Agreed. American should have been given the gates, they clearly have the deepest commitment to OKC right now. That new Alaska partnership is huge as well.

But what is the point of "getting" the new gates, if it just ends up spreading you across a larger area of the terminal? I think both AA and United will likely end up needing more gates, and that would just end up with a big long line of gates for one airline. Now I will freely admit that I am 100% not an airport expert, but I think it would make more sense to keep the airlines with more gates in the west most part of the terminal where they have gates on both sides. That would make it easier to consolidate operations by having all the planes near each other, it would make it easier to find your correct gate if the physical area is smaller, it would give passengers more room to spread out to seating for the other gates near there, and it would be less noise because you don't have all the foot traffic exiting the security checkpoint and restaurants nearby. I really think it's less of "who gets the shiny new gate" and more "what placement makes the most sense".

So I think it maybe a layout like this possibly:

https://i.imgur.com/DETLSXE.jpg

There is a Phase II to the eastern terminal expansion, and if/when that happens then all the gates could accommodate American.

But as it is, only 4 gates are being added in this phase.

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wrwa030619j.jpg

So the new security checkpoint is [being] built here in this Phase 1 deal, yes? Jus trying to get bearings right from the renderings and what has been finished.

This will force all new departures to at least walk through the new terminal section.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wrwa052121k.jpg

Yes

So I think it maybe a layout like this possibly:

https://i.imgur.com/DETLSXE.jpg

The gate to the far east is the international gate that can be closed off from the rest of the airport and has a hallway leading to the international holding room.

So the new security checkpoint is [being] built here in this Phase 1 deal, yes? Jus trying to get bearings right from the renderings and what has been finished.

This will force all new departures to at least walk through the new terminal section.

I did a little write-up and added some renderings which hopefully makes it easier to understand:

https://www.okctalk.com/content.php?r=732-Massive-expansion-at-Will-Rogers-Airport-nears-completion

Nice write up, glad I took so many pictures from seemingly innocuous places, adding those to the renderings really helps put it all together in my head.

Delta just has a few gates, so it makes sense to put them at the end of one side of the terminal. It’s not about which gate is nicest I think, but more about keeping gates together. Then the airlines with more gates can be located together.

It’s a significant public investment and it does not improve their access, as they are already on that end of the concourse.

They serve the fewest number of customers for a large airline and is an underutilization of said public investment.

So the new security checkpoint is [being] built here in this Phase 1 deal, yes? Jus trying to get bearings right from the renderings and what has been finished.

This will force all new departures to at least walk through the new terminal section.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wrwa052121k.jpg

Over the past year and a half i have probably spent the most time than others in the existing areas and the construction areas.

Its gonna suck to be an American, united or Alaska customer along with anyone else but delta, flying out of the airport, to go through TSA you have to go to the east side of the airport and walk back to your gate

I think delta is taking 3 of the 4 gates, 26, 28 and 30.
32 looks like it could be international, special use, military, stranded travelers gate as it looks like youre gonna have a large staging area on the baggage claim level available to just that gate, you could keep an airplanes worth of people downstairs they'd be isolated from the airport i dunno just my opinion

It looks like they have no plans to reopen Baggage Claim 1, directly under gates 22 and 24, at the start of construction they removed the baggage belt and put up construction walls, seems like they rebuilt a cinder block wall on 1 opening of the belt and the 2nd opening for the belt was a construction door, theyve since closed that opening up and it looks like that area is going to just be seating for awhile. the gc intends to give that area back to the airport soon, theyre redoing tile, and hopefully theyll lay carpet squares. I cant imagine losing a baggage claim when you're gaining gates.

Starbucks seems like the only eatery that is getting any attention, its the first thing youll see after you get through tsa.

TSA screening, this seems like an area youd give the most attention too, but the ceiling for that area is gonna be what keeps the project from opening, you cant install scanners lines etc until you have everything that goes above it.
Once its funtional they're removing everything in the entry in front of the southwest gates, and making it match the exit they have done by the current delta gates 22 and 24, im curious to know if theyll use the aux tsa area as an exit while they're converting the tsa to an exit. Its going to suck if youre walking back from the alaska gate 1.

