So, I have no problem with an occasional park-and-ride, as long as space for TOD is included.



I have no problem with a park and ride per se, so long as the park and ride garage is in downtown Norman. Parking could be $10 per day but if you get your parking ticket validated at another station then parking is free. This would keep people from using the free parking as their own personal parking space and ensure passengers have available parking.

People would still be free to live where ever they want, they just shouldn't expect a paved road to their front door.

Courtesy of our Subcommittee member, Jane Jenkins.


Milwaukee Streetcar Plan on Track for Passage
07/15/2011

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel
By Larry Sandler, Milwaukee Journal Sentinel

July 15

Milwaukee Common Council leaders Thursday endorsed building a $64.6 million modern streetcar line downtown, a move that brings the city closer than ever before to resolving a public transit debate that has raged for nearly 20 years. With Thursday's vote, a majority of aldermen have now declared their support for building the 2.1-mile line pushed by Mayor Tom Barrett, indicating it's likely to win council approval July 26 if all aldermen are present and none switch their votes.

The council's Steering & Rules Committee acted despite warnings by city Comptroller W. Martin "Wally" Morics, who urged aldermen to slow down the process, and despite two utilities' fears that the planned route would add tens of millions of dollars in costs and delay the project. In response, the panel called for the public works commissioner to consult with the council and comptroller to change the route or slice spending if necessary to cap costs at $64.6 million. Barrett hailed the vote as "a significant step" but added, "We know there remains a lot of work to be done" before the project is complete.

Modern streetcars resemble light rail vehicles. But, like old-fashioned streetcars, they typically run on rails laid in streets, draw power from overhead wires and operate in traffic. Milwaukee's streetcars would run every 10 minutes weekdays, and every 15 minutes in late-night, early-morning and weekend hours, from the lower east side to the downtown Amtrak-Greyhound station, starting in 2014.

The streetcar project would be financed by $54.9 million in long-idle federal transit aid and $9.7 million from a tax-incremental financing district set up for the Cathedral Place mixed-use development. City officials plan to seek federal aid to extend the line to E. Brady St. and to the Pabst Brewery redevelopment, boosting the total project cost to $104.8 million.

Running the streetcars would cost $2.65 million a year under the current plan, rising to $4.89 million if the extensions are added. Barrett wants to pay those costs with fares, parking fees and advertising and sponsorship revenue, a plan that would require separate council approval. Annual ridership is projected at 588,880 by 2015 with the basic route or 1.2 million with the extensions.

With the extensions, the project would create 625 construction jobs and 455 jobs at suppliers, plus 35 operating jobs. Milwaukee Composites President Jeff Kober drew applause by promising to donate the streetcar floors his company could produce.
Barrett first proposed the streetcar line in 2007. Last year, a study committee voted to advance the project into preliminary engineering. Design is now 30% complete.

At Thursday's meeting, more than 30 people joined Barrett in urging the committee to support the streetcar line. The advocates, many representing businesses and community organizations, focused on the line's potential to create jobs and spur economic development.

"This is about development," Barrett told aldermen. "This is about growing our tax base."

Rocky Marcoux, commissioner of city development, called the streetcar line "a city-building tool" that would give developers the confidence to invest in buildings along the route. Consultant Wallace White, a former sewerage district chief and onetime streetcar operator, said streetcars are "pedestrian accelerators" that bring more customers past storefront windows and ultimately drive retail business.
The route would come within a quarter-mile of every downtown hotel room, about 90% of occupied downtown office and retail space and 77% of downtown housing and parking lots.

Within 20 years, Marcoux projected $3.35 billion in potential development within walking distance of the streetcar line. Within three years, he said, new development could boost the city's tax base by $2.5 million.

Ald. Joe Davis Sr. questioned whether those numbers were valid in the face of the lingering economic downturn. Project manager Mark Kaminski said the figures were developed in 2010.

