maybe i'm misjudging their popularity, but Band of Horses just announced an Oct 3 date at the Diamond. thought this could've been a Criterion show, capacity-wise.

and on another note, Travis Scott set a world record for performing one of his songs 14 times at the OKC Criterion show last week. skim through part of the video in this story - that crowd was crazy... kid jumps from the upper balcony down into the crowd at one point.
http://pitchfork.com/news/73574-watch-travis-scott-perform-goosebumps-14-times/

Criterion has a capacity of 3500 (approximately, I think), Diamond's in 1900 (I think), and both can be partially closed off for smaller shows. Criterion's balcony was closed for Explosions in the Sky, so it brought the capacity down by half, probably, and Diamond was partitioned in half for X (and still wasn't anywhere close to full, sadly). So even if a band's projected draw is only 1500 or so (or less), they could still play at the Criterion. Not sure how much of an audience is required at each place to break even (and it'll vary depending on the band fees/payments), but DCF (I think that's the Diamond bookers) is just better than Levelland (Criterion bookers) by far, that's why the Diamond is getting better shows more often.

but DCF (I think that's the Diamond bookers) is just better than Levelland (Criterion bookers) by far, that's why the Diamond is getting better shows more often.

You are correct... DCF books the shows at Diamond.

new official live video for Flaming Lips' "There Should be Unicorns" shot at the Criterion last December

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3owN81tjac

maybe i'm misjudging their popularity, but Band of Horses just announced an Oct 3 date at the Diamond. thought this could've been a Criterion show, capacity-wise.

and on another note, Travis Scott set a world record for performing one of his songs 14 times at the OKC Criterion show last week. skim through part of the video in this story - that crowd was crazy... kid jumps from the upper balcony down into the crowd at one point.
http://pitchfork.com/news/73574-watch-travis-scott-perform-goosebumps-14-times/

That crowd definitely looks crazy... but performing one song 14 times??? That would drive me insane.

That crowd definitely looks crazy... but performing one song 14 times??? That would drive me insane.

I thought the same thing, but it occurred during the encore and the crowd was - as a younger millennial would describe it - still LIT AF.

I've merged the two Criterion threads as having the extra one in the Arts & Entertainment forum was just leading to confusion.

Post Malone just announced presale for Oct. 11 at 7 PM. The code is Congratulations on Ticketstorm.com.

Has anyone ever successfully gotten tickets @ the box office during a non-show day? I have been several times on many different days of the week and no one is ever there. Also they don't answer the phones.

Guess the best bet is to either buy online and swallow all the service fees or try on actual show date...?

Has anyone ever successfully gotten tickets @ the box office during a non-show day? I have been several times on many different days of the week and no one is ever there. Also they don't answer the phones.

Guess the best bet is to either buy online and swallow all the service fees or try on actual show date...?

Yes I have and you still pay a service fee at the box office. It is less than the online service fee.... I think it was $5 when I purchased Jason Isbell tickets at the box office.

I think the box office hours are from noon to 5 PM on non show days.

Yea I have gone during the advertised hours. But still haven't seen any sign of life, even after ringing the 'service bell'.

I wanted to get tickets for a couple upcoming shows, so thought I would save on the service fees, but I did not know they still have their own. Oh well, may end up just taking the convenience of the online route since I can't get any luck on the sidewalk.

Yes I have and you still pay a service fee at the box office. It is less than the online service fee.... I think it was $5 when I purchased Jason Isbell tickets at the box office.

I think the box office hours are from noon to 5 PM on non show days.

Yep, my experience too with EITS tickets. Called them before I went to make sure, but still had to ring the bell a few times...

Yea I have gone during the advertised hours. But still haven't seen any sign of life, even after ringing the 'service bell'.

I wanted to get tickets for a couple upcoming shows, so thought I would save on the service fees, but I did not know they still have their own. Oh well, may end up just taking the convenience of the online route since I can't get any luck on the sidewalk.

Yeah... I was kind of frustrated that I still had to pay a service fee after taking the time to drive over there..... That was pretty much the only reason I bothered..... It's the second time I've been charged a service fee when purchasing a ticket in person.... Guess service fees are just unavoidable any more.

