The fair got Pei'ed.

In the past I've heard the fairgrounds folks say they have 1000+ event days annually (meaning separate events booked on the same day count as separate event days). There is an event going on at the fairgrounds nearly every day of the year, with only a few days of those being the actual fair.

I'm with you in lamenting some of the things that I am sentimental about going by the wayside - personally I miss the track, the grandstand, the monorail, AND A WHOLE FREAKING WEEK of the fair - but the State Fair is only a part of what goes on out there and these additions will greatly increase/insure events and visitors and visitor $$$.

And there are still plenty of areas for easy relocation of that portion of the midway. Wouldn't be the first time that happened.

I guess there aiming to finish within a year after the 2014 season ends?

While it was not surprising there has been changes from some earlier designs released, the exterior seems to have taken a step to being less interesting and even worse they have moved the loading docks, kitchen and operations areas from being on the side by overflow parking to being a bit of a barrier between it and the rest of the fairgrounds.

oops: double post

While it was not surprising there has been changes from some earlier designs released, the exterior seems to have taken a step to being less interesting and even worse they have moved the loading docks, kitchen and operations areas from being on the side by overflow parking to being a bit of a barrier between it and the rest of the fairgrounds.Yeah, I noticed that too, what about the giant tv's? I guess that is not happening.

That building looks dated and it hasn't even been built yet. I hope that the city didn't pay the architect much for those designs. It's like a huge wal-mart.

The official names for the one in OKC is the State Fair of Oklahoma. The one in Tulsa is the Tulsa State Fair.

They are both considered "state fairs". I don't think there is much difference other than the names.

Actually, when Skip Wagner took over the fair back in the 2000's, prior to Tim O'Toole, the name was changed from State Fair of Oklahoma to Oklahoma State Fair.

At what point to the powers that be just put an end to the fair as we know it? I mean, surely that's on someone's unstated agenda.

I mean, let's be honest - there's really nothing left, particularly after this thing goes in. And from the looks of it, this thing will gobble up most of the midway, so what I believe has been the ultimate goal of the power brokers over the fair for the last decade or so - to get rid of it - is finally being realized.

No real point in maintaining and pretense otherwise at this point, is there?

I realize to some a slew of new buildings constitutes progress, and in some way I suppose it is, but the elimination of the fair in the process (in my book) is anything but.

I fully expect some dismissive announcement in the coming weeks or months issued under the pretense of great sadness and reluctance that the "financials just don't add up" and the "liabilities were getting too high" to have a fair (or similar words to that effect) and that'll be that. I note that construction on this thing starts after what would be next year's fair, so they could have a whole year to celebrate its demise.

Why the negative post? This will be a nice new building that will replae a bunch of old run down buildings. RIP! The midway will still be there. It's just going to move over to the racetrack site.

Would it be safe to assume the old racetrack will be turned into parking?

A great chunk of the old race track will become parking, which will also become a big portion of the midway once the new expo building is built.

Why the negative post? This will be a nice new building that will replae a bunch of old run down buildings. RIP! The midway will still be there. It's just going to move over to the racetrack site.

The buildings aren't the problem, the destruction of the fairgrounds most certainly IS a negative. The trend is to turn the fairgrounds into a convention center. New buildings are great. What we've torn down to gain them...not so much. We had a distinctive fairgrounds area with unique features. Not anymore...its rapidly becoming just a bunch of buildings. Yay.

Since so much emphasis is placed on the apparently much superior value of the convention space and convention-type events that can be hosted, and that so many thousands of days and hours are spent on convention-related activities, I'm simply pushing the obvious - let's just drop the pretense that anyone cares about the fair and just drop it. That's two more weeks of convention space/rental that will make more money, which is obviously the only objective at hand going forward.



Actually, when Skip Wagner took over the fair back in the 2000's, prior to Tim O'Toole, the name was changed from State Fair of Oklahoma to Oklahoma State Fair.


Wagner was the first domino to fall in the demise of the fairgrounds many years ago. The changes, as they often do, started slowly, but by the time folks who cared were organized enough to pay attention and get at least some media focus on everything he was tearing up, it was largely too late. The cannas, the Made in Oklahoma building, Cottonwood Plaza, the Giant Slide, the 14 Flags plaza, the monorail, the flowers building...all the things that have been destroyed or repurposed all started back with him. And I fully realize he was brought in by the powers that be to do precisely that.

