And that is one of the single biggest pieces of fiction OU has ever produced, which I'm sure is tickets sold, not bodies in the seats. I went to games in that era and I remember walking in, fully ready to buy a ticket, and a guy hands me a 50-yard-line, upper deck, chairback seat, and there wasn't a soul around me. The north and south endzones were all-but empty on a gorgeous Saturday afternoon. 70K in attendance? Give me a physical break. Not even close. OU, insofar as that goes, really only cares about paid attendance, and there are undoubtedly plenty of ways to manufacture/bend/inflate those numbers for whatever PR purpose might be at hand, but as far as people actually there? No way.
They were counting arms and legs.

It will be interesting to see what GSW will do to keep their people together. KD, Klay and Draymond are the only ones signed through next year, almost everyone else is an UFA. This includes Curry, Iggy, Livingston, Zaza, Varejao, David West and McGee. With their current roster, they are at $107.5MM and that is without the increases that KD, Klay and DG get next year. I know they will sign Steph to max, they have to and with as big of an idiot as he has been in the past, McGee definitely made himself some money this post season. I am not sure what they are going to do with Iggy or the others, but I am not 100% sure it matters. If they can keep the big four, they will have people knocking down their door to get on the team, just to win a championship.

It will be interesting to see what GSW will do to keep their people together. KD, Klay and Draymond are the only ones signed through next year, almost everyone else is an UFA. This includes Curry, Iggy, Livingston, Zaza, Varejao, David West and McGee. With their current roster, they are at $107.5MM and that is without the increases that KD, Klay and DG get next year. I know they will sign Steph to max, they have to and with as big of an idiot as he has been in the past, McGee definitely made himself some money this post season. I am not sure what they are going to do with Iggy or the others, but I am not 100% sure it matters. If they can keep the big four, they will have people knocking down their door to get on the team, just to win a championship.

Check this article:
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19591472/zach-lowe-golden-state-warriors-potential-dynasty-2017-nba-finals

They will have two years of pretty bad tax bills (barring another cap hike happens) then they trade away Klay and are good to go with the big 3.

* Same franchise. KC relocated to SD.

I always thought that KC went to Sacramento ?

Check this article:
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19591472/zach-lowe-golden-state-warriors-potential-dynasty-2017-nba-finals

They will have two years of pretty bad tax bills (barring another cap hike happens) then they trade away Klay and are good to go with the big 3.

What if they're willing to pay that tax bill in order to keep winning? GSW owners are raking in cash. With the new arena, they'll be raking in even more cash. Perhaps they'll decide to pay the tax and view it as an investment in multiple titles and the money that brings.

What if they're willing to pay that tax bill in order to keep winning? GSW owners are raking in cash. With the new arena, they'll be raking in even more cash. Perhaps they'll decide to pay the tax and view it as an investment in multiple titles and the money that brings.

Oh for two years the will pay the tax bill no problem. Then I imagine they would trade away Klay and still be in the tax but it all depends on how much they sign Durant and Curry for this summer.

I always thought that KC went to Sacramento ?

I show that KC went to Sacremento. SD went to LA (Clippers).

GS will pay a huge tax bill, but even for them, but there's a point where it become untenable. First, the owners are paying for the new arena, which is extremely expensive and cuts into their profits and spending. Second, there are CBA rules that limit how they can spend money. The real advantage that they'll have is that ring-chasing veterans are going to play there for the minimum to get a title.

It will be interesting to see what GSW will do to keep their people together. KD, Klay and Draymond are the only ones signed through next year, almost everyone else is an UFA. This includes Curry, Iggy, Livingston, Zaza, Varejao, David West and McGee. With their current roster, they are at $107.5MM and that is without the increases that KD, Klay and DG get next year. I know they will sign Steph to max, they have to and with as big of an idiot as he has been in the past, McGee definitely made himself some money this post season. I am not sure what they are going to do with Iggy or the others, but I am not 100% sure it matters. If they can keep the big four, they will have people knocking down their door to get on the team, just to win a championship.

