MidFirst recently moved a lot of Midland Mortgage employees to Shepherd Mall and is just starting renovations on their operations center on Rockwell and Hefner

Saw that this morning as well and was thinking the same thing...

That's the clear triangle shaped plot, right?

I would think it is, at one time it was going to be the Chamber site.

Well hopefully we hear something soon and this wasn't bought purely on speculation. I haven't thought about this angle before, but having an iconic building on this would anchor the appearance of the dead end on Shield's as seen from the bridge over the highway. And would help tie Deep Deuce and AA by expanding the core a little bit more towards those districts. It would probably also slow traffic down by having a large streetwall against the curve of that turn.

Saw that this morning as well and was thinking the same thing...

That's the clear triangle shaped plot, right?

Yes, most of it (yellow). The remainder is owned by the City (pink).

Of course, this is owned by an LLC but I know the attorney that filed and will see what I can find out. My hunch is MidFirst.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/4th.jpg

Wanted to follow up on the Midfirst/Midland news. Highly unlikely the visit last week regarded a potential buyer, but it was said to center around a type of expansion. Can't really elaborate.

Seperatley, pending a lease being signed, more employees will be moving from the 3Grand location to shepherd mall before the end of the year, maybe as soon as October 1. Unsure who will replace these openings at 3G, but with the growth, building or buying an additional facility still seems likely.

If it was MidFirst/Midland behind the downtown purchase, they are at least three and probably four or five years from being able to move into a new building if they were to build something new.

So, they certainly wouldn't need to sell this far in advance and in fact, it would probably be difficult to find a buyer who wants to commit now and wait that long.

Except for Chesapeake, of course.

Pete, I'm not going to speculate on names, etc. But one would be amazed at how much work might be done at this point. If a company was buying this land for a tower, one could be up and open in less than three years. I suspect the upcoming Devon book will bring a lot of clarity to how these projects proceed.

I know from the time Devon started construction, they were moving people in within about 2.5 years.

But my point still stands: If it is MidFirst they wouldn't be able to completely turn over their buildings for at least 3 years, and that's the best possible scenario.

Even after the Devon announcement, it took about a year to start construction, and we all know a ton of work was done before that announcement.


Steve, when does you book come out??

Hate to let everyone down, but 4th Street Properties, LLC is the same company that is developing the Maywood Apartments, so it looks like this site may just be for a future residential project, possibly phase 2 of the Maywood Apartments, unless they are acting as a proxy for a particular company.

http://www.okc.gov/agendapub/cache/2/g1s3tqu5hvuzgs55lecojm45/156110609012012011530357.PDF

Hate to let everyone down, but 4th Street Properties, LLC is the same company that is developing the Maywood Apartments, so it looks like this site may just be for a future residential project, possibly phase 2 of the Maywood Apartments, unless they are acting as a proxy for a particular company.

http://www.okc.gov/agendapub/cache/2/g1s3tqu5hvuzgs55lecojm45/156110609012012011530357.PDF

Nope, completely different entities.

Maywood Apartments is being developed by 4th Street Investors LP and this property was purchased by 4th Street Properties LLC.

Similar names but completely different ownership groups; this new one was just formed August 12, 2012.

Did you not read the PDF file? It specifically said 4th Street Properties, LLC.

Google this: "4th Street Properties, LLC" oklahoma city

And tell me what you see...

I saw that... But the Ron Bradshaw group never registered that name -- were just using it temporarily as they were 4th Street Apartments LLC.

They own the Maywood Land under 4th Street Investors and the mailing address and contact people are completely different than 4th Street Properties.


These are not the same groups.

Pete, I'm not going to speculate on names, etc. But one would be amazed at how much work might be done at this point. If a company was buying this land for a tower, one could be up and open in less than three years. I suspect the upcoming Devon book will bring a lot of clarity to how these projects proceed.

This is to say that using the Devon model timeline, there could already be architects and engineers working behind the scenes, and land surveyors could have already done as much without being noticed...this way a project of magnitude could pop at any moment. We all knew something was up with Devon, just as we know stuff is going on riot now... But here's the kicker, is that Devon could have easily been scared by 2008 and shut the whole thing down making us feel stupid for expecting a new skyscraper.

We will either feel very stupid or very smart, and either be bummed or elated, and this could pop tomorrow, in a year, or never...

We know MidFirst put a bid in on the OPUBCO properties on Broadway Extension and were topped by American Fidelity.

We also know they have been taking more and more space at Class B/C Shepherd Mall.


All signs point to MidFirst/Midland.

I can pretty much guarantee Bradshaw isn't banking this property....

I wonder if the city would sell the rest of the property between 3rd and 4th so they can build out that property to EK

I wonder if the city would sell the rest of the property between 3rd and 4th so they can build out that property to EK

I am sure that is part of the deal.

