Got it. Other industries are overtaking oil and gas. Currently oil and gas are less than 3% of our jobs. Aviation, Bio, Technology are the fastest growing. Manufacturing is also showing strong growth. Aviation has become the largest economic factor for okc.

OKC is doing OK and will likely continue to grow however, I doubt at rate reflectef in the study

What I mean is that OKC due to well chronicled economic ups and downs primarily in Oil and Gas as well as population shifts due to e.g.poor teacher pay, has never approached 1.4% year over year growth for more than a couple years. And if the State continues down the road of mediocrity never will. Low salaries, poor health care, poor schools, lack of diversity in the job market, incarceration is an industry, sentencing laws (I could go on).
Just visited my home town Lawton, place is worse than 40 years ago. Really sad to see. Crumbling infrastructure, no job opportunities.

In addition to all of that, have you heard about the recent cases of feline AIDS in OKC?

It's the number one killer of domestic cats...


https://media1.tenor.com/images/cfb93e990de0340cce6530bd5aeec82d/tenor.gif?itemid=4920629

In addition to all of that, have you heard about the recent cases of feline AIDS in OKC?

It's the number one killer of domestic cats...


https://media1.tenor.com/images/cfb93e990de0340cce6530bd5aeec82d/tenor.gif?itemid=4920629

Yeah, pretty sad����������☹��

Don't forget the CHUD problem in Oklahoma City. Lots of cannibalistic humanoid underground dwellers living in the sewers around OKC. It's a widely known problem and a reason why people don't move here along with sharknadoes.

What I mean is that OKC due to well chronicled economic ups and downs primarily in Oil and Gas as well as population shifts due to e.g.poor teacher pay, has never approached 1.4% year over year growth for more than a couple years. And if the State continues down the road of mediocrity never will. Low salaries, poor health care, poor schools, lack of diversity in the job market, incarceration is an industry, sentencing laws (I could go on).
Just visited my home town Lawton, place is worse than 40 years ago. Really sad to see. Crumbling infrastructure, no job opportunities.
Disagree. 40-50yrs ago Lawton was a ****hole. Now, IMO, a much nicer town/city.

At least we're not the Rust Belt where declines continue, albeit at a slower pace in Detroit which is good news there


Michigan’s largest county, home to Detroit, lost about 3,000 residents as of July 2017, according to yearly estimates released Thursday by the U.S. Census Bureau.

While still posting the nation’s ninth largest decline, Wayne lost significantly fewer people than the home counties of the Rust Belt and Midwest cities of Chicago, Baltimore, Cleveland, St. Louis and Pittsburgh.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/michigan/2018/03/22/wayne-county-population-loss-lowest-two-decades/33167773/

Don't forget the CHUD problem in Oklahoma City. Lots of cannibalistic humanoid underground dwellers living in the sewers around OKC. It's a widely known problem and a reason why people don't move here along with sharknadoes.

Don’t forget about the tigernado a few years back

Disagree. 40-50yrs ago Lawton was a ****hole. Now, IMO, a much nicer town/city.
Ok, but, if you can please cite
HOW Lawton is better. When I was growing up Ft. Sill was a major base, no longer, major private sector employers ??, now 1 Goodyear plant. Then a semblance of a downtown now none. Population growth over 40yrs stagnant or small decline. Lost Sears, Kmart, Bank of America. Tell me what Lawton offers for employment outside of fast food restaurants. Most of my HS classmates,500+ (Lawton 72) , live elsewhere. I do not hide my place of birth, but it has not progressed.

Ok, but, if you can please cite
HOW Lawton is better. When I was growing up Ft. Sill was a major base, no longer, major private sector employers ??, now 1 Goodyear plant. Then a semblance of a downtown now none. Population growth over 40yrs stagnant or small decline. Lost Sears, Kmart, Bank of America. Tell me what Lawton offers for employment outside of fast food restaurants. Most of my HS classmates,500+ (Lawton 72) , live elsewhere. I do not hide my place of birth, but it has not progressed.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/024/790/squidward.jpg

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/024/790/squidward.jpg

Mr Squiggler? my 10 year old grandson loves that character, as do you I see, LoL

Rural is decreasing, an ongoing trend across the country. Technology improvements drive a need for fewer farm workers.

