I have never been in a Lifetime Fitness but have heard how awesome they are. Question is, will this really mean that all their competition in the area is going to cease to exist? I mean, the price point is twice that of Gold's, correct? If that is the case, I would think that many consumers will be priced out. Or is there already a trend of gyms closing their doors when Lifetime opens up nearby?

I wouldn't think it would mean all the other comp is going to cease to exist, but it will be hard for another company running a gym similarly to come in there and operate with that brand name and competition. I work out at Gold's Gym Express on Penn and there are plenty of other gyms in the metro, but I pay $10/month and don't need anything else. And there are a lot of people just like me that just need treadmills and dumbbells...

I don't think you understand what this is. Lifetime Fitness is basically about to takeover the entire gym market for the whole QSM area. This is a big power-move to monopolize the exploding area.

Lifetime caters to a higher income customer base. Those who want simple workout equipment and concrete may not want to go there. Those who need daycare and a wide variety of sports and activities are their niche market. If the tennis facility is anything like the one in Centennial, CO, it will be a very nice facility.

Famous Footwear has closed.

Well this is a complete and total waste of land use and extremely disappointing. So in a couple of years when the place fails to be economically viable, we will have a detached out-building (with a pool) that doesn't help traffic with the mall. One can only hope the mall would use that opportunity to expand the mall to meet the building and add some stores. It's really too small to be viable as a long-living mall today anyway.

Life Time is an extremely stable company that owns nearly all of their buildings and have never closed a facility in 25 years due to poor performance. This is not a debt funded gym company like Bally's was and isn't a wishy-washy wanna-be like LA Fitness. Relative to their size don't need that many members, due to their pricing structure. The likelihood of this facility failing before QSM is quite low. It would be nice if they were able to convince the city to add a road out to the North traffic around the mall is already a POS, mostly due to horrible design.


I have never been in a Lifetime Fitness but have heard how awesome they are. Question is, will this really mean that all their competition in the area is going to cease to exist? I mean, the price point is twice that of Gold's, correct? If that is the case, I would think that many consumers will be priced out. Or is there already a trend of gyms closing their doors when Lifetime opens up nearby?

When they opened in Tulsa I don't think any other gyms closed. They stole members from all over, but due to their price structure they aren't going to empty out any one facility. I mean some people are happy paying $15/mo and not having the latest, greatest or all the options. For example, my wife and I moved from Planet Fitness in Tulsa to Life Time, I doubt that many people made the switch from $20/mo to $110/mo. Life Time will also gets a lot of the private pool and country club types, since their pool is probably better than any other private pool in the metro.

Where I think Life Time really hurt Golds in Tulsa was that they took like 70% of their trainers, they also wiped out Sky Fitness of most of their trainers. Not to mention all the class instructors, 120 classes a week takes a lot of instructors and they pay more than anywhere else for them.

I just noticed on the website for Savoy Tea Co., they are opening at Quail Springs in mid-July; looks like a kiosk-type location. It looks like they are based in Northwest Arkansas with locations in Fayetteville, Rogers, and Fort Smith.

I know some of us on here are concerned that QSM might go the way of Crossroads, but I ran across this and thought i was a really interesting idea for repurposing malls.

You Can Now Live Inside America's First Shopping Mall for $550 a Month (http://www.countryliving.com/real-estate/a35148/shopping-mall-micro-homes-in-rhode-island/)

I know some of us on here are concerned that QSM might go the way of Crossroads, but I ran across this and thought i was a really interesting idea for repurposing malls.

You Can Now Live Inside America's First Shopping Mall for $550 a Month (http://www.countryliving.com/real-estate/a35148/shopping-mall-micro-homes-in-rhode-island/)

I was in QSM the other day. If they want to improve and/or stay relevant, then they need to work hard at it and fast. Otherwise they're headed quickly in the direction of Crossroads.

