Rover,

Surely you're financially savvy enough to understand what an endowment is? (Hargreaves is telling us we can fund $6 million in annual operations with income from parking, basically)

Well, it has been a few years since I earned my Economics and Finance degree, but I remember I have heard the term.

Not sure what you are trying to say here. The Tulsa budget for PHASE ONE is apparently $300 million and part of that is apparently a part of the private endowments that is restricted for maintenance. So, take it out. The endowment will not be $170 million of the $300. Their budget is much greater than ours, no matter how you look at it. I believe our phase one is $88 Million vs. their $300 Million. I would hope theirs would be superior.

As for how OKC pays for programming and maintenance, was that up to Hargreaves and part of what you consider their incompetence? Perhaps, part of their responsibility, either said or implied, was to design for lower operating costs.

As for how OKC pays for programming and maintenance, was that up to Hargreaves and part of what you consider their incompetence? Perhaps, part of their responsibility, either said or implied, was to design for lower operating costs.




This is a very good point. The last few days I've been thinking about this issue, and yes, a boring park is boirng. But yes, a boring park is cheaper to maintain than a fancy park. Since we don't have any money to maintain this park, boring is better than broken. The last thing we need is Myriad Garden AND the Central Park visibly decaying nerxt to another.

Well, it has been a few years since I earned my Economics and Finance degree, but I remember I have heard the term.

Not sure what you are trying to say here. The Tulsa budget for PHASE ONE is apparently $300 million and part of that is apparently a part of the private endowments that is restricted for maintenance. So, take it out. The endowment will not be $170 million of the $300. Their budget is much greater than ours, no matter how you look at it. I believe our phase one is $88 Million vs. their $300 Million. I would hope theirs would be superior.

As for how OKC pays for programming and maintenance, was that up to Hargreaves and part of what you consider their incompetence? Perhaps, part of their responsibility, either said or implied, was to design for lower operating costs.

I see you throwing around a lot of figures. Steve Lackmeyer, maybe you've heard of him he writes for the paper, reports here at this link that there will be $125-150 in public funds dedicated to this park. I don't know about phases, I don't know how much the private sector was inspired to kick in (our private sector has not been so moved by the Hargreaves designs). But that's what I am going off of which seems to indicate these are comparable projects:

Who is Excited About the Future Core to Shore Park? | News OK (http://newsok.com/who-is-excited-about-the-future-core-to-shore-park/article/3924209)

As for the financial sustainability of long-term park maintenance with both of these parks, I would vehemently argue that the best way to ensure our capacity for maintaining what we build is to not just replicate the Myriad Gardens two blocks over. We all know that the Myriad Gardens redesign threw a kink into this project when it was essentially remolded into a fabulous Central Park. This MAPS3 park was envisioned back when the Myriad Gardens was looking pretty scraggly, and perhaps that's a conversation we should've had about the MBG redesign when P180 funds were being allocated - but those funds were spent and MBG is what it is. The MAPS3 Park Subcommittee has failed to react and respond accordingly in stunning fashion.

The figures are from the budget posted at the top of this page...$132 Mil total with $88 Mil on phase one. Previous poster gave the numbers for Tulsa...$300 Million for phase one.

Steve who?

Why are you being so snarky with me? In fact, I have been agreeing with you as to the bland quality of the design and the lack of proper vision and controls on this project. You seem to attack me on here even when I agree with you. LOL.

When did you refer to the bland nature of the park and a lack of proper vision and controls?

Story on KRMG that refers to "the $100 million park."

$100 million Tulsa park to be unveiled | www.krmg.com (http://www.krmg.com/news/news/local/100-million-tulsa-park-be-unveiled/nYNnn/)

Has great narrative descriptions of each of the park's design features.

Story on KRMG that refers to "the $100 million park."

$100 million Tulsa park to be unveiled | www.krmg.com (http://www.krmg.com/news/news/local/100-million-tulsa-park-be-unveiled/nYNnn/)

Has great narrative descriptions of each of the park's design features.