It could be one of the most disproportionately superior teams among most professional sports ever; if not, it sure puts them in that discussion. It's even more telling that other GM's are basically saying, "why bother" if you realize you are struggling to get one, maybe two star players on your squad, and then realize you're fighting a team with arguably four-plus. It's like fighting a hurricane with an eye dropper.

Also, I did see that while finals viewership numbers were up, overall NBA viewership was down for the year.

I always thought that KC went to Sacramento ?

My bad. I was mixing up California cities beginning with the letter "S". With a little thought on my part I would have seen the linkage between Sacramento Kings and Kansa City Royals. San Diego was in Buffalo prior to moving sometime in the early 70's.

It could be one of the most disproportionately superior teams among most professional sports ever; if not, it sure puts them in that discussion. It's even more telling that other GM's are basically saying, "why bother" if you realize you are struggling to get one, maybe two star players on your squad, and then realize you're fighting a team with arguably four-plus. It's like fighting a hurricane with an eye dropper.

Also, I did see that while finals viewership numbers were up, overall NBA viewership was down for the year.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the years to come. I remember watching "The Decision" where LeBron went to Miami and wanted to build a dynasty with Bosh and Wade and everyone jumped on the bandwagon to get on that team to win a championship. Then LeBron left, Bosh had a lot of personal injuries and Wade left a few years later and they finished 41-41 in 16-17 not going to playoffs for the first time in almost ten years.

I wonder if when they sign Curry long term if any one of those four will want to branch back out and do something different. They all have their championships, so at what point in time does Draymond want to go back to Michigan where he is from, KD to DC or Klay to LA (Clips or Lakers)? I don't know what goes through these guy's heads, but they have more money than they could spend in 10 lifetimes and do they just want to be on a team that is an HOV lane for a championship? I know a lot of them are very competitive and that might affect their decisions in the future.

From 538. com and Nate Silver

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-warriors-are-great-but-are-they-better-than-the-1939-yankees/?ex_cid=538twitter

..According to this metric, the Warriors are running slightly behind the NFL-best 2007 New England Patriots — and neither has anything on Joe DiMaggio and the 1939 New York Yankees, who compiled 106 wins and swept the Cincinnati Reds in the World Series.

I would have thought the 27 Yanks. Interesting chart in the link comparing Warriors to teams in other pro sports( NHL not included).

Just getting ready to post that 538 link. Interesting analysis.

From 538. com and Nate Silver

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-warriors-are-great-but-are-they-better-than-the-1939-yankees/?ex_cid=538twitter

..According to this metric, the Warriors are running slightly behind the NFL-best 2007 New England Patriots — and neither has anything on Joe DiMaggio and the 1939 New York Yankees, who compiled 106 wins and swept the Cincinnati Reds in the World Series.

I would have thought the 27 Yanks. Interesting chart in the link comparing Warriors to teams in other pro sports( NHL not included).

The baseball teams are generally more impressive in my book. The reason I say this is that your best pitcher doesn't play every day like in the NBA, NFL, etc.

Considering there is no salary cap in baseball, I don't find it impressive at all. Just buy all of the best players.

There is a luxury tax that has the same effect. Additionally not all "the best players" are free to sign whenever they want to. Contract obligations and such.

Considering there is no salary cap in baseball, I don't find it impressive at all. Just buy all of the best players.

Salary caps are hardly a tool to create competitive balance. But go on believing it. The owners thank you.

Salary caps are hardly a tool to create competitive balance. But go on believing it. The owners thank you.

Aren't the caps primarily in place to fix the cost of labor?

Aren't the caps primarily in place to fix the cost of labor?

Exactly. It's not a parity tool. It's a management tool. In other words, to manage salaries down.

The reason there is no salary cap in baseball is because the players union has their head's screwed on straight (and apparently has really good lawyers/representation).

