Consider me uninformed. Do basements here have sump pumps are a standard feature? I'm sure it depends on the age of the basement...but curious. Granted they can't keep up if water is rushing in.

And that is one of the many cruxes and sub-cruxes of the matter . . . Especially when the power shuts off.
Imagine going into a built-in, retrofit, storm "cellar" maybe out there in the garage and having the house collapse on top of the door to the subterranian "safe room" right before the flash floods start, the local storm drainage systems are overwhelmed and . . .

No Problem: Always keep a well-charged set of "aqualungs" or "rebreathers" equal to the stated capacity of the "safe room" in the safe room. Next to the dead battery storage devices.

That, or have a set of those personal survival pods ("like a helmet for your entire body . . . tested at Niagra Falls and in SciFi films" mentioned above) at the ready.

(apologies to Jayhawk for crosssing posts detail-wise . . . except, of course, for when the tornado took the house it didn't leave the backup generator unscathed . . . not counting the one that was found three counties away still running as if nothing had happened.)

In the real world, the other night, my wife said: "What are we going to do? Pull the couch over us?" (this, during and after a flurry of phone calls to and from visitors from UpNord trapped at the La Quinta on Memorial regarding our dinner invitation at the house and driving locations and their unfamiliarity regarding the Apocalypic Weather Broadcasts interfering with our plans including flooding concerns) "No," i replied (after "huh? say wha?"), "We'll get into that closet like the last time a tornado came close." "But we can't . . . The closet is full." "It won't be for long . . . until we get into it. In the meantime, let's keep hoping and praying it misses us . . . again." (and the sirens in the background continued their pointless banshee wail . . . but not for us. not this time.)

One more reason to be thankful (sorry if that sounds selfish).

And that is one of the many cruxes and sub-cruxes of the matter . . . Especially when the power shuts off.
Imagine going into a built in storm "cellar" maybe out there in the garage and having the house collapse on top of the door to the "safe room" right before the flash floods start, the local storm drainage systems are overwhelmed and . . .


That's one of my biggest (irrational) fears, and why I probably wouldn't ever depend on a house with a 'storm cellar.' I do think about what would happen if my entire house caved in on me in the basement, though...

There is no perfect system. And, like many have mentioned, the odds that one of us will directly experience the impact of an EF-5 are slim to none. However, if having some sort of a shelter available makes people like bchris02 sleep better at night, then it's well worth it for him/her to spend the money to get one.

I do think about what would happen if my entire house caved in on me in the basement, though...

The last house I lived in with a basement had a concrete ceiling in the basement. Problem solved.

That's one of my biggest (irrational) fears, and why I probably wouldn't ever depend on a house with a 'storm cellar.' I do think about what would happen if my entire house caved in on me in the basement, though...

There is no perfect system. And, like many have mentioned, the odds that one of us will directly experience the impact of an EF-5 are slim to none. However, if having some sort of a shelter available makes people like bchris02 sleep better at night, then it's well worth it for him/her to spend the money to get one.
I agree with you that if it helps him sleep better that storm shelter is well worth the cost.

You might look into buying or building a very sturdy table to hide under during a tornado. I know of several cases where people were killed when the floor above the basement blew off or caved in.
I have also known several people who would keep saws, hatchets, sledge hammers, large pry bars, and car jacks in their storm shelter. But I believe that most communities have a program where you can register your shelter so they can come check it after the tornado.

That's one of my biggest (irrational) fears, and why I probably wouldn't ever depend on a house with a 'storm cellar.' I do think about what would happen if my entire house caved in on me in the basement, though...

There is no perfect system.

I would substitute "rational concerns" for "irrational fears" . . . (but that's just me)
Still . . . if "The Smart People" who actually factor in all this sort of input and who are inventive and actually capable of providing real and effective solutions to the real and perceived problems involved in "Tornado Survival" issues . . . (nah . . . that ain't gonna happen . . . =)

The last house I lived in with a basement had a concrete ceiling in the basement. Problem solved.

Remember those Collapsed Freeway Section pics from that [last big] California earthquake?
I know that a concrete slab topped basement isn't an overpass/bridge but I also personally saw a 6" thick, 12' x 12' concrete slab moved over about 8" by that dinky tornado that hit out around Crescent/Mulhall back in '99 . . .

This does not do anything good for the image of Oklahoma. See below.




