I think the SH 74 and US 77 interchanges will be in coordination with ODOT. I agree these need to be finished and they need to address them soon.

They announced the final alignment for the Eastern County segment.

Driving Forward OK (http://www.drivingforwardok.com/#!Northeast-Oklahoma-County-Loop-Design-Alignment-Announced/tgcb1/570ff44a0cf2e66d024e6085)

They need to add another TP that runs from 1-35 out to the new TP somewhere along NE 23rd. That would be a perfect solution to get me out to that part of the county when need be. The more major highways the better!

I listed two examples in the post you quoted Einstein.


You're a big boy. You can google it for yourself.


Don't be a simpleton.

A sample of your recent contributions. I'm curious. Are you incapable of communicating without resorting to personal insults, or are you capable but merely making the deliberate choice not to do so? I know you've already clicked the reply button (suggested insults to use against me: fool, idiot, jerk, lamebrain, or pick from your own list, you're doing great so far) but before you click the submit button, I want you to pause and think if this is really the image you're looking to project.

They need to add another TP that runs from 1-35 out to the new TP somewhere along NE 23rd. That would be a perfect solution to get me out to that part of the county when need be. The more major highways the better!One day they need to eventually connect the Dr WK Jackson Parkway and extend it to the new turnpike. I'd also like to see 39th Expressway converted to a limited access freeway but I'll be surprised if that happens before 2030.

One day they need to eventually connect the Dr WK Jackson Parkway and extend it to the new turnpike. I'd also like to see 39th Expressway converted to a limited access freeway but I'll be surprised if that happens before 2030.

I agree 100%. They need to add more east and west routes on the north sides of the city. It takes forever on 39th if you are going to Yukon. Same with NW Expressway. And it will be the same when the new east county TP is completed. It's either I-40 or Turner TP. They need a super freeway in between like maybe somewhere between NE 23rd - NE 50th. And they also need a freeway from I-44 around the Newcastle (maybe a little north) that gives us a straight shot over to Moore instead of going all the way up to 2-40 then to I-35 and back south again. Give me my Freeways!

It has nothing to do with personal hatred for turnpikes. There are countless sources for you to investigate and see the data showing how much damage unneeded roads cause. Turnpikes serve a purpose and I'm in favor of expanding toll roads intelligently and I actually think that interstates should be converted to toll roads. I have no problem with tolling the roads to keep up with maintenance and expansion. I fully expect states are going to see more of this in the future. My problem with this eastern OK extension has everything to do with the necessity and placement. Would there be such an urgent need to alleviate I-35 traffic if it wasn't 2 lanes from I-44 to ~ 23rd St.? Or what if there were better interchanges as supposed to having both left and right entrance/exit ramps and cloverleafs major junctions? There's so many other things they could do to improve mobility before building a turnpike through Choctaw.

Now that you mention it...eliminating 18-wheeler traffic on I-35 from I-44 to 23rd is a GREAT thing!

I think that that has to be the only 4 lane interstate left within a 5 mile radius of Downtown OKC and it's been like that for years!

With the Eastern segment going in, our federal and state agencies should focus on the I-35/I-240 interchange, followed by widening I-40 to 6 lanes east of Tinker.

I saw recently that the widening of I-40 is in the works but with the traffic the way it is on I-40 and future trailer traffic having the alternate route, the aforementioned projects need to be moved ahead of a project like the I-44/I-235 interchange.

I'm sure I'm not the only Einstein who has figured that out...EUREKA!!

Now that you mention it...eliminating 18-wheeler traffic on I-35 from I-44 to 23rd is a GREAT thing!

I think that that has to be the only 4 lane interstate left within a 5 mile radius of Downtown OKC and it's been like that for years!

With the Eastern segment going in, our federal and state agencies should focus on the I-35/I-240 interchange, followed by widening I-40 to 6 lanes east of Tinker.

I saw recently that the widening of I-40 is in the works but with the traffic the way it is on I-40 and future trailer traffic having the alternate route, the aforementioned projects need to be moved ahead of a project like the I-44/I-235 interchange.

I'm sure I'm not the only Einstein who has figured that out...EUREKA!!I believe they have the widening of I-40 east of Tinker for a good 5-10 miles scheduled in phases starting in 2017 or 2018 though with the budget cuts, that might be pushed back.

