If the Barons are going to be around long term, Prodigal won't be involved, they have turned their focus to soccer, most of us fans realize this. Heck, this Saturday the Barons game is at 8:00 and the doors aren't opening until 7:30, 30 minutes before (ALWAYS an hour before). I haven't gotten an explanation, but my guess is all the staff will be at the Energy game and then SOME will come work the Barons game.

Also, the Energy haven't played a single game and have THEIR OWN STORE. Only way to get Barons gear is at games and online.

Cox Convention Center :: Oklahoma City Memorial Marathon Health and Fitness Expo & Race Packet Pick-up (http://www.coxconventioncenter.com/default.asp?cox=25&objId=366)

Here's the reason the doors are opening late. If you had asked anyone like a ticket rep, they would have told you this instead of just assuming. Just thought you would like to know. I found out when I asked mine if the time was correct and why...

Cox Convention Center :: Oklahoma City Memorial Marathon Health and Fitness Expo & Race Packet Pick-up (http://www.coxconventioncenter.com/default.asp?cox=25&objId=366)

Here's the reason the doors are opening late. If you had asked anyone like a ticket rep, they would have told you this instead of just assuming. Just thought you would like to know. I found out when I asked mine if the time was correct and why...

Yeah, it was posted on Facebook not long after I made the post.

Another tough loss in OT last night. Down 2-0 and have to win 3 straight in Texas to advance.

If Tulsa and/or Wichita were to get an American Hockey League franchise the interest might renew some great rivalries. Until then, the Barons will either need to double-up with the Thunder and share the Chesapeake Energy Arena (IHC: 12,000-18,036 seats) or move to the Jim Norick State Fair Arena (IHC: 9,750 seats) where they could possibly survive on a lower budget. An AHL team in the Peake could use the lower bowl seating.

IMO the Cox Convention Center Arena seems to have lost its appeal being across from the Peake.


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

If Tulsa and/or Wichita were to get an American Hockey League franchise the interest might renew some great rivalries. Until then, the Barons will either need to double-up with the Thunder and share the Chesapeake Energy Arena (IHC: 12,000-18,036 seats) or move to the Jim Norick State Fair Arena (IHC: 9,750 seats) where they could possibly survive on a lower budget. An AHL team in the Peake could use the lower bowl seating.

IMO the Cox Convention Center Arena seems to have lost its appeal being across from the Peake.


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

But if people don't want to go to The Cox Center, will they want to go instead to the State Fairgrounds? That might be a tough sell. I remember going to Blazers games at the fairgrounds during the first coupe of years they were back. Not sure about now, but back then it was pretty spartan, compared to the Myriad.
Also, the stated reason that Funk Jr shuttered the Blazers was that he was unable to rework a lease with the city to play at the Ford Center. Have things changed so much in the last few years that the city will NOW grant a reworked lease? Or was all of that just BS in the first place?

i'd probably go to fewer Barons games if they moved to the fairgrounds. part of the allure to us is being able to enjoy some downtown attractions before or after games

I go to a lot of barons games, and the cox center is just depressing. I don't know how long their lease is with CC but trying to rework a lease with CHK might bring better crowds. we know the city likes hockey (there was 8,800+ at the exhibition game between the stars and oilers back in Sept) so it should def explore that option. its like going to see the same movie at kickingbird vs the warren. just a better overall experience.

But if people don't want to go to The Cox Center, will they want to go instead to the State Fairgrounds? That might be a tough sell. I remember going to Blazers games at the fairgrounds during the first coupe of years they were back. Not sure about now, but back then it was pretty spartan, compared to the Myriad.
Also, the stated reason that Funk Jr shuttered the Blazers was that he was unable to rework a lease with the city to play at the Ford Center. Have things changed so much in the last few years that the city will NOW grant a reworked lease? Or was all of that just BS in the first place?

Borchard, your hatred for Funk is endless. Funk lost the lease because the thunder did not want to share the same arena with some bush league single A hockey team. If you wanted the blazers to stay at Ford center your beef should be with Bennet and the thunder not Funk. No one not even you Borchard would have been able to renew the lease.

i'd probably go to fewer Barons games if they moved to the fairgrounds. part of the allure to us is being able to enjoy some downtown attractions before or after games
Ditto... talk about a DOWNGRADE in fan experience... I can't understand Laramie's love affair with that arena. The Cox isn't great but it isn't THAT bad. Would I prefer it to be in The Peake? Absolutely, but there have been several schedule conflicts with Thunder games since the Barons have been here (that surely could be resolved, but not sure how easily) and the overhead between the two facilities has got to be significantly different as far as leasing goes.