When I was in QSM I saw a lot of store fronts occupied by what look like rinky dink operations instead of national retailers. There's a large space that is taken up by a virtual reality experience. Since VR doesn't take up a lot of room, it's just mainly blank, open space. There's an escape room place. There's a store front for safe rooms. A cheap looking relax/spa place (I think it's actually one of those back rub places that used to be out in the foyer of the mall). Cash for Gold. A couple of places with cheap looking women's clothes and no store decor that are on the second level between Von Maur and Dillards. A store front with fidget spinners and phone cases (A place you'd expect to be in a kiosk has an actual store front). A few nail places. And some empty store spaces.

I know Life Time Fitness is going in there, but there's just so much competition in the surrounding area and QSM doesn't seem to be taking the task of righting the ship seriously. I don't expect QSM to be able to lure stores away from PSM or get the same quality of stores as PSM but they should certainly do better than cheap, rundown strip mall.

Just FYI, there is a similar VR tenant at Penn Square.

The nature of malls is shifting and will continue to shift but I'm quite sure both Quail Springs and Penn Square will survive for quite a while before getting to the Crossroads situation.

The Life Time Fitness deal is an innovative idea which is needed because department stores are disappearing. Sure beats the heck out of a vacant Macy's.

And they recently landed the state's only H&M and Von Maur, so they deserve big credit for both. And the AMC there is a getting a major renovation.

I think they are doing about as well as can be expected given the dramatic shift to on-line shopping and deep discount stores.

I know space is a limitation at Penn Square, but I really wish Von Maur had ended up at Penn Square instead of Quail Springs. Think it would have been a better fit.

I was in QSM the other day. If they want to improve and/or stay relevant, then they need to work hard at it and fast. Otherwise they're headed quickly in the direction of Crossroads.

When I was in QSM I saw a lot of store fronts occupied by what look like rinky dink operations instead of national retailers. There's a large space that is taken up by a virtual reality experience. Since VR doesn't take up a lot of room, it's just mainly blank, open space. There's an escape room place. There's a store front for safe rooms. A cheap looking relax/spa place (I think it's actually one of those back rub places that used to be out in the foyer of the mall). Cash for Gold. A couple of places with cheap looking women's clothes and no store decor that are on the second level between Von Maur and Dillards. A store front with fidget spinners and phone cases (A place you'd expect to be in a kiosk has an actual store front). A few nail places. And some empty store spaces.

I know Life Time Fitness is going in there, but there's just so much competition in the surrounding area and QSM doesn't seem to be taking the task of righting the ship seriously. I don't expect QSM to be able to lure stores away from PSM or get the same quality of stores as PSM but they should certainly do better than cheap, rundown strip mall.

I don't think the VR and the escape room experience are necessarily bad things to have as they provide entertainment. While Penn Square has more activity than Quail Springs, it too isn't as healthy as it was a year or two ago.

Life Time Fitness should help Quail Springs a lot. I see a lot of opportunity for fitness clothing or health food businesses there.

Just FYI, there is a similar VR tenant at Penn Square.

The nature of malls is shifting and will continue to shift but I'm quite sure both Quail Springs and Penn Square will survive for quite a while before getting to the Crossroads situation.

The Life Time Fitness deal is an innovative idea which is needed because department stores are disappearing. Sure beats the heck out of a vacant Macy's.

And they recently landed the state's only H&M and Von Maur, so they deserve big credit for both. And the AMC there is a getting a major renovation.

I think they are doing about as well as can be expected given the dramatic shift to on-line shopping and deep discount stores.

Glad to see that AMC is getting a renovation. I really think that whole food court area is what makes QSM look so bad. It's so dirty and uncomfortable to sit. Looks like it hasn't been updated in at least 20 years. If they renovated that into a better spot for people to eat and hang out, they'd probably have much better traffic. Then if they could pull in at least one more new-to-market store, I think they'd be just fine.

Malls catering to middle class families have been struggling for quite some time and it seems that it has picked up steam even more over the past year or two. The decline of stores like Macy's as well as the teen fads from last decade like Aeropostale and Abercrombie & Fitch has been a knife to the throat of a lot of mid-tier malls. The optimal future for Quail Springs is to either go more high-end or to go more mixed-use. I think in a smaller market like OKC, the mall is going to struggle competing with the likes of Chisholm Creek and Penn Square. Even Penn Square seems to be slipping a bit compared to a few years ago.

