So no one actually said what was claimed. Just one person's decisions to make (some rather far fetched) inferences.

The urban core is a lot bigger and covers much more than downtown.

We spend more money on the fringe currently then we do "downtown"

tomokc- It is probably more of a question as to who would replace him. Would the race be competitive would a good alternative candidate?

Also, he has a enough of a GOTV mechanism to make any future Ward 2 election competitive should he be able to spin his way out of this and inoculate himself with time and distance from the bad past judgement issues.

Most voters don't have a problem accepting their fallen politicians after they've been inoculated by time (see former NY governor Elliot Spitzer who recently ran for NYC Controller, and former SC governor Mark Sanford who was just elected to US House). But Shadid hasn't been innoculated, in fact his dirty laundry hasn't even been aired yet. He's still fighting, he's not repentant, and those things must change. He first has to do his mea culpa on the local version of Oprah, appear contrite, walk in the wilderness awhile, and then come back if he wants.

He can't simply say, "This is in the past" because it isn't. Most of it is still in the future.

Great points.

Just to be clear with everyone since this conversation has turned to transit and there seems to be a bit of confusion.

BTW, I wrote this in response to OKCUSTU and it took awhile. I see Betts is addressing some of it but I'll post it anyway. If Stephen Tyler Holeman reads OKC Talk, this is for you to and those earlier Facebook posts late last night. Some of Ed's folks are trying to impose a great deal of innuendo about the transit issues as well. Perhaps it will help address them.

Mayor Mick is the Chairman of Regional Transit Dialogue (now in Phase 2) hosted by the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments. We (our steering committee, subcommittees and the URS Corporation), are conducting a commuter corridors study to better define what type of infrastructure and what the estimated costs are to build a comprehensive system. The Mayor is also supporting and directly involved in a bill through the state legislature (to be voted on in January and February) that will further enable the formal legal creation of a Regional Transit Authority.

In theory, a Regional Transit Authority would replace and potentially consolidate the Metro Transit bus system, CART (Norman's Bus System), and Citi-link (Edmond). Nelson Nygaard's 2013 Bus system Plan and the 2005 Fixed Guideway Study could in theory be fully funded. That would provide for enhanced bus coverage, frequency, shelters, and additional infrastructure; Bus Rapid Transit to Yukon, Meridian Corridor, and NW Expressway; Commuter Rail to Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, and Del City.

Lets be clear about this, Mayor Cornett was not initially a regional transit supporter. His earliest comments during his first term suggested that he considered transit another way to enable people to live outside of Oklahoma city and subsequently generate their tax revenue there. He was however in favor of improved transit specifically within the Oklahoma City limits proper. There were many times in his first and second terms where he specifically addressed those clamoring for a regional rail system and said that he would change his opinion if the other cities would help pay for it.

Now things have changed.

Mayor Cornett has visited many other cities and seen the overall benefits of a Regional Transit System. Many of the cities (particularly Edmond) have conveyed their support in pursuing the creation of an RTA. In those initial meetings, Midwest City, Del City, and Norman were the three cities with interested elected officials sitting in RTD #1.

NOW we have many of the Councillors and most of the Mayors of Edmond, Midwest City, Del City, Moore, and Norman interested and at the table. In the last few meetings, now Yukon is trying to get involved.

The pursuit of a meaningful solution to our transit woes is within eyesight. And this is primarily due to Mayor Cornett's early position about "not going it alone" and his willingness to embrace pursuing it with these folks now sitting at the table.

Interestingly enough, Ed Shadid does not sit on any of these committees and actually turned down the offer to participate when this initiative was first being organized.


Now regarding the "transit versus the convention center" conversation, MAPS 3 does not provide ongoing revenues for Operations and Maintenance. It is that simple. There is no person that would have a greater desire to see an additional $280 million go to the purchase of buses, shelters, and commuter rail. But if we buy it, how do we operate it? That is why a carefully thought out solution as the mayor proposes in the form of an RTA is the best way to resolve these long term costs. It also best positions us for matching funds for the actual physical infrastructure from the Federal Transit Administration.

The MAPS 3 streetcar is small enough of a system that we are confident that we can find the monies to operate it- parking revenues, advertising on trains and at stops, Santa Fe Station tenant space leasing, and potentially a TIF or change to the BID (Business Improvement District that funds Downtown OKC Inc.)

So some of us don't want to talk about Ed's prior bad decisions as an adult. That is ok with me. We all make mistakes. But regarding tangible evidence on the transit front, I have personally witnessed Ed try to tear apart our process, demonize the mayor, and pit transit advocates against one another. I have known him since the Ward 2 election.

The Mayor I have known since his first election winning against Jim Tolbert. On the transit issue, you have to give this guy props. He had an early position that he stuck to (one I didn't agree with), he forced the other cities to the table if they we serious, they came, and he jumped on board and is literally leading the process.

Forming a long term solution like an RTA takes a leader who doesn't pit advocates and public servants against one another. This (forming and getting an RTA approved by the voters) will likely be one of the most complicated and sophisticated public initiatives ever pursued in our state. It takes stability in leadership and political "buy in" from participating city governments outside of OKC and end even in a different county!

I have attended hundreds of meetings over the past decade. We have never been closer to moving on ahead forward to a substantive and meaningful solution. It is easy for Ed to ridicule our existing bus service. I feel for the folks forced to use it. But it took 70 years of "non-investment" to end up with the system we have to today. Plus the extrication of the original streetcar and Interurban rail system.

Here's a mathematical fact for you I was recently informed of- Mayor Mick has supported and achieved financially annually growing our bus system more than all mayors combined in the past 20 years preceding his tenure.

So whats it going to be?