Advancements in technology have been causing a number of rural Oklahoma counties to drastically drop in population for a very long time as far back as the 19 teens. Tractors must have been leaving horses behind in the dust.

It's evident in northwest Oklahoma. Some examples:

Ellis county 1910 15,375, 1920 11,673 -24%, 2017 3966
Alfalfa County 1910 18,138, 1920 16,253 −10.4%, 2017 5907
Major County 1910 15,248, 1920 12,426 −18.5% , 2017 7693

Really, the only difference between OKC's MSA and CSA is Pot County, which is mainly Shawnee.

I actually know a bunch of people who live in that area and work in OKC, so IMO it makes a lot of sense to include that county in our numbers.

Yep. Citi-data puts the number of workers who live and work in Shawnee at 58.5%, compared with Stillwater 88.2% and Enid 90.9%.

Census estimates for July 2017 are out for counties and, therefore, metropolitan areas!

OKC at 1,384,485 - an increase of 11,274 from July 2016.
Tulsa at 990,442 - an increase of 3,241 from July 2016.

Oklahoma County itself added more (+3,750) than the Tulsa metro did overall.


The heading of this Tulsa World article isn't good for Tulsa: For the first time since 2004, more people moved out of Tulsa metro than moved in, latest census data show
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/for-the-first-time-since-more-people-moved-out-of/article_3d266bdb-f199-5cb6-ad15-b10e6049920c.html (Depending on browser used, article may require payment.)

Bunty as far as your numbers for those counties that have been losing population since the teens, many of them where homesteaded with a family one each quarter. The land just cannot support a family. Its taking more and more land for a family to manage to make a living. I think its a trend reflected all over the country. I don't see those areas rising in population anytime soon. What I don't understand is why there is not a trend to consolidate some of these low population counties into one to cut down on costs.

Bunty as far as your numbers for those counties that have been losing population since the teens, many of them where homesteaded with a family one each quarter. The land just cannot support a family. Its taking more and more land for a family to manage to make a living. I think its a trend reflected all over the country. I don't see those areas rising in population anytime soon. What I don't understand is why there is not a trend to consolidate some of these low population counties into one to cut down on costs.

I wonder what happened to all those thousands of people who got out during the teens. They moved back to the neighboring states where they came from?

Some of the other rural counties, surely with help from oil, didn't start population declines until the Great Depression. Some have more than recovered those losses, some are far from it.

Rural schools sure went away, but county boundaries stayed the same. Too much government is still based on the conditions of 1907.

Rural schools sure went away, but county boundaries stayed the same. Too much government is still based on the conditions of 1907.

And unfortunately many of those rural school districts are still in place from when there were thriving farming communities which no longer exist. The Panhandle, as an example, could be one single county with Guymon as the courthouse seat. No need for Cimarron (pop. 2,475) or Beaver (pop. 5,636) counties and their respective administrative structures and school districts, run all of it from Guymon.

Fun fact(s) about Cimarron County: it's the only county in Oklahoma that has a town (Kenton) on Mountain Standard Time. It's county seat, Boise City, is closer to Denver than it is to OKC.

And unfortunately many of those rural school districts are still in place from when there were thriving farming communities which no longer exist. The Panhandle, as an example, could be one single county with Guymon as the courthouse seat. No need for Cimarron (pop. 2,475) or Beaver (pop. 5,636) counties and their respective administrative structures and school districts, run all of it from Guymon.

Fun fact(s) about Cimarron County: it's the only county in Oklahoma that has a town (Kenton) on Mountain Standard Time. It's county seat, Boise City, is closer to Denver than it is to OKC.

