http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/21cwiki1.jpg
Information & Latest News
900 W. Main (http://goo.gl/maps/mZubG)
cost=$51.5 million
start=2014
finish=June 2016
height=4 stories
sq. feet=173,680

3/21/14: Chat transcript with president Craig Greenberg (http://newsok.com/steve-lackmeyer-new-21c-museum-hotel-will-spur-redevelopment-of-other-okc-buildings/article/3945616)
12/18/13: City Council approves $5.3 million in TIF fundting (http://newsok.com/tif-money-approved-for-three-downtown-oklahoma-city-construction-projects/article/3915574)
11/25/13: Pioneering developers pointing west (http://newsok.com/pioneering-developers-pointing-west-in-oklahoma-city/article/3908548)
11/24/13: Historic auto plant set to become hotel (Historic auto plant set to become hotel, all-hours cultural hub)
11/23/13: As we first reported on 11/20, this hotel will in fact be going into the Fred Jones Building.

Links
Downtown Hotel Summary
Urban Project Summary
County Assessor Record (http://www.oklahomacounty.org/assessor/Searches/AN-R.asp?ACCOUNTNO=R013689090)
http://www.21cmuseumhotels.com/
OCU Law School Project (dead) (http://www.okctalk.com/showwiki.php?title=New%20OCU%20Law%20School%20dead&redirect=no)
Gallery

Would be an awesome place to convert to apartments.

Was an early Model T assembly plant. Mr. Jones worked there as a young man before going into the car business himself. Eventually he and his company became wartime innovators in the automotive remanufacturing industry. Because of materials rationing and conversion of automobile manufacturing plants to military production, you could not buy new automobile models. People still needed to have cars though, so he and his company filled that need by remanufacturing components such as engines and transmissions. Initially they started in the back of the Fred Jones Ford dealership at Robinson and Reno. They became the largest remanufacturer in the U.S., and when he needed to expand, Mr. Jones bought the old Ford plant where he had once worked. It is a great American story.

Agree wholeheartedly that it could/should be some of the best loft housing anywhere in this part of the country. Amazing floor-to-ceiling casement windows all around, great proximity to a rapidly-emerging district in Film Row...so much potential.

In some ways this building and Film Row reminds me of Brightleaf Square from home. Two old tobacco warehouses converted to retail, restaurants, and office space.

Brightleaf Square :: Fine Dining and Shopping in Downtown Durham (http://www.historicbrightleaf.com/)

Is the building for sale again?

When OCU Law was looking at it, one of the family spokesman (fred jones hall) was quoted in a Steve Lackmeyer article (nov 18, 2009) that although they have had many inquiries, they were looking for a non profit that would return something to the downtown area while allowing the property to stay in the family's hands.

I doubt you will ever see the plant itself change hands, at least while the current generation is still around. I think they view themselves as caretakers of Mr. Jones' legacy, taking it very seriously, and deservedly so. Also, unlike subsequent generations of many successful families, the children and grandchildren of Fred Jones have done a remarkable job of maintaining and adding to what he built. I don't see any circumstances where that family would feel compelled to sell the building out of need. Based on this and the fact that I know they love serving the community, I understand the desire to have the structure become home to a non-profit of some sort.

That said, I really do personally think the highest and best use of the building would be as some of the most outstanding urban housing in this part of the country.

What nonprofit would be large enough to need a huge building like that?


How about creating a non-profit that would convert the structure to housing then rent at reduced rate to anyone who pledges to do a certain amount of work for the community?

Kind of a community action/involvement incubator that focuses on several areas of need, such as beautification, mentoring/tutoring kids in inner city schools, etc.

That's a fantastic idea, Pete.

Chesapeake did something like that with the Chesapeake Community Plaza just off Britton near Broadway Extension. Maybe Devon, Continental or OG&E would be willing to step up and do the same thing here.

Chesapeake did something like that with the Chesapeake Community Plaza just off Britton near Broadway Extension. Maybe Devon, Continental or OG&E would be willing to step up and do the same thing here.

Tech - You're close. It's on the south side of Wilshire Boulevard between Western & Broadway. And that's a good comparison.

That Chesapeake development though actually houses various non-profit organizations at reduced rent.

I'm suggesting this building be converted to housing and reduced rent offered to those who volunteer a minimum amount of time towards approved community causes.

There are plenty of non-profits in that area who would benefit from housing that would supply them with volunteers.

Here is what Fred Jones Hall said when they struck the deal with OCU Law School:


We have criteria that have to be passed — it has to be a nonprofit institution that would help downtown, and at the same time allow the building to stay in the hands of the family.

I may get in contact with him and see if we can brainstorm some ideas.

Such a fantastic building and it's a shame to see it sit empty while the whole city is raging around it.

