the problem is even though it was most likely a fumble ... you never actually see the ball come out ..

the problem is even though it was most likely a fumble ... you never actually see the ball come out ..

True, but physically removing the ball from the ballcarrier is still a perfectly legitimate play.

True, but physically removing the ball from the ballcarrier is still a perfectly legitimate play.

the problem is the rule says "indisputable" ... that means 99% is not good enough ... the call on the field is thought to be a fact ... if is had been ruled a fumble it would have stood ..

It is just this simple - when the whistle blew the ball was in the hands of an Iowa St player who had already left the scrum and was running the other way with it. Just because a ref on the field doesn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen. That is why we have instant replay officials. They are supposed to see what no one else saw - in slow motion, from 20 angles, in HD.

I have been watching some of the PAC10/12 bad calls on YouTube today and holy cow - I don't know how any of them are still employed.

It is just this simple - when the whistle blew the ball was in the hands of an Iowa St player who had already left the scrum and was running the other way with it. Just because a ref on the field doesn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen. That is why we have instant replay officials. They are supposed to see what no one else saw - in slow motion, from 20 angles, in HD.

I have been watching some of the PAC10/12 bad calls on YouTube today and holy cow - I don't know how any of them are still employed.

when the sound of the whistle is heard on tv is not relevant .. the ref called the runner down ..

Texas will win that call 100% of the time. The game was on the line and no-one at that stadium wearing Black & White Stripes had enough guts to go against Texas ( in that situation ). The announcers did not want to "labor" to hard on that call, because they did not want to sway it (away) from Mack Brown & Texas Univ. ...big money won that decision.

when the sound of the whistle is heard on tv is not relevant .. the ref called the runner down ..

I know - that is what makes it a bad call. The ruled him down by contact - but he never hit the ground until AFTER the whistle. I am not sure the ref knew who the ball carrier was.

Texas will win that call 100% of the time. The game was on the line and no-one at that stadium wearing Black & White Stripes had enough guts to go against Texas ( in that situation ). The announcers did not want to "labor" to hard on that call, because they did not want to sway it (away) from Mack Brown & Texas Univ. ...big money won that decision.

I think was just a bad call. If the refs were wanting Texas to win they sure waited until the last minute to do it.

I know - that is what makes it a bad call. The ruled him down by contact - but he never hit the ground until AFTER the whistle. I am not sure the ref knew who the ball carrier was.I seldom agree with JTF but in this case he is 100% correct. The call on the field was horrible. I watched every angle the TV coverage had and the ball had to be out of the T.U. players hands before the whistle. The review had to find undisputable evidence to overrule but sometimes indisputable evidence can't be found to overrule what is obviously a bad call if you don't apply time related physics. (I.E. You don't see the ball come loose but you do see the I.S. player with the ball before the whistle was blown. Thus, the ball had to be loose before the T.U. player was down.)

Mack lives on for another week!

Check out this picture.

Saban-denies-Texas-rumors-oddly (http://humoroutcasts.com/2013/nick-saban-denies-texas-rumors-oddly/)

This is a better article, better climax, better punch.
Plus, there's a funny cartoon.

Saban_on_Texas (http://sillimanonsports.com/Saban_on_Texas.html)

Silliman on Sports
By Stan Silliman

SABAN REJECTS TEXAS RUMORS… ODDLY


It has been rumored Nick Saban might be a candidate for a possible Texas University opening. Bolstered by the fact a Texas regent member sent an agent to meet with Saban.

Pictured above Saban is at a press conference denying these Texas rumors. Let’s listen in:
“I’m old, folks. I’m too damn old to be making any more job changes. I’ll take more questions but first I need a donut for my coffee.”

“Kevin Scarbinsky, Birmingham News, Mr. Saban. Did you just ask for a donut? Chocolate or…?”
“Just a glazed donut. Do you not see my pinky finger poised for a donut? A glazed donut, dammit!”

“Mark McCarter, Huntsville Times, Mr. Saban. Do you want jelly in that glazed donut, Mr. Saban?”
“A plain glazed donut, Mark! Can’t you see my pinky getting tired? I’m pointing at you, Cecil.”

