View Full Version : Sears or JCP who will die first?
ChargerAg 10-15-2018, 09:13 PM Last two Sears stores in Oklahoma are on the chopping block, Norman and Tulsa are part of the 142 stores on the closing list.
Went in the Norman store about a week ago. The electronics department had been replaced with mattresses. Browsed around and found them selling pingpong paddles and nets. Selection just seemed so odd.
d-usa 10-16-2018, 11:36 AM Sounds like the "random crap we got left in the area" selection.
Jersey Boss 11-05-2018, 10:32 AM None in Oklahoma yet.
Lowe's is closing 51 stores in the US and Canada - CNN
https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/05/business/lowes-closures/index.html
Store in Sooner Mall (Norman) in the process of closing:
http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/IMG_0453.JPG
stile99 12-28-2018, 08:09 AM We may finally have the answer to this question today. Close contest, Penney's stock is now a penny stock, but Sears has until 3pm Central today, then the life support machines are turned off.
Jeepnokc 12-28-2018, 08:44 AM https://www.cnbc.com/2018/12/27/sears-may-need-to-liquidate-if-no-bid-comes-in-by-tomorrow.html
stile99 12-28-2018, 09:10 AM The thing that amazes me is a hedge fund manager buys a company that has been mismanaged, mismanages the hell out of it, makes as part of his final offer a demand for release from potential lawsuits over his past mismanagement, and yet somehow people are still going to say it's Amazon's fault.
mugofbeer 12-29-2018, 03:06 PM Well, Amazon was the last nail in a pretty much closed coffin.
emtefury 12-31-2018, 12:03 AM This is a neat story for anyone interested in Sears history. I didn’t know Sears sold mail order homes. The home came in a kit. The buyer had to find their own plumbing, electric, land and builder. I saw this is the newspaper of the area I grew up in. I read the news from there.
https://www.mcall.com/business/realestate/mc-biz-mail-order-homes-20181120-story.html
jompster 12-31-2018, 08:34 AM This is a neat story for anyone interested in Sears history. I didn’t know Sears sold mail order homes. The home came in a kit. The buyer had to find their own plumbing, electric, land and builder. I saw this is the newspaper of the area I grew up in. I read the news from there.
https://www.mcall.com/business/realestate/mc-biz-mail-order-homes-20181120-story.html
There were a couple still standing in Bristow when I lived there. One was on the southeast corner of 3rd St and Poplar, and I can't remember where the other is. The second may have been a kit from another company. They would ship them in by train and the pieces each had a number on them.
TheTravellers 12-31-2018, 05:54 PM We lived in Downers Grove, IL for 12 years, and they had tons of Sears homes, quite a few still standing, they're well known for how many are there, it was pretty cool driving around looking at them.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2004-05-12-0405110312-story.html
http://www.downers.us/public/docs/historic_preservation/13001%20-%20Sears%20Catalog%20Homes%20Booklet%20FINAL%20PRO OF.pdf
Dob Hooligan 12-31-2018, 06:33 PM The thing that amazes me is a hedge fund manager buys a company that has been mismanaged, mismanages the hell out of it, makes as part of his final offer a demand for release from potential lawsuits over his past mismanagement, and yet somehow people are still going to say it's Amazon's fault.
I read a story a few months ago that said the land was the reason for the purchase. Some were owned outright and many were long term leases (99 year at origination). Gives him low cost to control property, potential high revenue after repurposing. The people who have claims at liquidation aren't in a strong position to gain much at settlement, but could make it harder for him to maximize his $$$.
ShadowStrings 01-01-2019, 10:10 PM This is a neat story for anyone interested in Sears history. I didn’t know Sears sold mail order homes. The home came in a kit. The buyer had to find their own plumbing, electric, land and builder. I saw this is the newspaper of the area I grew up in. I read the news from there.
https://www.mcall.com/business/realestate/mc-biz-mail-order-homes-20181120-story.html
99% Invisible did an episode about this, if anyone is interested in listening:
https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/the-house-that-came-in-the-mail/
rezman 01-02-2019, 09:39 AM I remember years ago reading an article about Sears homes here in OKC. IIRC there were a couple homes somewhere in an area roughly east of May and south of 23rd +\- and to the east towards downtown. That’s a large swath, but I don’t remember what streets they where on.
