True, all the eastern supplies of water mean nothing until pipelines get built. The drought is going to last at least one more year, and we already have problems now. Hefner and Canton will go down a lot this summer and they could have the Draper water treatment plant going at 100% all the time, but I bet the Hefner facility would still be using a lot of water. The water isn't distributed well at all and that's not going to fixed anytime soon.

OKC will use the Canton water and drain it dry then use the se ok water supply. That's the way it works and okc has every right to do so. Supplying okc with water is their number 1 priority and as ruthless as it might be,that's their job. If they can get the se ok. water supplied to okc then all problems solved. There's enough water in that area to supply a city much larger than okc for a lifetime.

OKC will use the Canton water and drain it dry then use the se ok water supply. That's the way it works and okc has every right to do so. Supplying okc with water is their number 1 priority and as ruthless as it might be,that's their job. If they can get the se ok. water supplied to okc then all problems solved. There's enough water in that area to supply a city much larger than okc for a lifetime.


Except for there are areas (NW OKC) that are connected only to Hefner. They are not connected to the SE water supplies. And they won't be connected anytime soon. So again, what does NW OKc do next year when Hefner is dry and Canton is dry?

Kinda funny that News9 just ran a story about Canton!

Kinda funny that News9 just ran a story about Canton!Yes and they practically quoted my post #235

law,

Your point is about as simple as torea on blowing train whistles. At least you live in the state.

I'm certain that everyone who has read this thread between now and however long ago has gone home at night and thought about how they can be active in making a difference. But the masses on okctalk are probably less than 1% of the OKC metro population. If you want to get a good reaction, form a group--like what was done with Friends for a Better Boulevard. Use Facebook and print material. Even though media has touched on it, reach out to all the local stations and share your cause. Go to a city council meeting and present your case. We forum readers can do things here but not much is going to change unless you're able to inform the other 99% about it.

Not only do I live in the state, I have lived in OKC, my husband was born and raised there, and I have a lot of family living there. We have to start somewhere. Even 1% is a group we must seek. All the things you mentioned are in the works, or being done now. Several TV stations were here today. Mostly, the stories were too bad for Canton. TV stations need revenue, revenue comes from ads, big companies pay for ads. Their prospective is the news.

Please believe me, it is not my intent to scold. Before the release, the problem was Canton's. We have had many meetings with people who control the water. Truly, all we asked was for a delay, an opportunity for Hefner to fill with whatever spring rains and ground water will be available before the choice was made to drain Canton. OKCWT did not do that. Now the problem is yours. If there are no rains above Canton after this release, there will be no water. If there are no rains for 5 years, there will be no water for 5 years. There are at least 200,000 people totally dependent on Hefner water. Don't you think they are owed an explanation? What if the drought is even worse this year? Don't you think residents have a right to all the information?

If I was a vindictive person, I would say too bad, and hope that OKC will feel the effects of the drought first hand. Instead, I'm trying to warn you of the difficult situation some of you may face. I hope that will not be the case. You may have numbers here, but what will you say when DFW wants water? After all, they need drinking water too. Why would you think the few of you could stand in the way of a larger group of people who also need water?

Pray for rain. Especially those in real need.

The Corps will open the only usable gate, and drain the Lake. It is unknown when the water will stop, but at that point, OKC is done.

You said you were only telling the truth but this is not the truth. There is a specific amount of water being released.

Water from Canton Lake headed to OKC | KFOR.com ? Oklahoma City News & Weather from KFOR Television, Oklahoma's News Channel 4 (http://kfor.com/2013/01/30/water-from-canton-lake-headed-to-okc/)


Early Wednesday the Army Corps of Engineers began releasing 30,000 acre feet of water from Canton Lake, down the North Canadian River.

It will take about two weeks but eventually the water will end up in Lake Hefner.

Except for there are areas (NW OKC) that are connected only to Hefner. They are not connected to the SE water supplies. And they won't be connected anytime soon. So again, what does NW OKc do next year when Hefner is dry and Canton is dry?

Every time this question is asked the same worn out response is given "OKC has water rights" which doesn't answer the question.

The truth is that the city double down and made the Hefner plant their state of the art water treatment facility and mother nature caught them with their pants down before they could find other sources of water for it. You could have Lake Michigan supplying Draper, but it doesn't matter when the Draper facility can only handle so much water.

Now the city is just trying to BS their way through until the drought hopefully ends soon.