“Me?” says Cecil Hurt of the Tuscaloosa News. “I’ll get you your donut, Nick, but you seem to be sending some other signals.”

“What kind of signals, Cecil? Can’t a guy crave a donut and then stick his pinky out without you reading something else into it. And yes, I’m pointing at you again… with my index finger. I’m not going to Texas even if they offered me $ 8,… er… I mean $ 10 million a year. Do I make myself clear? Where’s that donut?”

“Mr. Saban, Tommy Deas here, Tuscaloosa News. I want to ask about D.J. Fluker and possible…”

“Tommy, look at my hand. How many fingers am I holding up? I asked for a donut not once, but TWICE!! See this? Two fingers!!”
SABAN REJECTS TEXAS RUMORS… ODDLY by Stan Silliman humor sports comedy cartoons articles
“Nick. Tommy Nicks, Mobile Register, could the Fluker investigation put Alabama on probation?”

“I don’t want to hear no more Fluker questions. I want my donut, Tommy, and get this, Tommy, if I hear another Fluker question I’m going to take these two fingers, these two, and poke your eyes… your very wide set eyes!!”

“Mr. Saban, it’s Jimmy Smothers, Gasden Times. If the Fluker deal goes South will that drive you to Texas?”

“Jimmy, I said no more Fluker questions. It is everything I can do NOT to flip you the bird. See this? I’m having to hold both my two center fingers down so as to not flip out. I wanted a donut. I asked twice. See this, twice!! Do I have to ask ten million times? I know that’s a good round number, but I shouldn’t have to ask. At Alabama I’ve won TWO national championships!! See this? TWO! I should be able to get a donut and if I wished to poke your eyes with these TWO fingers, I should be permitted. I’d like a donut, a yellow rose flavored glazed donut if you have one. Thanks.”

Man, what a cheap shot...luckily the Ia St guy saw it coming
http://nesncom.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/texasisu.gif?w=640&h=360

What makes the situation even more embarrassing for the Big 12 is that the league came out in support of the officials call.

Mack Brown bought himself some time with this lifesaver.
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSfEfZQmf8kVXz8d7Y6nBmd6dPkoKl-BXZEb137466zn8RIurFH

He will at least finish the year.

Man, what a cheap shot...luckily the Ia St guy saw it coming
http://nesncom.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/texasisu.gif?w=640&h=360

That's screwed up. First time I've seen that...

Mack lives on for another week!

It's a Conspiracy. The Sooners let Texas win so Mack Brown would be able to stick aroun'.
I don't know who's behind it, nor the rhyme or reason, but the NCAA should launch an investigation about wrongdoing.
(Or maybe just the Sooners coaching staff)

It's a Conspiracy. The Sooners let Texas win so Mack Brown would be able to stick aroun'.
I don't know who's behind it, nor the rhyme or reason, but the NCAA should launch an investigation about wrongdoing.
(Or maybe just the Sooners coaching staff)

Yeah, my co-worker who went to the game said the same thing about the Sooners letting Longhorns win

I think many OU fans learned an important lesson. You should never wish or hope for ill will on anyone. (Mack Brown to be fired.) You never know when fate and karma will crap on you instead of those who draw your ill will. Dislike a person all day long if you want but, never wish bad luck will come there way.

I think many OU fans learned an important lesson. You should never wish or hope for ill will on anyone. (Mack Brown to be fired.) You never know when fate and karma will crap on you instead of those who draw your ill will. Dislike a person all day long if you want but, never wish bad luck will come there way.


“karma” my butt... OU fans didn't need to lose to Texas to learn anything...Many OU fans have walked out of that stadium way too many times with a loss when OU was probably the better team to ever take a WIN against Texas for granted....

OU really missed Nelson and Philips. Beyond that the new OU coaches are going to need to recruit better players.
Time will tell but the word is that they are very good recruiters.

Texas could do a lot better than Mack for a coach but they have made some bad hires over the years.

The people who should be the most embarrassed are the Texas fans who gave their team absolutely no chance to win and sold thousands of tickets to OU fans.

Wouldn't it be one of the ultimate ironies in the storied history of these two programs if, during a season where the end of the run for one coach was presumed as an all-but given, but once the season ends, the other coach ends up gone -for whatever reason?

