I'm sad to report that this deal seems to be dead for OKC.

The consultant hired by this company told the City last week that we have been eliminated. Not sure why or that we'll ever know much more.

Also quite sure the company was/is Amazon.

I suspect Owasso may get this instead -- will probably be an official announcement soon.

We may have been too close to the new center in Ft Worth....?

I'm sad to report that this deal seems to be dead for OKC.

The consultant hired by this company told the City last week that we have been eliminated. Not sure why or that we'll ever know much more.

Also quite sure the company was/is Amazon.

I suspect Owasso may get this instead -- will probably be an official announcement soon.

Well we had good news and bad news so far this week, we can't win them all.

We may have been too close to the new center in Ft Worth....?

What's strange is that have a large facility in Coffeyville, KS which is only 60 miles from Owasso.

OKC needs to step-up our offering and make this happen. It needs to be big enough to get their attention. Evidently, the previous "package" did not maintain their attention.

I'm hearing google in the Tulsa market played a roll in this coming to the Tulsa market.

I'm sad to report that this deal seems to be dead for OKC.

The consultant hired by this company told the City last week that we have been eliminated. Not sure why or that we'll ever know much more.

Also quite sure the company was/is Amazon.


I suspect Owasso may get this instead -- will probably be an official announcement soon.

Surely OKC can "out bid' Owasso?

Surely OKC can "out bid' Owasso?

Tulsa really needs this so it wouldn't surprise me if they outbid OKC. Tulsa has been falling behind - significantly - in major economic growth (not counting retail openings). They haven't been doing bad per say but their population growth and job growth has been much slower than OKC and if things don't pick up, in 10-15 years they will be playing a distant second fiddle to OKC.

OKC needs to step-up our offering and make this happen. It needs to be big enough to get their attention. Evidently, the previous "package" did not maintain their attention.

Spend millions getting in a bidding war with another Oklahoma City...no thanks.

Spend millions getting in a bidding war with another Oklahoma City...no thanks.

you might want to un-capitalize that C…otherwise your statement is confusing ;)

Steve's chat today said his source denied this being Amazon....?

Spend millions getting in a bidding war with another Oklahoma City...no thanks.

Do you really think Tulsa just shares the same position here? ...they are not taking a passive approach to this opportunity. OKC should not either.

Guys, OKC needs ALL levels / types of jobs in OKC. GE is great and it is a Gem for OKC (and the state of ok too), we need to keep this opportunity w/ Amazon (yes, Steve's sources at way off on this if he is saying it is NOT Amazon ) here in the central OKC metro. We must press hard on this one, these type of companies ( Amazon / Google / etc) travel in packs when it comes to locations & jobs.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's not Amazon, just because of what Pete said about Coffeyville having a DC just 60 miles away.

Nobody knows for 100% certain who it is/was because they are using a code name (Project Socrates) and a group of consultants as intermediaries.

However, I am sure it's the same group that is looking at Owasso (Project Socrates was used in a newspaper report) so when/if that is announced, we'll know for sure at least who it is but will likely never get the full story of why OKC lost out.

I heard it was due to negotiations over the land (old Corning location) but don't know more than that.

Nobody knows for 100% certain who it is/was because they are using a code name (Project Socrates) and a group of consultants as intermediaries.

However, I am sure it's the same group that is looking at Owasso (Project Socrates was used in a newspaper report) so when/if that is announced, we'll know for sure at least who it is but will likely never get the full story of why OKC lost out.

I heard it was due to negotiations over the land (old Corning location) but don't know more than that.

That's sad if that's really the case. Unnecessary loss for OKC.

OKC needs to step-up our offering and make this happen. It needs to be big enough to get their attention. Evidently, the previous "package" did not maintain their attention.

I agree to an extent. But we're probably looking at other opportunities as well. Each opportunity probably has a ceiling as to the value. Who's to say this is the biggest deal we're working on right now? My guess is that it's not. Owasso, on the other hand, probably doesn't have many irons in the fire.