Not only do I live in the state, I have lived in OKC, my husband was born and raised there, and I have a lot of family living there. We have to start somewhere. Even 1% is a group we must seek. All the things you mentioned are in the works, or being done now. Several TV stations were here today. Mostly, the stories were too bad for Canton. TV stations need revenue, revenue comes from ads, big companies pay for ads. Their prospective is the news.

Please believe me, it is not my intent to scold. Before the release, the problem was Canton's. We have had many meetings with people who control the water. Truly, all we asked was for a delay, an opportunity for Hefner to fill with whatever spring rains and ground water will be available before the choice was made to drain Canton. OKCWT did not do that. Now the problem is yours. If there are no rains above Canton after this release, there will be no water. If there are no rains for 5 years, there will be no water for 5 years. There are at least 200,000 people totally dependent on Hefner water. Don't you think they are owed an explanation? What if the drought is even worse this year? Don't you think residents have a right to all the information?

If I was a vindictive person, I would say too bad, and hope that OKC will feel the effects of the drought first hand. Instead, I'm trying to warn you of the difficult situation some of you may face. I hope that will not be the case. You may have numbers here, but what will you say when DFW wants water? After all, they need drinking water too. Why would you think the few of you could stand in the way of a larger group of people who also need water?

Pray for rain. Especially those in real need.

And yet you continue on like we're all in the first grade. Go back early in this thread. I live on my own. Must I remind you that my water bill was $9.80 last month? Geez. You need to give a little more respect to those of us that are on here. I was just giving you some ideas, not knowing you're already well ahead of the curve. I'll do my part to make all 600 of my friends on Facebook aware of the situation.

And I don't think praying for rain is going to solve the problem, but I'll do my best to shake my booty for rain if I'm in the Woodward area (which for those of you that are geographically challenged, is upstream from Canton).

On edit: The newscast stated that only 200,000 gallons were being released from Canton? That's nothing. Think about how many gallons the average person uses in a day and multiply that by the northwest quadrant of OKC. That's an ear drop.

....

And yet you continue on like we're all in the first grade. Go back early in this thread. I live on my own. Must I remind you that my water bill was $9.80 last month? Geez. You need to give a little more respect to those of us that are on here. I was just giving you some ideas, not knowing you're already well ahead of the curve. I'll do my part to make all 600 of my friends on Facebook aware of the situation.

And I don't think praying for rain is going to solve the problem, but I'll do my best to shake my booty for rain if I'm in the Woodward area (which for those of you that are geographically challenged, is upstream from Canton).

On edit: The newscast stated that only 200,000 gallons were being released from Canton? That's nothing. Think about how many gallons the average person uses in a day and multiply that by the northwest quadrant of OKC. That's an ear drop.

Its 20,000 acre feet of water which is about 6.5 billion gallons. 200,000 gallons would be less than a Olympic size pool. It would be nice if we were only talking about that much water. Lol

nvm

So we're talking about 1/3 of an Olympic sized swimming pool?!

Is that even worth it?

No, its around 6.5 billion gallons that will arrive at Hefner. Not 200,000. That was a misunderstanding or misquote by the news.

20,000 acre feet is the correct number.
1 acre feet = 325,821 gallon

Edit: sorry backward conversion labels. Lol

No, its around 6.5 billion that will arrive at Hefner. Not 200,000. That was a misunderstanding or misquote by the news.

The news clearly way miscalculated. They also said 30,000 acre feet instead of 20,000...if that's the case, it's actually a bit over 9.75 billion

The news clearly way miscalculated. They also said 30,000 acre feet instead of 20,000...if that's the case, it's actually a bit over 9.75 billion

Yes, thats the initial release. 10,000 acre feet won't make it to Hefner. Less would be lost if they actually released it after a couple of days of really good rain. I don't why choose January with spring around the corner. They must really be pestimistic about spring rainfall.

You said you were only telling the truth but this is not the truth. There is a specific amount of water being released.

Water from Canton Lake headed to OKC | KFOR.com ? Oklahoma City News & Weather from KFOR Television, Oklahoma's News Channel 4 (http://kfor.com/2013/01/30/water-from-canton-lake-headed-to-okc/)

The specific number is 30,000 acre/ft of water. That is the intended release. Canton is so low now, it is unknown when the water will stop flowing. Silt studies have not been done since 1977. The water could quit flowing thru the gate sooner than 30,000. It might stop at 25,000 or some other number. As I have said, we are in unknown territory.

Should we bring in pumps and pump out every last drop?

