I take it that this is in response to the Canton fire?

I take it that this is in response to the Canton fire?

No.

I take it that this is in response to the Canton fire?

Wait what?

any updates on this? thanks in advance

Nothing new to report.

My understanding is this project is still moving forward, just slowly.

How slowly? I honestly was thinking by this time, we would have quite a few cranes throughout downtown OKC (this and Boulevard Place). I hope the supply chain issues and now rising interest rates don't kill any upward momentum downtown OKC was going to have, building-wise.

any more news?

In an Oklahoman story posted on the 6th for an unrelated residential development around the State Fairgrounds, the city's Economic Development Program Manager mentioned that there's enough money left over from a 2017 bond for Alley's End.

not sure how we could use bond funds to pay for a private development?

not sure how we could use bond funds to pay for a private development?

It's part of an affordable housing program.

Ah, that makes some sense

It's part of an affordable housing program.

10 mil from that 2017 bond issue for this

I've been able to confirm that these plans were actually created for another developer who had been considering acquiring this property; not Land Run. For some reason that potential deal did not come together.

My understanding is that Land Run does not have any specific plans at this time.

that sucks, drove by it sunday and it looks sad

OCURA just applied to close some abandoned alleys on this project, so looks like there is some forward movement.

that sucks, drove by it sunday and it looks sad

What is this from??

What is this from??

Dude, alley's end looks sad the way it is now

Updates?

Forward movement on this project.

City planning to lease the developers the site and take a minor ownership interest in the improvements.

Forward movement on this project.

City planning to lease the developers the site and take a minor ownership interest in the improvements.

I love forward movement!

Does city ownership usually spur development along faster, knowing they can lease it to another party if they fail to deliver the project?

^

This was all part of an RFP process and when they choose someone, they are the 'conditional redeveloper' meaning there are all types of requirements that must be met.

If they are not, the City can cut their involvement (as they did with the original developers of The Hill) or continue to work with them.

Ownership of the property usually doesn't transfer until all aspects of the agreement are fulfilled.

Really hoping we see construction start on this by the end of the year.

perhaps a redesign which adds height to this gateway corner could be expected? Perhaps also a significance in architecture that, perhaps, follows the street in an urban, vertical way - could also be exptected. that is how we should use TIF, as incentive, and not just a funding source for the bottom line.

The plan for this project now stipulates that all 211 units will be affordable housing.

I don't know if the design has changed but if so, they'll be required to resubmit their renderings.

The plan for this project now stipulates that all 211 units will be affordable housing.

I don't know if the design has changed but if so, they'll be required to resubmit their renderings.

Just curious....is there an actual definition of 'affordable housing'? Is that a vague term or is there actually price to reflect affordable housing?

Just curious....is there an actual definition of 'affordable housing'? Is that a vague term or is there actually price to reflect affordable housing?

It's a HUD term that generally means you need to be income-qualified.

The rule of thumb is that rent and utilities are no more than 30% of your monthly gross income and there is usually a tiered-system by income with a maximum limit.

It's a HUD term that generally means you need to be income-qualified.

The rule of thumb is that rent and utilities are no more than 30% of your monthly gross income and there is usually a tiered-system by income with a maximum limit.

Thanks.
So, under the HUD term, would a food service worker in downtown/Bricktown qualify for 'affordable housing' or not likely? I genuinely don't know.

Just curious....is there an actual definition of 'affordable housing'? Is that a vague term or is there actually price to reflect affordable housing?

Typically when people are talking about "Affordable Housing" they're referencing either LIHTC (Section 42) or Government Subsidized (Section 8) properties. LIHTC (Low Income Housing Tax Credit) properties restrict rents at certain stipulated AMI (Area Median Income) levels. The most common AMI level to be restricted at is 60% AMI but you often see a mix of 60%, 50%, 40%, and 30%. For LIHTC, the tenants typically still pay their own rent but it is just a lower amount a month (hence rent restricted). Hope this helps!

Typically when people are talking about "Affordable Housing" they're referencing either LIHTC (Section 42) or Government Subsidized (Section 8) properties. LIHTC (Low Income Housing Tax Credit) properties restrict rents at certain stipulated AMI levels. The most common AMI level to be restricted at is 60% AMI (Area Median Income) but you often see a mix of 60%, 50%, 40%, and 30%. For LIHTC, the tenants typically still pay their own rent but it is just a lower amount a month (hence rent restricted). Hope this helps!

Great info! Thanks!

Thanks.
So, under the HUD term, would a food service worker in downtown/Bricktown qualify for 'affordable housing' or not likely? I genuinely don't know.

Yes.

I know the affordable housing component at Page Woodson stipulated that a single person could not make more than $40K; the limit for 2 people was $45K and then there was a scale depending on the number of kids. That was six years ago when they opened so those income limits have likely increased since then.

And if you qualified, a studio started at around $800 with increases depending on square footage and the number of bedrooms.

Page Woodson, like most complexes that offer affordable housing units, is comprised of mostly 'market rate' apartments, which means the developer can charge whatever the market will bear. But the affordable housing units have to stay that way as part of the lending agreement with HUD.

I also know of several service industry workers that live at Steelyard in Bricktown for amazing rates due to their affordable housing units. It is a great thing, IMO. Most of them work in Bricktown itself or even Midtown.