Borchard, your hatred for Funk is endless. Funk lost the lease because the thunder did not want to share the same arena with some bush league single A hockey team. If you wanted the blazers to stay at Ford center your beef should be with Bennet and the thunder not Funk. No one not even you Borchard would have been able to renew the lease.
That may be, but I didn't call him any names, or wish ill on his offspring there. I simply stated what HE said was the reason he folded the Blazers. Go back to the Oklahoman's archives and read for yourself.

OKC Blazers cease operations; city to talk with AHL team | News OK (http://newsok.com/okc-blazers-cease-operations-city-to-talk-with-ahl-team/article/3382433?custom_click=masthead_topten)


The Oklahoma City Blazers have suspended operations after failing to renew their lease with Oklahoma City to play in the Ford Center or Cox Center, a team official said Thursday...The Blazers did not renew their lease with the Ford Center after months of negotiations. According to city documents, the city and SMG were going to grant the Blazers a three-year renewal, but the Blazers have retracted the deal.

After 17 Years, Oklahoma City Blazers Fold Up Shop in the CHL - Defending Big D (http://www.defendingbigd.com/2009/7/3/937441/after-17-years-oklahoma-city)

announced on July 1 they were suspending operations for the upcoming season after failing to agree with the city on a new lease.
So apparently, maybe even I could have been able to renew the lease. The city and SMG were planning to do it. It was Funk who nixed it. No hatred there, just facts.

And btw, the Blazers were bush league AA, not bush league single A, as you so elegantly put it.

Nothing wrong with the Myriad as a hockey venue that 5000 passionate screaming fans wouldn't cure. Fact the legendary John Brooks fired by Jr. felt the team lost their nice home ice advantage with the move to the Ford Center.

Ditto... talk about a DOWNGRADE in fan experience... I can't understand Laramie's love affair with that arena. The Cox isn't great but it isn't THAT bad. Would I prefer it to be in The Peake? Absolutely, but there have been several schedule conflicts with Thunder games since the Barons have been here (that surely could be resolved, but not sure how easily) and the overhead between the two facilities has got to be significantly different as far as leasing goes.


..."I can't understand Laramie's love affair with that arena." You know me well, Of Sound Mind! Appreciate your keen observation.

It was our first 'operable' arena following the demise of the ancient old Stockyard's Coliseum--truly miss that old lady. Smaller arena (9,750 seats) with plenty of open parking would provide IMO a better more cozy atmosphere without hiding seats. The city could provide more upgrades like a 'new roof' that doesn't leak or sag--looks like it may collapse any minute. The 'cons' as many of you have highlighted; non access to Bricktown or any quality food establishments; these amenities does enhance the 'family' experience.

If the downtown Staples Center in Los Angeles can schedule two NBA franchises (Clippers, Lakers) and one NHL franchise (Kings) in one building; why is it difficult for a scheduled matrix with an NBA and AHL franchise in the Chesapeake Energy Arena? The NBA doesn't like to have an active ice plant underneath the court. Does anyone know how Atlanta, Dallas, Los Angeles, Philadelphia and a few other cities address the problem where the arena is shared with the NBA-NHL?

Personally, I would prefer the Peake's lower bowl as a preference to the Cox Convention Center Arena--that place has served its life expectancy as a viable downtown venue. The city should go ahead with plans to either gut the lower (5,500-seats) or upper bowl (7,500-seats) for a smaller arena with more exhibition space or demolish the place once the new convention center is constructed. At one time they talked about keeping the upper bowl as a second floor arena for events (other than ice hockey/basketball) like dog, horse shows and Red Earth Native American Festival activities. As to any of these options being great alternatives would have more to do with the structure's capability of support for any of the options mentions.


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

Nothing wrong with the Myriad as a hockey venue that 5000 passionate screaming fans wouldn't cure. Fact the legendary John Brooks fired by Jr. felt the team lost their nice home ice advantage with the move to the Ford Center.
I so miss John Brooks! Best sports announcer ever IMHO

Albany 3,360
Oklahoma City 3,348
Abbotsford 3,007
Portland 2,185


For the love of Christ.....somebody please put this team out of its misery. It was embarrassing two years ago but it's just overkill at this point.

Oklahoma City does not deserve a professional hockey team in the American Hockey League. It's simply not a hockey town.