I do wish Quail Springs Mall the best. H&M, Von Maur, and Lifetime Fitness are all excellent grabs for them. They need to figure out a long-term vision and do it quick though if they want to remain viable long-term. It's not 1999 anymore and people don't use the mall in the same way. I think updating the concourse/food court is a must at this point.

Went to QSM the other day to look at shoes for one of my kids and went to the shoe store on the west end of the mall. I picked up a box and found only one shoe in it. I though the other shoe must've been the display. Picked up another box; same thing. And another and another. I realized that they all only had the right shoe (or was it left). I'm guessing this is a theft deterrent type thing. We went to Academy to look at cleats and all their boxes had both shoes in it. Does QSM have such a shoplifting problem that stores have to resort to this now?

I don't know which store u was in, but footlocker and foot action have been doing that for years. The left is usually on display or in the back (maybe its the right) and they go get it for you.

I don't know which store u was in, but footlocker and foot action have been doing that for years. The left is usually on display or in the back (maybe its the right) and they go get it for you.

Dillards does that as well. All of the real inventory is hidden away. What you can see in the showroom is for display only.

I must just be shopping in different places then.

All Dillards has is display. You can't pull down a box and try on shoes by yourself there. I know Academy doesn't hide one shoe. I don't believe Dick's does either.

They are remodeling and expanding one of the theaters at the AMC at Quail Springs; plans also show "Phase 1" which implies there will be more work done.



http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/amc1.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/amc2.jpg


I went and saw the new Thor movie at the Dolby cinema this past weekend. The sound system was great, however, the reclining seats don't recline all the way and there is no room for people to walk past once you are reclined. Also, my feet were on the wall in front of me, so they are not tall people friendly, either.

Penn Square AMC is a lot better when it comes to the seating. I think they would have better off just installing the sound system and normal seating at Quail. Or rebuilt the stadium seating from scratch in order to make more room for the reclining seats.

I went and saw the new Thor movie at the Dolby cinema this past weekend. The sound system was great, however, the reclining seats don't recline all the way and there is no room for people to walk past once you are reclined. Also, my feet were on the wall in front of me, so they are not tall people friendly, either.

Penn Square AMC is a lot better when it comes to the seating. I think they would have better off just installing the sound system and normal seating at Quail. Or rebuilt the stadium seating from scratch in order to make more room for the reclining seats.

Making sure I'm on the same page, there are no reclining seats with the remodel?

I do agree the seats at the Penn Square AMC are much better. I do like the spacious entrance and walkup at the quail springs AMC.

The Palladium theater in San Antonio is another example....a very 'grand' entrance and walkup. Maybe its me but I think it adds to the movie-going experience.

Compare to Harkins in bricktown with the daycare inside.....I think I prefer an inside ticket center.

Compare to Harkins in bricktown with the daycare inside.....I think I prefer an inside ticket center.

Definitely agree an inside box office would be nicer (I think Harkins HQ has a hard time accepting that not every state is Arizona), but the daycare is the only reason I can ever go to a movie that's not a kids movie these days.

Yup. Would be nice to see other theaters include a daycare too.

It'd be cool if we could get a real, film IMAX instead of this small screen, digital LIEMAX.

didnt we have one at the OmniDome?

didnt we have one at the OmniDome?

Yes and it's still there. I wish they would put it back to use showing first-run films. Serious moviegoers seek out 70mm IMAX theaters and will travel a long way for them.

Making sure I'm on the same page, there are no reclining seats with the remodel?

There are but they only recline 70 percent. Your feet and legs are at an awkward angle. They set them up like this because there isn't enough room.

When are they gonna renovate the food court? Its so outdated!

Yes and it's still there. I wish they would put it back to use showing first-run films. Serious moviegoers seek out 70mm IMAX theaters and will travel a long way for them.

