Not sure if this has been published. But, if not, this is pretty neat presentation that rank % growth for the top 53 Metros from 2010 to 2017. OKC came in 18th out of 53 markets reported for population growth.

https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2018/03/22/austins-population-keeps-popping-heres-how-many.html#g/431332/1

18. Oklahoma City, OK


2010 population 1,252,991
2015 population 1,358,452
2017 population 1,383,737
2010-17 change 10.43%
Change 18 (of) 53

One of my sources has OKC 2016 population as 1,373,211: Fact Finder https://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=bkmk

We had an average annual growth of around 21,000 from 2010-2015; population growth slowed to 10,000 plus following 2015.

10,526 difference in 2016-17. Predict at least 1,425,000 low to a high 1,502,000 in 2020

[QUOTE=Naptown12713;1027393]Not sure if this has been published. But, if not, this is pretty neat presentation that rank % growth for the top 53 Metros from 2010 to 2017. OKC came in 18th out of 53 markets reported for population growth. Go to: austinbizjournal.com

I prefer we dont look to Arkansas or Kansas for inspiration, but instead to Colorado. Just think, not too long ago Oklahoma was a larger population than Colorado, which just had Denver. What has CO done with Denver's lead, that has made them the GO-TO state/city for the entire West not named California?

I bet there are very many ideas that could be implemented in Oklahoma, one of which I recommend is a commitment for a separation of Church and State; you know, that is IN the constitution. Adopting this idea would force government to govern rather than tie up the floor with social influence in the guise of religious freedom. The growth model, sustainable growth, with cultural similarities - is readily available to the Northwest - in Colorado which once was just a tourist and federal government destination not that long ago. .....

Oklahoma lacks the stunning mountain scenery of Colorado, along with the skiing that comes with it. The gateway rocks to the Garden of the Gods with Pikes Peak in the background is hard to beat for natural beauty. The song "America the Beautiful" was inspired from the view atop Pikes Peak. If I wasn't such a dang homebody, I would have moved to the front range of Colorado long ago for just the pretty mountain scenery alone. With my postal job, I could have simply put in a request to transfer there and just wait for a new job opening. Indeed, a married couple where I worked chose to get transferred to Castle Rock, CO. But being a homebody runs in my family. Neither my parents or two brothers ever lived permanently further away than one county boundary away from where they grew up.

In the earlier days, oil was a bigger draw to Oklahoma than gold was to Colorado. You couldn't run the hit new invention of the automobile on gold.

The concept of of separation of church and state in Oklahoma is interestingly incongruent. Rep. Ritze, who was totally behind the Ten Commandments monument fiasco at the state capitol, won reelection in 2016 by nearly 70% of the vote. Yet, that same year Oklahoma voters turned down the question that would have changed the state constitution to permit the return of the the Ten Commandments monument outside the state capitol.

Anyway, I'm convinced that Oklahomans are going to have to take control over what has been going on at the state capitol, if they really care and want CHANGE. If they don't care, then expect more of the same. In other words, Cornett will be elected as governor, instead of the Democrat Edmondson.

Don't forget the CHUD problem in Oklahoma City. Lots of cannibalistic humanoid underground dwellers living in the sewers around OKC. It's a widely known problem and a reason why people don't move here along with sharknadoes.

Fortunately the CHUDs have managed to keep the Sewer Clown problem in check.

guys, I didn't mean the geographical adoption - there's no way in heck that OK could ever hope to compete or grow from that prospective.

I'm talking about the government and way of thought that exists in Colorado. IMO, both states are "former" frontier Western states with two large urban metro areas and vast rural. Granted, Colorado's is a bit more concentrated due to the huge continental mountains but I think the Mindset of Colorado in governing and their approach to public use is what I'd like Oklahoma to benchmark.

