I love it... but it's so... suburban/office park-ish. Its only street interaction appears to be with its backside, facing Walnut.

I think it's very nice and fits the area quite well.

The OKC GE energy research facility might have competition?
This article helps explain work that's done at some energy research centers.

Aramco Unveils New R&D Center in Boston Area
RIGZONE - Aramco Unveils New R&D Center in Boston Area (http://www.rigzone.com/news/oil_gas/a/130523/Aramco_Unveils_New_RD_Center_in_Boston_Area)

The OKC GE energy research facility might have competition?
This article helps explain work that's done at some energy research centers.

Aramco Unveils New R&D Center in Boston Area
RIGZONE - Aramco Unveils New R&D Center in Boston Area (http://www.rigzone.com/news/oil_gas/a/130523/Aramco_Unveils_New_RD_Center_in_Boston_Area)

So strategically placed in an area that knows oil and gas.....

So strategically placed in an area that knows oil and gas.....

Strategically placed near MIT would be my guess.....

So strategically placed in an area that knows oil and gas.....

There are highly thought of university’s in that area. They are bound to want researchers from around the world... In most cases Boston is probably an easy sale to new international researchers compared to OKC.

But if this new GE energy center along with our university’s do well with cutting edge research then we can slowly change the perceptions that many in the research community have about OKC....

Now if we could just mitigate the perceptions many have about our tornado's, it would really help.
The good news there are real things we could do that would help with this issue.

Here is the motherload of the GE Global Research Center schematics.




http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5233d1386947166-ge-global-research-center-ge5.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5232d1386947165-ge-global-research-center-ge4.jpg


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http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5421d1387208542-ge-global-research-center-ge21.jpg


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http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5410d1387208533-ge-global-research-center-ge10.jpg

I guess that site plan is what happens when you sell your soul. If this is what they had in mind I would just as soon this went to Norman. This is Bass Pro on a grand scale. Oh well, like I said before, GE only wants people think they are a 'green' company; they don't actually want to be one.

REALLY disappointed in the site plan for being so close to downtown.

Since it's fenced in, I'm not sure it matters one bit what the site plan is like. From a street user interactivity perspective it's a black box no matter what. Not excusing it. Just saying if it was always going to be fenced, then this shouldn't be too terribly surprising.

Design is ok, needs more glass, and why no adjacent parking garage? Site plan sucks, very suburban...

I seriously doubt they want people walking by peeking into the windows. It's a research facility, what would you expect.?

Design is ok, needs more glass, and why no adjacent parking garage?

There is structured parking.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/14/opinion/what-tech-hasnt-learned-from-urban-planning.html?_r=0

I seriously doubt they want people walking by peeking into the windows. It's a research facility, what would you expect.?

I would expect it to be more like the Aramco R&D center linked to above. Go check out 400 Technology Sq in Cambridge, MA on GoogleEarth. Why does OKC always aim for the bottom of the barrel? We get this great company, with tons of public dollars involved, and then build the biggest pile of crap with it. Once again, opportunity missed. At some point we have to move beyond the "we're just lucky to have it" mentality that dominates the OKC collective conscience.

One of the unique requirements for this facility is the staging area and outdoor lab.

This has to go somewhere and it makes sense to place it close to the street so they can get the huge equipment in and out of there and into the test bays.


I think this design is fine, especially given the surrounding properties.

I seriously doubt they want people walking by peeking into the windows. It's a research facility, what would you expect.?

New GE Research Center in Brazil:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Xz3GcrYEgjQ/UAwgKjTx9SI/AAAAAAAAALY/bO8om-vrgwA/s1600/GE.jpg

Then it should have either gone to Norman or OKC leaders should have pushed a different location. Like Devon Tower, people will fawn over it at first and then realize it is actually detrimental to the City's goal of increasing walkability. I have time to wait for people to catch up.

Anyhow, decision is done and I made my point. Moving on.

I would expect it to be more like the Aramco R&D center linked to above. Go check out 400 Technology Sq in Cambridge, MA on GoogleEarth. Why does OKC always aim for the bottom of the barrel? We get this great company, with tons of public dollars involved, and then build the biggest pile of crap with it. Once again, opportunity missed. At some point we have to move beyond the "we're just lucky to have it" mentality that dominates the OKC collective conscience.