Players are paid too much anyway

I think the counter argument here for parity and caps is European soccer.

Players are paid too much anyway

But they could be a lot more without the cap. NBA players in particular are worth a ton to the franchises (see KD). Owners don't want to have to worry about shelling out infinite amounts of money to keep the next big thing in their city.

Players are paid too much anyway

Radio Personalities:
Howard Stern 85 M
Rush Limbaugh 79 M
Ryan Seacrest 55 M
Shawn Hannity 29 M

TV Personalities:
Phil McGraw 88 M
Ellen Degeneress 75 M
Ryan Seacrest 55 M
Judge Judy 47 M

Movie Actors:
Dwayne Johnson 64 M
Jackie Chan 61 M
Matt Damon 55 M
Tom Cruise: 53 M

These numbers are for 2016 reported by FORBES. No such thing as "overpaid". You are paid what the market deems your worth.

The NBA should try out letting players be paid their actual worth. If that was the case Lebron, KD, Kyrie, Curry and Draymon would never be on the same team.

I think the counter argument here for parity and caps is European soccer.

Could you explain further. The vast majority of fans of professional sports in this country do not follow European soccer.

There are really wealthy teams in each of the major leagues that can outspend everyone else and they dominate the leagues every year. Barcelona, RM, Atletico, PSG, Juventus, Milans, Bayern, Dortmund, Manchesters, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal. There are other teams that are competitive, but these teams are perenial powerhouses because they can just outspend the rest of the teams in their league.

England has a handful of wealthy teams at the top, and most of the other teams are playing for middle of the pack and avoiding relegation every year.

Some years you'll have a random team like Leicester surprise eveyone and win, and then look what happens. In the summer, one of the wealthy clubs just buys their best player and back to the middle they go.

The NBA should try out letting players be paid their actual worth. If that was the case Lebron, KD, Kyrie, Curry and Draymon would never be on the same team.

I agree. I think the argument is against contract maximums. A salary cap with no maximums would create much better parity.

These numbers are for 2016 reported by FORBES. No such thing as "overpaid". You are paid what the market deems your worth.

Unless you play in the NBA or NFL, then you are paid less.

Unless you play in the NBA or NFL, then you are paid less.

If that were the case, rival leagues would be established. See American Football League, American Basketball Association, World Hockey Association.

Unless you play in the NBA or NFL, then you are paid less.

The Durants and the Westbrooks of the world are probably underpaid. But guys like Kyle Singler, Kendrick Perkins, and Oladipo are wildly overpaid. The max contracts allow teams to pay guys like Singler $5M per year when he's probably really only worth $200-300K.

If that were the case, rival leagues would be established. See American Football League, American Basketball Association, World Hockey Association.

No, because getting paid what they are worth is only good for the players, not the owners. The owners run the league not the other way around. Why would a bunch of owners want to start a competing league where the profits are basically guaranteed to be lower?

The Durants and the Westbrooks of the world are probably underpaid. But guys like Kyle Singler, Kendrick Perkins, and Oladipo are wildly overpaid. The max contracts allow teams to pay guys like Singler $5M per year when he's probably really only worth $200-300K.

I guess I don't follow the NBA enough, but I can't fathom how a salary cap would allow lower tier players to make more than they are worth when teams are trying to scrape under the caps to pay the big boys. Why not just pay Singler less to sign a Durant type?

I think the counter argument here for parity and caps is European soccer.

Also look up MLB. Granted the people who spend the most don't seem to be winning...

Also look up MLB. Granted the people who spend the most don't seem to be winning...

If you look at the distribution of playoff teams/world series contestants/etc, the MLB is one of the more even leagues out there. Consider they play 162 games in a season, and the best team wins south of 70% of the games and the absolute worse wins north of 30%. To compare, the NBA's two best (Warriors & Spurs) won better than 70% of the contests they played, and the worst two won less than 30%. Same in the NFL. The Pats won nearly 90%, and the Browns won 1 game last year.