Another fun fact - Cimarron County touches more states than any other county in America. Answer = 4. Colorado, New Mexico, Texas and Kansas

Yep. Citi-data puts the number of workers who live and work in Shawnee at 58.5%, compared with Stillwater 88.2% and Enid 90.9%.

Shawnee/Pott County should most def. be linked in OKC metro. I couldn't and wouldn't say that 15 years ago but today I most def. can. Lots of people tripping from OKC to Shawnee and visa versa on a daily basis today. There is no doubt about it and it is part of the metro. That would push OKC to right around 1.5 mil if included correct?

Pottawatomie County was included in the OKC metro area until 1999.

Since OKC extends its city limits into Pottowatamie County shouldn’t it be counted for that reason alone?

Let's not forget that not only did Oklahoma suffer thru the Great Depression; the Dust bowl era as well led to the devastation of our state's population.

1930: 2,396,040 [18.1%]


Great Depression: The period of declining and lower economic activity in the worldwide economy from the late 1920s through the 1930s. In the United States, it began with the stock market crash in October 1929 and was characterized by a decline in business activity into 1933.

Dust Bowl: Dust storms were the result of drought and land that had been overused. Drought first hit the country in 1930. By 1934, it had turned the Great Plains into a desert that came to be known as the Dust Bowl. In Oklahoma, the Panhandle area was hit hardest by the drought.

1940: 2,336,434 −2.5%
1950: 2,233,351 −4.4%

1960: 2,328,284 4.3%
1970: 2,559,229 9.9%
1980: 3,025,290 [18.2%]


Oil bust of the 1980s: The 1980s oil glut was a serious surplus of crude oil caused by falling demand following the 1970s energy crisis. ... The result was a six-year decline in the price of oil, which culminated by plunging more than half in 1986 alone.

1990: 3,145,585 4.0% Oklahoma City 444,719 40,705 10.08%/Metro: 958,839
2000: 3,450,654 9.7% Oklahoma City 506,132 61,413 13.81%/Metro: 1,083,346 13.0%
2010: 3,751,351 8.7% Oklahoma City 579,999 73,867 14.59%/Metro: 1,252,987
2016: 3,923,561 4.4% Oklahoma City 638,367 58,368 10.93%/Metro: 1,373,211 +9.59%

Est. 2017 3,930,864 4.8%

Got it. Other industries are overtaking oil and gas. Currently oil and gas are less than 3% of our jobs. Aviation, Bio, Technology are the fastest growing. Manufacturing is also showing strong growth. Aviation has become the largest economic factor for okc.

But 90% of our legislators' priorities.

Tulsa's growth only came from births versus deaths. They were close to net outmigration. OKC has slowed considerably. The state is seeing people move out. If not for OKC, this state would be losing population. Not surprising given the sheer idiocy of our state leadership and their hostility toward education and any kind of progressive change.

here here

tulsa's growth only came from births versus deaths. They were close to net outmigration. Okc has slowed considerably. The state is seeing people move out. If not for okc, this state would be losing population. Not surprising given the sheer idiocy of our state leadership and their hostility toward education and any kind of progressive change.

oh?

Not surprising given the sheer idiocy of our state leadership and their hostility toward education and any kind of progressive change.

It is certainly not helping attract knowledge workers which is the backbone of a 21st century economy. Education funding should be the top priority, followed by infrastructure. Oklahoma’s regional neighbors Texas and Colorado are doing what is necessary to nurture this economy and grow jobs, when will this state wake up?

Honestly with the clown show at the Capitol why would any company want to invest in Oklahoma? And why would anyone want to move here from somewhere else?

It is certainly not helping attract knowledge workers which is the backbone of a 21st century economy. Education funding should be the top priority, followed by infrastructure. Oklahoma’s regional neighbors Texas and Colorado are doing what is necessary to nurture this economy and grow jobs, when will this state wake up?