It seems to me that $2 million for a parcel of land would be one of the last pieces of the development puzzle, not one of the first.

We know MidFirst put a bid in on the OPUBCO properties on Broadway Extension and were topped by American Fidelity.

We also know they have been taking more and more space at Class B/C Shepherd Mall.


All signs point to MidFirst/Midland.

Wow, didn't know...that's big. This is looking very Devon pre-2009.

Wow, didn't know...that's big. This is looking very Devon pre-2009.

No, that's not big. They're not going to build a tower at $400/sf so that they can consolidate call center staff. That being said, I wouldn't rule them out.

No, that's not big. They're not going to build a tower at $400/sf so that they can consolidate call center staff. That being said, I wouldn't rule them out.

I wouldn't really focus on call center staff...Decent amount of em but the vast majority are operations

Again, we know they wanted to consolidate all their personnel at the Broadway/Britton site, so it does seem to be a priority.

With AF out of the picture, I can't imagine who else would be in line to put up a significant downtown structure at this point.

Continental would be a good candidate, but it may be a little soon for them.

I know the attorney who is the official registrant for the LLC that bought the property at 4th & EK Gaylord.

He said the buyers wish to be completely confidential at this point and wouldn't say anything more.


This tells me something big is brewing for that site otherwise there wouldn't be the need for such secrecy.

I know some people don't like the speculation if it is not a fact but I really enjoy the possibilities. I really appreciate this board and this thread. Thank you all for posting information as you get it.

Yes, it's fun to think about the possibilities.


If we could get a 30-40 story building at 4th & Gaylord and another on the Stage Center or Preftakes site, plus the CC hotel and a new SandRidge building, our skyline would be extended in every direction and we would have some really nice density in the CBD.

If all of those were to come into being, that would be incredible. We would be the most photographed city in America :) Just kidding.

If we could get a 30-40 story building at 4th & Gaylord and another on the Stage Center or Preftakes site, plus the CC hotel and a new SandRidge building, our skyline would be extended in every direction and we would have some really nice density in the CBD.

Not to mention the 3 new hotel in Bricktown along Sheridan. The will make the Sheridan street wall just over one 1 mile long.

2567

Could this be the building that will be built at this proposed site.

2567

Could this be the building that will be built at this proposed site.

I sure hope not! I hope they build something that suits the site. A building that calls you to look up Shields and pulls you in as you look up from Deep Deuce.

2567

Could this be the building that will be built at this proposed site.

A taller version of this wouldn't be to shabby for that site...This architectural style is outdated though, this says mid 90's to me...I woul expect something more modern...

If all of those were to come into being, that would be incredible. We would be the most photographed city in America :) Just kidding.

Build the right buildings and it might be...but likely those right buildings would have to be so very wrong ;)

...isn't "banking" this property... Steve, is that a subtle hint?

Yes, it's fun to think about the possibilities.


If we could get a 30-40 story building at 4th & Gaylord and another on the Stage Center or Preftakes site, plus the CC hotel and a new SandRidge building, our skyline would be extended in every direction and we would have some really nice density in the CBD.

Do we know the site of the new SandRidge tower? Is it going on the Chase Bank plot just to the east of SR tower?

It seems somewhat obvious that Preftakes is either a future Devon project or residential, and I would assume that's not an ideal spot for high-rise residential, so Devon seems like the best answer there (unless it's maybe Continental)

Also, to the density point...I've noticed after going through Austin and Tulsa recently and seeing some other Tier-3/Tier-2 skylines, that OKC's skyline is actually dense in comparison. Austin's skyline is incredibly sprawled and Tulsa's is minimal, but could be made to look denser if the buildings were plotted differently.

Do we know the site of the new SandRidge tower? Is it going on the Chase Bank plot just to the east of SR tower?

Immediately east -- between the current tower and Broadway. Estimated at 15-20 floors.

I know the attorney who is the official registrant for the LLC that bought the property at 4th & EK Gaylord.

He said the buyers wish to be completely confidential at this point and wouldn't say anything more.


This tells me something big is brewing for that site otherwise there wouldn't be the need for such secrecy.

Don't know if this means anything, but noticed utility marker flags in the ground at this site today, and alot of black plastic conduit.

Don't know if this means anything, but noticed utility marker flags in the ground at this site today, and alot of black plastic conduit.

That black plastic conduit was there in the spring......maybe this has been in the works a little longer than expected, or just some utility upgrade.

No, that's not big. They're not going to build a tower at $400/sf so that they can consolidate call center staff. That being said, I wouldn't rule them out.

Give me a break. The biggest knock on MidFirst building anew a year ago is that they hadn't outgrown their current digs on 44.

One thing that I also noticed about this site, is that it sits lower than the rest of downtown, at a bottom of a hill, so a 40 story at this site won't look like a true 40 story office tower compared to the rest of downtown.