Oklahoma: One of the 8 most dangerous places to live on the planet? | News OK (http://newsok.com/oklahoma-one-of-the-8-most-dangerous-places-to-live-on-the-planet/article/3842050)

File this under 'what the heck?':

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/296296_10152877663850191_25985827_n.jpg



This guy lost almost everything in the Moore tornado but discovered his car still ran! So he's driving it!!


Source: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152877663850191&set=a.307413635190.336102.226813135190&type=1

Not sure how legal that is... but you gotta admire the spirit!

Guess it is a good thing we don't have vehicle inspections anymore. :)

Guess it is a good thing we don't have vehicle inspections anymore. :)

You don't think it would pass?
:Smiley112

I'm sure it's not street legal at all. But it's hard to imagine a cop heartless enough to ticket the guy.

You don't think it would pass?
:Smiley112

I'm sure it's not street legal at all. But it's hard to imagine a cop heartless enough to ticket the guy.

i dunno . . . it doesn't look like he's wearing an approved seat belt . . .

Remember those Collapsed Freeway Section pics from that [last big] California earthquake?
I know that a concrete slab topped basement isn't an overpass/bridge but I also personally saw a 6" thick, 12' x 12' concrete slab moved over about 8" by that dinky tornado that hit out around Crescent/Mulhall back in '99 . . .
It must not have been done in one pour if it was the top of a basement. If it was just a slab on the ground that was moved, that's a totally different issue than a basement top.

The last house I lived in with a basement had a concrete ceiling in the basement. Problem solved.
Ours doesn't (the one we bought or the rental) and I would imagine that the majority up here are all wood frame but then we aren't really dealing with the same concern for tornadoes.


Remember those Collapsed Freeway Section pics from that [last big] California earthquake?
I know that a concrete slab topped basement isn't an overpass/bridge but I also personally saw a 6" thick, 12' x 12' concrete slab moved over about 8" by that dinky tornado that hit out around Crescent/Mulhall back in '99 . . .
The concrete caps we did at the Catholic Youth Camp near Luther (in response to the Muhall tornado) was tied to the CMU walls with a bunch of rebar, that one sounds like it wasn't tied properly to the structure.

Any word on any storm shelter rebates for our area?

KOCO ran a story in April that the state program had exhausted its funds. Do not know if the events of May prompted new funding.
Funds run out for local safe room rebate programs - Oklahoma City - OKC - KOCO.com (http://www.koco.com/weather/Funds-run-out-for-local-safe-room-rebate-programs/-/9845544/19670338/-/xxke7lz/-/index.html)

First of all, I stress I mean no offense to any of the great people who live in this state and city by asking this. I am greatly moved by the response from Oklahomans to this tragedy. My thoughts and prayers are with the people affected by it. Sometimes I am hard on OKC but overall I like it alright. However, if there is one thing that is really propelling me to consider moving away it is this.

I moved back to OKC last summer after having lived in several other places around the country. Last time I lived in Oklahoma I lived in Moore in 1999 and was nearly hit by the May 3, 1999 storm. After the tornado was past where my house was I watched the tornado wreak destruction out my back window. Needless to say, it was traumatizing. When I moved back to Oklahoma to accept a great job offer, I was concerned about tornadoes but thought to myself that the possibility of another storm like what happened on May 3, 1999 happening again was slim to none. Unfortunately, I was wrong as we all know what happened on May 20th. Now they are talking about the chance of tornadoes again this week and I am scared out of my mind. It seems that if there is a 'Ground Zero' for tornado alley, it is Central Oklahoma.

My question is, to people who have lived here a long time, how do you do it without having constant anxiety from April-June every year? I've lived in hurricane, earthquake, and tornado (though much less so than OKC) prone places but nothing compares to this. Maybe its the fact that though earthquakes and hurricanes can potentially do much more damage, tornadoes are far more frequent and random you never know where they are going to strike next and how strong they will be.

Is it something I will get used to after a few years here? Once again I mean absolutely no offense to anybody by asking this.

Would you feel safer living in Florida? Hurricane Andrew from 1992:


Andrew made a direct hit on Homestead, Florida and nearby Florida City (both not too far from Miami). What did the storm leave behind?

28,066 homes were destroyed…


82,000 businesses were destroyed or damaged…


107,380 homes were damaged…


250,000 people were left homeless…


700,000 people were evacuated…


1.4 million homes were left without electricity…


Homestead Air Force Base was literally wiped from the map…


1,167 mobile homes were destroyed (Andrew only spared 9 mobile homes in the area!)…



Total losses:

$26.5 billion (some media sources put the number as high as $30 billion- when adjusted in 2004 dollars, damage was about $43.67 billion)…


Death toll from Hurricane Andrew varies. According to an article in the August 24th, 2004 edition of the St. Petersburg Times:


The National Hurricane Center says a total of 44 people died from Andrew (15 directly killed by the hurricane, 29 indirect deaths)…


The Centers for Disease Control puts the death toll at 32, (14 directly killed by the hurricane and just 18 indirect deaths)…

Any word on any storm shelter rebates for our area?