I agree to an extent. But we're probably looking at other opportunities as well. Each opportunity probably has a ceiling as to the value. Who's to say this is the biggest deal we're working on right now? My guess is that it's not. Owasso, on the other hand, probably doesn't have many irons in the fire.

Steve mentioned in his chat that he is worried about the biggest deal he was tracking falling apart. That makes me wonder if this is in fact the biggest thing on the horizon right now or if its something else.

As far as the incentives, this specific deal may be more valuable to Tulsa than it is to OKC. This may be the only big thing Tulsa has on the horizon while OKC may have a few deals in the works.

"Winning" a bidding war isn't always a good thing. You need to be careful not to overbid and pay too much for an employer. Remember what happened to United Airlines with their maintenance facility that went to Indianapolis. OKC was caught up in the fast, final negotiations, and revisited their bid after Indy won. It was determined that we offered way too much money. When United ultimately closed the facility, it turned into a real blessing in disguise.

OKC needs to provide them an alternate location in OKC, or Team w/ others ( Norman / Yukon / Mustang , if they want to be close proximity of Airport) through a JV and make this package one they / Amazon says yes to. The old Corning Location may not be that nice of an area they are looking for ( most likely ) since Owasso is a "favorable spot".

Especially with Cathy O'Connor and the Economic Alliance, I trust that OKC does a great job of putting together an unified pitch and incentive program.

As Tom said, sometimes it's best to make your best possible deal then walk away if it isn't good enough.

There are a limited amount of funds and I'm sure we'll get other opportunities. I bet they are working on others we don't even know about.

Steve mentioned in his chat that he is worried about the biggest deal he was tracking falling apart. That makes me wonder if this is in fact the biggest thing on the horizon right now or if its something else.

As far as the incentives, this specific deal may be more valuable to Tulsa than it is to OKC. This may be the only big thing Tulsa has on the horizon while OKC may have a few deals in the works.

Really? Wow, that was quick. Just yesterday he was saying we had a much bigger gift to unwrap.

Steve mentioned in his chat that he is worried about the biggest deal he was tracking falling apart. That makes me wonder if this is in fact the biggest thing on the horizon right now or if its something else.

As far as the incentives, this specific deal may be more valuable to Tulsa than it is to OKC. This may be the only big thing Tulsa has on the horizon while OKC may have a few deals in the works.

That's incorrect, he said he is not so sure about the deal he was most excited about for downtown OKC, not coming to fruition. Not necessarily biggest deal...

"Winning" a bidding war isn't always a good thing. You need to be careful not to overbid and pay too much for an employer. Remember what happened to United Airlines with their maintenance facility that went to Indianapolis. OKC was caught up in the fast, final negotiations, and revisited their bid after Indy won. It was determined that we offered way too much money. When United ultimately closed the facility, it turned into a real blessing in disguise.

Maybe I can explain it this way. We are not the type of economic balance (yet) that we can lose out on Any major employer today. OKC metro needs these 1,000 jobs, think of it as 1,000 Families / Households that are affected.

This opportunty w/ Amazon is completely removed from our local / regional economic base. Bidding war, it's ALL bidding wars. That is business 101.

That's incorrect, he said he is not so sure about the deal he was most excited about for downtown OKC, not coming to fruition. Not necessarily biggest deal...

I would have bolded the downtown OKC part, actually. That clearly indicates that Steve was not talking about the development pertinent to this thread.

Maybe I can explain it this way. We are not the type of economic balance (yet) that we can lose out on Any major employer today. OKC metro needs these 1,000 jobs, think of it as 1,000 Families / Households that are affected.

This opportunty w/ Amazon is completely removed from our local / regional economic base. Bidding war, it's ALL bidding wars. That is business 101.

This isn't monopoly…it's not a buy every property you land on kind of game. The incentives will be used on other businesses. Maybe not another single 1,000 employee business…but what if it lures ten 80 employee businesses that have greater growth opportunity and higher paying wages?

