Washingtons' Relentless Pursuit of Their Runaway Slave, Ona Judge (https://bookshop.mymustreads.com/id004689667/Never-Caught). I often teach the other parts of Washington through a critical analyzing of Hamilton (Lin Manuel Miranda's Hamilton focuses on the traditional, presidential, heroic Washington). My students come out of my class with a deep understanding of the revolutionary and early American time period, but not just from the Founders, but from those who were enslaved by them too.

The only example of systematically hiding history I can think of is how Oklahomans hid the Tulsa Race Massacre. The inciting Tulsa Tribune article was destroyed (still no records of it) and it was excluded from textbooks. It wasn't until Scott Ellsworth's book came out in the 1980s that White Oklahomans slowly started recognizing the event again. But, as I point out above, schools have taught a historical narrative that is distorted, simplistic, and Eurocentric/White history for a very long time. That's changing because people are teaching more full and complete histories... or trying to. There's still plenty of racist history being taught, including about Indigenous nations and peoples in Oklahoma... that's another thread altogether.

first off, I never said any thing about the type of statues or whatever. I said that we shouldn't destroy history just because we are now so politically correct. This is what the mao era ccp did during the cultural revolution, they destroyed anything tied to the past in order to "bring the country forward" when in reality they used it as an excuse to get rid of tradition, culture in order to brainwash society.

I fear the same here. We surely agree that there were bad actors from history so why not STATE the history and why it was bad rather than try to cover it up. And as a person of mixed race from Oklahoma City, I never felt the racist ferver many on here are saying that existed due to a statue of this or a naming of a school. I'd also argue that non-minorities probably never had privilege due to those names either nor because most statues are of white pioneers and settlers, etc. No, the privilege comes from the INTERPRETATION of history, leaving some things out (or glancing on them) yet highlighting others.

That is what needs to change in my opinion, learn WHY so and so was bad. But if you remove it/him from history then you'll never know - which could be repeated again.

How is this still an argument?

Think of it like this. In the 1990's (50 years after the United States beat Germany in WW2), a group of Americans with pro Nazi sympathies erect large Nazi memorials and statues of Hitler in predominantly Jewish areas across the country. They do this for the sole reason of trying to antagonize and demoralize Jews. many Jewish adolescents attend schools named "Adolf Hitler High." Anytime someone demands the renaming of these schools or wants a Nazi statue removed from city hall, people cry of erasing the past, censorship, and cancel culture. They worry about our ability to learn from Hitler's mistakes without the local Jr. High being named after him. They lament that we would surely be erasing the History of WWll by removing statues that didn't even exist until 1994 but now for some reason are historically crucial and irreplaceable.

This is the argument you are making.

Tearing down statues is not "erasing" history, tearing down statues of confederate generals is stopping the glorification of these traitors. Just like we cannot erase what happened on April 19th, it would make absolutely no sense to erect a statue of Timothy McVeigh, hence why we would never ever do such a thing. We still teach our children what happened on the horrid day and we have designated a memorial to honor the victims of the tragedy but we DO NOT and WOULD NEVER put a statue up of someone who was on the wrong side of history. It makes no sense just like having statues of traitors who were INDEED fighting to keep their social norms and refused to see their own evil greed.

This argument is beyond me, I cannot believe as a black man who has SERVED this country that we are still debating such things.

Stop using HISTORY as a tool to hang on to ignorant traditions and beliefs.

This is exactly what has boggled my mind about this issue forever: these people were TRAITORS to the country. They tried to destroy our nation and fought to preserve the most evil institution concocted by man. There is no reason to have any level of glorification for these people. And it's not erasing history--no one is talking about banning their mention from the history books.

I think these statues should be placed in a museum somewhere in the country as a reminder just how much effort went to suppress African Americans. It’s one thing when you have pictures and are told history but actually seeing these massive statues in person could give someone an “oh sh!t” moment like these were actually real and commemorated. Put them in a civil rights museum in a place called the hall of shame.

according to the city, booker t. washington park was created in 1924. Booker T. Washington Park | City of OKC (https://www.okc.gov/departments/parks-recreation/parks-trails/ward-7-parks/booker-t-washington-park)

i searched the oklahoman archives and couldn't find anything in the 1920's.

i found several articles from the 1930's. other than mentions of youth programs and celebrations of emancipation day, there were some issues regarding oil wells on the property. the following was written in 1935 by a candidate for city council, charles w. offutt. please excuse the antiquated language, assuming that the site's filters don't get it for me.


while this isn't direct evidence... if the black community played a large role in selecting the site of a replacement park in the 1930's, it is likely that it had great involvement in selecting the details of booker t. washington park in the 1920's, including selecting its name. i imagine that the site reverted to a park after the oil lease expired. i'm not so sure that the rail spur that gives the park its triangular shape existed at this point... but my old okc maps are at home and i'm here at the office. i also wonder if this hassman park is what is currently called edwards park.