I believe most expect that they'll be brought back sometime this year. Of course the counties impacted will vary greatly. We'll probably see lotteries for the impact cities first and then for the counties.

It must not have been done in one pour if it was the top of a basement. If it was just a slab on the ground that was moved, that's a totally different issue than a basement top.

Of course, you are correct. It was apparently a concrete slab, poured over an addition of some sort, to a 100 year old farmhouse southeast of Crescent. The house was totally splinterized (and the slab moved). Ironically, a large corrugated paneled "pole barn" less than thirty yards from the (former) house was nearly unscathed.

That being said . . . I have often wondered why building codes have never DEMANDED that a corner of any tilt-up/alt. commericial construction building have interior lateral support walls--and maybe even some sort of ceiling structure (strong, but lightweight and properly anchored) and completely independent of the common steel roof truss system that is the first thing to go in a strong storm.

On the other hand I have often wondered why building codes don't demand a minimum 32" (preferably 36") wide door on at least one bathroom on the lower floor of a house. (for wheelchair access in case an unexpected event puts one unexpectedly in the position of needing one). Obviously, a bit of closet and/or other space would have to be sacrificed in order to allow for the extra eight to twelve inches of door opening but it is much less expensive to do this during the design part of a project than to do a retrofit. Please be advised that I don't personally need this sort of "accomodation" but I've known folks who do and possess a bit of empathy.

(and did, even while I was in the remodeling business)

With the right roof the thought of a modern engineered, solid, Compressed Earth Block (CEB) home is intriguing.

I would want to learn more.




An Overview of Different Construction Methods As They Pertain to Tornado Resistance

An Overview of Different Constru (http://www.earthtek.co/pages/overview.htm)

Or Rammed Earth: Rammed Earth Builder (http://www.earthandsun.com/)

With the right roof the thought of a modern engineered, solid, Compressed Earth Block (CEB) home is intriguing.

I would want to learn more.

An Overview of Different Construction Methods As They Pertain to Tornado Resistance

An Overview of Different Constru (http://www.earthtek.co/pages/overview.htm)

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but this sounds a lot like Adobe For The New Millenium and is probably most effective where there is little to no water table or rain or tornadic activity. (now i will read the article and prove myself wrong . . . =)

(free bonus suggestion: when setting fence posts it is always better to dig the hole, put some pea gravel in the bottom for drainage, then tamp in the dirt you took out to form the hole rather than setting the post in concrete. if you don't want to do a bunch of tamping, then water-packing the disturbed soil will make your fence post happier and make it last longer)

o'yeah: please note the poetic and protected juxtaposition of human and natural confines that resulted in this:
tornadoes? fuggedaboutem' only problem: no people. (on account of no water on account of . . . et. ad inf.)

http://greenpassivesolar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/cc3-wikipedia-by-Lorax-Mesaverde_cliffpalace_.jpg

perhaps a lesson to be learned from the wasps. and the W.A.S.P.s as well
excuse me . . . there is apparently a circle of . . . visitors arranged in the roofless kiva for the photo shoot. apparently they are from Oklahoma. i'm not sure . . . but they may be praying . . .

He was behind me in Moore the other day....LOL.

He was behind me in Moore the other day....LOL.

Hopefully not The Discredited Journalist from The Daily Oklahoman . . . =)
or that "lost ogle" dude . . .

(free bonus suggestion: when setting fence posts it is always better to dig the hole, put some pea gravel in the bottom for drainage, then tamp in the dirt you took out to form the hole rather than setting the post in concrete. if you don't want to do a bunch of tamping, then water-packing the disturbed soil will make your fence post happier and make it last longer)



Interesting tip on setting fence post.
I used steel T post on the last stockade fence I put up.
The posts are on 7 foot centers with an 8” x DIA 30” deep augured hole filled with mixed concrete.
This fence was about 115’ long built with a tolerance of .125. I hand selected each board and used no nails
I did all the work myself including the design.
The fence is about 12 years old now. It’s been exposed to strong winds and even with the drought the entire fence hasn’t moved more than about in either direction .250 off center.

With the soil and wind we have around here, that is one amazing fence. Oh: I probably should have made it clear that I was referring to wooden fence posts.