In reality, Oklahoma City has some HUGE similarities to Denver which I list as follows:

1) largest city and metro in the state and significant player in the region beyond
2) city hosts a major federal government center
3) capital city
4) arguably the most progressive area in the state, more purple than red in OKC/more blue than purple in Denver
5) energy as a major industry sector
6) fairly recent urban center expansion (Denver in the 1990s, OKC in the 2000s) - although Denver never really saw the decline or flight that OKC did
7) ties to Football (I bet, if Dallas wasn't so close, there'd be many more Denver Broncos fans in OKC, just as there are very many OU fans in Denver despite UC)
8)

Main differences:

1) GEOGRAPHY: OKC has no major geography nearby; Denver obviously has 14,400 ft continental mountains less than 20 miles west, OKC has the beginning of the Great Plains in it's west metro area.
2) COMPETITION: Denver lacks a larger major metropolitan area in close proximity; OKC has Dallas Ft Worth 200 miles away. OKC also has more competition with smaller metros nearby in Tulsa, Little Rock and Wichita to some degree (particularly TUL).
3) IDEALS/CULTURE: Denver has much more control over the state/region than OKC. Denver had the true frontier mentality where law and order meant establishment of Denver as the base. However, OKC was A center of many in the frontier therefore never really got much control until recently.
4) GOVERNMENT: Colorado is set up for Denver to succeed and compete with major metros in the US (and internationally). The rewards of jobs and growth is cherished in Colorado as a means of success for the state as a whole (which is then shared with the rural) vs. the approach in Oklahoma, which is to hold back OKC from getting too big so that the rural can have a place in government. I'd argue even more that Tulsa is being held back by this but also holds OKC back with its competitive nature, something that Colorado Springs does not do with Denver.

It is #4 that I think we can most learn from Denver and Colorado, and if we did adopt some change to where OKC could really take off and compete nationally - the entire state would benefit in the same way. Again, just look at population back in 1980s, Oklahoma was much larger despite Denver already being a larger city/metro and major federal center, big difference now and this is what I think we CAN learn.

The rural in Oklahoma need to recognize that they DONT have as much play as population centers but that they should consolidate resources so that Oklahoma City can compete and win in the national/international stage and Tulsa can compete and win in the regional/national. I think this is key to the success of Oklahoma - must change the government and ideals and prosper from growth rather than restrict it.

We are now last in everything good and first in everything bad.

This type of exaggeration is exactly what I’m talking about. It’s obviously untrue, but posters’ literally respond to my comment with more of the same claims without evidence.

4) GOVERNMENT: Colorado is set up for Denver to succeed and compete with major metros in the US (and internationally). The rewards of jobs and growth is cherished in Colorado as a means of success for the state as a whole (which is then shared with the rural) vs. the approach in Oklahoma, which is to hold back OKC from getting too big so that the rural can have a place in government. I'd argue even more that Tulsa is being held back by this but also holds OKC back with its competitive nature, something that Colorado Springs does not do with Denver.

Good points in your post, but this is spot on. I have firsthand experience with Colorado, and you're right the state works for Denver to succeed. Everything is centered around what is best for Denver and to a lesser extent the mountain towns since that is such a big tourist draw. The rural areas have little to no say and when they have complained about that they are quickly put in their place. I would love to see this model replicated in Oklahoma where OKC and Tulsa, in a combined effort, rule the state and set themselves up to be successful on a national/international stage. The only way that is going to happen is if the two metros put aside their differences and work together.

Good points in your post, but this is spot on. I have firsthand experience with Colorado, and you're right the state works for Denver to succeed. Everything is centered around what is best for Denver and to a lesser extent the mountain towns since that is such a big tourist draw. The rural areas have little to no say and when they have complained about that they are quickly put in their place. I would love to see this model replicated in Oklahoma where OKC and Tulsa, in a combined effort, rule the state and set themselves up to be successful on a national/international stage. The only way that is going to happen is if the two metros put aside their differences and work together.

You nailed it, BG918.

I'd venture to add Lawton to the list. I'd like to see a huge development corridor stretching from Lawton to OKC to Tulsa. Have the Big Three (so to speak) rule the roost in the state.

One major problem in Oklahoma (and Kansas) is that the rural counties still have too much power and influence in the legislature. Case in point the Speaker of the House represents Atoka and the President Pro Tem of the Senate represents Altus. The main population centers are larger in surrounding states like Texas, Colorado and Missouri so the rural politicians are more evenly matched or drowned out by the urban politicians. The Denver metro, for example, dominates the political world in Colorado which has skewed what once was a solid Republican state toward a Blue State that works for the new economy they are developing there (technology & aerospace).

Oklahoma has struggled with this identity for awhile and needs to accept that it’s a majority urban/suburban state with 2/3 of the state population living in the OKC and Tulsa metros. As I mentioned before if you combine the CSA’s that is 2.6 million people in relative close proximity to each other. The way you need to govern for an urban economy vs rural economy in the 21st century is very different.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.
Exactly how many is "many goodbyes" to people leaving? Just curious.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.