They are still very focused on showing science/nature related things there, but it really does feel like they could effectively use it as a fund-raiser for the rest of the museum if they started to show actual real movies. Even if they have to actually staff the place to sell concessions and stuff.

The Omnidome has closed and while it was 70MM film, it was not IMAX.

Yes and it's still there. I wish they would put it back to use showing first-run films. Serious moviegoers seek out 70mm IMAX theaters and will travel a long way for them.

No, the theater at the OmniDome was not actually a true IMAX. It was an unlicensed knockoff and that's why it never could show any first run true IMAX movies. My understanding was/ is that IMAX movies are licensed to be shown only in licensed IMAX facilities.

^

I don't know if "knockoff" is a proper term for it, but otherwise true statement.

^

I don't know if "knockoff" is a proper term for it, but otherwise true statement.

Sorry, just meant to convey it was a third-party provided system, that's all.

They are still very focused on showing science/nature related things there, but it really does feel like they could effectively use it as a fund-raiser for the rest of the museum if they started to show actual real movies. Even if they have to actually staff the place to sell concessions and stuff.

As far as I know it is currently closed and they don't even show documentaries anymore. It's kind of sad because I remember when the theater opened to much fanfare back in 2000.

Apparently QSM allows vaping in the mall now.

I went to the movies last night and while walking through the mall to get to the theater I saw a few different people vaping in the mall. This mall is going downhill quick. I predict its demise will be much quicker than Crossroads.

Apparently QSM allows vaping in the mall now.

I went to the movies last night and while walking through the mall to get to the theater I saw a few different people vaping in the mall. This mall is going downhill quick. I predict its demise will be much quicker than Crossroads.

I seriously doubt they allow it, just people doing it anyway.

I seriously doubt they allow it, just people doing it anyway.

Possibly. But these people were brazenly doing it out in the open. They weren't trying to hide it. And no mall employees were asking them to stop.

There is a reason why people who vape are not judged to be the most considerate people out there.

Apparently QSM allows vaping in the mall now.

I went to the movies last night and while walking through the mall to get to the theater I saw a few different people vaping in the mall. This mall is going downhill quick. I predict its demise will be much quicker than Crossroads.

I had a similar convo with Pete yesterday. My wife, daughter and I went to QSM for the first time in about a year. She wanted to shop at the Gap and since the PSM location is still closed, we went to QSM. The amount of non-name brand stores there was staggering. We parked by JC Penny, walked through and immediately saw a bunch of off brand female clothing stores, as well as offices, etc. I really hope with LifeTime Fitness and the eventual AMC remodel, they will get a list of better tenants.

It's been a couple of years since I've been to Quail Springs Mall and it was noticeably going downhill even then.

The problem is that QSM is exactly the kind of mall that is struggling nationwide right now i.e. a mall that primarily targets middle class families and teenagers. If you were in high school in the 2000s, it was the place to be. Today, not so much. Bringing in H&M, Von Maur, and Lifetime Fitness are a step in the right direction and gave new life to the mall, but what it needs is a complete face lift and upgrade. The food court looks straight out of 1992 (it was impressive back then!). Malls that focus on higher-end retailers are doing well right now and despite inherent problems with the retail market in OKC, you would think that proximity to Edmond would make attracting more upscale tenants easier.

"you would think that proximity to Edmond would make attracting more upscale tenants easier."

Getting from anywhere north of 33rd in Edmond to Penn/Memorial is a deterrent for Quail Springs Mall. Edmond's grid of endless un-timed stoplights, train that splits the town in half, lack of turn lanes on major corridors, makes going south and west towards Memorial a challenge.

For a mall like Quail Springs Mall, what do you put it it to become a destination?

For those born after 1980, do they see a need to buy from the mall or specialized retail compared to 15-20 years ago? Named brand clothing doesn't seem to be as big of deal as it was in the early 2000's.
Half of the food court options are just outside the mall, you could argue easier to get to, and probably priced cheaper.? (Chick-fila, Raising Canes, DQ, Subway)
While AMC is renovating, the price of going out to the movies has probably shifted from a weekly occurrence, to a once-a-month occasion for a movie you really want to see?=

Younger adults have a tighter disposable income and for what disposable income they have, it is geared more towards smart phone entertainment and seeking experiences. The Chisholm Creek development area is a perfect example of what the younger crowd wants. Top Golf, Main Event, and I-Fly are all "experiences" that they are willing to spend money on.

