First, get a place in the OKC urban core and rent it out via AirBnB to OKCTalkers who live out of town. ;)
Second, I think I've asked this before, but have you ever seriously considered moving back to OKC? When you mentioned wanting to make a difference earlier, all I could think is the incredible difference you could make by living in OKC.

If you do ever come back, settle in, and in a few years Mayor Brzycki sounds good.

Why do you care?

Because I dislike when any one makes an opinionated statement and tries to pass it off as fact. I mean that in general but it applies to your statement.

But I also know as soon as I make my next move, I'll deeply regret not living in California any more. :)

I don't know about that - I left California in 1990 and in 2003 I went to work in San Jose. During my first 3 days back I thought, "This isn't as bad as I remember. I could live here again." 3 days after that I couldn't wait to get out again.

If the 2015 version of OKC existed in 1994 I might have never left OKC in the first place.

That is a great statement to hear coming from you! It says a lot about how far OKC has come.



If the 2015 version of OKC existed in 1994 I might have never left OKC in the first place.

Still is, at least as of 2013. Also, I am almost certain that there is a larger percentage of people born in CA living in OK than any other state east of the Rockies.

California is not an easy place to live.

I do see California plates here quite often. I rarely ever saw them in NC. California isn't for everyone though. It's crowded and expensive. I can handle Dallas traffic but I have my reservations about L.A. traffic. It's a completely different world out there. To some people though the benefits outweigh the negatives. It really depends on what you want out of life and what your priorities are. California is expensive, but there is nowhere else in the US if not the world where so much is available in such close proximity. Literally anything you want to do is available there.

Don't all native Oklahomans have relatives that moved to CA in the dust bowl? I know I had great aunts and uncles on both sides of my parents living out here.

I must say, but for the high costs, San Diego is just about perfect. It lacks the severe traffic issues of LA and has a very laid-back, casual vibe. I could not see living in any other CA city, as the negatives might outweigh the positives. My company is HQ'ed in Silicon Valley, so I have been there many times and could not imagine living there.

That's a very fair post. My point was to not blame people who left for things not changing. Sure they have an affect, but you can't expect people to put up with things forever.

I've had enough of Oklahoma for right now. I'll most likely return at some point.

An opportunity knocked to live elsewhere, with many more things aligned with my interested than OKC. I may hate it. I certainly know I will not be a part of the community for a while -- and that is scary. Hopefully I can make some friends up there. As it stands I only know one person in Portland.

I agree with all of your points, though. I just don't like the "you're leaving because you're a quitter" mentality that is trying to creep into this thread. I'm leaving because I can and because I want to. And that's how it is for a lot of people.

In order to retain people. You have to make them not want to leave. Not tell them it will be better in 5 years.

We all have to live our lives how we want. Some want to help make places better while others just want to live somewhere that satisfies them as it is. Plenty of those options in America, but none in Oklahoma for me personally. Yet.

In all fairness, catch22, and I respect you a lot, you are the one who couched your departure in terms of having "enough" of the futility of trying to make a difference in OKC. This discussion is so good for us. Conversations like this are why I joined OKCTalk in the first place. We can sharpen and help each other through intelligent discussion when we talk about the big picture and people's real struggles and real motives. I'm not faulting you for wanting to leave; I just wish you didn't want to leave.

Definitely agree. I did many of those things including served on a MAPS Committee and started/championed a couple civic movements. I have NOTHING but respect for those who stay and fight. Nothing.

On edit: it should also be reiterated, that being car free (by choice) and with kids, really makes it harder for OKC to compete on the urban scene. If I was single or just married, it would be much, much easier to justify staying. But like others have mentioned, you've got to live the life you want and as a parent, give the life you think is best to your kids. I'm rooting for ya OKC!

I am married with 5 children. On Friday night, I took my boys, who are 6 and 5, on their bikes with training wheels, and I walked alongside them from the boathouse district--along the canal--through Bricktown, ate at Texadelphia, and walked/biked all the way back. 3 miles on training wheels is quite an accomplishment for a couple of little boys. We had the time of our lives.

That is a great statement to hear coming from you! It says a lot about how far OKC has come.

Imagine how many people on this very board might come to say, "If only the 2030 version of OKC were there in 2015, I would never have left." What a shame to miss out on what the next 15 years holds for OKC. I can't wait.