Compressed Earth Block Research from The University of Oklahoma College of Architecture

Division of Architecture - College of Architecture - The University of Oklahoma (http://www.ou.edu/architecture/division_of_architecture.html)

Learn about safe rooms

High Winds Safe Rooms (http://www.srh.noaa.gov/jetstream/hwsafe/)

Can/will Oklahoma and OKC be able to sustain positive population growth given the recent spate of severe weather and more importantly the negative perception that the city is a dangerous place to live because of the violent weather patterns? Thoughts

Yes.

As others have said, people have to live somewhere, and everywhere is at risk for something. Most reasonable people know and understand that, and know that part of living anywhere is how to mitigate the risks associated with living there, whether it be tornadoes, hurricanes, wildfires, earthquakes, blizzards, etc. These situations bring awareness and may scare off the more delusional who think there's a place where nature can't kill them, but I think most people see a potential place beyond the disasters that may occur there.

Can/will Oklahoma and OKC be able to sustain positive population growth given the recent spate of severe weather and more importantly the negative perception that the city is a dangerous place to live because of the violent weather patterns? Thoughts


The risk is that by not doing nearly enough to proactively protect our citizens with more shelters and mitigating damaged with stronger state building codes for new construction that we see business scratch Oklahoma off the list as a relocation destination.

From an outsiders perspective who might be looking at Oklahoma as a place to relocate a business some would be turned off by the fact that we don’t even require that our new schools have storm shelters as some other states have done. IMHO it portrays a backwards image of our state that we have been working so hard to overcome since the dust bowl days. When we won’t even do some of the most basic things to protect our self’s when other states do why should we expect others to want to move here?

The risk is that by not doing nearly enough to proactively protect our citizens with more shelters and mitigating damaged with stronger state building codes for new construction that we see business scratch Oklahoma off the list as a relocation destination.

From an outsiders perspective who might be looking at Oklahoma as a place to relocate a business some would be turned off by the fact that we don’t even require that our new schools have storm shelters as some other states have done. IMHO it portrays a backwards image of our state that we have been working so hard to overcome since the dust bowl days. When we won’t even do some of the most basic things to protect our self’s when other states do why should we expect others to want to move here?

Yeah, I'm not buying that argument. Plenty of other much bigger states that attract lots of commerce have disasters with much higher damage cost - Florida Texas and NY for just three.

Tornadoes and sharks seem to instill the same irrational fear in the public.

Yeah, I'm not buying that argument. Plenty of other much bigger states that attract lots of commerce have disasters with much higher damage cost - Florida Texas and NY for just three.

Tornadoes and sharks seem to instill the same irrational fear in the public.

You may not buy it but those states have far stronger build requirements that better protect people in new construction…. This puts more people’s minds at ease. Employers who care about their people look at such factors. They care that they don’t need to worry about their kid’s safety from most natural disasters while there at school. I'm not buying what your selling at all!

If we want to live in a top tier state it’s time to do what top tier states do and build stronger buildings and protect our people.

If we don’t do it the insurance companies are eventually going to do it for us, their way!

You may not buy it but those states have far stronger build requirements that better protect people in new construction…. This puts more people’s minds at ease. Employers who care about their people look at such factors. They care that they don’t need to worry about their kid’s safety from most natural disasters while there at school. I'm not buying what your selling at all!

Those 'stronger build requirements' still result in higher dollar value loses due to natural disasters than Oklahoma. Where's your proof that companies are bypassing Oklahoma because of tornadoes?

Top 10 States Most at Risk of Disaster-Kiplinger (http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/insurance/T028-S001-top-10-states-most-at-riskof-disaster/index.html)

Those 'stronger build requirements' still result in higher dollar value loses due to natural disasters than Oklahoma. Where's your proof that companies are bypassing Oklahoma because of tornadoes?

Top 10 States Most at Risk of Disaster-Kiplinger (http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/insurance/T028-S001-top-10-states-most-at-riskof-disaster/index.html)

Same thing I am wondering. Where's the proof?

Those 'stronger build requirements' still result in higher dollar value loses due to natural disasters than Oklahoma. Where's your proof that companies are bypassing Oklahoma because of tornadoes?

Top 10 States Most at Risk of Disaster-Kiplinger (http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/insurance/T028-S001-top-10-states-most-at-riskof-disaster/index.html)

Don’t ask silly questions, the event is way too fresh for there to be any proof.