Jersey Boss 01-08-2019, 11:13 AM And the winner is SEARS.
Sears plans to shutter business as Chairman Eddie Lampert's bid fails
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/06/sears-rejects-eddie-lamperts-bid-to-save-company-will-liquidate-.html
stile99 01-08-2019, 05:59 PM How many lives does this cat have? Let it die a merciful death already.
I know, I know. "But what about those 50,000 people!". They need to be looking already, the writing has been on the wall a looooong time.
https://kfor.com/2019/01/08/sears-reaches-11th-hour-deal-to-stay-in-business/
Jersey Boss 01-08-2019, 06:14 PM And the winner is SEARS.
Sears plans to shutter business as Chairman Eddie Lampert's bid fails
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/06/sears-rejects-eddie-lamperts-bid-to-save-company-will-liquidate-.html
"Never mind"- Emily Latella
Apparently the link was updated 3 hours after my initial post.
mugofbeer 01-08-2019, 09:57 PM Several talking business heads give JC Penneys a year unless something drastic happens.
jn1780 01-14-2019, 12:14 PM The "other" Sears may not make it once the original Sears finally goes under.
https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/14/business/sears-hometown-bankruptcy/index.html
Plutonic Panda 01-16-2019, 08:27 AM https://apple.news/Ai6ekOIy6RC-1dfuicYMJhQ
stile99 01-16-2019, 09:00 AM Oh good. The slow, painful death continues.
jn1780 01-16-2019, 10:01 AM Why does this guy like losing money? Is this a money laundry operation or is he just stubborn?
stile99 01-16-2019, 10:26 AM Why does this guy like losing money? Is this a money laundry operation or is he just stubborn?
When it isn't your money, it isn't your problem. The real question is what is wrong with the idiots who keep shoveling money at him.
Plutonic Panda 11-07-2019, 08:18 PM Sears(and KMart) closing more stores. No Oklahoma stores affected.
https://searsholdings.com/docs/110719_store_closing_list.pdf
Swake 11-07-2019, 10:18 PM Sears(and KMart) closing more stores. No Oklahoma stores affected.
https://searsholdings.com/docs/110719_store_closing_list.pdf
Are there any stores left?
SEMIweather 11-08-2019, 06:42 AM It looks like there is somehow still a KMart out in Clinton lol
Snowman 11-08-2019, 07:50 AM It looks like there is somehow still a KMart out in Clinton lol
It is practically a captive market for Clinton and a couple towns north and south of it.
Given how there is increasingly only two clusters, one in California and on in the north east, it seems they will likely abandon the few left in the plains, rockies & south soon. Probably replaced by a super center eventually.
jn1780 11-08-2019, 04:05 PM The hometown store at Quail Springs store closed. They reabsorbed them back into the company and immediately started closing those also.
SEMIweather 11-08-2019, 06:01 PM It is practically a captive market for Clinton and a couple towns north and south of it.
Given how there is increasingly only two clusters, one in California and on in the north east, it seems they will likely abandon the few left in the plains, rockies & south soon. Probably replaced by a super center eventually.
Wow, I really would have thought that Clinton would have a Wal-Mart. It seems weird that they don't, as their population is barely smaller than Weatherford or Elk City.
Bunty 05-17-2020, 02:21 PM Several talking business heads give JC Penneys a year unless something drastic happens.
JC Penney finally declares bankruptcy Friday. I wonder if JC Penney in Penn Square will close.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2020/05/15/jc-penney-bankruptcy-store-closings-coronavirus-closures-chapter-11/3057838001/
scottk 05-17-2020, 08:57 PM JC Penney finally declares bankruptcy Friday. I wonder if JC Penney in Penn Square will close.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2020/05/15/jc-penney-bankruptcy-store-closings-coronavirus-closures-chapter-11/3057838001/
JCPenney has already closed their stores in smaller communities in the state (Bartlesville, Ponca City, Stillwater). I believe Ardmore, and Enid are still holding on. They may be next in the closures since they are outlier stores in smaller communities.
