Who is Don Hayes?

Don Hayes is a local commercial real estate broker who is leading the group who has the building under contract.

He has been actively trying to find tenants for the first floor while they try and firm up a hotel or office use for above.

Don Hayes is a local commercial real estate broker who is leading the group who has the building under contract.

He has been actively trying to find tenants for the first floor while they try and firm up a hotel or office use for above.

Thanks Pete.

Any renderings, sketches, or descriptions of what Don's group wants to do with the building? Reopening windows, reconfiguring the first floor, facade changes, etc, etc? Or would that sort of info come along after tenants are secured?

Too early for renderings but you can pretty much count on the exterior remaining largely the same, just restored.

Too early for renderings but you can pretty much count on the exterior remaining largely the same, just restored.

If they put all the windows back in, it would look widely different.

A Yard House would be perfect in this building.

Sounds promising.

Spaghetti Warehouse building under contract to sell (http://www.okctalk.com/content.php?r=396-Spaghetti-Warehouse-building-under-contract-to-sell)

After years of neglect and abandonment, the historic building at 101 E. Sheridan, formerly home to Spaghetti Warehouse, may see a new owner and renovation.



I had looked at a project here around April 2015 where SW wanted to shut down for a week and have workers come in to fix the kitchen floor and under plumbing etc working 24 hours a day. It looked about the same as the pictures Pete posted so I guess that never happened. The basement under the kitchen was a rotten mess with a smell to match as bad as you can imagine.

Basically from what I remember they were going to move out all the kitchen equipment out, rip up the floor, re-enforce the beams, and put a new subfloor and tile back in and move the equipment back. From the other trades I was talking to none of them thought it would be able to be done in a week and it was going to run a few million to get it done.

http://newsok.com/spaghetti-warehouse-sells-for-3.8-million/article/5564906

Is Sam Coury the guy behind the Ambassador hotels and Coury Hospitality? Or is that Paul Coury?

Is Sam Coury the guy behind the Ambassador hotels and Coury Hospitality? Or is that Paul Coury?

Paul is Coury Hospitality.

If this building redevelops as a boutique hotel with ground floor retail it would be the truest thing to the original Neal Horton vision for Bricktown that has been done since the Glass/Confectionary/Baden renovations in the early 1980s.

If this building redevelops as a boutique hotel with ground floor retail it would be the truest thing to the original Neal Horton vision for Bricktown that has been done since the Glass/Confectionary/Baden renovations in the early 1980s.

We'll see if the Omni deal and it's TIF prohibitions interferes here.

According to the developer it probably will not be an issue, I've been told.

By the way, one of the few advantages this building presents other than location, size and exterior appeal is that it is a candidate for historic tax credits.

According to the developer it probably will not be an issue, I've been told.

They have something against free money?

Or could it possibly be that taxpayers don't need to be gifting millions to rich developers in order for them to build something?

Name a single hotel that has pursued public money besides 21c or Skirvin. Omni doesn't count because OKC pursued them.

Name a single hotel that has pursued public money besides 21c or Skirvin. Omni doesn't count because OKC pursued them.

The Ambassador and First National Center.

And all four of these hotels were historic rehabs just like this building would be.

Ambassador used TIF? I missed that. Again, Skirvin, FNC 21c are special instances. FNC hotel component is just a part of that development.

I know you are anxious to demonstrate that Omni TIF prohibition clause for hotels is somehow a bad thing, but again I will say that the hotel market is teetering on overbuild. It is causing compression, and low-rent properties on I-35 corridor, I-40/Meridian are much more of a problem for industry than this TIF prohibition. We don't need any artificial drivers of new rooms. If it works as a boutique hotel, great. That's a neat idea and I support it.

But it needs to be built on its own financials like pretty much every other hotel in the past decade. If the developer switches to a residential model to unlock TIF, also great, IMO. This is an example of incentives being applied CORRECTLY, Pete. As a staunch TIF critic you should at least applaud strategic usage that eliminates overbuild of a sector that does not typically require public funds and instead directs development to residential adaptive reuse with retail component, which we actually DO need.

I'm not anxious to prove anything; just providing healthy skepticism and actual facts for a program that frequently lacks both, while diverting billions of tax dollars as schools are in crisis and the state is calling emerging sessions to further slash needed funding.