I miss tuckers cinnabon and schlotzskys, the current food offering is really bad, 15 dollars for a hamburger or breakfast burrito is really bad, i really hope they give travellers better food offerings

So the new security checkpoint is [being] built here in this Phase 1 deal, yes? Jus trying to get bearings right from the renderings and what has been finished.

This will force all new departures to at least walk through the new terminal section.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wrwa052121k.jpg

Over the past year and a half i have probably spent the most time than others in the existing areas and the construction areas.

Its gonna suck to be an American, united or Alaska customer along with anyone else but delta, flying out of the airport, to go through TSA you have to go to the east side of the airport and walk back to your gate

I think delta is taking 3 of the 4 gates, 26, 28 and 30.
32 looks like it could be international, special use, military, stranded travelers gate as it looks like youre gonna have a large staging area on the baggage claim level available to just that gate, you could keep an airplanes worth of people downstairs they'd be isolated from the airport i dunno just my opinion

It looks like they have no plans to reopen Baggage Claim 1, directly under gates 22 and 24, at the start of construction they removed the baggage belt and put up construction walls, seems like they rebuilt a cinder block wall on 1 opening of the belt and the 2nd opening for the belt was a construction door, theyve since closed that opening up and it looks like that area is going to just be seating for awhile. the gc intends to give that area back to the airport soon, theyre redoing tile, and hopefully theyll lay carpet squares. I cant imagine losing a baggage claim when you're gaining gates.

Starbucks seems like the only eatery that is getting any attention, its the first thing youll see after you get through tsa.

TSA screening, this seems like an area youd give the most attention too, but the ceiling for that area is gonna be what keeps the project from opening, you cant install scanners lines etc until you have everything that goes above it.
Once its funtional they're removing everything in the entry in front of the southwest gates, and making it match the exit they have done by the current delta gates 22 and 24, im curious to know if theyll use the aux tsa area as an exit while they're converting the tsa to an exit. Its going to suck if youre walking back from the alaska gate 1.

I miss tuckers cinnabon and schlotzskys, the current food offering is really bad, 15 dollars for a hamburger or breakfast burrito is really bad, i really hope they give travellers better food offerings

I cant imagine losing a baggage claim when you're gaining gates.

If some of the longer term plans that would allow up to around 35-40 plausible gates can happen, expanding the east concourse and adding a south one, which seems would not have much more if any expansion of the central terminal building. We would have to be way underutilizing the capacity of the current baggage area.

Baggage claim capacity could be increased with traditional carousel type bag claim units - The ones you see in larger airports instead of the looped flat plate system.

In Denver, United has 6 bag claim units which together handle an average claim volume of around 12,000 bags per day.

The airport can survive easily off of 6 provided they were the higher capacity carousels.

PDX uses the flat ones (however they are probably double or triple the running length) and they make due with 10 units (for an airport that handles 5 times the passenger volume of OKC)

...
I miss tuckers cinnabon and schlotzskys, the current food offering is really bad, 15 dollars for a hamburger or breakfast burrito is really bad, i really hope they give travellers better food offerings

I'm with you on that one! :)

It wasn't that long ago that bag claim at WRWA consisted of just dumping the bags out in a small area that didn't rotate at all.

It was the worst system I have ever seen; people would climb all over each other.


BTW, at all these carousels they need to paint a line and have everyone stand behind it until they see their bag, then step forward. The current process of everyone crowding directly in front of the moving belt means you can't see your bag unless you elbow your way in.

^huh... must have been before my time as i don't recall ever seeing that. they've had carousels in baggage claim as far back as i can remember... sometime in the early to mid 80's... a time when anybody could just walk out to the terminal and there were banks of coin-operated tv's for people to sit and watch.

edit: found a pic!
https://i.imgur.com/75oO3tB.jpg

Yes, and they used to have a little observation tower within the terminal arm and anyone could access it, whether you had a plane ticket or not.

