I see no problem with gated communities and I prefer them.

I see no problem with gated communities and I prefer them.

I currently live in a gated community and I can see both pluses and minuses.

Always funny to see single blocks gated off. But I guess when you live in a slum like Nichols Hills you gotta be worried about keeping the riff raff out, right?

Always funny to see single blocks gated off. But I guess when you live in a slum like Nichols Hills you gotta be worried about keeping the riff raff out, right?

Yeah, except that none of Nicols Hills is gated...

Yeah, except that none of Nicols Hills is gated...
I think he was referring to the fact that this is in Nichols Hills, and will be gated.

Always funny to see single blocks gated off. But I guess when you live in a slum like Nichols Hills you gotta be worried about keeping the riff raff out, right?

This is like condo buildings in NYC having locked doors. I guess in ,urban utopia we still have private districts which have controlled access. Those urban dwellers just want to keep the riff raff out.

This is like condo buildings in NYC having locked doors. I guess in ,urban utopia we still have private districts which have controlled access. Those urban dwellers just want to keep the riff raff out.

There's still plenty of disdain for those setups among the broader city population, fwiw.

Always funny to see single blocks gated off. But I guess when you live in a slum like Nichols Hills you gotta be worried about keeping the riff raff out, right?

Heh... reminds me of the one street of Oak Tree which is gated off from the rest of the already gated neighborhood. I went to a reception at one of those houses, and the detached pool house is larger than my 4 bedroom home.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2922/33756261731_c1bbc68017_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TqVEyB)Cumberland Drive (https://flic.kr/p/TqVEyB) by lazio85 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/77483833@N04/), on Flickr

The Great Wall of Nichols Hills:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/nh042117.jpg

That brick veneer wall borrowed from some new Del City housing addition couldn't possibly be appealing to anyone with a college degree. There's just no way.

This entire project screams of not thinking clearly and soberly. I tend to think consumers at a certain price point expect a certain fluency in good taste.

In today's paper there was an article about Nichols Hills considering possibly enacting some sort of design review ordinance.

That brick veneer wall borrowed from some new Del City housing addition couldn't possibly be appealing to anyone with a college degree. There's just no way.

This entire project screams of not thinking clearly and soberly. I tend to think consumers at a certain price point expect a certain fluency in good taste.

You nailed it. I live about 8 blocks away and I'm in awe of how ridiculous it looks everyday. :hammer:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland050618.jpg

That's just so wrong........

That's just so wrong........

And why is that?

That's just so wrong........

LOL, why? Because a developer bought up a bunch of small houses in where the land was more valuable than the houses that were on it and chose to redevelop it?

LOL, why? Because a developer bought up a bunch of small houses in where the land was more valuable than the houses that were on it and chose to redevelop it?

I think he was referring to the site plan which is straight out of suburbia: gated ONE entrance and cul-de-sac preventing through access to Western. It ruins what would otherwise be a nice infill development.

I think he was referring to the site plan which is straight out of suburbia: gated ONE entrance and cul-de-sac preventing through access to Western. It ruins what would otherwise be a nice infill development.

:yeahthat:

And yet they will sell out at some of the highest $ per sqft in the city.

Just FYI, the developers are just selling lots then it is up to the homeowners to select a builder.

$450K per lot; looks like they have sold about 7 of 23.


I know AHMM is building a home for Renzi Stone, for example.

Yes, both the developer and the builders will do just fine.

Just FYI, the developers are just selling lots then it is up to the homeowners to select a builder.

$450K per lot; looks like they have sold about 7 of 23.


I know AHMM is building a home for Renzi Stone, for example.

That explains why they sold their home and are traveling for 8-9 months...

Why has this Nichols Hills development performed so much better than another similar one, that being on 63rd Street a couple of blocks east of Pennsylvania? Pete says that this one has sold 7/23 and two are under construction, but the 63rd Street development has only one finished and two more under construction.

^

Much better location, particularly the ability to stroll over to NH Plaza.

There are lots of good places to go there now: Trader Joe's, Pop's, The Hutch, Provision Kitchen, St. Mark's and soon to be Osteria and Hopdoddy.

Why has this Nichols Hills development performed so much better than another similar one, that being on 63rd Street a couple of blocks east of Pennsylvania? Pete says that this one has sold 7/23 and two are under construction, but the 63rd Street development has only one finished and two more under construction.
The ones on 63rd are actually less visible as there isn’t an entry from 63rd. Getting onto 63rd from the development isn’t particularly easy. And, it is somewhat more isolated. It isn’t gated.

The ones on 63rd are actually less visible as there isn’t an entry from 63rd. Getting onto 63rd from the development isn’t particularly easy. And, it is somewhat more isolated. It isn’t gated.

Cumberland won’t have a Western entrance, and it won’t be gated. But it has great walkability as Pete mentioned.

I believe Cumberland will have a key-coded gate to Western so at least residents can easily walk to all the places on Western as well.

Not exactly tearing it up here.

Lots are $450K.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland090819a.jpg

Not exactly tearing it up here.

Lots are $450K.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland090819a.jpg

I always thought it was a crazy idea, $2m+ and have no yard, what’s the point?

I get people not wanting to maintain a yard but when you are paying north of $2k a month in property taxes and insurance I don’t think hiring someone is a big deal. I’d rather have younger families in small houses living here.

At least they kept access to Western!

To say this has been a disaster so far would be an understatement

Probably need to drop the price by about $100k per lot. They’d do well to move them before the Recession begins in earnest.