Not at all saying this is what's going to happen, but the potential for epic irony at least crossed my mind when I heard that some sports tout/gambling (?) site apparently tweeted that he had a source saying Stoops would finish the season, but not be back next year at OU.

Like I said, not at all suggesting that's what's going to happen, but it would be amazing if Mack returned next year and Stoops didn't, for whatever reason.

..now if someone had a rumor that Heupel wouldn't be back as OC next year, that wouldn't be ironic, it'd be a blessing...(sarcasm light off).

It's a Conspiracy. The Sooners let Texas win so Mack Brown would be able to stick aroun'.
I don't know who's behind it, nor the rhyme or reason, but the NCAA should launch an investigation about wrongdoing.
(Or maybe just the Sooners coaching staff)

The OSU Cowboys may have solved your conspiracy theory.

Did Oklahoma State seal the tomb and legacy of Mack Brown?

The Mack Watch

The best way to quiet an angry fan base that wants the coach’s head on a platter is win, and the Horns did just with a six-game winning streak but now Mack Brown will probably have to field more questions about his coaching future after a bad home loss with first place in the conference on the line.

Five thoughts on Texas-Oklahoma State | Golden's Nuggets | www.statesman.com (http://www.statesman.com/weblogs/goldens-nuggets/2013/nov/17/five-thoughts-texas-oklahoma-state/)

“karma” my butt... OU fans didn't need to lose to Texas to learn anything...Many OU fans have walked out of that stadium way too many times with a loss when OU was probably the better team to ever take a WIN against Texas for granted....

OU really missed Nelson and Philips. Beyond that the new OU coaches are going to need to recruit better players.
Time will tell but the word is that they are very good recruiters.

Texas could do a lot better than Mack for a coach but they have made some bad hires over the years.

I will always remember Berry Tramel saying the day before this past OU/Texas game at the OU Club of Ft Worth luncheon, when asked if Texas had a chance to beat the heavily-favored Sooners, that "there is absolutely no chance that Texas will beat OU" and then when asked if he thought it might be a close game that "the game will be over by the second quarter, and all of the Texas fans will be gone by the end of the third". I thought his overconfidence was pretty unwarranted and wondered what OU team he had been watching all year...

I will always remember Berry Tramel saying the day before this past OU/Texas game at the OU Club of Ft Worth luncheon, when asked if Texas had a chance to beat the heavily-favored Sooners, that "there is absolutely no chance that Texas will beat OU" and then when asked if he thought it might be a close game that "the game will be over by the second quarter, and all of the Texas fans will be gone by the end of the third". I thought his overconfidence was pretty unwarranted and wondered what OU team he had been watching all year...

So true!

The OU-Texas game is one that never ceases to amaze me about its outcome. Most unpredictable outcome in years in which the game appears to be lopsided.. The pageantry surrounding this game is unrivaled by any in college football:

1. Neutral site half the equal distance between both schools.
2. Tickets divided so that you have a split in fan attendance.
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT2yGEKbwhZO3voXyTk-te-yjEjhHsgtBDAyDJh0BBtjiLYUhf-eg
3. Two bordering states
4. Competing universities located in the metropolitan areas of both state capitals.
5. Competing universities between each state's most notable institutions

No other college football game rivalry can match the accolades of this game.

and dont forget number 6. Millions of dollars Oklahoma gets to lose out on as Okies make their way down to Texas to spend all kinds of money.

and dont forget number 6. Millions of dollars Oklahoma gets to lose out on as Okies make their way down to Texas to spend all kinds of money.I have heard that augment before and for OU and Norman its wrong, very wrong!

The money that OU/Norman/Oklahoma losses out on up front is like an investment that pays off in much bigger ways.


Both OU & UT are paid extra money that’s well beyond the sale of tickets and TV to play the game in Dallas. This amount will contractually grow.

The OU-Texas game revives far more attention than any yearly game that either OU or Texas plays in.
Over the years this has helped OU recruit better players. This leads to bigger winning and the far bigger amounts of money that comes with winning big.
The game also gives OU exposure that helps OU recruit other sports, but also some top students from the area.