In a letter to the committee, Morics, the city's independently elected fiscal watchdog, said officials still lacked information to commit that much money to this project.
He said aldermen must decide the wisdom of the plan, but added, "In our judgment, releasing nearly $10 million now at an early point in the design process with major issues of capital cost and operational feasibility yet to be resolved would be premature."
Instead, Morics recommended the council go no further than to approve the concept and authorize enough money for additional design and planning. Once more information is available on building and running the streetcar, the mayor and council could decide whether to release the rest of the money, Morics wrote.

In a separate letter, AT&T Wisconsin President Scott VanderSanden urged the council to move the streetcar route away from his company's telecommunications hub on Broadway, warning that relocating underground lines could take two years and cost $10 million. Similarly, We Energies estimates relocating its steam, electric and gas lines could cost $40 million, City Engineer Jeff Polenske said.

Public Works Commissioner Ghassan Korban said those costs would be borne by the utilities, not the city, and that such issues are commonly resolved in road reconstruction projects. Korban, Barrett and Polenske said city officials would work through the final engineering phase to minimize those costs -- and, as a last resort, could even change the route if those issues couldn't be worked out any other way.
Still, Ald. Michael Murphy, a potential candidate for Morics' job, said he was troubled that aldermen weren't told earlier of the potential utility costs. Ald. Jim Bohl echoed the concerns voiced by Morics and Murphy.

Council President Willie Hines Jr. and Aldermen Bob Bauman, Ashanti Hamilton, Jim Witkowiak and Davis voted to approve the project, with Murphy and Bohl opposed. Murphy said he might propose more fiscal safeguards on the council floor.
Aldermen Nik Kovac, Willie Wade and Terry Witkowski are co-sponsors of the streetcar measure, with Bauman, Hamilton and Witkowiak, meaning streetcar supporters have at least an eight-vote majority on the 15-member council.

Panel members approved the tax-incremental financing plan on a separate 5-1 vote, with Bohl joining Hines, Bauman, Hamilton and Witkowiak in support, Murphy opposed and Davis absent.

The $54.6 million in federal aid that would be used for the streetcar was originally part of $289 million appropriated for a Milwaukee-area transit project in late 1991. Since then, Congress has taken back $48 million and state and local officials have agreed to use $149.5 million for other transportation projects, while rejecting plans for a bus-only highway, a light rail system, bus and car-pool lanes on I-94, a guided electric bus system and an express bus network.

Barrett and Gov. Scott Walker, then Milwaukee County executive, deadlocked on the final $91.5 million, with Walker seeking all of it for buses and Barrett pushing to use part of it for streetcars. In 2009, with his fellow Democrats in control of Congress, Barrett pushed through legislation that gave $54.9 million to the city for the streetcar line and $36.6 million to the county for buses.

The city's share cannot be spent on anything other than a streetcar system, Federal Transit Administration chief Peter Rogoff said in a letter to Bauman.

http://www.themilwaukeestreetcar.com/index.php

I find it interesting that they are pleased that their proposed system is within 1/4 mile of most areas that could utilize their street car system. Many of our detractors are worried about having to travel more than two blocks to get to our system. They are also very happy about a route that will be much shorter than our initial system.

I find it interesting that they are pleased that their proposed system is within 1/4 mile of most areas that could utilize their street car system. Many of our detractors are worried about having to travel more than two blocks to get to our system. They are also very happy about a route that will be much shorter than our initial system.

Milwaukee has one thing OKC doesn't have - a route. The Milwaukee route was planned mostly behind the scenes and after they got a route they sold it to the public. OKC did it the other way around, which is why there is so much more debate in OKC. The people of OKC said we want a streetcar, but no route had been planned. Cincinnati did the same thing - created the route then tried to sell it. That is why you can see a map of both streetcar routes (Milwaukee and Cincinnati) years before there is any funding available, meanwhile, OKC has funding available but no route yet. The OKC situation is ripe for debate.