Radio Personalities:
Howard Stern 85 M
Rush Limbaugh 79 M
Ryan Seacrest 55 M
Shawn Hannity 29 M

TV Personalities:
Phil McGraw 88 M
Ellen Degeneress 75 M
Ryan Seacrest 55 M
Judge Judy 47 M

Movie Actors:
Dwayne Johnson 64 M
Jackie Chan 61 M
Matt Damon 55 M
Tom Cruise: 53 M

These numbers are for 2016 reported by FORBES. No such thing as "overpaid". You are paid what the market deems your worth.

+1

The current MLB high total salaries (as of opening day):

Payroll Rank. Team Name Team Payroll - Payroll Percentile of average - Record Rank out of 30 teams

Top 5
1. Dodgers - 242M - 176% - 2
2. Yankees - 202M - 146% - 6
3. Red Sox - 200M - 145% - 7
4. Tigers - 200M - 145% - 24
5. Blue Jays - 178M - 129% - 17

Other Notable:
9. Nationals - 168M - 122% - 5
16. Rockies - 131M - 95% - 4
18. Astros - 124M - 90% - 1
21. Phillies - 111M - 81% - 30
26. Diamondbacks - 93M - 68% - 3
29. Rays - 70M - 51% - 10
30. Brewers - 63M - 46% - 9

If you really dig down and look at the numbers, there is probably more parity in baseball without a salary cap than in any of the other major US sports (NFL, NBA, & NHL) with a salary cap.

I guess I don't follow the NBA enough, but I can't fathom how a salary cap would allow lower tier players to make more than they are worth when teams are trying to scrape under the caps to pay the big boys. Why not just pay Singler less to sign a Durant type?

If the CBA didn't include max deals, teams could bid enormous amounts for Superstars. A player like Lebron could command $50M+ per year. If that would happen, the team has less cap space to sign all of its non-superstars. So the savings from max deals end up subsidizing the salary for the rest of the roster. And it makes sense that the Players would bargain for max deals since the vast majority of players are non-superstars.

Also, if the NBA eliminated max deals, you would probably see better dispersion of superstars. It's unlikely that you would see three or four on any given team, because they would simply be too expensive.

Also look up MLB. Granted the people who spend the most don't seem to be winning...

That was what originally got us on the topic of caps and parity. I said the greatest MLB teams didn't impress me much because it's easier to buy your way to a title.

The current MLB high total salaries (as of opening day):

Payroll Rank. Team Name Team Payroll - Payroll Percentile of average - Record Rank out of 30 teams

Top 5
1. Dodgers - 242M - 176% - 2
2. Yankees - 202M - 146% - 6
3. Red Sox - 200M - 145% - 7
4. Tigers - 200M - 145% - 24
5. Blue Jays - 178M - 129% - 17

Other Notable:
9. Nationals - 168M - 122% - 5
16. Rockies - 131M - 95% - 4
18. Astros - 124M - 90% - 1
21. Phillies - 111M - 81% - 30
26. Diamondbacks - 93M - 68% - 3
29. Rays - 70M - 51% - 10
30. Brewers - 63M - 46% - 9

If you really dig down and look at the numbers, there is probably more parity in baseball without a salary cap than in any of the other major US sports (NFL, NBA, & NHL) with a salary cap.

Do you think the MLB's incredibly long seasons, compared to the other leagues, helps to create more parity? In my mind it allows more runs and slumps that might level out the win percentages.

NBA Salary Cap for 2017-18 season is set at $99 million and the luxury tax level $119 million.

Next up-CJ Miles and Rudy Gay Thunder targets. Get these 2 and you have a pretty good lineup and depth. That team with PG13 would have prob. beat Houston in the playoffs and gave GS a run. Depth is what gave the Rockets the advantage. When the Thunder starters were on the floor they were as good or better than the Rockets. As soon as Russ sat the Rockets took control. I doubt that happens with CJ Miles and Gay coming off the bench.