I agree 100%. They need to add more east and west routes on the north sides of the city. It takes forever on 39th if you are going to Yukon. Same with NW Expressway. And it will be the same when the new east county TP is completed. It's either I-40 or Turner TP. They need a super freeway in between like maybe somewhere between NE 23rd - NE 50th. And they also need a freeway from I-44 around the Newcastle (maybe a little north) that gives us a straight shot over to Moore instead of going all the way up to 2-40 then to I-35 and back south again. Give me my Freeways!What I really think they should do is bulldoze everything on NE and NW23rd st. and build a 12 lane highway through there and run it down Classen completely bulldozing Classen so downtown OKC has better interstate access. I'd make the Classen Freeway about 14 lanes and build it down NW Expressway to Okarche that way downtown residents have another route option to Eischen's.

I'm not sure I'd agree. The OTA is different than in other states, where there are toll roads built and managed by private, for profit companies.

I didn't used to think that way, but my best friend is involved in multiple projects with OTA, including a few of these. Every time I say anything about the design, he always comes back to them only being in it to make money, which is the real reason they are ultra limited access. On the flip side, hopefully it means they know a road will pay for itself before it is built.

Maybe "make money" is a little too harsh since they are not for-profit, but they are concerned about positive cash flow from all of their investments, which defers greatly from ODOT.

I think that that has to be the only 4 lane interstate left within a 5 mile radius of Downtown OKC and it's been like that for years!

I don't see truckers driving that far out of their way, to add mileage on a pay road. I drive I-35 everyday, it could be better, but it isn't that slow. But I-40 from I-35 (between I-40 and Covell) to/from the new turnpike sucks a lot (although the new widening should help with that).

I haven't seen anyone that has come up with what trucking route would benefit from this new road. I am sure there will be trucks on it, but I seriously doubt it'll make much impact on I-35 or I-44 through town.

I just think there are much more worthy projects that could be built. PP has already listed 4 or 5 in the last page.

Where truckers need the relief and would pay good money for would be to bypass I-35 south of I-40.

What I really think they should do is bulldoze everything on NE and NW23rd st. and build a 12 lane highway through there and run it down Classen completely bulldozing Classen so downtown OKC has better interstate access. I'd make the Classen Freeway about 14 lanes and build it down NW Expressway to Okarche that way downtown residents have another route option to Eischen's.

Whoa! Slow down there a little bit. I think 10 lanes would be fine for now with an option for later.

Just give me my freeways now! I want the LOOP....

Where truckers need the relief and would pay good money for would be to bypass I-35 south of I-40.

the eastern section is being accomplished in stages. this particular stage may seem pointless, but the ultimate goal is to continue south past I-40 and loop back west to connect with I-35 around highway 9 or even a little farther south than that. -M

the eastern section is being accomplished in stages. this particular stage may seem pointless, but the ultimate goal is to continue south past I-40 and loop back west to connect with I-35 around highway 9 or even a little farther south than that. -M

And if that was already in progress, this turnpike might make sense, but that is probably another 15-20 years off, so in the mean time this highway will sit here with traffic counts of 8,000, while I-35 and I-240 is over 140K today. They are basically building phase 2 or 3, maybe 4, first.

People are also making an assumption that a continuation of the loop is planned, there is nothing on the 30-year ODOT plan and I haven't seen anything from OTA that they have plans to extend this pike down to Norman. I also seriously doubt OTA has the bonding power to build a complete loop around the metro anytime soon.

After looking at the map some and reading some more from OTA, I think the thought is trucks will get off I-35 on I-240 to the new pike then up to I-44. This will add about 10 miles, or 33% increase and at least right now the I-40/240 interchange is pretty poor, so I still have serious doubts this will be a highly utilized route.

The test will likely be based on does it save time despite being a few more miles.

I wasn't interested in what others think, I wanted to hear what you thought, else I would have Googled it.

They do it occasionally, I'd hardly say it is all the time. I was really thinking about the inner-city turnpikes like Kilpatrick and the Creek, where I don't recall them ever adding interchanges to.