But rest assured it will stick in the minds of corporate business leaders who will want to know what we are doing as a state to proactively prevent injuries, death and destruction just like many other states have done to mitigate their repeated natural disasters.
When it’s proven that we can do better doing nothing is tantamount to ignorance and stupidity and it will be seen as exactly that by outside business.

Oklahoma was just named as one of the 8 most dangerous places to live on the entire planet by Popular Mechanics. With publicity like this Oklahoma is going be forced to do hard core things to counter it. Otherwise the image is here to stay.


8 of the Most Dangerous Places (To Live) on the Planet - Popular Mechanics (http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/natural-disasters/4329314#slide-7)



The I-44 Tornado Corridor
Where: Oklahoma City/Tulsa, Oklahoma

More than 1 million people reside along the Interstate 44 corridor that runs between Oklahoma City and Tulsa, the Sooner State's two most populous metropolitan areas. Each spring, as the cool, dry air from the Rocky Mountains glides across the lower plains, and the warm, wet air of the Gulf Coast comes north to meet it, the residents of this precarious stretch, locally called Tornado Alley, settle in for twister season.

Since 1890, more than 120 tornados have struck Oklahoma City and the surrounding area, which currently has a population of approximately 700,000. On May 3, 1999, an outbreak of 70 tornados stretched across Oklahoma, Kansas and Texas. Several of the most destructive storms swept through Oklahoma City, destroying 1700 homes and damaging another 6500. Even with modern prediction capabilities and early-warning systems, 40 people died when an F-5 twister tore through Oklahoma City. In addition to the loss of life, this display of natural devastation caused more than $1 billion in damage. Since 1950, the longest the area has gone without a tornado is five years—from 1992 to 1998. (As if making up for lost time, in the 11 months that followed that record lull, 11 tornados hit.) For only three other periods during the last half-century has Oklahoma City gone more than two years without a tornado.

Northeast of Oklahoma City, along the same track that most tornado-producing storms travel, sits Tulsa, which has experienced its own share of devastation at the hands of Tornado Alley's storms. Between 1950 and 2006, 69 tornados spun across Tulsa County—population 590,000—though none proved as deadly as the 1999 storm that hit Oklahoma City. But because of its geography—the city lies along the banks of the Arkansas River and is built atop an extensive series of creeks and their flood plains—Tulsa is particularly vulnerable to the rain that accompanies Oklahoma's severe weather. Major floods in 1974, 1976 and 1984 caused hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of damage.

"Just Named" - try again..... "Editor's Note: This article was published in 2009 and is not a response to the recent events in Oklahoma"

Which means you should surely be able to find articles to support your claim since 'just named' was actually 4 years ago.

"Just Named" - try again..... "Editor's Note: This article was published in 2009 and is not a response to the recent events in Oklahoma"

Which means you should surely be able to find articles to support your claim since 'just named' was actually 4 years ago.

It's just as relevant today as it was 4 years ago, unless you’re dumb enough to think we are going to stop having tornadoes and such?

Hardening Your Home Against Tornadoes



The very worst tornadoes, such as the one that ripped through Moore, Okla., might overpower even our best home construction techniques. But there are plenty of steps to take to protect you home against more common kinds of twisters, and a variety of shelters to protect your family from the worst-case scenario.

Hardening Your Home Against Tornadoes - Popular Mechanics (http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/survival/tips/hardening-your-home-against-tornadoes-15553314?click=pm_latest)

June 4, 2013 2:44 PM


When you think of a tornado, you rightly think that there's little you can do to protect yourself short of huddling in a fortified underground bunker. Yet in the case of an F4 or F5 tornado, a fortified underground shelter would be the best bet.

Still, underground shelters have their own set of problems, including the possibility that groundwater can seep in or that they can easily become moldy as condensation forms on their walls. They're also extremely expensive and notoriously unstable—and expansive soils in the southern U.S. can wreak havoc with them.

Instead, existing homes can be fortified with sheet metal, plywood, and heavy-duty hardware, and you don't even have to go to an architect or an engineer for plans. FEMA has some surprisingly straightforward plans (PDF) that an experienced amateur builder should be able to use to make a safe room in his or her house or basement. And it doesn't require exotic hardware to make high-strength connections to bolster a residential frame building. Chances are you can find most of what you need at a local home center or lumberyard.

One of the best names in the business, Simpson Strong-Tie, makes connectors that create a continuous load path, tying the house together from roof to foundation. Simpson has teamed up with university engineers to make the design and installation process as straightforward as possible. If you can read construction drawings and are familiar with using basic power tools, especially a rotary hammer or a hammer drill, it's likely that you can install the necessary connectors.

