Yep.... I find it amusing that the Waiters elbow to Ginobli is mentioned time and time again but no one bothers to mention that if the referees call the technical on Ginobli for stepping over the line. The Waiters elbow probably never happens because the Thunder would have been shooting a free throw instead of in-bounding the ball.

But that happens all the time, and they don't call it.

But wait, now they want them to call a travel, when traveling is missed like every other play.

FiveThirtyEight now has Thunder as the highest prob to win.

http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-nba-picks/

They, Warriors and fans and media, can moan and piss about the no call on Westbrooks travel all they want. Curry clearly walked before his last shot of the first half. He shuffled his feet, then took a step to the left and launched. Clearly walking. Let's trade those two no calls. Theirs takes 3 points off the board. Same game outcome.

They virtually never call traveling in the NBA.

In the series with the Spurs, there were 3 different times their players dove to the floor and slid while controlling the ball and there exactly zero violations called.

We didn't even play particularly well last night and still beat the best team in the history of the NBA on their home floor.

I agree with pretty much everything everyone has posted, but I think it's more accurate to say OKC didn't play particularly well offensively. I thought OKC played really, really well defensively. So, OKC will need to improve offensively while not dropping off defensively.

I can't say how impressed I am with the team right now. Particularly, Donovan, Adams, Waiters, and Foye have really exceeeded my expectations in the playoffs. And obviously our other core guys have been great too. It's been amazing, but it's also important to keep in my mind that it was just one game. Let's do it again though...

I don't agree that traveling is never called and we should just write off that bad call against Russ. Russ blatantly travelled with the ball at the end of the game and it should have been called. Sure, we can point to other calls in the game, but we would all be complaining if it went the other way. A missed call like that will be part of the storyline, but people need to recognize that even with that no-call OKC was in a good position.

I agree with pretty much everything everyone has posted, but I think it's more accurate to say OKC didn't play particularly well offensively. I thought OKC played really, really well defensively. So, OKC will need to improve offensively while not dropping off defensively.

I can't say how impressed I am with the team right now. Particularly, Donovan, Adams, Waiters, and Foye have really exceeeded my expectations in the playoffs. And obviously our other core guys have been great too. It's been amazing, but it's also important to keep in my mind that it was just one game. Let's do it again though...

I almost feel like mentioning Adams in the same breath as those guys is insulting...he's been THAT good. If he becomes the kind of guy who can call out a defense the way Perkins did, OKC is in great shape moving forward if they can resign everyone. Might need to address minor issues at PF and SG, but a core with Westbrook, Durant, and Adams is STOUT.

Warning: Everything in the below quote is my opinion on Adams RE: Harden-trade...if you don't want to go back over that, feel free to skip...tl;dr Adams puts an end to questions about Harden trade


Given where Adams is at right now, not to mention how young he is and how much improvement he sees year in year out (with plenty more in front of him), you'd be a fool take Harden over Adams straight up on a team that already has Russ and KD. (To say nothing of the reality that we probably wouldn't have Kanter, we'd have paid a crap ton of taxes already, We'd not have McGary (who hopefully will be with the team this upcoming season) nor the rights to Abrines, who is probably ready to come play in the NBA. And we wouldn't have had a year with KMart (a year in which we had a great shot at a title had Westbrook not gone down to injury).

Furthermore, the only year in which Harden would have made a big difference is 2014 when Ibaka was a bit shaken up in the SAS series. w/ Harden we probably overcome that series, but who knows in the finals. 2013 wouldn't have mattered because of Westbrook and 2015 wouldn't have mattered because of KD injury.

I almost feel like mentioning Adams in the same breath as those guys is insulting...he's been THAT good. If he becomes the kind of guy who can call out a defense the way Perkins did, OKC is in great shape moving forward if they can resign everyone. Might need to address minor issues at PF and SG, but a core with Westbrook, Durant, and Adams is STOUT.