Milwaukee has one thing OKC doesn't have - a route. The Milwaukee route was planned mostly behind the scenes and after they got a route they sold it to the public. OKC did it the other way around, which is why there is so much more debate in OKC. The people of OKC said we want a streetcar, but no route had been planned. Cincinnati did the same thing - created the route then tried to sell it. That is why you can see a map of both streetcar routes (Milwaukee and Cincinnati) years before there is any funding available, meanwhile, OKC has funding available but no route yet. The OKC situation is ripe for debate.

okc has a route ..

okc has a route ..

It has half a route and it came after the vote for funding took place.

Barring engineering issues, we have a route, give or take a block at the ends. There is no route that will please everyone, especially if they're members of this forum.

Barring engineering issues, we have a route, give or take a block at the ends. There is no route that will please everyone, especially if they're members of this forum.

That is what I am saying. If there was a final route selected BEFORE the MAPS III vote there would be nothing to debate except when constuction starts. Milwaukee and Cincinnati both had final routes selected before they took their sales pitch to the people. By the time the public was informed that only thing left to talk about was how to fund it. In OKC the public was ahead of the curve fromt the get-go.

However, things in Cincinnati might not be as smooth as hoped. They had an intial route planned but when they lost $58 million in state funding they had to shorten the route to match available funding. Not everyone is happy about the modified route, including the NAACP who now wants to kill the whole thing.

One mistake that Okc is making is that they are making street car routes in areas that are already developed...therefore no new development will spur from the street car, you need to put street routes around areas that promote new construction

The best thing they could do is put a street car route around new central park, and near the river...

No one will ride it down by the river initially. There are many areas to still develop in the core, as much as many from the suburbs (not saying you are G. Walker) would not understand, it still needs to densify.

G Walker, The route should go past areas that are developed. That is where the riders are. The good thing about downtown is that we have lumps of areas that are not developed or underdeveloped. Automobile Alley has a lot of potential for development as well as the areas the route is going. I don't see a street in Midtown or downtown that could not be developed more.

Taking it by the river and around Central Park is a waste for now. Maybe in 10 or 15 years it will be feasible.

G Walker, The route should go past areas that are developed. That is where the riders are. The good thing about downtown is that we have lumps of areas that are not developed or underdeveloped. Automobile Alley has a lot of potential for development as well as the areas the route is going. I don't see a street in Midtown or downtown that could not be developed more.

Taking it by the river and around Central Park is a waste for now. Maybe in 10 or 15 years it will be feasible.

My point exactly, because the street car will not be operational for another ten years anyway, why not plan ahead instead of waiting until MAPS 5.

The route planned so far goes by plenty of vacant lots. I just wish we could get it into Deep Deuce in the first phase. There will soon be up to 2,000 people living in that area with potential for a lot more.

My point exactly, because the street car will not be operational for another ten years anyway, why not plan ahead instead of waiting until MAPS 5.

Perhaps you've missed a couple of posts here. The streetcar will be operational in five to six years. Phase two will not be completed for ten years. As has been said, you have to weigh economic development with need. If people don't ride the streetcar because it's going to areas that aren't developed at all, economic development won't occur there. There has to be a balance. The streetcar has to go to places of interest, places people work or live and ideally, go through areas that aren't completely developed. If you've got time (but watch out for sunstroke!) walk down Broadway from 13th to about fourth. Look west and see what exists on the cross streets between Broadway and Robinson. Then walk back up Robinson to 13th St. I think you'll see plenty of opportunities for economic development. The couplet system will make the east-west streets between Broadway and Robinson much more frequently accessed by people downtown and I think it won't be long before there's interest in buildings or land on them.

That is what I am saying. If there was a final route selected BEFORE the MAPS III vote there would be nothing to debate except when constuction starts.

You have to be kidding. You actually think that would have prevented any criticism or debate on this forum? LOL
Nothing stops it.

Add Kansas City to the growing list of Cities with future Streetcar.


Streetcars could be running in downtown KC by 2015
By BRAD COOPER
The Kansas City Star

After years of fruitlessly fighting for sprawling light-rail plans, Kansas City is moving swiftly to build a smaller rail line linking Union Station to the River Market area.

