"Stupid enough to be driving over the speed limit ... Driving over the speed limit actually is against the law for those who don't know it and like to consider themselves to be law abiding citizens." Well, I'm in great company then. Nobody asked you to apologize. But, you sure couldn't wait to label anyone who drives over the speed limit 'stupid.' FYI - I don't label myself a law abiding citizen. I actually highly endorse civil disobedience when appropriate (which can vary depending on one's perspective).

Please don't put words in my mouth. I said I would consider "myself" stupid if I did that and I absolutely would. I would deserve whatever consequences that I received for doing that. Other people are welcome to make whatever characterization about their activities that they desire.

If you consider disobeying traffic laws to be civil disobedience, I just don't know what to say. Your comments don't surprise me in the least.

CT,

I recently found a 94 marquis in nice condition and I jumped all over it because I was missing owning a larger ride that I can sit in rather than wear. Whenever the day arrives you decide to hang up your keys, maybe we can have us a chat.

CT,

I recently found a 94 marquis in nice condition and I jumped all over it because I was missing owning a larger ride that I can sit in rather than wear. Whenever the day arrives you decide to hang up your keys, maybe we can have us a chat.

Kevin,
I will try and remember that you asked. I don't think I'm going to be driving more than another year or two and even then, I will drive less than 2,000 per year. I bought a new Grand Marquis in 1997 and loved it, so I was looking for a later model when I stumbled onto the one I bought. The last year they were made was 2010, but mine's a 2006. I just replaced the original tires (due to age, not tread, they were starting to split), it has the original battery, and is in really good shape since I received a new paint job about three years ago due to hail damage. They were able to repair all the dents without replacing any body parts.

What gripes me is the lack of police on non interstate streets. If someone is going 80 instead of 70 on I40, I really don't see a big deal. But is someone is going 50 in a 40 on N. May at 5:00 in the afternoon, well that's a different story. Or how about speeding in neighborhood streets? Very difficult to get any police patrolling a neighborhood where kids are playing. But guess that's too much to ask.

What gripes me is the lack of police on non interstate streets. If someone is going 80 instead of 70 on I40, I really don't see a big deal. But is someone is going 50 in a 40 on N. May at 5:00 in the afternoon, well that's a different story. Or how about speeding in neighborhood streets? Very difficult to get any police patrolling a neighborhood where kids are playing. But guess that's too much to ask.

There isn't any money to be made keeping neighborhoods safe and crime free......

What gripes me is the lack of police on non interstate streets. If someone is going 80 instead of 70 on I40, I really don't see a big deal. But is someone is going 50 in a 40 on N. May at 5:00 in the afternoon, well that's a different story. Or how about speeding in neighborhood streets? Very difficult to get any police patrolling a neighborhood where kids are playing. But guess that's too much to ask.

It falls under YMMV. The highways have OHP to patrol them. They don't patrol city streets and neighborhoods. However, I see plenty of city police patrolling neighborhoods around here, and setting up speed traps. Especially when school is in session.

It falls under YMMV. The highways have OHP to patrol them. They don't patrol city streets and neighborhoods. However, I see plenty of city police patrolling neighborhoods around here, and setting up speed traps. Especially when school is in session.

Ive actually noticed quite a few for the last few weeks , OHP making stops on city streets, which I've found to be really strange.

Ive actually noticed quite a few for the last few weeks , OHP making stops on city streets, which I've found to be really strange.

City streets or state highways running through the city?

OHP = All Roads, All Codes. They can and do make traffic stops on city streets.

OHP = All Roads, All Codes. They can and do make traffic stops on city streets.

I know they can enforce everywhere, but I've never seen OHP patrolling neighborhoods. From a traffic patrol standpoint, they tend to stay on the highways in my experience, and leave the neighborhoods to city police.

It falls under YMMV. The highways have OHP to patrol them. They don't patrol city streets and neighborhoods. However, I see plenty of city police patrolling neighborhoods around here, and setting up speed traps. Especially when school is in session.
Edmond PD, OKCPD, OKC Sheriffs, Norman PD, and Logan County Sheriffs all patrol the highways. Most of the motorcycle cops are OKCPD. They aren't highway patrol. The police should not be allowed to conduct traffic stops on the highways and should stay on the streets and neighborhood roads and let the OHP handle the highways. But that doesn't happen.