Interesting to see 3 Criterion shows being listed for sale on Ticketstorm:
http://www.ticketstorm.com/venue/thecriterion/oklahomacity/14215/

I would guess the Criterion is now just renting it out to whoever wants to book the venue, and they sell tickets wherever/however they want to?

^^^^^^
Those are just shows sold through Ticketstorm. Other shows are available via LiveNation: https://www.livenation.com/venues/30758/the-criterion

Sept 24 - Jason Isbell & the 400 Unit
Sept 28 - Young the Giant: Home of the Strange Tour
Oct 1 - Yelawolf
Oct 12 - The XX
Oct 27 - Conor Oberst
Oct 28 - Chase Rice - Lambs & Lions Tour
Nov 5 - Kari Jobe: The Garden Tour

Obviously not a packed schedule, but there are some legit shows coming up.

For sure, yeah, they've got some good ones. I just thought that the Criterion had Levelland promote/book shows through LiveNation exclusively? I guess not.

^^^^^^
Those are just shows sold through Ticketstorm. Other shows are available via LiveNation: https://www.livenation.com/venues/30758/the-criterion

Sept 24 - Jason Isbell & the 400 Unit
Sept 28 - Young the Giant: Home of the Strange Tour
Oct 1 - Yelawolf
Oct 12 - The XX
Oct 27 - Conor Oberst
Oct 28 - Chase Rice - Lambs & Lions Tour
Nov 5 - Kari Jobe: The Garden Tour

Obviously not a packed schedule, but there are some legit shows coming up.

Not packed but that's definitely an improvement over the one show per month the venue has been getting lately. Still very sparse compared to what is going on up the turnpike.

Not packed but that's definitely an improvement over the one show per month the venue has been getting lately. Still very sparse compared to what is going on up the turnpike.

I counted roughly 150 concert events in OKC and 120 in Tulsa from now until 31 Dec 2017 across various venues. Unless I'm missing some here and there (I did this quickly), it's quite the contrary to "vary sparse" compared to Tulsa.

I counted roughly 150 concert events in OKC and 120 in Tulsa from now until 31 Dec 2017 across various venues. Unless I'm missing some here and there (I did this quickly), it's quite the contrary to "vary sparse" compared to Tulsa.

he is speaking specifically about this venue the Criterion. when you consider that Cains in Tulsa has 47 shows on calendar through Dec and if you combine the 7 at the criterion with the 19 at the diamond you are still at 26.. that's kind of sad.

^ Gotcha.

I counted roughly 150 concert events in OKC and 120 in Tulsa from now until 31 Dec 2017 across various venues. Unless I'm missing some here and there (I did this quickly), it's quite the contrary to "vary sparse" compared to Tulsa.

In my opinion, it's comparing the frequency of quality (admittedly, an incredibly subjective criterion) shows, not just the total amount of shows. For example, in a one week span this month Jason Isbell, Father John Misty, City and Colour, and Ben Folds are all playing at Cain's. And Ed Sheeran (not my cup of tea but a big name) and Buddy Guy are playing at the BOK and the Brady, respectively, within a few days of that same week. OKC's music scene is definitely improving but I'm not sure OKC has had a week with that many good shows in my lifetime.

In my opinion, it's comparing the frequency of quality (admittedly, an incredibly subjective criterion) shows, not just the total amount of shows. For example, in a one week span this month Jason Isbell, Father John Misty, City and Colour, and Ben Folds are all playing at Cain's. And Ed Sheeran (not my cup of tea but a big name) and Buddy Guy are playing at the BOK and the Brady, respectively, within a few days of that same week. OKC's music scene is definitely improving but I'm not sure OKC has had a week with that many good shows in my lifetime.

Garth Brooks had 4 shows and Sir Paul 1 in 4 days. Around 80,000 attendance, just a few weeks ago. Big time.

Double post

[/B]

Garth Brooks had 4 shows and Sir Paul 1 in 4 days. Around 80,000 attendance, just a few weeks ago. Big time.