The project is gaining momentum as two possible routes — one on Main Street and the other on Grand Boulevard — have emerged as favorites.

City officials would like to pick a route next month with an eye toward possibly starting rail service in 2015

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/08/21/3090249/streetcars-could-be-running-downtown.html#.TlO0S7x15KA.twitter#ixzz1VsLfksJp




Also, why have we not seen a Modern Streetcar available for display somewhere in downtown Okc?

I've seen where other cities that are promoting a future streetcar are able to bring an actual modern streetcar and place it somewhere for the public to view it inside and out. It would seem to me that something like this would really jump start a promotion for educating the Okc citizens about the benefits of the modern streetcar.

Add Kansas City to the growing list of Cities with future Streetcar.




Also, why have we not seen a Modern Streetcar available for display somewhere in downtown Okc?

I've seen where other cities that are promoting a future streetcar are able to bring an actual modern streetcar and place it somewhere for the public to view it inside and out. It would seem to me that something like this would really jump start a promotion for educating the Okc citizens about the benefits of the modern streetcar.

one of the reasons that cities do that is so they can gain support before the public vote to fund the building of the system ... we don't have that problem

Skyline - there is no reason for a demo streetcar in OKC - the funding has already been approved. OKC did it different than most cities. Usually cities put the entire plan together behind closed doors and then present a final vision to voters who either approve or reject the plan. OKC got the funding first and now they are trying to develop the plan. There have been some recent articles in Jax lately trying to build support for a downtown streetcar here. The problem is trying to find enough people who live 20 miles from downtown to help fund it.

Add Kansas City to the growing list of Cities with future Streetcar.




Also, why have we not seen a Modern Streetcar available for display somewhere in downtown Okc?

I've seen where other cities that are promoting a future streetcar are able to bring an actual modern streetcar and place it somewhere for the public to view it inside and out. It would seem to me that something like this would really jump start a promotion for educating the Okc citizens about the benefits of the modern streetcar.

We actually were offered that opportunity and turned it down Skyline. It wasn't made public as we made the internal decision in an effort to avoid having such an event misconstrued as favoritism towards one company or another. Since the funding is there, we are about to go into procurement. Therefore, we are particularly sensitive with the process in an effort to get the best possible competitive results.

That doesn't mean that committee members aren't reaching out trying to gather up information about what types of system vehicles/technologies are available, but it does mean that any public events will probably be limited to elements that would avoid any sense of conflict.

Thanks for answering the question.

I find that article very interesting in many ways.

Such as;
An estimated 16 U.S. cities operate streetcar lines, some that are modern and others of the vintage variety that have an early 20th century appeal.

Sixty others were planning streetcar routes as of 2010, according to the Community Streetcar Coalition, a group of cities and transit agencies that advocate federal funding of streetcars.



Also this;
For about 20 years, Kansas City has spent millions of dollars trying to develop light-rail plans that covered many miles and reached into different areas of the city.

This time, the city is focusing on a 2-mile route centered in downtown. It could eventually connect into a broader rail network — now under study — intended to connect downtown to the Missouri-side suburbs.

San Antonio moves ahead with funding-


City Council approves rail plan

Posted: 10/21/2011

The City Council has approved a streetcar plan that will introduce a new mode of travel in downtown San Antonio.

In a 9 to 1 vote, Council members agreed to contribute $40 million to VIA Metropolitan Transit’s streetcar plans with an additional $15 million in funding coming from private entities through the development of a special assessment district along the alignment. This contribution is in addition to the $55 million already pledged by Bexar County and the $70 million that will be provided by VIA.

The streetcar system is part of the initial projects to be carried out in the first five years of the Long Range Comprehensive Transportation Plan. The alignment approved by City Council will serve the Pearl Brewery and will travel down Broadway to turn east at Hemisfair Park, ending up at the Robert Thompson Transit Station at the Alamodome.