Once again, it goes back to my theory that the majority of Oklahomans are actually doing quite well with their lives and don't see much reason to rock the boat, complain or even vote. If I'm wrong, we should have a large turnover of Republicans to Democrats at the state capitol in November plus a Democrat as the new governor. If it continues to look like most Republican incumbents won't get challengers during the April 11-13 filing period, I will already be proven right. For governor, I still predict the winner will be Cornett. Edmondson, while he probably wouldn't be a bad governor, is just a proven loser.

It is certainly not helping attract knowledge workers which is the backbone of a 21st century economy. Education funding should be the top priority, followed by infrastructure. Oklahoma’s regional neighbors Texas and Colorado are doing what is necessary to nurture this economy and grow jobs, when will this state wake up?

Honestly with the clown show at the Capitol why would any company want to invest in Oklahoma? And why would anyone want to move here from somewhere else?

I’m going to repeat this on this board until the end of time. On the whole, Oklahoma’s neighboring state legislatures are just as bad as Oklahoma’s. I’ve lived in Kansas and Texas for the last 7 years and the same crap is happening. The one current difference I can identify is education funding. Kansas bottomed out and is slowly responding. Texas is a little better on pay.

When people say the Oklahoma State legislature is worse than other states I would love to see more specifics.

I’m going to repeat this on this board until the end of time. On the whole, Oklahoma’s neighboring state legislatures are just as bad as Oklahoma’s. I’ve lived in Kansas and Texas for the last 7 years and the same crap is happening. The one current difference I can identify is education funding. Kansas bottomed out and is slowly responding. Texas is a little better on pay.

When people say the Oklahoma State legislature is worse than other states I would love to see more specifics.

The facts are Oklahoma has the lowest paid teachers in the region while funding has been slashed to all state services. Numerous state business leaders have stated that the legislature is making it hard to recruit people to work for their companies which is likely directly related to the low population growth across the state.

When people say the Oklahoma State legislature is worse than other states I would love to see more specifics.

The fact that the state legislature is trying everything they can to kill the medical marijuana initiative before it's even voted on and that doing so is such a high priority says everything that needs to be said about this legislature. Until this state gets elected officials that are more focused on fixing the actual problems in this state instead of trying to impose a right-wing religious agenda, I don't see things getting much better. The fact that most lawmakers are running unopposed this year doesn't give me much hope for a turnaround. Hopefully getting somebody like Cornett in the governorship will be a step in the right direction.

The fact that the state legislature is trying everything they can to kill the medical marijuana initiative before it's even voted on and that doing so is such a high priority says everything that needs to be said about this legislature. Until this state gets elected officials that are more focused on fixing the actual problems in this state instead of trying to impose a right-wing religious agenda, I don't see things getting much better. The fact that most lawmakers are running unopposed this year doesn't give me much hope for a turnaround. Hopefully getting somebody like Cornett in the governorship will be a step in the right direction.

Again, you only bashed the Oklahoma legislature and did not actually provide a comparison surrounding states. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, but how many of the state's surrounding Oklahoma have passed medical marijuana. Also, do you think a religious agenda isn't an overwhelming component of Texas politics? Have you watched The Revisionaries on how Texas got it's state social studies standards? http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/films/revisionaries/

Again, most of you just aren't aware that these things are also happenning in surrounding states. These problems are not unique to Oklahoma. That's not to excuse bad policy or destructive culture. But we need to provide more evidence before saying Oklahoma is unique in its politics. On the whole, it's not.

The facts are Oklahoma has the lowest paid teachers in the region while funding has been slashed to all state services. Numerous state business leaders have stated that the legislature is making it hard to recruit people to work for their companies which is likely directly related to the low population growth across the state.

Yes, this is exactly what I pointed out. Education is the one issue of which I'm aware of in which Oklahoma is failing in comparison to peer/surrounding states. There may be other issues, but I'd actually like to see informed comparisons on other issues.