The Omni prohibition clause is not a strategic move by those managing TIF. It was forced upon the City by Omni to protect their investment. Otherwise, where was this supposed strategy before? Omni put that requirement in their contract, not the City.

And as already been demonstrated, plenty of TIF money has been used to fund hotels and all were special circumstances, just like this would be. 21c received the biggest TIF award in dollars and percentage at that time and that money went to one of OKC's wealthiest families. This property is frequently cited as critical to Bricktown, so much so there have has been countless media stories about it over the last 10 years. So suddenly now this building and project doesn't warrant special consideration?

Why should hotels be required to be 'built on their own financials' when every other type of commercial project are not and other hotels have already received free tax money? You are saying the hotel market is overbuilt but occupancy rates downtown remain high, especially compared to the rest of the city.

Very happy to see that Lingo is involved with this. They've done great work on these historic buildings.

...The Omni prohibition clause is not a strategic move by those managing TIF. It was forced upon the City by Omni to protect their investment. Otherwise, where was this supposed strategy before? Omni put that requirement in their contract, not the City...

That may be the case but the byproduct of the prohibition is desirable; that is, we are not funding hotel product that doesn't make sense on its own merit. The hotel market has been red hot - unlike other sectors - and does not need incentive. This is especially true of limited service product.


...And as already been demonstrated, plenty of TIF money has been used to fund hotels and all were special circumstances, just like this would be. 21c received the biggest TIF award in dollars and percentage at that time and that money went to one of OKC's wealthiest families. This property is frequently cited as critical to Bricktown, so much so there have has been countless media stories about it over the last 10 years. So suddenly now this building and project doesn't warrant special consideration?..

Because there are options for the building other than hotel, and because adding rooms in Bricktown doesn't provide significant benefit beyond what the other applications might. In the case of Ambassador, 21c and FNC, the hotel product provided a net benefit to their respective districts and to downtown beyond adaptive re-use of a derelict albeit important building. This would not.


...Why should hotels be required to be 'built on their own financials' when every other type of commercial project are not and other hotels have already received free tax money? You are saying the hotel market is overbuilt but occupancy rates downtown remain high, especially compared to the rest of the city...

Because, again, the downtown hotel development market is approaching "irrational exuberance" levels according to the industry, and because this has a ripple effect city-wide. There is still a significant amount of old, deep-discount product on the market. It is especially problematic in that much of this older product has no debt service, which means they can keep a property running by selling rooms very cheaply (check out the Biltmore, for instance). So while the downtown market remains pretty stable rates city-wide are plummeting, which could spell trouble for properties away from the city center, and which also has a negative impact on things like room tax and sales tax. It also long-term could create a softening of rates/occupancy even downtown. The hotel industry is a pretty complicated organism, and needs to be looked at through a city-wide lens when we make long-term decisions.

All of that said - while I have made my case for the TIF prohibition for downtown hotels - as you stated this IS a building with special circumstances, and if the powers that be found a way to make an exception, I would support it. :D

I'm just saying that the net benefit of the prohibition works to the advantage of the City, so even if driven by Omni it is a good thing overall.

The greatest thing about the Spaghetti Warehouse as I recall, it was the catalyst that lured many under the bridge from events at the Myriad into Bricktown that helped many of our leaders envision Bricktown's potential.

A number of times we visited the Spaghetti Warehouse before or after an event. Kept thinking what it would be like with some more restaurant choices; then, the boom came following the canal opening--Chelinos was the first major restaurant established on the Bricktown Canal.

State Fair Arena didn't have nearby restaurants close to the venue; Sammy's Pizza on 10th (west of Portland) was one of my favorites to attend before or after an event.

After reading the article from the Oklahoma I would much rather see the new owners do condominium's/apartments on the top 5 floors and retail on the first floor. There is already a holiday inn express behind this and 2 new hotels going in behind the ihop. We need affordable residential and for sale housing downtown. We just approved bonds for economic impact and affordable housing on September 12th. Offer these guys a grant coupled with a possible historic tax credit from the federal government and lets cater to some folks that might actually ride the streetcar that is going in as we speak. Another hotel is business, sure enough.....but we need folks that will ride that streetcar and use the new scissortail park to have options for affordable housing downtown !!