I thought about this just after posting what was intended to be a fairly hyperbolic comment. And I agree that was big time and hopefully we continue to get shows that have historically gone to Tulsa (IIRC, McCartney was last in Tulsa/OK in 2013 and Garth, who hadn't been to OKC in 20ish years, was in Tulsa in 2015). But I don't think stealing the once-every-few-years arena shows from Tulsa will turn OKC into an equal or better music town. In my opinion, it will take the Criterion and other nice similarly sized venues getting high quality shows of all genres to come on a very regular basis to where almost every week or every other week there are concerts that a sizable portion of the city is excited to see. And I don't think its unreasonable to say that OKC significantly lags Tulsa in this regard.

Double post.

I thought about this just after posting what was intended to be a fairly hyperbolic comment. And I agree that was big time and hopefully we continue to get shows that have historically gone to Tulsa (IIRC, McCartney was last in Tulsa/OK in 2013 and Garth, who hadn't been to OKC in 20ish years, was in Tulsa in 2015). But I don't think stealing the once-every-few-years arena shows from Tulsa will turn OKC into an equal or better music town. In my opinion, it will take the Criterion and other nice similarly sized venues getting high quality shows of all genres to come on a very regular basis to where almost every week or every other week there are concerts that a sizable portion of the city is excited to see. And I don't think its unreasonable to say that OKC significantly lags Tulsa in this regard.

While I think these statements are mostly fair, they really only acknowledge OKC's up to this specific moment in time. I think the argument can be made that we have reached an incredible tipping point in our music scene, and time will tell in this regard. It isn't proven of course, but if you ONLY look at what is on the books - though not concentrated in one or two venues like Tulsa - the gap has been closed to an incredible degree. When you factor that two of the venues - Jones and Tower - have yet to be able to capitalize on a good industry reputation (yet to be earned), I think the sky is the limit.

A few things to consider:


Criterion's much-publicized problems are not at all a reflection on the market OR the venue itself. By most accounts, the operator/promoter over-extended itself and also had a disagreement with LiveNation, who they were counting on for their bookings. The LiveNation thing appears to have improved, as there are now some nice LN shows on the books. Hopefully their bookings improve. The venue itself hits a sweet spot for medium size shows and is an excellent room. If the owner/operator can't get it together I have no doubt that someone else would emerge and be able to do really well. The shows that have been there have sold very, VERY well.


Jones Assembly has hit the ground running. Pretty impressive shows right out of the gate, and based on raves from the stage the other night, word will get around in the industry that it is a very artist-friendly venue. They also are working from, effectively, a bottomless bucket of money. Although it will never be a high-volume venue like Cain's, I would expect it to get shows that probably shouldn't even be in a venue that small (not that it is especially small). But for instance, this venue would not be big enough for Criterion-level shows like My Morning Jacket or The XX. Sellouts there and good reputation among artists and booking agents is going to be good for the entire market.


The Tower has not even had it's first show in the main room with a touring band yet. Essentially, they just opened this past Saturday. Throw out everything that happened with the prior operator, who never even finished build-out, much less booked a single show. They were obviously focused on Criterion and other issues. The new operators are well-funded, super smart and motivated, and though none of them have been in this game specifically for a while (one of the three promoted shows years ago), all are extremely connected in the industry. They are looking to do some amazing things, and I believe they will. The house sound system is going to be better than any venue in the market. Also, the artist experience backstage will be better than any other, and probably better than all but a very few tour stops for most artists. Their reputation is going to build exponentially, and I would expect that this will become the high-volume venue in this town (regularly featuring multiple shows per week) and consistently punch above its weight (based only on capacity) in artist quality.


Diamond Ballroom has seriously stepped up its game after feeling the heat from the new venues. Everyone loves to hate on Diamond (yeah, the location sucks and it looks awful from the outside, plus artist amenities are pitiful), but Diamond is actually not a terrible place to WATCH a show, and more importantly it is owned by the most successful promoter in OK, the same guy who for years put most of those great shows into Cain's and Brady. If he pays only half the attention to OKC that he does to Tulsa - which he should because he actually OWNS this venue - it would combine with the others to make this market a good one. Even right now, in addition to his always-present metal shows - he has Toadies, Old 97s, Texas Hippie Coalition, Against Me!, Band of Horses, Mastadon, Run the Jewels, Lords of Acid and others.


