View Full Version : Population Growth for OKC
KayneMo 05-25-2017, 01:24 AM July 2016 city population estimates are out!
http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2017/05/2016_census_population_estimat.html?appSession=600 62289107725440382636598391185251939525575982235165 23494306188181754441428594104063683731698452893736 4120075153173132249540920&cbSearchAgain=true
1. Oklahoma City - 638,367
+58,368 since 2010 Census (+10.1%)
+7,749 since 2015
2. Tulsa - 403,090
+11,184 since 2010 (+2.9%)
-15 since 2015
3. Norman - 122,180
+11,255 since 2010 (+10.1%)
+1,996 since 2015
4. Broken Arrow - 107,403
+8,553 since 2010 (+8.7%)
+871 since 2015
5. Lawton - 94,653
-2,214 since 2010 (-2.3%)
-1,658 since 2015
6. Edmond - 91,191
+9,786 since 2010 (+12.0%)
+1,200 since 2015
7. Moore - 61,415
+6,334 since 2010 (+11.5%)
+1,024 since 2015
8. Midwest City - 57,305
+2,934 since 2010 (+5.4%)
+117 since 2015
9. Enid - 51,004
+1,625 since 2010 (+3.3%)
-600 since 2015
10. Stillwater - 49,504
+3,816 since 2010 (+8.4%)
+671 since 2015
KayneMo 05-25-2017, 01:26 AM My hometown of Durant - 17,583
+1,727 since 2010 (+10.9%)
+266 since July 2015
TU 'cane 05-25-2017, 07:55 AM I had a feeling Tulsa would be at a loss for the year, even if just 15 people.
Broken Arrow's growth even appears to have slowed down a great deal.
Glad to see OKC still chugging along.
Have they released the estimate for the entire state, yet?
Edit: yes, just had to follow your link.
Oklahoma's state population grew by about 16,000 to 3,923,561. That's the lowest level of growth in the last 7 years. And at that rate, the state won't be breaking 4,000,000 by the 2020 census.
^
I consider that good growth for OKC given the downturn in the oil patch.
We always get job chasers when prices spike and then many clear out afterwards.
OkiePoke 05-25-2017, 08:53 AM ^
I consider that good growth for OKC given the downturn in the oil patch.
We always get job chasers when prices spike and then many clear out afterwards.
I wonder how many people moved from other cities to OKC during the downturn for jobs though.
OKCRT 05-25-2017, 09:14 AM I had a feeling Tulsa would be at a loss for the year, even if just 15 people.
Broken Arrow's growth even appears to have slowed down a great deal.
Glad to see OKC still chugging along.
Have they released the estimate for the entire state, yet?
Edit: yes, just had to follow your link.
Oklahoma's state population grew by about 16,000 to 3,923,561. That's the lowest level of growth in the last 7 years. And at that rate, the state won't be breaking 4,000,000 by the 2020 census.
All it will take is a spike in Oil/Gas and the numbers will grow. Who knows when that is going to happen. It's not a matter of if,but when.
Rover 05-25-2017, 12:18 PM So, OKC area About +90,000 and Tulsa area about +20,000?
KayneMo 05-25-2017, 01:08 PM So, OKC area About +90,000 and Tulsa area about +20,000?
2010-2016
OKC Metro +120,224 (+9.6%)
Tulsa Metro +49,723 (+5.3%)
Bunty 05-25-2017, 01:30 PM Stillwater should be able to go over 50,000 by 2020, if OSU doesn't have declines in enrollment. Stillwater probably can't attract enough industry to make up for losses there. Enid better stop its losses to stay above the magic 50,000 mark.
traxx 05-25-2017, 02:24 PM I'm not saying the numbers are wrong (I think they're probably right) but Edmond feels like it has more than 91K people in it. That's a town that was never meant to have that many people or that much traffic in it. I don't think there's a solution to the traffic there. More roads, wider roads, more traffic lights are not the answer. It's just a matter of having a population that's too large for an infrastructure that was never envisioned serving that much traffic.
^
A lot of what most people consider Edmond is actually far NW OKC.
In Edmond schools but outside the Edmond city limits.
KayneMo 05-25-2017, 02:43 PM ^ Based on census tract data from 2010, I added up the population of the area bounded by Waterloo on the north, May on the west, roughly Kilpatrick/Memorial on the south, and I-35 on the east and it comes up to 115,568. And that is data from 7 years ago so I'm sure it's quiet a bit more now.