These connectors give protection for F0, F1, and F2 tornadoes, which account for 95 percent of tornado activity. (For protection against an F1 tornado, Simpson Strong-Tie products cost $0.25 per square foot during new home construction. F2 protection costs $0.50 per square foot.)

Once winds start clocking in at around 165 mph, speeds equivalent to an F3, things get a little tricky. "By the time you get to that point, you're having problems with windows and roofs resisting those winds," says Randy Shackelford, vice president of the Simpson Strong-Tie Company.

Read more: Hardening Your Home Against Tornadoes - Popular Mechanics

Oklahoma has a low cost of living for a reason. What you are asking for is going to require a lot more government regulation on building codes and such, and I'm sorry...the wrong party is controlling things right now to make that happen. Not to go political, but you'll have a fierce fight on hand from the folks of the Tea Party and similar anti-government intrusion that will fight any changes...regardless of our sound and GOOD they are.

I'm with you though. We need to see building codes updated to at least accommodate not just tornadoes, but how many severe weather days do we have with damaging wind events? Quite a few: Monthly Storm Data Reports for Western, Central and Southern Oklahoma and Western North Texas (http://www.srh.noaa.gov/oun/?n=stormdata)

Oklahoma has a low cost of living for a reason. What you are asking for is going to require a lot more government regulation on building codes and such, and I'm sorry...the wrong party is controlling things right now to make that happen. Not to go political, but you'll have a fierce fight on hand from the folks of the Tea Party and similar anti-government intrusion that will fight any changes...regardless of our sound and GOOD they are.

I'm with you though. We need to see building codes updated to at least accommodate not just tornadoes, but how many severe weather days do we have with damaging wind events? Quite a few: Monthly Storm Data Reports for Western, Central and Southern Oklahoma and Western North Texas (http://www.srh.noaa.gov/oun/?n=stormdata)

I don’t want this thread to turn into a political discussion because on an issue like this it should cross party lines.
Most of the stuff that can be done on new construction is not very costly yet it significantly strengthens the new construction. The cost benefit is basically occurring over the entire life time of the structure, for many decades.

New codes can make us more prosperous though cost savings on lower insurance rates, lower damage rates, and lower heath care cost due to lower injuries and death.

The economic angle needs to be made clear to all, once it’s made I believe that most opposition in our state would melt away. Just like other states have done, it’s the right thing to do to protect our future.

It's just as relevant today as it was 4 years ago, unless you’re dumb enough to think we are going to stop having tornadoes and such?

'Dumb enough' is relative at best. The label you referenced was put on Oklahoma 4 years ago (by Popular Mechanics of all things) - are you 'dumb enough' to continue to forward your statement, yet since 2009 you can't find a single piece of evidence that companies refused to locate here because of tornadoes?

'Dumb enough' is relative at best. The label you referenced was put on Oklahoma 4 years ago (by Popular Mechanics of all things) - are you 'dumb enough' to continue to forward your statement, yet since 2009 you can't find a single piece of evidence that companies refused to locate here because of tornadoes?

On 6/4/13 CH 9 said that PM republished the article.

Since 2009 we haven’t had very much national publicity about our tornadoes until now. It’s entirely relevant rather you like it or not because we will keep having tornadoes… It’s entirely relevant because we have a national image of not doing all we can to protect our self’s and our kids.

If you don’t think this plays on people minds on in other parts of the nation when they think about moving to Oklahoma then you don’t get out much…. It’s a very big deal to overcome with some people and anything we can do to put people’s minds at ease is going to help in our economic efforts.

Living with tornado threats?

There are more than just building codes and shelters that we should do. Part of this is simple decisions.

Perhaps when a PDS tornado watch is issued it would be wise to allow schools to dismiss classes if they don’t have certified shelters. Once a warning is issued, for the schools that have certified shelters the kids should be kept in shelter during a tornado warning and not be allowed to be released to their parents.

Any non-essential employee should be allowed to leave work without fear of punishment if that place of employment has no certified shelter for all employees.

We could erect more electronic signs that inform drivers to tune to a certain radio station for more WX info.
The weather and news people should have a better system of informing drivers of the most up to date and current congested traffic along with the areas to avoid due to both the storm and congestion. We should reduce the bottle necks in our highways that are already needed every day.

It would be nice if insurance companies would give discount rates on homes that have been fortified for tornadoes.