Chapman Foundations pledge $10 million to Gathering Place - Tulsa World: Local (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/chapman-foundations-pledge-million-to-gathering-place/article_747be6d6-9f21-54f0-a74a-f65f195a0609.html)



The first phase of the Gathering Place, which is being funded by the Kaiser Foundation and other private donors, will be constructed from 24th to 31st streets on the east side of Riverside Drive, and from 24th Street to 33rd Place along the west side.
Construction is to begin in mid-2014 and be completed in late 2016 or mid-2017.
Phase I of the park is estimated to cost $300 million, including $50 million to purchase the land. The Kaiser Foundation bought the acreage and has committed another $150 million toward construction of the park.
Approximately $35 million in public funds will be invested in infrastructure related to the project.
The foundation is raising $125 million to $150 million in private funds to help complete construction of Phase 1 and provide seed money for an operating, maintenance and programming endowment.

So exactly what other phases are there?

So exactly what other phases are there?


Well, they aren't exactly published yet. I am telling you what I heard when I attended a presentation by the head of the Kaiser Foundation. It's not a secret, but it's also not public knowledge yet. Phase II will be an expansion to the south on the site of one of the apartment complexes with a cool way to bridge across 31st St with a new facility for the Tulsa Children's Museum. Remember how I said part of Riverside Dr will be buried?

Phase III is still not fully planned but likely will take the development up Joe Creek to join the park with Brookside.

When Steve L. said that there is "little interest" in The Central Park / C2S, ...I totally disagree. This park will be / should be the most iconic project we have to date. When it is completed, it will set the pace for all the developments that follow.

I want The Central Park to be so impressive, everyone that passes through on I-40 "must stop" to see what an amazing park that is a Must See! From the air, it will be the defining feature we will come to know, just as Central Park in NYC has that iconic look of Manhattan.

Steve L, we are out here ready for our park, just waiting patiently for our moment.

Swake - I think we're confusing the issue here. Nobody is saying for $135M we should have a park, bury Robinson and Hudson, and add a children's museum facility. Those future phases are amazing and it looks like the Gathering Place may finally be the transformational project that galvanizes Tulsa to invest in itself. In OKC we just want a park that goes a little beyond the McPark designed for us here by Hargreaves, so I think we really are just looking at Phase 1 as a comp.


When Steve L. said that there is "little interest" in The Central Park / C2S, ...I totally disagree. This park will be / should be the most iconic project we have to date. When it is completed, it will set the pace for all the developments that follow.

I want The Central Park to be so impressive, everyone that passes through on I-40 "must stop" to see what an amazing park that is a Must See! From the air, it will be the defining feature we will come to know, just as Central Park in NYC has that iconic look of Manhattan.

Steve L, we are out here ready for our park, just waiting patiently for our moment.

Gauging little interest in this park doesn't mean we don't need it. Lets just say there isn't an army if interested parties with a lot of hopes riding on this park like there are for other projects. The streetcar has a massive following mainly bc that was very grassroots and they use social media very well. This park doesn't really have that despite being one of the few (the only?) project with a public sign where commuters drive past. I think thats because we ASSUMED it would be done right. Unfortunately nothing indicates that is the case. More people should take interest in this park.

The Salvation Army is seeking to extend their lease until at least the end of August, as their new facility at 10th & Penn is still just a series of foundations. They also want the option to stay after that, as it's very doubtful the new place will be able for move-in before the end of the year.

Shouldn't be a problem with the park's schedule, which isn't set to start construction of Phase I until 2015:

http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/5496d1387379903-central-park-central3.jpg

Why are we putting this project into (3) seperate phases? ...it looks as if the design phasing is pushing this back for an extra 3 years! There is no need for that. We (OKC Mayor Office, this is you Mr. Cornett) need to place Hargreaves on a (single task) w/ Full Design. ????

It should not take ANY design firm (3 years ) to design a park? ...no. This project is holding up the $ Billiions for the private development groups in C2S and others. This is looking like an "okie" approach. This should be completed ( no later than ) 2017.

OKVision4U never disappoints.

OKVision4U never disappoints.

...and most get "Herded" like sheep and never look up. This is how we end up with the OKIE way of doing things.

So, how long should it take Catcher? ...what your thoughts on the process / timing of this project? hhmm? any?

MAPS is a pay as you go project and I love that we've made all of these improvements to OKC without debt. There will always be a debate on what project should be funded first, but one thing is sure - they can't all be first. While it would be nice to not have to do this in stages, I understand the reasons why it must and I've gotten past the instant gratification stage of my life and have enough patience to understand sometimes it's wiser to delay certain things.