Muse will have affordable housing units as well.

The plan for this project now stipulates that all 211 units will be affordable housing.

I don't know if the design has changed but if so, they'll be required to resubmit their renderings.

Does this suggest a potential delay as they get things worked out for the new plan?

Update:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/alleysend081523a.jpg

^^^ Good to see the additional affordable housing units in this project, whenever it gets built.

Looking at the picture, I'm glad that they're showing a crosswalk across NW 4th to the YMCA--I've seen a number of close calls between cars and pedestrians here over the years. On that note, has there been any mention from the city of redoing E.K. Gaylord Blvd from Sheridan to 4th? The section of road feels outdated and not super pedestrian friendly. I hope they eventually shrink it down to four lanes like it is south of Sheridan and then add in sidewalks on the east side from Sheridan to 2nd. Maybe get some nice median landscaping too. All to make this area more friendly to an apartment complex going in here.

This is (in my opinion) the most important vacant lot left in downtown. Development on this property would do wonders in connecting the urban fabric and simultaneously stitch the CBD, Auto Ally, Deep Deuce, and Flat iron districts together. It will become much easier and more enjoyable for people to move between these districts. It will also put hundreds of people directly on the streetcar route. I am very anxious to see this one get started.

This is (in my opinion) the most important vacant lot left in downtown. Development on this property would do wonders in connecting the urban fabric and simultaneously stitch the CBD, Auto Ally, Deep Deuce, and Flat iron districts together. It will become much easier and more enjoyable for people to move between these districts. It will also put hundreds of people directly on the streetcar route. I am very anxious to see this one get started.

it is important ... but the lot between the MBG and the scissortail park is the most important ..

it is important ... but the lot between the MBG and the scissortail park is the most important ..

Yea, good point. I probably shouldn't have used "most important." I was just trying to convey my excitement for the potential of multiple districts in the core being simultaneously stitched back together by a single development. I would for sure agree the lot between the MBG and the scissortail park is more important overall.

The real estate people at chase bank are dummies. Who (re)builds a one story bank with 3 drive thru lanes in the middle of downtown? i guess downtown was much different in 2015 but still lol.

Honestly they should close broadway from EK gaylord down to Kerr Ave. Would make for a great pedestrian plaza with the OKC cock ring as the main attraction lol

Who's Allie and why should we care about her end?

Who's Allie and why should we care about her end?

Uhhhh have you seen it?!?

uhhhh have you seen it?!?

lmao

Uhhhh have you seen it?!?

Pics

Pics

It's like Onlyfans for buildings...

It's like Onlyfans for buildings...

OnlyPlans?

onlyplans?
lmaooo

OnlyPlans?

you sir, owe me a new keyboard. didn't expect to read this while drinking coffee today... lol

you sir, owe me a new keyboard. didn't expect to read this while drinking coffee today... lol

https://media.tenor.com/q_OxP9p5KjQAAAAd/heavy-weights-scale.gif

They have submitted new plans for design review.

Most everything has changed, most significantly the deletion of the east building and parking structure in favor of surface parking. They may plan to build on that lot in the future.

The buildings in the new plan are 6 floors vs. 5 in the previous version.

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Here is the last design:

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/alleysend1.jpg

the parking garage was nice but i like the new exterior design better

One less apartment building+garage, less brick, more eif siding. Dammit lol Any chance this development can help get gaylord fixed? That street is a mess

Yeah I like the design way better. Definitely looks like a higher quality build that fits better with the buildings in the district and has better street interaction. The old one just looked very cold.

If spending more on the design of the main buildings that interact most with the Broadway means shelving the extra building and structured parking in the less desirable part of the tract next to the train tracks for later if/when the market dictates...that seems like a pretty reasonable compromise.

I'm convinced this will never get built. They have changed it like, 5 times. And each time it gets worse and worse, in terms of size and impact for downtown.

One less apartment building+garage, less brick, more eif siding. Dammit lol Any chance this development can help get gaylord fixed? That street is a mess

Was it all brick before? Looked like mostly metal looking siding.

These are the latest and likely final designs that will be voted on by OCURA tomorrow. If they pass, council will then approve.

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Way less brick from the previous design.

so no more giant VD next to the OKC Ring?

The massing along Gaylord seems improved as well as the trees adding to the curb appeal. It reminds me of the Colcord in some respects.

I loathe surface lots and spit on the idea of central Oklahoma City needing more, buuut it seems like going this route will help them get the project rolling and raise the value of this intersection versus what is currently there. I hope that they intend to build on the lot in the future or at least will be open to letting it be purchased/developed by someone else.

They have submitted new plans for design review.

Most everything has changed, most significantly the deletion of the east building and parking structure in favor of surface parking. They may plan to build on that lot in the future.

The buildings in the new plan are 6 floors vs. 5 in the previous version.

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/alleysend101723a.jpg


HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/alleysend101723b.jpg


HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/alleysend101723c.jpg


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The surface lot is a bit disappointing but I assume that makes it easier to finance. Hopefully a phase II happens in the future if this gets built as currently submitted.

Five floors increased up to six is a nice change.

Way less brick from the previous design.

You're right. Maybe/hopefully the design review committee will hold them to that and make them revise with less EFIS.