I think a lot if has to with with the architect selection. Miles Associates designed a pile of crap in Tulsa, they should have chosen www.rees.com, they would have slammed dunked this project!

Then it should have either gone to Norman or OKC leaders should have pushed a different location. Like Devon Tower, people will fawn over it at first and then realize it is actually detrimental to the City's goal of increasing walkability. I have time to wait for people to catch up.

Anyhow, decision is done and I made my point. Moving on.

Normally, I agree with a lot of what you say, but we disagree on this one. That part of town is developing into quite the research enclave and this suits their needs and what that area has become. I have no problem with it.

Realistically, office space for a tech company and research space are different animals. Also, within the 'fenced boundaries', they have room for expansion.

Then it should have either gone to Norman or OKC leaders should have pushed a different location. Like Devon Tower, people will fawn over it at first and then realize it is actually detrimental to the City's goal of increasing walkability. I have time to wait for people to catch up.

OKC is getting hundreds of prestigious high-paying jobs that will likely lead to great things in research and the oil & gas industry.

The nature of this facility doesn't make it easy to conform to strict urban design criteria, like pushing it to close to the street.

Considering the immediately surrounding developments, that a good part of this facility fronts on a wide pedestrian-hostile freeway, and all the great things this will mean for OKC, I think 99.8% will be and should be completely thrilled.

Then it should have either gone to Norman or OKC leaders should have pushed a different location. Like Devon Tower, people will fawn over it at first and then realize it is actually detrimental to the City's goal of increasing walkability. I have time to wait for people to catch up.

Anyhow, decision is done and I made my point. Moving on.

Why Norman ? GE stated they wanted to be near the major O&G players........and BTW, Devon Tower is awesome.....a lot of cities would die to have something close to it.

The GE Global Research center in New York is a compound.......this is a step up from it though.

I think a lot if has to with with the architect selection. Miles Associates designed a pile of crap in Tulsa, they should have chosen REES | An Architecture, Planning and Interior Design Firm (http://www.rees.com), they would have slammed dunked this project!

I think it could have been any number of local or regional architects. However, some of it has to do with client desires as well. An architect can only do so much.

I would love to see the building pushed to 10th and the parking and outdoor research behind. There's no reason the driveway to the outdoor research area couldn't extend that far.

I noticed that the southbound I-235 off ramp for Harrison Ave. is going to be revised under the current master plan for the site. It appears that the off-ramp will create a new intersection at 10th street on the Northwest side of the campus. I point this out, because it will drastically change the way you can leave the research park and go northbound on I-235, plus exiting will now take you a little bit longer to get to downtown if you are coming from Norman. Just an observation as I noted, but it should be taken into consideration that 10th street is about to become a major thoroughfare between St. Anthony's and the OUHSC. If I can find any available investors we can buyout the Chaparral Townhouses at 1301 N Stiles Ave., Oklahoma City, OK 73104 and redevelop that area to house future for sale units for the nearby growth of multiple districts.

I would expect it to be more like the Aramco R&D center linked to above. Go check out 400 Technology Sq in Cambridge, MA on GoogleEarth. Why does OKC always aim for the bottom of the barrel? We get this great company, with tons of public dollars involved, and then build the biggest pile of crap with it. Once again, opportunity missed. At some point we have to move beyond the "we're just lucky to have it" mentality that dominates the OKC collective conscience.

JTF, not everything can fit in your urban design box. Jobs are whats most important to downtown. This complex is great and will lead to more restaurants and urban housing nearby. These people will want to live close by and ride their bike to work. The complexity of the research leads to a quasi urban design. I like it. Its not a massive one or two story building. The parking garage creates a street wall and the design has room to get large equipment in and out. It also leaves an area for room to grow to the Southeast.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/14/opinion/what-tech-hasnt-learned-from-urban-planning.html?_r=0

Thanks for this awesome article. I just wanted to point out that, while it's bad that Devon has the large set-back from the street, I think the "Community space" mentioned in the article is well maintained with Nebu being open to the public... I've always been glad they did that, and have taken my kids there to eat on more than one occasion.