Ed's idea of playing games with the streetcar system to score political points? Ed's idea that somehow convention center money would solve our transit problem (even though he has no solution for the O&M)? Ed's non-participation in the ongoing processes to actually solve these dire problems?

or

Mayor Mick actually leading us politically by working together with our surrounding communities for better bus, bus rapid transit, para transit, streetcar, and commuter rail through a legitimate long term fix?

My vote is with Mayor Cornett.

Jeff M. Bezdek

Regional Transit Dialogue 1 Public Outreach Committee Chair
Regional Transit Dialogue 2 Commuter Corridors Study Task Force Member
Streetcar Federal Process Alternatives Analysis Steering Committee Member
MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Member (MAPS 3 Streetcar and Intermodal Santa Fe Station Hub Project)

Outstanding work. Bravo to you!

We spend more money on the fringe currently then we do "downtown"

Stop peddling those facts. We need to keep clinging to false narratives so we can feel righteous and wronged.

Yeah OKC doesn't have as many neighborhoods as it has housing editions. Obviously we're not Detroit, but I would benefit the city coffers to have some areas go back to wildlife like that city. Also an urban growth boundary. There is plenty of land for infill development in the city. As for neighborhood revitalization, I think I agree with you. Some parts of OKC have no commercial strip to redevelop. However there are some corridors with promise inside the 44/35/240 loop that could use some grants and could benefit from some TOD.

We spend more money on the fringe currently then we do "downtown"

The majority of the city revenue comes from places outside of downtown. Downtown can't hold a candle to what comes in from outside of downtown. Remember where the money came from to bail out downtown? Short memory. It wasn't downtown, because downtown was dead.

Yes, you said fringe, trying to change the direction of the conversation from a holistic viewpoint that included the entire city to one of "fringe" vs downtown. That is another example of what I'm talking about.

Just to be clear with everyone since this conversation has turned to transit and there seems to be a bit of confusion.

BTW, I wrote this in response to OKCUSTU and it took awhile. I see Betts is addressing some of it but I'll post it anyway. If Stephen Tyler Holeman reads OKC Talk, this is for you to and those earlier Facebook posts late last night. Some of Ed's folks are trying to impose a great deal of innuendo about the transit issues as well. Perhaps it will help address them.



Mayor Mick is the Chairman of Regional Transit Dialogue (now in Phase 2) hosted by the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments. We (our steering committee, subcommittees and the URS Corporation), are conducting a commuter corridors study to better define what type of infrastructure and what the estimated costs are to build a comprehensive system. The Mayor is also supporting and directly involved in a bill through the state legislature (to be voted on in January and February) that will further enable the formal legal creation of a Regional Transit Authority.

In theory, a Regional Transit Authority would replace and potentially consolidate the Metro Transit bus system, CART (Norman's Bus System), and Citi-link (Edmond). Nelson Nygaard's 2013 Bus system Plan and the 2005 Fixed Guideway Study could in theory be fully funded. That would provide for enhanced bus coverage, frequency, shelters, and additional infrastructure; Bus Rapid Transit to Yukon, Meridian Corridor, and NW Expressway; Commuter Rail to Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, and Del City.

Lets be clear about this, Mayor Cornett was not initially a regional transit supporter. His earliest comments during his first term suggested that he considered transit another way to enable people to live outside of Oklahoma city and subsequently generate their tax revenue there. He was however in favor of improved transit specifically within the Oklahoma City limits proper. There were many times in his first and second terms where he specifically addressed those clamoring for a regional rail system and said that he would change his opinion if the other cities would help pay for it.

Now things have changed.

Mayor Cornett has visited many other cities and seen the overall benefits of a Regional Transit System. Many of the cities (particularly Edmond) have conveyed their support in pursuing the creation of an RTA. In those initial meetings, Midwest City, Del City, and Norman were the three cities with interested elected officials sitting in RTD #1.

NOW we have many of the Councillors and most of the Mayors of Edmond, Midwest City, Del City, Moore, and Norman interested and at the table. In the last few meetings, now Yukon is trying to get involved.

The pursuit of a meaningful solution to our transit woes is within eyesight. And this is primarily due to Mayor Cornett's early position about "not going it alone" and his willingness to embrace pursuing it with these folks now sitting at the table.

Interestingly enough, Ed Shadid does not sit on any of these committees and actually turned down the offer to participate when this initiativie was first being organized.


Now regarding the "transit versus the convention center" conversation, MAPS 3 does not provide ongoing revenues for Operations and Maintenance. It is that simple. There is no person that would have a greater desire to see an additional $280 million go to the purchase of buses, shelters, and commuter rail. But if we buy it, how do we operate it? That is why a carefully thought out solution as the mayor proposes in the form of an RTA is the best way to resolve these long term costs. It also best positions us for matching funds for the actual physical infrastructure from the Federal Transit Administration.

The MAPS 3 streetcar is small enough of a system that we are confident that we can find the monies to operate it- parking revenues, advertising on trains and at stops, Santa Fe Station tenant space leasing, and potentially a TIF or change to the BID (Business Improvement District that funds Downtown OKC Inc.)

So some of us don't want to talk about Ed's prior bad decisions as an adult. That is ok with me. We all make mistakes. But regarding tangible evidence on the transit front, I have personally witnessed Ed try to tear apart our process, demonize the mayor, and pit transit advocates against one another. I have known him since the Ward 2 election.

The Mayor I have known since his first election winning against Jim Tolbert. On the transit issue, you have to give this guy props. He had an early position that he stuck to (one I didn't agree with), he forced the other cities to the table if they we serious, they came, and he jumped on board and is literally leading the process.

Forming a long term solution like an RTA takes a leader who doesn't pit advocates and public servants against one another. This (forming and getting an RTA approved by the voters) will likely be one of the most complicated and sophisticated public initiatives ever pursued in our state. It takes stability in leadership and political "buy in" from participating city governments outside of OKC and end even in a different county!