I won't swear to this, but I believe he left right when the media attention started to a bit negative on the changes, and he resigned and went back to Texas.

We didn't have to have a scorched earth approach. We didn't have to have a culture war from the mayor's office that started with the condescension of the fair having a "funnel cakes and corndog" image, but that's what we got. Yes, many of these buildings and sites needed attention. Just as certainly, however, there could have been a cooperative effort to maintain what was great and unique about the fair into the 21st century, but the conventioneers won, and in have come the bulldozers. It's just a great loss for OKC.

But we've got cool new buildings, so I guess I'm supposed to be happy.

yay.

The buildings aren't the problem, the destruction of the fairgrounds most certainly IS a negative. The trend is to turn the fairgrounds into a convention center. New buildings are great. What we've torn down to gain them...not so much. We had a distinctive fairgrounds area with unique features. Not anymore...its rapidly becoming just a bunch of buildings. Yay.

Since so much emphasis is placed on the apparently much superior value of the convention space and convention-type events that can be hosted, and that so many thousands of days and hours are spent on convention-related activities, I'm simply pushing the obvious - let's just drop the pretense that anyone cares about the fair and just drop it. That's two more weeks of convention space/rental that will make more money, which is obviously the only objective at hand going forward.



Wagner was the first domino to fall in the demise of the fairgrounds many years ago. The changes, as they often do, started slowly, but by the time folks who cared were organized enough to pay attention and get at least some media focus on everything he was tearing up, it was largely too late. The cannas, the Made in Oklahoma building, Cottonwood Plaza, the Giant Slide, the 14 Flags plaza, the monorail, the flowers building...all the things that have been destroyed or repurposed all started back with him. And I fully realize he was brought in by the powers that be to do precisely that.

I won't swear to this, but I believe he left right when the media attention started to a bit negative on the changes, and he resigned and went back to Texas.

We didn't have to have a scorched earth approach. We didn't have to have a culture war from the mayor's office that started with the condescension of the fair having a "funnel cakes and corndog" image, but that's what we got. Yes, many of these buildings and sites needed attention. Just as certainly, however, there could have been a cooperative effort to maintain what was great and unique about the fair into the 21st century, but the conventioneers won, and in have come the bulldozers. It's just a great loss for OKC.

But we've got cool new buildings, so I guess I'm supposed to be happy.

yay.

I agree completely. The plazas, the monorail, the airplanes, the grandstands, those were all the things that made the fair the fair. It just sucks what has happened. I equate it somewhat to what's going on with a lot of OKC's commercial centers. You lose what's funky and what made it unique and we wind up with another strip mall that looks the same as every other strip mall in every other city. It's lame and we're lesser for it.

I have to agree that no matter how functional this building may be, it has the appearance of a warehouse or another horse barn.
Advisory board reviews State Fair Park expo center design | News OK (http://newsok.com/advisory-board-reviews-state-fair-park-expo-center-design/article/3897224)

I have to agree that no matter how functional this building may be, it has the appearance of a warehouse or another horse barn.
Advisory board reviews State Fair Park expo center design | News OK (http://newsok.com/advisory-board-reviews-state-fair-park-expo-center-design/article/3897224)

Its pretty much a bigger version of the travel and transportation building AFTER they removed the air roof. Not as exciting as the preliminary designs. Hope this isn't a sign for things to come with the Convention Center.

Wagner was the first domino to fall in the demise of the fairgrounds many years ago. The changes, as they often do, started slowly, but by the time folks who cared were organized enough to pay attention and get at least some media focus on everything he was tearing up, it was largely too late. The cannas, the Made in Oklahoma building, Cottonwood Plaza, the Giant Slide, the 14 Flags plaza, the monorail, the flowers building...all the things that have been destroyed or repurposed all started back with him. And I fully realize he was brought in by the powers that be to do precisely that.