Did you even follow the link at the top of the page? The one that has OKC’s population growth as of 2017 at 18th among large metro areas? That’s right between the SLC and DC metros, not terrible company to be keeping.

The idea that OKC isn’t growing just fine is just horribly transparent fear-mongering by people who hate the political status quo.

Case in point: “We need something to change this November”. Folks, this is how you know people are trying to sell you a political ideology rather than engaging in rational discussion. At least he’s up front about it though.

I have a friend in Louisville that complains about the Kentucky government just like many do in OK. Apparently they have a similar urban vs rural divide with rural interests often overshadowing the efforts of the urban metros of Louisville and Lexington. And he says people there often talk up Tennessee and nearby Nashville just like people in Oklahoma talk up Texas and DFW.

By the way if you have never been to Louisville it’s worth a trip. The bourbon distilleries outside of town are also fun to check out.

From anecdotal evidence I have read, heard, seen it seems like for every 1 person/family leaving for greener pastures it seems like 1.5 persons/families are coming here for...well, greener pastures.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.

Do you even read some of the bile you write? OKC has never been dwindling. But I won't let facts get in the way of your great story!

Do you even read some of the bile you write? OKC has never been dwindling. But I won't let facts get in the way of your great story!

Not taking one side or the other, just want to provide some information. The OKC metro population is seeing a downward trend when it comes to population growth. For both overall net growth to net migration growth.

Here are the census numbers (https://www.recenter.tamu.edu/data/population#!/msa/Oklahoma_City%2C_OK) for the OKC metro. 2017 numbers are missing but I believe OKC only few by 11,000 or so, continuing the downward trend.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.

I wish they’d just delete some on your posts because they have absolutely no factual basis. Even when you are confronted with hard data and facts you remain defiant. Your posts are fake news.

This is very true. The census numbers bear this argument out. Hopefully Tulsa will get moving again and OKC will not continue to dwindle. I know it is entirely anecdotal, but I've said many goodbyes the last couple of years to smart people who were really committed to living here, and even liked it a great deal. They just got fed up with the atmosphere of dumbf-ckistan and bailed, mostly because they have young children and do not want to submit them to this kind of a hostile environment. The bubble of OKC is not enough to prevent it.

Hopefully the tide turns soon, and by soon I mean this November. We need to see several new faces in the legislature or I'm concerned OKC could lose a lot of momentum.

Your examples who left and their attitudes .... reminds me of Will Rogers saying that when the Okies migrated to California, it raised the IQ of both states. ��

lol, and probably very true actually.

The Real Estate center at Texas A&M finally updated their census population figures for the metro areas across the country to include 2017.

Here is Oklahoma City’s page (https://www.recenter.tamu.edu/data/population#!/msa/Oklahoma_City%2C_OK), as posted before.

2017 Population Numbers:

Overall growth was 11,274, down from 16,345, for a one year growth rate of 0.821. Domestic in-migration dropped from 5,296 to 248. Births, deaths and international migration all stayed about the same from 2016.

I wish they’d just delete some on your posts because they have absolutely no factual basis. Even when you are confronted with hard data and facts you remain defiant. Your posts are fake news.

I mean, I don't know him personally, and he didn't tell me goodbye, but we fit that description (sorta). It's why we're both supporting the walkout on social media from 700 miles away.

Rover and HOT ROD that's easy to say until you're faced with the consequences of status quo.

I mean, I don't know him personally, and he didn't tell me goodbye, but we fit that description (sorta). It's why we're both supporting the walkout on social media from 700 miles away.

Rover and HOT ROD that'sf easy to say until you're faced with the consequences of status quo.
Why are you trolling me now? Easy to be snide to someone you haven’t met and have no idea about. At least I’ve stayed here and worked to make it better instead of hightailing it out and taking pot shots. We need doers, not quitters.

Why are you trolling me now? Easy to be snide to someone you haven’t met and have no idea about. At least I’ve stayed here and worked to make it better instead of hightailing it out and taking pot shots. We need doers, not quitters.