I have attended hundreds of meetings over the past decade. We have never been closer to moving on ahead forward to a substantive and meaningful solution. It is easy for Ed to ridicule our existing bus service. I feel for the folks forced to use it. But it took 70 years of "non-investment" to end up with the system we have to today. Plus the extrication of the original streetcar and Interurban rail system.

Here's a mathematical fact for you I was recently informed of- Mayor Mick has supported and achieved financially annually growing our bus system more than all mayors combined in the past 20 years preceding his tenure.

So whats it going to be?

Ed's idea of playing games with the streetcar system to score political points? Ed's idea that somehow convention center money would solve our transit problem (even though he has no solution for the O&M)? Ed's non-participation in the ongoing processes to actually solve these dire problems?

or

Mayor Mick actually leading us politically by working together with our surrounding communities for better bus, bus rapid transit, para transit, streetcar, and commuter rail through a legitimate long term fix?

My vote is with Mayor Cornett.

Jeff M. Bezdek

Regional Transit Dialogue 1 Public Outreach Committee Chair
Regional Transit Dialogue 2 Commuter Corridors Study Task Force Member
Streetcar Federal Process Alternatives Analysis Steering Committee Member
MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Member (MAPS 3 Streetcar and Intermodal Santa Fe Station Hub Project)

You have given me much to think about, much... Thanks for the heads up really. I know you have a lot of insight on it that 98% people do not. And I know you want to transit more than most, so I respect your opinion.

Just to be clear with everyone since this conversation has turned to transit and there seems to be a bit of confusion.

BTW, I wrote this in response to OKCUSTU and it took awhile. I see Betts is addressing some of it but I'll post it anyway. If Stephen Tyler Holeman reads OKC Talk, this is for you to and those earlier Facebook posts late last night. Some of Ed's folks are trying to impose a great deal of innuendo about the transit issues as well. Perhaps it will help address them.



Mayor Mick is the Chairman of Regional Transit Dialogue (now in Phase 2) hosted by the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments. We (our steering committee, subcommittees and the URS Corporation), are conducting a commuter corridors study to better define what type of infrastructure and what the estimated costs are to build a comprehensive system. The Mayor is also supporting and directly involved in a bill through the state legislature (to be voted on in January and February) that will further enable the formal legal creation of a Regional Transit Authority.

In theory, a Regional Transit Authority would replace and potentially consolidate the Metro Transit bus system, CART (Norman's Bus System), and Citi-link (Edmond). Nelson Nygaard's 2013 Bus system Plan and the 2005 Fixed Guideway Study could in theory be fully funded. That would provide for enhanced bus coverage, frequency, shelters, and additional infrastructure; Bus Rapid Transit to Yukon, Meridian Corridor, and NW Expressway; Commuter Rail to Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, and Del City.

Lets be clear about this, Mayor Cornett was not initially a regional transit supporter. His earliest comments during his first term suggested that he considered transit another way to enable people to live outside of Oklahoma city and subsequently generate their tax revenue there. He was however in favor of improved transit specifically within the Oklahoma City limits proper. There were many times in his first and second terms where he specifically addressed those clamoring for a regional rail system and said that he would change his opinion if the other cities would help pay for it.

Now things have changed.

Mayor Cornett has visited many other cities and seen the overall benefits of a Regional Transit System. Many of the cities (particularly Edmond) have conveyed their support in pursuing the creation of an RTA. In those initial meetings, Midwest City, Del City, and Norman were the three cities with interested elected officials sitting in RTD #1.

NOW we have many of the Councillors and most of the Mayors of Edmond, Midwest City, Del City, Moore, and Norman interested and at the table. In the last few meetings, now Yukon is trying to get involved.

The pursuit of a meaningful solution to our transit woes is within eyesight. And this is primarily due to Mayor Cornett's early position about "not going it alone" and his willingness to embrace pursuing it with these folks now sitting at the table.

Interestingly enough, Ed Shadid does not sit on any of these committees and actually turned down the offer to participate when this initiative was first being organized.


Now regarding the "transit versus the convention center" conversation, MAPS 3 does not provide ongoing revenues for Operations and Maintenance. It is that simple. There is no person that would have a greater desire to see an additional $280 million go to the purchase of buses, shelters, and commuter rail. But if we buy it, how do we operate it? That is why a carefully thought out solution as the mayor proposes in the form of an RTA is the best way to resolve these long term costs. It also best positions us for matching funds for the actual physical infrastructure from the Federal Transit Administration.

The MAPS 3 streetcar is small enough of a system that we are confident that we can find the monies to operate it- parking revenues, advertising on trains and at stops, Santa Fe Station tenant space leasing, and potentially a TIF or change to the BID (Business Improvement District that funds Downtown OKC Inc.)

So some of us don't want to talk about Ed's prior bad decisions as an adult. That is ok with me. We all make mistakes. But regarding tangible evidence on the transit front, I have personally witnessed Ed try to tear apart our process, demonize the mayor, and pit transit advocates against one another. I have known him since the Ward 2 election.

The Mayor I have known since his first election winning against Jim Tolbert. On the transit issue, you have to give this guy props. He had an early position that he stuck to (one I didn't agree with), he forced the other cities to the table if they we serious, they came, and he jumped on board and is literally leading the process.

Forming a long term solution like an RTA takes a leader who doesn't pit advocates and public servants against one another. This (forming and getting an RTA approved by the voters) will likely be one of the most complicated and sophisticated public initiatives ever pursued in our state. It takes stability in leadership and political "buy in" from participating city governments outside of OKC and end even in a different county!