Pete, I would encourage you to. Though I wouldn't represent to know him well, I worked for him on two separate occasions (the first for the family company for 5+ years), and never found him to be or heard of him being anything other than a really decent guy who cares as much for OKC as anyone. The same holds true for his brothers and the rest of the family. Very good people. I would expect that he would be very receptive to good ideas and would treat you with respect. I think your idea is definitely worth listening to, at the very least.

As a recent graduate of OCU Law School, I find the claim of not-for-profit status to be overtly fraudulent.

That's funny. I graduated in 97 and the tuition was $395/hr. I hear it is about 1000/hr now. I told them that I will think about donating about my student loans are paid off in another 15 years.

While strolling in the San Marco area of Jacksonville last weekend I came across Sam Marco Lofts. It was an old elementary school that was converted to 38 live/work units. Something like this would be huge for downtown OKC and would fit perfectly in the Fred Jones building

This website has lot of pictures in the gallery section

The Lofts San Marco / A new lease on light. (http://www.theloftssanmarco.com)

http://media2.rent.com/media/property/228/404/650X430/22840428.jpg

Bricktown would be nice, but with the rumors of Hotel Black turning into housing or back into a hotel, I can't help but think this might be going there. Look at their other locations and they are old historic building. My pipe dream would be for a hotel like this to be in First National, with top 8-10 floors being housing.

Bricktown would be nice, but with the rumors of Hotel Black turning into housing or back into a hotel, I can't help but think this might be going there. Look at their other locations and they are old historic building. My pipe dream would be for a hotel like this to be in First National, with top 8-10 floors being housing.

Yes! Could very well be for Hotel Black / One North Hudson.

Would fit better there with proximity to the Arts District, Myriad Gardens, etc. Also would fit their profile of going into historic buildings.

Imagine the rooftop bar at that location... With an awesome art gallery on the ground level.

Louisville:
http://www.ratestogo.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/21c-hotel-and-museum.jpg

Cincinnati:
http://media.expedia.com/hotels/6000000/5290000/5287100/5287002/5287002_22_b.jpg

This hotel is amazing. It would be great to have something like this in OKC and would be a much unique experience from the typical Marriott Courtyard. I hope that it ends up here. I think the Arts district would be nice, but personally I think on the canal would be amazing if it is possible to do. If they can't build it directly on the canal, then they shouldn't do Bricktown and should do the arts district.

Now this would be special !

I really do think this will be in the former Hotel Black / One North Hudson building.

Especially when you consider that Devon has helped Preftakes bank-roll these properties and that Larry Nichols is incredibly passionate about the Colcord Hotel; so much so he wants to commission a book about it.

This would be the perfect use of this structure, especially given it's proximity to Devon, the Myriad Gardens, OKC Museum of Art, the Civic Center, etc.


I'm very, very excited about this project and already envisioning cocktails on the rooftop bar, overlooking the gardens, Devon Tower, Stage Center Tower, and perhaps another tower on the site of Carpenter Square.

This could be amazing.

http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5072d1384955844-one-north-hudson-black01s_metlib.jpg

I don't see any mention yet of OKC on their twitter page, but there's one about KC:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BXitkP_CcAAvQzt.jpg:large

Source: https://twitter.com/21cHotels/status/394475737438113792

Renovation of the Savoy in downtown Kansas City awaiting approval of TIF funding.

I had never heard of 21c before, but this seems like a very slick and well run operation. They are apparently trying to expand pretty aggressively.

This would be really cool for us. We already have a couple of nice boutique hotels coming (Aloft, Ambassador). More would be even better.

In addition to Kansas City (note they are also seeking TIF funds there), this is from 21c's Future Projects page:

A growing brand
Following the success in the bluegrass, the 21c Team is looking at opportunities to contribute to the cultural and civic life in urban centers across the country.

Under Construction
Durham, North Carolina
The 17-story Hill Building in downtown Durham, North Carolina will be the 5th boutique hotel location for 21c Museum Hotels. 21c plans to rehabilitate the historic building originally designed by Shreve, Lamb, and Harmon, the firm best known for the Empire State Building. The property, which will feature a contemporary art museum and restaurant, is scheduled to open in 2015.

Under Development
Lexington, Kentucky
21c Museum Hotels plans to develop a new combination boutique hotel, contemporary art museum and restaurant in downtown Lexington pending the approval of city government and other financing incentives. The hotel will be housed in downtown Lexington’s historic Fayette National Bank Building. It will be woven into the fabric of downtown, welcoming both visitors and members of the community to experience its rotating exhibitions, participate in its cultural events and enjoy its culinary offerings.

