These are all the DCA nonstop cities offered by the various airlines there:


1940

Was looking at flights in January 2013 and saw United is sending us a lot of "prop love". Just about all but 1 flight a day to DEN are on a Q400.

^Ouch, a flight that takes an hr and 20 in a jet now with a prop. Most of these are actually ex-Colgan, and I'm not sure if this is a Q400 problem or just a Colgan maintenance problem but I flew Colgan's Q400s last year OKC-IAH-OKC. The entire cabin vibrated continuously while in-flight, and it was way too loud, a continuous drone in-flight as well. Once was enough, and this coming from someone who likes flying and planes in general. I'll take the ATR over the Q400 anyday though, larger overhead bins in which you can store roller carryons and it sounds much more like a jet. I'll admit though it's a good move by UA Express to cut costs, the larger turboprops are way more fuel-efficient than the RJs for such distances.

Was looking at flights in January 2013 and saw United is sending us a lot of "prop love". Just about all but 1 flight a day to DEN are on a Q400.

Change over starts next month I believe.


^Ouch, a flight that takes an hr and 20 in a jet now with a prop. Most of these are actually ex-Colgan, and I'm not sure if this is a Q400 problem or just a Colgan maintenance problem but I flew Colgan's Q400s last year OKC-IAH-OKC. The entire cabin vibrated continuously while in-flight, and it was way too loud, a continuous drone in-flight as well. Once was enough, and this coming from someone who likes flying and planes in general. I'll take the ATR over the Q400 anyday though, larger overhead bins in which you can store roller carryons and it sounds much more like a jet. I'll admit though it's a good move by UA Express to cut costs, the larger turboprops are way more fuel-efficient than the RJs for such distances.

At least the Q400 speed will be comparable to the RJs currently flying the route. The other good thing, this is a capacity increase for OKC and like you said it will lower the cost of the trip. As far as the in flight experience, sounds like something was out of sync with the anti-vibration and noise dampeners not functioning properly. I see Republic as a more stand up operation and hopefully they'll do better than Colgan.

How can that be considered a capacity increase when now we have 3 mainline and 2 RJs on the route on United? I just checked January and saw no mainline, one RJs, and some props. At least we still have mainline on Southwest and Frontier, though I like United better.

How can that be considered a capacity increase when now we have 3 mainline and 2 RJs on the route on United? I just checked January and saw no mainline, one RJs, and some props. At least we still have mainline on Southwest and Frontier, though I like United better.

The change over the Q400s looks like it is in October. I didn't realize they put in more mainline equipment here recently. Last I looked (about a month ago) we were sitting at 4 RJs and 1 A320.

Looks like in November UA is going down to just 4 daily flights as well...so yeah, I take back my capacity increase comment. They are definitely dumping capacity out of OKC it appears.

Why don't we see increased air service? Is it a lack of political clout, is it that we split meager numbers between here and Tulsa, is it people traveling through DFW, little corporate travel?

Looks like we are getting back a mainline (Airbus) to IAH. There's been a lot of talk about moving the Airbus fleet to Houston and sending more 737s to Denver. Looks like that may be happening.

Why would United do that? Perhaps maintenance streamlining at the facilities?

From what I understand, there are economical benefits to the 737 in the higher altitudes, especially in the summer. On another note, there's a lot of speculation out there that UA is looking to move some traffic out of Houston in favor of other hubs (Denver in particular) as retribution to the city of Houston for allowing Southwest to start international travel out of Hobby.

Why don't we see increased air service? Is it a lack of political clout, is it that we split meager numbers between here and Tulsa, is it people traveling through DFW, little corporate travel?

The airlines have been reducing capacity for the last few years in many markets. It's nothing to do with politics and you would be very surprised about the amount of corporate travel here. It's not insignificant.

I am flying to Denver in late September on UA for the Texans/Broncos game and I got an email this past weekend that changed my schedule. I think they may have cancelled my early afternoon flight and put everyone on a flight leaving at 10am, so it appears the shrinkage has started.

Nothing to be alarmed about, seasonal reductions go across the board.

The airlines have been reducing capacity for the last few years in many markets. It's nothing to do with politics and you would be very surprised about the amount of corporate travel here. It's not insignificant.

It's extremely political with United at Houston. They originally announced that their first 787 would fly Houston to Auckland, New Zealand, which would have been the first US airline to have a direct flight to NZ. United decided to pull that flight after Southwest won the right to fly internationally out of Hobby. Also, United has "warned" Houston that they'll be cutting many, many jobs because of the potential for lost connections at Intercontinental. It's all posturing.

It's extremely political with United at Houston. They originally announced that their first 787 would fly Houston to Auckland, New Zealand, which would have been the first US airline to have a direct flight to NZ. United decided to pull that flight after Southwest won the right to fly internationally out of Hobby. Also, United has "warned" Houston that they'll be cutting many, many jobs because of the potential for lost connections at Intercontinental. It's all posturing.