I, for one, am glad they haven't started on this yet. It is not what most citizens want as a park and their stretched out timeline gives people a chance to contact anyone they can to get a better design.

OKVision4U never disappoints.

Where's the like button? :) ::LIKE::

MAPS is a pay as you go project and I love that we've made all of these improvements to OKC without debt. There will always be a debate on what project should be funded first, but one thing is sure - they can't all be first. While it would be nice to not have to do this in stages, I understand the reasons why it must and I've gotten past the instant gratification stage of my life and have enough patience to understand sometimes it's wiser to delay certain things.

catcher, it looks like you agree that it would be BEST to not stage this project. Many of you may not understand or may not have ever participated in a large project / initiative(s), but there is one thing that is a certainty, ...The longer the life of the project, the more challenges / issues appear. ( ie, Snake Bit ). It is the nature of large initiatives, it happens.

It is not about a "personal statement" in your life ( "i've gotten past the instant gratification stage of your life" ), it is about Funding / Design / Implementation / Finish.

MAPS is a pay as you go project and I love that we've made all of these improvements to OKC without debt. There will always be a debate on what project should be funded first, but one thing is sure - they can't all be first. While it would be nice to not have to do this in stages, I understand the reasons why it must and I've gotten past the instant gratification stage of my life and have enough patience to understand sometimes it's wiser to delay certain things.

Delay the Park? Why? ...so we can have the "perfect" park? ....that means when everyone is pleased.

In the history of public projects, there has NEVER been a project where EVERYONE is pleased. The reason why MAPS was so successful on the first initiative, was because we did not slow things down. If we wanted to have have things slowed down & go through the standard channels, then we have no need for MAPS.

Regardless of the design of the park, there will be a large group that won't be happy. So, why do we want to slow this down? ....let's move this through and get this Economic Momentum going.

I apologize to the small fraction of this board that hasn't "ignored" OKV4U for allowing myself to engage in a debate with him. He completely missed the points I tried to make as I've seen him do numerous times before. I should've known better. Once again, I apologize. It won't happen again.

OKVision4U never disappoints.

...and that's correct. I'm not concerned w/ that small fraction here, that is still looking for "acceptance / approval of others" before having their own personal opinion on a MAPS project that has been already (voted & passed) by a LARGE majority that want to see this project moving forward. Not getting hi-jacked by a few and want to "wait & see".

Yes, I'm committed to the large silent majority that never post.

I'm committed to the large silent majority that never post.

I find it hard to believe that there are some on here who don't post opinions.

I find it hard to believe that there are some on here who don't post opinions.

They try but they are all in the ridiculously long lines at Braums.

They try but they are all in the ridiculously long lines at Braums.

...they tried to leave, but their shoes are stuck to the sticky floors. ...they tried to leave, but the cashier is having trouble making change w/ a $5.00 bil on a $4.75 order.

Why are we putting this project into (3) seperate phases? ...it looks as if the design phasing is pushing this back for an extra 3 years! There is no need for that. We (OKC Mayor Office, this is you Mr. Cornett) need to place Hargreaves on a (single task) w/ Full Design. ????

It should not take ANY design firm (3 years ) to design a park? ...no. This project is holding up the $ Billiions for the private development groups in C2S and others. This is looking like an "okie" approach. This should be completed ( no later than ) 2017.

Why would we want to hold up $Billions in private development in the C2S, by allowing this delay?

Remember that MAPS projects can't be started until there is money in the bank to pay for the work in cash. So by dividing it into phases you can actually get started earlier than if you had to wait for all the money to be collected. The park was supposed to start earlier but has been delayed because of the delay in the final plan for the boulevard. And I don't know how you could kick a noble organization like the Salvation Army out of their home. The SA's new home was delayed, I believe, because a lot of the money was supposed to come from Chesapeake and when they kicked Aubrey out things changed. Phase III I believe is the park south of I-40.

Remember that MAPS projects can't be started until there is money in the bank to pay for the work in cash. So by dividing it into phases you can actually get started earlier than if you had to wait for all the money to be collected. The park was supposed to start earlier but has been delayed because of the delay in the final plan for the boulevard. And I don't know how you could kick a noble organization like the Salvation Army out of their home. The SA's new home was delayed, I believe, because a lot of the money was supposed to come from Chesapeake and when they kicked Aubrey out things changed. Phase III I believe is the park south of I-40.