I have attended hundreds of meetings over the past decade. We have never been closer to moving on ahead forward to a substantive and meaningful solution. It is easy for Ed to ridicule our existing bus service. I feel for the folks forced to use it. But it took 70 years of "non-investment" to end up with the system we have to today. Plus the extrication of the original streetcar and Interurban rail system.

Here's a mathematical fact for you I was recently informed of- Mayor Mick has supported and achieved financially annually growing our bus system more than all mayors combined in the past 20 years preceding his tenure.

So whats it going to be?

Ed's idea of playing games with the streetcar system to score political points? Ed's idea that somehow convention center money would solve our transit problem (even though he has no solution for the O&M)? Ed's non-participation in the ongoing processes to actually solve these dire problems?

or

Mayor Mick actually leading us politically by working together with our surrounding communities for better bus, bus rapid transit, para transit, streetcar, and commuter rail through a legitimate long term fix?

My vote is with Mayor Cornett.

Jeff M. Bezdek

Regional Transit Dialogue 1 Public Outreach Committee Chair
Regional Transit Dialogue 2 Commuter Corridors Study Task Force Member
Streetcar Federal Process Alternatives Analysis Steering Committee Member
MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Member (MAPS 3 Streetcar and Intermodal Santa Fe Station Hub Project)

That had to take awhile to put together, thank you for the post...very informative!

Just to be clear with everyone since this conversation has turned to transit and there seems to be a bit of confusion.

BTW, I wrote this in response to OKCUSTU and it took awhile. I see Betts is addressing some of it but I'll post it anyway. If Stephen Tyler Holeman reads OKC Talk, this is for you to and those earlier Facebook posts late last night. Some of Ed's folks are trying to impose a great deal of innuendo about the transit issues as well. Perhaps it will help address them.



Mayor Mick is the Chairman of Regional Transit Dialogue (now in Phase 2) hosted by the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments. We (our steering committee, subcommittees and the URS Corporation), are conducting a commuter corridors study to better define what type of infrastructure and what the estimated costs are to build a comprehensive system. The Mayor is also supporting and directly involved in a bill through the state legislature (to be voted on in January and February) that will further enable the formal legal creation of a Regional Transit Authority.

In theory, a Regional Transit Authority would replace and potentially consolidate the Metro Transit bus system, CART (Norman's Bus System), and Citi-link (Edmond). Nelson Nygaard's 2013 Bus system Plan and the 2005 Fixed Guideway Study could in theory be fully funded. That would provide for enhanced bus coverage, frequency, shelters, and additional infrastructure; Bus Rapid Transit to Yukon, Meridian Corridor, and NW Expressway; Commuter Rail to Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, and Del City.

Lets be clear about this, Mayor Cornett was not initially a regional transit supporter. His earliest comments during his first term suggested that he considered transit another way to enable people to live outside of Oklahoma city and subsequently generate their tax revenue there. He was however in favor of improved transit specifically within the Oklahoma City limits proper. There were many times in his first and second terms where he specifically addressed those clamoring for a regional rail system and said that he would change his opinion if the other cities would help pay for it.

Now things have changed.

Mayor Cornett has visited many other cities and seen the overall benefits of a Regional Transit System. Many of the cities (particularly Edmond) have conveyed their support in pursuing the creation of an RTA. In those initial meetings, Midwest City, Del City, and Norman were the three cities with interested elected officials sitting in RTD #1.

NOW we have many of the Councillors and most of the Mayors of Edmond, Midwest City, Del City, Moore, and Norman interested and at the table. In the last few meetings, now Yukon is trying to get involved.

The pursuit of a meaningful solution to our transit woes is within eyesight. And this is primarily due to Mayor Cornett's early position about "not going it alone" and his willingness to embrace pursuing it with these folks now sitting at the table.

Interestingly enough, Ed Shadid does not sit on any of these committees and actually turned down the offer to participate when this initiative was first being organized.


Now regarding the "transit versus the convention center" conversation, MAPS 3 does not provide ongoing revenues for Operations and Maintenance. It is that simple. There is no person that would have a greater desire to see an additional $280 million go to the purchase of buses, shelters, and commuter rail. But if we buy it, how do we operate it? That is why a carefully thought out solution as the mayor proposes in the form of an RTA is the best way to resolve these long term costs. It also best positions us for matching funds for the actual physical infrastructure from the Federal Transit Administration.

The MAPS 3 streetcar is small enough of a system that we are confident that we can find the monies to operate it- parking revenues, advertising on trains and at stops, Santa Fe Station tenant space leasing, and potentially a TIF or change to the BID (Business Improvement District that funds Downtown OKC Inc.)

So some of us don't want to talk about Ed's prior bad decisions as an adult. That is ok with me. We all make mistakes. But regarding tangible evidence on the transit front, I have personally witnessed Ed try to tear apart our process, demonize the mayor, and pit transit advocates against one another. I have known him since the Ward 2 election.

The Mayor I have known since his first election winning against Jim Tolbert. On the transit issue, you have to give this guy props. He had an early position that he stuck to (one I didn't agree with), he forced the other cities to the table if they we serious, they came, and he jumped on board and is literally leading the process.

Forming a long term solution like an RTA takes a leader who doesn't pit advocates and public servants against one another. This (forming and getting an RTA approved by the voters) will likely be one of the most complicated and sophisticated public initiatives ever pursued in our state. It takes stability in leadership and political "buy in" from participating city governments outside of OKC and end even in a different county!

I have attended hundreds of meetings over the past decade. We have never been closer to moving on ahead forward to a substantive and meaningful solution. It is easy for Ed to ridicule our existing bus service. I feel for the folks forced to use it. But it took 70 years of "non-investment" to end up with the system we have to today. Plus the extrication of the original streetcar and Interurban rail system.

Here's a mathematical fact for you I was recently informed of- Mayor Mick has supported and achieved financially annually growing our bus system more than all mayors combined in the past 20 years preceding his tenure.