Then it should have either gone to Norman or OKC leaders should have pushed a different location. Like Devon Tower, people will fawn over it at first and then realize it is actually detrimental to the City's goal of increasing walkability. I have time to wait for people to catch up.

Anyhow, decision is done and I made my point. Moving on.

Walkability is not the number one goal of the OKC area, but prosperity is.
You can not have walkablity if prosperity is not the the number one priority.
This GE center brings high paying jobs and further puts our area in the cross hairs of other researchers in ways that could bring other high intellectual based jobs.

There is a place for walkability but it has its limits in any advanced civilization.
I walked around downtown OKC just last night for the first time in a few years....
It seemed pretty walkable to me.

The city is ruined.

The second building above is fenced off too, for what you can see at the angle of the picture. I think the fact that GE could create their own inland island more than likely appealed to them.

Sid,

You have to remember.... This kind of research is not going to be in test tubes, they are going to be large very loud equipment that needs to have a buffer from the street and other businesses. The examples you gave above biodiversity are not noisy. This site is OK. I didn't give it my blessings by any means, especially being on 10th street, but it is decent. Look at Apple's new research campus.... No street interaction, but I would take those jobs in a heartbeat!

5434

It is what it is, and I am happy we have this close to our core.

They might as well just nuke Apple.... no way that design works anywhere in the world. lol

I feel about urban design the way I feel about environmental concerns: You have to pick your battles.

If you are forever taking extreme positions there will be issues and projects that will make you appear to be completely single-minded and out of step with reality. Then increasingly, people tune you out as some sort of crackpot. Remember the guy that just would not let the rail line issue behind Union Station go??

This is a huge win for OKC and is to be located in an area controlled by the State and not subject to any of the local design review committees. All around are office parks and cloverleafs...

Yes, the area needs to be improved but choosing this project to criticize for lack of walkability and relationship to the street is just going to cause most to consider that opinion as being way, way too extreme and may undermine credibility when it comes to fight much more important and winnable battles (such as the downtown boulevard or that awful Deep Deuce hotel that was thwarted).


Everyone only has so much political capital and going against something that is a massive, international win for OKC is only going to work against your bigger goals.

Walkability is not the number one goal of the OKC area, but prosperity is.
You can not have walkablity if prosperity is not the the number one priority.
This GE center brings high paying jobs and further puts our area in the cross hairs of other researchers in ways that could bring other high intellectual based jobs.

There is a place for walkability but it has its limits in any advanced civilization.
I walked around downtown OKC just last night for the first time in a few years....
It seemed pretty walkable to me.

Plus, all new construction requires sidewalks to be an added feature.

They might as well just nuke Apple.... no way that design works anywhere in the world. lol

Elysium. It's real...

I feel about urban design the way I feel about environmental concerns: You have to pick your battles.

If you are forever taking extreme positions there will be issues and projects that will make you appear to be completely single-minded and out of step with reality. Then increasingly, people tune you out as some sort of crackpot. Remember the guy that just would not let the rail line issue behind Union Station go??

This is a huge win for OKC and is to be located in an area controlled by the State and not subject to any of the local design review committees. All around are office parks and cloverleafs...

Yes, the area needs to be improved but choosing this project to criticize for lack of walkability and relationship to the street is just going to cause most to consider that opinion as being way, way too extreme and may undermine credibility when it comes to fight much more important and winnable battles (such as the downtown boulevard or that awful Deep Deuce hotel that was thwarted).


Everyone only has so much political capital and going against something that is a massive, international win for OKC is only going to work against your bigger goals.

http://www.okctalk.com/general-real-estate-topics/35757-connecting-downtown-health-sciences-center.html

Sid is absolutely correct here.

I don't understand why we are trying to separate prosperity/jobs/good urban design. They all should work hand in hand with this project. There is no reason that this building can't be better designed to fit better urban design context/principles. What happens if GE, in 5-10 years, decides to close their research center? We are left with a poorly designed building that does not interact with NW 10th St very well. Any other use besides the GE Research Building should demand better interaction with 10th St. What I am trying to say here is that we should not try to separate jobs/prosperity/urban design here. They all work together in the short term and long term. I don't think criticizing this particular site design for having poor urban design principles is in any way undermining credibility when it comes to fighting important/winnable battles. Implementing stronger urban design principles can easily help both parties here. GE and the City.

