Why so skeptical? Over the last (roughly) 10 years OKC has added 2 skyscrapers, Omni, convention center, scissortail park, each district has grown so much. Is Strawberry Fields that far from reality?

I think it has to do with how long we have known about this plan where literally nothing has happened. The first post on this thread was 4 years ago.

I suppose it's more of cautious optimism with the economy and the whole Covid-19 situation. It does take some years to recover from a pandemic this deadly.

Kind of tired of hearing anything about Strawberry until we see something done. All they've done is paid a ton of money for property and ask people for investment money and flash a few fancy renderings.

They have 3 “active” projects they are building which are pretty small sized developments yet no physical movement on them since they were announced years ago.

They have 3 “active” projects they are building which are pretty small sized developments yet no physical movement on them since they were announced years ago.

Actions speak and the first real action is filing for building permits and that hasn't happened on any of their properties.


Loads and loads of developers put together renderings and even make announcements in the hope they can find tenants *then* build. But once building permits are filed, they have actual plans drawn and hard money has been spent.


Really hope they do all types of great things with all this property, but this is a very clear distinction (actual action vs. promotion) that few understand and this site is the only place where that sort of thing is monitored and reported on.

^^^ oh you know which 3 developments I’m referring to? For some reason I thought they had filed for permits they just never built anything. So this entity isn’t filed a single building permit for anything?

Speculative renderings and designs are just that, speculative. I’ve seen enough throughout the last ten-15 years to know, never get your hopes up until money is secured and dirt starts turning.

Thanks Pete.

This is definitely going to take a long time to develop but given its size and OKC's slow & steady growth trends I wouldn't be shocked if its somewhere between 10-20% developed in 10 years. To me that's fine because good things take time. The biggest draw imo is its location. Walking distance from Scissortail, Myriad Gardens, Omni, Convention Center, The Peake, West Village Area, and the CBD.

I did more digging and it looks like this is in fact the current masterplan.
( https://www.strawberryfieldsok.com/our-vision )

With all due respect, good things seem to take an extra long amount of time in OKC. Having gone through the filing process with our city, I feel like that is one big reason why construction takes so long. Every single nook and cranny is checked by inspectors are multiple levels throughout the building process and there's no rhyme or reason on how one inspector considers passing versus failing. As one inspector told me once, it depends who you get and if they are in a good mood. If you fail an inspection, you can end up waiting up to 2-3 weeks before they come out again. By the end of the process, you don't even want to think about building/renovating anything else simply to avoid the entire process. I'm all for safety measures, but it seems to be overkill here in OKC. And no, it's not the same everywhere, cause we are dealing with permits in Dallas and it's a lot easier and faster.

With all due respect, good things seem to take an extra long amount of time in OKC. Having gone through the filing process with our city, I feel like that is one big reason why construction takes so long. Every single nook and cranny is checked by inspectors are multiple levels throughout the building process and there's no rhyme or reason on how one inspector considers passing versus failing. As one inspector told me once, it depends who you get and if they are in a good mood. If you fail an inspection, you can end up waiting up to 2-3 weeks before they come out again. By the end of the process, you don't even want to think about building/renovating anything else simply to avoid the entire process. I'm all for safety measures, but it seems to be overkill here in OKC. And no, it's not the same everywhere, cause we are dealing with permits in Dallas and it's a lot easier and faster.

THIS is what’s up. I got that tshirt.

With all due respect, good things seem to take an extra long amount of time in OKC. Having gone through the filing process with our city, I feel like that is one big reason why construction takes so long. Every single nook and cranny is checked by inspectors are multiple levels throughout the building process and there's no rhyme or reason on how one inspector considers passing versus failing. As one inspector told me once, it depends who you get and if they are in a good mood. If you fail an inspection, you can end up waiting up to 2-3 weeks before they come out again. By the end of the process, you don't even want to think about building/renovating anything else simply to avoid the entire process. I'm all for safety measures, but it seems to be overkill here in OKC. And no, it's not the same everywhere, cause we are dealing with permits in Dallas and it's a lot easier and faster.