Warning: Everything in the below quote is my opinion on Adams RE: Harden-trade...if you don't want to go back over that, feel free to skip...tl;dr Adams puts an end to questions about Harden trade

Adams has been good all year, but he's stepped it up a level in the playoffs, which is why I included him. He's been amazing. Having said that, given a choice straight up, I take Harden and I don't think it's close right now. We'll see how Adams develops, but Harden is a top 1-2 shooting guard (with Klay Thompson). It's easy to forget how good Harden is because of Houston's recent failure and culture problems. And I value Adams immensely. I just think we're dismissing a guy who deservedly finished top 2 in MVP voting last year, and can absolutely put a team on his back. Again, having said that, I absolutely love Adams and his future. He could legitimately become a top 5 center.

Adams has been good all year, but he's stepped it up a level in the playoffs, which is why I included him. He's been amazing. Having said that, given a choice straight up, I take Harden and I don't think it's close right now. We'll see how Adams develops, but Harden is a top 1-2 shooting guard (with Klay Thompson). It's easy to forget how good Harden is because of Houston's recent failure and culture problems. And I value Adams immensely. I just think we're dismissing a guy who deservedly finished top 2 in MVP voting last year, and can absolutely put a team on his back. Again, having said that, I absolutely love Adams and his future. He could legitimately become a top 5 center.

You'd rather have a lineup like this:

Westbrook - Harden - Durant - Ibaka - Perkins

than

Westbrook - Waiters - Durant - Ibaka - Adams

To be sure: Harden is unequivocally better than Adams as an overall player. But he's redundant and limiting to a team that already has KD and Westbrook.

Yes, that's the team that went to the Finals in 2012, and all of them have, and would have, improved. There is some redunancy, but Harden's ability to shoot and penetrate offsets that. He spaces the floor better than any player currently on the team. I'd take my chance that a team with those players could also attract a different center. There are better options than Perk available.

Anyway, I don't want to detract from what's happening now. Adams is a pure joy to watch and his rugged style is really translating well to the playoffs. He's been an absolute difference maker.

I believe Donovan was calling a TO as Westbrook was crossing half court.

I believe Donovan was calling a TO as Westbrook was crossing half court.

Royce Young tweeted that, but I haven't seen anyone say that was the case. The NBA didn't mention it in their report either. Interestingly, they did report that Curry travelled on his shot with 7 seconds left. :)

Royce Young tweeted that, but I haven't seen anyone say that was the case. The NBA didn't mention it in their report either. Interestingly, they did report that Curry travelled on his shot with 7 seconds left. :)

But no one seems to think that is worthy of mention, only Westbrooks travel.

^^^^^^^
I was going to mention that. The way people obsess over individual no-calls is silly. Missed calls suck, but they happen throughout the game - every game - both ways.

Also, I want to quibble a bit with Pete's pronouncement upthread that GSW is "the best team in history." And of course he's not the only one calling them that over their phenomenal regular season record.

But - besides the fact that I personally disagree - they won't even deserve consideration in that regard until they win this season's finals. A more accurate description at this point would include "winningest" rather than "best."

^^^^^^^^^
What criteria would you use in determining "best team in history" if not using "winningest" as a measuring stick? What team would you consider the best team in the history of pro basketball and why?

What criteria would you use in determining "best team in history" if not using "winningest" as a measuring stick?

Championships. The Boston Celtics and the Lakers would rate pretty highly by that criteria.

Whether they are best or winningest, they are still a great team and probably one of the greatest ever.

The irony is that if we beat them then most will argue they weren't the greatest, so the accomplishment will be somewhat watered-down and I don't know if that is fair.

The Warriors posted their best-ever record in the same division as the Spurs and Thunder, who are two of the better teams in recent NBA history.

Championships.

The reason I would not make that a criteria is what team has won multiple championships with the same roster in those championships. I look at best team as a snap shot of a particular team with the same roster that accomplishes that goal. So is the best team the one with the most championships? That would mandate a team having longevity. Would having only one common player to those championships give credence to that criteria?