So whats it going to be?

Ed's idea of playing games with the streetcar system to score political points? Ed's idea that somehow convention center money would solve our transit problem (even though he has no solution for the O&M)? Ed's non-participation in the ongoing processes to actually solve these dire problems?

or

Mayor Mick actually leading us politically by working together with our surrounding communities for better bus, bus rapid transit, para transit, streetcar, and commuter rail through a legitimate long term fix?

My vote is with Mayor Cornett.

Jeff M. Bezdek

Regional Transit Dialogue 1 Public Outreach Committee Chair
Regional Transit Dialogue 2 Commuter Corridors Study Task Force Member
Streetcar Federal Process Alternatives Analysis Steering Committee Member
MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Member (MAPS 3 Streetcar and Intermodal Santa Fe Station Hub Project)

Everyone on the quote bus!

As some folks try to introduce previously unmentioned buzz words like "gentrification" to as the next effort in promoting a suburban/urban divide, a reality check on who gets what, etc:
- Patience Latting Library - NW 122 and MacArthur
- Earlywine Park - SW 119
- New family aquatics centers -Lincoln Park, near NE 36 and Grand Boulevard; Bluff Creek Park, Hefner Road and Meridian; Trosper Park, SE 29 near Interstate 35; Route 66 Park, NW 23 and Overholser Drive, and Lake Stanley Draper Park.
- MAPS for Kids makeovers of schools citywide
- Trails citywide
- Sidewalks citywide
- New lake at Edwards Park in northeast OKC
- Skate Park in south OKC along the river (not downtown)
- New golf building at Lincoln Park
- Streetscapes up and down 23rd, west and east OKC
- Street, bridge improvements citywide with every bond issue far outnumbering those in urban core



Job incentives used to create new employment centers:
- Paycom - far west OKC
- AAA - northwest OKC

Incentives used for retail development
- Factory Outlet Shoppes - far west OKC

Efforts to CREATE affordable housing downtown/urban core:
- Mideke Building
- New homes in JFK
- New homes in Las Rosas
- The Steel Yard

Look at this list and know it's just small glimpse of the investment made outside of downtown by the city this past decade. I am not taking sides in the race. But I will put out factual information when I see what might be deceptive efforts to create an urban/suburban divide in OKC for whatever reason.

This "everything is about Downtown" monster needs to be killed. It is ridiculously erroneous -- and even if it were not, why is not a good idea to boost investment in the core of our city? Isn't the reason this city was on a proverbial deathbed related to the fact that we did NOTHING for the urban core for a generation, allowing it to rot?

I'm willing to have honest conversations about what we need to do to improve our city. I'm open to that. But it is 1) factually incorrect to suggest all of the investment the taxpayers have made is on Downtown, 2) rankly idiotic to oppose infrastructure improvements in our inner city PARTICULARLY IF YOU ARE THE CANDIDATE WHO IS RAILING AGAINST URBAN SPRAWL.

It's quite OK, Steve. You are doing your job.

Just to be clear with everyone since this conversation has turned to transit and there seems to be a bit of confusion.

BTW, I wrote this in response to OKCUSTU and it took awhile. I see Betts is addressing some of it but I'll post it anyway. If Stephen Tyler Holeman reads OKC Talk, this is for you to and those earlier Facebook posts late last night. Some of Ed's folks are trying to impose a great deal of innuendo about the transit issues as well. Perhaps it will help address them.



Mayor Mick is the Chairman of Regional Transit Dialogue (now in Phase 2) hosted by the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments. We (our steering committee, subcommittees and the URS Corporation), are conducting a commuter corridors study to better define what type of infrastructure and what the estimated costs are to build a comprehensive system. The Mayor is also supporting and directly involved in a bill through the state legislature (to be voted on in January and February) that will further enable the formal legal creation of a Regional Transit Authority.

In theory, a Regional Transit Authority would replace and potentially consolidate the Metro Transit bus system, CART (Norman's Bus System), and Citi-link (Edmond). Nelson Nygaard's 2013 Bus system Plan and the 2005 Fixed Guideway Study could in theory be fully funded. That would provide for enhanced bus coverage, frequency, shelters, and additional infrastructure; Bus Rapid Transit to Yukon, Meridian Corridor, and NW Expressway; Commuter Rail to Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, and Del City.

Lets be clear about this, Mayor Cornett was not initially a regional transit supporter. His earliest comments during his first term suggested that he considered transit another way to enable people to live outside of Oklahoma city and subsequently generate their tax revenue there. He was however in favor of improved transit specifically within the Oklahoma City limits proper. There were many times in his first and second terms where he specifically addressed those clamoring for a regional rail system and said that he would change his opinion if the other cities would help pay for it.

Now things have changed.

Mayor Cornett has visited many other cities and seen the overall benefits of a Regional Transit System. Many of the cities (particularly Edmond) have conveyed their support in pursuing the creation of an RTA. In those initial meetings, Midwest City, Del City, and Norman were the three cities with interested elected officials sitting in RTD #1.

NOW we have many of the Councillors and most of the Mayors of Edmond, Midwest City, Del City, Moore, and Norman interested and at the table. In the last few meetings, now Yukon is trying to get involved.

The pursuit of a meaningful solution to our transit woes is within eyesight. And this is primarily due to Mayor Cornett's early position about "not going it alone" and his willingness to embrace pursuing it with these folks now sitting at the table.

Interestingly enough, Ed Shadid does not sit on any of these committees and actually turned down the offer to participate when this initiative was first being organized.


Now regarding the "transit versus the convention center" conversation, MAPS 3 does not provide ongoing revenues for Operations and Maintenance. It is that simple. There is no person that would have a greater desire to see an additional $280 million go to the purchase of buses, shelters, and commuter rail. But if we buy it, how do we operate it? That is why a carefully thought out solution as the mayor proposes in the form of an RTA is the best way to resolve these long term costs. It also best positions us for matching funds for the actual physical infrastructure from the Federal Transit Administration.

