Midtowner: "It comes down for respect for others. Some folks have it, some don't. If you have respect for others, don't bring your children to inappropriate places; don't go to a restaurant and talk loudly or cackle at things which aren't really funny. Be respectful of space and boundaries and such. At the same time, if you're at Chile's or Applebees, and someone brings their screaming hellions, be conscious of the fact that you are not at The Carriage House."

Along with the comments of PennyQuilts, one of the most fair and balanced perspectives expressed on this issue. IMHO only, of course.

OKCMallen: "We later had a conversation about a related topic, and the mom got offended, "What are we supposed to do, just stay home?!" I looked at her dead in the eye and said, "Well, yeah." IT's that simple- when you have kids and they're too young to control/you can't control them, you simply don't need to be in crowded restaurants. There are sacrifices that come with kids. We aren't all supposed to accommodate you."

The wisdom of Solomon. No kidding.

I just remembered that, when my brother and I were young, going to a "sit-down" restaurant was a very big deal. We even got dressed up to go with our little clip-on ties and so forth. I think everyone in our household had been influenced by "Leave it to Beaver" . . . Although I used to like to pretend that I was Michael Anthony, the guy who delivered those checks from John Beresford Tipton, to deserving people, on "The Millionaire" rather than Wally or The Beave.

(BTW: I TOTALLY enjoyed playing grown-up like that.)

If it hasn't already been mentioned, one could probably add "Deep Fork Grill" to the list . . .
Or even if it HAS been mentioned.

Do you suppose that right next to the menus that many restaurants post next to their doors that some sort of "Parental Advisory" regarding behavior expectations might be appropriate? I don't really see how something like that could "hurt" business . . .

It used to be smoking or non-smoking seating. It would be nice if places could separate dinners with kids and without, even if it just either side of a room. We normally eat in the bar to avoid this issue. What has surprised me is when we go to higher end places, especially fine dining, and we get seated by a little screamer. I am sure parents do not want their kids to sit and listen to the way some adults talk either.

Now that I am a parent and have 3 yrs of restaurant experience I believe parenting comes into play but not as much as you think...Kids are normally amped up to be out and some of them simply don't handle the social scene and being surrounded by strangers as well as others

Easy to blame it on parenting but trying to fully understand the mind of a 3 yr old is useless

I don't want to offend you, Easy, but I have very strong feelings about this and as a guardian ad litem, I absolutely dreaded it when parents had this attitude because so many of their kids ended up being miserable and in trouble when they got older. I don't know how you parent - not saying I do and I am not saying that is going to happen to you but it would be a huge red flag in my previous line of work.

At some point in the not too distant past, how to parent didn't pass on to the next generation. Of course it is the parents' fault if a child acts up in a restaurant. Kids are kids and that hasn't changed. What has changed is that parents are abandoning millions of years of learning how to parent in favor of pop psychology and reading books like, "How to Raise Children in Your Spare Time," and "A Well Behaved Child in Fifteen Minutes - Guaranteed!" Some of the most incompetent parents I've ever worked with who see other families sitting at restaurants having a calm time would insist to me, in all sincerity, that those parents must "beat" the children in private to achieve that sort of civility. Hello?

It is not about understanding the mind of a three year old, really, other than to notice the signs that he or she is getting overstimulated, hungry or tired. And when that happens, you remove the child from the stimulus, feed them or put them to bed. That is not any big psychological jump and it shouldn't be. It is just being a parent. If a child is too amped up to behave in a restaurant, you don't take him in. PERIOD. As soon as a child figures out that he can act like a little monkey in a restaurant and get away with it, he has learned to be one of the dreaded screaming hellions. That IS the parent's fault. You don't just shrug and say you are helpless and expect the world to understand. The world WON'T understand and when the child gets older and expects it to, you set them up for a hard life.

Too many parents think they are supposed to be psychologists (without the rigorous training) or their child's buddy. Rubish. You don't take a child out in public and try to negotiate with them beyond age appropriate offering of choices selected by the parent. And if he or she doesn't select in short order, the parent selects for them, end of story. The parent is the parent and they set the rules and expectations. If someone can't control their child, they need to seriously think about getting some parenting classes to figure out what it means to be a parent. If someone can't control their four year old, god help them (and us) ten years down the road. Your child will thank you for it when they are grown.

I had three kids in five years and could take them out and they knew how to behave - I always got compliments. We enjoyed going and by teaching them manners, they got to do a lot of things that wouldn't have happened if they acted like brats. All of them, as adults, understand how things work, they respect their bosses and are doing well because teaching a child manners is teaching them to be able to make sense of the world. It takes complete consistency and an understanding that it is a parents' job to not inflict their children on the rest of the world but that is no different than what any other parent has to do.

For the "Problem Pointer" vs. "Solution Provider" File:

(Have It YOUR Way . . . Flower-y or Concise =)

Sign A:

To All of Our Valued Customers:

We Welcome You to what will, most assuredly, be
One of The Finest Dining Experiences of Your Life.