And people used to be able to greet you at the gate.

Yes, and they used to have a little observation tower within the terminal arm and anyone could access it, whether you had a plane ticket or not.

i think you had to pay a dime to activate the turnstile to get up there. my folks would tell me that was the original control tower, which may or may not be true.

^huh... must have been before my time as i don't recall ever seeing that. they've had carousels in baggage claim as far back as i can remember... sometime in the early to mid 80's... a time when anybody could just walk out to the terminal and there were banks of coin-operated tv's for people to sit and watch.

edit: found a pic!
https://i.imgur.com/75oO3tB.jpg

In college (late 90s), I was often tasked with shutting friends to and from the airport because I (1) had a car and (2) knew how to get to the airport from Oklahoma Christian University, a not-insignificant drive. I remember being able to accompany them right up to the gate, after passing a metal detector. Good times.

Yes, and they used to have a little observation tower within the terminal arm and anyone could access it, whether you had a plane ticket or not.

And people used to be able to greet you at the gate.

greeting at the gate i believe lasted all the way until 9/11

The TSA has a program to allow airports to permit non-flying public access to post-security areas. As far as I know, there aren't a ton of hurdles to this but TSA staffing is one of them. I believe this also requires an increase of TSA audits at the gate to ensure boarding passes match ID. (because theoretically I could buy a ticket in my name and give my boarding pass to someone else; they could use a gate-pass in their name to get through security then use my boarding pass to board as IDs are rarely checked at the gate)

There are a few airports that do this, I believe Tampa and Columbus run this program. Denver is looking into it for when the Great Hall project is completed as there will be more shopping options in the main terminal. This has to be an airport initiative, not led by the TSA.

Baggage claim capacity could be increased with traditional carousel type bag claim units - The ones you see in larger airports instead of the looped flat plate system.

In Denver, United has 6 bag claim units which together handle an average claim volume of around 12,000 bags per day.

The airport can survive easily off of 6 provided they were the higher capacity carousels.

PDX uses the flat ones (however they are probably double or triple the running length) and they make due with 10 units (for an airport that handles 5 times the passenger volume of OKC)

I thought PDX was around ~16m pre-coronavirus, which would be 4-times OKC's 4.4m.

Barely shy of 20 million for 2018 and 2019.

i think you had to pay a dime to activate the turnstile to get up there. my folks would tell me that was the original control tower, which may or may not be true.

I went up in that tower a number of times and don't think it was ever a control tower. 16874

This is what the view from the tower and the luggage claim area looked like.
16875
16876
This is what the terminal looked like when I first started flying.
16877

This is what the view from the tower and the luggage claim area looked like.
16875
16876
This is what the terminal looked like when I first started flying.
16877

Really cool photos, thank you for sharing. I wish that great art-deco terminal building could have been saved for adaptive re-use.

I went up in that tower a number of times and don't think it was ever a control tower. 16874

too bad there wasn;t a way to keep that observation/control tower. It was a gem and would be awesome today.

Really cool photos, thank you for sharing. I wish that great art-deco terminal building could have been saved for adaptive re-use.

any idea where the original terminal was located?

any idea where the original terminal was located?

It looks like it was in the current general aviation area, west of Meridian, south of Amelia Earhart lane. Plus the original runways were in the northwest corner of the current layout.

My best guess is a little south of SW66th. From a current satellite photo you can see a curve in the tarmac likely related to the fence in the picture, it looks like one of the current taxiways is in that photo, and today there is an angled scar of a removed taxiway plausibly continuing from what is seen in the lower left of the picture.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a9/5e/02/a95e02d6dfa9ef77dd9e0c896b2b2d4b.jpg

greeting at the gate i believe lasted all the way until 9/11

Prior to (I believe) the 1993 World Trade Center attack you could walk to the gate without even going through a metal detector. Literally no security screening; passengers and non-passengers alike. As a kid it was super exciting to go hang out at the gate to see someone off or to greet them coming out of the jetway. It was pretty routine to go have a meal with someone in one of the concourse restaurants before their flight, have a drink with them in one of the bars, etc.