Tulsa Metro JCP Stores: Owasso, Promenade Mall, and Woodland Hills. - Out of these Promenade seems the most likely to close. Owasso is a fairly new store, and Woodland Hills is the flagship mall of Tulsa Metro.
Then in OKC Metro for JCP you have Quail Springs, Penn Square, Midwest City Town Center, Shops at Moore, Norman Sooner Mall, and Shawnee Mall. If I had to guess, Shawnee and Norman would go before Quail or Penn. Penn is OKC's flagship mall, and Quail is going through a refresh with the large arcade and aquarium going in.
Not sure of the traffic, but the stand alone stores in Midwest City or Moore may also go if there is a buyer that would want to go into those centers. Given the current state of things, there may be no buyers, but I would guess those are easier to fill than two story mall anchors.
SomeGuy 05-18-2020, 05:02 PM Promenade JCP is closing, it was announced a few months ago IIRC.
jbkrems 05-18-2020, 05:50 PM Not surprised given that Tulsa Promenade Mall is doing very poorly financially.
cinnamonjock 05-19-2020, 06:28 PM I worked at the Ardmore penney's after school several years ago. Outside of Christmas and tax-free weekend, the only people keeping that store alive were elderly women. Didn't feel like a great long-term strategy then, or now.
John1744 05-22-2020, 06:42 PM JCPenney has already closed their stores in smaller communities in the state (Bartlesville, Ponca City, Stillwater). I believe Ardmore, and Enid are still holding on. They may be next in the closures since they are outlier stores in smaller communities.
Tulsa Metro JCP Stores: Owasso, Promenade Mall, and Woodland Hills. - Out of these Promenade seems the most likely to close. Owasso is a fairly new store, and Woodland Hills is the flagship mall of Tulsa Metro.
Then in OKC Metro for JCP you have Quail Springs, Penn Square, Midwest City Town Center, Shops at Moore, Norman Sooner Mall, and Shawnee Mall. If I had to guess, Shawnee and Norman would go before Quail or Penn. Penn is OKC's flagship mall, and Quail is going through a refresh with the large arcade and aquarium going in.
Not sure of the traffic, but the stand alone stores in Midwest City or Moore may also go if there is a buyer that would want to go into those centers. Given the current state of things, there may be no buyers, but I would guess those are easier to fill than two story mall anchors.
Someone would be smart to buy that spot JC Pennys is in at MWC. As long as the right thing goes in that area is insanely busy all the time.
SomeGuy 05-23-2020, 01:49 PM Unrelated or maybe related but Neiman Marcus isn't doing too well either and they filed for bankruptcy recently
jonny d 05-23-2020, 02:16 PM Unrelated or maybe related but Neiman Marcus isn't doing too well either and they filed for bankruptcy recently
Nordstrom is also closing 16 or so stores. ranted, their online shopping is top-notch, as are their sales they have online.
jbkrems 05-23-2020, 03:54 PM Nordstrom is also closing 16 or so stores. ranted, their online shopping is top-notch, as are their sales they have online.
Has the Nordstrom Rack near Penn Square Mall been re-opened yet? I wonder how many of those stores might close, too?
SoonersFan12 05-31-2020, 04:41 AM Not surprised given that Tulsa Promenade Mall is doing very poorly financially.
What is the reason? I have not been to Promenade Mall in years but from what I remember, it was a really nice mall
scottk 05-31-2020, 09:53 AM What is the reason? I have not been to Promenade Mall in years but from what I remember, it was a really nice mall
Unfortunate, sign of the times.
Given the current climate and overall demand of in-store shopping at malls, towns the size of OKC, Tulsa, etc appear to be able to support one large healthy mall in the market. OKC has Penn Square, Tulsa has Woodland Hills. Both owned by Simon.
Quail Springs is going through a re-branding with the aquarium and gaming/entertainment center being built, and a major fitness center replacing one of the anchors a few years back (Macy's to Lifetime Fitness). While the mall is still healthy, it's not as much a shopping destination as entertainment center.