Wanted to make sure everyone saw this:

The Cincinnati 21c was recently named the #1 hotel in the U.S. and #11 internationally: LINK (http://www.21cmuseumhotels.com/cincinnati/visit/news/2013/conde-nast-traveler-readers-vote-21c-museum-hotels-to-top-100-hotels-in-the-world/)


21c Museum Hotel in Cincinnati has been named the #1 hotel in the United States and #11 worldwide in the prestigious Condé Nast Traveler Readers’ Choice Awards, with 21c Museum Hotel Louisville ranking #8 in the country and #46 in the world and 21c Museum Hotel Bentonville debuting at #11 in the country and #75 internationally. The awards appear in the November issue and are the results of the Condé Nast Traveler Readers’ Choice survey with an unprecedented 1.3 million votes cast this year by nearly 80,000 participants.

It's a shame this couldn't be done to First National...

If this is true and the do come to OKC and they do choose Hotel Black as a location, I definitely think it could be top 5. That area alone will set a great vibe. Possibility of 2 new towers and the new Devon Tower, the Myriad Gardens, in the not to distant future the convention center will be just a walk through the park, as well as the Thunder games, the arts festival, a new school.... everything happening there might make Hotel Black the best location for a new hotel in the entire city. Especially a hotel of this caliber!

^

Yes, this all makes perfect sense.

Besides all of that, along with the Stage Center Tower, it would also create a very important bridge between the CBD and the western part of downtown, especially Film Row.

I really think that area (west) is going to take off in the very near future.

"I'm keeping a close eye on One North Hudson, the former Hotel Black - is something wonderful ahead for it?" -@Stevelackmeyer

Tweet from Steve this morning

This would be fantastic.

I hope so too Pete.

I've heard the Fred Jones building is another possibility but that is so far removed from everything else it seems unlikely.

I've heard the Fred Jones building is another possibility but that is so far removed from everything else it seems unlikely.

My understanding o fthe Fred Jones building is that they 1) don't want to let go of actual ownership, and 2) want the building to be used for something educational/non-profit/community enhancement (ie...small business incubator), wtc. Not sure something this for profit and commercial would fit into what I guess/suspect is their vision for this property.

How many rooms did the Hotel Black originally have? The reason I ask is the Cincy 21c Museum Hotel has 156 rooms, the Bentonville hotel has 104 rooms and the Louisville hotel has 90 rooms. Would this be somewhere in the middle of that?

My understanding o fthe Fred Jones building is that they 1) don't want to let go of actual ownership, and 2) want the building to be used for something educational/non-profit/community enhancement (ie...small business incubator), wtc. Not sure something this for profit and commercial would fit into what I guess/suspect is their vision for this property.

I believe there is something in the works for this, but do to the initial purpose of the building things can take longer for a change of hands to occur.

How many rooms did the Hotel Black originally have? The reason I ask is the Cincy 21c Museum Hotel has 156 rooms, the Bentonville hotel has 104 rooms and the Louisville hotel has 90 rooms. Would this be somewhere in the middle of that?

If the amount of Hotel Black rooms is somewhat smaller and this company has used historic buildings and built new digs, would it not be viable for them to combine both concepts? Also, they can move the art that lines the walls of the Stage Center.

If the amount of Hotel Black rooms is somewhat smaller and this company has used historic buildings and built new digs, would it not be viable for them to combine both concepts? Also, they can move the art that lines the walls of the Stage Center.

I have no clue how much room you need for a hotel room but the floors here at One N Hudson are approx. 3300-3500 sq feet per floor for floors 2-9. The tenth floor has a staircase up to the atrium on top that takes some of the square footage away. There is also a full basement and the annex that is attached on the west side that adds additional space and it has a second floor.

I believe there is something in the works for this, but do to the initial purpose of the building things can take longer for a change of hands to occur.

You're saying there's something in the works for the Fred Jones Building?

I have no clue how much room you need for a hotel room but the floors here at One N Hudson are approx. 3300-3500 sq feet per floor for floors 2-9. The tenth floor has a staircase up to the atrium on top that takes some of the square footage away. There is also a full basement and the annex that is attached on the west side that adds additional space and it has a second floor.

So the hotel would probably be on floors 2-9 with the atrium area hosting the restaurant and rooftop bar and the annex for the museum, spa, other amenities. They have several different kinds of rooms at the Bentonville hotel that run 375-475 sq ft so that would put eight or so on each floor (including hallways, ice machine, etc) and that would make it a 64 room hotel. Seems a little small unless they use a lot of other space for the room and the atrium level for hotel room suites.

Also, Preftakes owns the buildings next door so room to grow or demolish and build more space directly west. They could get some rooms on the second floor of the annex,

The Colcord has 110,000 square feet and 108 rooms.

The main part of One North Hudson (not including the smaller building to the west) is about 55,000 sf.

The Colcord has 110,000 square feet and 108 rooms.