When people say the Oklahoma State legislature is worse than other states I would love to see more specifics.
So would I. I'd like someone to research for a scorecard based on which state legislature has passed the most bills ruled as unconstitutional over the last 10 years. The last Oklahoma bill ruled unconstitutional barred oil company workers from suing the oil company for being hurt on the job. Many legislators may be religious right, but can govern like they never heard of the Golden Rule.

I’m going to repeat this on this board until the end of time. On the whole, Oklahoma’s neighboring state legislatures are just as bad as Oklahoma’s. I’ve lived in Kansas and Texas for the last 7 years and the same crap is happening. The one current difference I can identify is education funding. Kansas bottomed out and is slowly responding. Texas is a little better on pay.

When people say the Oklahoma State legislature is worse than other states I would love to see more specifics.

Let's be clear: Oklahoma has always had a clownish Legislature to varying degrees, as have those states. But the last 8 years have been a clinic on bad government. And it was all predictable given who was taking over and the rhetoric they had been promising for over a decade.

We are now last in everything good and first in everything bad. Sorry, we have Texas beat, and while Kansas is circling the bowl, we are in a lower echelon.

And there is no reason. This state has two relatively prosperous metro areas and abundant natural resources. But our state's greatest export is its smartest people. And that exodus will continue until Okies get over their stupid partisan stubbornness and stop voting for dumb people.

Let's be clear: Oklahoma has always had a clownish Legislature to varying degrees, as have those states. But the last 8 years have been a clinic on bad government. And it was all predictable given who was taking over and the rhetoric they had been promising for over a decade.

We are now last in everything good and first in everything bad. Sorry, we have Texas beat, and while Kansas is circling the bowl, we are in a lower echelon.

And there is no reason. This state has two relatively prosperous metro areas and abundant natural resources. But our state's greatest export is its smartest people. And that exodus will continue until Okies get over their stupid partisan stubbornness and stop voting for dumb people.

I agree with this completely.

Also a part of the equation though is getting people to run as Democrats. Most of the lawmakers aren't going anywhere because they are running unopposed. You can't vote these people out and replace them with more competent people if nobody is running against them.

While I would take today's OKC any day over how it was when I moved back here in 2012, it seems like the metro was on a roll during the Great Recession but has been stalling out since the national economy has improved. Tulsa has been stalled for much longer. OKC was starting to get mentions on "hot up and coming cities" lists. The past few years you've seen that less and less.

http://kfor.com/2018/03/27/oklahoma-representative-questioned-about-spanking-comment-during-education-funding-debate/

http://kfor.com/2018/03/27/oklahoma-representative-questioned-about-spanking-comment-during-education-funding-debate/
LOL, Bennett probably won more votes than lost them with his comments. Anyway, I hope he gets voted out of there.

LOL, Bennett probably won more votes than lost them with his comments. Anyway, I hope he gets voted out of there.

Yeah spanking is the cornerstone of child-rearing in Independent Fundamental Baptist circles. I've met a lot of people who think its a travesty that schools are no longer allowed to give swats (actually in Oklahoma I think it's still legal but most districts don't want to risk what could happen if they actually did it).

Yeah spanking is the cornerstone of child-rearing in Independent Fundamental Baptist circles. I've met a lot of people who think its a travesty that schools are no longer allowed to give swats (actually in Oklahoma I think it's still legal but most districts don't want to risk what could happen if they actually did it).

You used "cornerstone". I do not think it means what you think it means!

Yeah spanking is the cornerstone of child-rearing in Independent Fundamental Baptist circles. I've met a lot of people who think its a travesty that schools are no longer allowed to give swats (actually in Oklahoma I think it's still legal but most districts don't want to risk what could happen if they actually did it).