Probably need to drop the price by about $100k per lot. They’d do well to move them before the Recession begins in earnest.

I don't think the owner is in any financial trouble, will probably just sit on it till he can get that price.

Not exactly tearing it up here.

Lots are $450K.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland090819a.jpg

Certainly not very aware of the current real estate market they’re catering to...

There are scores of these types of projects in Dallas, LV, LA and OC that sit there and take time. These lots will fill up and this will be a great neighborhood. I just wish the road connected through to Western and wasn't gated, but I understand why they did that.

The bendy road lets you know its classy.

^^^ I thought the cul-de-sac would have been the selling point for you. ;)

The bendy road lets you know its classy.

Personally, I like the racing stripe the best.

With that door along Western they can still run marathons thru if they want lol.

This project continues to languish:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland041220a.jpg

To say this has been a disaster so far would be an understatement

This^

There have been two similar in-fill projects in NIchols Hills that have been more successful.

The first is just north of 63rd and the 2nd is along May Ave. and north of Wilshire.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberlandcourt041220b.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberlandcourt041220c.jpg

Elmhurst Court is still struggling tho. 3 of those 7 have been for sale for a long time.

One is at 1042 days on market.
One is at 164 DOM (people bought it in 2018 after it sat on market for 517 DOM, bought it for $1.45 Mill, now at $1.29 mil).
One is at 692 DOM

To say this has been a disaster so far would be an understatement

I don't think the developer expected quick sales and builds. The prices here make it a narrow market. They will do fine over time, and even longer now with the current recession and energy crash. This is a long term play and was always going to be.

Elmhurst Court is still struggling tho. 3 of those 7 have been for sale for a long time.

One is at 1042 days on market.
One is at 164 DOM (people bought it in 2018 after it sat on market for 517 DOM, bought it for $1.45 Mill, now at $1.29 mil).
One is at 692 DOM

People in OKC haven't yet bought into the idea of very expensive houses on zero or small lots in the suburbs. We are slower at acceptance of that, condos, patio homes, etc. than many other cities.

The owners/developers paid over $6 million over 10 years ago just for the homes, then spent more money on legal fees, demolition, improvements and marketing.

They sold a few lots several years ago but nothing since, long before the virus issue. They lost any sort of forward movement some time ago.

This is a massive failure by any measure.

The one on May Ave., Elmhurst Court, is not in Nichols Hills. It is Oklahoma City, in the area commonly known as West Nichols Hills. That is a big distinction for those in the area.

I recall hearing the lender took over for one of the partners in the project on the north side of 63rd Street.

The owners/developers paid over $6 million over 10 years ago just for the homes, then spent more money on legal fees, demolition, improvements and marketing.

They sold a few lots several years ago but nothing since, long before the virus issue. They lost any sort of forward movement some time ago.

This is a massive failure by any measure.

I think the virus will be the final nail in the coffin. This project will have to change.

As I mentioned earlier, you can't sell $275K lots for $450K at this stage of the credit cycle. You would need a number of very favorable tailwinds to do so.

Also, the type of person with the income necessary to afford CC isn't the type of person who cares about walking to NHP. Probably would have done much better with upscale multi-family (row houses, etc.), although I'm sure the surrounding owners would have made that difficult.

As I mentioned earlier, you can't sell $275K lots for $450K at this stage of the credit cycle. You would need a number of very favorable tailwinds to do so.

Also, the type of person with the income necessary to afford CC isn't the type of person who cares about walking to NHP. Probably would have done much better with upscale multi-family, although I'm sure the surrounding owners would have made that difficult.
Don’t know why you imply the walking part. I walk nearly every day in the area and consistently have seen more people out walking there than just about anywhere else in OKC. I see lots of families and young couples, more mature couple, all out walking. Even now. Why people want to promote this idea that somehow NH people aren’t interested in physical activity is beyond me. The park along Grand has wonderful walking trails and people use them. They walk, run, and bike heavily.

Don’t know why you imply the walking part. I walk nearly every day in the area and consistently have seen more people out walking there than just about anywhere else in OKC. I see lots of families and young couples, more mature couple, all out walking. Even now. Why people want to promote this idea that somehow NH people aren’t interested in physical activity is beyond me. The park along Grand has wonderful walking trails and people use them. They walk, run, and bike heavily.

I’m not disputing that some people in NH like to walk. I’m saying that they aren’t going to overpay for a lot just so they can walk to NHP. It’s definitely not cool enough to drive a $150k premium per lot.

I’m not disputing that some people in NH like to walk. I’m saying that they aren’t going to overpay for a lot just so they can walk to NHP. It’s definitely not cool enough to drive a $150k premium per lot.
I agree they won’t overpay. However, it’s had been selling for huge sums in NH for some time in way less developed areas. This may be a bust now, and the current economy will definitely set back any recovery, but I think the real reason is the overpaying of the properties in the first place. The developer was using the Aubrey McClendon theory of value... buy it all, make it exclusive , and eventually drive up the price. Problem is that there is too much other available stock. If NH would ever restrict tearing down the smaller older houses and property became more scarce, then it would have a chance.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/cumberland122020a.jpg

The one home on the north side of the street and closest to the camera is for sale for $1.9 million:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1115-Cumberland-Dr-Nichols-Hills-OK-73116/2083844760_zpid/

These are cool homes. They seem like garden homes but mansion style lol.

What a barren landscape.

Yeah, hard to build houses on top of trees.

Just betting from the price of the homes that when completed the landscaping will be just fine.