Further more, cities like Nichols Hills, Deer Creek, Mustang, etc. should have the OKC Sheriffs patrol those areas and the outlying areas.

So far, the only cities I have seen police patrol in is Los Angeles and Edmond. I support it. Especially in the morning or around 4-5 when there are kids out.

City streets or state highways running through the city?

I've been seeing them up and down Penn , Western, and May as far in as 89th to the south and as far as 59th to the north.

I constantly see a Sherriffs car at the I240 and I 44 junction as well..

https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2016TRAN0166-001165?WT.cg_n=HootSuite

But speed kills so lets make sure all of these cops are out protecting us from these horrible speeders!

OHP = All Roads, All Codes. They can and do make traffic stops on city streets.

I've never seen them do it and I've even tested it to see if they would pull me over and all I got was a dirty look.

Further more, cities like Nichols Hills, Deer Creek, Mustang, etc. should have the OKC Sheriffs patrol those areas and the outlying areas.

So far, the only cities I have seen police patrol in is Los Angeles and Edmond. I support it. Especially in the morning or around 4-5 when there are kids out.
If by OKC Sheriff you mean the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Dept., Mustang and other outlying areas are not in Oklahoma County.

If by OKC Sheriff you mean the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Dept., Mustang and other outlying areas are not in Oklahoma County.

Yes, my bad. Oklahoma County Sheriff. Mustang would have whatever county's sheriffs they lie under, patrol their streets. They just seem too small to need a police force. A lot of cities here in SoCal do that and it's great. You don't have to worry about suddenly slowing down because you've entered another town that is hungry for money.

Yes, my bad. Oklahoma County Sheriff. Mustang would have whatever county's sheriffs they lie under, patrol their streets. They just seem too small to need a police force.

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Good one.

So, assuming you were serious (there's no possible way you were), 20,000 people and a 32% yearly growth in population is "too small" to merit a police force in your world. What IS the magic number to merit a police force?

Mustang has a police force, but last I heard, it was like 20 or so officers, so not a huge one.

I think some people would do well to understand that traffic infractions are not the same as crime. Speeding is not a crime unless associated with reckless driving.

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Good one.

So, assuming you were serious (there's no possible way you were), 20,000 people and a 32% yearly growth in population is "too small" to merit a police force in your world. What IS the magic number to merit a police force?

I'm talking about land.

Calabasas has 24,153 people and it has no police force. So my world is the real world here. Perhaps before going off like that, do some research man. :)

http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/departments/sheriff.html

I'm talking about land.

Calabasas has 24,153 people and it has no police force. So my world is the real world here. Perhaps before going off like that, do some research man. :)

http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/departments/sheriff.html

Mustang is becoming a very densely populated area. Small in land area and almost completely populated. Don't see how Mustang can build many more additions. But Mustang has had a police force for a long time. It's population isn't that far behind Yukon.

I think some people would do well to understand that traffic infractions are not the same as crime. Speeding is not a crime unless associated with reckless driving.
I think most people understand that. The issue is that it is still illegal to disobey traffic laws and there are consequences for not doing so.

I think most people understand that. The issue is that it is still illegal to disobey traffic laws and there are consequences for not doing so.

There are 'consequences' with everything in life. The question simply is.... are you okay with the potential consequences. As for speeding (not reckless driving, not inattentive driving, not texting and driving - just speeding - say 1-15mph over the posted limit) the direct consequence can be a ticket. If you're okay with a ticket then you made an informed choice to take that chance. No idea what to tell anyone who would take issue with that.

I've never seen them do it and I've even tested it to see if they would pull me over and all I got was a dirty look.

I think the severity of the infraction probably makes the difference between getting dirty looks and a traffic stop. Also, since they're usually not assigned to patrol city streets. I think the stops they make on city streets are what they just happen to come across while off the highways. That may be why you don't see it very often.