Also, an article about the county chipping in this November-

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/Officials-celebrate-funding-for-streetcar-lines-2262363.php

Good. San Antonio is a wonderful city and a streetcar will make it that more wonderful.

Interesting that they had two route proposal from two different groups and neither went with a couplet system. It should provide for good comparisons later.

Good. San Antonio is a wonderful city and a streetcar will make it that more wonderful.

I agree, and maybe in the future we'll need a like system, but right now we don't have the population to support it.

I agree, and maybe in the future we'll need a like system, but right now we don't have the population to support it.

Are you saying we should wait? I mean it will be at least 5 years before the public will be able to ride anything. I would hope that downtown's continued densification would mesh with the streetcar timing of becoming operational. Certainly, the professional projections are around 1,200 riders per day in the first opening months.

I'm not saying that I don't have concerns. But that is exactly why so many of use have pressed for it to traverse the most densest part of downtown rather than chasing "empty lots" as many have proposed.

Don't worry UP, rcjunkie is just a public transit hater.

I agree, and maybe in the future we'll need a like system, but right now we don't have the population to support it.

That is the beauty of transportation systems; growth occurs around them. The only question becomes, what kind of growth do you want? Automobile based growth requires vast amounts of land and infrastrucutre while rail based growth is compact and requires limited infrastructure. Seeing as how most taxpayers are close to being tapped out I say we switch to compact and limited.

Don't worry UP, rcjunkie is just a public transit hater.

Soonerguru, you couldn't be more inaccurate on this one, I'm not a hater, but when we are nowhere near the required population to support said system, just not practical to build one.

FYI, a long time close friend (35 years), works for COTPA in management, he told me the other day the the average ridership on City Routes in the current system is 13 people. If that's what you call financially responsible, then my 3rd grade math teacher was wrong.

Does your friend give a reason for the low ridership?

I agree, and maybe in the future we'll need a like system, but right now we don't have the population to support it.

IF you build it they will come!

Soonerguru, you couldn't be more inaccurate on this one, I'm not a hater, but when we are nowhere near the required population to support said system, just not practical to build one.

FYI, a long time close friend (35 years), works for COTPA in management, he told me the other day the the average ridership on City Routes in the current system is 13 people. If that's what you call financially responsible, then my 3rd grade math teacher was wrong.

Does that imply that transit in and of itself is wrong? No. It might mean that the current route system, route timing, etc. is not working and needs adjusting.

Does your friend give a reason for the low ridership?

Could be that , American's love cars.

Maybe they do love cars. Then again, it might be because many people don't have a viable alternative so they are stuck with a car whether they love it or not.

Maybe they do love cars. Then again, it might be because many people don't have a viable alternative so they are stuck with a car whether they love it or not.

Did you just pretty much answer your own question? LOL

Did you just pretty much answer your own question? LOL

I knew the answer before I asked the question. I was wondering if COTPA knew the answer, and if they did, did they share it with rcjunkie.

Maybe they do love cars. Then again, it might be because many people don't have a viable alternative so they are stuck with a car whether they love it or not.

I love mine! I just wish that I could find a decent place to park it along the canal while visiting Bricktown. LOL

Have you ever lived anywhere that you didn't need a car?

Have you ever lived anywhere that you didn't need a car?

No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn. haha

Why would I live somewhere without a car?

I like cars, and I like to drive and park wherever I please.

Streetcars are fun, just like mopeds are fun too. The tourists will enjoy the experience.

No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn. haha

Why would I live somewhere without a car?

I like cars, and I like to drive and park wherever I please.

Streetcars are fun, just like mopeds are fun too. The tourists will enjoy the experience.

The only reason I ask is how do you know you love your car if you never had an opportunity to live without it?

I like cars, and I like to drive and park wherever I please.



That's kinda the problem. Without a better transit plan, you're not going to be able to drive and park wherever you please.

The streetcars should be designed around the needs of the area's residents, not its visitors. If it's only attractive to tourists, it's not going to be very successful.