I am over 55 yo and retired. I used to like going to Quail Springs mall but now days most of the stores do not have the stuff I like. Most of the clothes are not my taste. I used to like to look at cookware and home goods. but most of it is not stuff that I want or dream of. Its lower junk stuff. I don't have a large budget but I do like to buy a few nicer items or atleast look and save for an nice item. I wish we could get an LLBean store. I rather go to Penn Square of my shopping/dreaming. At least there is an Eddie Bauer and William Sonoma.

Getting from anywhere north of 33rd in Edmond to Penn/Memorial is a deterrent for Quail Springs Mall. Edmond's grid of endless un-timed stoplights, train that splits the town in half, lack of turn lanes on major corridors, makes going south and west towards Memorial a challenge.
Exactly. I don't understand how or why Edmond doesn't have timed lights. It's so annoying to have your light turn green but see the one just up the road turning red. So much start and stop when driving in Edmond.

Exactly. I don't understand how or why Edmond doesn't have timed lights. It's so annoying to have your light turn green but see the one just up the road turning red. So much start and stop when driving in Edmond.
Because timed lights are more inefficient during non-rush times... as evidenced in downtown OKC outside of normal business hours or peak traffic times around events.

Because timed lights are more inefficient during non-rush times... as evidenced in downtown OKC outside of normal business hours or peak traffic times around events.

Oh, so being inefficient 24 hours a day, 7 days a week is preferred to being efficient at least some of the time.

On more than one occasion I've driven in Edmond very early in the morning when it's just me and maybe one or two other cars on the road. I pull up to an intersection and have to wait for it to go through the entire cycle when there are absolutely ZERO cars coming from any other direction. And as long as we're using computers to time the lights, why don't we just have them do that at rush times, during the daytime etc. and then in hours when there's not many people on the road have it revert to the in-road trigger. I find it hard to believe that this couldn't be done.

Because timed lights are more inefficient during non-rush times... as evidenced in downtown OKC outside of normal business hours or peak traffic times around events.

If this were 1937, i might accept this answer. But it's 2017, and programmable timers have since been invented, not to mention computers, not to mention the internet. Even if, somehow, a simple programmable timer wouldn't get the job done, and for some reason a small computer wouldn't get the job done, they could easily send a signal to the lights and change the timing as needed.

And, as noted, they spent money putting sensors in the road. On top of that, cities like to brag they have traffic cameras to handle this exact situation.

What happened to the infrastructure that was being installed in Edmond that was supposed to be connected to a command center which allowed the signals to be linked and changed for daily traffic patterns?.

What happened to the infrastructure that was being installed in Edmond that was supposed to be connected to a command center which allowed the signals to be linked and changed for daily traffic patterns?.
It’s installed on second st. And works just fine from what I’ve seen. Phase 2 begins 2018.

There area couple of intersections lights in which the City of Edmond adjusted and they are horrible. One really bad light/intersection is at 2nd and Coltrane. The lights there used to be activated by traffic flow. Now they are on an extended timer to where going north or south on Coltrane is delayed a lot! I sat at that intersection Sunday and for almost 2-3 minutes ZERO cars were traveling on 2nd street and yet the light on 2nd stayed green. They really screwed up those traffic lights.


It’s installed on second st. And works just fine from what I’ve seen. Phase 2 begins 2018.

I travel 2nd street frequently and I havn’t noticed any improvement.

I kind of hate how it works on 2nd street. Taking a left from eastbound 2nd to N University used to have consistent behavior (you'd always get the green turn arrow first if anyone was waiting to turn), but now it feels like they just throw darts every day to decide how to run it. Sometimes it stays red for a bit and then goes flashing yellow. Occasionally it stays red and lets a few cars go through and then you get a green arrow. And sometimes you just get the old green arrow up front behavior.