I won't swear to this, but I believe he left right when the media attention started to a bit negative on the changes, and he resigned and went back to Texas.
I too blamed good ol' Skip for the demise and had high hopes for a reversal of what had been started when he was here...but I discovered that he wasn't the problem (he was just the public face). As you stated, the behind the scenes "powers that be" were the issue and namely a person by the name of Clay Bennett

Sent out today...

Council approves preliminary report for the MAPS 3 State Fair Park expo building (http://us2.campaign-archive2.com/?u=c067e0500e2a024737cbed896&id=2ef3c06f23&e=c0c0e2ecc5)

Here is an animation of the new Expo building:

QLJtcyMhgD0

Its pretty much a bigger version of the travel and transportation building AFTER they removed the air roof. Not as exciting as the preliminary designs. Hope this isn't a sign for things to come with the Convention Center.

It is FREAKING UGLY on the outside. I am very disappointed with what our $54 million is getting us.

It is FREAKING UGLY on the outside. I am very disappointed with what our $54 million is getting us.

Agreed.

Certainly looks like a lot of plain metal for $54 million, especially since the site just needs to be scraped without considerable expense.

And of course, it doesn't include parking or other surrounding infrastructure.

It is FREAKING UGLY on the outside. I am very disappointed with what our $54 million is getting us.

Couldn't have said it better. What happened to the renderings of the buildings that were, at one point, going in where the racetrack was razed? Am I nuts, or was there not a plan to put three multipurpose buildings there at one point? This thing is awful.

I guess I am missing something. Looking at the maps, I can't see how this building will do anything to harm the fair. IMO, there is so much wasted space on the fairgrounds, even with the new buildings buildings, that any permanent improvements in infrastructure are welcome. I could be reading it wrong, but looking at the maps, it seems like you could build a few of these things and they'd still have enough space to increase the size of the fair's midway if they wanted to. It's a huge swath of land in the middle of the city, a lot of which is still not even paved.

I agree it seems a little pricey from the renderings, but I can't imagine expecting much in the first place. It seems to me that if there is anywhere in the city where function should rule the day, it's the fairgrounds. Of course, you don't want to overpay for utilitarian design, but I don't mind utilitarian when it comes to the state fair. I don't even mind if it looks like a horse barn, because, well, at the fair grounds, more horse barns = serious revenue.

Turn my head when I pass the fairgrounds now. It's too heartbreaking- the monorail, the speedway, the extravaganza that used to be the state fair. It's an elitist playground now, no longer the people's fairground. Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects? rem when the deed done to the historic sfs(who paid for that?maps3?)in Mick's solemn smarmy announcement he promised to fill the motorsports void quick time- still waiting. Mick later bragged about having the money to do it so quickly like it was some great civic accomplishment.

Turn my head when I pass the fairgrounds now. It's too heartbreaking- the monorail, the speedway, the extravaganza that used to be the state fair. It's an elitist playground now, no longer the people's fairground. Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects? rem when the deed done to the historic sfs(who paid for that?maps3?)in Mick's solemn smarmy announcement he promised to fill the motorsports void quick time- still waiting. Mick later bragged about having the money to do it so quickly like it was some great civic accomplishment.

I went to the fair this year. Didn't seem like an elitist playground to me. Then again, I don't seem to have these elaborate memories of the fair. It's always been a midway, some rides, fried foods, and a few shows, right? All basically set up in a parking lot and some very pedestrian buildings. It was never as nice as Texas's fair, but their's also seems like overkill to me.


Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects?

I think the thinking has just been that the fairgrounds could have a much better ROI than it did in past. I would think any tax payer would appreciate that. Of course, maybe some feel the fairgrounds is supposed to be a subsidized entity with its focus on access and not revenue generation. Again, it always seemed to me that the fairgrounds were for a long time a large waste of public space for a relatively underwhelming event. I certainly would never want to see the fair go away, but I still don't see how these infrastructure projects present an inherent threat to the fair. Hopefully, they will give a return that justifies making the facilities better, which can only help the fair, right?

Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects?

Why do I have to pay for your 81 year old mom's social security? I do it and I don't complain about it but I also don't really have a choice. If she doesn't want to "fund their elitist projects" she doesn't have to. She can just shop outside of the OKC city limits. That is how the MAPS tax works. How much do you think your 81 year old mom is paying in sales tax into this or any of the other projects? $10, $12/year?