And again, the article says Canton Lake was built for OKC water, ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

The specific number is 30,000 acre/ft of water. That is the intended release. Canton is so low now, it is unknown when the water will stop flowing. Silt studies have not been done since 1977. The water could quit flowing thru the gate sooner than 30,000. It might stop at 25,000 or some other number. As I have said, we are in unknown territory.

Should we bring in pumps and pump out every last drop?

And again, the article says Canton Lake was built for OKC water, ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

I caught that bad reporting when I saw it at 6 and 10. Shame they can't get the basic facts of a story right.
From the COE website:

HISTORY AND DEVELOPMENT - Congress authorized the Canton Lake project in 1938 for flood control. The Flood Control Acts of 1946 and 1948 authorized irrigation and municipal water supply storage for the city of Enid, Okla. Because Enid did not access its storage rights, in 1955 Oklahoma City began a series of 5-year contracts with the federal government to utilize Canton’s water storage. Both the irrigation storage and the water storage were reassigned to Oklahoma City through Section 102 of the Water Resources Development Act of 1990. This project was started in 1940 but World War II temporarily halted construction. After the war, the Corps of Engineers resumed work, and the project was completed in late 1948 and formally dedicated in May of 1949. The cost to build the Canton Project was $11 million.

Not only do I live in the state, I have lived in OKC, my husband was born and raised there, and I have a lot of family living there. We have to start somewhere. Even 1% is a group we must seek. All the things you mentioned are in the works, or being done now. Several TV stations were here today. Mostly, the stories were too bad for Canton. TV stations need revenue, revenue comes from ads, big companies pay for ads. Their prospective is the news.

Please believe me, it is not my intent to scold. Before the release, the problem was Canton's. We have had many meetings with people who control the water. Truly, all we asked was for a delay, an opportunity for Hefner to fill with whatever spring rains and ground water will be available before the choice was made to drain Canton. OKCWT did not do that. Now the problem is yours. If there are no rains above Canton after this release, there will be no water. If there are no rains for 5 years, there will be no water for 5 years. There are at least 200,000 people totally dependent on Hefner water. Don't you think they are owed an explanation? What if the drought is even worse this year? Don't you think residents have a right to all the information?

If I was a vindictive person, I would say too bad, and hope that OKC will feel the effects of the drought first hand. Instead, I'm trying to warn you of the difficult situation some of you may face. I hope that will not be the case. You may have numbers here, but what will you say when DFW wants water? After all, they need drinking water too. Why would you think the few of you could stand in the way of a larger group of people who also need water?

Pray for rain. Especially those in real need.

now or later doesn't change anything for OKC ... no water is going to be lost or let down stream .. this won't fill hefner ..

waiting would have added now benefit for OKC

The cost to build the Canton Project was $11 million.

Adjusted for inflation would be around $101,365,395.18

Yes, thats the initial release. 10,000 acre feet won't make it to Hefner. Less would be lost if they actually released it after a couple of days of really good rain. I don't why choose January with spring around the corner. They must really be pestimistic about spring rainfall.

Or, the release is not necessary at this time. With Hefner 2/3rds full, there is no immediate need. They could have waited another month or two as we asked. Water is fungible, OKC officials have not nor will they ever say they want water for any other reason than drinking.

If they are that pessimistic, shouldn't OKC be taking much more drastic actions. If they are that pessimistic, then they are proving my points.

now or later doesn't change anything for OKC ... no water is going to be lost or let down stream .. this won't fill hefner ..

waiting would have added now benefit for OKC

Yes, it would have. Waiting for spring rains would have saved Canton for later, and at least given Canton Lake (not the town) a chance to survive. There is more rainfall between Canton and OKC, than above Canton. Once the water in Canton is gone, there will be NO more until it rains above Canton.

Doesn't OKC have some responsibility to be good stewards of the resources they use?

I know this isn't the weather thread, but forecast models showing active pattern coming up for first few weeks of February.

Looks like rain and snow with multiple systems.

I know this isn't the weather thread, but forecast models showing active pattern coming up for first few weeks of February.

Looks like rain and snow with multiple systems.

Hopefully, above Canton, not just between Canton and OKC. We'll be watching all the gauges.

What have the communities and farms surrounding Canton lake done to conserve water than OKC is not currently doing?

Yes, it would have. Waiting for spring rains would have saved Canton for later, and at least given Canton Lake (not the town) a chance to survive. There is more rainfall between Canton and OKC, than above Canton. Once the water in Canton is gone, there will be NO more until it rains above Canton.