Imagine how many people on this very board might come to say, "If only the 2030 version of OKC were there in 2015, I would never have left." What a shame to miss out on what the next 15 years holds for OKC. I can't wait.

This is the dilemma I am facing right now personally.

I really think that by 2030 OKC will have arrived and most of the things that are currently frustrating about this place or things that simply aren't available here will have arrived. In 2030 the urban core will have contiguous development with today's up and coming districts like Midtown and Deep Deuce having reached mature stages. There will be a fully functional streetcar and enough retail in the core that a trip to the suburbs should never be necessary. In 2030, the urban core of OKC should be able to stand on its own. There should also be some form of light rail/commuter rail by that point. Hall Capital will have developed the area around the 21c hotel, Film Row will be amazing, and residential development will have filled in all sides of the Myriad Gardens. An NFL stadium will either be under construction or under consideration.

The question is, do I want to stay here and wait for it to get to that point, or do I want to leave? Both answers can be easily justified. I don't blame anybody for not wanting to wait out the prime of their life here when they can spend it somewhere else that is more fitting for their goals, ambitions, and lifestyle. On the flipside, this is an excellent place to be if you want to make a difference and want to make a name for yourself as others have said. I also think this area is great for long term real estate investment. You can get some dirt-cheap land right now that in 2030 will likely be valued very high.

In all fairness, catch22, and I respect you a lot, you are the one who couched your departure in terms of having "enough" of the futility of trying to make a difference in OKC. This discussion is so good for us. Conversations like this are why I joined OKCTalk in the first place. We can sharpen and help each other through intelligent discussion when we talk about the big picture and people's real struggles and real motives. I'm not faulting you for wanting to leave; I just wish you didn't want to leave.

Sorry, I was not clear. I'm leaving not because I am fed up with trying to change Oklahoma; but rather just fed up with Oklahoma as a whole.

I honestly do not do a whole lot anyway-- I'm young, my voice is often ignored outside of this forum. I have attended probably close to 75 or 100 public meetings. Council, Streetcar, Parks, Airport Trust mainly. I've helped out on several city campaigns. I've emailed every city councilor at some point on certain issues, I've emailed dozens of city departments on issues that concerned me (Some of which have been implemented by the city), I report issues on the OKC.gov app, and I pull up every commercial building permit filed at the city online and get information on the ones that seem interesting to me. (Pete does this too)

I do a lot of things to stay informed. and make my opinion heard, and some work here and there to help those who are fighting for change. I don't lead the charge. however. I'm not in trenches.

So to expand what I truly mean now that I am behind a computer (I was posting on my iPhone at work, which causes me to rush and not lay my thoughts out how I intend):

I'm fed up with Central Oklahoma-- some of it can't be changed: the landscape, lack of natural beauty, the temperature extremes from arctic to Sahara desert, the persistent, wild wind which never seems to stop, the air hurts your face. Some of it can be changed: transit, walkability, political harshness.

I'm confident in OKC's future, but right now I am just tired of it. I'm tired of the "can't be changed" and equallity tired of the things that are changing, but seem so far off. The streetcar will be done soon. But how many more years until transit becomes a serious focus?

The bottom line is that I am losing my job in OKC, due to penny-pincher bean-counters in Chicago, IL. That's not OKC's fault. 20 other cities are also getting axed. I had the choice to stay in OKC and find other work (which wouldn't be difficult), or keep my job and move to Portland.

I don't want to be labeled as giving up on OKC, because I'm not. I'm taking a break. I'm burnt out with Oklahoma. I'm burnt out with the middle of the country.

So, to my friends who are fighting for positive change and progressive issues in OKC:

Just keep swimming. You're doing great.

I'll be back again one day, hopefully a little wiser, a broader view of the world, and hopefully will find myself able to help make some meaningful difference.

Imagine how many people on this very board might come to say, "If only the 2030 version of OKC were there in 2015, I would never have left."

This is a real problem though for OKC and I don't know that they realize that. If people can choose complete places over works in progress, most times they will. This is why I always talk about OKC not having a sense of urgency about things such as RTA. They don't realize that they are losing people because "We are working on it." It's not good enough. How for we've come doesn't matter to people looking to move into the metro today.