If this is what we get for $54M at the fairgrounds (e.g. cheaper land), imagine what we get for $250M downtown (e.g. more expensive land)!

Hopefully, FSB and Populous didn't have their star players on that project, eh?

$54 Million for JUST this building?

$54 Million for JUST this building?


MAPS 3 State Fairgrounds Improvements

The project is guided by the State Fair Park Master Plan and will include parking and site improvements and a new expo building. The current budget will allow for approximately 303,000 gross square feet of space, which reflects approximately 227,000 usable square feet of space.

The project will be completed in two phases to include:

Phase 1 – Parking and site improvements
Phase 2 – New expo building

Budget:
Fairgrounds Phase 1 - Parking & Site Improvements Site Prep $226,000
Fairgrounds Phase 1 - Parking & Site Improvements A&E/Design/Testing/Admin $587,000
Fairgrounds Phase 1 - Parking & Site Improvements Construction and FF&E $3,684,000
Fairgrounds Phase 1 - Parking & Site Improvements Project Contingency $219,000
Fairgrounds Phase 2 - New Expo Building Site Prep $238,000
Fairgrounds Phase 2 - New Expo Building A&E/Design/Testing/Admin $6,553,000
Fairgrounds Phase 2 - New Expo Building Construction and FF&E $44,537,000
Fairgrounds Phase 2 - New Expo Building Project Contingency $2,646,000

Total $58,690,000

Why do I have to pay for your 81 year old mom's social security? I do it and I don't complain about it but I also don't really have a choice. If she doesn't want to "fund their elitist projects" she doesn't have to. She can just shop outside of the OKC city limits. That is how the MAPS tax works. How much do you think your 81 year old mom is paying in sales tax into this or any of the other projects? $10, $12/year?
SS a scheme we all pay into for the good of the commonwealth- the money spent on the fairgrounds will enhance the lives of a small group of elites.

SS a scheme we all pay into for the good of the commonwealth- the money spent on the fairgrounds will enhance the lives of a small group of elites.

Edgar,
You rant more about a small group of eletist more than I've ever heard before. Not sure where your coming from here, not sure where any small group is benefitting. The facility and proceeds are all about the city. I really don't know the inner workings, but i'm sure there are audits that would basically expose any wrong doings going on.....relax, Ed is NOT the answer here....

81 year old mom ? Last spring you posted that you weren't old enough to vote ????

81 year old mom ? Last spring you posted that you weren't old enough to vote ????

You don't think some 60 year olds can get down :o

I will say the notion that the state fair is "for elites" nothing short of laughable. I mean, have you actually been to the state fair? Not what I would consider the Nichols Hills or Gaillardia set.

If anything, horse shows at Fair Park bring in a TON of money for this area. I would have never guessed it as I am probably the last person you'd see at one. But a lot of these people come in from around the country (but especially TX and CA), fill up hotels and eat at restaurants along Meridian, and frequent the equestrian and western stores in Stockyards City.

I will say the notion that the state fair is "for elites" nothing short of laughable. I mean, have you actually been to the state fair? Not what I would consider the Nichols Hills or Gaillardia set.

If anything, horse shows at Fair Park bring in a TON of money for this area. I would have never guessed it as I am probably the last person you'd see at one. But a lot of these people come in from around the country (but especially TX and CA), fill up hotels and eat at restaurants along Meridian, and frequent the equestrian and western stores in Stockyards City.

Too true on both counts. My inlaws come down once a year for 2 weeks just to go to one of the horse shows. They spend big bucks while here.

SS a scheme we all pay into for the good of the commonwealth- the money spent on the fairgrounds will enhance the lives of a small group of elites.

Right, all those elites who sell horses, cattle, etc, run small businesses (trade show booths), hotels and restaurants that the visitors from out of town go to. Those elites... I forgot about them.

.... It's an elitist playground now, no longer the people's fairground. Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects? rem when the deed done to the historic sfs(who paid for that?maps3?)in Mick's solemn smarmy announcement he promised to fill the motorsports void quick time- still waiting. Mick later bragged about having the money to do it so quickly like it was some great civic accomplishment.