Easy to be snide about someone you haven't met? That's exactly what you're doing. We didn't leave for political reasons, we left for the sake of our kid. Trust me, wasn't our first choice to take a loss on a 2 year old home but we wanted her in a better situation. Some things just come up that throw a wrench in your plans. We were champions for OKC our entire 8 years there, and still are. We just had a unique case.

To put these numbers in perspective, this is the lowest growth rate since 2003-04, that's not good.

To put these numbers in perspective, this is the lowest growth rate since 2003-04, that's not good.

Neither is $40 oil.

Did everyone really expect we’d continue growing at the same pace during a bust? The economy is getting diversified but it’s not that diversified yet.

Neither is $40 oil.
Really depends on who you're talking to, sadly.

I actually expected the growth, if you can call it that, to be even lower based on the fact that there was an oil bust so bad, it has its own Wikipedia article.

Having growth at all surprised me.

When there’s no negative net loss with either domestic in-migration and international migration, but both are low, the growth comes from a higher birth rate than death rate. The 2017 growth for OKC mainly came from having more births than deaths. Migration to OKC (both domestic and international) was less than 4,000. Meaning the other 7,000 plus came from new births.

A few years ago, the state passed a law making it illegal to hire non USA residents. I have a builder friend who said that since then he's had a hard time finding construction laborers. Not sure if that has changed but it could be a part of this out bound migration ?

A few years ago, the state passed a law making it illegal to hire non USA residents. I have a builder friend who said that since then he's had a hard time finding construction laborers. Not sure if that has changed but it could be a part of this out bound migration ?

No, international migration went basically unchanged for OKC. It was domestic in-migration that took a loss. Domestic in-migration is when other people leaving in the US move to other US location. When there’s a positive net gain, that means more moves to an area than left it. When it’s a negative net loss, more people left the area than moved to it.

No, international migration went basically unchanged for OKC. It was domestic in-migration that took a loss. Domestic in-migration is when other people leaving in the US move to other US location. When there’s a positive net gain, that means more moves to an area than left it. When it’s a negative net loss, more people left the area than moved to it.

Mick Cornett was correct; our economy is not as dependent on the energy sector as it was in the 80s. OKC's corporate portfolio is more diversified; less dependent & vulnerable where one sector's down slide misguides everything off course.

Lost jobs in the energy sector did impact our economy.

Mick Cornett was correct; our economy is not as dependent on the energy sector as it was in the 80s. OKC's corporate portfolio is more diversified; less dependent & vulnerable where one sector's down slide misguides everything off course.

Lost jobs in the energy sector did impact our economy.

If oil stays around 55 to 70 dollars you’ll see significant growth again. Add to the new corporation and jobs that have been hinted, but yet to be announced, and OKC should have a good year in 2018, as far as growth goes.

If oil stays around 55 to 70 dollars you’ll see significant growth again. Add to the new corporation and jobs that have been hinted, but yet to be announced, and OKC should have a good year in 2018, as far as growth goes.

I don't expect there to be significant oil and gas industry employment growth with the price of oil going up. The industry has been focusing on optimizing operations to do more with lower headcount. They'll have to employ more workers for rigs, but I don't think we will see a return of the white collar jobs located in the HQs in the city.

I don't expect there to be significant oil and gas industry employment growth with the price of oil going up. The industry has been focusing on optimizing operations to do more with lower headcount. They'll have to employ more workers for rigs, but I don't think we will see a return of the white collar jobs located in the HQs in the city.

I agree with you about companies getting really big, but I think as oil continues to stay steady, we'll just see more and more small companies created (as we are seeing currently) so we might see an increase in headcount, just decentralized across a bigger number of smaller, more focused shops.

I agree with you about companies getting really big, but I think as oil continues to stay steady, we'll just see more and more small companies created (as we are seeing currently) so we might see an increase in headcount, just decentralized across a bigger number of smaller, more focused shops.

Yeah I could see that happening as well.

I agree with you about companies getting really big, but I think as oil continues to stay steady, we'll just see more and more small companies created (as we are seeing currently) so we might see an increase in headcount, just decentralized across a bigger number of smaller, more focused shops.

Ahh, yes, excellent point.

If oil stays around 55 to 70 dollars you’ll see significant growth again. Add to the new corporation and jobs that have been hinted, but yet to be announced, and OKC should have a good year in 2018, as far as growth goes.

Yeah, assuming the strongest earthquakes continue to stay out of the OKC metro and only stick to the little towns well out in the middle of nowhere.

