I grew up in San Antonio and public transportation is horrible for a city of that size. Extremely poor planning on the cities part not even planning on implementing public transit.

I grew up in San Antonio and public transportation is horrible for a city of that size. Extremely poor planning on the cities part not even planning on implementing public transit.

You’re not wrong. Outside of the urban core, the city is very car dominant. But small improvements are being made.

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

That is ugly as sin. McMansion meets Disney fairy tale meets a builder who opted to do the design work themselves.

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

I've seen this house. It was built like this intentionally by the building-owner and if I recall there was a marker in front explaining the story.

The house was a couple that owned a business that is now bankrupt and they split. Going to be interesting to see if this thing ever sells. They really built it for themselves and now it is WAYYY too custom for most people to like.

LOL! That is a candidate for Zillow Gone Wild if I've ever seen one!

I think its very nice for the price. I just think it should have been built on a few ac.

I really like it. To each their own I guess.

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

That looks nothing like an authentic English manor. It’s more like an American meth dream of an English house.

Well I guess no one liked my house haha

On another note, the market in OKC is improving for homebuyers which is nice: https://kfor.com/news/local/oklahoma-city-market-appears-to-be-improving-for-homebuyers/

Well I guess no one liked my house haha

On another note, the market in OKC is improving for homebuyers which is nice: https://kfor.com/news/local/oklahoma-city-market-appears-to-be-improving-for-homebuyers/

I actually like it but needs a lot of decluttering

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

Looks like someone’s winning streak might’ve come to an end.

Well I guess no one liked my house haha

On another note, the market in OKC is improving for homebuyers which is nice: https://kfor.com/news/local/oklahoma-city-market-appears-to-be-improving-for-homebuyers/

Oklahomans are usually conservative and want to be cookie cutter. I think that house looks awesome.

Oklahomans are usually conservative and want to be cookie cutter. I think that house looks awesome.
I did too. If I had the money I’d buy that in a heartbeat.

There is a home in Deep Deuce that had a similar style that used to be for sale https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6-Blakeney-Pl-Oklahoma-City-OK-73104/245966146_zpid/

I did too. If I had the money I’d buy that in a heartbeat.

The backyard is admittedly great. I bet it sells ultimately for somewhere in the $600k-$700k range, due to the square footage. Look at the house on google maps to see the homes beside it. To say it doesn't fit the neighborhood is an understatement.

There is a home in Deep Deuce that had a similar style that used to be for sale https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6-Blakeney-Pl-Oklahoma-City-OK-73104/245966146_zpid/

How are these two homes comparable in any way? Drastically different styles. Different sizes. Different settings.

The backyard is admittedly great. I bet it sells ultimately for somewhere in the $600k-$700k range, due to the square footage. Look at the house on google maps to see the homes beside it. To say it doesn't fit the neighborhood is an understatement.

The house is 8500+ sq feet. No way it sells for less than $100 a square foot putting it at least at $850k

The house is 8500+ sq feet. No way it sells for less than $100 a square foot putting it at least at $850k

You are probably right. But I bet $100 a sq foot is it's ceiling. It's just too big in the neighborhood was built in. And the style is quite particular.

The house is 8500+ sq feet. No way it sells for less than $100 a square foot putting it at least at $850k
it might find just the right buyer... but to me it has a style that requires a very specific buyer, it's way overbuilt for the neighborhood it's in (the neighboring houses are 2000-3000 sq. feet), it only has two garage spaces, it's essentially a 1982 era house that has been added on to multiple times and the layout shows. i suspect that an inspection is going to reveal some serious functional issues. i could maybe see it going for around $700k-750k if the owner is willing/able to go that low.

How are these two homes comparable in any way? Drastically different styles. Different sizes. Different settings.

I more meant the castle-theme. Lots of heavy woods and iron finishes.

You never want to be the biggest house in the neighborhood. Esp when the size difference is that drastic. This is what happens when you build your "dream home" surrounded by not dream homes. This will take a while to sell.

It is a design atrocity! But, as noted here, there are people on OKCTalk that like it. :)

You never want to be the biggest house in the neighborhood. Esp when the size difference is that drastic. This is what happens when you build your "dream home" surrounded by not dream homes. This will take a while to sell.It really surprised me a few years ago when a house I had previously had built blew up and took two others with it. Average size of the neighborhood was 1300 to 1400 sq ft. The three new houses were closer to 2500.