For the love of Christ.....somebody please put this team out of its misery. It was embarrassing two years ago but it's just overkill at this point.

Oklahoma City does not deserve a professional hockey team in the American Hockey League. It's simply not a hockey town.

I always find it funny when people start saying a city deserves or does not deserve a sports team. It is something between a business and a hobby depending on the owner. On the development side for the Oilers it is a pretty nice city to have an affiliate in; we are like the 6th largest city in the league and have a lot more amenities for the players they send than most of the cities, better access by air, warmer weather, since Abbotsford's team is moving we will pretty much be tied for closest city to the Oilers, any losses are absorbed by the local owner and (take this with a grain of salt because most of the time few bad things are said for PR) they have commented they are happy with how the local management is running things. So at this point as long as the local owners think they can build up an audience or want to keep this level of hockey they probably will be able to extend the contract.

For the love of Christ.....somebody please put this team out of its misery. It was embarrassing two years ago but it's just overkill at this point.

Oklahoma City does not deserve a professional hockey team in the American Hockey League. It's simply not a hockey town.
Funny thing is, we USED TO BE a hockey town. People LOVED the Blazers. It's embarrassing to see that they had a playoff game and only 1,200 people showed up. I think it's interesting when people say, "Well if you supported the Blazers, and you don't support the barons, then you are not a "real" hockey fan..."
Fine, I'm not I guess. I loved the Blazers, and so did alot of other people. I haven't been to a Barons game in over 2 years. I just don't care.
Here is the attendance for The Central Hockey League, the one we used to be in:
7687
Tulsa draws right at 5K. Wichita still draws just over 5K. Drawing 5K, and driving to games, seems to be more feasible than drawing <3 and flying to Abbottsford, BC

barons lost last night 4-2 to the texas stars, ending their season.

Are town really "hockey towns" or "baseball towns?" It seems that people will go to the best product. OKC is now considered a "basketball town" when people didn't care 10 years ago... Move the Thunder out and bring the Yankees in and it'll be a "baseball town." Obviously, there is not much enthusiasm for the Barons.

We just need an ownership group to market (promote) the team. You don't need a 'Saturday Automobile give-away to promote hockey.

The Thunder has had a direct impact on hockey in OKC because of their notoriety and popularity. You have the same concerns with AHL franchises in Charlotte, Milwaukee and San Antonio where the AHL has to compete with the NBA; granted Charlotte, Milwaukee and San Antonio are much larger markets with 300,000 to 1 million more inhabitants. Their AHL franchise share the same venue as their NBA counterparts.

OKC finally elevated from 'AA' CHL city to a 'AAA' AHL city after the NBA Thunder had taken the city by storm. IMO, mistake one--the AHL Barons established themselves in the old Myriad former home of the Blazers. The Blazers enjoyed its final curtain in the Chesapeake Energy Arena (Ford Center). When the Barons arrived they went to the Cox Convention Center Arena (Myriad) which appeared to make the AHL less appealing.

The Blazers were drawing crowds of 5,000-7,000 before the debacle between Funk Jr., & Lund. Give Lund credit; he said that Oklahoma City wasn't a 'hockey town' but a 'Blazertown.' As dankrutka questioned, the label you attempt to put on a town according to a sport doesn't have merit.

The Funk group held on to PA announcer 'Ben Buckland' who sounds about as 'country' as cornbread & buttermilk. Buckland is a great individual; however, the AHL should have rebranded itself instead of accepting the Blazers' 'hand-me downs' (Buckland & the Myriad) becoming the 'second-hand Rose' Barons.

The 'Prodigal son' (Funk Jr.,) didn't like Brad was using dad's money and took over the reigns of a horse he had never rode. It's been a 'repeat' scenario of the Funks' trying to operate on a low budget without the basic operations' knowledge. The AHL will fail in OKC if someone doesn't rescue (with capital) and rebrand the AHL Barons. The level of play from the CHL vs. the 'superior play' of the AHL is like night & day. We have a great product in the American Hockey League.


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

Are town really "hockey towns" or "baseball towns?" It seems that people will go to the best product. OKC is now considered a "basketball town" when people didn't care 10 years ago... Move the Thunder out and bring the Yankees in and it'll be a "baseball town." Obviously, there is not much enthusiasm for the Barons.
... or, swap out the Thunder with the 66ers and the Barons with the Avalanche and see how lame basketball attendance becomes.

Funny thing is, we USED TO BE a hockey town. People LOVED the Blazers.
Different sports landscape in town, now. Get used to it.