No, international migration went basically unchanged for OKC. It was domestic in-migration that took a loss. Domestic in-migration is when other people leaving in the US move to other US location. When there’s a positive net gain, that means more moves to an area than left it. When it’s a negative net loss, more people left the area than moved to it.

OKC was a very attractive relocation destination during the Great Recession. High oil prices during the era helped protect this city from the worst of it. OKC enjoyed an unemployment rate of 5% when places like Charlotte were still over 10%. I think the slow down in domestic migration is simply because the rest of the country is doing much better now and at the same time, OKC's economy has cooled off. It's not horrible by any means but it isn't what it was back around 2012-13 during the last oil boom.

While I think it's probably okay to say that OKC's economy has cooled off, I'd use that term loosely. As of March the Metro has a 3.6% unemployment rate and that's with a record high 680,489 people in the labor force.

Yeah, assuming the strongest earthquakes continue to stay out of the OKC metro and only stick to the little towns well out in the middle of nowhere.

The earthquakes have been less and less. Please don’t show your political position and detour a thread.

The earthquakes have been less and less. Please don’t show your political position and detour a thread.

It most certainly isn't a political position. What it is is a big worry, quite easily denied, if you never sense them. That they're not happening as often doesn't come with a guarantee that another big one won't happen. But then a big earthquake in OKC may not effect its population growth any more than earthquakes adversely affected California's population boom.

The earthquakes have been less and less. Please don’t show your political position and detour a thread.

It is posts that this that derail threads into the hole of the politics forum. There was nothing either partisan or ideological in the post by Bunty. Is it the position of either of the political parties in Oklahoma to be pro earthquake or indifferent to the destruction of private property? Is it an ideological point that is exclusive to one ideology over the other? You are the one attempting to detour this thread, please knock it off.

It is posts that this that derail threads into the hole of the politics forum. There was nothing either partisan or ideological in the post by Bunty. Is it the position of either of the political parties in Oklahoma to be pro earthquake or indifferent to the destruction of private property? Is it an ideological point that is exclusive to one ideology over the other? You are the one attempting to detour this thread, please knock it off.

Wow��

It is posts that this that derail threads into the hole of the politics forum. There was nothing either partisan or ideological in the post by Bunty. Is it the position of either of the political parties in Oklahoma to be pro earthquake or indifferent to the destruction of private property? Is it an ideological point that is exclusive to one ideology over the other? You are the one attempting to detour this thread, please knock it off.

LOL, Interesting how you didn't include this last part of my quote: "But then a big earthquake in OKC may not effect its population growth any more than earthquakes adversely affected California's population boom."

How the political situation at the State Capitol may be discouraging population growth was brought up in this lengthy thread before. Where were you then? Rather than complaining, why don't you add something new, interesting and pertinent, if you know of anything, to the subject being discussed, which is Population Growth for OKC.

LOL, Interesting how you didn't include this last part of my quote: "But then a big earthquake in OKC may not effect its population growth any more than earthquakes adversely affected California's population boom."

How the political situation at the State Capitol may be discouraging population growth was brought up in this lengthy thread before. Where were you then? Rather than complaining, why don't you add something new, interesting and pertinent, if you know of anything, to the subject being discussed, which is Population Growth for OKC.
WTF?? Really?

I think you guys are saying the same thing.

Before I get jumped. I’m not even remotely close to being a backer of anything OK state legislature stands for. I’m a hard moderate/libertarian.

All I’m saying is that it seems earthquakes aren’t reall the issue they once were with so many regulations on drilling. Just my two cents.

Forgive me if this has already been discussed... but what sort of "pie in the sky" project would really accelerate population growth for OKC?

If the state/city could pick from anything (not counting Amazon HQ2) I wonder what would be the "perfect" employer/development/attraction/whatever to really push growth rates up? We know we need economic diversity, but that can be tough for say, a tech company, to relocate here due to the fact that there isn't a large talent pool to recruit from.

Has this sort of question been studied extensively? From my casual observations, it seems that a few home-grown companies striking gold is really what tends to create jobs and drive population growth. Perhaps 2-3 biotech companies develop a series of hit products that cause their companies to grow to ~1,000 employees? When DVN & CHK were on a growth tear, that obviously created jobs but I think that even if oil hit $120 tomorrow, you'd see some restraint in hiring compared to the last boom.