FTFY

I've also heard that they plan to eliminate many of the planned interchanges on the Gilcrease. At the end of the day, the OTA builds roads to make money, not provide good local infrastructure IMO Which considering I am a pro-infrastructure and efficiency guy, I have issues with the philosophy.

also FTFY

Where on the Kilpatrick would you have them add interchanges? Public demand got them to add an exit at Wilshire on the western side. As to the Creek, they had enough trouble with the rich snobs living just off Sheridan. Putting an exit there would have just been like poking a hornet's nest with a short stick.

Also, comparing the Eastern pike with either the Creek or Kilpatrick isn't balanced. Cross streets such as MacArthur, May, Penn, et al in OKC and Yale, Memorial, on the Creek have exponentially higher traffic counts than do the streets to be crossed by the Eastern pike.

If the government can build huge interstate tunnels connecting those secret bases all over the United States, can't they just build one tunnel under western Oklahoma County and another under eastern Oklahoma county? No one's farms, homesteads, or favorite places to park and neck would need to be disturbed. Shoot, they may already exist. There's Tinker in the east and the prison transfer center in the west.

^^^ Why isn't the research included in the title search. The buyer is paying good money for it. I can understand that the average citizen may miss future plans for a highway ROW someday, but with the resources that are available to realtors, title companies, and financial institutions, someone should have known.

Even before that though, given that the south loop has been considered for a decades, with at least one or more studies done. Why were they ever granted permission to be built in the first place.

If the government can build huge interstate tunnels connecting those secret bases all over the United States, can't they just build one tunnel under western Oklahoma County and another under eastern Oklahoma county? No one's farms, homesteads, or favorite places to park and neck would need to be disturbed. Shoot, they may already exist. There's Tinker in the east and the prison transfer center in the west.

Could it be constructed as a tunnel is one thing, actually spending a much higher amount to construct and maintain is another. Plus it they tend to prefer the option to widen later, which a tunnel does not give. Given issues with prior construction projects I would expect it would be flooded if they actually tried.

We only need to look south of our border to see how to build an interchange:


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/21/d7/3e/21d73e196f2dfd234ab6f8e530973181.jpg
The Texas Master Mixer
The High Five Interchange is the first five-level stack interchange built in Dallas,Texas.

Now we don't have to build a five level interchange--we could construct a three-four level interchanges (where appropriate like: Amarillo junction; Dallas junction, Fort Smith junction) which would make them more accessible without the yields & stops, this would allow traffic to blend and flow freely.

^^^ pure porn right there!

I wish they'd start building those in OKC. One day...

What I really think they should do is bulldoze everything on NE and NW23rd st. and build a 12 lane highway through there and run it down Classen completely bulldozing Classen so downtown OKC has better interstate access. I'd make the Classen Freeway about 14 lanes and build it down NW Expressway to Okarche that way downtown residents have another route option to Eischen's.

I hope asteroids destroy the earth before anything remotely close to that happens. Not just here, but anywhere else. Unless you're trying to wipe downtown off the face of the earth - then yours is a solid plan!

We only need to look south of our border to see how to build an interchange:


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/21/d7/3e/21d73e196f2dfd234ab6f8e530973181.jpg
The Texas Master Mixer
The High Five Interchange is the first five-level stack interchange built in Dallas,Texas.

Now we don't have to build a five level interchange--we could construct a three-four level interchanges (where appropriate like: Amarillo junction; Dallas junction, Fort Smith junction) which would make them more accessible without the yields & stops, this would allow traffic to blend and flow freely.

Holy hell.

The Absurd Primacy of the Automobile in American Life - The Atlantic (http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/04/absurd-primacy-of-the-car-in-american-life/476346/)

We only need to look south of our border to see how to build an interchange:


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/21/d7/3e/21d73e196f2dfd234ab6f8e530973181.jpg
The Texas Master Mixer
The High Five Interchange is the first five-level stack interchange built in Dallas,Texas.

Now we don't have to build a five level interchange--we could construct a three-four level interchanges (where appropriate like: Amarillo junction; Dallas junction, Fort Smith junction) which would make them more accessible without the yields & stops, this would allow traffic to blend and flow freely.