You can't win every battle, so it's important that your strategy remains consistent and sensible.

Really? Wow, that was quick. Just yesterday he was saying we had a much bigger gift to unwrap.

Even if the BIGGEST development he was tracking may not happen, that doesn't mean there isn't other stuff out there bigger than what has already been announced but not as big of a deal as what he was most excited about.

Especially with Cathy O'Connor and the Economic Alliance, I trust that OKC does a great job of putting together an unified pitch and incentive program.

As Tom said, sometimes it's best to make your best possible deal then walk away if it isn't good enough.

There are a limited amount of funds and I'm sure we'll get other opportunities. I bet they are working on others we don't even know about.

My HOPE is they are, but this is HOW you manage this topic. Focus on the customer in front of you. We need to let the others ( w/ all their potential) line up and be counted, but when it comes to a large Employer ( Amazon ) we need to do ALL we can to make this happen. We can't start giving Tulsa any momentum in the jobs bebate. The next employer that looks at OKC vs. Tulsa might be even more desirable and then Tulsa "will" be the trendy place to be. ....zero room for competition. We don't want to give them any momentum.

The City of Moore could use these 1,000 jobs / households affected. That would go along way....hmmm?

Maybe I can explain it this way. We are not the type of economic balance (yet) that we can lose out on Any major employer today. OKC metro needs these 1,000 jobs, think of it as 1,000 Families / Households that are affected.

This opportunty w/ Amazon is completely removed from our local / regional economic base. Bidding war, it's ALL bidding wars. That is business 101.

Wow, thanks for the lecture, professor. I think the people who are doing their best to land these jobs are doing their best. We've gotten Continental, GE, Dell, and Boeing in the last few years. These are all very high-paying job. I think they know the stakes.

We're not desperate, though, and we're not stupid. We're not going to get played for incentive money better used elsewhere. We'll come to the table with our best deal, and if they don't take it, we'll move on.

This isn't like the old days. We have a lot of very savvy people involved in these efforts, now, not just a bunch of good old boys. Have a little faith. We're sure as hell doing better than Owasso -- and most American large cities.

For what it's worth, I don't think this was a matter of incentives, especially since Owasso would be pulling from some of the same state programs.

There was some issue with the site.

My HOPE is they are, but this is HOW you manage this topic. Focus on the customer in front of you. We need to let the others ( w/ all their potential) line up and be counted, but when it comes to a large Employer ( Amazon ) we need to do ALL we can to make this happen. We can't start giving Tulsa any momentum in the jobs bebate. The next employer that looks at OKC vs. Tulsa might be even more desirable and then Tulsa "will" be the trendy place to be. ....zero room for competition. We don't want to give them any momentum.

The City of Moore could use these 1,000 jobs / households affected. That would go along way....hmmm?

I do agree with this the more I think about it, especially this being against Tulsa. Jobs/economic growth is one area where OKC is really pulling ahead of Tulsa. If Tulsa is able to get a leg up there, combine that with the other advantages Tulsa has and the momentum could easily shift in their favor.

This isn't monopoly…it's not a buy every property you land on kind of game. The incentives will be used on other businesses. Maybe not another single 1,000 employee business…but what if it lures ten 80 employee businesses that have greater growth opportunity and higher paying wages?

You can't win every battle, so it's important that your strategy remains consistent and sensible.

Ok, I will explain it this way.. If oil drops below $60 Brl, all things will come to a stop here in OKC. The small ones w/ a local "reliance' will have to stop and take a look at their business plan. Then you will want that other business w/ those 1,000 jobs. BTW, these are 800 full-time w/ 400 part-time. And the 800 were solid paying postions. Not just 8-12 hr. And, this Amazon company is bringing in outside investment dollars and not just OKC "recycling" the same one. fyi.

My hope is oil gets to $120 Brl and we keep this going for 20 years.

I do agree with this the more I think about it, especially this being against Tulsa. Jobs/economic growth is one area where OKC is really pulling ahead of Tulsa. If Tulsa is able to get a leg up there, combine that with the other advantages Tulsa has and the momentum could easily shift in their favor.