That's why it won't be specifically for tourists. They are a major ridership category, but not the precedent that the route is conceived around. The Memorial will be directly served, and it has a high tourist count. But the system route conception today is around mixed use.

For some reason Cincinnati Streetcar won a Tiger III grant for $10.9 million. The project has been surrounded by state officials, including the governor, actively trying to kill it. It relies on pretty shaky local/state funding sources. More info: http://streetsblog.net/2011/12/14/the-cincinnati-streetcar-triumphing-over-an-anti-transit-governor/

On the other hand, OKC has a huge, secure matching funds stockpile which will allow our project to be built in cash, and plenty of local support. I think we could submit a much more competitive grant application than Cincinnati's.

For some reason Cincinnati Streetcar won a Tiger III grant for $10.9 million. The project has been surrounded by state officials, including the governor, actively trying to kill it. It relies on pretty shaky local/state funding sources. More info: http://streetsblog.net/2011/12/14/the-cincinnati-streetcar-triumphing-over-an-anti-transit-governor/

On the other hand, OKC has a huge, secure matching funds stockpile which will allow our project to be built in cash, and plenty of local support. I think we could submit a much more competitive grant application than Cincinnati's.

we are applying for a small starts grant ... 80 mil so then in the future we might apply for or grants with the street car money ..

we did apply for a TIGER III grant for the hub

CINCINNATI RECEIVES TIGER 3 FUNDING FROM THE FTA

Applicant/Sponsor: City of Cincinnati

Total project cost: $156,290,000

Grant Funding: $10,920,000

This project will design and construct the Riverfront Loop, supplementing the Downtown Circulator route of the Cincinnati Streetcar. The extension will directly connect the Downtown circulator route already in design with the Cincinnati riverfront to the south.

Project Highlights

»»Restores connection to the Riverfront loop

»»Connects downtown with the $600 million Banks Mixed-Use development and 45-acre Central Riverfront Park

»»Supports the Downtown project linking employment centers with disadvantaged neighborhood

This modern streetcar system has the potential to revitalize Cincinnati’s urban core—a city served by six Fortune 500 companies, academic, medical and research institutions, with a widely dispersed employment base of over 70,000 people. By providing a public transit alternative, the city will use the investment to re-orient its development patterns into a more walkable, livable, and affordable community with a mix of land uses, housing units, and income groups. Much of the surrounding land use is underutilized vacant lots used as parking, which the city is working to redevelop using Tax Increment Finance Districts.

Are these TIGER III grants operated under the same philsophy as people who oppose payments to Continental Resources - as in - OKC is already building a streetcar so why should the federal government funded it.

After finding out how much it cost to fix the turnstiles on the Skyway here in Jacksonville, JTA decided to make riding the system free. The repairs and maintenance cost more than the revenue generated. Starting on Feb 1 all rides will be free (used to be 50 cents per ride). After 90 days they are going to review the system and if ridership increases they are going to keep it free.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/JTA-to-make-Skyway-transit-free/-/475880/8381976/-/a7bwga/-/


JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - For months, the Jacksonville Transportation Authority has said it's working hard to fix broken gates and other malfunctioning equipment at Skyway terminals.

But as Channel 4 investigators have recently learned, rather than fixing the problems that would force riders to pay up, JTA will offer free rides.

...

At the end of this month, the turnstiles and gates will no longer be needed. That's when the Skyway will be going fare free for 90 days as a test to see how many people will ride it for free. It's also a result of Channel 4 showing people who just squeezed by the turnstiles, avoiding fares all together.

...

There is also concern that making the Skyway free will lead to transients using it as a way to get out of the weather. JTA says it is making plans for that.

"You will see an increase in security on the Skyway as we move into these 90 days," Eller said.

Federal officials have given the green light for the Milwaukee Streetcar project to move forward, a city official said Monday...

http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/streetcar-project-gets-federal-backing-go40g8r-138346289.html

That article mentions $1 fares. Has there been any mention of how that might compare to potential fares for our system? I'm sure they will also have some kind of pass system but a $1 fare seems a little high to me.