Promenade has not been able to evolve as stores have closed.
From a location and age stand point, Promenade has more in common with Penn Square with both originally being outdoor shopping centers and having unique layouts and closer to the core of the city.
Woodland Hills was built a few years before Quail Springs Mall and has a similar racetrack layout and surrounding businesses on 71st Street in Tulsa mirror Memorial Road.
Then OKC and Tulsa both have two repurposed malls. Eastland Mall in far east Tulsa was rebranded into an office complex/call center as Eastgate Metroplex in the early 2000's. Crossroads/Plaza Mayor was to be similar to La Gran Plaza in Fort Worth, but ultimately closed October 2017.
Edmond Hausfrau 05-31-2020, 10:15 AM Unfortunate, sign of the times.
Given the current climate and overall demand of in-store shopping at malls, towns the size of OKC, Tulsa, etc appear to be able to support one large healthy mall in the market. OKC has Penn Square, Tulsa has Woodland Hills. Both owned by Simon.
Quail Springs is going through a re-branding with the aquarium and gaming/entertainment center being built, and a major fitness center replacing one of the anchors a few years back (Macy's to Lifetime Fitness). While the mall is still healthy, it's not as much a shopping destination as entertainment center.
Promenade has not been able to evolve as stores have closed.
From a location and age stand point, Promenade has more in common with Penn Square with both originally being outdoor shopping centers and having unique layouts and closer to the core of the city.
Woodland Hills was built a few years before Quail Springs Mall and has a similar racetrack layout and surrounding businesses on 71st Street in Tulsa mirror Memorial Road.
Then OKC and Tulsa both have two repurposed malls. Eastland Mall in far east Tulsa was rebranded into an office complex/call center as Eastgate Metroplex in the early 2000's. Crossroads/Plaza Mayor was to be similar to La Gran Plaza in Fort Worth, but ultimately closed October 2017.
Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the current trend in shopping malls is open air, pedestrian walkway, fountians, etc. and that Penn Square was open air back in the 80's? They enclosed it all to keep up with the mall trend back then.
Plus ca change...
mugofbeer 05-31-2020, 10:37 AM I wish someone would convert Shepherd Mall into some sort of mixed use development. Tear down the parts between the old department stores and replace with outdoor lifestyle center -type retail and apartments.
Bunty 05-31-2020, 11:39 AM It looks like there is somehow still a KMart out in Clinton lol
It keeps Wal-Mart away.
mugofbeer 05-31-2020, 11:46 AM I've seen 3 recent articles about Amazon buying out Penny's. It's been written happening both before or after bankruptcy.
scottk 05-31-2020, 11:56 AM I've seen 3 recent articles about Amazon buying out Penny's. It's been written happening both before or after bankruptcy.
Curious...What's the intended purpose of Amazon buying JCP? Would the stores continue as retail? Specialize in selling Amazon branded products? Smaller distribution warehouses for same day delivery?
SoonersFan12 05-31-2020, 12:20 PM Unfortunate, sign of the times.
Given the current climate and overall demand of in-store shopping at malls, towns the size of OKC, Tulsa, etc appear to be able to support one large healthy mall in the market. OKC has Penn Square, Tulsa has Woodland Hills. Both owned by Simon.
Quail Springs is going through a re-branding with the aquarium and gaming/entertainment center being built, and a major fitness center replacing one of the anchors a few years back (Macy's to Lifetime Fitness). While the mall is still healthy, it's not as much a shopping destination as entertainment center.
Promenade has not been able to evolve as stores have closed.
From a location and age stand point, Promenade has more in common with Penn Square with both originally being outdoor shopping centers and having unique layouts and closer to the core of the city.
Woodland Hills was built a few years before Quail Springs Mall and has a similar racetrack layout and surrounding businesses on 71st Street in Tulsa mirror Memorial Road.
Then OKC and Tulsa both have two repurposed malls. Eastland Mall in far east Tulsa was rebranded into an office complex/call center as Eastgate Metroplex in the early 2000's. Crossroads/Plaza Mayor was to be similar to La Gran Plaza in Fort Worth, but ultimately closed October 2017.