What was the original schedule? The final completion date is the same I believe, but the phases are closer together now.

So are we going to do this?


10:22 http://www.coveritlive.com/templates/coveritlive/images/spacer.gif [Comment From TerryTerry: ]
What have you heard from the City in regards to the Central Park design? Have they been hearing enough criticism to cause them to demand a better design from Hargreaves?


Friday March 14, 2014 10:22 Terry 10:23 http://www.coveritlive.com/templates/coveritlive/images/spacer.gif Steve Lackmeyer:
Hargreaves is going to do what Hargreaves is going to do unless enough people contact their city council members and those council members tell Hargreaves these designs don't meet their expectations.

I feel like my Ward 2 mouthpiece is broken and covered with a pernicious viral slime.

I feel like my Ward 2 mouthpiece is broken and covered with a pernicious viral slime.

That can't be, I've heard he is the most powerful councilman in OKC history.:)

So are we going to do this?

It's a shame we have to.

It's a shame we have to.Not really.... this could still be a great park. I don't want it to be like Tulsa's where you have to drive to see it and it is out of the way of everything. Spartan, we can fix it later to if no one likes it. It needs to be a park built for people downtown and have the best walkability possible.

For the pile of money we are no doubt paying this acclaimed world class firm, we should get a world class park right out of the box. Our planning department (and others) should be all up their arses every step of the way demanding good work and a good outcome.

Planning department hasn't said a word. They've let the committee w no planning or landscape architects bless the boring design.

I actually have stated before that OKC has made huge strides. I brag about that to people all the time. I was at the NCAA wrestling tournament this past weekend and people from all over the country were in town. It has a 15 million dollar impact on the economy in 3 days compared to 9 million for St. Louis when they hosted men's basketball, so I am just giving you figures as to how big the event was.

I was hoping OKC would shine and people would be impressed with our city but just the opposite happened. I heard how stagnant and gloomy the place seemed, how such a great wrestling state could be sooo unprepared for such and event. Restaurants all over the city, even Bricktown didn't even know the even was going on until thousands go in to the restaurants they are so understaffed. At other cities that host it, all over the city are signs saying "welcome wrestling fans" and I never saw one sign anywhere I went. It was 6 sessions for 2 days and 18,000 fans per session so it is a big deal. Anyway, back to the topic of people saying our airport was tiny, is this really a major league city, our city looked dingy, etc.

Sorry, but I took it personal and yes, I have been around. I think it is YOU that hasn't been around to other places like Fort Worth and a hand full of other cities who do get things done. I think OKC has done some very good things to not be such a depressing place but it is still very, very average. I think the image of having the Thunder here has done more for morale and giving the city more exposure in a positive way. OKC needs to do more and bigger projects NOW, not years from now on certain things. I don't know why more people just don't understand that "perception can be reality" when it comes to things like this. Those people with negative perceptions of our city may not change now because they didn't see anything that wowed them. They focused on the negative and that is what I want to shake. I wish they could've seen things that left them with glowing impressions of our city. Heck, I went to the Memorial on Sunday and it was probably the biggest draw for all the people in for the wrestling tournament. Did not see a single "Welcome Wrestling Fans" or anything that even remotely cared they were there. That really disappointed me. If any of you think I am negative in my posts I am sorry. I just don't accept being mediocre and truly care and want OKC to be great while I think many of you are content on little changes here and there and more accepting of what is going on and haven't been to many other places to see how we could be and simply are not because of our actions. OKC is 1 or 2 in the nation in unemployment for larger cities and this IS IS IS the time you make hay when the sun shines. Their is no excuse as to why this city should not be BOOMING other than the decisions that are made. Our governor should be out recruiting the nation about our economy and bringing in companies to this state like Gov. Rick Perry does for Texas.

I actually have stated before that OKC has made huge strides. I brag about that to people all the time. I was at the NCAA wrestling tournament this past weekend and people from all over the country were in town. It has a 15 million dollar impact on the economy in 3 days compared to 9 million for St. Louis when they hosted men's basketball, so I am just giving you figures as to how big the event was.