The main part of One North Hudson (not including the smaller building to the west) is about 55,000 sf.

Wow, I didn't realize the Colcord was so much bigger.

One North Hudson has a lot of additional land to expand to the west....

Yep, the two smaller buildings immediately west of One North Hudson are not historical, and then there is large lot between those and the bus station.

Just heard AGAIN that the location for this hotel may be the Fred Jones Building.

Doesn't make sense but it's from people I trust.

Just heard AGAIN that the location for this hotel may be the Fred Jones Building.

Doesn't make sense but it's from people I trust.

That would be big, only because it's tying in and expanding the western side of downtown and adding momentum toward the Farmer's Market area.

I would be SHOCKED to ever see the Fred Jones building change hands. The Hall family holds Mr. Jones' legacy very dear, and he not only worked in that building on the Model T assembly line as a young man but later bought that building from Henry Ford himself. It's much more than a real estate investment property to them (of which they have plenty of others). I believe we can/will see something great there one day, but I doubt it will involve transfer of ownership. Does anyone recall whether the proposed/abandoned OCU Law relocation to that building involved lease or purchase? I'm betting the former.

I would be SHOCKED to ever see the Fred Jones building change hands. The Hall family holds Mr. Jones' legacy very dear, and he not only worked in that building on the Model T assembly line as a young man but later bought that building from Henry Ford himself. It's much more than a real estate investment property to them (of which they have plenty of others). I believe we can/will see something great there one day, but I doubt it will involve transfer of ownership. Does anyone recall whether the proposed/abandoned OCU Law relocation to that building involved lease or purchase? I'm betting the former.

I believe you are correct, it was going to be a lease.

Could the auto hotel be converted to be additional hotel space?

Yep, the two smaller buildings immediately west of One North Hudson are not historical, and then there is large lot between those and the bus station.

Good point. The hotel in Bentonville was new construction so a hybrid of historical (Hotel Black) and the not historical building next to it may be feasible if TIF funds allow. Also, if non historical...easier to tear down to put in a second taller building for more rooms.

I think the Fred Jones building would be very cool but can't see family letting it go and also can't see the attraction for hotel that removed from downtown and entertainment district and/or convention center. As much as I would like for Film Exchange to become a entertainment district...not sure I see that happening. Definitely not on my end due to the elementary school and restrictions on liquor licensing

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/UnFrSaKn/Old%20Oklahoma%20City/Black%20Hotel/blackhotel1947.jpg

While we're contemplating the thought of the old Hotel Black being renovated as a new boutique hotel, I thought I'd play around with a great photo of that area that I just came across:

http://dl.dropbox.com/s/52vgerrk2v1axb8/FutureSheridan.jpg

That section of Sheridan is going to be one sweet spot in downtown!

Just heard AGAIN that the location for this hotel may be the Fred Jones Building.

Doesn't make sense but it's from people I trust.

One issue that I just realized that may be pushing this. The current state law requirements regarding schools and alcohol would limit a hotel bar at the Hotel Black, would it not? The Fred Jones would meet the separation requirement...

^

True but remember there was an exception made in Bricktown for ACM@UCO.

One issue that I just realized that may be pushing this. The current state law requirements regarding schools and alcohol would limit a hotel bar at the Hotel Black, would it not? The Fred Jones would meet the separation requirement...

I assume you are referring to the distance between the John Rex Elementary School and the Hotel Black?

One issue that I just realized that may be pushing this. The current state law requirements regarding schools and alcohol would limit a hotel bar at the Hotel Black, would it not? The Fred Jones would meet the separation requirement...

A hotel establishment is usually a bar/restaurant though and that is permissible right? It's just "class C" liquor licenses i.e. a bar that doesn't serve food that cannot be granted within 300 feet of a church or school as far as I know. I would hate for that to prevent redevelopment of the Hotel Black or hinder it from its potential.

A hotel establishment is usually a bar/restaurant though and that is permissible right? It's just "class C" liquor licenses i.e. a bar that doesn't serve food that cannot be granted within 300 feet of a church or school as far as I know. I would hate for that to prevent redevelopment of the Hotel Black or hinder it from its potential.

Just out of curiosity, does the 300' rule work if its 150' on the ground and 150' up? lol

Just out of curiosity, does the 300' rule work if its 150' on the ground and 150' up? lol

Ha... back in the '70's, I'd fly from OKC to Denver and the airline I was on at the time gave out small bottles of wine. The pilot at the time would tell us they would have to avoid flying over southwest Kansas due to the liquor laws.

Just out of curiosity, does the 300' rule work if its 150' on the ground and 150' up? lol

Sorry, but using the Pythagorean theorem still yields a 212.13 foot straight line distance, so... no banana daiquiri for you! :(