Twisters have come and gone through parts of Oklahoma, many, many parts, since well before it was Oklahoma. Near as I can tell, the state seems to be growing at a better than middlin' clip. OKC, Norman, even Mo-whathaveIgotafreakinbullseyeonmyback-ore are all doing some interesting growth in the past 25 or so years. As are Mustang, Yukon and parts further out.

Twisters suck, quite literally. But overall, life goes on even when the wind comes twirling down the plains instead of just sweeping..

On 6/4/13 CH 9 said that PM republished the article.

Since 2009 we haven’t had very much national publicity about our tornadoes until now. It’s entirely relevant rather you like it or not because we will keep having tornadoes… It’s entirely relevant because we have a national image of not doing all we can to protect our self’s and our kids.

If you don’t think this plays on people minds on in other parts of the nation when they think about moving to Oklahoma then you don’t get out much…. It’s a very big deal to overcome with some people and anything we can do to put people’s minds at ease is going to help in our economic efforts.

Yet, you can't provide a single fact or evidence.... just blah blah, opinion, blah blah opinion.

Its great to have an opinion. But to forward it as fact when you can't back it up in the slightest is absurdity.

If its such a 'very big deal to overcome with some people' (assuming you're still staying on your topic of companies not willing to locate to Oklahoma because of tornadoes) then please, just provide one simple source.

The state and OKC are growing by leaps and bounds - which flies in the face of your false assertions.

Storms don't blow away state's reputation, ability to recruit | Oklahoman.com (http://www.oklahoman.com/article/3843290?e_id=52616e646f6d4956d6cfb9da941e68866d2a4 09dffa695bd)


“Overall, it’s certainly not helpful to growing our economy or to our outside view, but I don’t think there’s any long-term negative effect,” Oklahoma City Mayor Mick Cornett said. “We’ve established our own identity over the past few years. I don’t think we’re branded by tragedies like we once were. Our brand has improved such that the weather events don’t overshadow the other events we’ve highlighted and promoted.”
“Ten to 20 years ago, our brand didn’t stand for much. It didn’t have any positive things associated with it,” Cornett said. “Now with the (Thunder) basketball team and the general economic news that has come out, there are so many positive things to be associated with Oklahoma City. It’s much easier for our brand to withstand this type of weather information.”

The Oklahoma City Chamber every few years conducts surveys of business leaders nationwide about their perceptions of Oklahoma City.

“Weather typically comes up,” said Cynthia Reid, communications director for the chamber. “We see the impact of weather ebb and flow from year to year. It was an increased concern in 2010 compared to 2007 because we had just had some storms. If we were to take that survey again now, we would see the same thing, but a year or two from now, we might not.”

The recent tornadoes may create a fearful image for some, but the national reports also could actually be beneficial, Reid said.

“There’s not a doubt in my mind that this brings some of those negative stereotypes back, but the coverage also has shown what kind of place this is,” Reed said.

“There’s a positive impact of how we come together.”

While the storms have highlighted a negative affect of living in Oklahoma, they also have pointed out one of the state’s greatest strengths, Hackler said.

“A lot of people would think companies would be put off by the weather, but we’ve gotten a lot of very favorable indications of support from companies that are considering Oklahoma,” he said.

“They’ve advised us that the weather is not going to take us out of consideration. In fact, the way Oklahomans respond to adversity, many companies have said that’s the type of people they want working for them.”
Bad weather may be less of a concern for larger national or international companies that are considering expanding to Oklahoma, Hackler said.

“Some really large companies we’ve been working with have said ‘We’re so big, wherever there’s adverse weather, it’s going to affect us. We can’t run from it or hide from it,’” he said.

“Companies are looking for a good opportunity for their company and their workforce to get the job done. The way Oklahomans respond to adversity shows their character and makes them valuable employees.”

Reid said business leaders in general tend to be less concerned about tornadoes and other weather-related threats.

“Business leaders have a tendency to understand that risk,” she said. “The greater impact we see is from potential employees asked to relocate here. They may not have that understanding.”

You may not buy it but those states have far stronger build requirements that better protect people in new construction…. This puts more people’s minds at ease. Employers who care about their people look at such factors. They care that they don’t need to worry about their kid’s safety from most natural disasters while there at school. I'm not buying what your selling at all!
Texas only has them to 100 miles from the coast, the rest of Texas (including the DFW, Austin and San Antonio areas) for the most part have no different codes than the state of Oklahoma. Houston and Corpus Christi were the only areas that I had to deal with anything different then what Oklahoma has in regards to actual building codes, mostly in glazing and no ballasted low-slope roofs for the most part. There were differences in land development and energy codes in Austin but nothing building wise was any different. They are all dealing with the International Code Council codes as the basis of municipal building codes. The City of Houston has pretty much a rewrite of the IBC, the City of Pasadena uses the NFPA buildings codes which is the only place that I have ever used the NFPA outside of fire protection or life safety.