I was hoping OKC would shine and people would be impressed with our city but just the opposite happened. I heard how stagnant and gloomy the place seemed, how such a great wrestling state could be sooo unprepared for such and event. Restaurants all over the city, even Bricktown didn't even know the even was going on until thousands go in to the restaurants they are so understaffed. At other cities that host it, all over the city are signs saying "welcome wrestling fans" and I never saw one sign anywhere I went. It was 6 sessions for 2 days and 18,000 fans per session so it is a big deal. Anyway, back to the topic of people saying our airport was tiny, is this really a major league city, our city looked dingy, etc.

Sorry, but I took it personal and yes, I have been around. I think it is YOU that hasn't been around to other places like Fort Worth and a hand full of other cities who do get things done. I think OKC has done some very good things to not be such a depressing place but it is still very, very average. I think the image of having the Thunder here has done more for morale and giving the city more exposure in a positive way. OKC needs to do more and bigger projects NOW, not years from now on certain things. I don't know why more people just don't understand that "perception can be reality" when it comes to things like this. Those people with negative perceptions of our city may not change now because they didn't see anything that wowed them. They focused on the negative and that is what I want to shake. I wish they could've seen things that left them with glowing impressions of our city. Heck, I went to the Memorial on Sunday and it was probably the biggest draw for all the people in for the wrestling tournament. Did not see a single "Welcome Wrestling Fans" or anything that even remotely cared they were there. That really disappointed me. If any of you think I am negative in my posts I am sorry. I just don't accept being mediocre and truly care and want OKC to be great while I think many of you are content on little changes here and there and more accepting of what is going on and haven't been to many other places to see how we could be and simply are not because of our actions. OKC is 1 or 2 in the nation in unemployment for larger cities and this IS IS IS the time you make hay when the sun shines. Their is no excuse as to why this city should not be BOOMING other than the decisions that are made. Our governor should be out recruiting the nation about our economy and bringing in companies to this state like Gov. Rick Perry does for Texas.seriously? Dude just shut-up. You don't have to copy and paste this crap on every thread. Just keep it one thread or make a thread about how OKC sucks and never lives to its image and blah blah blah.

Panda, an even easier solution would be for you to just not read my post if you see my name. Then again, you couldn't look like some tough guy behind a computer screen. Read a few more posts and you will see that my intentions are for the best and I want this city to be great. If I am a little more outspoken than some of you then perhaps it is that I care a little more so you can take your little tough guy behind a computer screen somewhere else because I will post things that I think are important and my opinion and not cross the line by any means. I may ruffle feathers on a few of you all as do a few other posters that have some of the same passion that I do and vision for the city but that's about where it ends. Have a good day Panda!

I was watching the news last night and saw Gov. Perry talk about how he goes out all over the nation talking about the Texas economy and recruiting companies to come there. Oklahoma has a good economy and it could also be great but like I was saying, it goes back to the decisions made and acting upon them. I feel like some people on here and around our city have the wrong mentality and that is my point. It's like in sports, many of you may have been happy to just make the team, have some playing time, and you feel fulfilled as that is your idea of success. As for myself, I used to try to set a world record for sit ups as a 7 year old in my living room, I wanted to be a state champion wrestler, then All- American, etc. I came from a family with no money but had a drive to succeed. Nothing wrong with any of us, just depends how you look at things. It is true that with the first approach you can only go so far and will only get so far which is what I feel OKC and many of our leaders are at. They don't see the greatness to reach out and grab it make it happen. They see other cities doing things but settle for less here. OKC is in a mini boom right now and losing out on many millions by not making more things happen while the iron is hot. I really am sorry if my posts offend anyone but can you really not see the difference of the 2 tales?

I know the park will take time but hardly anyone believes it will ever be what any of us hoped it would be. The convention center needs to fast-tracked as we are losing many millions of dollars in business for every day that it is not built. We could use in a major way a nice full service hotel like an Omni as demand is growing by the day. Waiting until 2019 is unacceptable in my opinion and will only cost millions more by then. These are the points I have trying to make.

Panda, an even easier solution would be for you to just not read my post if you see my name. Then again, you couldn't look like some tough guy behind a computer screen. Read a few more posts and you will see that my intentions are for the best and I want this city to be great. If I am a little more outspoken than some of you then perhaps it is that I care a little more so you can take your little tough guy behind a computer screen somewhere else because I will post things that I think are important and my opinion and not cross the line by any means. I may ruffle feathers on a few of you all as do a few other posters that have some of the same passion that I do and vision for the city but that's about where it ends. Have a good day Panda!Like I said in the other thread, when you go around posting the same thing on every thread, it gets annoying fast. I have yet to put one person on this site on my ignore list, mainly because I try to be open minded and not ignore people I disagree with, but what you did was pretty much the textbook definition of trolling.