There are tens of thousand of OU alumni and even more former Oklahoma’s living in Texas who are OU fans. This game helps keep those people more engaged in various OU causes. OU has received hundreds of millions of dollars in donations from people living in Texas. This is a great deal for the state. It would be very short sighted to ever end playing this game in Dallas.... It a huge driver of yearly donations to both university’s.

It plays a major roll in why UT is by far and away the top NCAA revenue producer. The last I saw OU was ranked #9 in NCAA revenue and its in large part due to the yearly donations that by it self far exceed any amount of money that OU would receive from one more home game every 2 years.

I know many dont ever want to move the game and the tradition of the cotton bowl red river rivalry is something not to be messed with in some fans eyes but the reasons you state have nothing to do with them always playing at the cotton bowl. OU fans will give money regardless of whether they are winning at the cotton bowl or in Austin. OU can still recruit students and athletes and donor money if the game was in Austin every other year. But this is a completely different argument Im making.

What Im talking about is the state of Oklahoma and the cities of Norman and Oklahoma City losing out on tons of money every other year because of the thousands that drive to Dallas and stay in hotels, eat at restaurants and all kinds of other types of money spending. Oklahoma has to lose out millions every time its played in Dallas and not here. OU and UT do get a big check for playing it there but that does nothing for the state. Im not looking to create some big discussion about it, just pointing out how the state and local businesses get screwed by it being in Dallas every year.

I know many dont ever want to move the game and the tradition of the cotton bowl red river rivalry is something not to be messed with in some fans eyes but the reasons you state have nothing to do with them always playing at the cotton bowl. OU fans will give money regardless of whether they are winning at the cotton bowl or in Austin. OU can still recruit students and athletes and donor money if the game was in Austin every other year. But this is a completely different argument Im making.

What Im talking about is the state of Oklahoma and the cities of Norman and Oklahoma City losing out on tons of money every other year because of the thousands that drive to Dallas and stay in hotels, eat at restaurants and all kinds of other types of money spending. Oklahoma has to lose out millions every time its played in Dallas and not here. OU and UT do get a big check for playing it there but that does nothing for the state. Im not looking to create some big discussion about it, just pointing out how the state and local businesses get screwed by it being in Dallas every year.

The state and local businesses are not getting screwed by this game being played in Dallas.
The reality is that it's the other way around.... They actually see more money.

There would not be anything close to the amount of interest in OU football if they had not won in historical fashion.. Winning big pumps far more money into the local economy than mediocrity and a much smaller stadium. OU’s recruitment of Texas players has been a very important part of OU’s historical winning ways.

If this game was home and home, there would not be that many from UT come to the game.. maybe 5 thousand or so ? Not that many tickets would be sold to the opposing team, thus less travel and hotel nights. Most OU fans will stricktly drive to and from the day of the game.. Best leave it in Dallas.

The state and local businesses are not getting screwed by this game being played in Dallas.
The reality is that it's the other way around.... They actually see more money.

There would not be anything close to the amount of interest in OU football if they had not won in historical fashion.. Winning big pumps far more money into the local economy than mediocrity and a much smaller stadium. OU’s recruitment of Texas players has been a very important part of OU’s historical winning ways.

Yes, of course winning matters. But you act like playing one game a year at the cotton bowl is the sole reason for money and success.

And yes, the state, Norman and OKC are losing out on millions of dollars. Maybe you dont call it getting screwed, since its pretty much always been this way but the state and local business owners are definitely missing out.

If this game was home and home, there would not be that many from UT come to the game.. maybe 5 thousand or so ? Not that many tickets would be sold to the opposing team, thus less travel and hotel nights. Most OU fans will stricktly driver to and from the day of the game.. Best leave it in Dallas.

Money being spent isnt restricted to the visiting team. This would also mean 75k OU fans would be spending their dollars in Oklahoma rather than Dallas.

I also think you underestimate the amount of UT fans that would want to come to a Norman game. And vice versa. I think a home and home, even if just a one time deal, would be a huge attraction for home and visting fans alike.

Money being spent isnt restricted to the visiting team. This would also mean 75k OU fans would be spending their dollars in Oklahoma rather than Dallas.
I also think you underestimate the amount of UT fans that would want to come to a Norman game. And vice versa. I think a home and home, even if just a one time deal, would be a huge attraction for home and visting fans alike.