I still hope a good promoter starts taking an interest in maybe the nicest big-ish venue, the Chevy Bricktown Event Center. The Alt-J show I saw there after the remodel was just outstanding. But I think they mostly rely on DCF, who is obviously expending their energy elsewhere.


Other venues add to the mix, sometimes also punching above their weight capacity-wise. The Opolis, 89th Street, ACM@UCO (Foxygen playing there tonight). If you run down a list of the bands that have played those places in the last decade you'd be stunned. But they are off of the radar of all but the most devout music-lovers.

The McCartney show and some of the other recents (Iron Maiden, etc), at Chesapeake happened and are happening because we are now on LN radar in a way we never were before. This should be a boost for large shows. We'll see.


Anyway, I think that judging the OKC scene based on what has come before ignores our brand new reality, as far as openings and how these new venues are driving change. Let's regroup this time next year and compare notes regarding OKC shows vs. Tulsa shows.

Don't forget, OKC also has Lost Lakes venue and the Farmers Market - which both pull legitimate EDM artists. And although EDM is a pretty niche genre, OKC's EDM scene is actually really solid for artist's tours.

^

Generally agree with everything here and my comments aren't intended to be overly pessimistic. I'm very optimistic about OKC's music scene, which I agree has improved dramatically and is getting better and better every day, but I'm not entirely convinced we've reached an actual tipping point to take OKC to the next level. However, I think that time could be coming in the near future and I would be ecstatic if I am wrong. Very excited about the Jones and hope it continues to punch above its weight (which I think it will fwiw). 100% agree about the Chevy events center - I think it's a space with incredible potential for bigger shows. I also agree about the quality of our small venues (which are typically my favorite places to see a show). I would also throw the Blue Note and the Deli in that mix as well.

The Criterion has financial problems which is limiting their bookings.

That is the controlling factor, not the demand for live music in OKC.

The shows they've actually hosted have been very well attended.

Pretty fascinating they are two years old, give or take, and have financial problems.

Pretty fascinating they are two years old, give or take, and have financial problems.

The people involved have had financial problems off and on for years.

^

100% agree. But I would posit that the financial health of a city's music venues and the quality and effectiveness of venues' promoters and operators are important factors in analyzing the quality of a city's music scene.

The Criterion has financial problems which is limiting their bookings.

That is the controlling factor, not the demand for live music in OKC.

The shows they've actually hosted have been very well attended.

When you say they've got financial problems, are you talking about the owners? If so, who actually owns it?

When you say they've got financial problems, are you talking about the owners? If so, who actually owns it?

I'm talking about the operators, Levelland Productions.

I'm talking about the operators, Levelland Productions.

Ahh, got it. that would make a lot of sense. Maybe it's time for a new promoter to step in?

Ahh, got it. that would make a lot of sense. Maybe it's time for a new promoter to step in?

Been time, for a while... I think we all thought that Levelland getting out of the Tower contract and closing the Wormy Dog would free up funds/time/whatever for them to concentrate on the Criterion, but that just hasn't happened yet. Seems like Levelland needs either a large infusion of cash, or to just get out/get pushed out of the Criterion (not sure how easy that would be due to contracts) and let someone that can do it do it.

Also wanted to thank Urbanized for your post, nice way to sum it all up, just wish it would all happen sooner than it is (seems like it's been a version of "Free Crab Tomorrow" every single day for months and months).

^^^^+1


Agree that urbanized did a great job of bringing perspective to our live music scene here in OKC.

A lot of our buzzing districts have live music venues. Uptown, film row, bricktown, plaza (?)

I think were on the right track

...Also wanted to thank Urbanized for your post, nice way to sum it all up, just wish it would all happen sooner than it is (seems like it's been a version of "Free Crab Tomorrow" every single day for months and months).

You're welcome. I just wanted to add, I was looking at Tower's website ( https://towertheatreokc.com/ ) and right now on the books they have 24 shows over the next 20 weeks, and this is a week after their first-ever show, with essentially zero industry and artist reputation to build on. The vast majority are touring acts. I can't wait to see what they have accomplished with some successful shows under their belts and good word-of-mouth in the industry and among artists.

I think the Tower is simply going to be a monster when it comes to bookings.