OHP = All Roads, All Codes. They can and do make traffic stops on city streets.

Yeah, there is an OHP that often sets up on SE 44 between I-35 and Classen.

... If you consider disobeying traffic laws to be civil disobedience, I just don't know what to say. Your comments don't surprise me in the least.

First, try taking some of your own advice about not putting words in one's mouth. My comment on civil disobedience was clearly in regard to your juvenile comment about labeling one's self as a law abiding citizen.

Regardless it falls broadly under many published definitions.

My comments regarding speeding 1-15 MPH over the posted limited shouldn't surprise anyone regardless who is making the statements. It's a non-issue - except to those who apparently want to make issues simply for the sake of it.

Pete, can we have a thread titled "Going on and on and on and on and on and on and on about how cool/stupid speeding is" and just move these types of posts there and leave the umpteen other threads that have degenerated into such available for on-topic conversation? Please?

Pete, can we have a thread titled "Going on and on and on and on and on and on and on about how cool/stupid speeding is" and just move these types of posts there and leave the umpteen other threads that have degenerated into such available for on-topic conversation? Please?

Yeah, because you didn't go off topic at all. Put on your big girl panties.

I think the severity of the infraction probably makes the difference between getting dirty looks and a traffic stop. Also, since they're usually not assigned to patrol city streets. I think the stops they make on city streets are what they just happen to come across while off the highways. That may be why you don't see it very often.


Yeah, there is an OHP that often sets up on SE 44 between I-35 and Classen.

That code needs to be changed then. Why do we need 3 different agencies patrolling the same areas?

First, try taking some of your own advice about not putting words in one's mouth. My comment on civil disobedience was clearly in regard to your juvenile comment about labeling one's self as a law abiding citizen.

Regardless it falls broadly under many published definitions.

My comments regarding speeding 1-15 MPH over the posted limited shouldn't surprise anyone regardless who is making the statements. It's a non-issue - except to those who apparently want to make issues simply for the sake of it.
I made my point and I consider it to be legitimate. You obviously disagree and that is your right. You won't change my mind and I won't change your mind so there is nothing more to say about it.

I'm talking about land.

Calabasas has 24,153 people and it has no police force. So my world is the real world here. Perhaps before going off like that, do some research man. :)

http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/departments/sheriff.html

Calabasis also doesn't have any residents worth less than a few million (unless you count the scum that rent the 2,500sf pool houses, but they're going to land that tv commercial gig real soon!). The biggest crimes that go down in that part of the hills are nothing less than white collar.

I saw 2 in the blind spot right before the S-bound nw23rd exit laser tagging cars on 235. Made me wonder why they weren't issuing tickets on the new 25mph limit ON 23rd at. People still doing 45-50 on the reg with lit pedestrian crossings a half mile apart.

I'm talking about land.

Calabasas has 24,153 people and it has no police force. So my world is the real world here. Perhaps before going off like that, do some research man. :)

http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/departments/sheriff.html

They may not have their own police force, but that's not to say there are no police there - they contract with the LA County Sheriff's Department.
"All police and fire services are provided to residents through contract with the Los Angeles County Sheriffs Department and Consolidated Fire Protection District of Los Angeles County. The City receives fire protection and paramedic services as well as wild land fire protection and forester tree service from the Department of Forestry and Fire Warden."

Calabasis also doesn't have any residents worth less than a few million (unless you count the scum that rent the 2,500sf pool houses, but they're going to land that tv commercial gig real soon!). The biggest crimes that go down in that part of the hills are nothing less than white collar.

I'm very familiar with Calabasas as I live there on the weekends outside of school. There is plenty of action especially in Old Town Calabasas. I fail to see the difference. I'm sure there are other communities who don't have a police force that have lower income families and individuals.

My point is that I believe resources could be saved, money could go elsewhere to create better place making, lighting, and infrastructure, and the area would still be patrolled and would be safe. That would also give the Sheriffs something better to do than sit on the side of the highway trying to seize marijuana and patrol areas the OKCPD already patrol.

Do you not agree with me though? I think it would be smarter for certain cities to save their resources and spend it elsewhere.