I've noticed that houses in our neighborhood aren't selling as fast as the signs appear lately. I know of 4 that have had signs in the yards for a few weeks.

I was browsing Facebook and saw a beautiful house for sale I was for sure was located in Britain somewhere but turns out it’s for sale in Norman: https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/nation-world/national/article263733628.html

Direct Zillow link: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/402-Scarlet-St-Norman-OK-73072/21743795_zpid/?utm_campaign=iosappmessage&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=txtshare

this one is still on the market, down from $1.5M to just $875k.

What is a rough construction cost $ / sq ft for single family stick built on an owned lot, just standard level quality, like a 3 bd /2 bath ? Okc metro area?

What is a rough construction cost $ / sq ft for single family stick built on an owned lot, just standard level quality, like a 3 bd /2 bath ? Okc metro area?
Not exact but I know a couple that are looking at new around 1700sq ft houses in Mustang and they're seeing 310,000 to 340,000. So by that it would be 182 to 200 per sq ft.

this one is still on the market, down from $1.5M to just $875k.
Good deal if they keep lowering the price I might be able to pull out my checkbook. ;)

Great report from The Frontier about the housing market issues in OKC: https://www.readfrontier.org/stories/oklahoma-citys-affordable-housing-stock-continues-to-shrink-while-rents-spike/?fbclid=IwAR1rbZWQV4gV_gEjJeDL-4TZ0Q8u3mlcS-3Y18yzcTesyh8DieTTdxru51w

Another article about this issue: https://freepressokc.com/okc-housing-availability-affected-by-airbnb-other-homeshares-biz/

Rental market has seen a massive increase, one of the largest in the country in fact:


OKC had the largest year-over-year increase in the country, with a 24.1% increase in rent compared to last year.

- https://okcfox.com/news/local/oklahoma-city-sees-fastest-rent-increase-in-the-nation-housing-crisis-usa-zillow-rentcom-board-member-of-mlsok-licensed-instructor-in-real-estate-rent-help-affordable-cheap-cheapest-best-apartment-house-first-month-jasmine-pratt-peter-levinson#

Rental market has seen a massive increase, one of the largest in the country in fact:



- https://okcfox.com/news/local/oklahoma-city-sees-fastest-rent-increase-in-the-nation-housing-crisis-usa-zillow-rentcom-board-member-of-mlsok-licensed-instructor-in-real-estate-rent-help-affordable-cheap-cheapest-best-apartment-house-first-month-jasmine-pratt-peter-levinson#

Not too surprising given inflation + market conditions. It will be interesting to see what happens in '23 given economic outlook & conditions now. The unfortunate part is that a lot of renters who wanted to buy since 2020 - present but couldn't are now completely priced out of the market with rates and thus have no other option but to rent. We really need focus more on homeownership education for young people so they aren't in these situations.

I am not an expert but the feeling I get is so many people want their first house to be like their parents move up house. What happened to starter homes? My first house was 700 sq ft 2 bed, 1 bath on 2 ac. It turned out to be a good deal. First it got me it to a house I could afford, second it was a place I could keep my horses, and third it was a great investment. It more then doubled the value in the two years I owned it. I was able to divide it up into lots and sold it to someone who build starter homes. I was able to take the money, move a bit farther out and buy 10 ac and build a bit larger home. Point being, your first home may not be exactly your dream home but it beats renting and builds equity. Most will not fall into the deal that i did. Still that starter home be it a small one bed or a small 3 bed is usually better then a rental. Maybe builders need to start building small 2 bed 1 1/2 bath 700 to 1200 sq ft starters on small lots. What i am seeing near me in Edmond for 1500 sq ft homes on small 6000 sq ft lots is $$ for what they get and I would not call them starters. Just my 3 cents. Sorry inflation.

I agree with a lot of that. I am at the age where the first wave of my friends is starting to have kids in college. Apartments in college towns now have gourmet kitchens with granite countertops, private bathrooms for each bedroom, swimming pools, spas, "amenity spaces" and the like. Some of these kids eventually move back in with their parents after they graduate for a while. They never go through the "slumming" stage during school or in a first apartment or two. They think all places of residence should look like the house their parents worked 20 years for.

I know I am overgeneralizing but this has been a topic of conversation in my friend group of late.

Blame HGTV and Instagram.

Everyone wants a magazine-ready house.

It is a bit more complicated with apartments.