This is laughable. We're less than 24 hours from the GE announcement. We've been smoking Tulsa in jobs announcements, unemployment, and income growth. We've been getting high-profile relocations like Boeing while they have been bleeding jobs from American, lost the Dollar-Thrifty HQ, etc. Name one serious Tulsa jobs announcement in the last 24 months.

It will take years and years for Tulsa to catch up to OKC economically. Years. Don't forget the pending announcement of the MLP; my guess is OKC, not Houston, will be its headquarters.

We should do what we can to win these jobs but don't lose perspective on our city's position. Frankly, the statement above is yet one more example of your "glass half empty" comments that have little grounding in the facts.

Mayor Norick taught us we should concentrate on enhancing the quality of life style for those currently here, but for those who come later. I trust those responsible for such things to look at the deal and make a reasonable judgement.
Some times, the best deal is the one in which you walk away.

This is laughable. We're less than 24 hours from the GE announcement. We've been smoking Tulsa in jobs announcements, unemployment, and income growth. We've been getting high-profile relocations like Boeing while they have been bleeding jobs from American, lost the Dollar-Thrifty HQ, etc. Name one serious Tulsa jobs announcement in the last 24 months.

It will take years and years for Tulsa to catch up to OKC economically. Years. Don't forget the pending announcement of the MLP; my guess is OKC, not Houston, will be its headquarters.

We should do what we can to win these jobs but don't lose perspective on our city's position. Frankly, the statement above is yet one more example of your "glass half empty" comments that have little grounding in the facts.

I don't think losing an Amazon distribution center is going to give Tulsa any sort of long-term leg up. Tulsa has been stagnating in terms of jobs announcements and this will be a shot in the arm for them. Its understandable they would be willing to put forth more incentives for this distribution center than OKC would. Tulsa needs this. However, if as OKVision said, oil drops to $60/bbl AND Tulsa lands another high profile high-tech company beyond the Amazon center, the momentum could shift in their favor. With everything that has been announced in OKC this may seem like just gravy now, but things can and do change. I can see both sides in this debate.

This is laughable. We're less than 24 hours from the GE announcement. We've been smoking Tulsa in jobs announcements, unemployment, and income growth. We've been getting high-profile relocations like Boeing while they have been bleeding jobs from American, lost the Dollar-Thrifty HQ, etc. Name one serious Tulsa jobs announcement in the last 24 months.

It will take years and years for Tulsa to catch up to OKC economically. Years. Don't forget the pending announcement of the MLP; my guess is OKC, not Houston, will be its headquarters.

We should do what we can to win these jobs but don't lose perspective on our city's position. Frankly, the statement above is yet one more example of your "glass half empty" comments that have little grounding in the facts.

Our local economy is so tied into the O&G market, that it will swing with the Eb & Flow of that market. ( I love that market, I want it to be here and strong for another 100 years. ) OKC needs to have all the other segments THRIVING. Tech / Healthcare / Bio / Aero and it is getting better each year. I just want to fight for ALL big jobs movers for other families here in OKC metro.

I don't think losing an Amazon distribution center is going to give Tulsa any sort of long-term leg up. Tulsa has been stagnating in terms of jobs announcements and this will be a shot in the arm for them. Its understandable they would be willing to put forth more incentives for this distribution center than OKC would. Tulsa needs this. However, if as OKVision said, oil drops to $60/bbl AND Tulsa lands another high profile high-tech company beyond the Amazon center, the momentum could shift in their favor. With everything that has been announced in OKC this may seem like just gravy now, but things can and do change. I can see both sides in this debate.

If the price of oil tanks OKC is screwed -- but so is Tulsa, Houston, and maybe even Denver and other cities. We do not have a very diversified economy. We are going "all in" on oil and gas. It's great right now, but that is the risk. 1000 distribution center jobs would not be our economic salvation if the commodity price of oil and gas tank precipitously. Fortunately, the global demand for oil and gas are not decreasing.