Then there were metal detectors added in response to that first WTC attack. Anyone could still go to the gate to see someone off and/or greet them. If you could clear a metal detector, you were in.

Then of course 9/11 happened and all bets were off. Way more innocent (or perhaps naive) time.

it's friday, so i did a little sleuthing regarding the original terminal. i think the current layout is from 1969... here is an aerial from 1964. the two hangars just north of the old terminal are still there, so it provided a pretty good point of reference for both position and scale. here is a detail of the area and a comp showing where the terminal would be situated today. i linked the files since they're pretty big.

1964 usgs aerial (http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-1964.jpg)

composite between 1964 and now (http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png)
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-1964.jpg

This is what the terminal looked like when I first started flying.
16877

Would have been cool if during the major renovation that got us to our current look could have built some stylistic tribute to this original terminal.

it's friday, so i did a little sleuthing regarding the original terminal. i think the current layout is from 1969... here is an aerial from 1964. the two hangars just north of the old terminal are still there, so it provided a pretty good point of reference for both position and scale. here is a detail of the area and a comp showing where the terminal would be situated today. i linked the files since they're pretty big.

1964 usgs aerial (http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-1964.jpg)

composite between 1964 and now (http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png)
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-Comp.png
http://magnvs.de/pics/OKC-1964.jpg

So neat to find this info out. Thanks for the work you put into that composite image.

Prior to (I believe) the 1993 World Trade Center attack you could walk to the gate without even going through a metal detector. Literally no security screening; passengers and non-passengers alike. As a kid it was super exciting to go hang out at the gate to see someone off or to greet them coming out of the jetway. It was pretty routine to go have a meal with someone in one of the concourse restaurants before their flight, have a drink with them in one of the bars, etc.

Then there were metal detectors added in response to that first WTC attack. Anyone could still go to the gate to see someone off and/or greet them. If you could clear a metal detector, you were in.

Then of course 9/11 happened and all bets were off. Way more innocent (or perhaps naive) time.

And of course in the good old days they virtually never checked any identification or really even looked at the name on a ticket. If Mary wanted to fly and had a ticket in Joe's name all she had to do was have the boarding pass and walk on the plane. If they did ask for ID at check-in, Joe could show his ID and then hand his boarding pass to Mary.

Is there any chance OKC will have Clear once the expansion is fully open and operating?

16893

I'm curious about the laying of the tarmac surface at WRWA, and maybe there's a construction person out there who knows --- the tarmac is being laid. I saw where the workers first put down a base of sand and gravel, then on top of it, some kind of hard surface that looked to be about 8 to 10" thick. Now the final surface is being laid, well over a foot thick, and I'm wondering - a traditional concrete truck isn't being used, but instead, a dump truck that's feeding the concrete machine. Is this material concrete? Something else? I saw where no re-bar was used. What is this stuff? Thanks......

^

I've been watching that as well. See below for a larger photo.

I know they sometimes use those paving machines in highway construction. Concrete is poured into their hopper then a strip of pavement goes down at a calibrated depth.


I guess they do this in strips then fill in between with a more traditional concrete pour?

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wrwa060921a.jpg

16893

I'm curious about the laying of the tarmac surface at WRWA, and maybe there's a construction person out there who knows --- the tarmac is being laid. I saw where the workers first put down a base of sand and gravel, then on top of it, some kind of hard surface that looked to be about 8 to 10" thick. Now the final surface is being laid, well over a foot thick, and I'm wondering - a traditional concrete truck isn't being used, but instead, a dump truck that's feeding the concrete machine. Is this material concrete? Something else? I saw where no re-bar was used. What is this stuff? Thanks......

It's concrete, but really thick. They do this in the odd-looking strips so that they can insert the dowel rods into each panel so the pavement doesn't heave over time (IIRC). This type of truck can transport concrete faster, but it doesn't last as long. They use it when the concrete batch plant is located close enough.