Doesn't OKC have some responsibility to be good stewards of the resources they use?

again i said for OKC ...

I think the long-term viability of Canton Lake as a recreational resource will be waning. This isn't necessarily due strictly to the extended drought, but more so due to agricultural usage of the Ogallala Aquifer. Much of the drainage basin of the North Canadian (Beaver) River lies in recharge zones to this aquifer, which has been drawn down at alarming rates in the past 20 years. My belief is that it will end up much like Lake Meredith in the Texas Panhandle, once a massive reservoir, now barely maintaining water. Lake(?) Optima, which is on the Beaver River, should be the cautionary tale that Canton should heed.

Its 20,000 acre feet of water which is about 6.5 billion gallons. 200,000 gallons would be less than a Olympic size pool. It would be nice if we were only talking about that much water. Lol

Yeah...my first thought when I awoke today was "200,000 gallons? That's not right" lol.

I think the long-term viability of Canton Lake as a recreational resource will be waning. This isn't necessarily due strictly to the extended drought, but more so due to agricultural usage of the Ogallala Aquifer. Much of the drainage basin of the North Canadian (Beaver) River lies in recharge zones to this aquifer, which has been drawn down at alarming rates in the past 20 years. My belief is that it will end up much like Lake Meredith in the Texas Panhandle, once a massive reservoir, now barely maintaining water. Lake(?) Optima, which is on the Beaver River, should be the cautionary tale that Canton should heed.

It is a cautionary tale OKC should heed. Canton has no control of the water in the Lake. Only the Corps, OKCWT, OWRB have any say. OKC will be out of water.

Around Canton there are only a few irrigation systems. The big systems are in the panhandle. Those are individual permits with the OWRB, none irrigate from Canton Lake.

Before we moved to city water, our well only produced 4 gal/per minute. Barely enough to call it a water well. We managed our water use VERY carefully. We were able to care for a sizable garden that produced more than we (and family and friends) could eat. So I know it can be done.

Okc won't ever be "out of water". At least not in this century

I think the long-term viability of Canton Lake as a recreational resource will be waning. This isn't necessarily due strictly to the extended drought, but more so due to agricultural usage of the Ogallala Aquifer. Much of the drainage basin of the North Canadian (Beaver) River lies in recharge zones to this aquifer, which has been drawn down at alarming rates in the past 20 years. My belief is that it will end up much like Lake Meredith in the Texas Panhandle, once a massive reservoir, now barely maintaining water. Lake(?) Optima, which is on the Beaver River, should be the cautionary tale that Canton should heed.


Once you get very far west of the 100th meridian many natural springs that were once common are now long gone.
As they make their way off the Ogallala Aquifer rivers such as the Beaver and Cimarron rivers for all practical proposes have run dry 99% of the time for the past 40 years or more that I know of.
Since Canton Lake has pretty much maintained its water levels during this entire 40 years except during periods drought I do not believe further depletion of the Olagala will have very much if any impact on Canton Lake water levels

Once you get very far west of the 100th meridian many natural springs that were once common are now long gone.
As they make their way off the Ogallala Aquifer rivers such as the Beaver and Cimarron rivers for all practical proposes have run dry 99% of the time for the past 40 years or more that I know of.
Since Canton Lake has pretty much maintained its water levels during this entire 40 years except during periods drought I do not believe further depletion of the Olagala will have very much if any impact on Canton Lake water levels

In a similar manner that it had no effect on Lake Meredith, right?

In a similar manner that it had no effect on Lake Meredith, right?

It’s a different situation.
The Lake Meredith area is in a far more arid area and that will never change.

Okc won't ever be "out of water". At least not in this century

200,000 of you may soon be, def sooner than the end of this century.




It’s a different situation.
The Lake Meredith area is in a far more arid area and that will never change.

Actually the catchment area for Canton Lake and Lake Meredith are not so different or far apart.

Actually the catchment area for Canton Lake and Lake Meredith are not so different or far apart.

There is very little run off to Lake Canton from the panhandle area particularly as you move west.
The great bulk of the water that fills Lake Canton comes from east of the 100 meridian and well east of the Ogallala aquifer.

Having lived travel in this area extensively while dealing with numerous land owners, many geologist and others who follow the high plains water issues closely I have heard what they say and I have seen these rivers perhaps thousands of times going back to the late 1960’s.