Can't blame this flop on Buckland, or the Thunder. The Blazers drew 6500 their last year in existence. It's Funk Jr's baby. Even the savvy hockey fans fired up about the upgrade jumped off the sinking ship.

Different sports landscape in town, now. Get used to it.
I guess I did. i don't go to hockey games anymore

I guess I did. i don't go to hockey games anymore

Maybe we should blame this hockey flop on YOU, then. Maybe you're unknowingly the god of hockey attendance, and if you only went, more would.

Borchard wants to be in a league with Allen, texas, St Charles Missouri, Independence Missouri, and Brampton Canada.
those are huge thriving cities on the brink of getting a major league team.

Sorry we are better than A hockey... Last time the blazers were in town they had no affiliation with any nhl team or anything. It was an independent league, just like the independent leagues in baseball. Sorry I don't think the Sugarland skeeters are equivalent of the Tulsa drillers.

Maybe your boy Brad Lund can bring the blazers back at the state fair arena...

Im still on the ship. Having a great time. If it sinks so be it.

Maybe we should blame this hockey flop on YOU, then. Maybe you're unknowingly the god of hockey attendance, and if you only went, more would.

I know. DAMN YOU, Brad!

Borchard wants to be in a league with Allen, texas, St Charles Missouri, Independence Missouri, and Brampton Canada.
those are huge thriving cities on the brink of getting a major league team.
And right now, we're in a league with;
Abbotsford (Nope, sorry. They're leaving town)
Glens Falls, NY. Have you ever been there? I have. It's smaller than Durant.
Albany, NY. Woo Hoo! Capital city!
Bridgeport, CT
Binghamton, NY (It's the same size as Stillwater)
Manchester, NH (Now this is a BIG city. It's the size of Norman)
Portland (Maine, NOT Oregon. That WOULD be cool! But this one s a little bigger than Moore)


Sorry we are better than A hockey... Based on what, exactly? And once again, the CHL is AA, NOT A

Last time the blazers were in town they had no affiliation with any nhl team or anything. It was an independent league, just like the independent leagues in baseball. And your point?

Sorry I don't think the Sugarland skeeters are equivalent of the Tulsa drillers.
Nobody said they were. But you're not actually giving an apples-to-apples comparison.
The Blazers were the equivalent (minus the official affiliation, which you seem to lust after) of the Tulsa Drillers...AA
And btw, the Sugar land Skeeters averaged TWICE the attendance of the Oklahoma City Barons. Probably shouldn't have used them as an example, for a couple of reasons...

Maybe your boy Brad Lund can bring the blazers back at the state fair arena...
That would be fine with me. And I will bet you $10 right now (I'm cheap) that if he DID bring back the Blazers, AND they played at the fairgrounds (which wouldn't be my first choice) they would STILL outdraw the Barons.

It was great when they revived the CHL in the early 90s--Dallas, Fort Worth, Memphis, Oklahoma City, Tulsa & Wichita. The NHL moved into the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex and the whole landscape of the league changed. The CHL started to spread out (Macon, GA). It wasn't the town but the nickname 'Whoopee;' was this about a musical or a play on words (Whoopee) sex or did Whoopi Goldberg own the team?

The league moved a franchise into Rio Grand Valley (Hidalgo, TX) a city the size of Guthrie, OK. We would have been better off having a 3rd Oklahoma CHL franchise in the Edmond-Guthrie area at the Lazy E arena; it would have saved on travel.

The American Hockey League does have some great known cities along with a few non popular ones.

Would Tulsa and/or Wichita have an 'impact' on the resurrection of ice hockey in OKC?


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

Tulsa draws right at 5K. Wichita still draws just over 5K. Drawing 5K, and driving to games, seems to be more feasible than drawing <3 and flying to Abbottsford, BC

I have a hard time believing some of those attendance figures. The Tulsa games that I've been to in the last few years have been horrendous. Seriously, that last Oilers/Thunder game I saw at the BOK looked like an open practice. How Tulsa still has a hockey team is a mystery.

Tulsa draws right at 5K. Wichita still draws just over 5K. Drawing 5K, and driving to games, seems to be more feasible than drawing <3 and flying to Abbottsford, BC

I can not remember what sport it was, but I remember a while back that one of the college teams used buses essentially for PR to imply they were cutting back on expenses, though it turned out that it cost more to do that than fly.