Exactly. I don't understand how or why Edmond doesn't have timed lights. It's so annoying to have your light turn green but see the one just up the road turning red. So much start and stop when driving in Edmond.

Just an FYI, those lights are in OKC, has nothing to do with Edmond. I'm pretty OKC has someone's drunk uncle designing most of the roadways in town.

If this were 1937, i might accept this answer. But it's 2017, and programmable timers have since been invented, not to mention computers, not to mention the internet. Even if, somehow, a simple programmable timer wouldn't get the job done, and for some reason a small computer wouldn't get the job done, they could easily send a signal to the lights and change the timing as needed.

And, as noted, they spent money putting sensors in the road. On top of that, cities like to brag they have traffic cameras to handle this exact situation.

Cincinnati metro has a great system. The lesser intersection would just flash yellow on the main road and road for cross traffic until traffic on the side road warranted switching to normal light behavior. Once the traffic slowed down again, the lights went back to flashing. I worked at a large office complex with our own light, and it worked great. Most of the day, and all of the evening/weekends it was flashing. During morning, lunch and evening peaks it operated like a normal light.

Even the lights in major intersection would switch to flashing in late at night when traffic was really light.

Just an FYI, those lights are in OKC, has nothing to do with Edmond

Wait, you're telling me that any light north of 33rd in Edmond is actually OKC lights?

I live on May and NW 187th, and our physician is in the Mercy I-35 building. I have long ago given up on taking the straight line through Edmond and it’s usually half the time to take the 6-7 mile detour and drive May/Turnpike/I-35.

Maybe start a separate thread for discussion about street lights?

Well, the Edmond street lights are an appropriate topic for this thread to consider how they are affecting Quail Springs by acting as a barrier for casual shoppers. But we have probably exhausted that particular subject by now.

Well, the Edmond street lights are an appropriate topic for this thread to consider how they are affecting Quail Springs by acting as a barrier for casual shoppers. But we have probably exhausted that particular subject by now.Probably true. I live in north Edmond and am quite closer to QSM, but the lights and traffic flow of Edmond make it a nightmare to get to QSM, and once you get on I-35 you feel like you might as well spend the extra few minutes to just go to Penn Square. The only reason we go to QSM is for Von Maur (and then we will spin through Dillard's and the H&M baby section). There are just so many more and better options at PSM.

When was the food court remodeled? It feels like it was between 1997-2000. I actually really liked the old food court and mall entrance before the theater was built. Dated, but nostalgic.

Probably true. I live in north Edmond and am quite closer to QSM, but the lights and traffic flow of Edmond make it a nightmare to get to QSM, and once you get on I-35 you feel like you might as well spend the extra few minutes to just go to Penn Square. The only reason we go to QSM is for Von Maur (and then we will spin through Dillard's and the H&M baby section). There are just so many more and better options at PSM.

I don't disagree, but the parking at PSM is a nightmare all year round, and an all-out disaster during the holidays. As little shopping as I do in malls, QSM is much preferred. Plus, their movie theatre has $5 tickets before noon, which works out well, too.

Our kids still love PSM. I guess if I didn't hate crowds as much, I wouldn't mind PSM. When I had all Apple stuff, I was there much more often looking at the new shiny toys. I still keep meaning to drop in on the Think Geek store, too.

I don't disagree, but the parking at PSM is a nightmare all year round, and an all-out disaster during the holidays. As little shopping as I do in malls, QSM is much preferred. Plus, their movie theatre has $5 tickets before noon, which works out well, too.

Our kids still love PSM. I guess if I didn't hate crowds as much, I wouldn't mind PSM. When I had all Apple stuff, I was there much more often looking at the new shiny toys. I still keep meaning to drop in on the Think Geek store, too.Parking at PSM isn't bad if you go at the right time. We typically park S/E of the men's Dillard's, and if that are looks super busy then we head to the garage and park on the 2nd level (which is between a direct access to the mall so people seem to avoid it). We try to not go to the mall at busy times, but if we have to I agree, parking at PSM is a nightmare.