Lake Meredith suffers from a much higher evaporation rates. When Meredith water reaches a certain height it soaks into the aquifer, but this only occur 2 or 3 times in a decade in recent years. There is also very a large demand for Meredith water from many community’s in the area. The water is pumped to towns as far away as south of Lubbock. Without doing the math and knowing exactly how many people Hefner serves the population that Meredith serves may well be more than Hefner. Oklahoma won a court battle that required that a certain about of water be discharged from Lake Meredith.
Meredith’s run off comes from a far more arid area. There is just not near as much rain for it to fill it even in normal years.

The specific number is 30,000 acre/ft of water. That is the intended release. Canton is so low now, it is unknown when the water will stop flowing. Silt studies have not been done since 1977. The water could quit flowing thru the gate sooner than 30,000. It might stop at 25,000 or some other number. As I have said, we are in unknown territory.

Should we bring in pumps and pump out every last drop?

And again, the article says Canton Lake was built for OKC water, ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

I understand your concern but your obvious exaggerations don't help your position. The lake has a capacity of 111,000 acre feet. Is it 2/3 empty now?

Whether it was built for Oklahoma City's water supply really isn't the issue.

Canton Lake (http://www.swt-wc.usace.army.mil/CANT.lakepage.html)

At the time of this posting, the conservation pool is at 38%.

Yes, we should bring in pumps and leave Canton with a dry hole.

OKC shall have green lawns and the ability to water our streets in a drought while turning NW OK into a wasteland.

You're being just a little bit melodramatic here.

Canton was built for one purpose--to hold water for the use of OKC. It's being used for that purpose. Locals need to be thankful they were provided that lake and its use in the good years.

Is there no truth or fact checking mandated for reporting anymore??!! Channels 4, 5 and 9 all got it wrong!
Let's get some facts straight that the major news outlets are reporting incorrectly!

Marsha Slaughter with the Oklahoma
City Water Utilities Trust has stated only 200,000 residents depend on the water from
Lake Hefner which gets it's water from Canton Lake. Where did this 1.2 million figure come from?? 1.2 million is the entirety of the population of the metro area and we all know
they don't all depend on Canton Lake/Hefner water for their drinking. This is a highly inflated figure to make this draw look more necessary to the public, than it actually is..

Why aren't you mentioning the 40,000 acre feet that is currently in Lake Hefner that would have gotten the people who rely on Canton/Hefner water by until late spring early summer??

This draw was not necessary at this time! All the Canton Lake Assn asked for was that you try and get us into spring and see if any spring rains would alleviate the severity of this situation, so that perhaps all the fish in our lake could survive and not die which is very likely to happen in the summer due to this draw of water.

Once you take the water from Canton it's gone and we can't get it back, and it's highly unlikely rains will come out west due to the drought, but the odds of OKC receiving the needed rainfall to help put water in Hefner are much greater. Over a 30 year period Canadian county averaged 9 more inches annually than Woodward County in western Oklahoma, so who do you think has the better odds of receiving the much needed spring rains?? It always rains a lot more between Watonga and OKC than it does out west of Canton to refill our lake.

Further more please stop spreading the untruth that Canton was built for OKC water storage!! That is an easy statement to disprove. Mrs. Regan should be ashamed of herself for implying that to the reporter and coercing her to lie on live TV. The FACT is, the city of Enid had some limited storage rights for a good many years after the lake was built and it wasn't for quite some time until OKC received any water rights in Canton at all.

And please stop using the term "drinking water" until you mandate no outside watering!! Unless you count the grass and trees "drinking" while they are dormant! You are again slanting the story to sound more severe on your end so you can justify the damage you are doing on this end in Western Oklahoma.

What a shame, the innocent people in the communities that surround Canton Lake are getting ready to pay dearly for the sins of those in power in OKC, who have not educated the people that there is a severe water crisis on the very near horizon. It's no longer on the horizon for the people of Canton and surrounding towns, it's now here with the begin of this release. It will be severe in areas of OKC soon enough if spring rains don't come. The people of OKC are good people, but nobody has told them how serious this situation is so they haven't changed their water practices to start conserving. The people in authority have done a disservice to the people of OKC and greatly to the people who rely on Canton Lake for their lively hood. This could have all been avoided or at least put off for several months or years had those in power shared the need for conservation a year or two ago when the drought started instead of waiting until it was a dire situation. Shame on you leaders, shame on you.

There will be a need.

I just want to know what the plan is, if they even have a plan for a much worse situation.

I can tell you what the plan is, they plan to dump sewage into Hefner and retreat it....won't that make for some nice boating?? Can you imagine the stench for those running and biking around the lake? To quote cousin Eddie on Christmas Vacation...."Really nice Clark, really nice!"