What you are doing is called voicing nonconstructive criticism and that is generally saved for elementary grade arguments.

I know the park will take time but hardly anyone believes it will ever be what any of us hoped it would be. The convention center needs to fast-tracked as we are losing many millions of dollars in business for every day that it is not built. We could use in a major way a nice full service hotel like an Omni as demand is growing by the day. Waiting until 2019 is unacceptable in my opinion and will only cost millions more by then. These are the points I have trying to make.

No, your original post asked if they were ever going to happen. Here is your direct quote: "I don't have much faith in the Convention Center and Hotel, the Boulevard, Park or Light Rail ever truly happening in our life time." If you would have done 10 minutes of research on the points, you would see where they are planned and happening just not as fast as you want them to. I completely agree on us losing money is business since the CC is not built yet, but I don't want to get millions of dollars into debt because we are in a hurry. I appreciate that you want things to happen quickly, but you don't seem to understand that there is a procees to these projects that have to happen.

While I won't at this time discuss the content of Soondoc's omnipresent comment, I will say that its inexcusable copy/pasting into every thread on OKCTalk has inspired me, for the first time, to use the "Ignore User" feature of the board software. Feels good.

PluPan, he's obviously just trolling trying to get attention/responses. I'd just let him have his little moment.

Soondoc, if you're honestly trying to spark an informed discussion you're taking the wrong avenue. Create a new thread in the open forum instead of pasting the same thing in every thread.

I actually have stated before that OKC has made huge strides. I brag about that to people all the time. I was at the NCAA wrestling tournament this past weekend and people from all over the country were in town. It has a 15 million dollar impact on the economy in 3 days compared to 9 million for St. Louis when they hosted men's basketball, so I am just giving you figures as to how big the event was.

I was hoping OKC would shine and people would be impressed with our city but just the opposite happened. I heard how stagnant and gloomy the place seemed, how such a great wrestling state could be sooo unprepared for such and event. Restaurants all over the city, even Bricktown didn't even know the even was going on until thousands go in to the restaurants they are so understaffed. At other cities that host it, all over the city are signs saying "welcome wrestling fans" and I never saw one sign anywhere I went. It was 6 sessions for 2 days and 18,000 fans per session so it is a big deal. Anyway, back to the topic of people saying our airport was tiny, is this really a major league city, our city looked dingy, etc.

Sorry, but I took it personal and yes, I have been around. I think it is YOU that hasn't been around to other places like Fort Worth and a hand full of other cities who do get things done. I think OKC has done some very good things to not be such a depressing place but it is still very, very average. I think the image of having the Thunder here has done more for morale and giving the city more exposure in a positive way. OKC needs to do more and bigger projects NOW, not years from now on certain things. I don't know why more people just don't understand that "perception can be reality" when it comes to things like this. Those people with negative perceptions of our city may not change now because they didn't see anything that wowed them. They focused on the negative and that is what I want to shake. I wish they could've seen things that left them with glowing impressions of our city. Heck, I went to the Memorial on Sunday and it was probably the biggest draw for all the people in for the wrestling tournament. Did not see a single "Welcome Wrestling Fans" or anything that even remotely cared they were there. That really disappointed me. If any of you think I am negative in my posts I am sorry. I just don't accept being mediocre and truly care and want OKC to be great while I think many of you are content on little changes here and there and more accepting of what is going on and haven't been to many other places to see how we could be and simply are not because of our actions. OKC is 1 or 2 in the nation in unemployment for larger cities and this IS IS IS the time you make hay when the sun shines. Their is no excuse as to why this city should not be BOOMING other than the decisions that are made. Our governor should be out recruiting the nation about our economy and bringing in companies to this state like Gov. Rick Perry does for Texas.

This has absolutely nothing to do with this thread topic

Has anyone seen this? I haven't and has a bunch of new renderings I haven't seen.

http://www.okc.gov/maps3/Park%20Master%20Plan%20Presentation%20Dec%2018%202 013.pdf

Whoever did the concept for the boathouse dock & the pier I am pretty sure does not row. Since they put two columns in a space that obstructs coming at it easily from the east, then make it a pain to come/go west by having the dock lined up strait into an embankment. While it still could be serviceable, you are probably cutting it down to handling less than a third of what it should be capable of, actually if they want to keep the pier and the rock wall the same it would be better to turn the dock ninety degrees so boats could just launch/return strait out to the middle from both sides (actually if they utilized the same length of dock they could do a second one parallel to that first one and then have about four times as much capacity of this design).