Great urban design provides easier access to short/long term viability.

Poor urban design can make it harder to adapt a building in the future.

I feel about urban design the way I feel about environmental concerns: You have to pick your battles.

If you are forever taking extreme positions there will be issues and projects that will make you appear to be completely single-minded and out of step with reality. Then increasingly, people tune you out as some sort of crackpot. Remember the guy that just would not let the rail line issue behind Union Station go??

This is a huge win for OKC and is to be located in an area controlled by the State and not subject to any of the local design review committees. All around are office parks and cloverleafs...

Yes, the area needs to be improved but choosing this project to criticize for lack of walkability and relationship to the street is just going to cause most to consider that opinion as being way, way too extreme and may undermine credibility when it comes to fight much more important and winnable battles (such as the downtown boulevard or that awful Deep Deuce hotel that was thwarted).


Everyone only has so much political capital and going against something that is a massive, international win for OKC is only going to work against your bigger goals.

I completely agree. East of I-235 shouldn't be held to as strict of an urban design standard as say if this project was in Midtown. I happen to like the project the way it is and I think it fits well with the existing urban fabric in the Health Science area. OKC has a variety of districts feeling a variety of niches. NOT ALL URBAN DISTRICTS HAVE TO BE THE SAME! In fact, it's best if they aren't. I agree that walkability isn't the primary goal of development in OKC, but prosperity is. I agree with Sid that jobs shouldn't be separate from good urban design, but you have to pick your battles and what neighborhoods are most important to force strict urban design standards. In my opinion, the Health Sciences area is not one of them. If one wants to see a completely walkable, new urbanist paradise in the realistic future, they are living in the wrong city.

Sid,

You have to remember.... This kind of research is not going to be in test tubes, they are going to be large very loud equipment that needs to have a buffer from the street and other businesses. The examples you gave above biodiversity are not noisy. This site is OK. I didn't give it my blessings by any means, especially being on 10th street, but it is decent.

I will say that as someone who's toured the Halliburton Research Facility in Duncan, this point shouldn't be lost on anyone. The type of facility needed for oil and gas drilling equipment differs complete than for something you would find at, say, the OMRF tower. Lots of testing of new equipment that is often big and bulky. Frankly my biggest critique of this site plan is that they didn't hide the outdoor lab very well. If they are opening this center to grow their artificial lift business, don't be surprised to see large pumpjacks and mocked up drilling rigs on the site. Not complaining as the outdoor area won't be facing DT though...my point being that R&D centers for large industrial users tend to be in some far flung suburban campus type environment simply due to the need for space. And trying to fit the needs of something like that into an urban setting is a bit tough. So while I am not wild about it, I think they did the best the could.

If you look at the floorplans I hosted, they have some 3-story test bays..

Imagine the type of equipment they'll be hauling in and out of this place.

It's a minor miracle we got them to locate in the central core.

I feel about urban design the way I feel about environmental concerns: You have to pick your battles.

If you are forever taking extreme positions there will be issues and projects that will make you appear to be completely single-minded and out of step with reality. Then increasingly, people tune you out as some sort of crackpot. Remember the guy that just would not let the rail line issue behind Union Station go??

This is a huge win for OKC and is to be located in an area controlled by the State and not subject to any of the local design review committees. All around are office parks and cloverleafs...

Yes, the area needs to be improved but choosing this project to criticize for lack of walkability and relationship to the street is just going to cause most to consider that opinion as being way, way too extreme and may undermine credibility when it comes to fight much more important and winnable battles (such as the downtown boulevard or that awful Deep Deuce hotel that was thwarted).


Everyone only has so much political capital and going against something that is a massive, international win for OKC is only going to work against your bigger goals.
I agree, this area is already completely ruined from an urban design perspective anyway by a bunch of buildings that aren't going anywhere anytime soon. If this was on the other side of 235, I would be annoyed.

If you look at the floorplans I hosted, they have some 3-story test bays..