It just feels weird to have people from NW OK scolding us on water conservation and how we decided to use our water.

No one is scolding, just trying to educate the folks about a bad situation that didn't have to happen. I don't believe for one minute that the fine folks of OKC would intentionally do harm to the people of Western OK. I do feel that those in power have not done their due diligence in educating their water patrons of the severity of this issue so we are trying to do that. We will pay now for their lack of effort in educating, the people who rely on Hefner/Canton water will pay later if it doesn't rain. Praying for rain.

I understand your concern but your obvious exaggerations don't help your position. The lake has a capacity of 111,000 acre feet. Is it 2/3 empty now?

Whether it was built for Oklahoma City's water supply really isn't the issue.

Prove any exaggerations. From the Corps page on current Canton Lake status "At this elevation the total amount of water stored in Canton Lake is 49279 acre-feet."

The draw is 30,000 acre-feet. Canton's capacity WAS 111,000. The actual capacity today is unknown. No silt studies have been done since 1977. The actual capacity may only be 90,000 acre feet. Besides, Canton was already very low before this draw, you were not starting at 111,000.

So YES, Canton Lake BEFORE the draw was slightly above 2/3 empty. Within the next few days, it will be at 2/3rds empty, and this draw is expected to last around 2 weeks.

The Corps have said they do not know if the entire amount can be drawn, we are in unknown conditions. The Corps have said you are done after this draw until the lake refills to drawable level. These are facts not exaggerations.

No one is scolding, just trying to educate the folks about a bad situation that didn't have to happen. I don't believe for one minute that the fine folks of OKC would intentionally do harm to the people of Western OK. I do feel that those in power have not done their due diligence in educating their water patrons of the severity of this issue so we are trying to do that. We will pay now for their lack of effort in educating, the people who rely on Hefner/Canton water will pay later if it doesn't rain. Praying for rain.

What percentage of people reading this thread do you really think did not know we had a problem?

What percentage of people reading this thread do you really think did not know we had a problem?

I am not sure and that would be pure speculation on my part, but I feel a large percentage of them didn't know how serious it was and how it was going to devastate economies and ruin a lake in Western OK for many years.

Do the people of the surrounding communities get their drinking water from Canton Lake?

What percentage of people reading this thread do you really think did not know we had a problem?

What percentage do you think know the problem?

Do the people of the surrounding communities get their drinking water from Canton Lake?

No. Canton uses wells west of town. The ground water here is poor quality.

Do the people of the surrounding communities get their drinking water from Canton Lake?

Are you trying to imply that the water from Canton Lake that has been wasted over the last two years all went to drinking water?? Such as dormant grass and trees "drinking" it as it sprayed out of auto sprinklers that are still running today? I guess I am confused...

What percentage of people reading this thread do you really think did not know we had a problem?

Anybody who was reading and believing BoulderSooner's placation that there is no water problem in Oklahoma City.

Are you trying to imply that the water from Canton Lake that has been wasted over the last two years all went to drinking water?? Such as dormant grass and trees "drinking" it as it sprayed out of auto sprinklers that are still running today? I guess I am confused...

Where did I say anything even remotely close to what you are implying? I asked a simple question that I did not know that answer too.

Where did I say anything even remotely close to what you are implying? I asked a simple question that I did not know that answer too.
I apologize, I thought you were saying because it's "drinking water" as they say on the news, it was more important for OKC to have it and the fact of the matter is we all know it's not just drinking water. Again, sorry for the confusion I am just really irritated by the way it's being portrayed in the media. To answer your question, no communities out here use the lake for drinking water.

Where did I say anything even remotely close to what you are implying? I asked a simple question that I did not know that answer too.
I apologize, I thought you were saying because it's "drinking water" as they say on the news, it was more important for OKC to have it and the fact of the matter is we all know it's not just drinking water. Again, sorry for the confusion I am just really irritated by the way it's being portrayed in the media. To answer your question, no communities out here use the lake for drinking water.

I'm just not looking forward to seeing a dry lake bed and dead fish skeletons everywhere.... :-(

I know it’s controversial….. but we probably need to take a hard look at cloud seeding.

Further more please stop spreading the untruth that Canton was built for OKC water storage!! That is an easy statement to disprove. Mrs. Regan should be ashamed of herself for implying that to the reporter and coercing her to lie on live TV. The FACT is, the city of Enid had some limited storage rights for a good many years after the lake was built and it wasn't for quite some time until OKC received any water rights in Canton at all.