KayneMo 05-25-2017, 02:48 PM Add in the two large census tracts to the west (bounded by Waterloo, County Line, Kilpatrick, & May) and north OKC/Edmond comes to 125,102 residents in 2010.
jerrywall 05-25-2017, 02:58 PM I'm not saying the numbers are wrong (I think they're probably right) but Edmond feels like it has more than 91K people in it. That's a town that was never meant to have that many people or that much traffic in it. I don't think there's a solution to the traffic there. More roads, wider roads, more traffic lights are not the answer. It's just a matter of having a population that's too large for an infrastructure that was never envisioned serving that much traffic.
Don't forget that UCO has over 17k students. Many of those are not Edmond residents, and are either commuters or temporary residents that might not be included in these counts. Also people that may commute into Edmond for work.
SOONER8693 05-25-2017, 03:16 PM Don't forget that UCO has over 17k students. Many of those are not Edmond residents, and are either commuters or temporary residents that might not be included in these counts. Also people that may commute into Edmond for work.
College students are counted in the population of a town/city. Since they basically reside there for approx 9 months of a year, they count. I learned that in a Population Statistics class I had in college. Before that, I assumed they did not count, but, they do.
jerrywall 05-25-2017, 04:27 PM College students are counted in the population of a town/city. Since they basically reside there for approx 9 months of a year, they count. I learned that in a Population Statistics class I had in college. Before that, I assumed they did not count, but, they do.
But not the non resident ones, correct? I'm not sure how many of them reside on campus (or in Edmond) and how many commute.
TheTravellers 05-25-2017, 04:35 PM But not the non resident ones, correct? I'm not sure how many of them reside on campus (or in Edmond) and how many commute.
When I went back in the 80s, there wasn't much housing at UCO, and I know they've added more. https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/university-of-central-oklahoma/paying-for-college/room-and-board/ says 1883 is the housing capacity, so that's still pretty low.
Laramie 05-25-2017, 07:28 PM But not the non resident ones, correct? I'm not sure how many of them reside on campus (or in Edmond) and how many commute.
:ot:
Massive improvements to the campus over time.
Central State College, Central State University & UCO has had a reputation for being a commuter's campus. I've seen a spike in on campus dormitories & apartment type housing that surrounds the campus.
Remember Thatcher Hall, a non air conditioned freshman all male sweat box, with box fans in the windows; had to move back home and commute in the middle of my freshman year.
https://www.higheredjobs.com/images/AccountImages/1782_3.jpg
When I attended the school back 70s, the landscape & campus beautification really took off; at my daughter's graduation recently, the campus looked awesome with an artificial lake near the University Center.
SOONER8693 05-25-2017, 08:13 PM But not the non resident ones, correct? I'm not sure how many of them reside on campus (or in Edmond) and how many commute.
Correct.
BG918 05-25-2017, 11:35 PM Pretty tepid growth, I wonder how much is tied to Oil & Gas? Or people leaving the state for better economic opportunities in surrounding states?
dcsooner 05-26-2017, 06:19 AM Pretty tepid growth, I wonder how much is tied to Oil & Gas? Or people leaving the state for better economic opportunities in surrounding states?
Be careful what you say on this board about OKC negatives. Truth and honesty is not always appreciated. Having said that the truth is OKC has poor State leadership, over depemdance on oil and gas, poor schools, lack of diversity, and low wages to name a few. But, as usual most will not check facts and work to change them they will undoubtedly attack the person for voicing an opinion. Welcome to the new America where facts don't matter, hello Montana. Thank you DT
jerrywall 05-26-2017, 08:40 AM Nothing wrong with BG918s question but you're just as toxic as normal.
stlokc 05-26-2017, 08:49 AM BG918's question about oil and gas is fair. But, with respect, I don't consider 10% growth in 6 years to be "tepid." That's considerably higher than the national average. Although I haven't looked, I would suspect that is a higher rate of growth than most of the nation's 50 biggest metro areas.
TU 'cane 05-26-2017, 09:18 AM It's okay everyone. It's already been preemptively established that we're jerks for trying to be positive, acknowledging the growth there's been, realizing OKC is still branching out and finding new leaves, and for calling out what is usually the same 1-2 individuals who think OKC should be JUST LIKE L.A. or Chicago, etc.