Although I agree one would be nice, I wouldn't want to be on it during one of our famous ice storms :)

Likely wouldn't be banked correctly; trucks would need to slow down to 25 to keep from tipping over. Some wouldn't and we'd have cattle running all over the place.

also FTFY

Where on the Kilpatrick would you have them add interchanges? Public demand got them to add an exit at Wilshire on the western side. As to the Creek, they had enough trouble with the rich snobs living just off Sheridan. Putting an exit there would have just been like poking a hornet's nest with a short stick.

Also, comparing the Eastern pike with either the Creek or Kilpatrick isn't balanced. Cross streets such as MacArthur, May, Penn, et al in OKC and Yale, Memorial, on the Creek have exponentially higher traffic counts than do the streets to be crossed by the Eastern pike.

My phone changes Kilpatrick to Kirkpatrick :-/. I'd add interchanges at Bryant, Kelly and Santa Fe. Kelly could be skipped if they actually finished the 77 interchange. I'd also finish the 74 interchange. As it stands right now there is only one EB entrance and two WB entrances in serving Edmond, including the 77 interchange.

BTW: It isn't just MHO that OTA has to make money with their roads to pay back their bonds and operating expenses. By their very nature, the ability to pay for their bills with their roads is more important than building great infrastructure for the common good. It isn't an insult, just the way it is.

If the Eastern Loop works out the way they want it to, it'll put a lot of extra truck traffic on the I-240/I-35 interchange. I do see trucks using it more in the SB direction, due to the backups at I-40/I-35. So this will add all of that traffic to the WB 240 to SB 35 ramp, which even after the reconstruction, will continue to be a cloverleaf. Getting rid of the double cloverleaf will help a lot, but still not as good as a real flyover.

https://www.ok.gov/odot/images/I35_I240_plan_map_forweb.jpg

The concern with too many toll roads is future growth. Just wonder what distribution companies & centers think about being the vortex of a cluster of toll roads.

Metropolitan Tulsa probably has more toll roads for an area its size than any major top 100 MSA in the United States:

Creek Turnpike - designated State Highway 364 (SH-364); highway passes through the cities of Sapulpa, Jenks, Tulsa, and Broken Arrow.

Cimarron Turnpike - I-35 in Noble County (east of Enid) and ends in the western suburbs of Tulsa.

Muskogee Turnpike - begins at the Broken Arrow Expressway (SH-51) southeast of Tulsa: State Highway 351 (SH-351), is a toll road in eastern Oklahoma

Turner Turnpike - connects Oklahoma City & Tulsa parallels historic U.S. Route 66 (now State Highway 66) & carries I-44.

Will Rogers Turnpike - serves as a parallel route to US-66 and carries I-44.

^ Don't forget about Indian Nation to get to Dallas.

At least the Oklahoma toll roads are relatively cheap compared to many other state's toll roads. But toll roads will continue to proliferate everywhere until states/feds actually raise the fuel tax, or come up with a different method of paying for roads (such as a mileage tax).

Turnpike officials promise better metro-area access for southwest Oklahoma City area | News OK (http://newsok.com/turnpike-officials-promise-better-metro-area-access-for-southwest-oklahoma-city-area/article/5494380)

Here is an image of the proposed SW loop that was revealed last week:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/turnpike042816.jpg

New turnpike routes approved! The OKC metro is really expanding!

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-transportation-commission-gives-turnpike-routes-green-light/article/5502605

I had to read that article three times before it finally hit me that the word 'new' is tied to the word 'turnpike', and not the word 'routes'.

New turnpike routes approved! The OKC metro is really expanding!

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-transportation-commission-gives-turnpike-routes-green-light/article/5502605

Great news!

New turnpike routes approved! The OKC metro is really expanding!

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-transportation-commission-gives-turnpike-routes-green-light/article/5502605

Awesome! Very exciting to see this.

Good article here: http://www.drivingforwardok.com/#!Retired-general-OKC-turnpike-plan-is-a-winner/tgcb1/576569230cf2c6c57268c4e9

Good article here: http://www.drivingforwardok.com/#!Retired-general-OKC-turnpike-plan-is-a-winner/tgcb1/576569230cf2c6c57268c4e9

That's not an article, it's a Letter to the Editor in The Oklahoman.

Thank you for the clarification.