It's concrete, but really thick. They do this in the odd-looking strips so that they can insert the dowel rods into each panel so the pavement doesn't heave over time (IIRC). This type of truck can transport concrete faster, but it doesn't last as long. They use it when the concrete batch plant is located close enough.

That all makes perfect sense. Thanks!

It's called a slipform paver and used for big jobs like this and highway construction. Once every other strip is done, the machine will be moved up to the completed grade and will straddle the unpoured section and pave those. They lay the rebar on chairs near the bottom of the pour as that is where concrete fails first. Once you see a crack on the top of concrete, it means the bottom has failed way before. A lot of changes happen underneath concrete that are not visible with settling, water intrusion, and soil shifting over time. Having the reinforcement at the bottom keeps it together for longer.

But, it is a rule of life. Ice cream melts and concrete cracks. Can't be avoided, only delayed.

Also, asphalt is becoming a common base material now for heavy-duty applications where enhanced longevity is desired. A crushed recycled-concrete base will be used and compacted, and then a 5-8" deep asphalt application, and then topped with re-inforced concrete.

The I-44 Turnpike reconstruction near Tulsa used this method. Crushed concrete base, asphalt on top of that, and then the final thickness being concrete applied from a slipform paver.

Sorry for the super late ask.

I'm flying out tomorrow, and coming back Wednesday. What's the parking strategy?

i think you had to pay a dime to activate the turnstile to get up there. my folks would tell me that was the original control tower, which may or may not be true.

I used to play board games in high school in the observation tower, carpeted walls and rarely busy, in OKC at that time nothing else to do on a Friday night that didn't involve underage drinking or unplanned pregnancy. The observation tower was safe and perfect. And yes you could go to the gates, the metal detector was right next to the bar with all the ferns and the bartenders wore vests circa 1978. You could literally ask her to hold your sambuca, slide through the detector, and she'd give you the glass on the other side.
As a side issue, having to pay with cash in the turnstile was what kept it so empty and a quiet place to play. There's a lesson there for the streetcar.

Is there any chance OKC will have Clear once the expansion is fully open and operating?

Fair question. But I have never seen anyone else in the TSA precheck queue besides me?

Prior to (I believe) the 1993 World Trade Center attack you could walk to the gate without even going through a metal detector. Literally no security screening; passengers and non-passengers alike. As a kid it was super exciting to go hang out at the gate to see someone off or to greet them coming out of the jetway. It was pretty routine to go have a meal with someone in one of the concourse restaurants before their flight, have a drink with them in one of the bars, etc.

Then there were metal detectors added in response to that first WTC attack. Anyone could still go to the gate to see someone off and/or greet them. If you could clear a metal detector, you were in.

Then of course 9/11 happened and all bets were off. Way more innocent (or perhaps naive) time.

I remember all this. I flew back from Europe in 1989 and there were metal detectors. I know because no one met me at the gate because my elderly grandmother couldn't get up from her wheelchair to walk through the detector, so they had to try to find a "respectful" way to search her. I remember thinking, huh, I guess we don't meet family at the gate anymore. And this was well before any WTC attacks, though post many hijacking attempts.

Sorry for the super late ask.

I'm flying out tomorrow, and coming back Wednesday. What's the parking strategy?

I drove around the loop yesterday to kill some time before work and the parking lot looked full. Lot 1 long term is closed and it looked like half of lot 2 was also closed. I think that might have to change soon looked pretty full to me. Of course there is the garage

Parking at Will Rogers is actually super cheap right now. I believe with the pandemic, prices were lowered. You can park for just $7 per day (as of last week, anyways).

I used to uber/lyft, which would be about $40 round trip from where I live. However, the parking is so cheap that you can basically park for 4-5 days and still come out on top.

Note: This is parking in the uncovered lots that a shuttle picks you up and takes you to the terminal.

Parking at Will Rogers is actually super cheap right now. I believe with the pandemic, prices were lowered. You can park for just $7 per day (as of last week, anyways).