I would agree that developments seem to take an extra long time but I don't know enough about the inspection process you laid out to really comment on it. Having dealt with other City offices, I could totally see that being the case though. I get to work on many large and small projects in OKC and see the financials behind them. The truth no one from here really likes talking about is that many times these projects (especially the bigger ones) are simply too risky to take on and the bigger local lenders are reluctant to loosen up. When you really dig into the metrics OKC is not as appealing to investors as one would think given all the progress the city has made. We boast many things that look appealing on the surface such as really low unemployment rates and a cheap cost of living but we also have an average income drastically lower than the national average. Our population grows consistently but we do so extremely slowly. Could we be one of those cities that has a big boom in the coming decade or two? Possibly. Things can change quickly but looking at the past can be a great indicator for the future and OKC's past is one that's been pretty consistent on this front.

Something that hurts Strawberry Fields, the OAK, and the Producer's District is that we already have an extremely soft office market that doesn't really show signs of getting much better in the near future. Things change fast so they COULD get better but I wouldn't necessarily project it to. Retail nationally is hurting so we aren't alone there by any means. The weed shops actually do help since they pay ridiculous rents that far exceed typical market rents so that's good I guess. Something that does bode well for this development is that contrary to what some believe, most of the multifamily developments in the general downtown area are not struggling. I have personally seen rent rolls/average occupancy and retention rates for many of the multifamily developments downtown and most of them are at stabilized occupancy with only a few exceptions. It is becoming more competitive and one new trend I've seen is the emergence of concessions like a month of free rent.

I completely understand the general consensus of skepticism for this development but in my opinion, there is plenty demand for mid-rise housing here. Is there enough to justify building a 15-20 story apartment/condo building right now? Probably not. I won't even go as far to say that a mid-rise residential building would for sure be successful but from everything I can gauge I think that they'd have a good shot at getting it leased up pretty swiftly if the price points are right. I think if they can successfully develop housing here it will kick start the rest of this development. I'd also be willing to bet that they've had interest on the three developments but no one ready to pull the trigger due to the current state of the area. I encourage you all to drive through this area in the coming week, what you will see is a bunch of unoccupied dilapidated structures and many homeless people sleeping in the nooks and cranny's (no offense meant, just an observation). Many people wouldn't even consider walking through here in the middle of the day because whether it's actually safe or not, it doesn't ~feel~ safe.

Some new images on their website.

Looks like the development at the corner of the boulevard and Hudson will be called Parkside Retreat.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120b.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120c.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120d.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120e.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120f.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120g.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120h.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120i.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120j.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120k.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/strawberry053120l.jpg

Love the images of course. Here's to hoping much of this will happen over time.

Pete, have you had a chance to talk to anyone affiliated with Strawberry Fields, to try to get an update for the timing of their projects?

I know they are required to develop the lot at the boulevard and Hudson in the very near future. This is part of an agreement with the city when they did a land swap.

Who knows on the rest. I know they have been trying to partner with other developers to start on some of these but there have been no permits or anything that would indicate anything is imminent.

It's astounding to me that we just spent months reconstructing S Walker Ave from SW 25 to Reno and we couldn't build sidewalks as a part of it. A block away from our beautiful $139 million park. Along a bus route. Maybe someone in Public Works knows something we don't and Strawberry Fields will be magically finished in 6 months, thus giving the city government an excuse for why sidewalks here could wait. That would be a nice surprise.

Anyway, the picture is looking north from SW 5 and Walker.

^

When those properties are redeveloped, the owners will be required to install sidewalks.

Some ominous news for this development:

Tax liens have been placed on 93 of the 97 properties owned by Strawberry Fields LLC.

They have not paid the 2019 property taxes on any of those 93 properties, with a total owed of over $200,000.

Color me surprised

The virus is going to be blamed for everything but these taxes are from 2019, before the pandemic.

This group has yet to do anything other than tear down dozens of structures.

That's what we get when someone with far more enthusiasm than development experience is allowed to grab huge tracks of property in an important district. Assuming I'm remembering the history of this right, that is.

The virus is going to be blamed for everything but these taxes are from 2019, before the pandemic.

This group has yet to do anything other than tear down dozens of structures.

Wouldn't 2019 taxes be paid in 2020 (during the pandemic)? Not saying that you are wrong, by any means. Just trying to possibly give SOME benefit of the doubt to the owners.

Isn't it that you can pay half in December and the rest in March if required.

Isn't it that you can pay half in December and the rest in March if required.

This is correct.

But they didn't pay anything in December or March.

I mean, is anyone surprised that this was nothing more than a slideshow of shiny new things in order to flip these properties?

That's what we get when someone with far more enthusiasm than development experience is allowed to grab huge tracks of property in an important district. Assuming I'm remembering the history of this right, that is.

allowed?

they bought the property what could have been done to "stop" them ??