The MAPS 3 streetcar is small enough of a system that we are confident that we can find the monies to operate it- parking revenues, advertising on trains and at stops, Santa Fe Station tenant space leasing, and potentially a TIF or change to the BID (Business Improvement District that funds Downtown OKC Inc.)

So some of us don't want to talk about Ed's prior bad decisions as an adult. That is ok with me. We all make mistakes. But regarding tangible evidence on the transit front, I have personally witnessed Ed try to tear apart our process, demonize the mayor, and pit transit advocates against one another. I have known him since the Ward 2 election.

The Mayor I have known since his first election winning against Jim Tolbert. On the transit issue, you have to give this guy props. He had an early position that he stuck to (one I didn't agree with), he forced the other cities to the table if they we serious, they came, and he jumped on board and is literally leading the process.

Forming a long term solution like an RTA takes a leader who doesn't pit advocates and public servants against one another. This (forming and getting an RTA approved by the voters) will likely be one of the most complicated and sophisticated public initiatives ever pursued in our state. It takes stability in leadership and political "buy in" from participating city governments outside of OKC and end even in a different county!

I have attended hundreds of meetings over the past decade. We have never been closer to moving on ahead forward to a substantive and meaningful solution. It is easy for Ed to ridicule our existing bus service. I feel for the folks forced to use it. But it took 70 years of "non-investment" to end up with the system we have to today. Plus the extrication of the original streetcar and Interurban rail system.

Here's a mathematical fact for you I was recently informed of- Mayor Mick has supported and achieved financially annually growing our bus system more than all mayors combined in the past 20 years preceding his tenure.

So whats it going to be?

Ed's idea of playing games with the streetcar system to score political points? Ed's idea that somehow convention center money would solve our transit problem (even though he has no solution for the O&M)? Ed's non-participation in the ongoing processes to actually solve these dire problems?

or

Mayor Mick actually leading us politically by working together with our surrounding communities for better bus, bus rapid transit, para transit, streetcar, and commuter rail through a legitimate long term fix?

My vote is with Mayor Cornett.

Jeff M. Bezdek

Regional Transit Dialogue 1 Public Outreach Committee Chair
Regional Transit Dialogue 2 Commuter Corridors Study Task Force Member
Streetcar Federal Process Alternatives Analysis Steering Committee Member
MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Member (MAPS 3 Streetcar and Intermodal Santa Fe Station Hub Project)

I do support masstrans improvements.

As some folks try to introduce previously unmentioned buzz words like "gentrification" <snip>

I expected more honesty from you Steve. The word is used on a regular basis around here and everywhere we talk about OKC. Because it's relevant.

Including on your page from March where you acknowledged exactly what I just said about it.

11:05 a.m. What is your prediction about how downtown development might radiate outwards to other center city areas? Any chance it will cause neighborhoods and retail areas in the general area of OCU, NW Classen High School, May ave, etc. to improve, gentrify, etc.?

Steve Lackmeyer 11:05 a.m. yes.

OKC Central Chat transcript, March 22, 2013 | News OK (http://newsok.com/okc-central-chat-transcript-march-22-2013/article/3768441)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentrification

<snip>CULARLY IF YO<snip>


I was watching a Ron White bit the other night about him being in a theater and people behind him jabbering during the performance. He used a simile to talk about that.

Repeatedly posting large text in a forum is just like the simile he used too.

What, precisely, is the problem with gentrification? If there is an identifiable problem, how do you propose stopping it? Should we instead invest in areas that already have high end housing and retail, to allow areas that have fallen into disrepair to continue to slide? Or do you believe that the city shouldn't invest in anything and allow the free market to create organic evolution of different areas?

Steve, I do appreciate your perspective and what you've added fundimental to the conversation. A holistic approach is the opposite of us and them...downtown vs the suburbs and whatever else. Can't say the same for many of the other folk in this forum who, as I have pointed out, do not have a holistic view.

The continued overuse of the words "gentrification" and "holistic" reminds me of the movie "The Princess Bride" and the similarly-overused word "inconceivable." Like Inigo Montoya, I think you don't know what those words mean.

mkjeeves, I'm not going to ask how old you are, but I am going to ask if you lived in Oklahoma City in 1980 and if you did, how many times you went downtown between 1980 and 1990, if you can recall.

Back to regular programming...

From Steve Lackmeyer's coverage of Tuesday's council meeting reported on page 1C in today's paper: "A consultant hired to analyze the feasibility of a convention hotel downtown was hit with a blistering verbal attack by councilman and mayoral candidate Ed Shadid, but otherwise found a receptive audience among the remainder of the city council Tuesday." Quoting Shadid, "I expected a highly biased, poorly reasoned, poor methodology study, and I wasn't disappointed." (I believe that someone else posted this yesterday.)

It's not that Shadid continues to stand alone in his beliefs, but he also stands VERY alone in the caustic, obnoxious, offensive and demeaning way that he expresses himself. He may be right, but he's an a$$hole, and nobody follows someone like that.

The continued overuse of the words "gentrification" and "holistic" reminds me of the movie "The Princess Bride" and the similarly-overused word "inconceivable." Like Inigo Montoya, I think you don't know what those words mean.

Speaking of "semantics" . . . Don't you think that, technically, "holistic" should actually be spelled "wholistic"?
(it's inconceivable to me that somehow the "w" got dropped)

mkjeeves, I'm not going to ask how old you are, but I am going to ask if you lived in Oklahoma City in 1980 and if you did, how many times you went downtown between 1980 and 1990, if you can recall.

http://www.okctalk.com/ask-anything-about-okc/35798-age-location-3.html#post716070

I spent part of that time period living at NW 32nd and Shartel and working in a number of the buildings downtown, around town and around the state, as I do now.