They may not have their own police force, but that's not to say there are no police there - they contract with the LA County Sheriff's Department.
"All police and fire services are provided to residents through contract with the Los Angeles County Sheriffs Department and Consolidated Fire Protection District of Los Angeles County. The City receives fire protection and paramedic services as well as wild land fire protection and forester tree service from the Department of Forestry and Fire Warden."I know. That's what I'm saying some areas like Nichols Hills, Forest Park, or Valley Brook should have. I'd even think Mustang would be a good fit for it as the land area is small enough, but maybe not. . .idk. Just a thought really.

I saw 2 in the blind spot right before the S-bound nw23rd exit laser tagging cars on 235. Made me wonder why they weren't issuing tickets on the new 25mph limit ON 23rd at. People still doing 45-50 on the reg with lit pedestrian crossings a half mile apart.

Because the speeders on 235 are low-hanging fruit, easy, and they can make more money on them, most likely, without the hassle of trying to stop people on 23rd. Cops will take the easy money any day rather than get in the city and actually enforce dangerous traffic activities (red light running, speeding on 23rd, etc.).

Speaking of 23rd, we were on our way home eastbound and slowed to 27 in the 25-mph zone. People were whipping around us like we were standing still. It's going to be very hard to get people more in a pedestrian-oriented mindset if law enforcement isn't involved, I'm afraid.

^^^^^^^
The street is going to have to be reconfigured there to make lower speed feel more natural and intuitive. Right now the street tells you to do 40, so people are going to do 40. Cops or no cops.

Speaking of 23rd, we were on our way home eastbound and slowed to 27 in the 25-mph zone. People were whipping around us like we were standing still. It's going to be very hard to get people more in a pedestrian-oriented mindset if law enforcement isn't involved, I'm afraid.

I was almost mowed down by someone speeding south on Broadway yesterday crossing the street from Cultivar to Plenty Mercantile.... They had to be doing at least 40 through there.

I was just passing one of the new signs they put up that say it's a state law to yield to a pedestrian in the crosswalk and pointed at them but they never even slowed a bit. The car that was following stopped about 25 feet from the crosswalk and yielded to us thankfully.

Motorcycle cops have been nabbing people on the Kilpatrick Turnpike in the mornings lately. Mainly the eastbound lanes coming from Yukon to Edmond. Seems like they pick 1 or 2 days per week and are pulling people over left and right (including me once - warning).

They have a good spot on the EB service road along the Kilpatrick between Western and Santa Fe. Seen them nabbing speeders there a lot.

I was almost mowed down by someone speeding south on Broadway yesterday crossing the street from Cultivar to Plenty Mercantile.... They had to be doing at least 40 through there.

I was just passing one of the new signs they put up that say it's a state law to yield to a pedestrian in the crosswalk and pointed at them but they never even slowed a bit. The car that was following stopped about 25 feet from the crosswalk and yielded to us thankfully.

It's the same with the giant white stripey crossings as well. I think it all has to do with people living in a city where the car is not only King. It's the master and commander of all it surveys.

This is quite evident on our newest streets like western ave district, Broadway (although it just be re-striping of paint), and plaza. Absolutely NO consideration for bikes. I boo the western district the most as all the precedence is given to more parking, chicanes, and befuddlingly over complicated sidewalks with 0 consideration for cyclists.

If the 23rd st or classen corridors get a makeover regarding parking and layout it would be an incredible opportunity to start stepping in the direction of multi-modal transportation in this city. There's an entire lane on the south side of 23rd that's practically useless due to parallel street parking that's sparsely used.

I was almost mowed down by someone speeding south on Broadway yesterday crossing the street from Cultivar to Plenty Mercantile.... They had to be doing at least 40 through there.

I was just passing one of the new signs they put up that say it's a state law to yield to a pedestrian in the crosswalk and pointed at them but they never even slowed a bit. The car that was following stopped about 25 feet from the crosswalk and yielded to us thankfully.

Just start walking out into the crosswalk, pointing at the car that is coming while you're doing it, keep walking until you get close enough to scare the sh*t out of them. They'll either stop then or they'll stop the next time, just don't get run over, works almost every time when they think you won't stop and they're going to hit you.