Geez, Shadid, I'm no fan of what's being done to the fairgrounds, but MAN your rhetoric gets old. Are your really that bored?

Or did they run out of envelope lickers in the back of the Subway where you run your campaign?

The exhibition buildings look to me to be used mainly for gun shows, motorcycle swap meets, Affair of the Heart, spring auto show, SW Street Rod shows. Hardly a small, elite group attending these types of events as I see it.

OK, we just had a Bait & Switch. ...and I'm not talking about Obama and his healthcare promise of "keeping your current plan" and then saying I"m sorry, sorta.

Who was the group that gave us the really nice rendering w/ a nice event center? That was worth having. This, not so much. Do we really need more metal buildings in Oklahoma? ...can't we use another form of design? FSB...??? Let's reach down and hit the Obama I'm Sorry Button, and get us that Event Center worth having like we were promised.

If it were only for elites, would any of us be using it? I think not. :-P

The exhibition buildings look to me to be used mainly for gun shows, motorcycle swap meets, Affair of the Heart, spring auto show, SW Street Rod shows. Hardly a small, elite group attending these types of events as I see it.

Apparently, you haven't yet seen the renderings of the proposed Dress Code.
(if you don't have a receipt from Hans Hermann or Mr. Ooley you will be, like, persona non grata 'r sumpin')

Populous did the design for the building. FSB is doing the construction documents. The building promised in the MAPS 3 renderings was way too pricey.

Populous did the design for the building. FSB is doing the construction documents. The building promised in the MAPS 3 renderings was way too pricey.

I thought FSB was lead, with Populous as sub-consultant.

Populous did the design for the building. FSB is doing the construction documents. The building promised in the MAPS 3 renderings was way too pricey.

Too Pricey? ...or just wanted all the other new buildn's to be metal sheds too. ? Yes, Like I said... A Bait & Switch.

I believe the renderings may have been done for the MAPS 3 campaign by Skyline Ink. These were just a hypothetical of what the building could be.

The new exhibition hall at the fairgrounds is a giant metal building?

Shocker!

Seriously....who wasn't expecting this?

Seriously....who wasn't expecting this?

Unfortunately, everyone that was duped by the original renderings that promised something infinitely nicer.

Always a bad idea to over-promise and then under-deliver.

That's why it's stupid to blow MAPS money on the fairgrounds. And then that subcommittee even jock if to get their project moved up the priority list when it should've been last.

Turn my head when I pass the fairgrounds now. It's too heartbreaking- the monorail, the speedway, the extravaganza that used to be the state fair. It's an elitist playground now, no longer the people's fairground. Why does my 81 years mom have to fund their elitist projects? rem when the deed done to the historic sfs(who paid for that?maps3?)in Mick's solemn smarmy announcement he promised to fill the motorsports void quick time- still waiting. Mick later bragged about having the money to do it so quickly like it was some great civic accomplishment.

Elitist playground? Your hyperbole is breathtakingly idiotic.

Are the state fairgrounds where the elitists gather to enjoy turkey legs and FFA gatherings?

These elitists?

15 Best Oklahoma State Fair Photos of all Time | The Lost Ogle (http://www.thelostogle.com/2013/09/12/15-best-oklahoma-state-fair-photos-of-all-time/)

Elitist playground? Your hyperbole is breathtakingly idiotic.

Are the state fairgrounds where the elitists gather to enjoy turkey legs and FFA gatherings?

Every tme I pass by there are acres of expensive horse trailors.

Horse trailers from out of town represent elitists? Boy, somebody has a SERIOUS inferiority complex or a screwed up sense of class structure. LOL.

Horse trailers from out of town represent elitists? Boy, somebody has a SERIOUS inferiority complex or a screwed up sense of class structure. LOL.

Horse trailers from out of town represent $money$. Out of town money being spent at OKC restaurants, hotels, gas stations, Walmart, local bars, etc. I don't care if they are elitists are not when they come to my office and write a retainer check.

The various events at the fairgrounds are why the hotels and restaurants along I-40 & Meridian are so busy and many more are being built.

Brings a ton of money into town all year long.


In my younger days, I worked at one of those hotels and we'd get absolutely swamped anytime there was something happening at the fairgrounds.