Imagine the type of equipment they'll be hauling in and out of this place.

It's a minor miracle we got them to locate in the central core.

I agree with this.

If this place is going to be so loud why did they put it next to a bunch of hospitals and medical research facilities?

If this place is going to be so loud why did they put it next to a bunch of hospitals and medical research facilities?

You guys really sound like a bunch of spoiled brats..... Daddy buys you a brand new Jeep and you complain its not a Range Rover.

GET OVER IT! THIS IS AMAZING FOR OKC AND DOWNTOWN!

Back to the future of OKC with a world class research center based in the core of our thriving city! Look out Austin and Silicon Valley! I hope we have more announcements in the same ball park as this soon. This is not just jobs, its a catalyst to future jobs and economic prosperity for OKC.

BE HAPPY PEOPLE!

You guys really sound like a bunch of spoiled brats..... Daddy buys you a brand new Jeep and you complain its not a Range Rover.

GET OVER IT! THIS IS AMAZING FOR OKC AND DOWNTOWN!

Back to the future of OKC with a world class research center based in the core of our thriving city! Look out Austin and Silicon Valley! I hope we have more announcements in the same ball park as this soon. This is not just jobs, its a catalyst to future jobs and economic prosperity for OKC.

BE HAPPY PEOPLE!

Like

I'm wondering if the redesign of the 235 exit had to do with their selection for this site.

I agree with what some of the other folks said about the type of equipment they are going to be testing. This isn't a bio-engineering lab or some research facility where everyone is going to be sitting around running simulations on computers all day. They're going to be testing BIG, LOUD, HEAVY equipment. I don't know how many other posters have experience seeing oil and gas operations out in the field first hand but let me tell you, that stuff is loud when you're out on the side of a mountain in the Appalachians! I can only imagine how loud it will be in an enclosed environment. GE's other research lab's aren't strictly oil and gas, so I'm sure what they're dealing with in the concepts that Sid posted are on a MUCH smaller scale. Its hard to try and compare other typical research labs to what will be going on here. This would almost be like building a facility near DT where Boeing, or some aerospace manufacturer, tested new engine designs. And like someone else said those facilities are normally way outside of town.

If this place is going to be so loud why did they put it next to a bunch of hospitals and medical research facilities?

I would imagine that this thing will be pretty sound proof.

Yeah it should be sound proof. But it probably wont be sound proof.

I would imagine that this thing will be pretty sound proof.

If that's true, then the big, loud, heavy equipment should have no problem in the area.

But really, if it's REALLY that loud, then it won't matter how far it's set back from the street.

So just do it right the first time, eh?

The area just north of the building is labeled "outdoor lab", so not all testing will be done indoors.

You guys really sound like a bunch of spoiled brats..... Daddy buys you a brand new Jeep and you complain its not a Range Rover.

GET OVER IT! THIS IS AMAZING FOR OKC AND DOWNTOWN!

Back to the future of OKC with a world class research center based in the core of our thriving city! Look out Austin and Silicon Valley! I hope we have more announcements in the same ball park as this soon. This is not just jobs, its a catalyst to future jobs and economic prosperity for OKC.

BE HAPPY PEOPLE!

Like.

This GE research center is an amazing deal. I think a lot of people underestimate how big of a deal this is.

If that's true, then the big, loud, heavy equipment should have no problem in the area.

But really, if it's REALLY that loud, then it won't matter how far it's set back from the street.

So just do it right the first time, eh?It has been done right. This is an amazing win for OKC. Great design, great company, great asset, great jobs, great location. . . I don't know what there is to hate. This is as mind blowing as the people that were hating on the Devon Tower

It has been done right. This is an amazing win for OKC. Great design, great company, great asset, great jobs, great location. . . I don't know what there is to hate. This is as mind blowing as the people that were hating on the Devon Tower

Guys. I feel like nobody is actually reading what others are actually saying on here.

NOBODY IS SAYING THIS IS AN OVERALL BAD DEAL. C'mon guys.

There are obvious design flaws. I'm not saying the entire deal is bad. That's stupid. All I am saying is that it is absolutely okay to criticize their site design, as we would with anyone else.