I would say that Roberson is a higher priority than Miles or Gay. We'll find out soon enough...

Roberson and Paul George playing defense together combined with Adams would be a tremendous defensive unit.

Several reports say the Thunder is targeting Zach Randolph. That would be...interesting.

Several reports say the Thunder is targeting Zach Randolph. That would be...interesting.

I would be interested to see how he and Russell would work together. They are both very passionate people and don't really hold their emotions down.

Gay would prob. replace Kanter and Miles to replace Christion. Still think the Thunder are trying to move Kanter. This might allow the Thunder to keep Roberson if Gay comes as an MLE 1+1 deal. The Thunder would be a much stronger team than last years and would move into contention for number 2 spot in the west. Still would leave McDermott and Abrines and Grant on 2nd unit. That would be some decent depth and allow the Thunder to play small if Presti can get it done. I think this would be about the best the Thunder could put out there and would make them a legit contender. This has to be Presti's master plan IMO.

I would be interested to see how he and Russell would work together. They are both very passionate people and don't really hold their emotions down.

Russell Westbrook & Mighty Jo Z-Bo (Randolph)?

Recipe mixture for human nitroglycerin; they would blow up the Peake.

Gay would prob. replace Kanter and Miles to replace Christion. Still think the Thunder are trying to move Kanter. This might allow the Thunder to keep Roberson if Gay comes as an MLE 1+1 deal. The Thunder would be a much stronger team than last years and would move into contention for number 2 spot in the west. Still would leave McDermott and Abrines and Grant on 2nd unit. That would be some decent depth and allow the Thunder to play small if Presti can get it done. I think this would be about the best the Thunder could put out there and would make them a legit contender. This has to be Presti's master plan IMO.

Interesting idea. The small part is spot on with replacing a backup 5 with a 3.

Taj Gibson signed with Minnesota, leaving the Thunder bare at PF.

At 14MM per, let him go

Taj Gibson signed with Minnesota, leaving the Thunder bare at PF.

They have the guy playing for the Blue that they drafted in the 2nd round a couple years ago. Can't think of his name right now but he averaged 18-19 ppg and a bunch of rebounds last season. I heard some talk of them wanting to bring him up last season but didn't have any room on the roster. I do know he went to Kentucky and was their 6th man and did pretty well on a roster that was stacked with 1st round draft picks.

Taj Gibson signed with Minnesota, leaving the Thunder bare at PF.

Hard to believe that Taj got that much. He is a decent reserve and has a decent all around game but 14mil per? Kanter is a better player at not much more and some think his contract is excessive. I hope we keep Kanter since he is a force on offense. Yes, he can struggle against some teams but he will win you more overall than he will lose. He's a good player.

They have the guy playing for the Blue that they drafted in the 2nd round a couple years ago. Can't think of his name right now but he averaged 18-19 ppg and a bunch of rebounds last season. I heard some talk of them wanting to bring him up last season but didn't have any room on the roster. I do know he went to Kentucky and was their 6th man and did pretty well on a roster that was stacked with 1st round draft picks.

I would not expect Dakari Johnson to contribute to the Thunder in any meaningful way any time soon. He's done okay in the G-League, but his celing is probably an-end-of-the-bench big. Josh Huestis is more likely, but he just hasn't shown he has the overall skills to contribute either. Relying on either player would send a strong message to Russ that the Thunder are incapable of filling out their roster with NBA-level players. Remember, the Thunder thought Semaj Christon was ready to contribute from the G-League and it he was a disaster for OKC. The Thunder would have been better off keeping Ronnie Price instead of paying him not to play.