We go to about 5 Barons game per season. We once looked at a 11 game mini season package. We may do it next year because our daughter enjoys the games. I think if the Barons went to a flat ticket rate and made the entire place GA and closed off the second level you'd get more folks at games, and maybe it'd feel like more people. I don't know, just a thought.

We go to about 5 Barons game per season. We once looked at a 11 game mini season package. We may do it next year because our daughter enjoys the games. I think if the Barons went to a flat ticket rate and made the entire place GA and closed off the second level you'd get more folks at games, and maybe it'd feel like more people. I don't know, just a thought.

I just think it's sad that, given how popular hockey USED to be, that we've come to this. Seriously, how long before they propose playing games at Arctic Edge?

I just think it's sad that, given how popular hockey USED to be, that we've come to this. Seriously, how long before they propose playing games at Arctic Edge?

Again, you and a couple others continue to have your head in the sand about this, but the NBA drastically changed the landscape in OKC.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but the bring-back-the-Blazers crowd is starting to sound a little like the disgruntled Seattle basketball fans...

Again, you and a couple others continue to have your head in the sand about this, but the NBA drastically changed the landscape in OKC.

Tha Blazers drew 6500 their lat year. Funk Jr and the secretive plutocrats wanted to change the culture of hockey on OKC and rebrand the team, and it went over as well as the new Coke formula.

Here are other AHL teams that share a city with the NBA:
Lake Erie Monsters - 8144
Chicago Wolves - 7927 (Not only an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
San Antonio - 7001
Charlotte Checkers - 6360
Toronto Marlies - 6013 (Not only have an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
Milwaukee Admirals - 5844

Did the NBA not "change the landscape" in these places?

I think those CHL attendance numbers might be a little skewed. I remember the Blazers giving tickets away. PAID attendance if obtainable would be more telling. I myself would rather pay a few bucks more for a better product. If I want to see cheap club hockey I go see OU play at the Blazers Ice Centre or whatever it is called now.

I think those CHL attendance numbers might be a little skewed. I remember the Blazers giving tickets away. PAID attendance if obtainable would be more telling. I myself would rather pay a few bucks more for a better product. If I want to see cheap club hockey I go see OU play at the Blazers Ice Centre or whatever it is called now.

When we lived in Stuttgart, we went to see the Stuttgart Wizards play. The smaller feel was incredible, and the players knew that those who came to see the game were real fans of the sport (or family!). The venue wasn't heated and one side wasn't even seating, but sort of a broad slow stairway where fans were expected to stand. They were sure to pay attention to the fans after each game. It was a wonderful fan experience (and it sure didn't hurt that you could get gluhwein cheaply there). On the other hand, the level of hockey was not near what you could get from the next level up (at the Bietigheim-Bissingen Steelers games further north) or from any higher caliber league.
I fully enjoyed the Blazers when they played here, and the roster continuity from an unaffiliated team was marvelous, but like Jersey Boss says, the AHL is a better product (and not really much more expensive, if you account for inflation).
Further, Jersey Boss is spot on with the attendance record being skewed with the ticket giveaways. I'm sure that if the Blazers were financially successful, they'd still be here, even if the Funk's wanted a higher level league affiliation.

Tha Blazers drew 6500 their lat year. Funk Jr and the secretive plutocrats wanted to change the culture of hockey on OKC and rebrand the team, and it went over as well as the new Coke formula.

rebrand it from what? bad play and fighting? you know who likes to watch that? NOT true hockey fans.

Here are other AHL teams that share a city with the NBA:
Lake Erie Monsters - 8144
Chicago Wolves - 7927 (Not only an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
San Antonio - 7001
Charlotte Checkers - 6360
Toronto Marlies - 6013 (Not only have an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
Milwaukee Admirals - 5844

Did the NBA not "change the landscape" in these places?

A few of those places are not really debatable because there is a legit hockey culture (Lake Erie, Chicago, Toronto, Milwaukee) in place, and has been in place for years. We're NEVER going to compare to places where kids can go out and play pond hockey in the winters, that's a fact.

As for San Antonio (and Charlotte), I'm sure it doesn't hurt that they play in the same arena as the Spurs (and Bobcats), and have double the MSA of OKC. The NBA is not the only factor at play here.

Again, I'll ask you like I ask Edgar (who we are used to not answering questions on this site but only answering in vague generalities), what changed? It's still a black rubber round thing pushed around on ice with a carbon fiber stick.