Bumping this post because I appreciate the research you did to actually address this historical issue around how Booker T. Washington park got its name. It is also very plausible that Black citizens knew they had to choose a park name that was amenable to White citizens. I'd be very curious to know more. I'll try to do some research on how Booker T. Washington was viewed at that time in the Black community and see what I can find.

Which part? Maybe I can clarify.

This paragraph:


Now living in Texas, I feel very fortunate to not have grown up around this Confederate history in Oklahoma. It's weird to me that many Oklahomans would care about Confederate monuments considering the state had a minimal role in the Civil War.

With a close reading I can see that you are talking about the confederate history you see around you in Texas (right?), but just at a glance it kind of reads as the opposite somehow.

I think these statues should be placed in a museum somewhere in the country as a reminder just how much effort went to suppress African Americans. It’s one thing when you have pictures and are told history but actually seeing these massive statues in person could give someone an “oh sh!t” moment like these were actually real and commemorated. Put them in a civil rights museum in a place called the hall of shame.

Yes, this. Put them in an airplane hanger-type facility on their original pedestals (or a reasonable facsimile thereof, *including* how large and high they were and the plaques on them), and have complete histories of the people they are of (distilled down to a few paragraphs, probably, to keep people engaged).

Melt them down and cast them into plaques that have the bits from the different state secession documents that cover the degree to which slavery was why they were all leaving the union. Throw in the Cornerstone Speech for completeness, maybe the Silent Sam dedication speech too. For extra points the Silent Sam plaque can be made specifically out of Silent Sam.

In response to Martin's post #24:

Booker T. Washington Park and the Henrietta B. Foster Center (4th Street YMCA) in Oklahoma City is where I learned to swim.

Recall Washington Park how they would open the pool at 9 a.m. , in the morning. You were allowed to swim free. Why, they poured the chlorine crystals into the pool and we stirred the crystals around; then the pool closed at 12 noon and reopened at 1 p.m., that's when you had to pay. Those chlorine crystals left a distinguished 'white ash,' on you that took a good 15 minute shower to wash off.

The pool at Washington Park wasn't anywhere you could get any privacy getting undressed/dressed. There were no stalls for the commodes and the showers were like those in the Army where you had a portal supporting 4 shower heads and don't dare drop your bar of soap and have to bend over. A few of the other youths would laugh and yell, 'black-eye peas.'

Washington Park was an experience. Many of our teachers in the OKC School District were hired during the summer to manage the pools.

They had a little pool for children 9 and under managed by a midget named 'Pearle Cooper.' This small woman was tough and you couldn't out run her; so she kept many of the toddlers & pre-juveniles in line until they graduated to the big pool.

They were very stitch about enforcement of the pool rules and regulations. Those who couldn't follow the rules were banned for up to 1 - 2 weeks. If you got a third violation, you were banned for the remainder of the park season.

Back on topic..

As someone who works everyday on what we teach in schools, this narrative that people are systematically "destroying history" like in authoritarian states is really bizarre. I literally know of zero people who have tried to somehow destroy or hide history. Most of the debates actually just focus on historical emphasis and narrative.

Let me give a brief example. We've always taught about George Washington in schools, but textbooks and teachers often ignored his role as a slave owner. I guess you could say educators and the public were "hiding" the history of Black Americans. Social studies educators today don't "cancel" Washington, but we actually teach him and others in more complex ways. So now, I often teach both about him as a slave owner and in his roles as a general and president. My elementary social studies teacher candidates read a Young Adult version of Erica Armstrong Dunbar's Never Caught: The Washingtons' Relentless Pursuit of Their Runaway Slave, Ona Judge (https://bookshop.mymustreads.com/id004689667/Never-Caught). I often teach the other parts of Washington through a critical analyzing of Hamilton (Lin Manuel Miranda's Hamilton focuses on the traditional, presidential, heroic Washington). My students come out of my class with a deep understanding of the revolutionary and early American time period, but not just from the Founders, but from those who were enslaved by them too.

The only example of systematically hiding history I can think of is how Oklahomans hid the Tulsa Race Massacre. The inciting Tulsa Tribune article was destroyed (still no records of it) and it was excluded from textbooks. It wasn't until Scott Ellsworth's book came out in the 1980s that White Oklahomans slowly started recognizing the event again. But, as I point out above, schools have taught a historical narrative that is distorted, simplistic, and Eurocentric/White history for a very long time. That's changing because people are teaching more full and complete histories... or trying to. There's still plenty of racist history being taught, including about Indigenous nations and peoples in Oklahoma... that's another thread altogether.