I mean, is anyone surprised that this was nothing more than a slideshow of shiny new things in order to flip these properties?

Absolutely not. That has been many people's concern from the beginning.

They may need to make a deal with the city to build the MAPS4 soccer stadium here.

They'd have to take a big loss on what they've paid for land, but nobody else is going to be buying and developing for a while, then the stadium could be a springboard for more development.

Except not south side as many desire

(edit: I guess technically much of this IS south side, just not south of the river)

They may need to make a deal with the city to build the MAPS4 soccer stadium here.

They'd have to take a big loss on what they've paid for land, but nobody else is going to be buying and developing for a while, then the stadium could be a springboard for more development.

How big of a footprint would a stadium take up including parking? Also k thought the stadium was going to the fairgrounds... Is that something different?

How big of a footprint would a stadium take up including parking? Also k thought the stadium was going to the fairgrounds... Is that something different?

Yes, two different things: 1) new fairgrounds arena and 2) soccer stadium.

Both were included in MAPS 4.


As for footprint, it would be large. I could see it going more to the west then leaving the area closest to the park for residential and commercial.

allowed?

they bought the property what could have been done to "stop" them ??

Oh please, nothing like this happens in a vacuum. The city cooperated, banks cooperated, all in service to a boondoggle that couldn't even start a single construction project.

Nothing is really lost here.

Everything in that area was in bad shape so there has been no subtraction.

Just a classic case of over-promising which leads to disappointment but no real harm.

Other developments that might have actually broken ground could have been in the works in this area though, more synergy for the park when it opened. It's total speculation on my part of course, but this should have been prime real estate for something interesting aside from just Social Capital.

Other developments that might have actually broken ground could have been in the works in this area though, more synergy for the park when it opened. It's total speculation on my part of course, but this should have been prime real estate for something interesting aside from just Social Capital.

That's true but even Social Capital is really struggling. I was in there on a beautiful Sunday evening when the park was very busy and there weren't more than 30 people in the entire place.

SF has at least consolidated what were dozens of small lots and fragmented properties. Down the road, that will help the area to develop, even if they don't do the work themselves.

That's true but even Social Capital is really struggling. I was in there on a beautiful Sunday evening when the park was very busy and there weren't more than 30 people in the entire place.

SF has at least consolidated what were dozens of small lots and fragmented properties. Down the road, that will help the area to develop, even if they don't do the work themselves.

I wish crowd funding were an option. Right now only the rich can benefit. I know you can invest in a project, but it would be nice if the corporation would sale shares at say $10,000 a piece to raise capital and get these projects moving. I bet alot of middle class families would be interested in this option if strawberry field was capable of pulling it off.

Otherwise let the sale to someone that can develop the land instead of just sitting on it and making the citizen of OKC wait a decade to see something developed on it.

I wish crowd funding were an option.

I like that idea, instead of sitting on my hands hoping for something to happen in my lifetime, I’d chip in to help make it happen. Heck, I’d vote for a 5 cent sales tax increase if I could, just to see changes come 5x faster, before my kids all leave for college.

I wish crowd funding were an option. Right now only the rich can benefit. I know you can invest in a project, but it would be nice if the corporation would sale shares at say $10,000 a piece to raise capital and get these projects moving. I bet alot of middle class families would be interested in this option if strawberry field was capable of pulling it off.

Otherwise let the sale to someone that can develop the land instead of just sitting on it and making the citizen of OKC wait a decade to see something developed on it.

I agree with you and I'm wondering why or how we got away from the days when development could happen on an individual scale. If you look at the original plat for Oklahoma City, or basically any American city west of the Appalachians, you'll see tiny lots. Even in valuable urban areas those lots are much more affordable to individual professionals or small syndicates of individuals than entire city blocks. Do architects and tradesmen not want to work on smaller projects? Do city governments not like to zone for or approve those sorts of projects? Maybe banks won't lend for them? It's genuinely baffling, because places where that style of development has been preserved are universally more pleasant for pedestrians and more economically vibrant. Even when block-scale or half-block-scale developments include ground-floor retail (and they all too often don't, in our neck of the woods), they are but a shallow imitation of the real thing.

I wish crowd funding were an option. Right now only the rich can benefit. I know you can invest in a project, but it would be nice if the corporation would sale shares at say $10,000 a piece to raise capital and get these projects moving. I bet alot of middle class families would be interested in this option if strawberry field was capable of pulling it off.