I don't think losing an Amazon distribution center is going to give Tulsa any sort of long-term leg up. Tulsa has been stagnating in terms of jobs announcements and this will be a shot in the arm for them. Its understandable they would be willing to put forth more incentives for this distribution center than OKC would. Tulsa needs this. However, if as OKVision said, oil drops to $60/bbl AND Tulsa lands another high profile high-tech company beyond the Amazon center, the momentum could shift in their favor. With everything that has been announced in OKC this may seem like just gravy now, but things can and do change. I can see both sides in this debate.

If oil drops to $60/bbl with no corresponding rise in natgas both OKC and Tulsa will be in trouble.

I'm with guru on here. It's never a good idea to start believing your poo doesn't stink, I don't get the negativity here. Crabbiness from cabin fever, maybe?

You have to think it would at least damage the relationship or make things awkward in the negotiation room when the site selectors learn that someone involved in a top secret deal has been leaking details to a public website.

If the price of oil tanks OKC is screwed -- but so is Tulsa, Houston, and maybe even Denver and other cities. We do not have a very diversified economy. We are going "all in" on oil and gas. It's great right now, but that is the risk. 1000 distribution center jobs would not be our economic salvation if the commodity price of oil and gas tank precipitously. Fortunately, the global demand for oil and gas are not decreasing.

Guru / Daniel .... The best times to increase (outside / non-traditional ) economic segements : This is for Oklahoma anything other-than Agri / Energy Oil & Gas / Institutional & Government jobs, is Now. This is when we beaf-up our Healthcare / Bio / Tech / Aero / & yes, Distrubtion too. If OKC metro could get these other segments to "wag the dog" than the price of oil would always be gravy and not primary or single purpose ecoonmy.

Hey, you tell me, would an addtional 1,000 jobs be a major impact to Moore right now? ... Tornado victims could certainly use this to speed up recovery and help them get their swaggr back.

Guys... OKVision4U is the Edgar of all other threads. He/She have ideas in their head and nothing you say will change that. He/She is right and you are too dumb to understand the brilliance of those arguments.

Carry on...

Guru / Daniel .... The best times to increase (outside / non-traditional ) economic segements : This is for Oklahoma anything other-than Agri / Energy Oil & Gas / Institutional & Government jobs, is Now. This is when we beaf-up our Healthcare / Bio / Tech / Aero / & yes, Distrubtion too. If OKC metro could get these other segments to "wag the dog" than the price of oil would always be gravy and not primary or single purpose ecoonmy.

Hey, you tell me, would an addtional 1,000 jobs be a major impact to Moore right now? ... Tornado victims could certainly use this to speed up recovery and help them get their swaggr back.

I agree, and don't oversimplify what I'm saying. Perhaps I should make it more clear to you: OKC SHOULD FIGHT HARD TO GET ALL KINDS OF JOBS, whether white collar, blue collar, manufacturing, technical, service, and even public sector. Do not misunderstand: we should aggressively go after them. But we shouldn't go in the tank on incentives out of desperation.

We won't win every battle, but we're doing something right. OKC was recently recognized for being in the top 5 of all cities for middle class job growth. Don't lose perspective.

As to economic diversification, I've been a proponent of that for three decades, so no argument there. However, the biggest private sector influencers in OKC and the state for economic development are oil and gas guys, so they tend to dominate the boards / committees / organizations that undertake our economic development efforts, and they have the loudest voice.

Tell them you want us to compete with Silicon Valley. Tell them you want us to diversify our energy economy by focusing on alternative energy jobs as well.

People have been talking about diversifying OKC's economy beyond oil and gas for my entire adult life, and while we have made progress in certain areas, this is an oil and gas town baby.

Guys... OKVision4U is the Edgar of all other threads. He/She have ideas in their head and nothing you say will change that. He/She is right and you are too dumb to understand the brilliance of those arguments.

Carry on...