And you? What's your history with OKC and Oklahoma.

What, precisely, is the problem with gentrification?

Ask the last four posters who are scared to death to talk about it and that people might use it while discussing OKC.

I tried to read as much as I could of the last few pages but I have had this 'gentrification' discussion with mkjeeves before and here is his concern I understood it (and he can correct me if I wrong). The main concern with gentrification is that as areas revitalize the rents and cost of ownership go up, which in turn drives lower income people out of the area. Even if they own their homes outright the rise in property taxes also put a strain on their limited budgets. At the same time, many of the people in these areas rely on mass transit and in a cruel twist of irony, get forced out of their neighborhood at the very time the improvements to mass transit are made in that neighborhood. That probably explains why mkjeeves and others prefer an expanded bus system instead of rail. They want improved mass transit, but not so improved that middle and upper incomes get attracted by it.

While I can see this concern, there are lots of ways to mitigate it. First, the city can (and does) encourage that a certain percentage of units in large development are offered below market rate. A return to traditional residential outbuildings (granny flats, garage apartments, etc...) also offer safe and affordable housing - especially to the aging elderly and young people. Poor homeowners also see an increase in the home/property value so if they do decide to sell they receive much more than would have in the past. Finally, along with the new residents comes new businesses and better connections to other parts of the urban core, which bring with it increase opportunities for work and quality public recreation (2 things which usually elude the poor).

Alas, we do know one thing for sure - the segregation of people by income (practically mandated by the federal government since the 1949 Housing Act) hasn't worked out well for any of us.

We have not seen lower income residents forced out of JFK or around Las Rosas. There was no history of lower income people living in Bricktown. Affordable housing has been maintained for seniors at the Tower Apartments and Wesley Village in Midtown.
I have no loyalty to either guy in this race. No one can say I've not hit Mick Cornett with hardballs over the past several years. But I will cite history and facts when efforts are undertaken to divide urban and suburban.

Granted, most of OKC's downtown and downtown adjacent neighborhoods have had very few residents for the last 50 years, but what happens when Paseo, 23rd Street, Plaza District, Capitol Hill, and OKCs other historical urban clusters go Midtown or when HSC area goes Memorial Road? Mkjeeves is concerned about what happens to the people living in those areas now.

We know for a fact rail transit will bring a lot of new development to every neighborhood it touches, which is why people who don't want the development oppose rail.

Some people easily dismiss the positive effects of profit as a motive for development and redevelopment. We could leave dilapidated areas that way and it could be affordable to all....at least anyone who WANTED to live there. The same free market forces that work to improve our society as a whole are curiously repugnant to some uber conservatives on here who now WANT government to control the makeup of the market supply and control the rental income. They seem to view capitalism as an evil.

http://www.okctalk.com/ask-anything-about-okc/35798-age-location-3.html#post716070

I spent part of that time period living at NW 32nd and Shartel and working in a number of the buildings downtown, around town and around the state, as I do now.

And you? What's your history with OKC and Oklahoma.

I moved to OKC from Denver in 1980. I lived on 24th St., right behind Cuppies and Joe's. I was a student at the Health Sciences Center and have worked there since graduation. I'd moved here from Denver, which in 1980 had a vibrant, alive downtown day and night. I lived just outside downtown Denver (in a non-gentrified area) and didn't have a car because I didn't need one. I walked or rode the bus everywhere. When I moved here and we immediately went downtown to see what was happening there, we were shocked. We walked around, stared at everything, looked for a restaurant, a store, people, anything. My husband's first comment, "What a dump!" For years I longed to go back to Denver, but for work-related reasons it wasnt feasible. I've since lived in OKC's outskirts, in Deer Creek, in Nichols Hills, but always missed what I had in Denver. When I could see downtown starting to become a shadow of what was clearly its former self, I decided to take a risk(or at least what my friends thought was a risk) and move downtown. It's not Denver, but its not the ghost town it was in 1980.

I never felt like OKC was ignoring me out in the near 'burbs. I had good roads, parks and schools. There were nice grocery stores and shopping. But downtown I considered an embarrassment for a city of our size. So I was thrilled when MAPS was proposed. I was excited about MAPS for Kids. When I look at pictures of what downtown OKC was like in the 40s, I feel sad for what we lost. Denver didn't destroy their downtown and it still flourishes. It's there for every citizen. Now we have a downtown in OKC every citizen can enjoy. I'm proud of what OKC has accomplished and want to see it continue to improve. Which is why I'm voting for Mick Cornett (back on topic).

^ there's another example. No answer other than spend it downtown.

No. If I understand it right, it is NOT just a "spend it downtown" concept. There are plans underway to provide (north) Western and Meridian with a streetscape. I'm pretty sure HubCap alley is included in the plan to make OKC better. There's a lot of work around the 44th or 59th and Western intersections better that could result in some organic improvement there. These are just a couple of examples that come to mind.
Further, I'm pretty sure I DON'T want a lot of investment in my neighborhood. I like my T1/T2 transect UN-urbanized. What would you have the city throw money at, anyway? Better bus shelters? I'm pretty sure it's on the to-do list.

The continued overuse of the words "gentrification" and "holistic" reminds me of the movie "The Princess Bride" and the similarly-overused word "inconceivable." Like Inigo Montoya, I think you don't know what those words mean.

I think they play second fiddle to "swarthy", though.

"Swarthy" is definitely the best and most ridiculous thing that has come out of this thread.