My house was built to house some folks with the last name of London. I live there now and own the place. Do I care that my house was built by the Londons? Not a whit. Lake Canton was built as a reservoir lake for the City of Enid. OKC later purchased those rights after Enid, which is generally a terribly run city, failed to make payments. It doesn't matter why the lake was built. Now OKC owns those rights and has the right to utilize them whether you like it or not. What is Canton losing? A recreational lake. What's the harm? A few businesses which were built depending on the existence of something which wasn't meant to support their recreational uses, but rather to make sure I can keep a green lawn in the middle of the summer.


And please stop using the term "drinking water" until you mandate no outside watering!! Unless you count the grass and trees "drinking" while they are dormant! You are again slanting the story to sound more severe on your end so you can justify the damage you are doing on this end in Western Oklahoma.


I plan on watering my lawn this summer as much as humanly possible. I paid good money for an automatic sprinkler system which covers both my yard and flower gardens and I fully intend to have one of the greener yards on my street.

If you don't like it, move to my neighborhood, we have a couple of houses for sale.

[quote]What a shame, the innocent people in the communities that surround Canton Lake are getting ready to pay dearly for the sins of those in power in OKC, who have not educated the people that there is a severe water crisis on the very near horizon. It's no longer on the horizon for the people of Canton and surrounding towns, it's now here with the begin of this release. It will be severe in areas of OKC soon enough if spring rains don't come. The people of OKC are good people, but nobody has told them how serious this situation is so they haven't changed their water practices to start conserving. The people in authority have done a disservice to the people of OKC and greatly to the people who rely on Canton Lake for their lively hood. This could have all been avoided or at least put off for several months or years had those in power shared the need for conservation a year or two ago when the drought started instead of waiting until it was a dire situation. Shame on you leaders, shame on you.

Oh please. What a bunch of crybabies. Folks in Western OK who engage in non-ranching agriculture or supply their cities and towns with groundwater and draw from the aquifer at a rate clearly greater than that of replenishment are certainly in no position to lecture anyone on water use.

My house was built to house some folks with the last name of London. I live there now and own the place. Do I care that my house was built by the Londons? Not a whit. Lake Canton was built as a reservoir lake for the City of Enid. OKC later purchased those rights after Enid, which is generally a terribly run city, failed to make payments. It doesn't matter why the lake was built. Now OKC owns those rights and has the right to utilize them whether you like it or not. What is Canton losing? A recreational lake. What's the harm? A few businesses which were built depending on the existence of something which wasn't meant to support their recreational uses, but rather to make sure I can keep a green lawn in the middle of the summer.



[quote]I plan on watering my lawn this summer as much as humanly possible. I paid good money for an automatic sprinkler system which covers both my yard and flower gardens and I fully intend to have one of the greener yards on my street.

If you don't like it, move to my neighborhood, we have a couple of houses for sale.



Oh please. What a bunch of crybabies. Folks in Western OK who engage in non-ranching agriculture or supply their cities and towns with groundwater and draw from the aquifer at a rate clearly greater than that of replenishment are certainly in no position to lecture anyone on water use.

Wow, your compassion for all the business owners and their employees losing their lively hood is endless, you must be a really popular person...I only wish I were as smart as you. I dare say if your family, friends or yourself owned businesses here you wouldn't be singing that tune. I get that it's hard to relate to that when you are the center of your own universe though. The depth of your personal sacrifice for your fellow man is simply astounding! What an individual.

Folks in Western OK who engage in non-ranching agriculture or supply their cities and towns with groundwater and draw from the aquifer at a rate clearly greater than that of replenishment are certainly in no position to lecture anyone on water use.
The recharge rates are greater than the withdraw rates in most of western Oklahoma in the areas well east of the Ogallala aquifer.

I would say that anyone who arrogantly says they are going to water their lawn this summer “as much as humanly possible” such as Midtowner says, particularly when he has been shown to be wrong on facts, is in no position to lecture anyone on water use!

Yet on other threads he scolds anyone he can on pollution and energy use, yet he plans on being wasteful with water.
That’s sound about right for the guy who admires a man like Gene Stipe.

I plan on watering my lawn this summer as much as humanly possible. I paid good money for an automatic sprinkler system which covers both my yard and flower gardens and I fully intend to have one of the greener yards on my street.

As I said earlier, Good for you! Get rid of that water just as soon as you can! Water those gutters while it rains! The sooner you do that, the better off you'll all be!