...no, it looks like just a few of you Brett.

I agree, and don't oversimplify what I'm saying. Perhaps I should make it more clear to you: OKC SHOULD FIGHT HARD TO GET ALL KINDS OF JOBS, whether white collar, blue collar, manufacturing, technical, service, and even public sector. Do not misunderstand: we should aggressively go after them. But we shouldn't go in the tank on incentives out of desperation.

We won't win every battle, but we're doing something right. OKC was recently recognized for being in the top 5 of all cities for middle class job growth. Don't lose perspective.

As to economic diversification, I've been a proponent of that for three decades, so no argument there. However, the biggest private sector influencers in OKC and the state for economic development are oil and gas guys, so they tend to dominate the boards / committees / organizations that undertake our economic development efforts, and they have the loudest voice.

Tell them you want us to compete with Silicon Valley. Tell them you want us to diversify our energy economy by focusing on alternative energy jobs as well.

People have been talking about diversifying OKC's economy beyond oil and gas for my entire adult life, and while we have made progress in certain areas, this is an oil and gas town baby.

Guru, we are on the same page for sure. We probably agree on 95% here. OKC has a great image across the US now and I love it. I just don't want to ever over-look 1,000 jobs to Owasso. It's not like we lost them to Austin / Dallas / KC / LA / Miami / NYC. I get that, but Owasso? Surely we can make a stronger push and "win" that one.

Also, until this state puts serious efforts into improving the outcomes AND FUNDING for common education AND higher education, we are not going to be attractive to many employers outside of the realm we have now.

Also, until this state puts serious efforts into improving the outcomes AND FUNDING for common education AND higher education, we are not going to be attractive to many employers outside of the realm we have now.

+1

We can take a loss of this distribution center. OKC does need to the quote "we'll do anything and everything to land every single opportunity" rather than be realistic as to what each deal is worth it to the city and if they one day leave, can we say that was money well spent bringing them here. It sucks and maybe out of some miracle we will still get it but for now, just keep waiting for other wonderful news.

We can take a loss of this distribution center. OKC does need to the quote "we'll do anything and everything to land every single opportunity" rather than be realistic as to what each deal is worth it to the city and if they one day leave, can we say that was money well spent bringing them here. It sucks and maybe out of some miracle we will still get it but for now, just keep waiting for other wonderful news.

..well that's one way to look at it.

Yeah and realistically, if we find out we truly missed out on this and Tulsa got it, I guess we'll just have to settle for our street car, possible multiple skyscrapers, GE center, massive retail dev. on Memorial, the countless awesome urban housing projects, 21c Museum Hotel, world class boat row with future white water rapids and whatever other awesome projects the future brings us.

By many accounts, a Ford F150 is a dang decent truck, and would serve its owner well.

That said, unless there is one and only F150 available and you must have a truck today,
and perhaps not even then, one ought not pay 2X MSRP just so it isn't sold to some
landowner over near Owasso.

Yes, the F150 is a dang fine truck. But, it isn't the only ride one can choose.

Yeah and realistically, if we find out we truly missed out on this and Tulsa got it, I guess we'll just have to settle for our street car, possible multiple skyscrapers, GE center, massive retail dev. on Memorial, the countless awesome urban housing projects, 21c Museum Hotel, world class boat row with future white water rapids and whatever other awesome projects the future brings us.

Pollyanna Panda, We are all excited about our current progress & our future is incredibly bright. I want 10 towers w/ enough new commerce to warrant my High Speed Rail projects here in Oklahoma. But, that does not let me off the hook for 1,000 jobs in OKC metro to Owasso, OK. I don't take losing any jobs to Owasso. ..and especially groups like Amazon.

Pollyanna Panda, We are all excited about our current progress & our future is incredibly bright. I want 10 towers w/ enough new commerce to warrant my High Speed Rail projects here in Oklahoma. But, that does not let me off the hook for 1,000 jobs in OKC metro to Owasso, OK. I don't take losing any jobs to Owasso. ..and especially groups like Amazon.