The reason I would not make that a criteria is what team has won multiple championships with the same roster in those championships. I look at best team as a snap shot of a particular team with the same roster that accomplishes that goal. So is the best team the one with the most championships? That would mandate a team having longevity. Would having only one common player to those championships give credence to that criteria?

That gets tricky. I think it's easy in a given year to say a team is the "best" and I think Golden State certainly qualifies as one of, if not, the "best" team in the league, at this time. The best team in history? Well, the game changes over time. Could the "best" of 1985 beat the "best" team of 2016? Probably not, because the style and the tempo of the game today is so different. So I'm not sure of another criteria besides championships to determine the best of all time.

Of course, I personally know the best basketball team of all time was the 1992 Men's Olympic basketball team.

That gets tricky. I think it's easy in a given year to say a team is the "best" and I think Golden State certainly qualifies as one of, if not, the "best" team in the league, at this time. The best team in history? Well, the game changes over time. Could the "best" of 1985 beat the "best" team of 2016? Probably not, because the style and the tempo of the game today is so different. So I'm not sure of another criteria besides championships to determine the best of all time.

Of course, I personally know the best basketball team of all time was the 1992 Men's Olympic basketball team.

I would give them the best of all time based on the record they earned playing against teams in the same era. As you pointed out the game in '85 is different than the game of '16. As far as comparing those teams I think the best of 1985 playing against the best of 2016 would be won by the team that was playing under the rules of the era they were best in. I think the best of 2016 would have had a fit playing the physical game of the Pistons before the Bulls climbed into the throne.

Whether they are best or winningest, they are still a great team and probably one of the greatest ever.

The irony is that if we beat them then most will argue they weren't the greatest, so the accomplishment will be somewhat watered-down and I don't know if that is fair.

The Warriors posted their best-ever record in the same division as the Spurs and Thunder, who are two of the better teams in recent NBA
history.

Same conference but the 3 are in separate divisions. That's why we only played them 3 times this year, next year it will more than likely be 4. Thunder is Northwest, Spurs are Southwest and GSW is West division.

Yes, sorry, meant conference.

I'm not even sure why it needs to be argued that a team can't be crowned "best ever" before they even make it out of their conference finals. Should they do that AND win the NBA championship they of course belong in the conversation, and their best regular season record makes an argument for them even more compelling.

To be fair, they did win the NBA championship last season and have virtually the same team back.

It doesn't work that way, of course.

Ah, so that's why the Warriors rarely lost games this season.

Protect home court, boys. For once, I think the extra rest days will benefit us as we are pretty beat up. Adams and Westbrook definitely need some healing time.

That game... woof.

Though it does feel a lot better to be blown out after winning game one than it did to get blasted by the Spurs right out of the gate.

GSW was on tonight and we were really off in the second half. Have to play smarter in game three. No more early shot clock, long threes!!!!

We had too many fundamental mistakes. Durant needs to take care of the ball better, way too many turnovers.

It was nice to see KD have a good shooting night though. Here is looking forward to game 3. HCA is hopefully going to help us.

Also, what has been going on with Ibaka as of late? Terrible D, not switching when he needs to, when he does, he is late, which allows easy layups.

What is Ibaka doing shooting threes and on the perimeter? He should be not allowed to go 15 feet away from the basket. He should inside pounding away, blocking shots, shooting within 15 feet and grabbing rebounds. He needs to understand he is not Durant and never will be. He is hurting the team and the coach should bench him until he understands.

You do understand that the coaching staff are the ones telling Ibaka to shoot from there, right? It was an actual plan to incorporate a legitimate 3 point shot into Ibaka's regimen.

Ibaka's problem is defense, he hasn't stopped jumping on a pumpfake since he entered the association. He has a lack of discipline and confidence.

I think what we are seeing (especially last night) is that with our starting lineup, the person guarding Roberson doesn't have to actually do that and can be used to clog the passing lanes or double KD/Russ. This is creating havoc with KD's passing and the ability to get the ball to an open man.