Wow, your compassion for all the business owners and their employees losing their lively hood is endless, you must be a really popular person...I only wish I were as smart as you. I dare say if your family, friends or yourself owned businesses here you wouldn't be singing that tune. I get that it's hard to relate to that when you are the center of your own universe though. The depth of your personal sacrifice for your fellow man is simply astounding! What an individual.

If my house is swept away by a hurricane because it's beachfront property, am I a smart or stupid person if I rebuild on the beachfront?

If I build my livelihood around a lake which is wholly owned by some entity which has rights to all of the water and will exercise those rights in a drought, am I a smart or stupid person?

OKC shouldn't feel guilty. Canton is part of their water use plan and they are exercising it. If folks wanted to build livelihoods around the possibility that Canton would remain a great recreation lake despite the knowledge that the primary purpose of the lake is not recreation, that's on them. Not us. If Canton was in a similar situation and OKC was on the receiving end, do you imagine they'd behave any differently? If we didn't have any significant rain this spring and we never took that water, would the OKC government not instantly become very unpopular to its own citizens?

The fact is that folks in NW Oklahoma and SE Oklahoma need to understand that OKC, not Idabel and certainly not Canton is along with Tulsa, THE driver of this state's economy. If they like their schools and roads and bridges and county court systems and appellate courts and state agencies and whatnot, they need to realize that OKC and Tulsa have to exist to pay for those things and to provide two large marketplaces for the goods produced by rural communities. Part of that deal is that cities like OKC and Tulsa can't possibly store all of their own water and will have to collect water from elsewhere.

Running a state takes cooperation between rural and urban communities. It seems Canton wants all of the benefits of having OKC, but none of the costs.

This has turned out to be a pissing contest, let's just all pray for rain and try to be a little more conservaitve.

This has turned out to be a pissing contest, let's just all pray for rain and try to be a little more conservative.

If my house is swept away by a hurricane because it's beachfront property, am I a smart or stupid person if I rebuild on the beachfront?

If I build my livelihood around a lake which is wholly owned by some entity which has rights to all of the water and will exercise those rights in a drought, am I a smart or stupid person?

OKC shouldn't feel guilty. Canton is part of their water use plan and they are exercising it. If folks wanted to build livelihoods around the possibility that Canton would remain a great recreation lake despite the knowledge that the primary purpose of the lake is not recreation, that's on them. Not us. If Canton was in a similar situation and OKC was on the receiving end, do you imagine they'd behave any differently? If we didn't have any significant rain this spring and we never took that water, would the OKC government not instantly become very unpopular to its own citizens?

The fact is that folks in NW Oklahoma and SE Oklahoma need to understand that OKC, not Idabel and certainly not Canton is along with Tulsa, THE driver of this state's economy. If they like their schools and roads and bridges and county court systems and appellate courts and state agencies and whatnot, they need to realize that OKC and Tulsa have to exist to pay for those things and to provide two large marketplaces for the goods produced by rural communities. Part of that deal is that cities like OKC and Tulsa can't possibly store all of their own water and will have to collect water from elsewhere.

Running a state takes cooperation between rural and urban communities. It seems Canton wants all of the benefits of having OKC, but none of the costs.

Your rant would be true and relevant to this topic if we were asking the delay be put off indefinitely, but as that is not the case your are wrong in your writing. I know full well the benefits that OKC and Tulsa bring to the state but you might also consider the oil and gas that comes from our part of the state might be rather large economic drivers as well?? We only asked Mrs. Slaughter and the OCWUT to hold off for 60 to 90 days before taking the release to let spring rains try and help relieve the issue. We only pointed out that if her organization would have done their jobs, and seen the effects of this drought which has long been forecast by professionals, that we wouldn't be where we are today. If they had educated on and perhaps mandated some water rationing this probably wouldn't be an issue right now. Everyone out here knows who has the water rights and that the city has the right to use them, we just wanted some good stewardship of the water and consideration of the damage that will be done to everyone out here. We are all people who come to the city to shop and spend money in that economic machine, so it's not like OKC survives on it's own. We are all from Oklahoma and depend on one another. The argument of leaving the water in Canton lake for a couple of more months, doesn't say we don't want any of the costs of having OKC. I just can't understand using your reserve before using what's in your own back yard. There is well over 4-5 months water stored in Hefner right now, all we were asking for was a couple. It would be like running a motorcycle on the reserve tank before flipping it to main, doesn't make sense especially when the main tank may be refilled much quicker than the reserve.