For the record, there are a few design flaws with Devon as well, but we won't get into that ;)

Guys. I feel like nobody is actually reading what others are actually saying on here.

NOBODY IS SAYING THIS IS AN OVERALL BAD DEAL. C'mon guys.

There are obvious design flaws. I'm not saying the entire deal is bad. That's stupid. All I am saying is that it is absolutely okay to criticize their site design, as we would with anyone else.

For the record, there are a few design flaws with Devon as well, but we won't get into that ;)A design flaw based on an opinion...

A design flaw based on an opinion...

Or by most strong urban design principles.

Guys. I feel like nobody is actually reading what others are actually saying on here.

NOBODY IS SAYING THIS IS AN OVERALL BAD DEAL. C'mon guys.

There are obvious design flaws. I'm not saying the entire deal is bad. That's stupid. All I am saying is that it is absolutely okay to criticize their site design, as we would with anyone else.

For the record, there are a few design flaws with Devon as well, but we won't get into that ;)

Every building is going to have design flaws to somebody because not everybody has the same taste. I understand the design of the GE center is not up to urbanist standards. However, its not like its going into a pristine, walkable, urban area. The design fits very well with everything else that is already east of I-235. If this was going west of I-235, I think the urbanists would have more of a case.

Personally, I think walkability and developing a genuine urban environment needs to be the goal for development between the river on the South, 23rd St on the north, Western on the west and I-235 on the east. The Paseo and Capitol Hill can also be added into that core area. Outside of that I think it should be up to the developer.

Every building is going to have design flaws to somebody because not everybody has the same taste. I understand the design of the GE center is not up to urbanist standards. However, its not like its going into a pristine, walkable, urban area. The design fits very well with everything else that is already east of I-235. If this was going west of I-235, I think the urbanists would have more of a case.

Personally, I think walkability and developing a genuine urban environment needs to be the goal for development between the river on the South, 23rd St on the north, Western on the west and I-235 on the east. The Paseo and Capitol Hill can also be added into that core area. Outside of that I think it should be up to the developer.

I'm tired of this rhetoric. Why is "eh, it's good enough" considered OK? Why can't we shoot for better? Yeah, it might fit the current dynamic of that area, but why can't we look forward? What is our vision for the future of that area? It's extremely close to downtown and is ripe for more walkability.

If that's true, then the big, loud, heavy equipment should have no problem in the area.

But really, if it's REALLY that loud, then it won't matter how far it's set back from the street.

So just do it right the first time, eh?

My point was that this type of research facility is going to require very large spaces, as others have pointed out also. So those spacial requirements are obviously going to limit the design of the building as far as the aesthetics go. Others had been commenting on the overall look and shape of the building, and I was just trying to point out that the type of research going on is going to limit the design possibilities. It isn't going to be able to look like some of the concepts that Sid had posted.

You're right though, that has no effect on how far it sets back from the street.

I'm tired of this rhetoric. Why is "eh, it's good enough" considered OK? Why can't we shoot for better? Yeah, it might fit the current dynamic of that area, but why can't we look forward? What is our vision for the future of that area? It's extremely close to downtown and is ripe for more walkability.

It's not "good enough", its outstanding. Just because it doesn't fit urban standards doesn't mean it isn't a good development or good architecture. If they were building this...

http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00IBMtCYNyLezs/Steel-Warehouse-in-Colombia.jpg

...I could understand complaining but the architecture they are using is awesome and it complements the rest of the area. That area is not walkable and is not going to be even in 50 years. This reminds me of all the people demanding the Memorial retail development (which I have my doubts about but that's another thread) be built to walkable, urban standards.

It's not "good enough", its outstanding. Just because it doesn't fit urban standards doesn't mean it isn't a good development or good architecture. If they were building this...

...I could understand complaining but the architecture they are using is awesome and it complements the rest of the area. That area is not walkable and is not going to be even in 50 years. This reminds me of all the people demanding the Memorial retail development (which I have my doubts about but that's another thread) be built to walkable, urban standards.

If you don't think this area will be walkable in 50 years, I don't think my arguments will go any further. If we resign ourselves to thinking nothing will change, nothing will.