Remember, OKC is racist, too family oriented, and too dependent on O&G (partially still true, even though this has been partly dispelled in the past) and is losing people and companies by the day because of these reasons.
Oh, and also remember there's an "ignore" feature. That comment usually pops up as well.
Can someone who has time pull numbers to what most would argue are our peer cities (mid-level/tier) so we can compare? Maybe pull about 5 cities.
KayneMo 05-26-2017, 09:19 AM BG918's question about oil and gas is fair. But, with respect, I don't consider 10% growth in 6 years to be "tepid." That's considerably higher than the national average. Although I haven't looked, I would suspect that is a higher rate of growth than most of the nation's 50 biggest metro areas.
The OKC metro ranks 14th in growth rate among the 50 largest metros from 2010-2016.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas
stlokc 05-26-2017, 09:29 AM Thank you for pulling that, KayneMo! That's the kind of list that I love to study.
I think this puts us in good stead. Honestly, that growth is probably just about where we want it to be. It's healthy and within our ability to handle it. Much faster and it opens up a whole different set of problems regarding overheating housing values and stressed infrastructure that OKC is probably not ready for.
progressiveboy 05-26-2017, 09:41 AM In many ways, dcsooner is spot on about Oklahoma. Not trying to be toxic, but the truth is the truth. I was born and raised in OKC for a good portion of my life. However, by leaving the State, it opened my mind that Oklahoma desperately needs to work on it's image. Poor education, poor health factors, no true diverse industry. Sorry folks, but sometimes the truth needs to be spoken. I am ready to get raked over the coals now (LOL).
stlokc 05-26-2017, 09:56 AM I haven't lived in OKC for 20 years but in talking with family and friends, and through multiple trips back, it seems to me that, (outliers like Sally Kern notwithstanding) there is a real and growing divergence between the Oklahoma City metropolitan area, which is becoming more urban and progressive and the rest of the state, which, if anything, is regressing.
Laramie 05-26-2017, 10:29 AM Good observation by stlokc above: ^ ^ ^
Overall, IMO this board has grown with many new posters who have opinions of OKC that are not always positive; with that said, we do need to evaluate why some of these negative statements are made. Feel free to request of a posters why or how did they formulate that opinion. Was it based on facts, fiction or feelings?
Or better yet, don't argue, just post some positive data as exhibited by KayneMo (post #985). There are still many stereotypes about Oklahoma & OKC that people have harbored since Steinbeck's 'Grapes of Wrath.'
I recall an individual who is one of my best friends, he came to Oklahoma chasing a potential sweetheart (beautiful, Delaware Indian girl); he had a very high IQ from a wealthy family in Maryland; but also naive & grossly misinformed. He thought that he would take Oklahoma by storm; he envisioned Oklahoma in the Tsa-La-Gi Indian village setting. He planned to enter the state, purchase a business and lure her with his charm and gifts. I'm not a Brad Pit; however, I do know my competition--my friend was talented, intelligent; however you might describe his looks as 'Dog pound ugly.'
Ross MacLochness 05-26-2017, 10:31 AM Overall, IMO this board has grown with many new posters who have opinions of OKC that are not always positive; with that said, we do need to evaluate why some of these negative statements are made. Feel free to request of a posters why or how did they formulate that opinion. Was it based on facts, fiction or feelings?
Or better yet, supply them with some supportive data as exhibited by KayneMo. There are still many stereotypes about Oklahoma & OKC that people have harbored since Steinbeck's 'Grapes of Wrath.'
I recall an individual who is one of my best friends, who came to Oklahoma chasing a potential sweetheart (beautiful, Delaware Indian girl); he had a very high IQ from a wealthy family in Maryland; but also naive & grossly misinformed. He thought that he would take Oklahoma by storm; he envisioned Oklahoma in the Tsa-La-Gi Indian village setting. He planned to enter the state, purchase a business and lure her with his charm and gifts. I'm not a Brad Pit; however, I do know my competition--my friend was talented, intelligent; however you might describe his looks as 'Dog pound ugly.'
Well..., did he accomplish his task?? I wanna hear the rest of the story...