Is corporate re-location the most desirable for population growth?

OKC was a very attractive relocation destination during the Great Recession. High oil prices during the era helped protect this city from the worst of it. OKC enjoyed an unemployment rate of 5% when places like Charlotte were still over 10%. I think the slow down in domestic migration is simply because the rest of the country is doing much better now and at the same time, OKC's economy has cooled off. It's not horrible by any means but it isn't what it was back around 2012-13 during the last oil boom.

Does that not then speak to the vulnerability of OKC and it needing record crude oil prices for its net domestic migration rate to be in the 8,000 to 10,000 range? Similar markets, population wise, like Raleigh and Jacksonville have consistently seen domestic migration numbers in the 15,000-20,000 range since 2013.

Charlotte may have had a higher unemployment rate, but that never affected their growth. Their net domestic rate stayed fairly consistent as did their overall growth.

Does that not then speak to the vulnerability of OKC and it needing record crude oil prices for its net domestic migration rate to be in the 8,000 to 10,000 range? Similar markets, population wise, like Raleigh and Jacksonville have consistently seen domestic migration numbers in the 15,000-20,000 range since 2013.

Charlotte may have had a higher unemployment rate, but that never affected their growth. Their net domestic rate stayed fairly consistent as did their overall growth.

Charlotte's economy was abysmal early in this decade. I am surprised that the growth rate didn't take a huge hit. I believe the benefits Charlotte offers such as a high quality of life and low cost of living compared to the Northeast (where most of its transplants come from) helped keep people moving there. The city had quite a bit of momentum prior to the recession.

OKC on the other hand has a local economy that is out of sync with the national economy due to reliance on oil and gas. What this town really needs to take off is a successful homegrown company in some sector other than energy. I think a major corporate relocation would be a long shot right now. I am not going to give my own opinion on why since I know I'll be attacked if I do, but does anybody actually think the current situation at 23rd and Lincoln is good for OKC? Are the priorities of state lawmakers indicative of a state that wants to attract and retain an educated workforce? I think a lot of people underestimate how dire that situation currently is.

Charlotte's economy was abysmal early in this decade. I am surprised that the growth rate didn't take a huge hit. I believe the benefits Charlotte offers such as a high quality of life and low cost of living compared to the Northeast (where most of its transplants come from) helped keep people moving there. The city had quite a bit of momentum prior to the recession.

OKC on the other hand has a local economy that is out of sync with the national economy due to reliance on oil and gas. What this town really needs to take off is a successful homegrown company in some sector other than energy. I think a major corporate relocation would be a long shot right now. I am not going to give my own opinion on why since I know I'll be attacked if I do, but does anybody actually think the current situation at 23rd and Lincoln is good for OKC? Are the priorities of state lawmakers indicative of a state that wants to attract and retain an educated workforce? I think a lot of people underestimate how dire that situation currently is.

Agree, I won't expound on my response for the reason you indicated but just yesterday a neighbor knowing I am an OK native commented how my home State is near last in economic, health political and q of l measures. People tend to not move to areas with that kind of performance

Agree, I won't expound on my response for the reason you indicated but just yesterday a neighbor knowing I am an OK native commented how my home State is near last in economic, health political and q of l measures. People tend to not move to areas with that kind of performance

I have some friends that recently moved to Norman from Denver. One of them has ties to OK so not completely out of the blue but their rationale was that for similar salaries to what they were both making in Denver they can buy twice the house and still have money leftover living in Norman. They are also playing the long game of expecting Oklahoma to eventually improve its standing due to its abundant natural resources, mild climate and central location as a spillover for fast-growing Texas. One of the first rules of investing in something is buy low, especially when everyone is cautioning against it. Then hold as it hopefully rises in value. That is their opinion of Oklahoma; right now things are a mess but there is potential for things to get better and for OK to be a high growth state similar to how Tennessee has turned itself around.

Charlotte's economy was abysmal early in this decade. I am surprised that the growth rate didn't take a huge hit. I believe the benefits Charlotte offers such as a high quality of life and low cost of living compared to the Northeast (where most of its transplants come from) helped keep people moving there. The city had quite a bit of momentum prior to the recession.