There has been discussion that the OKC streetcar may very well be free. We have not reached there yet however.

Tucson broke ground on their 3.9 mile streetcar project costing $196 million, $78 million of that is due to Federal Funding and grants.
http://www.tucsonstreetcar.com/index.htm


http://fastlane.dot.gov/2012/04/tucson-streetcar.html
Tucson breaks ground on Sun Link streetcar
because transportation is good business

...sure they will also have some kind of pass system but a $1 fare seems a little high to me.

cheaper than the DT spokies though.
8^)

Tucson should have gotten rid of all their one-way streets downtown while they were at it.

Kansas City is launching a campaign for a modern streetcar downtown. https://www.facebook.com/streetcarneighbors

I was just there and let me tell you, that movement is not only passionate, they are really, really leveraging the tech and entrepreneur community. It looks awesome!

I'm curious to see if it goes through. They had a big light rail initiative when I lived there, but it died on the ballot.

Kansas City is launching a campaign for a modern streetcar downtown. https://www.facebook.com/streetcarneighbors

I was just there and let me tell you, that movement is not only passionate, they are really, really leveraging the tech and entrepreneur community. It looks awesome!

I think this might be their break-through, but I'm also curious why their route is about double the per-mile expense as ours. KC has a very dubious and depressing history of streetcar attempts in the last 20 years. I think there is an actual organized opposition to streetcars in KC, which we're pretty lucky to not have I think..

After finding out how much it cost to fix the turnstiles on the Skyway here in Jacksonville, JTA decided to make riding the system free. The repairs and maintenance cost more than the revenue generated. Starting on Feb 1 all rides will be free (used to be 50 cents per ride). After 90 days they are going to review the system and if ridership increases they are going to keep it free.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/JTA-to-make-Skyway-transit-free/-/475880/8381976/-/a7bwga/-/

Its free in Portland for most of the downtown area!

..., but I'm also curious why their route is about double the per-mile expense as ours. ...

The line will travel 2.2 miles from one end to the other and is estimated to cost $101 million, there renderings show double tracks making it about 4.4 miles the way we calculate ours, so it is closer to a 15% premium to ours. There seems like a lot of other ways the remaining difference could be used up quickly: part of that route is currently one way only so will need rework the street's traffic signals and possibly one/two parallel to it, the cost for land/building of a maintenance building may be higher, they may have some known conflicts underground that need dealt with, labor costs may be slightly higher there and/or they may want higher frequency necessitating more streetcars.

Cincinnati debuts their shelter design. Something that we will be thinking about seriously, very shortly.

http://cincinnati-oh.gov/noncms/projects/streetcar/docs/news_shelter.cfm

Cincinnati debuts their shelter design. Something that we will be thinking about seriously, very shortly.

http://cincinnati-oh.gov/noncms/projects/streetcar/docs/news_shelter.cfm

I don't like that. I think there will be an immediate incorrect perception that public transit is for the homeless, and traditional transit shelters do attract those elements. We may especially want to consider some innovative ways to mask the traditional shelter appearance.

I think Toronto offers good examples of ways to blend streetcar shelters into the surrounding urban environment:
http://www.toronto.ca/wes/techservices/involved/transportation/st-clair_construction/plaque/images/shelter_streetcar.jpg

Just to be fair (and play devil's advocate against myself), these shelters will have to cover people from all kinds of potentially brutal weather conditions. We may way wind cover, shade, rain cover, etc. Shade could possibly be provided instead with trees over the shelters.

I agree about the trees. The best stop design that I have seen thus far that is glass is the DC Metro Bus Shelters. I did a quick search but didn't find a pic of what I had actually seen while up there this year. But the take away is that it is mostly translucent and has glass sides. The realty is, we really need to take into account Oklahoma's severed weather as best we can- IE the wind, horizontal rain as well as the heat.

Also, this stop needs to include an advertising mechanism, route maps, and on on-time displays. I'd say a good music system ought to be considered as well.