Ross MacLochness 05-26-2017, 11:01 AM I just came across a pertinent article on population growth that I think ties in to this discussion with regards to types of growth and positivity/negativity. The author is from Phoenix, one of the fastest growing cities in the Nation, and compares his city to the growth of Seattle. He outlines two different models of growth and while most people from phoenix brag about the numbers, he goes on a rant about Phoenix's mistakes as they grew. I think OKC has made some of the same mistakes as Phoenix so it's worth the read, but again, we are fortunate to be a little behind so that as we continue to grow, we can learn from the mistakes and successes of other cities around the nation.
http://www.seattletimes.com/business/economy/seattle-and-phoenix-two-tales-of-growth/
KayneMo 05-26-2017, 11:04 AM OKC metro March 2017
Total Non-farm jobs (in thousands) - 631.0 (100%)
Mining and logging - 15.6 (2.5%)
Construction - 27.6 (4.4%)
Manufacturing - 34.4 (5.5%)
Trade, transportation, and utilities - 111.6 (17.7%)
Information - 8.3 (1.3%)
Financial activities - 34.1 (5.4%)
Professional and business services - 80.0 (12.7%)
Education and health services - 92.1 (14.6%)
Leisure and hospitality - 68.6 (10.9%)
Other services - 25.0 (4.0%)
Government - 133.7 (21.2%)
https://www.bls.gov/regions/southwest/summary/blssummary_oklahomacity.pdf
OKC Demographics 2010
Race
White - 62.7%
—Non-Hispanic - 56.7%
Black - 15.1%
—Non-Hispanic - 14.8%
Asian - 4.02%
—Non-Hispanic - 3.97%
Native American - 3.5%
—Non-Hispanic - 3.1%
2 or More - 5.2%
—Non-Hispanic - 4.0%
Other - 9.4%
—Non-Hispanic - 0.1%
Hispanic - 17.2%
Non-Hispanic - 82.8%
Race alone or in combo
White - 67.0%
Black - 17.0%
Native American - 6.8%
Asian - 4.8%
Other - 10.5%
https://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?pid=DEC_10_DP_DPDP1&prodType=table
Seems quite diverse to me in both aspects of demographics and industry.
stlokc 05-26-2017, 11:21 AM OKC is considerably more diverse than a lot of people realize; in terms of industry and demographics.
As for that article, and thank you Ross for it, it is absolutely spot-on. Growth simply for the sake of adding bodies, any warm bodies, at a fast rate, should never be a goal. Smart growth, forward-looking diversification and investments in things that matter are much more important than "can-we-grow-faster-faster-faster"
jn1780 05-26-2017, 11:29 AM That industry breakdown really shows our dependence on Tinker and the FAA. More so than O&G really. It is concerning that we are one presidential pen stroke away from being hit in the groin.
I would like to see the Information sector significantly larger.
The diversity thing reminds me of when people decried OKC getting an NBA team, saying the city wasn't culturally or racially diverse enough, especially from certain Seattleites who ironically live in one of the whitest cities in the United States.
That industry breakdown really shows our dependence on Tinker and the FAA. More so than O&G really. It is concerning that we are one presidential pen stroke away from being hit in the groin.
I would like to see the Information sector significantly larger.
It is true Tinker and the FAA are huge employers in the area, but keep in mind 'government' also includes all public schools and universities, which is why that sector is always so huge.
And of course, we have the state, city and county governments in that number as well.
KayneMo 05-26-2017, 12:01 PM ^ BLS separates education from government, combining it with health services.
Laramie 05-26-2017, 12:24 PM Well..., did he accomplish his task?? I wanna hear the rest of the story...
Sorry, let me finish...
No, she married one of her high school teachers a year after she graduated. He's doing great; he moved back to Maryland (an avid NFL Redskins' fan); built a nice $750,000 home, married a very beautiful young lady, they had 8 children. Damn, gotta to admit my homie has charm; she saw something in him beyond looks...
Ross MacLochness 05-26-2017, 12:27 PM Sorry, let me finish...
No, she married one of her high school teachers a year after she graduated. He's doing great; he moved back to Maryland (an avid NFL Redskins' fan); built a nice $750,000 home, married a very beautiful young lady, they had 8 children. Damn, gotta to admit my homie has charm; she saw something in him beyond looks...
haha, if at first you don't succeed, move to maryland, build a nice 3/4 million $ home, marry a beautiful lady and have 8 kids.