You had passionate brand loyality with the Blazers, not sure why you'd toss that away except the oilies wanted to name a team after themselves. Thank God it's the Thunder and not the Barons like they dreamed. Not insulting all the old hockey fans in town would have helped. Balzer fans a blue collar beer drinking screaming at the opposition and ponuding on the glass ilk. The faith and family bs didn't help. I'll go to church if feel in need. Not condusive to a rowdy atmosphere. Blazer may have comped some tickets, but at least people actually used them. Sad thing about the Barons, every game their are piles of bought tickets no one cares enough to use. The upgrade could have been successful if you had soemone who knew what they were doing. If Funk eating the operating losses?

What's done is done. Time to move on.

You had passionate brand loyality with the Blazers, not sure why you'd toss that away except the oilies wanted to name a team after themselves. Thank God it's the Thunder and not the Barons like they dreamed. Not insulting all the old hockey fans in town would have helped. Balzer fans a blue collar beer drinking screaming at the opposition and ponuding on the glass ilk. The faith and family bs didn't help. I'll go to church if feel in need. Not condusive to a rowdy atmosphere. Blazer may have comped some tickets, but at least people actually used them. Sad thing about the Barons, every game their are piles of bought tickets no one cares enough to use. The upgrade could have been successful if you had soemone who knew what they were doing. If Funk eating the operating losses?

Is this another plutocracy / chamber junta evil plan? Let me know when you run out of tin foil. I'd love to sell you some.

thanks Dubya, still have a full roll at home.

How?!

I guess I just don't see where faith and family is pushed in Barons advertising. I mean, they have pretty sweet beer specials every Friday night that I enjoy taking part of. Help me understand what made the Blazers so great, as I didn't show up here until January 2009. What made it conducive to a rowdy atmosphere that is not present now?

I guess I just don't see where faith and family is pushed in Barons advertising. I mean, they have pretty sweet beer specials every Friday night that I enjoy taking part of. Help me understand what made the Blazers so great, as I didn't show up here until January 2009. What made it conducive to a rowdy atmosphere that is not present now?

I did not realize they did any advertising at all

A few of those places are not really debatable because there is a legit hockey culture (Lake Erie, Chicago, Toronto, Milwaukee) in place, and has been in place for years. We're NEVER going to compare to places where kids can go out and play pond hockey in the winters, that's a fact.

As for San Antonio (and Charlotte), I'm sure it doesn't hurt that they play in the same arena as the Spurs (and Bobcats), and have double the MSA of OKC. The NBA is not the only factor at play here.

Again, I'll ask you like I ask Edgar (who we are used to not answering questions on this site but only answering in vague generalities), what changed? It's still a black rubber round thing pushed around on ice with a carbon fiber stick.
For me, at least, it seemed like everything changed. I wasn't a Barons hater, I promise. I went to the first game. I went to several more that year. But every time I went it just didn't feel the same. My wife said the same thing. She wasn't a hockey fan when I met her. But after I took her to only about 2, or 3, Blazers games, she turned to me and asked how much season tickets were.
I asked her why, and she said, "I don't know, maybe we should get some next year. This is fun"
She doesn't want to go to a Barons game now, any more than I do. I didn't just go to games, either. i used to NEVER miss a game on the radio, if at all possible. I went to many away games, as well. I knew all of the players' names, and most of the opposing players. My ex-wife and I once planned a short vacation to Tennessee around the Blazers playing two games there at the same time.
And I am so tired of people who don't know who keeping throwing out "Oh the blazers gave away tickets!"
I can tell you FOR A FACT, as a multi-year Season Ticket Holder, that I NEVER got a free ticket to a Blazers games. And I personally don't know anyone who did. During their first season, I even stood in line just to get one of the extra 500 tickets that they released for the game against Tulsa at the Fairgrounds.
That being said, maybe the Barons should give away some tickets. it might get people in the door. It also doesn't look good when their cheapest ticket is more than the Thunder's cheapest ticket.
And now I see people saying that maybe they should block off the entire upper bowl at the Cox Center to make it look better? that's just pitiful.

I guess I just don't see where faith and family is pushed in Barons advertising. I mean, they have pretty sweet beer specials every Friday night that I enjoy taking part of. Help me understand what made the Blazers so great, as I didn't show up here until January 2009. What made it conducive to a rowdy atmosphere that is not present now?
For me, it came down to rivalries. We hated Tulsa. We hated Wichita. They hated us. It made for some great games to watch. I also agree with something Brad Lund said once in an interview. When someone asked him about Oklahoma City being a "hockey town", he said, "Oklahoma City isn't a hockey town, it's a Blazers town." It's a lot like the Thunder. Oklahoma City wasn't a basketball town. If anything, Oklahoma City was/is a Sooner Football town. But the Thunder has made people, like me, my wife, her parents all watch the Thunder. Before they came to town, I could count on one hand the number of NBA games I had watched in the past 10 years. So I would say the same thing, "Oklahoma City isn't a basketball town, it's a Thunder town."