That sounds like a terrible idea.

Just start walking out into the crosswalk, pointing at the car that is coming while you're doing it, keep walking until you get close enough to scare the sh*t out of them. They'll either stop then or they'll stop the next time, just don't get run over, works almost every time when they think you won't stop and they're going to hit you.

And the time it doesn't work you get clobbered by a speeding car, you then happen to sue and win, at least you have enough money to pay for your diaper to be changed since you were paralyzed from the chest down. No thanks

And the time it doesn't work and you get clobbered by a speeding car, you then happen to sue and win, at least you will have enough money to pay for your diaper to be changed since you were paralyzed from the chest down. No thanks

If you're dumb enough to *actually* step knowingly in front of a car, you deserve what you get. The "works almost every time" means that "works almost every time unless they just blow by you like a**holes", which was implied above in the "get close enough to scare the sh*t out of them" part. I've used this maneuver about 200 times in the past and never gotten hit because I'm smart enough to get close to them, but not WALK INTO THEIR PATH. :doh:

If you're dumb enough to *actually* step knowingly in front of a car, you deserve what you get. The "works almost every time" means that "works almost every time unless they just blow by you like a**holes", which was implied above in the "get close enough to scare the sh*t out of them" part. I've used this maneuver about 200 times in the past and never gotten hit because I'm smart enough to get close to them, but not WALK INTO THEIR PATH. :doh:

The problem is people going down a tight street like Broadway with all those cars parked along there, speeding at 40mph or better, already are familiar with that street because they're comfortable with it enough to go that fast and thus you can bet that they just don't give a crap about crosswalks or speed limits or anyone crossing the street there. Pointing to a sign isn't going to do anything for them. Remember when trying to make a point in this instance, you're the one without the protection of a car around you. It's too bad.

Well maybe next time I'm crossing the street down there I will keep a few marbles handy in my pocket.... Then when the idiot that thinks they are above the law goes flying by me.... One of those marbles will just ;) "accidentally" ;) slip out of my pocket and hit their windshield..... *OOPS*

Yeah... I can't really do something that irresponsible but the thought of doing it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. :Smiley122

I think that the crosswalks need to be emphasized even more. Or have them raised causing a speed bump. I see people flying down Broadway frequently, there needs to be more incentive to move a few blocks east and hop on the highway if you want to drive fast.

The lane striping done a couple of years ago needs to be formalized with curb extensions or something like large planters and reflective pylons. The second southbound lane desperately needs to be re-striped as a turn lane, which could be capped at intersections with a refuge island (which could also be made of planters). Unfortunately continental (zebra-striped) crosswalks are really needed on Broadway, but are near-impossible to do because of the stamped concrete intersections, the retention of which is pretty non-negotiable to Automobile Alley stakeholders (the current hardscape dates back to the recovery from the Murrah bombing and Team 2 recommendations). There are also ADA problems with the existing crosswalks, which were done as a part of that 1999 streetscape. What DESPERATELY needs to happen is signalization at 8th, or even better, all-way stops at every intersection (sorry, speeders).

I've held my tongue a bit on the "state law...yield to pedestrians in crosswalk" paddle signs because I know who pushed for them, and they are very well-intentioned. They HAVE succeeded in slowing down traffic to a great extent, and they are great for public awareness that Broadway is a pedestrian zone. So lots of people are now driving differently there. Unfortunately, not everybody. Which is why I am afraid that in some ways it has actually made Broadway MORE dangerous. The signs now embolden some pedestrians to throw caution to the wind and essentially dare cars to hit them. The car is going to win that contest. And despite the fact that it SAYS state law (this is actually a stock sign, and doesn't speak to Oklahoma law specifically), a police officer would totally fault the pedestrian if they straight walked out in front of a car. And really, it doesn't matter, because you don't want the resulting accident to happen to begin with.