Serge Ibaka's per game playoff numbers:

http://www.okctalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=12589&d=1463679877

What is Ibaka doing shooting threes and on the perimeter? He should be not allowed to go 15 feet away from the basket. He should inside pounding away, blocking shots, shooting within 15 feet and grabbing rebounds. He needs to understand he is not Durant and never will be. He is hurting the team and the coach should bench him until he understands.

Ibaka is terrible in traffic. He's not a good post player or creator. When he's on the perimeter he stretches the defense, which creates open space for KD, Russ, and others to operate. Ibaka has been our best three point shooter in the playoffs. He just has to find a nice balance of stretching the floor and crashing the boards. But he needs to take open there's if they're there.

For comparison. Kevin's per game playoff numbers:

http://www.okctalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=12588&d=1463679746

Ibaka's has a little more to go with his 3-point shooting as does Westbrook. Andre Roberson went to the Wizard of Oz, he now has some courage to shoot the three.

Regardless of whether or not we advance to the finals; Thunder's accomplishments this season should help keep Durant on a little longer.

All we need is one more solid piece (Harrison Barnes caliber) to complement what we have to really solidify the Thunder to make that championship run.

We haven't lost yet, Laramie. ;)

Ibaka had limitless potential just a few years ago. Now, he literally looks Thunderstruck out there most of the time. It's amazing how someone can have so much talent to go along with terrible basketball IQ sometimes. He commits more cardinal sins (fouling 3point shooters, always getting caught in the air, ect) than anyone on the team.

Inside Ibaka's brain...

http://teesbox.com/image/cache/data/thinking-causes-brain-damage/thinking-causes-brain-damage-868x1029.png

You know who's terrible in traffic? Kevin Durant.

I talked about this with Dan via Twitter the other day, and I don't think we ever found the exact info I'm getting at, but KD is an absolute TO machine. I haven't been able to find a stat for possession minutes, but if you put a stopwatch on every player from the time he touches the ball til it leaves his hands, KD's TO numbers would be astronomical compared to Russ and to most star players in the league. I don't recall ever seeing a superstar player so careless with the rock.

You know who's terrible in traffic? Kevin Durant.

I talked about this with Dan via Twitter the other day, and I don't think we ever found the exact info I'm getting at, but KD is an absolute TO machine. I haven't been able to find a stat for possession minutes, but if you put a stopwatch on every player from the time he touches the ball til it leaves his hands, KD's TO numbers would be astronomical compared to Russ and to most star players in the league. I don't recall ever seeing a superstar player so careless with the rock.

Good observation Urbanized,

He has got to limit his turnovers. Inside the paint traffic; K.D. doesn't possess the strength & conditioning it takes to hang onto the ball.

Yeah, KD has to limit his TOs. High usage players are going to turn it over, but Urbanized is right that KD's rate of TOs is too high. But I think read that 6 of his 8 TOs last game occurred when he shared the court with Roberson. So, some TOs might be the result of poor offensive spacing. Donovan may have to pull the plug on some or all of Roberson's minutes. Could Waiters and Foye absorb them? Or can the Thunder make an adjustment when Roberson is on the court? They need to do something...

The team needs another competent ball-handler.

The team needs another competent ball-handler.

Well, it has one in Payne, but he's just not ready for this postseason. I really think he'll take a big step next season and be a solid contributor.

Welp, "the best team in history" was just humiliated for a second time by the third seed in the West. I don't remember the '96 Bulls being beaten by 20 or 30 in the conference finals. Probably because they swept them.

I'll just leave this here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995%E2%80%9396_Chicago_Bulls_season

They should hand out groin cups to the fans for the next game.

Another incredibly impressive performance by OKC... but it's still just one game. Game 4 is obviously a big one. It's very unlikely OKC gets another blowout. We'll see if they can grind one out in the next one. I'm looking forward to driving up for it.