This is a real problem though for OKC and I don't know that they realize that. If people can choose complete places over works in progress, most times they will. This is why I always talk about OKC not having a sense of urgency about things such as RTA. They don't realize that they are losing people because "We are working on it." It's not good enough. How for we've come doesn't matter to people looking to move into the metro today.

This is why I believe the city needs a comprehensive vision for the entire urban core from Wheeler to 23rd and also needs to find a away to prioritize certain corridors (10th in Midtown comes to mind).

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but apparently we've had a record year in regard to flu related deaths.
Going back to September of 2014, the tally sits at 108 now. That's kind of serious...

Any way, here's a brief article:

Record Number Of Oklahoma Flu-Related Deaths Still Climbing - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com | (http://www.newson6.com/story/28820792/record-number-of-oklahoma-flu-related-deaths-still-climbing)

I'm not sure if it's been like this everywhere, or if OK was just hit particularly hard.

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but apparently we've had a record year in regard to flu related deaths.
Going back to September of 2014, the tally sits at 108 now. That's kind of serious...

Any way, here's a brief article:

Record Number Of Oklahoma Flu-Related Deaths Still Climbing - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com | (http://www.newson6.com/story/28820792/record-number-of-oklahoma-flu-related-deaths-still-climbing)

I'm not sure if it's been like this everywhere, or if OK was just hit particularly hard.

It would not be surprising if we start to see medical stats like this more commonly broken, because the numbers for that are largely set by the age range the baby boomer population spike is getting to.

City population estimates for 2014 are out from the Census.

Oklahoma City - 620,602 (+40,594 since 2010)
Norman - 118,040 (+7,115)
Edmond - 88,605 (+7,206)
Moore - 59,196 (+4,115)
Midwest City - 57,039 (+2,668)

Interesting. I think OKC will overtake Baltimore as the 26th largest city next year, although we are roughly neck and neck with Portland (and Portland is growing at nearly the exact rate as OKC).

Also, I think these estimates are having a hard time measuring anything in Cleveland County right now. Norman actually had a small population loss while Moore showed a gain of 1.2% YoY. Seems like that should be inverted due to the tornado.

City population estimates for 2014 are out from the Census.

Oklahoma City - 620,602 (+40,594 since 2010)
Norman - 118,040 (+7,115)
Edmond - 88,605 (+7,206)
Moore - 59,196 (+4,115)
Midwest City - 57,039 (+2,668)

Next year it will be interesting to see if the reduced price of oil negatively impacts the population figures, if at all.

Interesting. I think OKC will overtake Baltimore as the 26th largest city next year, although we are roughly neck and neck with Portland (and Portland is growing at nearly the exact rate as OKC).

Also, I think these estimates are having a hard time measuring anything in Cleveland County right now. Norman actually had a small population loss while Moore showed a gain of 1.2% YoY. Seems like that should be inverted due to the tornado.

Not talking MSA but, at current growth patterns, Raleigh NC will likely pass the Metro population by the next census (2020) so although we may pass Memphis as an MSA, I think unless we increase our good growth with great growth we will remain in the same place MSA wise.

What was OKC's growth rate for 2014? It's a shame OKC was excluded here:

http://www.slate.com/content/dam/slate/blogs/moneybox/2015/03/04/u_s_urbanization_big_cities_are_booming/cities_1.png.CROP.promovar-mediumlarge.png

I have OKC's 40,000+ gain 2010-2014 resembling a 6.99% population increase. But that's apples to oranges.

2010 - 2013 was a 5.3% gain.

580,005 for April 1, 2010 --- 610,613 for July 1, 2013.

By the way I think that 580,005 is actually the "2010 base pop" which is somehow slightly lower than the official 2010 Census count... not sure what any of that means though.

Coming in just below San Antonio in growth...not bad AT ALL.

2010 - 2013 was a 5.3% gain.

580,005 for April 1, 2010 --- 610,613 for July 1, 2013.

Tio9969, help me to understand these figures which the U. S. Census initially listed OKC with 579,999 (Central City) . The 580,005 was that an adjustment? I've come in on the tail end of this thread...

Found it: Estimate base?

http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=bkmk

Oklahoma City (city) QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau (http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/40/4055000.html)

Then again, the difference between 579,999 and 580,005 is all of six.

so where will OKC be in 2020 if it maintains (balance) the current growth? 700,000 on roughly 120,000 for the decade?

