We don't like traffic, so we will expand our road to handle more cars.We expand our roads to handle more cars and increase the traffic capacity thus having better flowing traffic. It's not a dislike of traffic rather than not having the roads that can handle the traffic that has exhausted the current capacity.

Car's and traffic will ultimately turn into people. Who do you think is driving the cars? There is no planning for cars and traffic, there is planning for growth and with growth you'll get traffic, that is how it goes. If the city is smart, it will widen its roads and plan ahead for traffic to make it easy and have smooth flowing traffic instead of these inferior two lane roads, and even four lane roads are getting to be too small. I think Lindsey will become a great street and turn into an amazing corridor that will see more big investments directly as a result from increasing the traffic capacity.

This is where the thinking is being detached. Norman has a unique (for the area) arrangement thanks to OU. You have a "captive" student base that is use to be in a high density area and walking to classes or to eat (Campus Corner). The idea people had for Lindsey was to encourage further high density growth with new mixed used developments. We are already seeing some of these along 12th SE and Lindsey and the new development on Lindsey at Classen. As we look down the road further commuter rail options it needs to have some density built around it to ensure it is successful. Population density and a higher density of wealth is much more attractive to higher end retailers and businesses than the suburban setup you see in most areas. This is why you saw Whole Foods open up to the Classen Curve area instead of maybe Edmond or another area with a higher income base - more density. The extreme demand for housing and other amenities in Downtown OKC also show case the growing trend for people wanting a more dense living option that doesn't require them to drive everywhere. We aren't talking about changing all of Norman to a high density city...it is too big for that. However, you can development Central Norman from the Lindsey corridor through campus and up to downtown to play off of the higher population density (thanks to OU) to offer a more urban living area. If people want and enjoy the suburban life, there are plenty of areas on the fringes of Norman that already cater to that.

Your opening statement highlights where the disconnect is and why people are disagreeing on this thread. The point isn't to develop and area that people drive - that's UNP. The point is to develop an area that people want to live in (which many already do) and be able to go about their daily lives without needing to have to get into the car to go 1 mile to the grocery store or to get something to eat. Four lane Lindsey is fine, like I've said over and over again. However, traffic lights are going to still cause backups - regardless of how much managing they can do. Lindsey is a bit unique because you rarely have one directional congestion. In the AM you have commuting students and staff coming in, commuting workers going out...and in the PM you have the reverse. You are going to get a backup somewhere - on Lindsey - regardless of the traffic light setup. This is why I would rather see the investment be done now, instead of investing millions now and going back in 10 years and spending millions again fixing it, to go to roundabouts at all the major intersections. Traffic will keep flowing then and it will be at a speed that will keep it safe for drivers and also for pedestrians to encourage strong growth.


We expand our roads to handle more cars and increase the traffic capacity thus having better flowing traffic. It's not a dislike of traffic rather than not having the roads that can handle the traffic that has exhausted the current capacity.

Like I said...not every area needs to be the same. Are you seeing people asking for all the roads in the new residential areas of Downtown OKC asking to be widened? No. If people want that, there are many options for driveable areas of town. Walkable areas are in high demand because many don't want to deal with having a car as a requirement for every day life. If you don't want that life style, don't live in that area...there are plenty of options.

Car's and traffic will ultimately turn into people. Who do you think is driving the cars? There is no planning for cars and traffic, there is planning for growth and with growth you'll get traffic, that is how it goes. If the city is smart, it will widen its roads and plan ahead for traffic to make it easy and have smooth flowing traffic instead of these inferior two lane roads, and even four lane roads are getting to be too small. I think Lindsey will become a great street and turn into an amazing corridor that will see more big investments directly as a result from increasing the traffic capacity.

All of this is backwards logic of the essence of greating a great place. I don't say that to be rude or anything. Planning for vehicle traffic is important sure...but giving more and more room and priority to vehicular traffic will secure you a place that is out of scale for humans not in vehicles...not to mention it's more expensive.

Placemaking can be a hard concept to convey but it's easy to document the lack thereof