Otherwise let the sale to someone that can develop the land instead of just sitting on it and making the citizen of OKC wait a decade to see something developed on it.

Somewhat of a different situation than you're talking about, but I think we'll eventually see several concert venues saved in this way once the pandemic is over.

I wish crowd funding were an option. Right now only the rich can benefit. I know you can invest in a project, but it would be nice if the corporation would sale shares at say $10,000 a piece to raise capital and get these projects moving. I bet alot of middle class families would be interested in this option if strawberry field was capable of pulling it off.

Otherwise let the sale to someone that can develop the land instead of just sitting on it and making the citizen of OKC wait a decade to see something developed on it.

As much as I like the idea, and would find a way to invest also : unfortunately, I feel it just gets too many hands in the pot. People with no commercial investment experience thinking because they chipped in 10K that they have some control or say in the project. After everyone gets their say we end up with a development that looks like this

https://i0.wp.com/www.uncoveringoklahoma.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/2017-07-06-Poe-Bouyz-House-02.jpg

I wish crowd funding were an option. Right now only the rich can benefit. I know you can invest in a project, but it would be nice if the corporation would sale shares at say $10,000 a piece to raise capital and get these projects moving. I bet alot of middle class families would be interested in this option if strawberry field was capable of pulling it off.

Otherwise let the sale to someone that can develop the land instead of just sitting on it and making the citizen of OKC wait a decade to see something developed on it.

You're better off investing $10,000 elsewhere. GIving money to a group who is paying a high premium for non-income producing property, sitting on it for who knows how long and then having to pay good money for new construction in an area that isnt well developed or mature isnt going to make for a good investment. Not to mention the developer fees you'll be paying out of that $10,000. Feel bad for anyone who has invested here. Going to be a long time until a payoff.

You're better off investing $10,000 elsewhere. GIving money to a group who is paying a high premium for non-income producing property, sitting on it for who knows how long and then having to pay good money for new construction in an area that isnt well developed or mature isnt going to make for a good investment. Not to mention the developer fees you'll be paying out of that $10,000. Feel bad for anyone who has invested here. Going to be a long time until a payoff.

:Smiley173

I mean, is anyone surprised that this was nothing more than a slideshow of shiny new things in order to flip these properties?

CORRECTION :

..... .. a slideshow of shiny new things in order to TRY TO flip these properties

I wish this project will be taken over by top developers such as Simmons Property Group or The Cordish Companies.

Steve had some info on his live chat seemingly from Pat regarding the property taxes. She stated that essentially yes they’re behind and they have a plan in place to get it taken care of. The other interesting thing is the Parkside Retreat parcel is apparently going to have 174 condos if anything ends up happening there. There’s a lot of IF’s with this but just wanted to pass along the info. See Steve’s live chat for the exact dialogue.
(https://oklahoman.com/article/5671861/okc-central-chat-with-steve-lackmeyer)

I hope the tax situation is soon resolved but what else are they going to say other than 'we are in the process of working it out'?

As far as the old Goodwill parcel, that is owned my Mazaheri after bringing suit against the city for what he said was inequitable payment for property they took for Scissortail Park. It's not owned by the Strawberry Fields group outright like 97 other properties on the west side of the park, although there seems to be some degree of cooperation between the two groups. When Mazaheri took ownership from the city, he was contractually obligated to develop the property in a short period of time. I posted a while back that the plan has always been for mid-rise condos. And Mazaheri has paid all his property taxes.

And BTW, that question was asked in his chat based directly on info only researched and reported here, but Lackmeyer often edits out any reference to OKCTalk before posting a question in a petulant act of hostility. Many questions in his chat originate from work done on this site and it is never credited.

I really need to start fact-checking his chats.

He says:


She responds there were no liens, only delinquent 2019 taxes. If I remember correctly, a lien in the filed in the fourth year of delinquency, not the first.

This is directly from the public notice published by Oklahoma County:


Notice is hereby given that, under authority and
direction of O.S., Title 68, § 3101 et seq., the
hereinafter described lands, lots, tracts and parcels
of real estate, all situated in Oklahoma County,
Oklahoma, now has a tax lien for unpaid ad valorem
taxes and/or special assessments. Further, if the
lien remains unpaid for a period of three years or
more, as of the date such taxes first became due
and payable, this property will be sold at public
auction unless the delinquent taxes, interest and
penalty are paid in full prior to the time of the tax
sale.

I wonder how she knows so little about the tax law.