Metro at a nice solid 1.7m?

so where will OKC be in 2020 if it maintains (balance) the current growth? 700,000 on roughly 120,000 for the decade?

Metro at a nice solid 1.7m?

1.7 million will probably happen closer to 2030 at current growth rates.

By 2030 I bet metro pop is much close to 2 mil than 1.5. I mean it's at 1.5+ right now so by 2020 IMO 1.7 and by 2030 close to 2 mil if not there. I don't see it going down. Of course I add Shawnee area since it is part of the metro just the same as Norman or Guthrie.

By 2030 I bet metro pop is much close to 2 mil than 1.5. I mean it's at 1.5+ right now so by 2020 IMO 1.7 and by 2030 close to 2 mil if not there. I don't see it going down. Of course I add Shawnee area since it is part of the metro just the same as Norman or Guthrie.

Oklahoma City MSA Population (2014): 1,322,459

I would guess 1.4ish by 2020 and 1.6-1.7 by 2030.

By 2030 I bet metro pop is much close to 2 mil than 1.5. I mean it's at 1.5+ right now so by 2020 IMO 1.7 and by 2030 close to 2 mil if not there. I don't see it going down. Of course I add Shawnee area since it is part of the metro just the same as Norman or Guthrie.

But Shawnee is not part of the MSA like Norman and Guthrie are...

At the current rate, I'm guessing 1.46 million in 2020.

But Shawnee is not part of the MSA like Norman and Guthrie are...

At the current rate, I'm guessing 1.46 million in 2020.

Sounds about right. I don't see OKC making it to 1.5 million by 2020 but it should pass 1.4 million.

1,336,767 is 2014 metro Okc pop. MSA. And Shawnee should be added within several years IMO bringing it over 1.5 mil.

American FactFinder - Results (http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=bkmk)

1,336,767 is 2014 metro Okc pop. MSA. And Shawnee should be added within several years IMO bringing it over 1.5 mil.

American FactFinder - Results (http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=bkmk)

Pottawatomie County only has 71,158 people so if it was added that would bring the metro population to around 1.4 million. So yeah, it's maybe possible to have 1.5 million in the OKC-Shawnee CSA by 2020. However, CSA is a metric that is irrelevant to people outside the census bureau and City-Data and I don't think simply adding counties to increase population gives OKC any bragging rights. OKC needs real growth, specifically in the urban core and other denser areas of the metro.

That's what I am saying. If you add Shawnee and the other micros to OKC like some other cities do then we are at 1.5+ right now. Look at Seattle for instance. Look how far they go out to Tacoma (about 40 Miles) and then make the skip out to Olympia to add to their pop. Lots of other cities do the same and with OKC and Shawnee coming closer together with sprawl it shouldn't be long before they are added IMO. So for all intent purposes OKC metro is 1.5 mil. Look how many gamblers make the drive to Grand casino everyday. It's part of the city area IMO.

Seattle goes way past Tacoma to get our numbers. But that is for CSA. The Seattle-Bellevue MSA is different than the Tacoma-Olympia MSA; two different MSAs that's mostly combined to get the Seattle-Tacoma CSA most of the time since we're all kind of close.

One other thing to think about is the Puget Sound is geographically constrained, so we go north-south by leaps and bounds but not so much East-West.

I do agree that Shawnee should be part of OKC's MSA and Stillwater should be the CSA, that to me would be applicable to Seattle MSA vs Seattle-Tacoma CSA, since Shawnee is as every bit as integral to the OKC metro as Norman and Guthrie are but Stillwater is a bit away from OKC-Norman-Guthrie much like Olympia is here (and likely the same amount of commuters for each csa). Fair is fair!

And if OKC metro under its current definition is 1.3M in 2013, then I could totally see it growing more than 200K to eclipse 1.5M within the next 5 years. Heck, I bet it would be 1.6M in 2020 under the current definition; with it revised to what the MSA should be then it would be 1.7M.

And if OKC metro under its current definition is 1.3M in 2013, then I could totally see it growing more than 200K to eclipse 1.5M within the next 5 years. Heck, I bet it would be 1.6M in 2020 under the current definition; with it revised to what the MSA should be then it would be 1.7M.



http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/georgeview1med.jpg
Population figures are difficult to predict. Oklahoma City is at the point where we will grow or become stagnant. City & State leadership will be the key.