The whole UA vs WN in Houston is just stupid. UA just needed an excuse to move capacity around. WN won't be starting international flying from HOU until 2015. How a 737 to CUN or LIM can impact a 787 to Aukland is just beyond me. LOL

Like Catch22 mentioned though, these are mainly seasonal adjustments like most airlines do during the fall until the middle of November.

The whole UA vs WN in Houston is just stupid. UA just needed an excuse to move capacity around. WN won't be starting international flying from HOU until 2015. How a 737 to CUN or LIM can impact a 787 to Aukland is just beyond me. LOL

Like Catch22 mentioned though, these are mainly seasonal adjustments like most airlines do during the fall until the middle of November.

From a traveler's standpoint, I was upset. First, I want to get on a 787 soon, and second, we have family in NZ and it looked like a great opportunity to hit the 787 and NZ in one shot.

Now the first 787 "scheduled" is DEN-NRT

Houston is definitely getting the shaft from UA across the board.

It's extremely political with United at Houston. They originally announced that their first 787 would fly Houston to Auckland, New Zealand, which would have been the first US airline to have a direct flight to NZ. United decided to pull that flight after Southwest won the right to fly internationally out of Hobby. Also, United has "warned" Houston that they'll be cutting many, many jobs because of the potential for lost connections at Intercontinental. It's all posturing.

Houston and the issues with Southwest Airlines and United are a unique situation and I don't really consider that about politics anyway unless you consider any business pressures to be politics.

Now if you're talking about awarding spots in slot restricted airports politics, I might not argue about that.

It appears that any reduced capacity out of OKC is not significanly affecting our stats.

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-citys-will-rogers-world-airport-reports-growth-in-july-tulsa-airport-sees-decline/article/3703290?custom_click=pod_headline_financial-news

Pax increases are always good...but I would like to see the okc airports authority release load factor details per airline as well like more cities do. Though I guess we can get the detailed information once the dot posts them.

If someone would email the airport, and request they start including those details, I'm sure they would. I emailed them requesting them to start including passenger data per airline, and they started doing it shortly thereafter with each month's data reports.

Anyone going to purchase a United 787 ticket this weekend? If I had the cash, I'd be doing so...

A 787 was in Portland a while ago. Of course, they're made just up I-5 in Seattle.

Flight Aware shows 3 787's in the air at this time( 5:35 CDT ). One( http://flightaware.com/live/flight/JAL7) is about a third of the way through a 13 hour flight from Boston to Tokyo. 6694 miles.

^Just some FYI, while FlightAware is a good tool to have (especially for aviation enthusiasts, like me), the aircraft map is on a 5-minute delay. So the flight can be much further along than shown on the map.

The times are accurate, the map is delayed. When it says an Estimated 1:18 arrival. The flight usually touches down about 1:18.

I realized that as soon as I posted it and went to fix it, 'cause I knew someone would catch that error lol. Fixed.

Does anyone think we'll see Spirit Airlines here in the near future? I'm sure I'll get backlash over Spirit, but while I don't love their customer service and their ancillary fees, you can't really beat their fares.

While one can never say never in the airline business, I don't see OKC having the right type of business model that Spirit is seeking on a daily basis. If they were to come here, perhaps they would fly somewhere a few days a week like Florida. Spirit has a unique presence on the east coast connecting passengers to popular east coast towns like Atlantic City or Myrtle Beach. For OKC, I just don't see it.

If an airline were to start new service to the east coast from OKC, it would be AA with non-stop service to CLT ( yes, I just went there.... :) )

While one can never say never in the airline business, I don't see OKC having the right type of business model that Spirit is seeking on a daily basis. If they were to come here, perhaps they would fly somewhere a few days a week like Florida. Spirit has a unique presence on the east coast connecting passengers to popular east coast towns like Atlantic City or Myrtle Beach. For OKC, I just don't see it.

Yeah I have to agree. Spirit is cherry picking some pretty decent sized markets right now. DFW is turning into one of their larger stations. They'll get people to drive down and won't have to fly into Oklahoma at all.

http://www.spirit.com/images/base/content/page_headers/route_map.jpg


If an airline were to start new service to the east coast from OKC, it would be AA with non-stop service to CLT ( yes, I just went there.... :) )

Your scenario couldn't possibly include Doug Parker being CEO of AMR at the time, would it? ;) LOL

The only scenario I see Spirit opening service in OKC is if they do a major Denver or Las Vegas expansion again. Both are large O/D leisure markets with people searching for the lowest fare.

I couldn't imagine driving to DFW just to save money on airfare. The time cost alone is a deal breaker for me.