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For me, it came down to rivalries. We hated Tulsa. We hated Wichita. They hated us. It made for some great games to watch. I also agree with something Brad Lund said once in an interview. When someone asked him about Oklahoma City being a "hockey town", he said, "Oklahoma City isn't a hockey town, it's a Blazers town." It's a lot like the Thunder. Oklahoma City wasn't a basketball town. If anything, Oklahoma City was/is a Sooner Football town. But the Thunder has made people, like me, my wife, her parents all watch the Thunder. Before they came to town, I could count on one hand the number of NBA games I had watched in the past 10 years. So I would say the same thing, "Oklahoma City isn't a basketball town, it's a Thunder town."

You failed to give the Hornets any credit here. I would respectfully disagree that this is a Thunder Town and is more of a town that appreciates NBA basketball right here. The arguments you make for the Blazers should have bode well for the Calvary when they were here, not so much. The Thunder would be doing well even if Dallas did not have a franchise(they being closest to OKC).

The entire way the Blazers left seemed poorly handled. First they should not have left a year between to let people out of the habit of going to games, second it seemed like they came off as insulting to at least the team and possibly even fans while moving them out (though it has been long ago enough I do not remember the details), third keeping the name/colors/logo (maybe with a slight refresh) seems like it would have been a much better way to make that transition.

The entire way the Blazers left seemed poorly handled. First they should not have left a year between to let people out of the habit of going to games, second it seemed like they came off as insulting to at least the team and possibly even fans while moving them out (though it has been long ago enough I do not remember the details), third keeping the name/colors/logo (maybe with a slight refresh) seems like it would have been a much better way to make that transition.

That bothered me as well. It seemed that as soon as the Barons were announced trolls came out of the woodwork to bash Blazers fans as stupid, and the team as bush league, not worthy, terrible, etc... Even though the same entity owned both teams, no mention was given EVER of the Blazers history. All banners removed, etc... It kinda pissed me off

Here are other AHL teams that share a city with the NBA:
Lake Erie Monsters - 8144
Chicago Wolves - 7927 (Not only an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
San Antonio - 7001
Charlotte Checkers - 6360
Toronto Marlies - 6013 (Not only have an NBA team, but an NHL team as well)
Milwaukee Admirals - 5844

Did the NBA not "change the landscape" in these places?

Good point, Borchard:

Oklahoma City is on the verge:

OKC market is going through a transformation period where we want more major league sports; however we don't have the population & income base to support another major league franchise. Major League Soccer (MLS) or North American Soccer League would be our next option. MLS is growing and not on the level of the Fab Four sports (MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL).

These cities have the population base to support other sports; cities need at least one million metropolitan area population to support one major league sport.[/B]

There are a lot of factors which affect the AHL attendance in these cities like population density, disposable income etc., we are a 'break-through city' (one major league sport) with markets like Portland, San Antonio, Memphis, Orlando, Raleigh (NHL), Sacramento and Salt Lake City.

Cleveland (Lake Erie Monsters) - 2,064,725 [MLB, NFL, NBA] Overextended sports market -0.60% decline in population Barons - AHL 1929-1973, Barons - NHL 1976-1978, Established hockey base but failed as an NHL city

Chicago 9,537,289 - [MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL] (Wolves in suburban Rosemont, IL) former IHL city that moved to the AHL when the IHL folded.

San Antonio - 2,277,550 [NBA] [mid major AHL] former CHL city that eventually became an AHL city after a brief battle between CHL & AHL franchises.

Charlotte - 2,335,358 [NFL, NBA] [mid majors AHL, IL baseball] moved to the AHL in 2010 after successfully competing in the Eastern & Southern Hockey leagues 1956 to 1977, ECHL in 1993-2010

Toronto - 6,054,191 [MLB, CFL, NBA, NHL]

Milwaukee - 1,569,659 [MLB, NBA] [mid major AHL] Overextended sports market +0.88% population growth
1973–1977 (USHL), 1977–2001 (IHL), 2001–present (AHL); Milwaukee is 100 miles from Green Bay in NFL's 150-mile radius in one state; also 85 miles from Chicago in border state.