Many U. S. cities that reach that 1.25 million metro plateau (e.g., Austin, Charlotte, Columbus, Indianapolis, Nashville) usually begin a period of accelerated growth as it expands its corporate & economic base followed by an influx of talented professionals. We need to keep our talented professionals here.

Among OKC's biggest challenges will be to supply the housing, developments & quality jobs growth that will keep pace with that demand.

Five key needs for improvement components mush be addressed: Higher Education, Public Transportation, Air travel access (flights to/from Oklahoma City), along with improved Infrastructure & Quality schools (K-12)--those will be our greatest obstacles.

Several key traits like the NBA, transit (public), growth employers (Devon, Chesapeake, Continental Resources, Sandridge, American Energy Partners, Enable Midstream Partners, Sonic, Tinker AFB), & the increased growth development investments in area districts like Asian, Bricktown, Boathouse, Central Business, Commerce Street, Farmers Market, Medical Centers (Integris Baptist centers, Mercy, OU Medical, St. Anthony), Paseo, Wheeler districts are positive signs.

All districts will need continuous aesthetic & cosmetic attention.

And if OKC metro under its current definition is 1.3M in 2013, then I could totally see it growing more than 200K to eclipse 1.5M within the next 5 years. Heck, I bet it would be 1.6M in 2020 under the current definition; with it revised to what the MSA should be then it would be 1.7M.

I think getting to 1.5 million by 2020 is optimistic in the face of low oil prices and negative media attention. I would really like to see it happen but I don't see how it would be possible unless there is a huge uptick in population growth and right now there really isn't a catalyst for it. Getting to 1.7 million in 5 years would require adding 400,000 people, or a growth rate over almost 30%. What would drive growth to those levels? I think snagging a few corporate relocations from California would help but OKC seems to have trouble competing with Dallas and Austin for those.

Population figures are difficult to predict. Oklahoma City is at the point where we will grow or become stagnant. City & State leadership will be the key.

Many U. S. cities that reach that 1.25 million metro plateau (e.g., Austin, Charlotte, Columbus, Indianapolis, Nashville) usually begin a period of accelerated growth as it expands its corporate & economic base followed by an influx of talented professionals. We need to keep our talented professionals here.

Among OKC's biggest challenges will be to supply the housing, developments & quality jobs growth that will keep pace with that demand.

Five key needs for improvement components mush be addressed: Higher Education, Public Transportation, Air travel access (flights to/from Oklahoma City), along with improved Infrastructure & Quality schools (K-12)--those will be our greatest obstacles.

Several key traits like the NBA, transit (public), growth employers (Devon, Chesapeake, Continental Resources, Sandridge, American Energy Partners, Enable Midstream Partners, Sonic, Tinker AFB), & the increased growth development investments in area districts like Asian, Bricktown, Boathouse, Central Business, Commerce Street, Farmers Market, Medical Centers (Integris Baptist centers, Mercy, OU Medical, St. Anthony), Paseo, Wheeler districts are positive signs.

All districts will need continuous aesthetic & cosmetic attention.

The price of oil is 10X more important then city leadership or any of those things. The higher oil is in 16 17 18 and 19 the bigger the boom. Those are nice but they don't drive growth, oil drives growth, they help with retention in the down years.

Beautifications, beautification, beautification... ...we need to clean & keep our city clean.

What visitors see in our city often becomes their first & last impression. We want to impact all of their senses.

Oklahoma City is home to NBA (Thunder), PCL (Dodgers), USL (Energy), quality museums and annual events like Red Earth, Big 12 tournaments (baseball, wrestling etc.,) and the Women's College World Series (WCWS); these events help showcase our city in a different light. The loss of the NFR which our city built will continue to be a grim reminder that facilities to host events are important. Much like advertising & marketing; these events become our brand as well as the importance of the upkeep of our city.

OKC needs to take advantage of its central location; where a piece like a convention center complex can cater to an event like the recent Southern Republican Leadership Conference. You can build your city's convention portfolio through hospitality for which OKC is quite reputable.

OKC's population will boom if we have something to offer. Build our base through firms that provide quality jobs through growth & development; these are key investments to secure our future.

The price of oil is 10X more important then city leadership or any of those things. The higher oil is in 16 17 18 and 19 the bigger the boom. Those are nice but they don't drive growth, oil drives growth, they help with retention in the down years.