Bunty 05-26-2017, 12:37 PM I'm not saying the numbers are wrong (I think they're probably right) but Edmond feels like it has more than 91K people in it. That's a town that was never meant to have that many people or that much traffic in it. I don't think there's a solution to the traffic there. More roads, wider roads, more traffic lights are not the answer. It's just a matter of having a population that's too large for an infrastructure that was never envisioned serving that much traffic.
Edmond getting more and better shopping, restaurants and movie theaters means a bigger draw for people from Stillwater and Enid adding to the traffic problems. It's doubtful Stillwater will ever get a better movie theater, a Home Depot or Target and a bunch more desirable businesses when people can just drive to Edmond in 45 minutes for all that. The upside is Stillwater and Enid gets spared from the nuisance of the problems that more congestion brings on.
bradh 05-26-2017, 02:32 PM Edmond getting more and better shopping, restaurants and movie theaters means a bigger draw for people from Stillwater and Enid adding to the traffic problems. It's doubtful Stillwater will ever get a better movie theater, a Home Depot or Target and a bunch more desirable businesses when people can just drive to Edmond in 45 minutes for all that. The upside is Stillwater and Enid gets spared from the nuisance of the problems that more congestion brings on.
What are you talking about, Enid has all that. What does Edmond have that folks from Enid would have to drive down for?
dcsooner 05-26-2017, 03:37 PM I haven't lived in OKC for 20 years but in talking with family and friends, and through multiple trips back, it seems to me that, (outliers like Sally Kern notwithstanding) there is a real and growing divergence between the Oklahoma City metropolitan area, which is becoming more urban and progressive and the rest of the state, which, if anything, is regressing.
I totally agree with this observation
Laramie 05-26-2017, 04:54 PM Oklahoma City's most promising days are ahead; Tulsa is following a similar break-out path you saw with OKC in the 90s as their metro will eclipse 1 million in 2020. The initiatives in both cities: MAPS & VISION 2025 has spurred more than $1 billion in private investments in each city.
Oklahoma City & Tulsa are cities on a separate direction from the state. Tulsa like OKC has managed to move toward a more diverse economy; they appear to be a little more heavily dependent on the Energy sector as OKC was in the 80s.
George Kaiser's foundation - 55 additional aces planned for Tulsa's new park ($350 million) along Riverside Drive: http://www.news9.com/story/22597201/george-kaiser-family-foundation-has-big-plans-for-a-gathering-place-in-tulsa
Oklahoma City ($132 million) has 70 acres planned for a central park in the core: http://newsok.com/article/5442858
These new parks are gathering places that adds to the 'quality of life' aspects of cities that are near or exceed the 1 million metro population.
Bunty 05-26-2017, 10:37 PM What are you talking about, Enid has all that. What does Edmond have that folks from Enid would have to drive down for?
Then I will kick Enid out of the point I was making.
Bunty 05-26-2017, 11:13 PM In many ways, dcsooner is spot on about Oklahoma. Not trying to be toxic, but the truth is the truth. I was born and raised in OKC for a good portion of my life. However, by leaving the State, it opened my mind that Oklahoma desperately needs to work on it's image. Poor education, poor health factors, no true diverse industry. Sorry folks, but sometimes the truth needs to be spoken. I am ready to get raked over the coals now (LOL).
So many bad state legislators, who probably aren't as well traveled as you, come from all over the state. Yet, the new state AG referred to the Oklahoma Legislature as well led by smart people. Fortunately, the Chamber of Commerce with its lobbying pressure has probably been more successful than any other concern in holding back a number of bad bills that would have been negative to industrial expansion and discourage population gains. So things in Oklahoma could be worse, progressiveboy.
The C of C will have to be back hard at it in 2018. If Oklahomans, as smart voters, want more done, then they will have to kick out a bunch of state capitol incumbents in 2018, assuming they get challengers. If not, incumbents will think they have been doing things right all along, and Oklahomans can just look forward to getting more bad government right back in their faces with population gains further slowing down. The C of C can't hold back everything bad.
Meanwhile, on the positive side, passage of the Energy Jobs Act of 2017, which allows horizontal drilling in all rock formations not just shale, will hopefully work as well as its promoters expect with thousands more drilling jobs and increased tax revenue. That will be a nice development, provided that legislators don't take it away by resuming income tax cuts as some of them are looking forward to doing.
Midtowner 05-27-2017, 02:32 PM If our legislature has learned anything from relentless tax cuts, they'll forget it in 12 years anyway when every single one of them has termed out.