My partner and I have a starter house (i.e., complete fixer-upper) in the city and for a couple years had an apartment in Stillwater while he finishes his PhD. There was at least one student he taught in the same apartment complex - which had mold in the bathroom before we even moved in, the windows wouldn't completely seal and buffalo gnats would get in and bite him (causing allergic reactions), mold was growing from the AC registers, the outlets were all broken with chunks missing where you plug things in, there was literally a dead rat in the hallway for months, we replaced the fire extinguisher and smoke detector in the apartment since they wouldn't respond and correct the issue even though, per the lease, they were responsible for it, and this list just goes on. Hell, even the breaker panel had a recall from early 2000s for starting fires - as in if it were inspected, it would fail inspection.

It was so bad, I was looking at houses in the area to buy because I didn't feel safe with him living there. Sadly, that is what $500/mo gets you, the $450/mo apartment we found literally had part of the ceiling collapsing in. So why would someone not get a roommate or two and go for a $1,200-1,500/mo apartment? You each pay about the same amount as you would for a condemnable apartment, but you aren't exposed to the same health hazards.

I bought my first house in 1978 at the age of 23. 1160 sq ft 3 bedroom, 1 and 1/2 bath, brick with 2 car garage, 60x140 lot in Warr Acres. Cost was $35500. It was very affordable for me on a single person income with no kids. Using the inflation calculator here https://www.aier.org/cost-of-living-calculator/?utm_source=Google%20Ads&utm_medium=Google%20CPC&utm_campaign=COLA&gclid=Cj0KCQiA1NebBhDDARIsAANiDD3eMK8qN5g5YFMNc0oB hZZo8QJV_2EbJ9EKknYwANLl_k-ENlbPTeEaApQAEALw_wcB that $35500 cost would be equivalent to $158000 today. I see a lot of similar houses today in that price range. And back in 1978 my interest rate on that house with a 30 year mortgage was 9.5% with 10% down with a FHA loan.

I am not an expert but the feeling I get is so many people want their first house to be like their parents move up house. What happened to starter homes? My first house was 700 sq ft 2 bed, 1 bath on 2 ac. It turned out to be a good deal. First it got me it to a house I could afford, second it was a place I could keep my horses, and third it was a great investment. It more then doubled the value in the two years I owned it. I was able to divide it up into lots and sold it to someone who build starter homes. I was able to take the money, move a bit farther out and buy 10 ac and build a bit larger home. Point being, your first home may not be exactly your dream home but it beats renting and builds equity. Most will not fall into the deal that i did. Still that starter home be it a small one bed or a small 3 bed is usually better then a rental. Maybe builders need to start building small 2 bed 1 1/2 bath 700 to 1200 sq ft starters on small lots. What i am seeing near me in Edmond for 1500 sq ft homes on small 6000 sq ft lots is $$ for what they get and I would not call them starters. Just my 3 cents. Sorry inflation.

Well done. But that takes patience, sacrifice, and compromise.... things not in abundance these days. Too many feel entitled to start at a much higher level and they don't understand and generally have little real appreciation for what their parents did to get to where they are. They don't know what they don't know.

I bought my first house in 1978 at the age of 23. 1160 sq ft 3 bedroom, 1 and 1/2 bath, brick with 2 car garage, 60x140 lot in Warr Acres. Cost was $35500. It was very affordable for me on a single person income with no kids. Using the inflation calculator here https://www.aier.org/cost-of-living-calculator/?utm_source=Google%20Ads&utm_medium=Google%20CPC&utm_campaign=COLA&gclid=Cj0KCQiA1NebBhDDARIsAANiDD3eMK8qN5g5YFMNc0oB hZZo8QJV_2EbJ9EKknYwANLl_k-ENlbPTeEaApQAEALw_wcB that $35500 cost would be equivalent to $158000 today. I see a lot of similar houses today in that price range. And back in 1978 my interest rate on that house with a 30 year mortgage was 9.5% with 10% down with a FHA loan.

The problem with that comparison is that for a $158,000 house (which I agree would be considered entry-level today) you need a $30,000 down payment. That can be a pretty hefty amount for a 23 year old, especially with student loans. I'm also not sure that starting salaries have risen at the same pace as the cost of housing.

The problem with that comparison is that for a $158,000 house (which I agree would be considered entry-level today) you need a $30,000 down payment. That can be a pretty hefty amount for a 23 year old, especially with student loans. I'm also not sure that starting salaries have risen at the same pace as the cost of housing.

That's if you put the full 20% down, which is not a requirement. There's plenty of options out there to put less down and pay the monthly PMI until you're in a spot to put additional cash down, refinance, or ride out the PMI payments until you get to 20% equity.