I used to uber/lyft, which would be about $40 round trip from where I live. However, the parking is so cheap that you can basically park for 4-5 days and still come out on top.

Note: This is parking in the uncovered lots that a shuttle picks you up and takes you to the terminal.

Yeah, I think that's defined as lot #2 which I believe is the route I'm taking. That and I come back so late anyway that I don't want to wait for rideshare to come pick me up.

So I must've missed the earlier conversation about this, but we were back at WRWA for the first time since January 2020 and planned on grabbing food before flying, yet all the dining options in the main area by the security checkpoint are shuttered. What are the plans for filling those again? Really frustrating to have so few options to grab a quick bite before boarding.


e: \/\/ Ah, perfect, thank you!

So I must've missed the earlier conversation about this, but we were back at WRWA for the first time since January 2020 and planned on grabbing food before flying, yet all the dining options in the main area by the security checkpoint are shuttered. What are the plans for filling those again? Really frustrating to have so few options to grab a quick bite before boarding.

https://www.okctalk.com/content.php?r=719-Hatch-Osteria-Elemental-Coffee-and-Plenty-Mercantile-to-open-in-airport

I drove around the loop yesterday to kill some time before work and the parking lot looked full. Lot 1 long term is closed and it looked like half of lot 2 was also closed. I think that might have to change soon looked pretty full to me. Of course there is the garage

All of Lot#2 is now open. Lot#1 is currently still employee only parking. If you have any questions or concerns on airport parking give us a call at 405-316-3250.

Lot #1 Shuttle parking officially reopened this morning! If you have any airport parking questions please call 1-405-316-3250

Lot #1 Shuttle parking officially reopened this morning! If you have any airport parking questions please call 1-405-316-3250

Just a quick question if you don't mind I saw the sign that said credit card only. Is there a machine out there to pay as you leave or do you have to do it in the terminal?

Just a quick question if you don't mind I saw the sign that said credit card only. Is there a machine out there to pay as you leave or do you have to do it in the terminal?

yes lot#1 and lot#3 are currently credit card only. You can pay for your fee with your parking ticket in the airport when you return at any of the Parking kiosk pay stations located in baggage on the east side of baggage and west side of baggage located next to the exit doors. Also you can pay at the exit pay station in the parking lot itself located at the drive thru exit of both parking lots.

yes lot#1 and lot#3 are currently credit card only. You can pay for your fee with your parking ticket in the airport when you return at any of the Parking kiosk pay stations located in baggage on the east side of baggage and west side of baggage located next to the exit doors. Also you can pay at the exit pay station in the parking lot itself located at the drive thru exit of both parking lots.

But how can you take the ticket with you to pay at the indoor kiosk if you're supposed to leave it visible on the dash? Or is that not the procedure anymore?

Don’t leave it on the dash, the sun will wear away the writing if it’s left there too long, as I discovered one time.

Most parking tickets I have received in the last 5 or 6 years all around the country have specifically stated to not leave on dash. I used to leave them on dash as proof of admittance, but really it doesn’t make much sense logically because you can’t leave the lot without paying anyway. Most lots have a minimum fee for lost tickets. So they are going to get paid either way. Many operators also track license plates upon entry, or drive the lot overnight scanning them with a camera reader. No real need to ever leave a ticket.

But how can you take the ticket with you to pay at the indoor kiosk if you're supposed to leave it visible on the dash? Or is that not the procedure anymore?
the only thing you leave on dash is if you are parked in reserved premium parking and you have a reservation slip you place that slip on your dash. If you have any questions please contact Will Rogers Parking at 405-316-3250.

Thank you for helping inform others about this. There is signs currently being created to inform customers at the entrances of the ticket machines to not leave the tickets exposed to sunlight on the car dash. If you ever have any Airport parking questions on concerns please call 405-316-3250 they are there 24/7 to answer any and all of your parking questions or concerns

^Thanks all! Have to form a new habit!

Freddy's is taking a spot in the food court.

Wasn't this space last occupied by Tucker's?

HTTP://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/freddys070621a.jpg