We Believe that, like a diamond,
The Total Dining Experience has many facets:

We take care to provide only the best and freshest ingredients.
We prepare those ingredients at the highest levels of the Culinary Arts.
We strive to maintain an atmosphere of informal elegance worthy of the food that you are about to enjoy.

We also take measures to assure that the ambiance is not disrupted:
If you are accompanied by small children,
We expect you to exercise parental control over their behavior.
Simply in order to protect the rights--and The Dining Experience--of our other patrons.

If you won't "be the adult" here,
We will.

Thank you for your consideration.
(Suggested Tip: 20%)


Sign B:
We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone:
If you can't control your brats,
Don't bother coming through the door.
Seriously.

And don't expect to be "comped" with Free Happy Meal Coupons
if and when we graciously invite you to leave.

The Mgmt.

I'd like to see one of those "Most Interesting Man in the World" commercials in which his sales pitch gets interrupted by misbehaving tikes.

PQ: I just fell in love with you a little bit.

PQ: I just fell in love with you a little bit.

Thanks, Bandnerd - in all my years of being here, I don't remember a comment that I appreciated more.

Yep, kids will be kids. Especially the terrible 2's. It's 90% parents 10% kids fault.


Now that I am a parent and have 3 yrs of restaurant experience I believe parenting comes into play but not as much as you think...Kids are normally amped up to be out and some of them simply don't handle the social scene and being surrounded by strangers as well as others

Easy to blame it on parenting but trying to fully understand the mind of a 3 yr old is useless

I am sure there is some of that going on, even with the best efforts of the parents. But there are too many instances where the parents do nothing, are completely oblivious or actively encourage/reward (positive reinforcement) the inappropriate behavior.

I understand what you are saying about the last part. From what I have observed, the best way is to correct immediately, distract and under no circumstances try to reason with a child. Rather give them options, so they feel like they are in control/have input. This also works well with bosses (reach your own conclusions). LOL

It used to be smoking or non-smoking seating. It would be nice if places could separate dinners with kids and without, even if it just either side of a room. We normally eat in the bar to avoid this issue. What has surprised me is when we go to higher end places, especially fine dining, and we get seated by a little screamer. I am sure parents do not want their kids to sit and listen to the way some adults talk either.

Often smoking/non-smoking worked out to be kids/no kids (same with the eating in the bar suggestion). Course the downside to eating in the bar is the distinct possibility that you have inappropriate behavior (loud/obnoxious etc) from folks that have had a bit too much to drink. Why is it many drinkers think they have to talk louder? Does alcohol plug up their ears or something? I don't drink so I honestly don't know.

Often smoking/non-smoking worked out to be kids/no kids (same with the eating in the bar suggestion). Course the downside to eating in the bar is the distinct possibility that you have inappropriate behavior (loud/obnoxious etc) from folks that have had a bit too much to drink. Why is it many drinkers think they have to talk louder? Does alcohol plug up their ears or something? I don't drink so I honestly don't know.

They don't actively make that decision.

Now that I am a parent and have 3 yrs of restaurant experience I believe parenting comes into play but not as much as you think...Kids are normally amped up to be out and some of them simply don't handle the social scene and being surrounded by strangers as well as others

Easy to blame it on parenting but trying to fully understand the mind of a 3 yr old is useless

Do you loudly talk on your phone in church? It's kind of the same principle. Here, you're actually admitting that you know for a fact that your child is going to be loud. The question is whether you think it's okay to inflict that 3 year old on totally innocent bystanders in any given situation. Since you don't light up your cigarette at the hospital or chatter on your phone in church, why inflict your kids on innocent bystanders in inappropriate forums?

Thanks, Bandnerd - in all my years of being here, I don't remember a comment that I appreciated more.

Ha, never knew my opinion meant anything to anyone around here ;) I appreciate level-headed arguments, and you presented one with which I wholeheartedly agree. Had to share the love.

Don't fret children dining lovers...Already said I was one of the good guys...My two year old acts up one of us takes him out to the car immediately while the other nabs the to go boxes

Just commenting on all the back in my day kids acted great bs is all...Just don't notice it or really care until we get older is all

Don't fret children dining lovers...Already said I was one of the good guys...My two year old acts up one of us takes him out to the car immediately while the other nabs the to go boxes

Just commenting on all the back in my day kids acted great bs is all...Just don't notice it or really care until we get older is all

I was well aware of this when I was raising my kids and wouldn't have dreamed of behaving the way I see young parents do all the time, anymore. It is a lousy thing to teach a child that he is royalty and then the jokes on them when they find out they aren't.

I was well aware of this when I was raising my kids and wouldn't have dreamed of behaving the way I see young parents do all the time, anymore. It is a lousy thing to teach a child that he is royalty and then the jokes on them when they find out they aren't.


Exactly. Those parents aren't doing their kids any favors.