But not on hotels.

Yes, of course winning matters. But you act like playing one game a year at the cotton bowl is the sole reason for money and success.

And yes, the state, Norman and OKC are losing out on millions of dollars. Maybe you dont call it getting screwed, since its pretty much always been this way but the state and local business owners are definitely missing out.
You are way undervaluing how important this is to OU football and also to the entire university, which equals big bucks for the community and the state.



Its not the sole reason for OU's success but its a very major component. You have to look at this as an investment!
Hundred's of millions have been donated to OU just because of this game. This far exceed the amount of money that OU and the community revives from a single home OU game.
The benefits of added DFW exposure is a very major reason why so many other Big 12 university’s wanted TCU in the conference.
In the long run the local OKC merchants are not getting screwed. The only people getting screwed are the other programs of the Big 12 who don't have a game like this to sale to its recruits... Anymore the other Big 12 fan bases are about the only people who ever complain much about the OU Texas game in Dallas.

If this game was home and home, there would not be that many from UT come to the game.. maybe 5 thousand or so ? Not that many tickets would be sold to the opposing team, thus less travel and hotel nights. Most OU fans will stricktly drive to and from the day of the game.. Best leave it in Dallas.

There may be 5000 or so Longhorn fans showing but there are many more OU fans than that coming to every home OU game from out of state. Many stay in hotels, rent cars and such.. About 10 years ago the OU ticket office said they sold 4000 OU football season tickets to north Texas zip codes. This doesn’t include other parts of Texas or other near by states. They said at the time that they sold tickets to zip codes in all but 3 states. When you consider this occurs about 6 times a year that's probably more fans in a years worth of time coming in from out of state to Norman than travel from Oklahoma to Dallas each year.

a home and home will never have the cache that Texas-OU Weekend/Dallas carries. Leave it alone already!!

There may be 5000 or so Longhorn fans showing but there are many more OU fans than that coming to every home OU game from out of state. Many stay in hotels, rent cars and such.. About 10 years ago the OU ticket office said they sold 4000 OU football season tickets to north Texas zip codes. This doesn’t include other parts of Texas or other near by states. They said at the time that they sold tickets to zip codes in all but 3 states. When you consider this occurs about 6 times a year that's probably more fans in a years worth of time coming in from out of state to Norman than travel from Oklahoma to Dallas each year.

Selling to out of state zips could also be what is going on with the Thunder....... but as we find out, those 'season ticket' holders for the 20 states are online ticket brokers. We bought extra playoff tickets from someone in Illinois in the lower level last year. I also know fans who drive to OU games from the Dallas metroplex for the game, and then drive back home the same night.

a home and home will never have the cache that Texas-OU Weekend/Dallas carries. Leave it alone already!!

EZ Million tried to sell this when he was alive. Neither Norman or Austin was really all that excited about it. I think OU and Texas fans alike prefer playing it in Dallas/Ft. Worth area. If nothing else it's nice little weekend away from home before the holidays.

The positive momentum came to a screeching halt when No. 12 Oklahoma State came to town, handed Brown the worst home loss of his 16 year career in Austin and undid everything Texas had worked for since September 21...

...McCoy's super-human talents helped disguise how bad the Longhorns offensive line was. McCoy also masked the fact that the Longhorns had zero running attack without him.

Alabama went on to beat Texas 37-21, and Mack Brown was stunned.

If you watch college football, you have probably heard the stories of numerous dominant quarterbacks who did not even receive an offer from Texas. Whether it was Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III in 2011, Johnny Manziel in 2012 or Jameis Winston this year, the stories all sound eerily similar: Texas either did not offer these talented quarterbacks or looked at them at a different position.--Texas Football: Did Mack Brown the CEO Doom Mack Brown the Football Coach? | Bleacher Report (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1855872-texas-football-did-mack-brown-the-ceo-doom-mack-brown-the-football-coach)

Let's be real? Texas has had the talent; but it takes an outstanding coach to manage all those egos. Personally, I believe that the real problem in Texas has been having too much talent in addition to having a superiority complex.

http://ts4.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.4999227130905483&pid=15.1