Yet, you can't provide a single fact or evidence.... just blah blah, opinion, blah blah opinion.

Its great to have an opinion. But to forward it as fact when you can't back it up in the slightest is absurdity.

If its such a 'very big deal to overcome with some people' (assuming you're still staying on your topic of companies not willing to locate to Oklahoma because of tornadoes) then please, just provide one simple source.


We are taking about the future not the past. As I said it’s way too soon for these particular tornadoes to have had any impact on the decisions of relocations. To not consider that is to ignore reality of the present time.
Business has become far more risk adverse than ever has been. It would literally take a fool to not think they won’t have an impact on some relocation decisions in the future.

Our relocation competitors will make dam sure that the decision makers in business see how Oklahoma’s has chosen to protect their life and property that you can take to the bank. Your way hands them ammunition to work with.

Storms don't blow away state's reputation, ability to recruit | Oklahoman.com (http://www.oklahoman.com/article/3843290?e_id=52616e646f6d4956d6cfb9da941e68866d2a4 09dffa695bd)

Check and mate.

The state and OKC are growing by leaps and bounds

Almost all our states growth has been related to energy where most people have a decent perception of the impact of tornadoes. People who are not exposed to tornado threats from other part of the country are often far more apprehensive. They are going to look far harder at what we are doing, or not, when it comes to relocations. Their relocations are big key to a more diversified state economy.

Check and mate.


That’s hardly the case….! It’s a mayor in spin mode just exactly as you would expect to see!

Even the mayor admits “Overall, it’s certainly not helpful to growing our economy or to our outside view, but I don’t think there’s any long-term negative effect,”

Only time will tell but even he has got to know that we are missing out on opportunity’s because we haven’t been as proactive as we should be.

And some people never miss a chance to be negative. Absolutely nobody knows for sure at this point how it will affect OKC in the long term but the indications seem to be that the affects will be minimal.

“There’s not a doubt in my mind that this brings some of those negative stereotypes back, but the coverage also has shown what kind of place this is,” Reed said


Some of those negative stereotypes can be removed if we will work toward a plan that works to protect our children while they are in school along with some other basic precautions.
This negative stereotype that was often repeated by national news sources and it looks horrible to many outsiders.

And some people never miss a chance to be negative. Absolutely nobody knows for sure at this point how it will affect OKC in the long term but the indications seem to be that the affects will be minimal.


This isn’t about being negative at least from me. Actually it’s the complete opposite.

It about taking control of the situation and building a better future by mitigating the cost associated with the storms of the future.

It’s about being smarter than we have been by doing things that we know work and doing most of it at reasonably low cost. There are real reasons why other states have started more proactive measures than what we have done.

It sends a much better message to outsiders and even to our self’s than the status quo that some seem to think is ok.

Safety experts call for national law encouraging strong building codes | Insure.com (http://www.insure.com/insurance-news/law-strong-building-codes.html)
May 21, 2013
Building safety experts want Congress to pass a law that would give states financial incentives to adopt and enforce strong building codes.

The International Association of Fire Chiefs and the Insurance Institute for Business & Home Safety are supporting the Safe Building Code Incentive Act, which was introduced in the House and Senate May 8.

"There is no question among first responders, and the fire service in particular, that strong building codes provide vital life safety protection during natural disasters such as wildfires," Chief Hank Clemmensen, International Association of Fire Chiefs president and board chairman, said in a press statement.

Julie Rochman, Insurance Institute for Business & Home Safety president and CEO, said the passage of the bill is important because 34 states do not have building codes that rely on the latest modern building science.

The bill would give qualifying states an additional 4 percent of funding for post-disaster assistance if they used nationally recognized model building codes. To qualify, states would need to adopt and enforce the International Residential Code from either of the most recent two updates (2012 or 2009).

Almost all our states growth has been related to energy where most people have a decent perception of the impact of tornadoes. People who are not exposed to tornado threats from other part of the country are often far more apprehensive. They are going to look far harder at what we are doing, or not, when it comes to relocations. Their relocations are big key to a more diversified state economy.

Agree 100%. I was just in Atlanta on business last week and all people would talk about is the tornadoes. They were nice about it but asked, nicely, why we would choose to live here when it's so dangerous.