The thing that makes it ESPECIALLY dangerous is the lighting on Broadway. When we did the streetscape we were very proud of the historic-themed light posts with metal halide lamps. They put off a brilliant white light, which is much more pleasant than the sickly yellow glow that comes from the sodium lamps of that period (the 1990s). The thing that I have come to understand since is that those lights create a pretty unsafe/harsh environment, as they shine directly into the retinas of oncoming drivers, essentially blinding them to the sidewalk and the crosswalks. I myself have had pedestrians walk out in front of me on Broadway since the paddles were installed, and despite my knowledge of the nature of the street AND proceeding with care, I STILL came way closer to striking someone than I'd like, because I simply couldn't see their dark silhouettes in the middle of the street. Night times are very dangerous on Broadway, in my opinion.

If you want to see what I'm talking about, drive down Broadway and THEN drive down Film Row and pay attention to how much easier it is to see the sidewalks, the street and the buildings, because the P180-type lights used there DIRECT LIGHT AT THOSE OBJECTS rather than at your eye. Seriously, Broadway needs new lighting more than almost any other improvement.

Of course, much of the above post will be rendered moot when the streetcar comes through and changes the way the lanes and parking are configured along Broadway.

Thanks for the very informative post, Urbanized, as always... One thing that I thought about that might help is to put flashing lights on the signs and in the crosswalks, as Edmond has done in some of its school zones, but I'm not sure how practical it would be or if we have the money to do that (answer to the second question is "probably not", though) or if they are that effective.

The raised crosswalk (not just a speed bump, but the entire crosswalk raised above street level) is also a good idea, would most likely be effective, would seem to alleviate ADA concerns (since they're at sidewalk level) as a bonus, but again, not sure we have the money to do it.

If you're dumb enough to *actually* step knowingly in front of a car, you deserve what you get. The "works almost every time" means that "works almost every time unless they just blow by you like a**holes", which was implied above in the "get close enough to scare the sh*t out of them" part. I've used this maneuver about 200 times in the past and never gotten hit because I'm smart enough to get close to them, but not WALK INTO THEIR PATH. :doh:

You're right. That's what people do here. People in OKC will learn to do it as well. Sometimes you have to be aggressive. Throwing marbles at a windshield though, I'd be afraid someone would come back and shoot me. That's a really good way to enrage someone.

I took this shot about 10 minutes ago. OHP on N. Western just north of 178th.

12775

^^^

Sure wish he had been working 23rd Street between Lottie and MLK today at lunch... He could have ticketed the Edmond Police officer that was speeding, changing lanes without signaling, and straddling the centerline, in front of me today.

Seeing law enforcement officers breaking traffic laws irritates me more than seeing civilians doing it.

^^^

Sure wish he had been working 23rd Street between Lottie and MLK today at lunch... He could have ticketed the Edmond Police officer that was speeding, changing lanes without signaling, and straddling the centerline, in front of me today.

Seeing law enforcement officers breaking traffic laws irritates me more than seeing civilians doing it.

OKBBQEA,
I agree except for one thing, if the officer had been called to a scene of a problem (wreck, domestic violence, et al), they have the authority (and should have) to "bend the rules" to reach their destination. If it was just some cocky "cop" using his position of authority to hurry off to lunch, I've got a problem. But how do we know? I don't have a clue.
C. T.

OKBBQEA,
I agree except for one thing, if the officer had been called to a scene of a problem (wreck, domestic violence, et al), they have the authority (and should have) to "bend the rules" to reach their destination. If it was just some cocky "cop" using his position of authority to hurry off to lunch, I've got a problem. But how do we know? I don't have a clue.
C. T.

If they are in emergency mode, their sirens and lights need to reflect that. If they are concerned about making a surprise entrance at a crime scene or suspected crime in action, they can turn their lights off once they are few blocks away.

OKBBQEA,
I agree except for one thing, if the officer had been called to a scene of a problem (wreck, domestic violence, et al), they have the authority (and should have) to "bend the rules" to reach their destination. .

Agree for the most part, they should at least have their lights on if in emergency mode, but an Edmond cop cruising down SE 23rd in Oklahoma City at lunch hour is enough of a clue for me that he wasn't on an emergency call..... a booty call maybe... but they would have surely had a unit in closer proximity than this unit was.