I like those Page 31 renderings.

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.

I haven't seen anything saying it would be held on the new park area this year. What information do you have about that?

I saw something in the presentation about a "Manuel Perez" park area adjoining to the west and this is the first I've heard about that.

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.

I like Mick, but Mick is a dork.

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.

http://www.okctalk.com/arts-entertainment/37419-okcfest-2014-a.html

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.


I see your point but sometimes you have to start out that way to gain recognition until you arrive. I remember growing up hearing a lot about and seeing this show on TV called "Austin City Limits". I heard it turned into something big and now the locals just refer to it as "ACL". I am just glad more and more things are happening and doors are continuing to open up in OKC. I sure wish things would happen sooner but that is just the impatience in me and the desire to see this place arrive and become great.

I like those Page 31 renderings.Yeah.. these are my favs and sorry if they have already been posted. I know some of them have, but these are better quality than the ones from Channel 4. Maybe Pete can include these in the article in place of the lesser quality ones from Channel 4.

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t31.0-8/1097248_10202665033899537_4623086849032155678_o.jp g
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/t31.0-8/894495_10202665042139743_3607422829177176709_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t31.0-8/10259092_10202665031379474_1825296438981004360_o.j pg
https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t31.0-8/1956737_10202665035499577_3718078388691533330_o.jp g
https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t31.0-8/1960797_10202665041259721_1308483271300227202_o.jp g
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t31.0-8/1957934_10202665042539753_3838591731637740584_o.jp g
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t31.0-8/1602019_10202665042859761_4204264226781271289_o.jp g
https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t31.0-8/1965697_10202665042219745_1999911061756816623_o.jp g

Also, here is a closer shot of river front area

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t31.0-8/1548186_10202665098741158_3813546868644221952_o.jp g

Anyone seen Mayor Mick and a few others bringing "OKCFEST" music festival to this land starting later this spring/early summer? Of course he wants to name it OKCFEST, in OKC, OKLAHOMA. Everything he tries to rename is OKC or OKLAHOMA something. Good idea, horrible execution on the name. Could you imagine if Bonnaroo, Woodstock, Burning Man, or Coachella took the same approach? Sorry Mick, but "Big League Cities" don't have to name everything after themselves.
Not sure your point. Woodstock was for Woodstock, NY. Coachella is for the Coachella Valley, where it is. Monterrey Jazz festival, for Monterrey, CA. Lots of events identified by city or location. What's the big deal?

By the way, his specialty at A&M was branding. And Ray Ackerman also got the river renamed the OKlahoma River. While some people like cute naming, it isn't always the most effective. Simple and direct is often the best.

Interesting new wrinkle...

In their Wednesday meeting OCURA will vote to approve acquisition of not only the property for lower Central Park, but also dozens of properties immediately east.

They have been doing this to a certain extent near the Boulevard and upper proposed park, but not to this extent.

Also, interesting that they would do this on the west side which is largely residential versus the east side which is all auto repair and salvage yards. Most of Hubcap Alley (follow link for photos) will be wiped out by the park.



http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/7430d1397501014-central-park-lowerpark2.jpg



http://www.okctalk.com/attachments/development-buildings/7429d1397501013-central-park-lowerpark1.jpg

Previously, OCURA has set some very broad boundaries for acquisition but this latest initiative is very specific in terms of trying to acquire everything outlined above.




http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/c2s11314.jpg

What do they need the land for, or is that still an unknown?

Most of what OCURA does is to piece together parcels that are dilapidated in an emerging area and then put out an RFP for developers.

They often do this years in advance of actually soliciting proposals, which I would think is the case here. They'll do their best to buy the land without litigation, but then go through the eminent domain process if needed.

I'm sure they want to do this at the same time as they make the park land acquisition, just because it's easier.


Construction on the lower park isn't until 2020.

Interesting...

Uh wait so all of Hubcap Alley is coming down? I'm confused, how long until Capitol Hill is in the way of Hargreaves' "creativity"??