I completely forgot about Woodland Hills, I thought that was the mall you were talking about, my mistake! Woodland Hills mall is doing well, correct?
mugofbeer 05-31-2020, 01:09 PM Curious...What's the intended purpose of Amazon buying JCP? Would the stores continue as retail? Specialize in selling Amazon branded products? Smaller distribution warehouses for same day delivery?
I would imagine all of the above.
SomeGuy 05-31-2020, 01:38 PM Woodland is probably the second healthiest mall in Oklahoma. They did lose Sears, but an H and M is coming later this year.
Just read on CNN that the JCP stores in Enid, McAlester, Midwest City, Shawnee, Muskogee, and the store at Promenade will close.
jonny d 06-04-2020, 09:48 PM 5 years ago, I begged for the JCP in Penn Square to close, so Nordstrom could take its place (r so the mall could expand). But now, I don't think many department stores are expanding.
Here is the CNN article mentioned above:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/04/business/jcpenney-store-closures-bankruptcy-coronavirus/index.html
jerrywall 06-04-2020, 10:34 PM Curious...What's the intended purpose of Amazon buying JCP? Would the stores continue as retail? Specialize in selling Amazon branded products? Smaller distribution warehouses for same day delivery?
I'd suspect a large reason would be their brands. Arizona, St John's Bay and a bunch of others I can't remember. Amazon has been expanding their house brands.
Penney's closing 154 stores this summer, including:
Oklahoma:
Oakwood Mall, in Enid
Tandy Town Shopping Center, in McAlester
Town Center Plaza, in Midwest City
Arrowhead Mall, in Muskogee
Shawnee Mall, in Shawnee
Tulsa Promenade, in Tulsa
SoonersFan12 06-05-2020, 09:28 AM Penney's closing 154 stores this summer, including:
Oklahoma:
Oakwood Mall, in Enid
Tandy Town Shopping Center, in McAlester
Town Center Plaza, in Midwest City
Arrowhead Mall, in Muskogee
Shawnee Mall, in Shawnee
Tulsa Promenade, in Tulsa
I am not really surprised, I think they will do better as a stand alone, we have JcPenny's in Moore as stand alone and it seems to be doing well
cinnamonjock 06-05-2020, 11:58 AM Surprised the Ardmore location survived.
bombermwc 06-05-2020, 03:49 PM I'd like to say that i'm annoyed about the MWC one but with Kohls just a few stores down in the same shopping center, it's been on shaky ground since it opened. And more often than not, i'm not able to find something i like there compared to going to Target or Kohls. The brands they have just haven't been keeping up. They have the old lady patrol down, but that's a shrinking market ya'll.
jdizzle 06-05-2020, 03:52 PM Stinks, since MWC won't be able to fill that anytime soon.
Plutonic Panda 09-12-2020, 10:55 PM The plot thickens:
J.C. Penney has reached a tentative deal to sell its business and stores to a group of mall owners and lenders in a move that would save the department store chain from liquidation.
The retailer disclosed Wednesday during a bankruptcy hearing that it had struck the deal with Simon Property Group, Brookfield Property Group and a group of bankruptcy lenders.
The deal is expected to save more than 600 stores and 70,000 jobs. The company has separately announced plans to liquidate 242 locations.
https://www.indystar.com/story/money/2020/09/09/jcpenney-sale-simon-property-group-brookfield-property-partners/5761731002/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&fbclid=IwAR3e-ey5ryaT28I0xPjqkvC4fRKBCZQrlcUkbU8nAinVzcVemcB2eQg zgQc
mugofbeer 09-12-2020, 11:48 PM Also buying Brooks Brothers, Forever 21 and Lucky Jeans.
Beats not getting paid rent and having empty spaces.
SomeGuy 11-12-2021, 02:58 PM https://bestlifeonline.com/news-kmart-closing-stores/. It's really sad how Kmart went from being the 3rd largest big box retailer to almost nothing. Eddie Lampert was the worst thing to happen not only to Sears and Kmart but Brick and mortar retail
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