I couldn't imagine driving to DFW just to save money on airfare. The time cost alone is a deal breaker for me.

plus don't forget the money you'll spend to park and gas money to get there and back.

I couldn't imagine driving to DFW just to save money on airfare. The time cost alone is a deal breaker for me.

You'll probably be shocked on how many people actually do it though. Especially when Spirit offers their $9 air fares...well then add in 5 billion in fees. LOL

Does anyone think we'll see Spirit Airlines here in the near future? I'm sure I'll get backlash over Spirit, but while I don't love their customer service and their ancillary fees, you can't really beat their fares.

I'm flying Spirit for the first time next month. The fare was low but for what they charge you for a checked or even a carry on bag I don't know if it's worth it for most people.

I couldn't imagine driving to DFW just to save money on airfare. The time cost alone is a deal breaker for me.

The time sucked, but with parking and a hotel figured in, I still saved almost $350 for my family last year. Saving another $300 this fall doing the same. I don't like it, but I can't pass up that type of savings when money is tight.

I fly internationally only about three times a year, but each time, I depart from Dallas because it's so much cheaper and without and the myriad of connections required from OKC. Domestically, I do most of my flying from here in OKC, but there's just too much savings and convenience when leaving from Dallas that I can't not do it.

Easiest question of the day:

What is the model of the FedEx plane that flies into WRWA? I'm presuming that it's an Airbus, but the way it lumbers in for landing, it looks much bigger than a 737-style plane.

(Oh, the things I think about while stuck in I-44 traffic!)

767?

767?

No plane that big flies into WRWA on a regular basis. The FedEx plane is an Airbus A310.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/FDX1472

I believe the biggest plane that flies in/out of OKC (diversions excluded) is a B757, which UPS uses.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/UPS734

A310 is larger than a 757.

FedEx goes between the A310 and A300 depending on load requirements.

As far as size of aircraft. The A310 is a wide body whereas the 757 is a narrowbody. Both I believe still operate as "heavies" as far as ATC is concerned (I think the 757 is more because of wing tip vorticies). However, the 757-200 which UPS operates in is about 2 feet longer than the A310, but the A310 cabin is about 7ft wider. The A310 also has a higher MTOW (max takeoff weight) of 312k lbs, versus the 757 which as 255k lbs. So depending on how you look at it, the A310 is bigger. The A310 is actually more comparable to the 767-200 than the 757.

FedEx goes between the A310 and A300 depending on load requirements.

As far as size of aircraft. The A310 is a wide body whereas the 757 is a narrowbody. Both I believe still operate as "heavies" as far as ATC is concerned (I think the 757 is more because of wing tip vorticies). However, the 757-200 which UPS operates in is about 2 feet longer than the A310, but the A310 cabin is about 7ft wider. The A310 also has a higher MTOW (max takeoff weight) of 312k lbs, versus the 757 which as 255k lbs. So depending on how you look at it, the A310 is bigger. The A310 is actually more comparable to the 767-200 than the 757.

I stand corrected. My apologies, I mistakingly put the A310 in the (narrow-body) A320 family.

On a different topic, what are the chances OKC gets more service to the NYC area in the next 5-10 years. It would be great to have an option to go from OKC-JFK in order to expand our international options.

I stand corrected. My apologies, I mistakingly put the A310 in the (narrow-body) A320 family.

On a different topic, what are the chances OKC gets more service to the NYC area in the next 5-10 years. It would be great to have an option to go from OKC-JFK in order to expand our international options.

Put up a paper with numbers from 1 to 100 and throw a dart...that'll give you your percentage chance. :)

NYC still is not a Top 10 market with it comes to O&D and has never gone back to 2 flights a day. There is a chance we could see DL or AA add service to either LGA or JFK at some point, but I'm not holding my breath. Right now outside of getting JetBlue to fly to OKC, I see the nonstop market to New York being pretty flat. Of course if you can predict what is going to happen in this industry more than a few months out, you are pretty good. :)

As an AA EXP, I would love to see a Jetblue flight to JFK that I could interline to Europe. Or even an AA flight LGA would help vs. UA to EWR which is ridiculously expensive at times. The more competition and choices the better.

The airline industry is going through what I feel is a very unique transition period. The business model is quite different from what it was even a decade ago. Years from now we'll look back and think "remember when we had XX number of airlines" at OKC. I believe the airlines have done enough research at every airport and feel that what OKC has is about as good as it can get right now. If an airline saw there being a potential for profit here, trust me, they'd jump all over it.

That's just my .02$.

The only area I see that "could" perhaps have a chance of starting up here would be someone flying us to the Pacific NW. But, for now, that may be years from happening.