I wonder how many schools in Oklahoma or in Tillman County teach about the history of Benjamin Tillman, the namesake of the county

This paragraph:

With a close reading I can see that you are talking about the confederate history you see around you in Texas (right?), but just at a glance it kind of reads as the opposite somehow.

Gotchya. I totally see how my wording was confusing. I was trying to say that there were not a lot of Confederate monuments in Oklahoma. There are in Texas. I don't like them. Hopefully that's clearer lol.

Gotchya. I totally see how my wording was confusing. I was trying to say that there were not a lot of Confederate monuments in Oklahoma. There are in Texas. I don't like them. Hopefully that's clearer lol.

Thank you, Dan

https://www.velocityokc.com/clientuploads/directory/super_blog/OKC_Innovation_District_Core_Rendering.jpg

Placeholders are fun because they help you envision various projects to occupy space with some density.

Our City's MAPS Initiatives have acted much like a 'booster or charger' to get our city on the move. MAPS 4 will focus more on human needs.

I am disappointed with two projects; Riversports Rapids and now the empty sight of the Street Cars. Let me move over to that thread...

Not sure how I'd missed this until now, but here is the draft of the latest land use, preservation, and transportation plan for the proposed Innovation District: https://www.okc.gov/home/showpublisheddocument/22983/637553930103530000.

There is a 6PM Zoom meeting tonight (okc.zoom.us/j/97081503618 ) for anyone interested in giving feedback, which can be provided here: https://www.okc.gov/departments/planning/current-projects/innovation-district-land-use-plan/view-and-comment-on-innovation-district-land-use-plan

Interesting.

https://www.okctalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16860&d=1621524812

told you guys streetcar was not done. ..

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/innovation072521a.jpg

A fair amount of those buildings need to be completely razed so the property development can start from scratch.

A fair amount of those buildings need to be completely razed so the property development can start from scratch.

+1. But i don’t necessarily see the Echo Cap guys doing things the right way here.

Hope I’m wrong, though.

Found this and I don't think this vision has been posted. Nice image of what can be.
17032
https://perkinswill.com/project/oklahoma-city-innovation-district-and-capitol-environs-land-use-and-strategic-development-plan/

I love the proposal to removal the parking lots at the state capitol and replace it with a park. When is that happening?

Found this and I don't think this vision has been posted. Nice image of what can be.
17032
https://perkinswill.com/project/oklahoma-city-innovation-district-and-capitol-environs-land-use-and-strategic-development-plan/


If this all comes to fruition, it will be very exciting. I office out of one of the buildings there that a parking lot will be taken out and a building built with a parking garage to the north. So, from a person that works in this area and will be directly affected by it, it is exciting.

Found this and I don't think this vision has been posted. Nice image of what can be.
17032
https://perkinswill.com/project/oklahoma-city-innovation-district-and-capitol-environs-land-use-and-strategic-development-plan/

I agree this is nice and PRAY it gets developed as shown.

I am also delighted that the architects see the innovation district as its own area, per their statement about the 10-street bridge redevelopment that will "reconnect the Innovation District to Automobile Alley". Previously we had heard boosters indicating that the Innovation District would INCLUDE Automobile Alley which is a huge mistake.

I love the proposal to removal the parking lots at the state capitol and replace it with a park. When is that happening?

I agree with this also. Too many exposed surface parking lots.

Make it a capitol campus, our version of the National Mall. Extend the streetcar and build architecturally significant parking garages for employees and visitors.

They need to build light rail but I’m really not on board with anymore funding for the streetcar. Tried using it the other night and it was awful.

They need to build light rail but I’m really not on board with anymore funding for the streetcar. Tried using it the other night and it was awful.

LOL what? We used it the other night and it was easy.

light rail will be way too much capacity and far few stops for such a route Plutonic Panda. Streetcar is most appropriate for downtown to the Capitol and points inbetween - hence why it's already being planned for.

I don't think there's any route in OKC that would work for light rail other than POSSIBLY to the airport. NW Expressway area is another area that would do well with Light Rail but that's being covered with "BRT light".

light rail will be way too much capacity and far few stops for such a route Plutonic Panda. Streetcar is most appropriate for downtown to the Capitol and points inbetween - hence why it's already being planned for.

I don't think there's any route in OKC that would work for light rail other than POSSIBLY to the airport. NW Expressway area is another area that would do well with Light Rail but that's being covered with "BRT light".

IIRC, the corridor out to Tinker being studied by the RTA is being considered for light rail as it is the only one with insufficient railroad tracks for commuter rail.

could be, I also heard rapid streetcar.