You're correct that it's still legal in Oklahoma for children not on an IEP: http://www.oscn.net/applications/oscn/DeliverDocument.asp?CiteID=380409

Surprisingly, I've encountered quite a few schools (mostly small/rural districts) that actually still use corporal punishment as a means of discipline. Not surprisingly, I've also encountered quite a few instances where parents (who had previously given permission for their child to be spanked) became angry at the school afterward, alleging it was done too harshly, or that too many swats were given, etc.

One major problem in Oklahoma (and Kansas) is that the rural counties still have too much power and influence in the legislature. Case in point the Speaker of the House represents Atoka and the President Pro Tem of the Senate represents Altus. The main population centers are larger in surrounding states like Texas, Colorado and Missouri so the rural politicians are more evenly matched or drowned out by the urban politicians. The Denver metro, for example, dominates the political world in Colorado which has skewed what once was a solid Republican state toward a Blue State that works for the new economy they are developing there (technology & aerospace).

Oklahoma has struggled with this identity for awhile and needs to accept that it’s a majority urban/suburban state with 2/3 of the state population living in the OKC and Tulsa metros. As I mentioned before if you combine the CSA’s that is 2.6 million people in relative close proximity to each other. The way you need to govern for an urban economy vs rural economy in the 21st century is very different.

One major problem in Oklahoma (and Kansas) is that the rural counties still have too much power and influence in the legislature. Case in point the Speaker of the House represents Atoka and the President Pro Tem of the Senate represents Altus. The main population centers are larger in surrounding states like Texas, Colorado and Missouri so the rural politicians are more evenly matched or drowned out by the urban politicians. The Denver metro, for example, dominates the political world in Colorado which has skewed what once was a solid Republican state toward a Blue State that works for the new economy they are developing there (technology & aerospace).

Oklahoma has struggled with this identity for awhile and needs to accept that it’s a majority urban/suburban state with 2/3 of the state population living in the OKC and Tulsa metros. As I mentioned before if you combine the CSA’s that is 2.6 million people in relative close proximity to each other. The way you need to govern for an urban economy vs rural economy in the 21st century is very different.

A lot of this will change once redistricting occurs in 2020 and moves more legislative control to urban centers, especially OKC.

Let's be clear: Oklahoma has always had a clownish Legislature to varying degrees, as have those states. But the last 8 years have been a clinic on bad government. And it was all predictable given who was taking over and the rhetoric they had been promising for over a decade.

We are now last in everything good and first in everything bad. Sorry, we have Texas beat, and while Kansas is circling the bowl, we are in a lower echelon.

And there is no reason. This state has two relatively prosperous metro areas and abundant natural resources. But our state's greatest export is its smartest people. And that exodus will continue until Okies get over their stupid partisan stubbornness and stop voting for dumb people.Probably one of the realists posts on OKCTalk.

Let's be clear: Oklahoma has always had a clownish Legislature to varying degrees, as have those states. But the last 8 years have been a clinic on bad government. And it was all predictable given who was taking over and the rhetoric they had been promising for over a decade.

We are now last in everything good and first in everything bad. Sorry, we have Texas beat, and while Kansas is circling the bowl, we are in a lower echelon.

And there is no reason. This state has two relatively prosperous metro areas and abundant natural resources. But our state's greatest export is its smartest people. And that exodus will continue until Okies get over their stupid partisan stubbornness and stop voting for dumb people.

+1

Um, anyway.....

Not sure if this has been published. But, if not, this is pretty neat presentation that rank % growth for the top 53 Metros from 2010 to 2017. OKC came in 18th out of 53 markets reported for population growth.

https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2018/03/22/austins-population-keeps-popping-heres-how-many.html#g/431332/1

And there is no reason. This state has two relatively prosperous metro areas and abundant natural resources. But our state's greatest export is its smartest people. And that exodus will continue until Okies get over their stupid partisan stubbornness and stop voting for dumb people.

