Here's another question, I wonder if it will be unanimous. Rather have density with 5-6 more low rises? ( 150-280ft ) Or 1-2 more highrises? ( 400-780ft )
331133123313
33143315
Easy visual, but the pics are kinda small

#3 and 4

Just look at the off topic posts in this thread as intermission as we wait for more word. Reading through this thread, it's derailed many times when there wasn't any real news, but a lot of it has been interesting.

The title of this thread suggest that anything goes, 'Speculation, News and Ideas'.

Sooner or later, something with substance will surface on this thread.

Here's another question, I wonder if it will be unanimous. Rather have density with 5-6 more low rises? ( 150-280ft ) Or 1-2 more highrises? ( 400-780ft )


I would be happy if the tallest building downtown was 10 stories. The most important part of the building is where it meets the ground. Height should only be used to define the space around it which most architects and city planners put at a ratio of between 1:1 and 1:2, meaning a street 40 feet wide feels most comfortable to pedestrians if the buildings are between 20 and 40 feet tall (2 to 4 stories).

Time to break the boredom:




Comment From Brent
Steve, you and your downtown coverage/blog/chats seem to be some of the most popular coverage for the Oklahoman. Are there any plans for you to get some more help to cover developments and ongoing construction, etc.? Especially with you being one person and with everything going on, it would appear to be a good idea to give the people more of what they want.

10:44
Steve Lackmeyer: No. Normally I'm pretty much able to stay on top of it all. Again, forgive me for lapses the past few weeks. I can tell you I've been involved in some serious discussions involving the "mystery tower" as it is referred to by some, and I am tantalizingly close to being able to expand my reporting on the topic.

10:16
Comment From Paul T.
With the Class A office market being so tight downtown, why hasn't any developers stepped up to develop speculative office buildings?

10:20
Steve Lackmeyer:
I'm going to go on memory here, so forgive me if I end up a bit off. But to build a modern Class A office building downtown, it's going to cost up to $325 a square foot. At best, this market will support $18 a square foot for rent - maybe $20 if someone really pushes it. Go to a bank, try to get financing for a speculative office building with no guaranteed tenants and those numbers. The project with those numbers just doesn't cash flow and it's seen as a big risk by lenders. But ... even with all that said ... I am still tracking a new downtown tower. I am not seeing or hearing anything that discourages me from the notion that we are about o see a major expansion in Class A space

I suspect both Continental and OG&E are getting close to announcing something.

We know the Stage Center foundation has been accepting bids on their property and we are pretty darn sure Continental is in the running. From everything I've heard, they will prevail; I would bet there is already a hand-shake agreement. However, I doubt anyone wants to make an announcement until there are more specifics, and I"m sure it's taking time for CLR to put together their general plan. In other words, I don't think Stage Center or CLR want anything to come out until they can make a simultaneous announcement, because it will have to involve scraping the existing structure which will be controversial.

I also know that OG&E has employed a professional real estate firm to scout locations for a new building. I became aware of that almost a year ago, so they would have to be pretty far along in their plans. But of course, they also don't want to make any sort of announcement until all their ducks are in a row.

Beyond that, there are lots of possibilities but the actions of those two companies are for real, it's just that there are lots of little steps (and possible pitfalls) before either can announce a big building project.

If what you say is true Pete (and I hope that it is), then I see three towers in our near future, because it seems inevitable that Devon will build another one, presumably in the Preftakes area.

I would be happy if the tallest building downtown was 10 stories. The most important part of the building is where it meets the ground. Height should only be used to define the space around it which most architects and city planners put at a ratio of between 1:1 and 1:2, meaning a street 40 feet wide feels most comfortable to pedestrians if the buildings are between 20 and 40 feet tall (2 to 4 stories).

I agree. Certainly tall structures are needed in thriving business districts, but height alone does not equate to a good urban experience. Most of the best neighborhoods in truly urban cities are not the ones with the skyscrapers.

And some of you folks wanted to lock down and close this thread up.....It's just now getting interesting, because it's getting ready to happen.

and as soon as something is announced it will have it's own thread...........

I think everyone just needs to be patient. A $700 million dollar office tower project will take a lot longer to coordinate and get organized than a $30 million dollar hotel project. Just need to keep it in perspective, with that large amount of money, they want to be sure they have everything secured before they go public. If they came out publicly and announced they were building a tower before they had anything secured, land prices all over the CBD would soar.