The problem with that comparison is that for a $158,000 house (which I agree would be considered entry-level today) you need a $30,000 down payment. That can be a pretty hefty amount for a 23 year old, especially with student loans. I'm also not sure that starting salaries have risen at the same pace as the cost of housing.I can see this. I really don't know how first time home buyers in their 20s have a shot. I was very lucky when I was that age. I'm very mechanical. I bought a 600sq ft house off of NW 19th & May for $6000 in 1978 when I was 19. Gutted and redid everything then lived there for a couple years. Sold it for $16000. Bought a 1200sq ft house on NW 34th & Hammond. Did pretty much the same but went on the make the one car garage a den and built an over sized two car garage. Lived there for a couple years and then doubled my investment. Bought a new house then. After leaving wife #1 I started the whole process over. But not everyone has the ability to do that.

Some of that can be attributed to student loan debt.

Some of that can be attributed to student loan debt.

Indeed.

I bought my first house at age 28 for $138,000. I was able to put the 20 percent down, but ...
I had had a pretty good job since graduation and the ability to save month over month for 5 years.
I did not have student loans.
I did not have health issues.
I did not have kids at an early age.

Even then it was tight.

I guess the above "shows my privilege" but many people don't get to have that confluence of factors. And in the 20 years since, the prices and the debt have only accelerated. In many respects, it's understandable that people in their 30s are just now in a position to buy for the first time.

It's also possible that younger persons don't want the hassle of homeownership. Especially if you move for work or better quality of life, owning a home ties up a lot of your liquidity. It's one thing if you live in a hot market and plan to make $ when you move on, but in OKC you'll likely lose money if you don't stay put at least 4 years. I bought my first home 15 years and if I could swing losing the mortgage deduction, I'd rather rent in a higher density city and use the cash out to invest in REITs. I hate being my own landlord. Maybe Okies don't have to move as often as other places? More families?

The problem with that comparison is that for a $158,000 house (which I agree would be considered entry-level today) you need a $30,000 down payment. That can be a pretty hefty amount for a 23 year old, especially with student loans. I'm also not sure that starting salaries have risen at the same pace as the cost of housing.

How is that different than my $3500 down payment for a 23 year old in 1978? Or the 9.5% interest rate I had to pay? Even in 1996 when I bought my 2nd house on a 15 year mortgage I paid a 7.125% interest rate. For years young people could get mortgages for 3-4%. Maybe less on refinances. I chuckle when I hear complains about rates approaching 7% now. Welcome to how buying a house was except for the last 15-20 years or so.

I wished that I was able to have had a 9.5% interest rate on my first house. I was 3 months on the job at the Edmond Fire Dept in 1981. That 700 sq ft house on 2 ac was $42,000. I did have a decent down payment but when you understand that I was the third woman that attempted to work as a firefighter and the first two only lasted a very short time, one does not want to go over their head in debt and the mortgage company. I made it 27yrs and as I posted sold it 2 yrs later at a nice profit. Some times your first place is far from your dream place but you have to look long term.Start small, save and later get a better place.

Median income for OKC is $31,450. Couple that with student loans and it is easy to see homes out of reach. I'd be curious as to available properties for someone making 31,450 and a payment of 30% of take home

At that income level i would think it would be challenging to get an apartment that is not about to fall down, has black mold, has drug problems etc. As you said someone with that income, take out taxes, SS, other deductions. Then take out student debt. Sounds like they better move back in with their parents or other family. Housing is out of reach for them. Maybe they could rent a room and mow the grass for an older person.

Median income for OKC is $31,450. Couple that with student loans and it is easy to see homes out of reach. I'd be curious as to available properties for someone making 31,450 and a payment of 30% of take home

Oh please. Anyone with student loan debt should have a degree and be making well above the median income.

Yah, anyone with any kind of decent degree or even without that wants to work can find something that will pay more then that. I guess if you received your degree in computer gaming (not game programming and yes there is such a degree that requires no history, science, math etc I guess you do have limited options to use it. How i know, a friend in another state has a daughter that got that one and so did her boy friend, its basically how to get the top score in computer games)

other lower cost housing options, buy a small house in Guthrie, Luther or a mobile on a half ac and save save save. Work 2 jobs. Dont spend money on just stuff. Work save, have a cheap to own and drive small car. Again save. Minimal clothing that fits ones job. Have nothing fancy for a number of years and take your lunch, do low cost meals. Save save save. Ok then move up. Stay far away from debt.