BG918 05-27-2017, 08:34 PM I haven't lived in OKC for 20 years but in talking with family and friends, and through multiple trips back, it seems to me that, (outliers like Sally Kern notwithstanding) there is a real and growing divergence between the Oklahoma City metropolitan area, which is becoming more urban and progressive and the rest of the state, which, if anything, is regressing.
Well the problem is that the state govt funds important things that impact OKC and Tulsa like transportation, education and healthcare so even though the cities are getting better they can only do so much at odds with the state.
Plutonic Panda 12-27-2017, 08:37 AM Another poster has indicated Oklahoma had very minuscule growth(almost negative). What was OKC’s growth? I’m guessing Tulsa lost population again.
KayneMo 12-27-2017, 09:18 AM Census estimate shows growth has slowed. July 1, 2017 population estimate for the state is 3,930,864 - a 12-month increase of 9,700. City population estimates aren't released until about June 2018.
Oklahoma Population Numerical Increase
2016-2017: +9,657
2015-2016: +16,848
2014-2015: +29,345
2013-2014: +25,168
2012-2013: +34,542
2011-2012: +30,066
2010-2011: +25,703
Plutonic Panda 12-27-2017, 09:26 AM Hopefully that will increase for 2018. Those are horrible numbers for an entire state.
Colbafone 12-27-2017, 09:45 AM Hopefully that will increase for 2018. Those are horrible numbers for an entire state.
As it should be. Short of literally 3 or 4 school districts, no child should be raised in this state. Until this state gets its act together, I would imagine more people moving out of state, and less job development, this less coming into the state.
We all post on here and have a decent knowledge of the OKC area. But how many of you are familiar with more rural areas? Go drive to Watonga. Or Mangum. Sayre. Lahoma. Medford. Chandler. Cashion. Our rural school districts are less educated now than ever.
Rover 12-27-2017, 09:59 AM While you are correct about the abysmal way this state approaches education, I'm betting the slow down has more to do with slowdown in the oil and gas business than education. People move to where there are jobs. The rural oil patch has been hard hit. And, farming continues to be more and more automated and efficient.
People need to realize that the curve on oil and gas is threatened by alternate energy solutions and technology, as are other jobs. We either change our approach to education and training or will continue to slowly lose jobs, or at least not grow. It is a US problem as well.
Plutonic Panda 12-27-2017, 10:14 AM While you are correct about the abysmal way this state approaches education, I'm betting the slow down has more to do with slowdown in the oil and gas business than education. People move to where there are jobs. The rural oil patch has been hard hit. And, farming continues to be more and more automated and efficient.
People need to realize that the curve on oil and gas is threatened by alternate energy solutions and technology, as are other jobs. We either change our approach to education and training or will continue to slowly lose jobs, or at least not grow. It is a US problem as well.
So how long until I see you in another thread responding to another poster who is complaining the economy isn't diverse enough in Oklahoma saying Oklahoma has a very diverse economy. lol
bchris02 12-27-2017, 10:56 AM As it should be. Short of literally 3 or 4 school districts, no child should be raised in this state. Until this state gets its act together, I would imagine more people moving out of state, and less job development, this less coming into the state.
We all post on here and have a decent knowledge of the OKC area. But how many of you are familiar with more rural areas? Go drive to Watonga. Or Mangum. Sayre. Lahoma. Medford. Chandler. Cashion. Our rural school districts are less educated now than ever.
I agree. Oklahoma has some of the most depressing small towns of any state I've spent time in. Small towns within OKC or Tulsa's sphere of influence and towns near the state border are doing alright, but places like Henryetta? McAllister? Checotah? Okemah? It's depressing just driving through some of those places.
I think the oil & gas slowdown, dysfunction at 23rd and Lincoln, and the improving national economy are hitting Oklahoma pretty hard right now. It will be interesting to see what OKC and Tulsa's numbers look like. My guess is a hair of growth in OKC and a hair of population loss for Tulsa.
Bunty 12-27-2017, 11:16 AM I agree. Oklahoma has some of the most depressing small towns of any state I've spent time in. Small towns within OKC or Tulsa's sphere of influence and towns near the state border are doing alright, but places like Henryetta? McAllister? Checotah? Okemah? It's depressing just driving through some of those places.
