First of all, Pete's right. Speculative office is not happening anytime soon. Office construction is going to be depressed for a long time. That's why I specified condo or hotel for my mythical 10-story building.

PluPan, there is a happy medium here. No, every significant building does not have to be downtown. I have no problem with NW Expressway/Penn and wouldn't mind seeing some upscale development along the Broadway Extension. I also don't mind the Kilpatrick between Broadway and McArthur. Every city has suburban business districts.

As a corollary, though, there are any number of studies that have shown that the healthiest cities are the ones that promote some density. OKC is doing it right. When did the city start to take off? It was when a concerted effort was made to establish the centrality of Downtown/Midtown/the river etc and to do some civic and institutional investment there. (MAPS). I know this is silly, but if you'd built the canal on Memorial Road and the Thunder Arena on 240 and relocated a brand new civic center to Mustang, we would not have had the success we have had. But back to commercial uses: I am glad that Devon Tower is downtown and not in a wheat field on I-35. Big corporations that want to invest in their city should think about what helps the city. It's not "small town" thinking to think this way.

It doesn't have to be either or. The suburban growth will come just as an inexorable part of life. Nobody sits at City Hall with a gun and says "You can not build your tall building north of 10th street."

it's in the suburbs now... imagine how far out this was when the buildings were built. i think the newest 'tall building' in the area is penn bank tower and that was built in '82 at the latest and others like founders tower were built in the 60's.

edit: i was wrong... according to the assessor's site, penn bank tower was built in 1984.
I need to go really research more of OKCs history. I was driving along lake Hefner and stopped to look at downtown and wow we really do have a second skyline and it almost blends in with downtown skyline.

First of all, Pete's right. Speculative office is not happening anytime soon. Office construction is going to be depressed for a long time. That's why I specified condo or hotel for my mythical 10-story building.

PluPan, there is a happy medium here. No, every significant building does not have to be downtown. I have no problem with NW Expressway/Penn and wouldn't mind seeing some upscale development along the Broadway Extension. I also don't mind the Kilpatrick between Broadway and McArthur. Every city has suburban business districts.

As a corollary, though, there are any number of studies that have shown that the healthiest cities are the ones that promote some density. OKC is doing it right. When did the city start to take off? It was when a concerted effort was made to establish the centrality of Downtown/Midtown/the river etc and to do some civic and institutional investment there. (MAPS). I know this is silly, but if you'd built the canal on Memorial Road and the Thunder Arena on 240 and relocated a brand new civic center to Mustang, we would not have had the success we have had. But back to commercial uses: I am glad that Devon Tower is downtown and not in a wheat field on I-35. Big corporations that want to invest in their city should think about what helps the city. It's not "small town" thinking to think this way.

It doesn't have to be either or. The suburban growth will come just as an inexorable part of life. Nobody sits at City Hall with a gun and says "You can not build your tall building north of 10th street."
All good points. I thought if a skyscraper was to be built outside of downtown this would be the best place for one.

There hasn't been anything taller than six floors built outside of downtown since the 80s.

As in approaching 40 years.

Maybe a few slightly taller in the health sciences area.

^^^ That is for the entire Metro Area or just OKC

^^^ That is for the entire Metro Area or just OKC

Can you name anything in all of Central Oklahoma?

It just doesn't happen any more.

^^^ maybe not in Oklahoma but it does elsewhere. I know Norman has some taller buildings I was thinking of the hotel by the airport isn’t it taller than 8 stories?

Can you name anything in all of Central Oklahoma?

It just doesn't happen any more.

opubco scrapes by in 1991 with 10 floors. but still... that's over 30 years ago so your point stands.

^^^ maybe not in Oklahoma but it does elsewhere. I know Norman has some taller buildings I was thinking of the hotel by the airport isn’t it taller than 8 stories?
i'm sure embassy suites and norman regional are taller than 6 stories... but hotels and hospitals aren't exactly office space.

Just consider the massive amount of development in Central Oklahoma over the last 40 years... Literally billions of dollars.

And zero tall buildings outside of downtown; and even downtown, only a few.

that moment i realized that it's friday afternoon... practically the weekend... and i'm spending time thinking about the number of tall buildings built in the okc metro.

i might as well be typing this in klingon. : )

Blah - at least it's "easy" to tear down if we ever get serious about developing density in this general area. Does seem like a huge missed opportunity for some sort of hub that connects with the BRT line and (seemingly less likely every year that passes) the proposed street car line up Classen.

I mean, just the BRT line alone, should dissolve the downtown connections for the 005, 007, and 008 and having a second transit hub at this location would make just unbelievable sense for the Embark route map given its proximity to the most important retail sector in the city, and its "halfway point" nature between all of the important stuff on Expressway + May + Memorial, and downtown. To say nothing of that transit hub being able to capitalize on the retail in the area if a big enough station were built.

I really think that's the highest and best use of this property surrounded by 44/Blackwelder/NWX/Classen.

Plus, this will produce $0.00 of sales tax on Sunday.

Blah - at least it's "easy" to tear down if we ever get serious about developing density in this general area. Does seem like a huge missed opportunity for some sort of hub that connects with the BRT line and (seemingly less likely every year that passes) the proposed street car line up Classen.

I mean, just the BRT line alone, should dissolve the downtown connections for the 005, 007, and 008 and having a second transit hub at this location would make just unbelievable sense for the Embark route map given its proximity to the most important retail sector in the city, and its "halfway point" nature between all of the important stuff on Expressway + May + Memorial, and downtown. To say nothing of that transit hub being able to capitalize on the retail in the area if a big enough station were built.

I really think that's the highest and best use of this property surrounded by 44/Blackwelder/NWX/Classen.

Plus, this will produce $0.00 of sales tax on Sunday.

This is really a negative for you? You do realize that at 6 days a week of being open, they blow out all other fast food restaurants in sales and bring in plenty of sales tax. More than most of the fancy restaurants around town. The problem with this property is it simply isnt that big for anything grand. A restaurant was about all it was good for.

This is really a negative for you? You do realize that at 6 days a week of being open, they blow out all other fast food restaurants in sales and bring in plenty of sales tax. More than most of the fancy restaurants around town. The problem with this property is it simply isnt that big for anything grand. A restaurant was about all it was good for.

It was a bit tongue-in-cheek. If OKC and our developers ever get serious about Belle Isle, I'm not worried we'll find a solution to this being developed. Realistically this will be a pit stop for a lot of out of towners, so its a net positive for now.

I'm also probably salty because I can walk here in 5 minutes and this will probably only increase my CFA intake by 5ish meals/year. Just doesn't move the needle that much for me.personally.

They've started dirtwork on the new Chik-fil-A, that intersection is about to become an absolute cluster.