Median income for OKC is $31,450. Couple that with student loans and it is easy to see homes out of reach. I'd be curious as to available properties for someone making 31,450 and a payment of 30% of take home

I would be interested to know where that number came from? I've almost always seen >$50k for median in OKC and even Oklahoma at large. That's a pretty huge discrepancy.

https://www.google.com/search?q=oklahoma+median+income&sxsrf=ALiCzsYKifTMeR1k28qKjcI0jC2howUzvg%3A1668743 511523&source=hp&ei=VwF3Y8W5HIqmqtsPqdG7uAI&iflsig=AJiK0e8AAAAAY3cPZ6RWjpWwrgY7tZG4lBXjvRB5bC-g&oq=oklahoma+median&gs_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAEYADIKCAAQgAQQRhD7ATIFCAAQgAQ yBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFC AAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDoNCC4QxwEQrwEQ6gIQJzoHCCM Q6gIQJzoECCMQJzoFCAAQkQI6BQguEIAEOggILhCABBDUAjoLC C4QgAQQxwEQ0QM6CAguELEDEIAEOgsIABCABBCxAxCDAToLCC4 QgAQQsQMQgwE6CwguEIAEEMcBEK8BOgsILhCABBCxAxDUAjoRC C4QgAQQsQMQgwEQxwEQrwE6CwguENQCELEDEIAEOggIABCABBC xAzoRCC4QgAQQsQMQgwEQxwEQ0QM6EQguEIMBEK8BEMcBELEDE IAEOg4ILhCABBDHARCvARDUAlD8BlirQmDGXGgBcAB4AIABwAK IAa4SkgEHMy44LjIuMpgBAKABAbABCg&sclient=gws-wiz

https://www.google.com/search?q=oklahoma+city+median+income&sxsrf=ALiCzsaS5tpkNo0TezgNrx6dkwpnWUVrIg%3A1668743 524677&ei=ZAF3Y5LxKIWnqtsP57ivmAg&ved=0ahUKEwiSs4mI6rb7AhWFk2oFHWfcC4MQ4dUDCA8&uact=5&oq=oklahoma+city+median+income&gs_lcp=Cgxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAQAzIKCAAQgAQQRhD7ATIFCAA QgAQyBggAEAcQHjIECAAQHjIECAAQHjIFCAAQhgMyBQgAEIYDM gUIABCGAzoKCAAQRxDWBBCwAzoHCAAQsAMQQzoMCAAQgAQQDRB GEPsBOgcIABCABBANOggIABAFEB4QDToMCCMQsAIQJxBGEPsBS gQIQRgASgQIRhgAUJQIWLkPYLEjaAFwAXgAgAFoiAG5A5IBAzQ uMZgBAKABAcgBCsABAQ&sclient=gws-wiz-serp

I would be interested to know where that number came from? I've almost always seen >$50k for median in OKC and even Oklahoma at large. That's a pretty huge discrepancy.

2020 US Census Bureau
The number you cite is for household.(56,456)

Oh please. Anyone with student loan debt should have a degree and be making well above the median income.

See post #225 where the poster ( at age 28)had optimal factors regarding health, no children, no student loans and good employment opportunities. Not typical for most.

See post #225 where the poster ( at age 28)had optimal factors regarding health, no children, no student loans and good employment opportunities. Not typical for most.

You are the one coupling someone with student loan debt with being a median income earner. And it was tough for me at times back in 1978 when I bought my first home. Lots of things I did without so I could be a home owner and not a renter.

My father was able to go to pay for college, and buy an Oldsmobile 442 and still save for a home in 1971. By working nights as a janitor at the old wonderbread plant. My wife and I are in our 40’s we pay $2500/monthly for student loans. While our mortgage is $875 for our 1200 sq ft home in Coronado heights. Boomers are completely out of touch with the struggles of todays income earners

My father was able to go to pay for college, and buy an Oldsmobile 442 and still save for a home in 1971. By working nights as a janitor at the old wonderbread plant. My wife and I are in our 40’s we pay $2500/monthly for student loans. While our mortgage is $875 for our 1200 sq ft home in Coronado heights. Boomers are completely out of touch with the struggles of todays income earners

I mean we have it so much better than they did back then with massive jobs programs like the WPA slapping everyone in the face with generous wages and training. My situation is much better than what they had with that giant albatross around their necks