Gentrification in OKC isn't a such a bad thing in that not a lot of displacement happen because of so much available land. In fact, some neighborhoods could benefit patients; there's nothing but empty storefronts at a lack of opportunity at some Oklahoma City neighborhoods. White blanks that there's also the ways we could mitigate rent increases and make sure that older residents and longtime residents don't get priced out of the neighborhood. As good as big business tax breaks have been, neighborhood grants can really generate jobs and make our cultural scene better. Some have wrongly suggested that The plaza or midtown just waved a wand and got gentrified over night. Wrong, both received city monies for street scape projects and in the case of midtown, a tax break to St. Anthony's. There some other great core neighborhoods that would benefit from streetscapes improvements or helping local companies expand or relocate in the core.

But I did think that synopsis of rail versus bus is a little simplistic. Oklahoma City needs a robust transportation network that also includes buses; the rail transit system will not be operable for at least a decade. Also there are parts of Oklahoma City that again are just not dense enough to handle rail and so therefore we need a robust bus system.

I don't know anyone who supports rail who doesn't agree with you about the bus system, okcusta. But I think rail will sell a tax that can be used to improve all transit. I think, based on conversations I've had with people who have either lived in OKC all their lives or cities without good bus transit, as well as people who are fairly fiscally conservative (and there are more of those than there are people like me) that getting a tax passed that only supports improved bus transit would be problematic. We need to promote an improved transit system to get the comprehensive system we need.

I don't know anyone who supports rail who doesn't agree with you about the bus system, okcusta. But I think rail will sell a tax that can be used to improve all transit. I think, based on conversations I've had with people who have either lived in OKC all their lives or cities without good bus transit, as well as people who are fairly fiscally conservative (and there are more of those than there are people like me) that getting a tax passed that only supports improved bus transit would be problematic. We need to promote an improved transit system to get the comprehensive system we need.

And I think it would be more appropriate to handle that at a county-wide level or maybe even form a multi-county trust be established (or COTPA just be rejiggered) to administer something like this.

Clearly we need an RTA. Maybe someone could be a leader and start working on that. :-P

Clearly we need an RTA. Maybe someone could be a leader and start working on that. :-P

Mayor Cornett IS working on that. See UP's post (oft quoted).

Mayor Cornett IS working on that. See UP's post (oft quoted).

I read shawn's statement as tongue in cheek. Was I wrong?

Warren you were not wrong. It was totally tongue in cheek.

OKC Mayoral Candidate Ed Shadid Faces New Drug Abuse Allegations - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports | (http://www.news9.com/story/24234906/shadid)

Well this election is over

I heard the Police Union has pulled their endorsement of Shadid?

I heard the Police Union has pulled their endorsement of Shadid?

Appears to be true.....

FOP Pulls Shadid Support, Cites ?Recent disclosures? | The McCarville Report (http://mccarvillereport.com/archives/16626?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter)

I think the world of Mike McCarville... but I'd call it a suspension, not a pulling of support.

That email read more like a suspension of the endorsement and spending rather than an outright cancellation of the endorsement.

To each their own.


On edit: Steve types faster than I do. :)

I think the world of Mike McCarville... but I'd call it a suspension, not a pulling of support.

I agree. Hard to see how the endorsement might be "restored" in Jan though. But stranger things have happened I suppose.

His most rabid supporters are sure he's being vilified by the "chamber goons" or they feel sorry for him. FOP probably not quite as gullible.

His most rabid supporters are sure he's being vilified by the "chamber goons" or they feel sorry for him. FOP probably not quite as gullible.

Fool me once.....

I think the world of Mike McCarville... but I'd call it a suspension, not a pulling of support.

Yes, I agree, it's more like a wait n see. On the subject of Mike McCarville, I've known him for years and received his McCarville Report 30 years ago when it was actually something you got in the mail. Mike is as decent a man as you'll find. I just wanted to say that.

I agree. Mike is a legend - someone I greatly admire.

I suspect the endorsement will just quietly fade away.
The incumbent's people would be over the line bonkers to do anything other than let it die a lonely death in the political swamp known as On Second Thought bog.

He just sent an email to all police officers saying all kinds of things & playing the victim. Also saying he and his wife will address the media tomorrow.

This guy is a real piece of work... He will try to manipulate everybody he can!

Woah. I can't imagine the FOP is going to like that, though I suppose it depends on how the email was worded.

He just sent an email to all police officers saying all kinds of things & playing the victim. Also saying he and his wife will address the media tomorrow.

This guy is a real piece of work... He will try to manipulate everybody he can!

What moron is running his campaign?

He just sent an email to all police officers saying all kinds of things & playing the victim. Also saying he and his wife will address the media tomorrow.

This guy is a real piece of work... He will try to manipulate everybody he can!

That is his "ex-wife," although he also refers to her as "coparent."

Appears to be true.....

FOP Pulls Shadid Support, Cites ?Recent disclosures? | The McCarville Report (http://mccarvillereport.com/archives/16626?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter)

If this is true, then i'd donate to them again. I said I wouldn't when they endorsed ES, but if they've recanted...... then great.

I think the world of Mike McCarville... but I'd call it a suspension, not a pulling of support.

You are correct, but it's hard to imagine them suddenly re-endorsing him after this. It seems like a formality until they can get a full vote approving withdrawal of the endorsement.

How does ed shadid have access to the email addresses of all police officers? Did the union give him access to all of their email addresses?

It's going to be problematic for a union of law enforcement officers to continue their support for someone who has now admitted to repeated violations of the law. Regardless of whether he has cleaned up his life. My guess, if ES was applying for a job on the police force, these admissions would result in a denial of employment. Supporting someone for mayor who would not be deemed suitable for employment with their agency would be stupid. JMHO

What moron is running his campaign?

I suspect he is. And his political IQ is clearly low.

Regardless, I don't know how a union associated with law enforcement can publicly support someone with his history and maintain any credibility.