1) We don't know it is Amazon, so quit acting like that's fact.

2) You haven't met anyone on this board who wants OKC to give up on trying, or stop growing, or quit building new/better things. But you have no sense of reality or scale when it comes to anything you've posted. 10 towers would be great, but it won't happen. Probably not in my lifetime and I like to think I've got another 60 years in me. From where we were 20 years ago, the one we have is incredible. The one announced is only adding to it and there may be some evidence we are getting a third (BoA drive-thru site). Being excited for that doesn't mean people who don't care because we aren't clamoring for 10 towers.

I don't fault your enthusiasm; it's great to have people excited about OKC. Your problem is that you degrade anyone who doesn't believe your pie-in-the-sky proclamations. OKC will not die without 10 towers, or just because we didn't land this facility. Just like OU won't wither on the vine if they don't immediately expand their stadium. We aren't idiots. We definitely don't love OKC less than you, so stop acting like that.

It stinks we didn't get this but keep in mind only a few miles from this proposed business is a monstrous series of distribution warehouses owned by Hobby Lobby.

This project would have been about a million square feet... HL already has almost SIX million sf and is growing rapidly. I'm sure they'll be over 10 million in just the next few years, as they have very ambitious growth plans and have said many times they will do all their distribution from OKC.

So, with or without this new business we have thousands of distribution jobs in that immediate area with thousands more to come, and soon.


Frankly, I hope our economic development people are spending most their time and incentive dollars pursuing high-paying jobs. It seems we have an absolute avalanche of lower-paid jobs, especially when you consider the call centers and other back-office types of operations in town.


And BTW, people forget that first and foremost, OKC is a GOVERMENT town, not oil & gas. Tinker alone employs over 27,000 (!) and that's not including the Boeing jobs. The State employs 42,000 (!) just in OKC; even the FAA employs 7,500 which is more than Devon, Chesapeake, Continental, SandRidge and Enable combined. Then you have the City, County, school districts, higher education... All huge and then a ton of jobs in the healthcare industry as well.

In fact, of employers with more than 1,000 employees in OKC, oil & gas only accounts for 6,600 out of 153,000 jobs -- that's just over 4%.

But the reason that industry gets so much emphasis (this thread is a perfect example) is because they pay well. And we need more of that type of employer than we'll ever need more distribution and call centers.

By many accounts, a Ford F150 is a dang decent truck, and would serve its owner well.

That said, unless there is one and only F150 available and you must have a truck today,
and perhaps not even then, one ought not pay 2X MSRP just so it isn't sold to some
landowner over near Owasso.

Yes, the F150 is a dang fine truck. But, it isn't the only ride one can choose.

I just ran some "rough" numbers in what 800 full time & 400 part time jobs would bring in on an annual basis.... Rough number $35,000,000 in wages in year 1. If they worked there 10 years, it would be est. $350 Mil. That is just a portion of the direct numbers represented to a local economy. That is a $ 1/3 Bil. Now that Ford Pick UP is worth the investment. ...and speaking of Ford Pick Ups, I'm sure they would by a few pickups in that same 10 years span too. So the extra dollars our city ponies up on the front, is well worth it.

It stinks we didn't get this but keep in mind only a few miles from this proposed business is a monstrous series of distribution warehouses owned by Hobby Lobby.

This project would have been about a million square feet... HL already has almost SIX million sf and is growing rapidly. I'm sure they'll be over 10 million in just the next few years, as they have very ambitious growth plans and have said many times they will do all their distribution from OKC.

So, with or without this new business we have thousands of distribution jobs in that immediate area with thousands more to come, and soon.


Frankly, I hope our economic development people are spending most their time and incentive dollars pursuing high-paying jobs. It seems we have an absolute avalanche of lower-paid jobs, especially when you consider the call centers and other back-office types of operations in town.