So I'm wondering if the Criterion owners are worried/interested in how Tower's doing so well, and if they will ever be able to get a piece of that pie? Can the owners kick Levelland to the curb for being such a crappy promoter or if they're locked into a contract for a decade? Are they even considering that? Or are they just going to let Levelland limp along the way they've been doing for years (ever since the Criterion opened, pretty much)? Do the owners even care that they're missing out on big shows and decent money? Does anybody know the owners and can ask those questions (I'm just a regular concert-goer, no connections to anybody, so I can't)?

^^^^^^^^
Levelland IS the owner of Criterion. Of course - like most anything - the real owner is the bank. As long as they make their mortgage Levelland is in control of the building.

^^^^^^^^
Levelland IS the owner of Criterion. Of course - like most anything - the real owner is the bank. As long as they make their mortgage Levelland is in control of the building.

Interesting, other posts had implied that somebody else was the actual owner and they had hired Levelland as the operator/promoter, now I know. So, to answer my own questions, Criterion bookings will probably not improve in the foreseeable future unless Levelland gets it sh*t together, which doesn't show signs of happening quickly...

Levelland has an investor for the building but they are the main owners and operators.

Interesting, other posts had implied that somebody else was the actual owner and they had hired Levelland as the operator/promoter, now I know. So, to answer my own questions, Criterion bookings will probably not improve in the foreseeable future unless Levelland gets it sh*t together, which doesn't show signs of happening quickly...
Well, since they no longer have responsibilities related to Tower or Wormy Dog it seems like now is the time for things to turn around for them, if it ever is to happen. Obviously the schedule is still light, but if you're pulling for them it would seem to be encouraging that bookings are better than the REALLY dry spell of some months ago, and also that Live Nation bookings seem to have returned to the venue.

Well, since they no longer have responsibilities related to Tower or Wormy Dog it seems like now is the time for things to turn around for them, if it ever is to happen. Obviously the schedule is still light, but if you're pulling for them it would seem to be encouraging that bookings are better than the REALLY dry spell of some months ago, and also that Live Nation bookings seem to have returned to the venue.

Yep, agreed, hopefully they have the wherewithal, time, *and* the $$$ to be doing that *right now*. Going to The xx in Oct, glad to see them come here, the other Live Nation acts just aren't my thing, but it is better than it was for most of this year, though...

To be completely fair, the Criterion (when they do book shows) is still booking shows that are much bigger gets than the Tower. That is not a knock on the Tower because I'm blown away with how well the Tower has done so quickly (I've already bought tickets for two different shows). I wouldn't be shocked if they start booking better shows than the Criterion (they are definitely booking more). However, I think every show the Criterion has booked the next two months would all be the biggest shows the Tower has booked.

Not excusing the issues the venue has had but they are still booking some really good shows.

Well the Jason Isbell concert this Sunday has been postponed to Jan 4th due to a death.

If you are a Frank Turner fan (opening act). He will be playing 89th Street - OKC (https://www.facebook.com/89thstreetokc/?hc_ref=ARRCIm5svyjAWjJqSWQBHf6IIMG9ZPGNY666LcYzd0 h6SEBzjW9hGi0jkUNv8nsM0Ro)on Sunday now.

Just announced that David Byrne will be playing this venue 4/25.

Oh my holy lord

Oh my holy lord

+1

The press release says Byrne will be playing hits from the Talking Heads as well as music from his forthcoming record.

That is an amazing get for this market.

I was having a pretty abysmal Tuesday until I read this. Thank you and thanks to the Criterion!

wow... this is a once in a lifetime kind of event!

*ducks*

Eh, they have shows at the Criterion slightly more often than that.

wow... this is a once in a lifetime kind of event!

*ducks*

Eh, same as it ever was...

Eh, they have shows at the Criterion slightly more often than that.

Did you not know that Bill Ransic will be appearing, courtesy of the Junior League?

who is David Byrne?



*ducks*

who is David Byrne?



*ducks*


http://lmgtfy.com/?q=David+Byrne :p

Anybody who used Windows XP should remember this song at least.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuY4FR-bmGY

wow... this is a once in a lifetime kind of event!

*ducks*



Eh, same as it ever was...

Bravo, guys.

Hey that wasn't the point of my post butthead :)