Losing Taj stinks. He's good, but $14 million is a lot for the Thunder with their salary cap constraints. If the Thunder don't get Rudy Gay, I could see a combination of Jermai Grant, Doug McDermott, and Paul George getting minutes at the 4. Roberson can play in the 4 spot offensively. There were rumblings late in the season that McDermott might try to work on his game so he could play at the 4 and Grant has already done so some. However, in late game situations, I bet the Thunder would want George at the 4 in a line with Russ, Abrines/McDermott, Roberson, George, Adams. George has publically stated he doesn't like playing the 4 defensively even though it's a great spot for him in small ball lineups. In the end, I hope the Thunder can pick up someone (Gay or otherwise) who has more experience playing the 4. It's a bit concerning to go into the season without a guy who has played the position.

They have the guy playing for the Blue that they drafted in the 2nd round a couple years ago. Can't think of his name right now but he averaged 18-19 ppg and a bunch of rebounds last season. I heard some talk of them wanting to bring him up last season but didn't have any room on the roster. I do know he went to Kentucky and was their 6th man and did pretty well on a roster that was stacked with 1st round draft picks.

Dakari Johnson - but today's game may be beyond him. He's big but slow.

Hard to believe that Taj got that much. He is a decent reserve and has a decent all around game but 14mil per? Kanter is a better player at not much more and some think his contract is excessive. I hope we keep Kanter since he is a force on offense. Yes, he can struggle against some teams but he will win you more overall than he will lose. He's a good player.

Taj Gibson is a much better overall player than Kanter, which is why he is valued highly by a number of NBA teams. He's very good defensively and decent offensively (even if he can't stretch the floor to the 3 point line). From everything I've heard, there is almost no market for Kanter. To get rid of him the Thunder might have to give up another assett. Kanter is skilled, but players like him, Greg Monroe, and Jahlil Okafor are just not valued in the modern pace-and-space NBA. Teams want versatile bigs, not post-up players that can be played off the court by small ball lineups that kill offensive spacing. More traditional bigs can still succeed in the league if they can catch lobs, protect the rim, and show some athleticism (see Steven Adams). Obviously, being one of the worst defenders in the NBA more than negates what Kanter brings on offense. His individual numbers may look good, but he kills offensive spacing with his post-ups and poor passing. I love Kanter, but if the Thunder could offload him for nothing I think they would have already done it.

Kanter is good against a lot of teams offensively, but he's unplayable against two really important teams: the Rockets and Warriors.

That's where the coach & the GM come into play. Rotate combinations of players to produce the best outcomes.

Taj Gibson is a much better overall player than Kanter, which is why he is valued highly by a number of NBA teams. He's very good defensively and decent offensively (even if he can't stretch the floor to the 3 point line). From everything I've heard, there is almost no market for Kanter. To get rid of him the Thunder might have to give up another assett. Kanter is skilled, but players like him, Greg Monroe, and Jahlil Okafor are just not valued in the modern pace-and-space NBA. Teams want versatile bigs, not post-up players that can be played off the court by small ball lineups that kill offensive spacing. More traditional bigs can still succeed in the league if they can catch lobs, protect the rim, and show some athleticism (see Steven Adams). Obviously, being one of the worst defenders in the NBA more than negates what Kanter brings on offense. His individual numbers may look good, but he kills offensive spacing with his post-ups and poor passing. I love Kanter, but if the Thunder could offload him for nothing I think they would have already done it.

Don't forget to add D and not 3 guys, a la Tony Allen, Roberson, Thabo Sefolosha, and Andre Roberson. I suspect if Roberson gets a significant contract, it'll be the same reason Kanter did and its to turn the screws on OKC.

If Roberson gets more than 5 mil per yr contract I am not matching if I'm the Thunder.

If Roberson gets more than 5 mil per yr contract I am not matching if I'm the Thunder.

Thunder made a qualifying offer to Dre for $4.59 million on June 26. Agree OKCRT if he doesn't accept it, let him walk.

IF Roberson makes improvements in the two critical areas (free throws/3 point shooting); then that improvement will dictate how much he will get for the next free agency. Right now, those critical areas could cost the team; especially when opponents' strategy purposefully fouls him because he can't shoot free throws.