Definitely agree with this. I wouldn't say oil is as important as high-paying jobs. In OKC, most of that kind of growth comes from the energy sector. Improving quality of life is a bonus and really helps keep people in OKC when they otherwise might have the opportunity to move somewhere else. Unfortunately, OKC isn't blessed with the geographical advantages of an Austin or a Portland. Because of that, its unlikely it will ever boom on its own merit. However, an economy-driven boom is definitely possible.

The price of oil is 10X more important then city leadership or any of those things. The higher oil is in 16 17 18 and 19 the bigger the boom. Those are nice but they don't drive growth, oil drives growth, they help with retention in the down years.

Your city & state leadership's decision-making can have an impact on where companies locate or relocate for that matter. MAPS was influential on Devon remaining in OKC or possibly relocating to Houston.

Let's not overemphasize the importance of oil as it relates to the overall scheme. A simplified base which becomes dependent on oil is risky.

We don't want to repeat what happened with the oil bust decades ago. Oklahoma City's economy is more diverse than the price of oil. We learned from that episode of the 80s. Developments like the Keystone Pipeline would oversaturate the market and continue to add to the oil woes.

Oklahoma City needs to continue to diversify its corporate & business base where one sector doesn't adversely affect the whole economy.

Let's not overemphasize the importance of oil as it relates to the overall scheme. A simplified base which becomes dependent on oil is risky.

We don't want to repeat what happened with the oil bust decades ago. Oklahoma City's economy is more diverse than the price of oil. We learned from that episode of the 80s. Developments like the Keystone Pipeline would oversaturate the market and continue to add to the oil woes.

Oklahoma City needs to continue to diversify its corporate & business base where one sector doesn't adversely affect the whole economy.

It's really really really easy to run around and preach diversification. It's very very very hard to achieve and sometimes comes through just sheer luck.

We're more diverse now then the 80s and we'll be more diverse in 2040. It's a very slow difficult. A lot of the workforce and talent here has experience in the oil industry. It's no different then being a tech firm and location in Silicon Valley. Thats where a huge chunk of the talent for tech is.

All those things you listed are nice but to not even acknowledge that oil prices are basically the gasoline in the car (see what I did there?) is ignorant of how our economy works. The city can build an awesome car, but without gasoline to fuel it, it's going no where. The higher the price of oil, the more gasoline we have.

The only thing the city can really do is work to improve the quality of life here. The city can try to create a more business friendly environment, but that doesn't assure anything. You can give incentives for companies to move here, you can host conventions, but if out of state people visit OKC and they don't like what they see, they won't come back. We need to invest in our core and make the city a beautiful, fun, and exciting place to live.

The one thing that we can't predict but we can try to shape is potential industry.

Jobs. Jobs are what make people stay or leave, move here or move there.
As stated previously, it's easy to preach economic diversity, it's another to achieve it. It's hard to do.
Not to derail into politics, as this will be my only mention of it, but Steve had mentioned a while back on one of his chats that he received word of a national brand that was looking to move their HQ to OKC but decided against it when some of our bills made national news, etc. particularly aimed against same sex relationships. Just something to think about...

Honestly, OKC just needs to keep doing what it's doing now. Stay consistent and stay level headed in regard to what's planned. Don't bite off more than you can chew. Patience will always win out. And as hoya just said above, improve quality of life. Keep on track with the light rail plans (pun intended), and continue to make OKC pedestrian friendly. If you notice, the cities growing exponentially are the ones with booming millennial populations, of which comes a taste for outdoor activity, biking walking, etc.

Jobs. Jobs are what make people stay or leave, move here or move there.
As stated previously, it's easy to preach economic diversity, it's another to achieve it. It's hard to do.
Not to derail into politics, as this will be my only mention of it, but Steve had mentioned a while back on one of his chats that he received word of a national brand that was looking to move their HQ to OKC but decided against it when some of our bills made national news, etc. particularly aimed against same sex relationships. Just something to think about...

I agree with this.

I wish the legislature would quit with the anti-gay obsession. It may help them shore up a few votes but it re-enforces a perception issue that hurts Oklahoma economically at all levels. Unfortunately, you can't reason with people who think they are doing the work of God. I think when discussing Oklahoma City's growth prospects, its essential to discuss politics because the social conservatism does have an impact on people moving here, people staying here, and businesses willing to locate here. Other than tornadoes, its the number one thing people in other states cringe at when you mention Oklahoma.