This could be a fuel saving break through for air travel...


http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid1847329143?bckey=AQ~~%2cAAAAAEhanPQ~%2cgw69Hq ZGImteTrVx81v9ivVUQcd8j23_&bclid=0&bctid=1317928787001

A note about the 757 and it being a "heavy"-as venture said it's considered a heavy purely for wake turbulence separation. It doesn't have an official "heavy" designation like the 310 or the 767. The 757 has particularly dangerous wake turbulence because of its airfoil shape-which is a supercritical airfoil. There are plenty of resources on this material in books and on the web. Also, the lack of any separaton between the aileron and the edge of the wing flaps on such a wing also contributes to this phenomenon, as this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tc2AiqpEg3M) video shows.

Speaking of 757's, I was at DEN recently and noticed United had a 757 flying non-stop to...Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I couldn't figure out why...tourists going to Yellowstone? It was on a Sunday afternoon.

Speaking of 757's, I was at DEN recently and noticed United had a 757 flying non-stop to...Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I couldn't figure out why...tourists going to Yellowstone? It was on a Sunday afternoon.

That, skiing and a couple other large national parks in the area, most of their flights are seasonal

That, skiing and a couple other large national parks in the area, most of their flights are seasonal

This is exactly why. Vale, Steamboat Springs, and other smaller resort towns in the Rockies get mainline service this time of year through early Spring.

Speaking of 757s into resort towns, having flown into KJAC a number of times on a 757... I would highly suggest putting it on your bucket list of things to do if you're an aviation nerd like many of us are. The power of the engines on an incredibly short runway are very exciting.

Speaking of 757s into resort towns, having flown into KJAC a number of times on a 757... I would highly suggest putting it on your bucket list of things to do if you're an aviation nerd like many of us are. The power of the engines on an incredibly short runway are very exciting.

Would that require getting some sort of pilot's license first? :eek:

ljbab: Naw. no pilots license is necessary, AA, DL and UA all fly into KJAC at some point during the year in a 757. Find an empty seat on any flight and enjoy. However, if you have the time and patience to fly a 757 into KJAC, then go right ahead and fly one in yourself. Though, I feel that by the time you're in line to actually pilot one of those, the 757 may be no more. Sad really, she's the perfect plane to fly into short runway towns or high altitude. Ive linked video below for those have not had the enjoyment to listen to the engines really roar. Im thinking we should have a new thread dedicated to airplane landings and take offs in Oklahoma airports. Commercial or general aviation.

JacksonHole2009 757 take off - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDub49KD4ek)

There are a whole lot of videos for OKC on Youtube, just type "takeoff oklahoma city" or "landing oklahoma city" on Youtube and you'll get plenty.

As for the 757 (both 200 and 300), they will be around for at least 5 more years or so before the fleet starts getting too old to be flown, but there has been a renewed interest shown recently in at least studying an aircraft replacement for the 757.

OUman, yes, you can find lots of videos on youtube..I was referring to our own landings and take offs being uploaded... :) And, not just commercial landings, but GA ones too. Cheers!

Ahh ok, yeah that would be cool.

Skywest Airlines announced that they have reached an agreement to provide flights for American Eagle using 50 seaters, aka ... CRJ-200's out of LAX and D/FW

These will replace the ERJ-140'S.

Im guessing Lawton may be in line to see some of these. In another tidbit, I see Skywest also signed an agreement to fly for USAirways. Hmm..let's the rumormill start on this one... American Eagle and USAirways both in a codeshare agreement. I know it probably means nothing since Skywest flies for just about anyone, but still.... hmmmm

Skywest Airlines announced that they have reached an agreement to provide flights for American Eagle using 50 seaters, aka ... CRJ-200's out of LAX and D/FW

These will replace the ERJ-140'S.

Im guessing Lawton may be in line to see some of these. In another tidbit, I see Skywest also signed an agreement to fly for USAirways. Hmm..let's the rumormill start on this one... American Eagle and USAirways both in a codeshare agreement. I know it probably means nothing since Skywest flies for just about anyone, but still.... hmmmm

Its only a matter of time before US/AA merge. Then we'll have the "prophecy" fulfilled of just 3 large major airlines plus Southwest to control the market. Yeah there are the other guys like JetBlue, Virgin, Allegiant, Spirit and Froniter...but nothing like what we use to have.

The OO (SkyWest) deal for Eagle is a good one. The big one will be the awarding of over 220 additional large RJs for flying under the American Eagle banner. This is going to be huge in getting markets that should be with 70+ seaters up to snuff. Though you have to wonder just how much longer the 50 seaters can hold on. The ERJ-135s are all but dead...now the -140s are next in line. I'm pretty sure DL already parked all of the old CRJ-440s that Comair and Mesaba use to operate. Then of course the DorkJet rocket ship is already out to pasture. It will just be nice to finally see larger jets put into slot controlled markets to increase capacity instead of trying to cram in more 50 seaters.

Do you think an AA/US merger means increased east coast service from OKC or will they continue to funnel us through Dallas and Chicago?