After reading the article from the Oklahoma I would much rather see the new owners do condominium's/apartments on the top 5 floors and retail on the first floor. There is already a holiday inn express behind this and 2 new hotels going in behind the ihop. We need affordable residential and for sale housing downtown. We just approved bonds for economic impact and affordable housing on September 12th. Offer these guys a grant coupled with a possible historic tax credit from the federal government and lets cater to some folks that might actually ride the streetcar that is going in as we speak. Another hotel is business, sure enough.....but we need folks that will ride that streetcar and use the new scissortail park to have options for affordable housing downtown !!With a purchase price of $3.8 million for that building, I doubt affordable housing could break even there even with tax credits, etc.

As someone who has worked for a company that turned down incentives, the owner gave me a very specific very smart reason for it. He said I don't want to owe them anything. You take incentive money you open yourself up to public criticism, more oversight, and in general just more visisblity. I just don't want that.

Could be a situation like that.

I think the upper floors should be condos/apartments as well. We already have several hotels in the area with more to come.

^^^

As someone who has worked for a company that turned down incentives, the owner gave me a very specific very smart reason for it. He said I don't want to owe them anything. You take incentive money you open yourself up to public criticism, more oversight, and in general just more visisblity. I just don't want that.

But the entire basis of getting TIF is that you must show on a pro forma a 'funding gap' which demonstrates the project cannot be built without it. The infamous 'but for' argument that is the non-provable assumption at the very core of all such public incentives.

That's why this assumption is so incredibly dubious. Anyone can make a pro forma say anything they want; it's just numbers on a spreadsheet. It's not like it's independently audited and verified.

Over beers and honest conversation local developers will tell you they specifically create proformas to show a 5-8% funding gap in order to have the best chance of obtaining free TIF money. Otherwise, how do you begin to explain that dozens and dozens of projects all fall in this exact window, regardless of timimg, type of project, developer, location, features, etc.? They all know how to game the system due to the long track record of what it takes to get the free money.

And of course, there are plenty of projects that get built without any TIF at all.

With a purchase price of $3.8 million for that building, I doubt affordable housing could break even there even with tax credits, etc.

Good point....

The guest speaker in Steve's downtown development chat this morning said something about wishing Urban Outfitters would open up on the first floor of the Spaghetti Warehouse Building. Is Urban Outfitters even still popular? I know it would have been a great catch for OKC in 2007 but it seems kind of like one of those stores that was a last decade fad. I can think of numerous other retailers I would like to see downtown over Urban Outfitters. First and foremost, a grocery store or even a CVS would be much welcome. It's hard to believe downtown still doesn't have these things and we are almost in 2018.

Edit: I just looked it up and Urban Outfitters has experienced a resurgence recently.

I really think that the Spaghetti Warehouse first floor should remain a restaurant or a bar. It's quite a cool space in my opinion.

With a purchase price of $3.8 million for that building, I doubt affordable housing could break even there even with tax credits, etc.

I'm not a developer so I don't know how the calculations are done but if the first floor was kept as a restaurant, couldn't that help maqe it more feasible for the upper floors to be converted to some sort of residential?

I don think it matters what the first floor is for 2+ to be residential. I would argue that being a resaurant makes the smell harder to deal with. As nice as spaghetti is, do you want to be the "spaghetti smell guy" every where you go? At least with it being retail, there isn't a smell, you dont have a kitchen to worry about with potential hazards there (ventilation, flames, etc). And noise would be, quite frankly, less with retail. So if i were looking, i would chose retail over food any day for the bottom floor of what i live in.

I have always heard that the cost to renovate the upper floors of these older buildings is expensive. You wouldn't think so with brick walls, etc. Apparently the code requirements are expensive. Just what I heard...

I have always heard that the cost to renovate the upper floors of these older buildings is expensive. You wouldn't think so with brick walls, etc. Apparently the code requirements are expensive. Just what I heard...

I don't know about this building, but I did do the second floor of the Kingman plow building. We had to restore the wood flooring, couldn't cover any pillars, and had to leave the safe intact and in place... It was expensive and time consuming. In retrospect, if we weren't in the middle of the tech bubble, I would have pushed to locate elsewhere.

Spaghetti Warehouse Building to begin renovation (http://www.okctalk.com/content.php?r=451-Spaghetti-Warehouse-Building-to-begin-renovation)

The first steps towards renovation of the historic building at 101 E. Sheridan in Bricktown will be soon taken as plans have been filed to replace all windows and open the ample number of previously blocked window openings.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018.jpg


Sam Coury bought the building last September and told OKCTalk that the window replacement is the first step in a full remodel of the historic structure.