Good point. Not many other states not named Texas have two decent-sized metros (combined MSA population of 2.4 million) and the abundant natural resources that are available in Oklahoma (Top 5 State for oil, gas & wind power, adequate water resources, productive farming & ranchland) with a moderate climate. There is no reason if the government does its job that this state should not be a growth magnet,

Good point. Not many other states not named Texas have two decent-sized metros (combined MSA population of 2.4 million) and the abundant natural resources that are available in Oklahoma (Top 5 State for oil, gas & wind power, adequate water resources, productive farming & ranchland) with a moderate climate. There is no reason if the government does its job that this state should not be a growth magnet,

Oklahoma should look to Tennessee as a model. Tennessee was a state that was once a more backwater Southern state like Oklahoma, Arkansas, and Alabama but in recent years has really pushed itself ahead of the pack, much like North Carolina has. Nashville is currently one of the most desirable cities that Millennials are moving to and its earning a reputation as being a lower-cost alternative to places like Portland and Austin. What did Tennessee do? They started investing in education and infrastructure. Those two things are very important if you want to see economic growth.

Oklahoma should look to Tennessee as a model. Tennessee was a state that was once a more backwater Southern state like Oklahoma, Arkansas, and Alabama but in recent years has really pushed itself ahead of the pack, much like North Carolina has. Nashville is currently one of the most desirable cities that Millennials are moving to and its earning a reputation as being a lower-cost alternative to places like Portland and Austin. What did Tennessee do? They started investing in education and infrastructure. Those two things are very important if you want to see economic growth.

Ya, I'm gonna disagree with you here. I've seen a bunch of "worst top 10" lists with Tennessee right near the top in certain categories. I'd, actually, look to Colorado on how we should manage our government, resources and infrastructure.

I'm by no means saying we need to be a liberal state (I'm a moderate and vote both sides), but we definitely have the resources and capabilities to become one of the leaders in growth, in all aspects, if we can get the pencil pushing idiots out of our state legislation.

Good point. Not many other states not named Texas have two decent-sized metros (combined MSA population of 2.4 million) and the abundant natural resources that are available in Oklahoma (Top 5 State for oil, gas & wind power, adequate water resources, productive farming & ranchland) with a moderate climate. There is no reason if the government does its job that this state should not be a growth magnet,

Lol, “moderate climate”. Everyone from out of state that I know describes our climate as biblical.

Ya, I'm gonna disagree with you here. I've seen a bunch of "worst top 10" lists with Tennessee right near the top in certain categories. I'd, actually, look to Colorado on how we should manage our government, resources and infrastructure.

I'm by no means saying we need to be a liberal state (I'm a moderate and vote both sides), but we definitely have the resources and capabilities to become one of the leaders in growth, in all aspects, if we can get the pencil pushing idiots out of our state legislation.+1. Tennessee is not that impressive of a state, or at least to me. I know there are some cool things happening but I would rather Oklahoma look to Texas or Colorado to use as a model.

I've always thought Texas should be a model for the state. Our demographics and geography are similar to Texas so we have those bases to work from.

I've always thought Texas should be a model for the state. Our demographics and geography are similar to Texas so we have those bases to work from.

There is just such a human capital difference. DFW itself is more than 2x as big as Oklahoma. Kansas or Arkansas might be better, in my opinion.

Human capital difference doesn't matter when you look at the size of the cities. It's not like we have 1.3 million people in a city that has the infrastructure and buildings for 5+ million like Dallas does. There are policies that could be put in place to attract people to the city/state, thus increasing growth.

Human capital difference doesn't matter when you look at the size of the cities. It's not like we have 1.3 million people in a city that has the infrastructure and buildings for 5+ million like Dallas does. There are policies that could be put in place to attract people to the city/state, thus increasing growth.

Well, included in that human capital is the capacity to learn from past mistakes. This state doesn't have it, so they can't really compare with Texas. At least at the leadership level. I am just tired of them taking the best and brightest this state has to offer, so to me, comparing the 2 is not ever going to be fair.