OKC on the other hand has a local economy that is out of sync with the national economy due to reliance on oil and gas. What this town really needs to take off is a successful homegrown company in some sector other than energy. I think a major corporate relocation would be a long shot right now. I am not going to give my own opinion on why since I know I'll be attacked if I do, but does anybody actually think the current situation at 23rd and Lincoln is good for OKC? Are the priorities of state lawmakers indicative of a state that wants to attract and retain an educated workforce? I think a lot of people underestimate how dire that situation currently is.

Ummm have you heard of Paycom? This is already happening with several companies outside of the energy industry.

No one thinks what's going on at the capital is good for OKC, most of us just don't take the hardline stance that it's the cause of all of our problems like you do. I think because of your views, you vastly overestimate how dire that situation is.

I have some friends that recently moved to Norman from Denver. One of them has ties to OK so not completely out of the blue but their rationale was that for similar salaries to what they were both making in Denver they can buy twice the house and still have money leftover living in Norman. They are also playing the long game of expecting Oklahoma to eventually improve its standing due to its abundant natural resources, mild climate and central location as a spillover for fast-growing Texas. One of the first rules of investing in something is buy low, especially when everyone is cautioning against it. Then hold as it hopefully rises in value. That is their opinion of Oklahoma; right now things are a mess but there is potential for things to get better and for OK to be a high growth state similar to how Tennessee has turned itself around.

I agree with this sentiment. I won't be surprised if we start seeing some people flee from Denver and DFW Metro towards OKC in the next few years because of the soaring cost of living. DFW is growing so fast, they can't keep up with it and it's causing the cost of living to grow quite fast. It's not on par with Denver but it's continuing to go up. Nevermind the traffic headaches. As much as we would like to see OKC growing like Dallas, it's really a good thing we aren't. Steady growth is better than explosive growth because it allows the city to keep up and adapt to it. And as much as I would like to have seen OKC get Amazon HQ2, it's a good thing we didnt!

Agree, I won't expound on my response for the reason you indicated but just yesterday a neighbor knowing I am an OK native commented how my home State is near last in economic, health political and q of l measures. People tend to not move to areas with that kind of performance

Life is how you make it. I assume you're doing fine in Oklahoma and don't contribute to why Oklahoma ranks so low in quality of life rankings. Oklahoma people who aren't doing well might as well move out, such as those living in poverty. Many other states through government programs treat the poor and/or disabled better. Food stamps have been cut. So it's mainly just poor people who should avoid Oklahoma like the plague.

Ummm have you heard of Paycom? This is already happening with several companies outside of the energy industry.

No one thinks what's going on at the capital is good for OKC, most of us just don't take the hardline stance that it's the cause of all of our problems like you do. I think because of your views, you vastly overestimate how dire that situation is.

Every state legislature is a little nutty.

I like how the flow of this thread is praising and jealous of charlotte with no mention that the NC legislature cost them an NBA all star game and and the NCAA tournament lol

Every state legislature is a little nutty.

I like how the flow of this thread is praising and jealous of charlotte with no mention that the NC legislature cost them an NBA all star game and and the NCAA tournament lol

Exactly, it’s funny how BChris always conveniently forgets that when talking about Charlotte and North Carolina vs. Oklahoma.

^^^ North Carolina is a solid middle-of-the-pack state when it comes to things like education and is one of the better states in the South. To most people, this is a much bigger factor than political culture. As you mention, North Carolina does have a socially regressive legislature. It's not as far right as Oklahoma's but it is dominated by the Christian Right and in fact they are worried about it costing Raleigh the Amazon HQ.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/the-unspoken-factor-in-amazons-search-for-a-new-home-jeff-bezoss-support-for-gay-rights/2018/04/20/9cfa8c66-31e6-11e8-8bdd-cdb33a5eef83_story.html?utm_term=.8edd999a0639

Still, North Carolina is at least in the running for the HQ and Oklahoma isn't. Why is that and what needs to change to make the state more competitive?

Yeah, the state legislature is almost always made up of the B Teamers. Every state has nutjobs who propose crazy bills. California just tried to pass a bill making it a crime (punishable by up to 6 months in jail) for a restaurant to give a plastic straw to customers who don't specifically ask for one.

Our particular crazies on 23rd and Lincoln certainly don't help matters, but I think education funding is the only really serious problem we have. Our state reps are no crazier than the ones in Texas, and that state is doing fine.

Charlotte is so...played out. This is OKC Talk, right, not CLT Talk.