Oklahoma City - 1,319,677 [NBA] [mid majors - AHL, PCL baseball] +5.32% population growth
OKC's ice hockey history: Blazers 1965-1977, Stars 1978–1982, defunct 1982-92, Blazers 1992-2009, Barons 2010 -present...

Sources: List of Metropolitan Statistical Areas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas)

Could Your City Give a Sports Team a Good Home? (http://wagesofwins.com/2011/10/31/could-your-city-give-a-sports-team-a-good-home/)

Denver is most overextended market for professional sports - The Business Journals (http://www.bizjournals.com/bizjournals/on-numbers/scott-thomas/2011/08/denver-is-most-overextended-market.html)


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif [B] "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif

They ought to make the "Could Your City Give a Sports Team a Good Home?" an annual article. Refresh the tables data, summarize the changes in who can support or is now overextended and some minor edits to a general description. At this point the data is between three and four years out of date.

I am not sure about the NASL team's plan on possibly moving up but the OKC Energy was talking like allowing another five to ten years of growth in the market/population before they would be ready to try and make the step up.

They ought to make the "Could Your City Give a Sports Team a Good Home?" an annual article. Refresh the tables data, summarize the changes in who can support or is now overextended and some minor edits to a general description. At this point the data is between three and four years out of date.

I am not sure about the NASL team's plan on possibly moving up but the OKC Energy was talking like allowing another five to ten years of growth in the market/population before they would be ready to try and make the step up.
I know I'm a little jaded on this but I do NOT believe that Oklahoma City will get an MLS franchise. There are just too many other cities larger than us that are ahead of us.
I'm very glad that, so far at least, the NASL folks aren't saying things like "Our goal is MLS!" And that's all I hear from the Energy front office. It's a load of crap, no matter which group says it. Getting 4,000 people to a game won't get you there. Building a 7,000 seat soccer stadium won't get you there. The only number that will get you to MLS is $75,000,000. That's the amount of the check someone will have to write for the franchise fee to get into MLS. Then, there is the probable $100,000,000 that will have to be forked out to build a 20,000 seat Soccer-specific stadium.
I don't want to hear people keep floating that pipe dream. I just want them to say, "Come out and see us play in USL/NASL. It's great!"

We agree on something for once. I don't think we should shelve out hundreds of millions to get get MLS when it's not the best players in the world.

borchard we agree!

I don't see how they give us a MLS franchise without paying the entry fee. 10-15 years ago when there was talk about it, it could have been an option but not now. The league has grown from then.

I would say are best chance to land a 2nd major league team would be hockey, but not sure the thunder would want to share the arena. And a NHL crowd would be completely different than the "blazer supporters" like borchard

And I'm the farthest thing from a soccer-hater. I LOVE soccer. My two, least favorite sports teams in the whole wide world are:
1. The University of Texas
2. The Mexican National Soccer team

I would LOVE to have an MLS team here to support. But I just don't think it is going to happen. We had a chance back in 2002, but Express Sports decided to buy the Redhawks, instead. Back then I believe that the entry fee was ~$10 million. Now it's ~$75 million. And I know that one of the problems in 2002 was that MLS wasn't doing as well as it is today.
I really don't know if the NHL would do well here, either. I used to think it would, but that was back in the mid-nineties when the NHL was booming.
I just want whatever soccer team survives here to be the best it can be, and be an example to other cities as to how it SHOULD operate.

And I'm the farthest thing from a soccer-hater. I LOVE soccer. My two, least favorite sports teams in the whole wide world are:
1. The University of Texas
2. The Mexican National Soccer team

I would LOVE to have an MLS team here to support. But I just don't think it is going to happen. We had a chance back in 2002, but Express Sports decided to buy the Redhawks, instead. Back then I believe that the entry fee was ~$10 million. Now it's ~$75 million. And I know that one of the problems in 2002 was that MLS wasn't doing as well as it is today.
I really don't know if the NHL would do well here, either. I used to think it would, but that was back in the mid-nineties when the NHL was booming.
I just want whatever soccer team survives here to be the best it can be, and be an example to other cities as to how it SHOULD operate.

We don't have the population, corporate or income bases to support the NHL to compete with the NBA (OKC Thunder) since the seasons interlock. MLS would be marginal; however the Funks are going to ride this train off the track because their track record has always been 'talk and hype' with no intentions to move to the next level. They played this game about the Calgary Flames moving to OKC in the late 90s.


http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/images/smilies/okc.gif