Plans filed with the Downtown Design Review Committee show the intention to replace all the old openings with new historically-appropriate windows.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018b.jpg


A test was undertaken by removing the bricks from one opening and determining that that process could be performed without damaging the surrounding original brick.

Coury said they hope to start the window replacement project as soon as the necessary approvals are received. He plans to pursue historic tax credits which require the rest of the building to remain unchanged, and is hopeful of receiving the necessary cooperation from the city, state and federal governments to move the project forward as quickly as possible.

Coury mentioned the building is particularly important due to its iconic and highly visible status in Bricktown.

The interior of the building is rough but solid according to Coury and he envisions either apartments, office, a hotel or even warehouse space on floors 2-6, restaurant and retail space on the 1st floor, and a possible nightclub in the full basement.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018j.jpg


The 6-story building has been completely vacant since the Spaghetti Warehouse closed its doors in early 2016, part of a national contraction.

Coury has employed Catherine Montgomery of local firm Preservation and Design Studio, which has worked on several area restoration projects such as the Ambassador Hotel and Calvary Baptist Church.

101 E. Sheridan was originally constructed by the Oklahoma Furniture Manufacturing Company as a 3-story building in the early 1900's, with 3 more floors being added afterwards. It occupies a key corner at Sheridan and Oklahoma in the heart of Bricktown.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018d.jpg

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018e.jpg

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018f.jpg

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw011018g.jpg

I want to know how the bricks in the windows are removed.

Likely using a brick and mortar saw.

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/tools/Saws-Blades/Saws-Specialty/arbortech-as170-brick-mortar-saw-set?infoParam.campaignId=T9F&gclid=Cj0KCQiAs9zSBRC5ARIsAFMtUXEog1ddyQf0Tv-gu7eH0yiE3EtLIRAqysoSmk8DDMyrI-S8tllDFLAaAlE2EALw_wcB

I hope the nightclub happens.

I want to know how the bricks in the windows are removed.

Its probably not hard at all to tell you the truth. Brick gets its strength though having them interlock. Only the mortar and weight of the bricks kept those windows in.

I would think that a Garage Burger joint would fit very nicely here, especially since there are already garage doors facing Sheridan. Hopefully if a restaurant does go in, it will be a local place, or perhaps another local brew-pub.

I would think that a Garage Burger joint would fit very nicely here, especially since there are already garage doors facing Sheridan. Hopefully if a restaurant does go in, it will be a local place, or perhaps another local brew-pub.

I would hope it would be something a little more unique than that, especially since there is already so many burger restaurants in the vicinity and there is a Garage less than a mile away in Midtown.


I hope the nightclub happens.

I think it depends on what kind. It would be cool to have a jazz lounge in OKC (would something like that be successful here?) I think this building would be a perfect location for such a concept if it were to be tried here. I would hope to not see another one of your typical OKC nightclubs a-la Circus Party Bar.

There is a place in Grapevine called "Great Scott" https://www.google.com/search?q=Great+Scott+Grapevine&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiFtO7D3NDYAhUG3mMKHSpSDR0Q_AUICygC&biw=1920&bih=1012

I have actually spoke with them about this building, because their current location has the same feel and size and also they have a menu and plating philosophy that doesn't exist in downtown. Plus they have a happy hour with 1/2 of charcuterie..

...
I think it depends on what kind. It would be cool to have a jazz lounge in OKC (would something like that be successful here?) I think this building would be a perfect location for such a concept if it were to be tried here. I would hope to not see another one of your typical OKC nightclubs a-la Circus Party Bar.

Not sure if UCO's Jazz Lab in Edmond fits the description of a jazz lounge, since I've never been, and not sure how much money it makes (don't know if it's all underwritten by UCO or if it has to make a profit to pay rent or ......), but it might qualify as a successful jazz lounge.

I'd like to see a Yard House.

It would be cool to have a jazz lounge in OKC (would something like that be successful here?) I think this building would be a perfect location for such a concept if it were to be tried here.