I think the oil & gas slowdown, dysfunction at 23rd and Lincoln, and the improving national economy are hitting Oklahoma pretty hard right now. It will be interesting to see what OKC and Tulsa's numbers look like. My guess is a hair of growth in OKC and a hair of population loss for Tulsa.
I've been to Idabel before and didn't know a town could look so run down and poor. Towns in central and western Oklahoma aren't generally as bad off. A big bunch of small towns have been slowly dying away or at best stagnant for decades.
Online shopping and buying doesn't help most any town, large or small. Wal-mart closed in Perry. The upside is the west side Wal-mart in Stillwater benefits. Not all the problems have to do with poorly run state or local government.
The price of oil keeps slowly going up. That will surely help things in Oklahoma from getting worse. Higher prices for oil should mean more drilling and bring in higher revenue. Citizens should oppose legislators, who take that as a sign to resume reducing income taxes. Opposition to cutting taxes should be just as strong as opposition to raising them.
dcsooner 12-27-2017, 11:27 AM While you are correct about the abysmal way this state approaches education, I'm betting the slow down has more to do with slowdown in the oil and gas business than education. People move to where there are jobs. The rural oil patch has been hard hit. And, farming continues to be more and more automated and efficient.
People need to realize that the curve on oil and gas is threatened by alternate energy solutions and technology, as are other jobs. We either change our approach to education and training or will continue to slowly lose jobs, or at least not grow. It is a US problem as well.
To that point, this State is horrible in job creation. The lack of manufacturing on a large scale is one aspect, dependence on O&G. OKC touts all these firsts in multiple categories BUT nowhere do we talk about JOB CREATION. Oklahoma never COMPETES for high wage jobs and saying low cost of living is a plus is overused. Low cost of living equates to low wages and incomes. The State is simply run poorly
Laramie 12-27-2017, 11:45 AM Census estimate shows growth has slowed. July 1, 2017 population estimate for the state is 3,930,864 - a 12-month increase of 9,700. City population estimates aren't released until about June 2018.
Oklahoma Population Numerical Increase
2016-2017: +9,657
2015-2016: +16,848
2014-2015: +29,345
2013-2014: +25,168
2012-2013: +34,542
2011-2012: +30,066
2010-2011: +25,703
Thanks KayneMo:
Very disappointing especially when our city maintained decent numbers despite the glitch with the oil industry. Can't wait to see what the numbers are for Oklahoma City & Tulsa--state's 2 most populous cities. Our state is getting a bad rap for not getting its fiscal house in order coupled with the oil crisis. We'll see how diverse OKC's economy is come June 2018.
U.S. Census Bureau QuickFacts: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/OK
Jersey Boss 12-27-2017, 01:34 PM While you are correct about the abysmal way this state approaches education, I'm betting the slow down has more to do with slowdown in the oil and gas business than education. People move to where there are jobs. The rural oil patch has been hard hit.
People need to realize that the curve on oil and gas is threatened by alternate energy solutions and technology, as are other jobs.
I'm gonna call Bull Chips on this. Yeah there has been a slowdown in O&G due to market forces. However the assault on alternative energy is not due to market forces but by the state government looking to the past for solutions. Passing laws penalizing consumers from selling back solar excess or prohibiting third party solar farms from selling to residential customers hurts the employment prospects of individuals in these industries well as entrepenours investing in these new industries. Cutting incentives for wind energy while still propping up Hamm and his fellow barons with tax cuts, tax credits, and prohibiting towns from regulating drilling and waste water injection does not encourage the future.
Now mix in draconian marijuana laws and refusal to abandon the lock 'em up and throw away the key approach to crime and you have a future with 4 or 3 congressional seats next time around.
Add into the mix the State overriding municipalities when they try to pass quality of life ordinances such as minimum wage increases and the state will slowly go the way of rural Oklahoma.
Rover 12-27-2017, 05:08 PM Funny, our draconian mj laws were in place while we were booming. So was our awful education situation.
dcsooner 12-27-2017, 05:37 PM Funny, our draconian mj laws were in place while we were booming. So was our awful education situation.
Exactly When was Oklahoma booming? When teachers got a raise, when we got a large 2-3000 job factory? Or maybe when the per capita income ranked above the 25th quartile? When we lost oil companies to Houston? When we jailed more people per capita than any other State?You really mean when big oil boomed cause that is the ONLY industry that has historically had boom cycles.
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