And BTW, people forget that first and foremost, OKC is a GOVERMENT town, not oil & gas. Tinker alone employs over 27,000 (!) and that's not including the Boeing jobs. The State employs 42,000 (!) just in OKC; even the FAA employs 7,500 which is more than Devon, Chesapeake, Continental, SandRidge and Enable combined. Then you have the City, County, school districts, higher education... All huge and then a ton of jobs in the healthcare industry as well.

In fact, of employers with more than 1,000 employees in OKC, oil & gas only accounts for 6,600 out of 153,000 jobs -- that's just over 4%.

But the reason that industry gets so much emphasis (this thread is a perfect example) is because they pay well. And we need more of that type of employer than we'll ever need more distribution and call centers.

great points. +1.

Another thought: it is not in OKC's best interest for Tulsa to wither and die. We need Tulsa to start catching up a bit. The two cities, led by OKC, are what will ultimately lead this state into the current century. Don't like the backwater backwardness of our Okie Legislature? Curse and moan about liquor laws and other silly things? If OKC AND Tulsa become vibrant economically dynamic cities, and experience major population growth, the rural influence in our government will begin to wane. Right now, we have a rurally dominant legislature.

We need Tulsa to do better than it is doing right now for our own self interest.

It's about what brings the community the most prosperity...and creating the right environment for it.
Many other jobs are then created on their own and without the incentives that the very high wage jobs receive....

1) We don't know it is Amazon, so quit acting like that's fact.

2) You haven't met anyone on this board who wants OKC to give up on trying, or stop growing, or quit building new/better things. But you have no sense of reality or scale when it comes to anything you've posted. 10 towers would be great, but it won't happen. Probably not in my lifetime and I like to think I've got another 60 years in me. From where we were 20 years ago, the one we have is incredible. The one announced is only adding to it and there may be some evidence we are getting a third (BoA drive-thru site). Being excited for that doesn't mean people who don't care because we aren't clamoring for 10 towers.

I don't fault your enthusiasm; it's great to have people excited about OKC. Your problem is that you degrade anyone who doesn't believe your pie-in-the-sky proclamations. OKC will not die without 10 towers, or just because we didn't land this facility. Just like OU won't wither on the vine if they don't immediately expand their stadium. We aren't idiots. We definitely don't love OKC less than you, so stop acting like that.

Brett, you missed the 10 tower point... it is one of positive hopes for Oklahoma. But before we get that far, we need to have a very HEALTH Economy..... diversified. You may not grasp that concept, but that's ok, the class will move on w/o you.

Brett, you missed the 10 tower point... it is one of positive hopes for Oklahoma. But before we get that far, we need to have a very HEALTH Economy..... diversified. You may not grasp that concept, but that's ok, the class will move on w/o you.

Ahhh, my apologies. I simply can't keep up with the brilliant intellect you so obviously possess. I grovel and humble myself at your feet.

Another thought: it is not in OKC's best interest for Tulsa to wither and die. We need Tulsa to start catching up a bit. The two cities, led by OKC, are what will ultimately lead this state into the current century. Don't like the backwater backwardness of our Okie Legislature? Curse and moan about liquor laws and other silly things? If OKC AND Tulsa become vibrant economically dynamic cities, and experience major population growth, the rural influence in our government will begin to wane. Right now, we have a rurally dominant legislature.

We need Tulsa to do better than it is doing right now for our own self interest.

You make an excellent point here.

Another thought: it is not in OKC's best interest for Tulsa to wither and die. We need Tulsa to start catching up a bit. The two cities, led by OKC, are what will ultimately lead this state into the current century. Don't like the backwater backwardness of our Okie Legislature? Curse and moan about liquor laws and other silly things? If OKC AND Tulsa become vibrant economically dynamic cities, and experience major population growth, the rural influence in our government will begin to wane. Right now, we have a rurally dominant legislature.

We need Tulsa to do better than it is doing right now for our own self interest.
Dead-on. OKC is doing good at expanding it's workforce base. If we've got to lose, we should celebrate losing to the Tulsa market. OKC needs Tulsa to thrive.