You're only talking a 20 foot elevation change at most. So yes, it might look like a 39 story building. Just getting into too small of details before we even know anything about this.

You're only talking a 20 foot elevation change at most. So yes, it might look like a 39 story building. Just getting into too small of details before we even know anything about this.

I just thought I'd throw that out there, but looks more than a 20 foot dip to me...

Maybe said fantasy development will have steps leading up to it so it will be level with the average plain of downtown. No, probably not...

Give me a break. The biggest knock on MidFirst building anew a year ago is that they hadn't outgrown their current digs on 44.
And like I said BEFORE. They aren't going to build at $400 sf downtown so they can consolidate their call center staff that they are currently housing in B/C Shepherd Mall space. If they build downtown, which I hope happens, don't look for them to move their call center staff downtown when they can place them in any number of spaces around the city for much cheaper.

I don't know about that. When I worked for a large company in Tampa we had several floors of customer sevice in our downtown Tampa office tower because the CEO wanted all of his employees (minus the data center staff) in one location. We found we actualy got a better class of applicant and the employees were more productive by having them in a more high profile location. Nice surrounding have a way of bringing out the best in people. One of the problem with remote locations is that it create high turn-over because the employee doesn't see any opportunity for advancement and builds resentment between low level employees and upper management. Companies that have a mix-use of employee type in the same building seem to work the best.

At the Data Center on NW Expwy, Hertz had 90% of their IT and 30% of their Reservation at that location for a while. This was due to needed overflow of the reservation center, but no adverse effects came from it. They had about half of one floor out of the 5 floors at that location.

Ok, this is not our presumed "Mystery Tower". However, it is a cool video rendering of a fantasy residential tower in OKC that incorporates a vertical garden:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrRmJ_KwONY

I like!

The guy who created that video is Kevin Barrett. Here's a link with some more info:

Vertical Garden (3D) Project (http://www.behance.net/gallery/Vertical-Garden-(3D)/5081593)

There are a few screenshots that show the software renderings when he was designing the tower.
Obviously, the guy is really talented.

I can't figure out where that photo is shot from.

Looks to be just a little west of Classen and somewhere between 10th and 23rd

How about dropping that building on the Stage Center site? The Myriad Gardens would cross the street and go vertical.

And like I said BEFORE. They aren't going to build at $400 sf downtown so they can consolidate their call center staff that they are currently housing in B/C Shepherd Mall space. If they build downtown, which I hope happens, don't look for them to move their call center staff downtown when they can place them in any number of spaces around the city for much cheaper.

Well that's one thing OGE in weighing....

I heard something depressing last night and I certainly hope it's not true. I heard Sandridge bought the 4th and Broadway land for a parking garage. You'd think they could build on one of the closer existing parking lots. They'd better be planning for street level retail or I'll be bitterly disappointed.

Steve has said its definitely not SR.

I certainly hope you're right. I heard it from a source that I would expect to have reasonably reliable information. But, I want to be wrong.

I certainly hope you're right. I heard it from a source that I would expect to have reasonably reliable information. But, I want to be wrong.

Some of us think that MidFirst is going to build a new tower at that location................this is just a big guess though.

betts, I think there may be some confusion because it's been long known that SandRidge wants to buy the Chase Bank property at 3rd & EKG, immediately north of the Broadway/Kerr parking garage they recent purchased.

There are some SR renderings showing that garage expanded into that space.

I guess we'll just have to wait to find out. I would be a lot more excited to have a new tower as a neighbor than a new parking garage. It didn't make sense to me, because there is closer open land to Sandridge than it and commuters hate to get their feet wet, much less cross streets. But the source was a pretty good one.

Yea, it doesn't make sense to me, if SR was behind the purchase, why would they do it under 4th Street Properties, LLC? Moreover, why would they be so confidential about the purchase if it just was for a parking garage? I guess we will just have to wait and find out, like everything else....

From Steve's last chat:


Steve Lackmeyer
10:00 a.m.
An LLC is behind the purchase at NW 4 and E.K. Gaylord and so far I’ve been unable to determine who is behind the LLC. For this site to work, keep in mind half of it is owned and controlled by the Oklahoma City Urban Renewal Authority. It’s pricey piece of dirt now, so I can understand why some may think the block could be a potential skyscraper site. I do know that SandRidge Energy was trying to acquire the property earlier this year, but officials with the company say they ended the effort and they are not the buyer.


Read more: Unedited transcript of OKC Central Chat with Steve Lackmeyer, Sept. 7, 2012 | NewsOK.com (http://newsok.com/unedited-transcript-of-okc-central-chat-with-steve-lackmeyer-sept.-7-2012/article/3707702#ixzz264miqcyo)

Well I guess that answers our question, lol :cool:

From Steve's last chat:

I am relieved.