King of Thug Ball

Draymond Green
http://thesportsfanjournal.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/538861d3df6acbb8d03d65d024fe6e76_crop_north.jpg
http://lordheath.com/web_images/nothing_but_trouble__title_card_.jpg

Adams isn't human.

Bill Simmons tweeted this:

"Steven Adams has 3 fractured vertebrae, a broken finger and two ruptured testicles - he's probable to return. Back to you Marv."

Vegas is getting slaughtered by OKC this post-season.

Welp, "the best team in history" was just humiliated for a second time by the third seed in the West. I don't remember the '96 Bulls being beaten by 20 or 30 in the conference finals. Probably because they swept them.

I'll just leave this here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995%E2%80%9396_Chicago_Bulls_season

If for nothing else, I learned that the 95 Magic weren't that good.

I can't give enough props to Dion, he is balling hard on both ends. He feeds off of the energy of the team and crowd, and he is playing his role to absolute perfection. That drive and wrap-around-pass to Ibaka for the slam was a thing of beauty.

When Roberson goes 5/9 and 3/5 from 3, it bodes well for the offense.

Those betting against OKC in Vegas are getting slaughtered this post-season.

FIFY

Vegas never loses.

You know who's terrible in traffic? Kevin Durant.

I talked about this with Dan via Twitter the other day, and I don't think we ever found the exact info I'm getting at, but KD is an absolute TO machine. I haven't been able to find a stat for possession minutes, but if you put a stopwatch on every player from the time he touches the ball til it leaves his hands, KD's TO numbers would be astronomical compared to Russ and to most star players in the league. I don't recall ever seeing a superstar player so careless with the rock.

Saw an Ed Kleese commentary on this and he made a great point:

It's not just the raw numbers, which are bad enough in and of themselves...it's WHERE he loses it. When Russ turns the ball over running 100 mph, the ball ends up out of bounds or the defense is so out sorts that they can't generate a fastbreak opportunity.

When KD loses the ball, it's at the top of the key and OKC has no chance to get back and set a defense.

You know who's terrible in traffic? Kevin Durant.

I talked about this with Dan via Twitter the other day, and I don't think we ever found the exact info I'm getting at, but KD is an absolute TO machine. I haven't been able to find a stat for possession minutes, but if you put a stopwatch on every player from the time he touches the ball til it leaves his hands, KD's TO numbers would be astronomical compared to Russ and to most star players in the league. I don't recall ever seeing a superstar player so careless with the rock.

I think it would be some combination of turnovers per usage rate, but yeah, it's incredible how often he turns it over.

They're announcing by the end of the day whether Draymond will be suspended or not. I didn't think that they would, but they set a precedent suspending Dahntay Jones just a day before for arguably something not as bad. It will be interesting to hear their ruling.

They're announcing by the end of the day whether Draymond will be suspended or not. I didn't think that they would, but they set a precedent suspending Dahntay Jones just a day before for arguably something not as bad. It will be interesting to hear their ruling.

If they didn't suspend Jones, there wouldn't be as much of an outcry to suspend Green.

If they didn't suspend Jones, there wouldn't be as much of an outcry to suspend Green.

Maybe not, but that's just because people have short memories. There's a long history of suspensions for this action: https://twitter.com/Albabycakes/status/734770776130228225/photo/1

I believe Green should be suspended for a game if you look at this view: https://t.co/manyl4yRvN

But, my guess is the NBA will upgrade Green's foul to a Flagrant 2, which will put Green one tech away from a suspension. If they follow their own rules and precedent then he should get a one game suspension for game 4. We'll find out soon...

^

Yeah, that view looks really, really bad for Green.

Whether or not they suspend Green, the Thunder will need to stay focused; let's not get wrapped up in the Green debacle--IMO he's a thug.

Ok, he may be a dirty basketball player, but I don't think that makes him a thug.

Steven Adams is also a dirty player, but no one calls him a thug.