This is just among my circle, but I know a lot of younger people who a year ago were OKC cheerleaders that moved away after this last legislative session. Those are people whom would have contributed to the success and vibrancy of this community had they have stayed. Things like this do have an effect.

You can be socially conservative and still have people move here. But being crazy tends to keep them away. Anybody who would even consider moving to Oklahoma (or Texas, or most places in the South) is going to be okay with living in a socially conservative place. If they weren't, they wouldn't even think about it. And remember that half the country is relatively conservative. But outspoken people like Sally Kern, who make national news and come across as very hateful people, do our city and state a real disservice. I don't think they are very representative of the people of Oklahoma. The great majority of the people here, while very religious and conservative, do not wish harm upon gay people or think that they are worse than terrorists. But Sally Kern makes people think the whole state is that way.

I don't want this to stray into politics, so I'll try to get it back on topic. As gay marriage becomes less of a political issue (which will probably happen after the next Presidential election, presuming the Supreme Court makes it legal throughout the country this summer, we'll probably see the last fights about it over the next year or two), this is something that will hopefully start to fade in Oklahoma. We can't get back the business Steve was talking about that considered moving here, but there'll be other businesses in the future who find themselves in a similar position, and if gay marriage isn't as big a political issue at that point, we'll be in a much better position to get those companies.

Believe it or not, but I had heard back around 2008-2012 that many people were looking to move to Oklahoma due to our stances on some issues that leaned right of center... I'm not sure how many, but this was all via word of mouth within and without some of my own social circles. The way I recall it was it was a sizable number of people interested in getting out of the NE, NW, etc. looking for more "conservative" places to live. So, it's definitely something that goes both ways, I guess. And we shouldn't necessarily demonize one side when examined from 30,000 feet.

My best advice is keep the crazy on the low and find healthy balance that can benefit the population of OK.

Believe it or not, but I had heard back around 2008-2012 that many people were looking to move to Oklahoma due to our stances on some issues that leaned right of center... I'm not sure how many, but this was all via word of mouth within and without some of my own social circles. The way I recall it was it was a sizable number of people interested in getting out of the NE, NW, etc. looking for more "conservative" places to live. So, it's definitely something that goes both ways, I guess. And we shouldn't necessarily demonize one side when examined from 30,000 feet.

My best advice is keep the crazy on the low and find healthy balance that can benefit the population of OK.

This is not something that "goes both ways." Sorry...

I think getting to 1.5 million by 2020 is optimistic in the face of low oil prices and negative media attention. I would really like to see it happen but I don't see how it would be possible unless there is a huge uptick in population growth and right now there really isn't a catalyst for it. Getting to 1.7 million in 5 years would require adding 400,000 people, or a growth rate over almost 30%. What would drive growth to those levels? I think snagging a few corporate relocations from California would help but OKC seems to have trouble competing with Dallas and Austin for those.

7-years away. The 1.335M MSA figure was from 2013. Roughly 56K per year would do it.

In 2014, Oklahoma City metro is home to 1.41 million residents, up from 1.25 million in 2010.

...Oklahoma City is one of the most diverse cities in the state, and its Hispanic population has grown dramatically over the years. The Hispanic population of Oklahoma City grew 85% from 2000 to 2010, with a proportion increasing from 5.2% to 8.9% in that same time period.

Oklahoma City Population 2015 - World Population Review (http://worldpopulationreview.com/us-cities/oklahoma-city-population/) Released 10-19-2014

2014's estimate of 1.41 million looks encouraging according to the above link; an estimate gain approximately 75,000 from 2013 - 2014.

1,410,000
1,334,000
(+) 76,000

We could easily reach 1.6 million by 2020 if we maintain our current rate of growth; 2015's estimate should give us a good gauge as to how the numbers play out as we approach 2017. Wouldn't be surprised to see an estimated low of 1.7 or high of 2 million range by 2020.

^ Where does that 2014 number come from? The Census estimate has the metro at 1.34 million for 2014, a gain of about 84,000 since 2010. At that rate (about 21,000 per year), the metro would be at 1.46 million in 2020 (2015 would be approximately 1.36 million), which is how I got that number in my previous post. I would be surprised to hit 1.5 million in 2020, much less 1.7 million or nearly 2 million.