Hope these people aren't successful.

http://kfor.com/2016/07/08/anti-turnpikes-group-hires-attorney-to-fight-proposed-plans/

Hope these people aren't successful.

http://kfor.com/2016/07/08/anti-turnpikes-group-hires-attorney-to-fight-proposed-plans/

I'm not sure what the comment about the people of Mustang is supposed to mean. Part of the proposal is in the Mustang school district but the city limits of Mustang are not affected.

I'm not sure what the comment about the people of Mustang is supposed to mean. Part of the proposal is in the Mustang school district but the city limits of Mustang are not affected.

I don't know either. I didn't fully understand that part. This has to do with the eastern segment and not the Kilpatrick ext. that will run close to Mustang. That portion has received much more support due to their already being a fair amount of housing in the area.

That was an odd comment mostly because it left out Yukon. Mustang and Yukon would benefit the most from the southwestern extension. And really people who live just north of Mustang probably say they live in Mustang for the sake of simplicity.

Hope these people aren't successful.

http://kfor.com/2016/07/08/anti-turnpikes-group-hires-attorney-to-fight-proposed-plans/

I hope they are! What a massive waste of money.

I don't mind the eastern turnpike. I just don't like how this is the first phase. Right now the current plan helps no one. They need to do Purcell/South of Norman up to I-40 first. THEN between I-40 and I-44. Followed later by connected it north back up to I-35 in the Guthrie Area.

I hope they are! What a massive waste of money.

Whose money?

Whose money?

All toll-payers.

All toll-payers.

I'd say that if they're using it...They're getting their money's worth. And since it's their money...

That would only hold true if the money from each turnpike was used to pay for its own cost and not the cost of the whole system.

Eh. I'm going to guess that these turnpikes aren't going to be as much of a drain on the turnpike system as the Chickasaw or Cherokee turnpikes. (The Cherokee was built to bypass a segment of unsafe road and ODOT couldn't afford to build through the terrain. It wasn't ever expected to turn a profit.) If anything, I could see the Kilpatrick extension turning a small profit off of airport traffic (helps funnel people from the airport onto the existing Kilpatrick, where they might be otherwise inclined to take I-44 to Northwest Expressway or something like that).

Whose money?


I'd say that if they're using it...They're getting their money's worth. And since it's their money...

I wouldn't argue with this guy when it comes to roads and highways. Not even worth it.

Whose money?

Does it matter? When you get down to it, it's someone's money - that came from somewhere - that can be put to far better use than perpetuating the unsustainable auto-centric sprawl we've married ourselves to here. Don't we have enough of that?

I wouldn't argue with this guy when it comes to roads and highways. Not even worth it.

Couldn't agree more - it's not like we don't have enough roads and highways around here! Finally we're on the same page.

Couldn't agree more - it's not like we don't have enough roads and highways around here! Finally we're on the same page.

But see we're on the page regarding mass transit and walkability in certain areas. Not on my position of highways. I agree there needs to be much more mass transit in the core and I think you'd find I'm actually very supportive of walkability.

But see we're on the page regarding mass transit and walkability in certain areas. Not on my position of highways. I agree there needs to be much more mass transit in the core and I think you'd find I'm actually very supportive of walkability.

Except for the part where you want to drive 50 MPH down NW 23rd through Uptown... ;-)

Except for the part where you want to drive 50 MPH down NW 23rd through Uptown... ;-)haha :P

I actually want the street to be redesigned to slow people down using round-a-bouts, mid traffic signals, raised ped crossings, etc.

haha :P

I actually want the street to be redesigned to slow people down using round-a-bouts, mid traffic signals, raised ped crossings, etc.

+1

haha :P

I actually want the street to be redesigned to slow people down using round-a-bouts, mid traffic signals, raised ped crossings, etc.

Huh? How would raised pedestrian crossings slow drivers down? In which universe? (I'm guessing not the one we live in).

Huh? How would raised pedestrian crossings slow drivers down? In which universe? (I'm guessing not the one we live in).

Take a spin through the parking lot at the Lowe's in MWC and you will understand lol.

Huh? How would raised pedestrian crossings slow drivers down? In which universe? (I'm guessing not the one we live in).

Do you slow down for speed bumps, or go over them full throttle?

Huh? How would raised pedestrian crossings slow drivers down? In which universe? (I'm guessing not the one we live in).

Full raised pedestrian crossings do work to slow folks down. They also prioritize pedestrians over traffic, and help folks with disabilities.