I wonder how she knows so little about the tax law.

i wonder how the downtown reporter allows people to mislead his subscribers

I really need to start fact-checking his chats.

He says:



This is directly from the public notice published by Oklahoma County:

To be fair, he's writing in a chat, not for an article, and he says "if I remember correctly," so he's not stating its the 100% fact. Also, he's got the general gist of it; I'd presume he's mixing up the term lien and the subsequent sheriff's sale. Looking at the definition, he's only off 1 year. That's definitely not something you'd expect the average person to know by heart.

To be fair, he's writing in a chat, not for an article, and he says "if I remember correctly," so he's not stating its the 100% fact. Also, he's got the general gist of it; I'd presume he's mixing up the term lien and the subsequent sheriff's sale. Looking at the definition, he's only off 1 year. That's definitely not something you'd expect the average person to know by heart.

His chat transcripts get published just like an article and I doubt the average person makes much of a distinction.

As I reporter, if you don't know you shouldn't make a statement. And you absolutely should not be posting statements from someone else without doing your own research and context, which he does ALL the time.

And the gist of what he wrote was that this was no big deal, no tax liens when there are for 93 properties. So the premise is completely wrong and based on protecting a developer who has fed stories to him. And he contradicted accurate and detailed work I had painstakingly researched and documented, which is why the question was asked in the first place.


This goes far beyond this one chat and when you spread disinformation of your own or from someone else (again, happens ALL the time) you should be corrected and called out.

Getting correct information out should always be a priority over a 'friendship' and this is where the OKC Twitter Clique does our community a terrible disservice. He is never held accountable and instead because he is corrupt in a way that benefits many of his apologists, we are left with good ol' boy PR instead of honest, fact-based reporting.

The way he has covered this development (and many others where he befriends his subjects in order to be fed stories and does nothing but PR in return) and then written about it is a classic case in point.

There are so many other examples and people generally know -- especially the ones who willingly manipulate him -- but most benefit and thus continue to exploit. This is all very bad for OKC.

Based on your statements, I can't tell if they are one year behind or three years behind?

If this is year three when do they hit year four and what specifically triggers the auction?
When they reach year four, if they pay year one, does that kick the can down the road for another year? If not, can they stay right at that three-year mark and just pay taxes just in time every year.

Also, please don't get in the mud. Your work speaks for itself. If you take the high road and keep doing great reporting people will understand where to get .

Based on your statements, I can't tell if they are one year behind or three years behind?

If this is year three when do they hit year four and what specifically triggers the auction?
When they reach year four, if they pay year one, does that kick the can down the road for another year? If not, can they stay right at that three-year mark and just pay taxes just in time every year..

They never paid the 2019 taxes, so they are behind one year. There are now tax liens on 93 of their 97 properties, implemented earlier this month.

If this current lien is not resolved by the 3rd anniversary (which in this case will be Sept. 2023) then the properties will be sold at sheriff's sale. With the lien in place, there are issues in getting financing and selling the property, as the lien would have to be first resolved.


The important thing in all this is that they are behind and owe the county a bunch of money. Over 70% of property taxes are used to fund public education. And of course, this is a signal that they are having financial problems -- hope they get it worked out.

Also, please don't get in the mud. Your work speaks for itself. If you take the high road and keep doing great reporting people will understand where to get .

You are right and I let 99.8% of this stuff go; people would be absolutely shocked to know a lot of what goes on; there has to be a limit.


And I will say it's a very odd dynamic in OKC that people *hate* confrontation and thus it allows for all types of craziness by people willing to test then fully exploit that; and it is detrimental to the community.

I've asked a lot of the leaders in this city, "If something terrible was happening in OKC, how would we know?" The universal response: 'We wouldn't'.

I try and do my part (TEEMCO, Farmer's Bank) but the Oklahoma uses their ample power and platform to first promote then protect lots of corruption.

This could mean absolutely nothing at all, but it appears the Strawberry Fields Website is no more. (https://www.strawberryfieldsok.com/)

it at least means that whoever is managing their IT is not on the ball

Sometimes that happens because you stop paying your IT, which seems likely for a group that is also known to be behind on their taxes.

Yes but I've also seen people just forget. Domain renewals. SSL renewals...

I know much of that is automatic these days, but........

Assuming I'm reading the data right their domain got renewed back in April, so that part should still be good at least.

https://www.godaddy.com/whois/results.aspx?domain=strawberryfieldsok.com

It looks like they haven't paid their hosting company.