They are going to find the piece of land they really want, organize a payment offer, and then directly approach that buyer (possibly even under a different name or LLC) with that offer and secure their land. If they don't keep it on the down low, every vacant parcel would be on the market for 10x what they were asking before. They also need to secure a contractor, architect, etc. Again -- you don't want your plans out there publicly for this. Don't forget about the bank and their finance and legal departments. Even if they can pay cash, they still need to communicate with finance or the bank to work out plans for paying cash for it. Much more complicated than literally writing a check for the grand total and having a tower over night.

These are all the same things every project goes through, and things that need to be taken care of in private instead of out in the open.

And if the deal falls through or they change their mind -- guess what, you don't have to make an announcement saying so. No announcement is needed at all.

I am going go out on a limb and say we will have an official announcement by March 31, 2013.

I think everyone just needs to be patient. A $700 million dollar office tower project will take a lot longer to coordinate.....

Yeah, yeah, blah blah blah... where's my tower announcement!

Just kidding. :wink:

Of course, you're right. That's a very sober assessment of the situation. I understand.

And yes, I'll try to be patient. Don't have any choice, do I? I am being forced to be patient against my will!
:)

I think that limb might hold up...

I think that limb might hold up...

tease tease tease .... lol

I can't wait to see a lot more cranes in dt OKC!!!

I think that limb might hold up...

Aw hell, Steve. Why'd you do that to us?

I am going go out on a limb and say we will have an official announcement by March 31, 2013.

I'm going to go with my sister's birthday, April 22nd.

I am going go out on a limb and say we will have an official announcement by March 31, 2013.
You are now being held accountable for anything that comes after that....lol

I am going go out on a limb and say we will have an official announcement by March 31, 2013.


I think that limb might hold up...


tease tease tease .... lol


Aw hell, Steve. Why'd you do that to us?

Lol... that is awesome.

You are now being held accountable for anything that comes after that....lol

I'll be accountable for anything after 4/22 as well.

Go figure. The day I don't have time to check OKCTalk or Steve's blog is the day all this tower talk comes about. Makes me excited!

I think a 2700 feet Burj Oklahoma should be built. It would be a huge tourist attraction and would bring a ton of people to Oklahoma that would otherwise never come. There could be an entire city in a building. Imagine the possibilities! Plus it would be a one of its kind in the United States (the other one being in Dubai).

I think a 2700 feet Burj Oklahoma should be built. It would be a huge tourist attraction and would bring a ton of people to Oklahoma that would otherwise never come. There could be an entire city in a building. Imagine the possibilities! Plus it would be a one of its kind in the United States (the other one being in Dubai).

http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/10/103800/2400008-2346514_oh_you_super.jpg

We could build a tower that goes to the moon. A moon tower. Anyone else know where a moon tower is? I do! Here, in Downtown OKC in about 5 years.

Without nanotechnology, the base of a moon tower would have to be 620 sq miles wide.

Yeah, I figured the base would have to be pretty massive and then you have the orbiting issues. Maaan...

I agree. Certainly tall structures are needed in thriving business districts, but height alone does not equate to a good urban experience. Most of the best neighborhoods in truly urban cities are not the ones with the skyscrapers.

Of course, I would consider a neighborhood and an office district to be two different things and OKC certainly could use both.

Aw hell, Steve. Why'd you do that to us?

Because we love it. LOL

I think a 2700 feet Burj Oklahoma should be built. It would be a huge tourist attraction and would bring a ton of people to Oklahoma that would otherwise never come. There could be an entire city in a building. Imagine the possibilities! Plus it would be a one of its kind in the United States (the other one being in Dubai).

Can't... tell... if... kidding.

Which happens to be the size of OKC. Hmmmmm....maybe there is something to this theory after all.

IDK if it'd really have to be that big, but that's the only reason I mentioned it :tongue:

Can't... tell... if... kidding.

Yeah was joking.

Come Thursday, I'll be out of the country for 10 days. The way my luck is, it'll probably be announced during that time span. So be it.

Come Thursday, I'll be out of the country for 10 days. The way my luck is, it'll probably be announced during that time span. So be it.

If that's what it takes to get an announcement, so long. LOL

How long was the speculation about the Devon tower before it was actually announced? Not just random speculation (that has probably been going on since the completion of the Chase tower) but concrete evidence something would soon be built yet no announcement?