^CSA number not MSA.

Today the metro pop is close enough to 1.5 mil. to call it 1.5 mil. By 2020 OKC metro pop should be somewhere around 1.75-1.8 mil. This includes micros like Shawnee. Also,there are thousands of hispanic residents that are not accounted for.

Today the metro pop is close enough to 1.5 mil. to call it 1.5 mil. By 2020 OKC metro pop should be somewhere around 1.75-1.8 mil. This includes micros like Shawnee. Also,there are thousands of hispanic residents that are not accounted for.

Between 2010 and 2013 the metropolitan area grew by 2.6%

If the metro area grows at the same rate through the entire decade, that would put the CSA at 1,436,030 in 2020. To get anywhere near 1.7 or 1.8 million by 2020 would require Austin-level growth or even greater which isn't going to happen in the face of low oil prices (not considering other factors holding growth here back). If the metro grows as fast as it did from 2000-10, which actually saw better growth numbers than what the metro is currently seeing, that would still only put the CSA population at 1,512,858 in 2020.

I agree with this.

I wish the legislature would quit with the anti-gay obsession. It may help them shore up a few votes but it re-enforces a perception issue that hurts Oklahoma economically at all levels. Unfortunately, you can't reason with people who think they are doing the work of God. I think when discussing Oklahoma City's growth prospects, its essential to discuss politics because the social conservatism does have an impact on people moving here, people staying here, and businesses willing to locate here. Other than tornadoes, its the number one thing people in other states cringe at when you mention Oklahoma.

This is just among my circle, but I know a lot of younger people who a year ago were OKC cheerleaders that moved away after this last legislative session. Those are people whom would have contributed to the success and vibrancy of this community had they have stayed. Things like this do have an effect.
I find it hard to believe that "a lot" of people moved away because of a legislative session. If someone is that unstable about a place because of something like that, then they are likely to be moving again soon. When you say "a lot", exactly how many is "a lot"? I hope you can be honest with your response. I say that because as long as I've been following this board, almost all of your posts are anti OKC or veiled to try to cover that bias.

I find it hard to believe that "a lot" of people moved away because of a legislative session. If someone is that unstable about a place because of something like that, then they are likely to be moving again soon. When you say "a lot", exactly how many is "a lot"? I hope you can be honest with your response. I say that because as long as I've been following this board, almost all of your posts are anti OKC or veiled to try to cover that bias.

"A lot" is within my own circle of friends and acquaintances. I know nobody who moved specifically because of the legislature but I've known a few who have stated it was a factor. It's probably a bigger factor for people currently living elsewhere who are considering accepting a job here, especially if they happen to be LGBT or non-conservative Christian.

Today the metro pop is close enough to 1.5 mil. to call it 1.5 mil. By 2020 OKC metro pop should be somewhere around 1.75-1.8 mil. This includes micros like Shawnee. Also,there are thousands of hispanic residents that are not accounted for.

What sort of metrics are you using to calculate the metro's population that it should be above 1.7 million by 2020?

I find it hard to believe that "a lot" of people moved away because of a legislative session. If someone is that unstable about a place because of something like that, then they are likely to be moving again soon. When you say "a lot", exactly how many is "a lot"? I hope you can be honest with your response. I say that because as long as I've been following this board, almost all of your posts are anti OKC or veiled to try to cover that bias.

It's also important to point out that (a) this is nothing new. Anyone living in Oklahoma is either aware of the state's politicians or naive. And (b) this is not in any way a problem exclusive to Oklahoma. This is another case of Oklahomans just being more familiar with the craziness of their state legislators. I would argue that Kansas' politicians who have basically bankrupted the state by basing policy on the unproven Laffer Curve. Texas' legislature passed an anti-marriage equality resolution and is close to legalizing concealed carry on college campuses against the wishes of police forces and pretty much every university. There is no shortage of examples. "Crazy" legislation is being passed in most states in this country. So, this is neither new or exclusive to Oklahoma. I doubt it's a more significant factor than it was in the past or than it is in other conservative states. Maybe it's worse in Oklahoma, but I'd have to some research before jumping to that conclusion.

What sort of metrics are you using to calculate the metro's population that it should be above 1.7 million by 2020?

Look at growth from 2010-2015. If we have the same rate of growth we should be there. I am talking CSA