Yep. Friday night during the spring you can drive down Meridian and the hotel parking lots are full of horse trailers. A good friend of mine and his family co-manage one of the hotels in this area and the vast majority of his business is either horse show attendees or FAA trainees.

If you believe the chamber of commerce, OKC has more horse shows and equine events (http://www.okcchamber.com/index.php?submenu=HorseShowCapital&src=gendocs&ref=HorseShowCapital&category=VisitOKC) than any other city in the world, contributing north of $120 million to this area's economy. Don't see how anyone could have a problem with this.

Yep. Friday night during the spring you can drive down Meridian and the hotel parking lots are full of horse trailers. A good friend of mine and his family co-manage one of the hotels in this area and the vast majority of his business is either horse show attendees or FAA trainees.

If you believe the chamber of commerce, OKC has more horse shows and equine events (http://www.okcchamber.com/index.php?submenu=HorseShowCapital&src=gendocs&ref=HorseShowCapital&category=VisitOKC) than any other city in the world, contributing north of $120 million to this area's economy. Don't see how anyone could have a problem with this.

We pass by the fairgrounds frequently throughout the week and there are almost always horse trailers and horse shows going on -- like almost every weekend. I don't think people realize how much money these people spend in OKC and how frequent these events are. It's a great thing for our tourism economy, our attractions, restaurants, retailers and hotels.

$120 million may actually be a conservative figure.

I drove by the fairgrounds late tonight on the way home and the parking lot was packed with horse trailers. This is very good and lucrative business for OKC.

The tourism/convention business is so thoroughly misunderstood and under-appreciated by the average person, and even often by some of the leadership of our city and state. People come here by choice from other parts of the country and literally drop off sacks of money into our economy and tax base, with very little burden on our infrastructure. What's not to like?

The horse and pig shows are lucrative for the city but no one cares about them. The fairgrounds are a private enterprise now. They sold off the people's artifacts, razed the hip cool space age monorail, razed the historic SFS and now we have no motorsports in OKC. Was that progress?!

Those horse folks play a large role in the fact that about 33-38% of the MAPs tax is paid by folks from outside OKC. And they are regular contributors to the hotel tax and the regular sales tax as well. It's definitely a lot of income every year.

The horse and pig shows are lucrative for the city but no one cares about them. The fairgrounds are a private enterprise now. They sold off the people's artifacts, razed the hip cool space age monorail, razed the historic SFS and now we have no motorsports in OKC. Was that progress?!

Anytime you bring in out of town money, it contributes to our growth and progress. I would guess that about 15% my company's revenue is from non okc residents that are in OKC for fairground activities, Thunder games, bricktown or river activities. Their retainers allow my business to grow which has allowed us as a small business to hire three additional full time employees in last couple of years and start construction on a new building downtown. This new construction will keep those in the building trade employed. This new building on what was empty land will now generate higher property taxes for the state and city which then allows them to buy new police cars and add more police officers who then visit more donut shops for coffee. The city can hire more firemen that can pay other firemen $200.00 to cover their shift while they have other businesses on the side. (wait..that's a whole different story where firemen can pay someone to work their shift and they still get their full paycheck and benefits) These additional police officers make more DUI arrests which then allows my business to grow even more. Pretty simple math here.....

Anytime you bring in out of town money, it contributes to our growth and progress. I would guess that about 15% my company's revenue is from non okc residents that are in OKC for fairground activities, Thunder games, bricktown or river activities. Their retainers allow my business to grow which has allowed us as a small business to hire three additional full time employees in last couple of years and start construction on a new building downtown. This new construction will keep those in the building trade employed. This new building on what was empty land will now generate higher property taxes for the state and city which then allows them to buy new police cars and add more police officers who then visit more donut shops for coffee. The city can hire more firemen that can pay other firemen $200.00 to cover their shift while they have other businesses on the side. (wait..that's a whole different story where firemen can pay someone to work their shift and they still get their full paycheck and benefits) These additional police officers make more DUI arrests which then allows my business to grow even more. Pretty simple math here.....

and people came from all over to race on Friday nights and stayed in hotels and ate in restaurants but the elitists tore down our track because they didn't like their ses status.