How long was the speculation about the Devon tower before it was actually announced? Not just random speculation (that has probably been going on since the completion of the Chase tower) but concrete evidence something would soon be built yet no announcement?

I think I remember hearing that OKC Talk started talking about what eventually turned out to be the Devon Tower about a year before the initial announcement. We're just a few days past the start of this thread (although talk of a mystery tower surfaced shortly before this thread).

I'd think this forum is even more well connected than in 2007 when rumors RE: Devon first started floating. So it would make sense that the rumor mill would last longer, even on a project smaller than Devon Tower (which I think we all expect to see).

I just hope we're not getting our hopes up for something on the same scale as Devon: in height, money, or quality.

I don't expect anything better than Devon.

I don't expect anything better than Devon.

I don't think anyone does. I, for one, am just excited for a denser skyline.

Without nanotechnology, the base of a moon tower would have to be 620 sq miles wide.

Good. We have just enough room, especially since we're so keen to demo anything for a new tower!

Well, Steve seems to think the Mystery Tower is really moving along behind the scenes. From today's chat:

Comment From Eugene:
what happened to all the buzz about new skyscrapers? Why no new announcements by now?

Steve Lackmeyer: Real estate transactions take time. And that’s exactly what is happening right now. This is not speculation, this is not a guess; I am telling you, a complicated real estate transaction is underway, and when the deal is done, that is when the involved parties will be ready to discuss what is planned.

:D

^^^^arghhhh, I so want to LIKE that post!^^^^

....I am telling you, a complicated real estate transaction is underway, and when the deal is done, that is when the involved parties will be ready to discuss what is planned.

:D

A new downtown McDonalds? Cool!!!

just kidding

A new downtown McDonalds? Cool!!!

just kidding

If it looks like this - bring it on.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6165/6163016020_30a12a138c_n.jpg

If it looks like this - bring it on.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6165/6163016020_30a12a138c_n.jpg

Like +1

I think we are getting very close to an announcement by Continental and/or OG&E.

I think we are getting very close to an announcement by Continental and/or OG&E.

Oh no, don't do that to me!

I think we are getting very close to an announcement by Continental and/or OG&E.

my bet is on Continental... i don't know anything about OG&E's plans... but i keep hearing a lot from the same people who were telling me a few months ago to be paying attention in the 2nd quarter of 2013... so i'm thinking possibly an end of March or first part of April announcement

I think we are to...I am still holding firm that we will have an announcement by March 31st, 2013. Hopefully it won't be a soft announcement...like just them saying 'we are building a tower', lol. It would be nice to have a hard announcement with details of the project, like what architecture firm they will use, renderings, and projected start dates etc...

Pete, how likely is it that we see new towers from both Continental and OG&E? Or do you see it happening where Continental builds something new and OG&E takes the tower that Continental is currently in? Or some other way?

It would be nice to have a hard announcement with details of the project, like what architecture firm they will use, renderings, and projected start dates etc...

I would suspect that a model of the building already exists somewhere.

I wouldn't mind seeing another Pickard Chilton project...but I also like Cesar Pelli, Boka Powell, and HKS.

Since were speculating and forming ideas on the new DT tower, perhaps a partnership with CR and OG&E building a new 50 story tower. Sounds like a reasonable possibility!

i'd much rather see 2 30-story than 1 50-story

See, I know I might be less popular with this idea, but, I love height. So if we could get a another 50 or better yet, a 65-70 story tower, I would explode(in a good way lol). But, I know that is most likely not going to happen.

i'd much rather see 2 30-story than 1 50-story

I agree

i'd much rather see 2 30-story than 1 50-story

I agree as well. It is kind of funny how the urbanist seem to favor low-rise high density and people who are more suburban-minded like tall buildings. I guess it so so they can see downtown from the suburbs.

I am really feeling this design of this new 30 story office tower proposed for downtown Austin (of course), lol:

http://www.austintowers.net/Austin_Downtown/index_files/colorado_third_tower.jpg

I agree as well. It is kind of funny how the urbanist seem to favor low-rise high density and people who are more suburban-minded like tall buildings. I guess it so so they can see downtown from the suburbs.

i think for me it's a matter of just density... anything over 25-story, i just want more of... so i'm not opposed to 2 more 50-story if that is what is coming... but i will always take 2 buildings over 1. and i think i will fill that way until that image in the Banner of OKCTalk is filled with buildings from one side to the other... then we can start talking about height and getting some super tall builds to rival Dubai