Maker's was a speakeasy jazz lounge and cigar bar in Bricktown that shut down around 7 years ago. The location was fairly hidden, which was part of the appeal, but may or may not have affected business. If I remember right, they shut down from tax issues, not lack of success. https://www.yelp.com/biz/makers-cigar-lounge-oklahoma-city

^^^^^^^^
Correct. If there is any cauitonary tale to be told about Maker's - other than excercising care when selecting business partners and keeping an eye on things no matter who is tasked with running them - is not to say grace over too much square footage. If they'd never opened the upstairs portion, the original Maker's might still be open today. R.I.P. One of the best bars not only in the history of Bricktown, but of OKC.

A Yard House would do extremely well in Bricktown.

^^^^^^^^
Correct. If there is any cauitonary tale to be told about Maker's - other than excercising care when selecting business partners and keeping an eye on things no matter who is tasked with running them - is not to say grace over too much square footage. If they'd never opened the upstairs portion, the original Maker's might still be open today. R.I.P. One of the best bars not only in the history of Bricktown, but of OKC.

I've heard a lot of people talk about this bar. It's a shame that it closed and that nobody else has managed to try the concept. I think a historic building with a lot of character like the Spaghetti Warehouse building would be perfect for it.

"possible nightclub in the full basement."

Love this. I think OKC should have more basement dance clubs and bars.

Here is the latest rendering of the next phase of renovation, which will involve replacing all the windows and exterior renovation.

Most of us have never seen this building without the upper floors boarded.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/sw020918.jpg

This is going to be incredible and will make such a difference.

Probably the most visible corner in all of Bricktown.

Can't wait to see it come back to life.

Honestly I miss the Spaghetti Warehouse. I know it really wasn't that great of a restaurant, but made an excellent date night choice for my wife and I while were

Honestly I miss the Spaghetti Warehouse. I know it really wasn't that great of a restaurant, but made an excellent date night choice for my wife and I while were
You’re not alone. My whole family enjoyed it and misses it.

My first real date (off campus with actual money spent) with my wife was at that Spaghetti Warehouse about 14 years ago. I had lasagna breath for our first kiss!

Never went to eat there.

New panes, new gains for former Spaghetti Warehouse building

By: Molly M. Fleming The Journal Record February 14, 2018

OKLAHOMA CITY – Light will soon shine inside the top floors of the Spaghetti Warehouse building in Bricktown.

Originally constructed as the Oklahoma Furniture Manufacturing Company Building, the warehouse property at 101 E. Sheridan Ave. has boarded and bricked-up windows.

There are 216 windows to be exact, said Sam Coury, who bought the property and is redeveloping it. Coury has spent most of his life developing commercial real estate. This is his first time to tackle an old building though. He said he sees it as any other type of building.

“It’s no big deal,” he said.

The city of Oklahoma City’s planning department approved the window changes, though the Bricktown Urban Design Committee was given the chance to ask questions about the project at its Wednesday meeting. The committee didn’t see any major problems with the plan.

Coury said he was waiting for the committee’s approval before he ordered the windows. He’ll place the order this week.

He said he took out some of the brick on a couple of windows to test the building’s stability and nothing shifted.

“When I get them in, it will be beautiful,” he said.

Coury is working with architect Catherine Montgomery, president and founder of Preservation Design Studio. Montgomery is known for her ability to work through the process of getting a building listed on the National Register of Historic Places. She then helps the owner update the structure with the guidance of the Oklahoma State Historic Preservation Office. Getting on the register and updating the building properly allows the owner to qualify for state and federal historic tax credits.

Montgomery said the new windows were coordinated with SHPO, in case Coury wanted to pursue getting on the register, but Coury said he doesn’t know if he’ll pursue that. The windows would have been updated to properly fit the old building.

Coury’s plans provided to the city do not specify a use. He said he’d like to install the new windows, get the building cleaned up, then work with people who are interested in buying a condo in the 98,000-square-foot, six-story structure. He said the building is in sound shape and even has white-oak floors that bear the stamp of a Texarkana, Arkansas manufacturer.

He said he expects to have the windows replaced in the next 90 days. He’s already started working on cleaning the interior.

Montgomery said the interior is beautiful, with a light layer of nostalgic dust. She said replacing the windows will bring an awesome change to the corner of Sheridan and Oklahoma avenues.

“It’s suddenly going to look alive,” she said.

We loved Spaghetti Warehouse. I hated to see it close. They had the best Sangria in town.

Making room for the new windows:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/spaghetti051318.jpg