I prefer we dont look to Arkansas or Kansas for inspiration, but instead to Colorado. Just think, not too long ago Oklahoma was a larger population than Colorado, which just had Denver. What has CO done with Denver's lead, that has made them the GO-TO state/city for the entire West not named California?

I bet there are very many ideas that could be implemented in Oklahoma, one of which I recommend is a commitment for a separation of Church and State; you know, that is IN the constitution. Adopting this idea would force government to govern rather than tie up the floor with social influence in the guise of religious freedom. The growth model, sustainable growth, with cultural similarities - is readily available to the Northwest - in Colorado which once was just a tourist and federal government destination not that long ago. .....

^^^ Dope is one ^^^

I prefer we dont look to Arkansas or Kansas for inspiration, but instead to Colorado. Just think, not too long ago Oklahoma was a larger population than Colorado, which just had Denver. What has CO done with Denver's lead, that has made them the GO-TO state/city for the entire West not named California?

Colorado is a very, very different place demographically though. Colorado, like the rest of the mountain west except for maybe Utah, has always had a libertarian culture centered on rugged individualism and recently has been becoming more progressive. Oklahoma, despite never having been a Confederate state, has strong cultural ties to the upper South. That's one reason I say Tennessee is a good example to look to. While that state still has problems, it was once in about as dire straits as Oklahoma is but has improved itself and is home to one of the fastest growing, most desirable cities in the country. It's much more culturally similar to Oklahoma than Colorado is. I agree that Arkansas and Kansas are not examples to follow. While both states may currently be in better shape than Oklahoma, that hasn't always been the case and they aren't exactly booming.



I bet there are very many ideas that could be implemented in Oklahoma, one of which I recommend is a commitment for a separation of Church and State; you know, that is IN the constitution. Adopting this idea would force government to govern rather than tie up the floor with social influence in the guise of religious freedom. The growth model, sustainable growth, with cultural similarities - is readily available to the Northwest - in Colorado which once was just a tourist and federal government destination not that long ago. .....

Unfortunately that will never happen in this state or at least not in the near future. Religious authoritarianism is too embedded in the political mindset of this state and the mere concept of "separation of church and state" is considered an attack on Christianity. Simply look at what is going on right now with the medical marijuana initiative. It's stuff like that that causes me to lose hope. It's likely going to take a generational shift at the statehouse.

Colorado is a very, very different place demographically though. Colorado, like the rest of the mountain west except for maybe Utah, has always had a libertarian culture centered on rugged individualism and recently has been becoming more progressive. Oklahoma, despite never having been a Confederate state, has strong cultural ties to the upper South. That's one reason I say Tennessee is a good example to look to. While that state still has problems, it was once in about as dire straits as Oklahoma is but has improved itself and is home to one of the fastest growing, most desirable cities in the country. It's much more culturally similar to Oklahoma than Colorado is. I agree that Arkansas and Kansas are not examples to follow. While both states may currently be in better shape than Oklahoma, that hasn't always been the case and they aren't exactly booming.

I agree being more like Tennessee seems like an attainable goal for Oklahoma. There are some similarities between OKC and Nashville both being the state capital and main population center with a large centralized metro area. Both states have large economically-depressed rural areas and there is a similar rural vs. urban identity crisis. Geographically they are even similar with vast agricultural lands and forests with pine-covered mountains in the east.

However Oklahoma needs to look at how Colorado functions as far as consolidated government functions, especially education. In Colorado there are 179 public school districts while in Oklahoma there are 520 districts. There aren't small regional universities located in places like Alva and Durant in Colorado but rather they are centralized in the larger population centers.

Map showing last year's population change nationwide

https://i2.wp.com/www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2018-03-26_frey_new-census-data_blog-post-figures-1.png?w=768&crop=0%2C0px%2C100%2C9999px&ssl=1